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New 55 Gallon Tank

16K views 41 replies 11 participants last post by  shelbynjakesdad 
#1 ·
I recently set up a small N. Multifasciatus tank and became hooked on cichlids. My wife and kids also have been captivated by these little guys, but they want some COLOR! I told them that to get cichlids with good color, we need a much bigger tank... so I found a steal of a deal of a 55 (48") on Craigslist. It came with everything, including fish (misc tropicals) and is fully cycled. I'm in the process of locating some rocks to re-decorate and then I'll be off the to the LFS to trade in the tropicals and get some mbuna. I have a great LFS who has a wide selection of mbuna at very reasonable prices, and they take all fish in for credit, so I'm going to get all my mbuna there.

I've done some extensive research on this site, so I think I'm on the right track for stocking... I just want to get some opinions to make sure I'll be fine. My wife's requirement is "no silver or plain colored fishes" and we want breeding groups, so that leaves me with mbuna that have colorful females. I also hate seeing fish that are too large for their tanks, so I want to stick to the smaller mbuna. All that being said, here is what I am considering:

1M/5F Cynotilapia Hara (Fish at the LFS are about 2 inches now and I think can differentiate M/F)
8-10 Rusties (Cannot sex them, they are about 1 to 1.5 inches)
10-12 Msobo Deep (May get fewer if can be sexed, need to go back and look closer, but I want a LOT of females, love the color)
1 ALbino BN Pleco (Came with the tank, its about 2 inches)

I think this follows the rules of 3 breeding groups, different genus, and no look-alike males. I understand that as they get older I'll have to trade in some of the extra males (and hopefully fry).

One of my concerns is aggression from the Msobo. My first choice was Saulosi, but he doesn't currently stock them, so Msobo seems like the closest substitution (I want at least 1 VERY dimorphic species). My other concern is size. I've seen different info for all these species in regards to size - I don't want anything more than 5 inches, preferably 4 inches. Any suggested substitutes are welcome, just keep in mind my requirements - small mbuna with colorful females.

Wow, this turned into a long post - thanks for reading if you made it all the way to here. Thanks for any advice / suggestions...
-Dan
 
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#2 ·
Hi Dan, I know the Pseudotropheus saulosi are dimorphic and the female are beautiful yellow. I think the Msobo deep and hara are both blue right? So maybe you can swap one of them with the saulosi for a yellow color. Btw, do you have a picture of your shellie tank? Would love to see it.
 
#3 ·
Yeah Saulosi were actually my first choice, but the LFS doesn't stock them - so I substituted Msobo. I think they should be fine with Hara. The females are brilliant yellow/orange and the male is blue with black belly / blotches. The Haras are light blue with a few black vertical bands, quite different looking from the Msobo male.

The only pics I have of the Multi tank (10 gallon) were taken with my cell phone:


I (and the multis) have re-arranged things a little, but these are close to what it looks like now.

And here is the new 55 gallon (many changes coming to this tank):
 
#5 ·
Really? The profiles on this site list max size of 5" for Hara and 5.5" for Msobo. I've looked around on other sites and seen anywhere from 4"-5" for Hara and 4.5" to 5.5" for Msobo. Those of you that have these species, how big are yours? Are the females typically smaller than the males? I'd only keep 1 male of each species, so I guess 1 5.5" to 6" fish of each might be ok.

I really love the Hara, I sat at the LFS for quite a long time watching them flash their bars and change color right before my eyes - incredible... I'm pretty sure I'm going to get those. Msobo are beautiful fish, but I'm not set on them. If they get too big or are too agressive, I'm open to getting something else... I really wish they stocked saulosi. Are there any other "smallish" mbuna that would fill in that yellow/orange color to compliment the Hara and Rusties?
 
#6 ·
Hi Dan, the only Cynotilapia hara I see in this site's species profile section has both the male and female to be blue. "Since it's introduction into the hobby a few years ago, this fish has undergone a number of different trade names, from Zebra Hara, to Cyno. afra White Top. This fish is unusual for a Cynotilapia in that the females are an attractive blue colour as well as the males, and the unusually long pelvic fins of the males. This fish is collected at Gallireya Reef". Am I looking at the wrong one? As for the saulosi, did you ask your LFS to order them for you? I think they are pretty popular fish so I don't see why they wouldn't.
 
#8 ·
Another thought I had was to get some M. estherae (Red Zebras) instead of the msobo. How do they compare size wise? Is it really hard to find the variant with blue males (which I would prefer)? I'll have to go back to the LFS and see which he has. So what do you think of the combination of hara, rusties, and estherae? Is the orange of the rusties and zebras too much orange? I've never seen an adult rusty, so I'm not sure if they are more orange, purple, or brown. I think if I went this route I'd get a couple more hara females and fewer rusties.

Then again, I'm not really set on rusties... I could do hara, estherae, and another smaller mbuna, but I don't know which. Rusties are an easy choice because they are different color than everything and are small. Any suggestions for a 3rd mbuna with hara and estherae?

Thanks. :fish:
 
#10 ·
Having 6" fish in your tank really isn't a problem unless it bothers you. When we first did the profile for the hara, 5" was the best info we could gather at the time. I have some that are still young and are 5" I think. We will review.

I was surprised to see the msobo listed at 5.5".
 
#11 ·
Thanks DJ... I just hate seeing fish in tanks that look too big / don't have enough room to swim. I've never had a 55g before or any 6-inch fish, so maybe you are right. I just think my preference would be to have more smaller fish. The tank I bought has a large (maybe 9 inch) tinfoil barb in it that's WAY too big, I feel so sorry for that guy and I'm going to trade him in ASAP. I guess since the majority of my tank will be females (which are typically smaller), I should be ok with 2 males that exceed 5 inches (since rusty males should stay under 5 inches).

After reading more about the msobo, I'm now leaning toward estherae in its place. So I'll probably go with the hara / rusty / estherae combo... Do you see any issues with this? Sound good?
 
#12 ·
I think the estherae would work, but I see they are listed at 5". Again surprised. I think my estherae is the largest fish in my tank, LOL.

I would not choose estherae over msobo for size (since fish vary anyway)...go with the one you like.
 
#13 ·
Well, I went to a rock quarry this weekend and bought 200lbs of rock. I think it turned out pretty good (fake plants temporary):


I tried to make caves and cracks for the fish to claim as territory, but there is no way I can make enough for all of the fish I'm going to get... is it important that they all have a cave? How does that work? Do I need to pull out the big rock on the left and add more small rocks to form more caves? Also, if the fish get 5-6 inches long there aren't many places they could fit...
 
#14 ·
You would be surprised where they can fit, LOL. Every male will want to claim a territory on the substrate surrounded by rocks (not a cave so much). You probably want to have 2X as many territories as you have males.
 
#15 ·
DJ, thanks for continuing to answer my quesitons - very helpful for a newb. I didn't know that the territories are on the substrate... I thought the caves were the territories. The females don't claim territories? Do they just use the caves to escape aggression? So do I need to have more depth of the rocks (from to back) along the substrate? Right now it is mostly a rock wall, with caves/cracks.

Thanks.
 
#16 ·
Well no one really needs caves...a patch of substrate with rocks for a border is what the male wants. More of a cubicle than a cave.

The females just hover overhead and do not claim territories. Yes...think of the rocks as a means of escape for them, but once in a true cave, the fish will not stay in there and defend the entrance if it is not dominant...IDK why but when challenged they come right out into the face of the aggressor and hide at the surface in plain sight.

For the females you want lurking places like under a ledge or a swim through where maybe the chaser will lose track of her. Like a car chase scene.

Maybe a rock every so often along the front and the back to section off patches of substrate? The males can claim the spots in between.

I like the rocks you chose and your arrangement though!
 
#17 ·
Great! Thanks for the advice. I've read tons of articles about fish, but not found any about how to arrange the rocks. They all say "LOTS OF ROCKS", but don't say much about how to best arrange them. Your description makes a lot of sense and it sounds like my arrangement is good for the most part, just need to add some "dividers" in the substrate along the rock wall. :thumb:
 
#18 ·
UPDATE!

I re-scaped the tank a bit, removing the big rock on the left and creating more "cubicles" (as DJ called them) along the substrate for the males to "work". I love these rocks, they stack great creating caves and swim-throughs, and they make stunning backgrounds for close up photos of the fish.


Also finally got some mbuna. Finally decided on msobo, hara, and rusties. I picked up 8 msobo, trying to pick out as many females as possible. It was kind of hard to tell, but after watching them for almost a week, I think I have 3M, 5F. They are about 2 inches and the males are starting to "morph" to blue. I realize I'll have to rehome the extra males. I also picked up the hara, but have no idea which are male and female. They are smaller, only about an inch, but I got a great deal ($4.50 each for F1 fish). I picked up 12 because of the size, price, and the fact that I cannot tell sex at all (want to be sure to have enough females). They only had 4 rusties left, so I'm waiting until they get more.

Here is my question... How long do I have to add the rusties? I don't want the msobo and hara to claim all the good territory and attack the rusties when I add them. I know I did it a bit backwards, since the rusties are smaller and less aggressive than the msobo and hara, but that's what the LFS had at the time.

Anway, here are some pics, not great quality - taken with my iPhone...

msobo female:


msobo male starting to morph to blue:


hara:


another hara:
 
#20 ·
Only a week? Really? I think my msobo are still too immature to spawn and the hara are definitely too immature. Isn't that when they start showing real aggression? I'm not sure I'll be able to get the rusties for a week or two - depends on when the LFS gets them. If a few weeks pass before I get the rusties, does it help to move rocks around to shake things up a little when I add them?
 
#21 ·
You'd be surprised on how young mbuna can spawn. I've got an acei no bigger than 2" that is holding a mouth fil of fry right this second. I've also got 24 hara to go along with it, with 1 of the wild caught female holding and she's about 3". I've got 2 w/c males sight the bigger being the dominant but none have claimed an area. They roam everywhere and also swim constantly In the open water. They are all still really young with the latest male at 4". I would guess he's going to Fe every bit of 6". I've also had red zebras that have hit 6" as well. I'd like to say that what is listed on their specs on size is what's going on in the wild where in captivity will hit larger in size due the abundance of food and lack of predators.
 
#22 ·
It's not so much a spawning issue, but claiming territory. Of course you can add the fish whenever you get them. But if you really wanted the rusties to be on equal footing with the other fish...that would need to happen pretty quick. A worthwhile goal, but often not realistic. No worries!
 
#23 ·
Thanks for the replies...

IanR29, I've pretty much given up on only keeping smaller fish. Ideally it would be nice, but I can't get saulosi locally and I'm looking for mbuna with colorful females, so not much other choices. I was just kind of confused because everyone was saying acei are too big for 55 gallons because they get 6 inches, so I was trying to keep only smaller fish.

DJRansome, I haven't seen much territory claiming yet, so for now I think I'm ok. I'll get the rusties in there as soon as I can. I haven't seen any aggression from the msobo towards the hara yet, its all been contained to their on species. Maybe they don't see them as a threat because they are so much smaller. I've seen the alpha male msobo fighting (locking jaws) with what I thought was a female, who didn't back down from him at all. Do they do that, or is that one a male in female "clothes"?

Anyway, just thought I'd share a pic of the alpha male, he is really changing fast!
 
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