# Mbuna, some bloating and discoration



## lightnb (Oct 20, 2012)

Many but not all of my juvenile mbuna are looking a bit bloated and the bloated spot is discoloured (photos below). I've read about "bloat" the disease, and this doesn't seem to be that since the fish are still very active and they are eating algae and plants. They don't seem lethargic at all. I have seen a bit of rubbing on the sand and the rocks (from all of them, not just the bloated ones), not constantly, but maybe one fish (a different fish each time) every five minutes? I have an automatic feeder (twice per day) so I haven't watched the feeding, but I have disabled the feeder as of tonight and will try feeding them manually tomorrow to observe if any aren't going for the food.

I have 5 Acei (1 juvenile, 1 adult), 5 juvenile Labs, 5 juvenile Red Zebras, 1 melanochromis auratus (adult), 1 upside-down malawi catfish. Its mostly the juvi labs and zerbas that are showing bloating but one juvi acei was too. I'd like to know if this is an illness or just too much feeding/wrong diet. I noticed the bloating about 1 day ago. I turned off one of the feeding dispersements and I can't tell if the bloating has gone down or not since then. (Should I fast them for a day?)

The fish are fairly new to the tank. The tank took 3 weeks to cycle, and after a spike in ammonia the second week, 2 weeks later the ammonia was 0, nitrite was 0 and nitrate was 5ppm. I added the five juvi labs and juvi Zebras and the catfish then. After 1 week, I added the adult Acei (from another tank that he outgrew), and then another week later I added the melanochromis adult (from a tank that he outgrew). 1 week after that, I added the 4 juvi Acei to finish the set. 1 week after that, I added many plants from my pond. Then 5 days later, I added more lighting, and plant food on a regular basis. And that was last week. 3 days ago, the water test showed a rise in ammonia levels to .25ppm nitrite was 0, nitrate was 5ppm. I did a 25% water change and added a dose of Prime for the whole tank (75G). Prime is supposed to make ammonia non-toxic, but leave it so the filter still eats it. Today, my test showed .25ppm ammonia still, no nitrite and nitrate at 10 PPM. The temperature today was 84 deg F. There is no heater.

I've been giving them a pellet/stick food that I think may be too protein rich. It was around 40% protein. I'm planing to maybe try the flake food, but don't know if it will work in my auto feeder (which is why I got pellets in the first place!). I also give them a cucumber slice sometimes.

Water hardness is 125.3 PPM GH, 19 deg. KH. There is an algae growing on the glass. Probably a result of increased light and the plant food. There's also white stuff inside on the glass, like snow flakes. Please see the pictures for that too.

Snow Flakes:


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## lightnb (Oct 20, 2012)

PH is 8.4 (Can't find the edit button to add to my original post)


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Post back once you know if they are eating. Bloat does not always result in an over-rounded fish...just as often they look normal or even emaciated. Yours might just be overfed, especially if the auto feeder just dropped food.

The lighter bellies might be a stress thing due to your water problems.


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## lightnb (Oct 20, 2012)

Is it just the ammonia that's a problem (re: water quality) or does something else need addressed too?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Just the ammonia, but ammonia is toxic. Don't underestimate the impact of it.

The key is are your fish eating? If they are I would stop feeding for 2 days and resume at 1/2 the amount you have been feeding so far.


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## lightnb (Oct 20, 2012)

So far as I can tell, they are all eating. They all go to the surface and run around trying to find food anyway. Trying to track 15 fish to see if they all got a bite doesn't seem possible. But I didn't notice any that weren't interested in food. Except the catfish, but he never comes out to get food. I think that's normal though. So I'll stop feeding until Wednesday and then give them just one meal a day for a while. I just did a 40% water change, and will re-check the ammonia once it's had time to circulate a bit.


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## lightnb (Oct 20, 2012)

Ammonia reading is now close to 0. It seems a slight bit more chartreuse than pure yellow, but not as green as a .25 reading.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

You want the pure yellow color. See how things go for the next couple days.


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## lightnb (Oct 20, 2012)

I think ammo is 0. I did another 40% on Wednesday. When comparing the test tube to the card, its definitely more like 0 than the .25 color. It's just tricky to read since it doesn't match the yellow on the card exactly.

Some of the bloating has gone down, but one or two of the labs still looks a bit plump. While the rest are less plump, the same area is still a bit discoloured. There is also something else going on in the water- It's a bit cloudy and it has tiny white particles like dandruff. I waited for the filter to take them out, but it did not. The water change didn't seem to do anything either. I'm not sure what this is or how to treat it? Also, some of the fish are flashing fairly frequently.

But ammo is 0, nitrite is 0 and nitrate is < 20ppm. Anything else to check for or try?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I would not consider pale bellies discolored. Maybe the fish are not dominant. I'd say you now have a bacteria bloom due to the period of elevated ammonia. I'd do a 50% water change to get your nitrate to 10ppm and wait it out.


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