# 20G Long Stocking and General Q's



## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

I just picked up a 20L from the $1 gallon sell and I'm ready to take my shot at a shell dweller tank! :dancing: Anyway, I've been doing alot of reading on what my options are and I think I have my eyes on Multies.

With that being said, how many can I safely house without getting in over my head? What is the preferred "go to" shells for them? I've read a few different ideas on this, but it seems to mainly come down to Escargot Shells? How many shells are generally put in with a tank of this footprint? I also have either an AC50 or Eheim Ecco 2234 to use for the setup. How well do they handle current? Is the Eheim going to be too much or vice versa regarding the aquaclear? I also don't suppose I could get away with some rockwork in the tank? I.E. colorado river rocks or something?

Apologize for all the questions, I'm just making sure to clear up some unanswered questions so forth before I dive into housing these guys!


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## webbie (Apr 29, 2012)

Multis are a great choice for your first shellie tank,in a 20 ltr I would go for 1 male 3 females in no time at all they will start to fill the tank with fry,Escargot shells perfect for them cheap and readily available,for 4 fish I would put in a dozen shells,some rocks sure they will stick to the shells but a few rocks to aid aquascaping no probs,dont know much about the filters you intend to use flow rate etc but shellies stay at the bottom of the tank very rarely moving above half way up the water column so water flow wont bother them if you think it is too powerful for them aim the outflow against the glass,facinating fish to keep enjoy ! :fish:


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## webbie (Apr 29, 2012)

just had a look at the eheim web site and looks like the eheim 2234 has an ajustable flow ,I would go for that one :fish:


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## TMB60 (Jan 6, 2011)

Either filter will work fine. I've used both but now use AC's on everything - I don't dread cleaning them as much as I do canisters.

A 20 long setup I found to work well is a shell pile on each end with a rock pile in the middle. Don't skimp on shells - arrange in a cluster 2-3 shells deep (maybe 20 or so shells per pile). The males prefer the upper shells and the females the lower ones. The extra males that don't pair up for breeding tend to gravitate to (and really like) the rock pile. Escargot or Whale's eye shells are perfect.

Start with a group of six to ensure you'll get at least one female.

Sand substrate - Multies are diggers and earth movers.

Good luck - you'll really enjoy this tank.


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## Cooder (Jul 19, 2011)

with a 20L you should be ok with all shellies, except for lamprologus callipterus which the males get to like 8 in or more, lol obviously... anyway.

I love the ocellatus "type" shellies the most such as speciosus, stappersi (meleagris), gold ocellatus, ornatippinnis etc. these types of shellies dont live in colonies like multies but breed in pairs or harems and require 2 shells each at least to spread out territorial aggression

i like them particularly because of their feisty nature and there sand dozing antics, very funny to watch and not to mention much more colourful than multies.

With occies, start with 6 or so and get a pair or 2, many more and you could get fatal fighting  separate the tank line of sight with a small pile of rocks, and turbo shells, escargot or whales eye shells are all good.

hope this helps.


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## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

Great info! Thanks for the replies! I actually just got back from one of my local fish shops and picked up a few more supplies to get some steps closer to getting it all setup. I also found these rocks in-store which for the life of me, I can't remember what they are called? :-? I assume they are aquarium safe though... I will also be boiling them for ~30 minutes just as a precaution. Here are some pictures. Sorry for the blurriness.


















Looks like all I have left now is to get another stand ordered, shells and I'm almost set! :dancing:


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## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

I also forgot to mention that I'm going to be going with Eco-Complete Cichlid Sand again and was curious if the small grain size of 1.0mm and large grain size of 2.0mm for the White Sand (not the salt and pepper sand) might be a little too big for shellies?


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## TMB60 (Jan 6, 2011)

Eco-Complete makes a 0.5mm sand that I think would be better. The 1mm picture on their website just looks too "rocky".
Smaller is better for what the shellies like to do with it.


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## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

Darn, thats a bummer. I have the salt and pepper sand in my 60G and while it looked good at first, it just isnt as appealing to me anymore. Any other sand reccomendations? I really like EcoComplete for the minerals and buffering capabilities etc...


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Sand really does not do much for buffering...I've had aragonite for 7 years and yet to see an increase in pH or KH. Pool filter sand is my go-to substrate now.


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## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

DJRansome said:


> Sand really does not do much for buffering...I've had aragonite for 7 years and yet to see an increase in pH or KH. Pool filter sand is my go-to substrate now.


Ah. I agree with PFS though. I'm just unsure of what the actual grain size might be just in-case it could be too big for shellies? I can't imagine its any bigger than 2.0mm at the largest grain?


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## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

Ensorcelled said:


> DJRansome said:
> 
> 
> > Sand really does not do much for buffering...I've had aragonite for 7 years and yet to see an increase in pH or KH. Pool filter sand is my go-to substrate now.
> ...


Don't know why I cant edit this last post but anyway. I forgot to mention I do have the option of Tahitian Moon Sand for cheap. Wonder if it would be too much black and potentially wash out the color of the fish.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

In my experience crushed coral and/or african cichlid sand does indeed have an effect on pH. Perhaps it depends on the water parameters out of the tap. I try to have at least one type of substrate and/or rock that raises and stabilizes pH in all my tanks. If I don't, my pH is down around 7. With either lace rock, crushed coral of african cichlid sand my pH is very stable at 8.2.

As for tahitian moon sand, I have used it and didn't like it. Looked awesome at the start, but over time tended to collect debris, which was very obvious, and it also tended to bring out the darker colors in my fish and decorations. For example, I had fish that were supposed to be a very pure off white color, which I thought would contrast nicely against the black sand, but after a few days the fish started looking very dark and blotchy. Fish will tend to modify their colors to match their surroundings, and this was undesirable for the fish I was keeping. I also had some deep red rocks that again I thought would contrast, but the black sand tended to bring out the dark in the red, and it didn't turn out that attractive.

I also would not recommend Ocellatus. Just my opinion. I had a group in my 20L here at work. I waited forever for them to spawn, which they did, however once the fry leave the shells they are on their own, and once the parents want to spawn again, they will kill all the fry. It sucked. They were also VERY boring to watch. They pretty much just hunkered down outside their shells and did nothing all day.

I have Multies at home and they are 10x more interesting to watch, and they don't kill their offspring.

Just my experiences and opinions. Enjoy whatever you end up doing!


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

PFS grain is 20.


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## badspellar (Oct 14, 2009)

DJRansome said:


> PFS grain is 20.


 I do not understand. 20 what?


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## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

I don't mean to start a debate or anything but I just personally like Eco Complete. The sand that I'm wanting to go with is 1.0mm small grain and 2.0mm large grain. Like I said before, I don't know if that is too big of a grain size for multies. I figure that size is potentially on par with standard Pool Filter Sand?


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## Frazee86 (Aug 1, 2010)

That size will be fine I use pfs and multis never had issues moving giant piles around


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

My Multies carry snails around that are at least .25" in diameter LOL, so it should be fine.


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## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

So I just received my escargot shells and they look nice! My question is, with them being new in a box would I need to boil them to remove anything potentially harmful or am I good with just a quick rinse under the tap and start shelling my tank?


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I usually soak my new ones in warm water to soften up any remaining residue that may be present inside. A vigorous agitation in the water and then flush with tap water usually suffices.


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## Ensorcelled (Mar 1, 2011)

Deeda said:


> I usually soak my new ones in warm water to soften up any remaining residue that may be present inside. A vigorous agitation in the water and then flush with tap water usually suffices.


Thanks again Deeda for your help. I am currently in progress of soaking them as I type! :thumb:


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