# Mouth sticking out of water ??



## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

Hi all
Need some help/advice

I have 12 cichlids in my 55 gallon. Had them for about a year or so.
I noticed the other day that 2 of them, yellow labs were doing the dance. I am convinced I saw an egg being picked up by the female.
Anyway this lasted a while and I was excited about it but at the same time concerned.
I would like to try and keep the fry. 
I thought that perhaps the other fish would eat the fry so I managed to catch the female and place her in a 10 gallon tank that I just purchased. I took the water from the 55 gallon, along with the substrate, a large rock and a plant.
After placing her in the tank I read somewhere that the male might not have fertilized all the eggs (not sure if this is true) so I then caught the male and put him in the 10 gallon with the female - The two of them looked ok and they would lie next to one another by the rock.
I also added a few more little stones for them to hide in. The next day the male went to town moving all the sand around the rocks etc.
Now I noticed that he female stays near the filter at the top of the water, her mouth pokes out the top of the water constantly - should I be concerned?
I have not seen her eat in 2 days and not quite sure what to do.
I did purchase an egg tumbler just in case but heard it is best to let her spit the fry naturally..

Should I take the male out the tank and put him back in the 55?
Should I try to remove the eggs from the female and put them in the tumbler?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I suspect the 10G is too small for both these fish so I would remove the male back to the main tank as once the male has fertilized the eggs, his job is done.

Is there any type of filter on the 10G tank?


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

There is a filter that came with the tank. One of those 10 gallon tanks from petsmart. The male seems happy and eating and digging around. Should I try to remove the eggs from the female


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

It is usually suggested to wait at least 2 weeks before stripping the eggs from a holding female to be sure she is carrying fertilized eggs so at this time I would say no.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

What about the fact that she is just hanging near the side if the filter with her mouth sticking out of the water


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

That behavior can be a sign of stress from being moved, possible water quality or if the male is chasing her at all. Do you have a test kit so you can test the water in the 10G tank? I know the male isn't exhibiting any problems but I don't know what else it can be at this point.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

I will do a water test later on today - perhaps also do a partial water change.

I did remove the male this morning and put him back in the 55 gallon.
The female is not sticking her mouth out the water but she is staying near the top of the water. I was thinking I should put in an air stone and see if there is any change. Don't want to do too much as I am not sure what will stress her out.

Let me know your thoughts or suggestions.
Thanks for your help


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Adding an air stone to the tank won't hurt anything so I'd do that.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

Put in an air stone and we will see what happens.
I must be honest, I don't think she is carrying anymore. She does not seem to gasping all the time anymore. Not does it look like her gills are moving a great deal like she did when I first noticed.
Last night when I fed her she did not seem to care for any food so perhaps she ate the eggs ? Or perhaps I am just over analyzing everything

The male that I put back in the main tank is now being chased all over the place. I am afraid to put the female back in there when the time comes. Maybe I'll get couple more labs to spread the bullying around ?


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

Update. 
Just fed her and she did eat a little


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

She probably swallowed the eggs or spit them out so you can put her back in the main tank if you want. It is often suggested that when adding one or two cichlids to an existing tank with mature fish, that you do a bit of decor or rock rearranging so that established territories are broken up and I think this applies in your situation despite the 2 labs having lived there before.

What other species of fish do you have in the tank? Is it a combination of males and females?


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

I am not quite sure what types of cichlids they are. I tried to take some pictures last night and upload them here - not the greatest of pics as a lot of them are blurry but you might be able to tell. I think I have some duplicates in there

The first 3 the pics shows the yellow lab in her own tank.
You can see the 3D background I made last year - included a link at bottom to a video of the waterfall I have going in the tank - I never put it on except if someone comes over and wants to check it out. I have a smaller yellow lab that usually goes into the sand catch and empties all the sand out so the waterfall (sandfall) stops working 

Let me know your thoughts.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

Totally messed up the picture uploads - hope this works - also on one of the orange ones - looks yellow in the pic - their tail has been eaten by the other cichlids


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

So I was looking at her and found that she hardly moves her mouth open and closed. I am guessing at this point she is no longer holding.
I would still like to try and breed them, do you think I should just put her back in the main tank or take the male and put him in the 10 gallon with her?

Thanks


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Kouger, I did open a new topic in the Unidentified forum for the pics you posted here so that you can get help with identifying them so don't worry, I didn't delete your pics. :wink:

She looks beaten up a bit, so I would keep her alone in the 10G for a week or so until she recovers. I suggest keeping excellent water quality in the 10G tank by doing enough water changes to keep the nitrate level as low as possible to facilitate healing her fins.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

Thanks for the reply - unfortunately after my last post I moved her back to the 55 gallon - she seems to be doing good in there and not being harassed. I will keep my eye on her though. Probably should have had more patience.

So now for something very exiting and at the same time a little disappointing - after I moved her back to the 55 gallon, I was looking at one my orange cichlids (the one with the chewed up tail), he normally hangs around in a corner near the sandfall catch. Well to my surprise I spotted a fry inside the sand catch. I could not believe what I was seeing. Only one of them though. I am sure the other were eaten and I don't even know when this all happened and what fish it could be.
I tried for over an hour to catch the little bugger to no avail. The sand catch is about 2 inches in diameter and about the same in depth. There is a PVC pipe that runs from the bottom of it to the top of the tank. 
Every time I went near the thing, it would disappear. I tried to siphon it up with a big tube but no luck.
So next best thing I could think of was to put in some of those plastic grass things from LFS for the fry. Put it near the sand catch. Hope it survives. I would love to move it to the 10 gallon.
Any suggestions on how to catch the little sucker or just leave it in there and hope for the best? Maybe put another one of those grass things in - there are two in a pack, I did use both right next to each other.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I would just leave the single fry in the main tank, it's already survived so far.

You do have a lot of different species in your tank so more than likely you will have some hybrid babies because there is no way to guarantee which species spawned together.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

It would be kinda cool to see what coloring the hybrid would turn out to be - I tried to find the fry this morning but could not see it anywhere. Hope it survives.
Any thoughts on those plastic fry things from the LFS? Do they really work or should I try doing something else if another fish has babies without my knowledge. I would love to keep them and try to raise them.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I have not had luck with the hang on fry boxes but others have had success. The mesh style fry boxes can be a problem because the adult fish can usually suck the babies out through the holes.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

What I was thinking is that the fry that I found in my tank obviously happened a few weeks ago without my knowledge. I am sure this may happen again so to give them a fighting chance I put the plastic grass there for them. Then if I see any I will try and catch them an put them in the 10 gallon.
I have been looking all day to see if I could find the one from last night but no luck. I am sure he was eaten.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

It has been a while since my last post and wanted to update you all and ask you another questions.

Firstly I found the fry, still alive and seems to be doing ok - my sister says it is a female because it is still alive and clever enough to stay out of trouble 
I cannot catch the little bugger so I am just going to leave it alone and hope it survives. Not sure what kind of fry it is - any ideas?

My question is, do you guys think that my female pictured below is carrying? Also have a picture of the male that I think was the culprit  
It seems like he mouth is larger than normal. I did manage to get her out the tank and put her in the 10 gallon. This is not the same female as before but I do think it was the same "horny" little male as before.

Thanks in advance.

Male









Female









Female









Female









Female









Female









Fry


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Yes it looks like the female is holding.

I really can't identify the fry and it will be difficult since you have a couple different potential males in the tank.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

How long before she would release the fry? Best guess is that this happened in the last few days


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Mouth brooding cichlids can hold from 21 to 36 days depending on species and water temperature according to the article in the Library.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

You think she will be OK in the 10 gallon by herself for that long


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

How long can the female go without eating? 
It's been about 11 days now and have not seen her eat a thing


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

The 10G tank should be fine and the female probably won't eat until she is ready to release the fry.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

Thanks for the info. 
Another question. There seems to be a kind of film on top of the water. I did a couple of water changes but it does not help too much. Is this because the filter that came with the 10 gallon is not so good? . I ordered a marina slim s10 filter which should arrive today. The current filter sits inside the tank. Got the tank from petsmart for $34. Can't remember the name of the filter. Not home right now


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Surface water film is common and can usually be avoided by increasing surface agitation either with the filter output, power head/wave maker or an air stone. It's usually easiest to just direct the filter output toward the water surface if you have a canister filter or to lower the tank water level a bit with a power filter.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

Well after hooking up that marina slim, I decided it was a waste of money. Might be good enough for a 5 gallon but certainly not a 10 gallon. Also seemed to rattle. So went out and bought an aquaclear 20. Much better. Will see what happens tomorrow and see how clear the water is. Should I put a sponge or net over the intake so the fry don't get sucked in


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

You can add a coarse pre-filter sponge over the intake strainer to avoid sucking in the fry once they are released.


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## kouger (Jul 8, 2015)

Ok. Thanks for your help. I am really hoping that I see her spitting the fry. Would love to get it on video


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