# take mate suggestions for breeding FM's (55g)



## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

sorry for the multiple posts but i thought i needed to make it more clear on what i have planned for my tank.... i alredy have a male FM anout 4" and i am getting him 3 females around the same size... there will b 2 bristle nose cats in there but i was looking or some other fish to broden the variety.... i really like the look of JD's but not sure if they will up set the balance in the tank. maby some cool schooling fish would be good. i am not sure so or maby a salvine or what ever they r called. any suggestions i will b most greatfull for


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## Toby_H (Apr 15, 2005)

I believe you mentioned elsewhere that this will be a 55 gal tank... which is an important factor to mention...

I suggest you go with either a breeding set up or a community set up... mixing the two is difficult and greatly increases risks while decreasing options...

Just so you know... Firemouthes are pairing fish, not colony breeders... so the 2 odd females are likely to be fairly stressed by the pair...

Sexing young Firemouthes isn't an easy task so it is likely your 3 females will be a mix of sexes...

A pair of FMs and a Dempsey will probably work. I would suggest a female Dempsey over a male... same for Salvini...

A school of Tetras will make the tank more visually interesting. If you go with a larger fish such as a Dempsey or Salvini the Tetras won't last long... but if you stick go with 2 pairs of Firemouthes your chances will increase considerably...

Plecos / Catfish are well known to eat eggs/fry and aren't a good addition to a breeding set up... provided you actually want to produce/distribute fry. If you just want to enjoy watching the breeding cycle but do not wish to deal with fry, they are a great asset as they will deal with the fry for you.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

r JD slow growing fish?? and could i have barbs would they last longer??


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i have convicts in my tank at the moment and they have no problem with the other ones except when they r breeding' and the other one come 2 close to the eggs but otherwise they r fine
i think i will get a female JD


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

does any one have some good suggestions coz i need some help!


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## Comic Sans (Apr 21, 2009)

4 Firemouths in a 55 is pretty much tapped out. You say you also already have cons. the tank really is fully stocked already.

But I agree with above a JD, TWO Firemouths and some dithers is a nice tank.


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

I agree with most of the others. 1 pair of firemouths and 1 Jack Dempsey, plus a school of fast moving dithers such as Giant Danios would be nice, but even that will take some luck. You should be able to find a larger Jack Dempsey if you look around. If you don't get a Dempsey large enough, your firemouths will try to drive him out of the tank.

Also...what are your plans with the fry? If you want to raise them, then you need to keep ONLY 1 pair of firemouths --- nothing else. If you just want to experience natural behavior, then you also might consider a predatory catfish species to help keep the fry numbers down. That's also where a Salvini might be an even better choice than the JD.

55g is really small for a community tank with a breeding pair. It may take some trial and error to get it right.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i don't care about the fry........ i just want a breeding pair for the colour and i would like a JD but no more than about 4" to start with....... i think i might get giant danios


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

how many Giant Danios


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

If you do add the Jack or Salvini, you'll need a bit more room...so about 6 giant danios. If you decide against the other cichlid, I'd add 10 danios. Keep in mind though, that the best predators for fry control will be nocturnal....catfish or loaches will quickly reduce the eggs/fry.

This assumes that you have a lot of filtration and perform frequent water changes.
Again..55g is a bit small for this kind of setup, so there will be some trial and error.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i was wondering if i amde like a large barrier of like drift wood and rock in the middle
would it b good and lots of caves would it b ok then


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

The decorations will help with the cichlids...but not the Danios. If it's too open, you'll have the opposite problem. With a 55g, you'll have to compromise somewhere.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i think if the danoes r big enough they won't get eaten


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i really like JD's and FM's........ so what else would b good if i make really good hiding places good caves and some good plants would the b alright......... what about barbs tho....... they school right


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## Comic Sans (Apr 21, 2009)

Barbs are pretty bad fin nippers, and they aren't that fast. I'd suggest some larger tetras.


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

With a 55g, you are going to have to make a compromise. If you have a lot of cichlids with the required decorations, they'll each establish a territory....and that won't leave your danios (or other dithers) enough room to escape an angry, charging cichlid. Community tanks with dithers ONLY work if you leave the faster dithers an open area, so they can evade attack.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

k i think i will skip the schooling fish and just have the JD's and FM's


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

hello i am still w8ing for what u guys think abiut the two pairs


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## gage (Feb 7, 2007)

if you ditch the Jack Dempsey idea then 2 pair of firemouths could work, but likely not 2 pairs with a Jack Dempsey will work in this size tank.

firemouth pairs tend to take about a 2 foot diameter of space. a 55 is 4 feet, so 2 firemouth pairs together will take a 4ft space, where is the dempsey to go?

firemouths maybe small, but especially when breeding are far from pushovers, whereas JD tend to be. even if your JD was not so much of a pushover, most fish are intimidated by a 2 vs 1 match, so will run away.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

no i ment have a pair of JD's and a pair of FM's


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

or what about a pair of FM's a JD they will b no more than 3" 4" so they won't b big....... what else would b good coz that isn't many fish..... but if i devide the tank with lots of aves and stuf like that i think the 2 pairs would b fine coz i really want 2 JD's and 2 FM's


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i am going to do this all tomorrow so i need some answers.........


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## under_control (Jan 9, 2008)

jamesman_1994 said:


> or what about a pair of FM's a JD they will b no more than 3" 4" so they won't b big....... what else would b good coz that isn't many fish..... but if i devide the tank with lots of aves and stuf like that i *think *the 2 pairs would b fine coz i really *want *2 JD's and 2 FM's


Step one. Type full words.

Step two... don't ask for advice if you already have your mind made up. What you want and what is good for the fish are not always the same thing. Just because you really want something does not mean that it will or should work.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

oh and a little bit of turf wars should b alright right?? any way i think it would b a mad combo......... thanks guys


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## Robchester_2000 (Nov 8, 2008)

when the two JD's breed there won't be a turf war, they will kill your FM's.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

............... that sucks but what if i devide the tank with rocks and drift wood
like make a wall in the middle


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

will the JD be just a colourful when it is not with a pare?


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

hay gage i am 15 so it is hard not to shorten all the words when i txt people all the time and use msn.........


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

hay also umm my fire mouth nearly ate my convict that is just a little bit smaller than him..... he is getting quite agressive......... u sure he won't b fine with JD's


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## Robchester_2000 (Nov 8, 2008)

JD's are named after a boxer for a reason, they are really tough, and if your pair fall out with the FM's it won't matter how tough your FM is, it'll be dead.
the JD will look great even without a pair, you just need dark substrate.
you may get really lucky and have a pair of dempseys that are laid back, but its unlikely. 
why not just have your FM pair, a single JD and maybe a few dither fish, much more likely to succeed, and as i said, put a black gravel or sand in there, and your JD will be spectacular.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

kk sounds good so if i have white gravel he will look bad?


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

so what should i have for dithers??
giand danos?? or what??


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

If you want a second pair of another cichlid species to go with your firemouths, then choose something other than Jack Dempseys. Jack Dempseys tend to be fairly mellow--until they breed. Then they get VERY aggressive. There's a 99 percent chance that they would kill your firemouths.

You should be able to put a pair of Rainbow Cichlids or a pair of Blue Acaras....but keep in mind that theytend to be less aggressive than firemouths. But if you have the tank set up right, it should work.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i have just got my mind set on JD i don't know y but i do........... r blue acaras like bright blue??


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i think i will go with the pair of fm's and a JD........ i think i might also get like 6 giant danos........... what should i do for the deco?? like some nice drift wood and like a good cave or something for the JD and i am also defenetly trying the blk gravel........ what would b good??


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

which JD has more colour female or male


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

In general, male Jack Dempseys are larger and more colorful. But I've had some females that were just as pretty as some of the less colorful males.

For decor, I'd have a cave on each side of the tank, with a medium to large piece of driftwood in the middle. That way there is a visual barrier, but each can have a cave. Make sure to leave the danios some swimming room too.


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

Blue Acaras vary a little in color...but they look like a little like a Jack Dempsey when they mature. Not in body shape, but with a lot of spakles/spots. Just look up blue acara in the profiles on this site, or on you tube.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

thanks old cat u have given me some really good advice.... but i have 1 question......... how dig should the caves b ??? because i don't want them to grow out of them


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## giffler (Jun 28, 2006)

if you use rocks (make sure they are clean) then you can modify them as the fish get bigger and they usually look more natural than ornaments, also its cheaper :thumb:


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

ya i don't like the fake stuff........ it also discolours as time goes on so i am going to toll for somr nice rocks. thanks for the tip giffler


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## giffler (Jun 28, 2006)

if your can, try a rock yard, just take a bucket with you and pick which rocks you want, it's only ever cost me a few bucks for a good size bucket so hopefully places around you are as good :thumb:


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

kk


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

hay i got a pair of JD's i just realised that the FM is about 3times bigger than the JD's and is pushing them around a bit
they guy at the shop said if there is a visual barrier it should b fine


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## Robchester_2000 (Nov 8, 2008)

why did you bother asking us whether it would work when you just went out and bought what we told you wouldn't work. its your tank, so whatever, but its annoying to give advice and be ignored.
good luck.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i removed the fire mouth


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

i mean i removed the female firemouth and have the pair od JD and 1 male FM


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

with a few dithers so it gives the tank some more personality while the JD's r small......... there is also like 3 bristle nose cats in there


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

and anyway it is my descision in the end...........


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

anyway u havn't seen the size diff between the JD's and the FM it is huge


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## giffler (Jun 28, 2006)

It is your decision, but why bother coming on here asking for advice when you are just going to ignore it. It's all well and good that the jd's are heaps smaller than the fm for now but given time they will outgrow it and then there is likely to be problems.


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

well rn't JD's slow growers and also read my other post about the JD's it will give u some more info


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## giffler (Jun 28, 2006)

as i said for now it will probably be ok, however the advice you are being given is based on the long term prospects of the tank


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## jamesman_1994 (Jun 23, 2009)

kk the tank is practically empty 
and has a total visual barrier between the caves at either end so i think i have some time b4 i start having trouble


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