# My tank: "Enough" hiding places?



## albita (Oct 12, 2013)

So...Be nice to me because this is my first cichlid tank . And, yes, I know that typical habitat is just lots of rocks, but I don't particularly enjoy the hard/modern feel of that. I have been enjoying my tank for several months now and recently have 2 ladies holding. However, I have also noted that most of my yellow labs are now hiding in the fake plants instead of the rockwork. They still come out to eat (which makes getting any pictures of what I am talking about challenging) and seem just fine to me...but I'm not an expert and I am wanting to make sure I have "enough" spaces for them and they aren't doing this because they are stressed. There are also areas where no fish are hiding at all, which leads me to believe it might just be them?

My tank:

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https://flic.kr/p/10981394835
Note: There are a few more "hiding" places behind the holey rock that you can't see from the front (maybe 3-4...at least 2 of which have been claimed)

The yellow labs in the plants:

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https://flic.kr/p/10981400235
They just kind of sit there on the branches "resting"

Example of unclaimed area:

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https://flic.kr/p/10981497986

The "favorite" area to try to claim and hold:

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https://flic.kr/p/10981494886
Currently both my dominant Cynotilapia Afra & dominant Yellow Lab share this general territory (each having their own nook within it)

Thanks in advance. Again, I just want to make sure that I am not inadvertently stressing out my yellow "bush" labs.


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## NJmomie (Jan 17, 2013)

I think you have too much "stuff" in the tank. I'm not sure where to look. As for why certain fish pick an area, my guess is they feel safe there. The important thing is to make sure there aren't any fish cowering in the upper or lower corners due to bullying. Besides being busy, I would imagine it's difficult to vacuum your tank. Have you considered removing some of the plants and keeping just one color rock?


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## albita (Oct 12, 2013)

Yeah...I know it's busy. But, that's how I like it. Shrug. It makes it feel homey to me. The single color rock and lack of plants would feel too stark for my current tastes. It is challenging to vacuum the tank. I move about 1/2 the stuff to vacuum, then move it back when I'm done. I can't move the holey rock as it is far too heavy for me to move...but I figure there isn't anything getting under it anyway. Or at least, not much. I just wanted to make sure my fish's behavior wasn't an indicator of stress. I do have one that stays in the lower corner and always has...but it's never been picked on either (?). Other than that, I just thought it was weird that they were hanging out in the plant so much recently.


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## oetheous (May 25, 2013)

As mentioned above, as long as no fish are obviously being bullied into the top corners of the tank... then we can conclude that there are sufficient hiding spaces.


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## sumthinfishy (Jan 26, 2013)

its your tank. to each his/her own. as long as u like the way it looks and fush are healthy and happy(which they appear to be) then that is all that matters.as far as natural habitat being rocks, we took natural out of it when we put them in the glass box. lol. enjoy


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## NJmomie (Jan 17, 2013)

albita said:


> Yeah...I know it's busy. But, that's how I like it. Shrug. It makes it feel homey to me. The single color rock and lack of plants would feel too stark for my current tastes. It is challenging to vacuum the tank. I move about 1/2 the stuff to vacuum, then move it back when I'm done. I can't move the holey rock as it is far too heavy for me to move...but I figure there isn't anything getting under it anyway. Or at least, not much. I just wanted to make sure my fish's behavior wasn't an indicator of stress. I do have one that stays in the lower corner and always has...but it's never been picked on either (?). Other than that, I just thought it was weird that they were hanging out in the plant so much recently.


I hope I didn't come across as being too pushy or critical. It is your tank and should be to your taste. 
What I said was merely my opinion. Sorry if you or anyone else in the forum take my opinion personally.


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## albita (Oct 12, 2013)

I didn't take it personally at all . It would be an awfully boring world if we all decorated exactly the same.


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## ozman (Sep 7, 2012)

personally i think your tank is so busy with the decore that it distracts from your fish..and thats why we want them hey!. just my 2c worth.

all the best to you and you keep your tank how you like it. it's personal choice and your the one that has and looks after it. :fish: :thumb:


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## jphanton00 (Jan 5, 2013)

My personal experience is that how you have your tank now, won't be what you end up with when your colony is finished and full grown. Your giant TX holey rock is great for fry, but the holes appear too small for any value as far as hiding space for bigger fish. Like you, I partly set my tank up how I enjoyed for personal appeal and partly for how I thought it would be in their natural environment. It wasn't until almost a year later when my labs were full grown and matured that I started to notice an issue. Granted I had the cowering in the corners that the others have spoken about throughout this past year, but until recently I didn't realize that was cowering (I'm still learning the fish behavior). It wasn't until my male lab went all nutso and killed one of my females. That's when I realized my set-up was completely wrong. I wasn't crazy about cichlid stones, because to me they don't look natural and they're ugly. But I broke down and bought several (they do not displace as much water as actual rock does). I also set up my current rock to create tunnels and escape routes. So basically my tank is one part real rock and one part fake, hollowed stones (you can click TANK under my name to see the picture). But since the complete 180, my male has stopped his crazy behavior and no one cowers now. I also added several more females for good measure. But from what research I've done it appears that Mbuna like hiding spots like caves and nooks. I notice mine like tight spaces big enough to turn around in where its dark and their backside is covered. They don't have to worry about being snuck up on. The females need the tunnels and swim thrus where they know they can escape an aggressive male without him following.

Its sort of overwhelming and a ton of information, but my best advice is keep what you have until you start to notice an issue. Then be prepared to change it. And most of the pretty and appealing décor that I enjoy personally (like castles and bridges and lots of plants) do not work for these fish. But the fish are pretty and appealing enough that I find I don't need all that other stuff. Trust me, once these guys become full grown, you won't want all that other stuff in there because you'll want to see these guys in all their glory. That's the beautiful part of the tank. If you're one of those that likes the tank décor more (which there is NOTHING wrong with) then I would get smaller, less aggressive fish and then go crazy on whatever décor you like. But unfortunately and fortunately, lol, with these fish you will need to design the tank around their needs and not yours as I found out the hard way. If you look online for videos of Lake Malawi, you can see that virtually no plants exist where these guys reside and its basically just a sandy bottom with nothing but rock piles. Kind of blah, but it is what they're accustomed to. These that have been bred in captivity, well, I imaging they can adapt, but the principle of feeling safe is the same.


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## albita (Oct 12, 2013)

Thanks . You bring up some really interesting points. I will make sure to be watching the fish for any signs of stress. Some of the holey rock has really big holes (hard to see those in the pic)...but some of them may be too small once the fish grow up and may need a bit of a redesign at that point. Which, honestly, I'll probably be ready for. I like changing things up in my house, so I can't imagine I won't be changing things up over time in my fish tank.


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## enshacra (Nov 13, 2013)

Enough hiding places so much i just lost myself hehe...


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## richraceri (Mar 3, 2013)

These fish are often happiest hovering in their own small space watching everyone else in the pecking order. The happiness they get from keeping an eye on each other tends to lead us all to a pile of rocks and open water. 
If you feel a need for more try these. Plastic plants for color. Store bought plants are way to thick. I reduce the foliage to just 1 or 2 stalks for color but no real loss of space. A 1/4" masonery drill bit makes any rock a suitable anchor for all the extra stalks you end up with. The fish like to stand behind them but can still watch/monitor aggressors though a single stalk plant. This one stalk plastic plant approach lets me add some color (without detracting from fish color) and some opportunity to dodge a chaser without really using up any free water space.
I have never had any luck with 1 opening cichlid caves. Single opening caves tend to attract mostly the alpha male. Others don't want to be trapped with no way out. I sometimes use the bigger penn plax structures. I create multiple openings on one side with a carbide rotary bit on my air compressor but add no openings on the backside. An alpha can use the openings in the decoration to watch his front yard and hovering under the decoration lets him have a reprieve form harsh lighting (fish have no eyelids). But space between the tank wall and solid backside of the decoration creates a safety zone for lessor fish. My alpha males tend to not go around back of the decoration as they see the back wall as a limit to their territory. 
Of course even the fish down on the pecking order like to watch their tankmates so in the end any safe space created behind any decoration isn't really winning. It just adds to the illusion an alpha might have about space boundaries he can defend. A pile of rocks and open water lowers aggression because it's crowded and offers the least defined natural territory boundaries. We tend to end up there, and the fish are pretty awesome without all the excess stuff. Cichlids arn't really decoration fish in my experience.


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