# Bottom Feeders



## dkbrasher

What suggestions do you folks have on bottom feeders in a mixed Malawi tank? I would like something that adds interest but serve its purpose. Any suggestions?


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## smellsfishy1

Catfish are usually a good addition.
Pretty much any synodontis catfish should work out for you.
They are active and I think attractive but also work well with cichlids.


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## dsawyer56

I have a Pictus Catfish, an upside down catfish and a pleco. Havn't had any problems so far and they keep my tank nice and clean.


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## Darkside

dkbrasher said:


> What suggestions do you folks have on bottom feeders in a mixed Malawi tank? I would like something that adds interest but serve its purpose. Any suggestions?


Why do you need a bottom feeder? All cichlids eat off the ground, they fulfill the same niche as a catfish or loach in aquaria.


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## il0veCichlids

Here are some bottom feeders i got in my cichlid tanks. i love bottom feeders so i try to have a variety of them, not just becaues they clean the tank but they look awesome and have great personality!

I buy them all as babies and raise them.
3 FeatherFin Catfish (Syno Euruptus)
2 Raphael Catfish 
1 Spotted Pleco
1 Rubberlip Pleco
1 Zebra Loach
1 Lahota Botia

and I also have some snails and some ghost shrimps in other tanks! they're fun to watch especially the STRIPED RAPHAEL CATFISH. The cichlids wont eat the raphael since all catfish have rock spines and will like hurt the cichlids mouth if attempted.


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## Darkside

il0veCichlids said:


> Here are some bottom feeders i got in my cichlid tanks. i love bottom feeders so i try to have a variety of them, not just becaues they clean the tank but they look awesome and have great personality!
> 
> I buy them all as babies and raise them.
> 3 FeatherFin Catfish (Syno Euruptus)
> 2 Raphael Catfish
> 1 Spotted Pleco
> 1 Rubberlip Pleco
> 1 Zebra Loach
> 1 Lahota Botia
> 
> and I also have some snails and some ghost shrimps in other tanks! they're fun to watch especially the STRIPED RAPHAEL CATFISH. The cichlids wont eat the raphael since all catfish have rock spines and will like hurt the cichlids mouth if attempted.


Catfish and loaches don't clean the tank any better than cichlids do.


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## oldcatfish

I disagree with the statement made by Darkside----some species of catfish and loaches do a much better job of cleaning an aquarium than most cichlids. Catfish and loaches have a much better sense of smell and will usually eat smaller pieces of food than an equal sized cichlid will accept. That being said, there are exceptions to that rule---predatory catfish are less efficient scavengers than sand sifting cichlids such as Geophagus or Fossochromis.

Now, whether you need catfish and loaches in your aquarium is an entirely different debate. If you don't overfeed your cichlids, and you keep the substrate clean---then your cichlids will thrive without them. And bottom feeders do add to the bio-load of your tank.


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## Darkside

oldcatfish said:


> I disagree with the statement made by Darkside----some species of catfish and loaches do a much better job of cleaning an aquarium than most cichlids. Catfish and loaches have a much better sense of smell and will usually eat smaller pieces of food than an equal sized cichlid will accept. That being said, there are exceptions to that rule---predatory catfish are less efficient scavengers than sand sifting cichlids such as Geophagus or Fossochromis.
> 
> Now, whether you need catfish and loaches in your aquarium is an entirely different debate. If you don't overfeed your cichlids, and you keep the substrate clean---then your cichlids will thrive without them. And bottom feeders do add to the bio-load of your tank.


If you feed pellets catfish will make 0 difference.


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## oldcatfish

Actually, if you feed pellets...that's when they often make the biggest difference. If your cichlids are eating large enough pellets that they have to chew them (so that small food particles come out of their gills), that's where catfish & loaches will help. If you are very careful about your feeding, and only feed pellets that your cichlids can swallow whole---then the bottom feeders really won't help.

But most people tend to feed enough that there is at least some unwanted food particles----it's up to the aquarist to either clean it up with a gravel siphon, or use bottom feeders to assist.

I'll give you a personal experience of mine with a spotted Raphael catfish that I had in a heavily stocked 75g all male Mbuna tank. I put the little fellow in with cichlids twice his size. I really never saw him, and forgot all about him. When I tore down the tank to move to another house several years later---there he was....at about three times his original size. I never fed any special food to him and cleaned the aquarium twice a week(with weekly gravel vacuum). I am very careful about feeding--I often take flak from other fish keepers about not feeding enough to my fish---but clearly, I was feeding enough that the "scavenger" found food in my tank. In my case, the heavy stocking was a major factor, but I would have expected the catfish to starve to death....or at least be out during the daylight looking for food.


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## Darkside

oldcatfish said:


> Actually, if you feed pellets...that's when they often make the biggest difference. If your cichlids are eating large enough pellets that they have to chew them (so that small food particles come out of their gills), that's where catfish & loaches will help. If you are very careful about your feeding, and only feed pellets that your cichlids can swallow whole---then the bottom feeders really won't help.
> 
> But most people tend to feed enough that there is at least some unwanted food particles----it's up to the aquarist to either clean it up with a gravel siphon, or use bottom feeders to assist.
> 
> I'll give you a personal experience of mine with a spotted Raphael catfish that I had in a heavily stocked 75g all male Mbuna tank. I put the little fellow in with cichlids twice his size. I really never saw him, and forgot all about him. When I tore down the tank to move to another house several years later---there he was....at about three times his original size. I never fed any special food to him and cleaned the aquarium twice a week(with weekly gravel vacuum). I am very careful about feeding--I often take flak from other fish keepers about not feeding enough to my fish---but clearly, I was feeding enough that the "scavenger" found food in my tank. In my case, the heavy stocking was a major factor, but I would have expected the catfish to starve to death....or at least be out during the daylight looking for food.


Substrate will affect the distribution of food. I can agree that there will be more misplaced food over gravel than sand, which is why your raphael cat was find enough to eat. Over sand there will be little difference. I keep and breed all kinds of bottom feeding fish. Currently I'm breeding dwarf cories, Synodontis, BN plecos and kuhli loaches. I use sand across all of my aquariums and I do make a special effort to feed the substrate feeding fish as well as the other inhabitants. Nothing will keep an aquarium clean better than sand-sifting fish.


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## oldcatfish

Darkside, you are right....sand would make a difference. In all my years of fishkeeping, I've always used gravel----nothing against sand, I just never had a reason to change.


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## hollyfish2000

All that said -- I wouldn't give up my synodontis (multipunctatus or lucippinis) for anything!!! They are so beautiful and with so much personality. I do feed mine, in addition to them getting what they can off the bottom. At least four minimum, for the full effect IMHO


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## gnomemagi

My Syno Eruptus is an awesome guy. I'm probably the opposite of oldcatfish - I probably overfeed my tank. My Syno has a pot belly. 

I find this species to be a fairly aggressive (in terms of bottom feeders) and mine will routinely chase my SA/CA cichlids away from his log (which he is too fat to go inside now ). I feel they would hold their own against mbuna.


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## oldcatfish

Don't get me wrong...if I know that I have bottom feeders in the tank, I do feed them a couple of times a week. But in the case I was relating....the catfish disappeared---I'd taken all the decorations out of the tank several times for cleaning before. I never did figure out where he was hiding.


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## iCichlid

How do you feed the Syno's? I have 4, and well, if i feed a sinking food, they are gobbled up before hitting the bottom! I try to target feed them so their food goes into their cave, but with 15+ Cichlids, yeah...

Any suggestions?


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## oldcatfish

In heavily stocked tanks---I turn the lights out for a couple of hours...then I put sinking food into the tank. The catfish easily find the food first. Or you can just feed them first thing in the morning, before the lights come on.
With larger Synodontus catfish---you don't need to do that...they'll push the cichlids out of the way.


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## iCichlid

i tried that, my Mbuna are too smart. so now i feed one side of the tank then to try to feed the side the Syno's live on... so far so good!!


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## oldcatfish

If you wait long enough with the lights out (or get up early enough in the morning), your cichlids will be asleep----the catfish won't...and will easily find the food first, especially if you leave the lights off for awhile longer.


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## Darkside

iCichlid said:


> i tried that, my Mbuna are too smart. so now i feed one side of the tank then to try to feed the side the Syno's live on... so far so good!!


Mbuna and smart in the same sentence :lol: Oldcatfish is right, if you wait long enough your cichlids will be asleep.


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## smellsfishy1

Darkside said:


> iCichlid said:
> 
> 
> 
> i tried that, my Mbuna are too smart. so now i feed one side of the tank then to try to feed the side the Syno's live on... so far so good!!
> 
> 
> 
> Mbuna and smart in the same sentence :lol: Oldcatfish is right, if you wait long enough your cichlids will be asleep.
Click to expand...

They are definitely opportunistic. 
I also feed my cats after the lights have been out for a while.
Algae discs/wafers seem to be appreciated along with pellets, pretty much anything that sinks.


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## sim_plic_i_ty

iCichlid said:


> How do you feed the Syno's? I have 4, and well, if i feed a sinking food, they are gobbled up before hitting the bottom! I try to target feed them so their food goes into their cave, but with 15+ Cichlids, yeah...
> 
> Any suggestions?


I would like to know this as well...


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## Rhinox

My syno's are smart. They've adapted to the mbuna stealing all the food before it hits the bottom. Bottom feeders, eh? My syno's swim upside down at the surface grabbing the pellets before they sink!

Occasionally, I drop some food pellets in my AQ110 filter return which instantly pushes the pellets down to the sand and into the rocks before the cichlids have a chance to eat them. Some of the cichlids still grab the food off the bottom, but the catfish do get some of the pellets. The only way I know everyone is getting enough food is that in 3 months since I got them, nobody has starved, and everyone is growing. Once the cichlids start breeding regularly, I will let them mostly spit in the tank, where I imagine the catfish will get a lot of fry to eat during the nights.


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