# Filter Decisions and Questions



## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

Right now I have the Penguin 350 HOB and I'm thinking of going with the Marineland C220. I have a 55g tank. First, will the canister provide for better filtering even though the Penguin 350 is rated for a 70gal tank and the c220 is rated for a 55gal?

Second, how often do media havve to be changed on the canister and how often would I be cleaning the canister itself?


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## reflexhunter (Jul 25, 2009)

Run both on your tank


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## countryboy814 (Feb 19, 2012)

1) Run both
2) I clean canister about every 3 wks. I have a penguin 350 and clean it every other week. Bio media only has to be rinsed in aquarium water. Any other media can get the full cleaning


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

You can just run both...I agree with reflexhunter.

I recently bought a aquatop CF500UV and I am VERY happy with it. It would be plenty for a 55g and you can run it all by itself. It is only a few more $$$...holds A LOT more media and it has 525gph flow versus 220gph. Remember...after media is put into canister filters the true GPH will be less than half. So the marineland 220 will be around 100gph and the CF500uv will be around 250-300gph. Just something to consider....


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

So why not just get another Penguin 350 instead of the canister?


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Pipsfc said:


> So why not just get another Penguin 350 instead of the canister?


Canister is far superior IMO. Holds more media...a lot more. Better filtration overall. Also quieter.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

Dang! I was hoping to get rid of my HOB. I was Also thinking about stepping up to the c360 thinking that would provide the 7 turns an hour, but since I just found out the media basically cuts the gph in half that wont work. This hobby is proving to be costly, yet fun.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

countryboy814 said:


> 1) Run both
> 2) I clean canister about every 3 wks. I have a penguin 350 and clean it every other week. Bio media only has to be rinsed in aquarium water. Any other media can get the full cleaning


Just make sure I understand, when you say "clean" canister every 3 wks or your 350 every other week, do you mean just changing the media or full up scrub down the filters?


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## reflexhunter (Jul 25, 2009)

Running two filters not only helps with the bio load and mechanical filtration, but if for any reason one should fail, you would still have one running and hopefully you wouldn't have any issues with the chemistry of your tank.

As far as cost of the filters, you could try to purchase used equipment, or use off brand filters that have some pretty good reviews. I have a couple of the Odyessea cf500 canister filters that I have modded(google it and you will find the mod that someone else came up with) very impressed so far with this filter, moves and filters quite a lot of water and for the cost of one of the name brands you could buy anywhere from 2-4 of these filters(59.95) 
Gl
Daniel


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## rgr4475 (Mar 19, 2008)

Pipsfc said:


> countryboy814 said:
> 
> 
> > 1) Run both
> ...


I clean my canister filters once a month or so. I only run sponges and bio media in mine. I take all the trays out of the filter and rinse off the inside and clean the sponges real good with tank water. When the bio media starts getting real gunky, I give it a light rinse with tank water and back in it goes. FX5 and C360 btw.

On my HOB's. (Emperor 400's) I replace the filter floss (pillow stuffing) in the grey media tray about once every two weeks. I clean or replace the blue filter cartridges about once a month and will do a total break down cleaning of them about once every 4-6 months.


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## countryboy814 (Feb 19, 2012)

rgr4475 said:


> Pipsfc said:
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> 
> > countryboy814 said:
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HOB I clean more because of sand that piles up. Impellers are expensive. The canister I clean when flow is reduced. Canisters are huge nitrate factorys if unattended.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

I seem to be having issues keeping my nitrate levels low. Would that be due to a lack of filtration?


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## countryboy814 (Feb 19, 2012)

Nitrates can be controlled by water changes, substrate cleaning and filter cleaning. By this I mean that the waste material put out by your fish needs to be removed.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

As countryboy814 stated above,

High nitrates is usually a sign that your filter is dirty and needs to be cleaned more frequently than you currently are doing, you need to do more frequent and/or larger water changes, fish waste is building up in the substrate or around any decor you have or that your tap water is high in nitrates.

What species of fish do you have in the 55G tank, how many are there and approximately how large are they?


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

Deeda said:


> As countryboy814 stated above,
> 
> High nitrates is usually a sign that your filter is dirty and needs to be cleaned more frequently than you currently are doing, you need to do more frequent and/or larger water changes, fish waste is building up in the substrate or around any decor you have or that your tap water is high in nitrates.
> 
> What species of fish do you have in the 55G tank, how many are there and approximately how large are they?


I know water changes are what help reduce the nitrate levels, but I do 20% water changes every two weeks and change my HOB filter cartridges once a month. Maybe I need to change them more often. Something I haven't done is clean the filter completely yet. I need to do that. Here is what I have in the tank right now but I'm about to change it up:

1 Labidochromis caeruleus

2 Metriaclima estherae
2 Metriaclima lombardoica

1 Pseudotropheus sp. "Acei" (Msuli)

1 Shark catfish

1 Sucker fish that I can never pronounce the name to.

I'm reluctantly getting rid of the 2 Metriaclima lombardoica to reduce my number of species to three and because these guys are the more aggresive ones. I'm also getting rid of my Shark Catfish since he's about 5" now and requires a brackish water tank. I'll be adding more of the other guys to make my setup 1M:3F for each species.

I also picked up the Fluval 206 today from PetSmart since it was 50% off. I'll be adding it to my Penguin 350 HOB to incease my GPH cycling. I'm excited as it's my first canister. Eventually I want to replace my HOB with a Fluval 306 or 406 or the Marineland C220 or C360. I know now that I don't need the carbon in the 206 but is there anything else I need to know when I set it up?


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## countryboy814 (Feb 19, 2012)

20% every 2 weeks......yikes. I do at least a 35% change every week.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

Maybe I need to do that then.


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## smitty (May 7, 2004)

You can run both. But I would be cleaning a canister once a month. I also would not buy the Marineland I would go with a Eheim.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Pipsfc said:


> Deeda said:
> 
> 
> > As countryboy814 stated above,
> ...


Ok....you need to step up the size and frequency of your water changes. Also...I wouldn't throw away your filters instead clean them in old tank water. I do a 80% water change every 5 days. I would recommend doing 35% water changes weekly if not 50%.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

13razorbackfan said:


> Pipsfc said:
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> > Deeda said:
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Wow! I had no idea I needed to change the water that frequently. I always thought it was bad on the fish changing the water that often and with those amounts. I'll be sure to take your advice.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

[/quote]
Wow! I had no idea I needed to change the water that frequently. I always thought it was bad on the fish changing the water that often and with those amounts. I'll be sure to take your advice.[/quote]

Yeah...if the filters are established you can change large amounts of water as long as the water going in is the same temp and same chemistry(kH/pH) or close to it. Your fish will thank you for it, you will get good growth, nice colors, less stress, fins and other injuries heal quicker, etc....


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

13razorbackfan said:


> > Wow! I had no idea I needed to change the water that frequently. I always thought it was bad on the fish changing the water that often and with those amounts. I'll be sure to take your advice.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


How do you manage to keep the water going in around the same pH/kH when using a siphon attached the sink? I've always added the buffers and chems as the water goes in, but not with more than 20% water change.


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## rgr4475 (Mar 19, 2008)

Pipsfc said:


> 13razorbackfan said:
> 
> 
> > > Wow! I had no idea I needed to change the water that frequently. I always thought it was bad on the fish changing the water that often and with those amounts. I'll be sure to take your advice.
> ...


I use a home made Python water changer and use the sink. I made a line on the tank I take the water down to and calculated the amount of gallons I removed from the tank and just add my buffers and water conditioner as I am filling the tank back up.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Pipsfc said:


> 13razorbackfan said:
> 
> 
> > > Wow! I had no idea I needed to change the water that frequently. I always thought it was bad on the fish changing the water that often and with those amounts. I'll be sure to take your advice.
> ...


What buffers and chems are you adding and why? What is your kH/pH out of the tap? i add nothing to my water except my dechlorinator.


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## rgr4475 (Mar 19, 2008)

13razorbackfan said:


> What buffers and chems are you adding and why? What is your kH/pH out of the tap? i add nothing to my water except my dechlorinator.


Lucky!! In the previous place I lived, I had to do the entire buffer recipe. My new place, the only thing I need now is add baking soda because my tap PH is low.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

rgr4475 said:


> 13razorbackfan said:
> 
> 
> > What buffers and chems are you adding and why? What is your kH/pH out of the tap? i add nothing to my water except my dechlorinator.
> ...


Indeed. The last I checked my tap pH it was mid 8's and the kH was pretty high as well.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

My pH levels from the tap are about 6.9. My kH is quite low and usually reads around 60. I was using Kent Cichlid Chemistry but that would do nothing for my pH and kH. I decided to try the baking soda method and that worked great!


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## B.Roberson (Nov 6, 2011)

Yes. You need to do 40-50% wc WEEKLY. No exceptions to get your nitrates down. And your fish and your filters will be happier.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

B.Roberson said:


> Yes. You need to do 40-50% wc WEEKLY. No exceptions to get your nitrates down. And your fish and your filters will be happier.


I definitely will be now that I know it's ok. I'll be doing my first 40% either today or tomorrow. It's weird but I'm actually excited and looking forward to it!


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Pipsfc said:


> B.Roberson said:
> 
> 
> > Yes. You need to do 40-50% wc WEEKLY. No exceptions to get your nitrates down. And your fish and your filters will be happier.
> ...


LOL....I remember those days!!!


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

13razorbackfan said:


> Pipsfc said:
> 
> 
> > B.Roberson said:
> ...


To be honest, I've got this new cichlid fever and all I want to do is get more of them, make sure they have a good place to live, and find a new, bigger tank to start another setup. This is so much, but it can get pricey.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

[/quote]
To be honest, I've got this new cichlid fever and all I want to do is get more of them, make sure they have a good place to live, and find a new, bigger tank to start another setup. This is so much, but it can get pricey.[/quote]
Yep...be sure to pace yourself.....take your time in getting the right fish. I have had the bad habit in the past about getting whatever fish looked good at the time. I felt I wasn't "complete" unless I bought another fish.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

13razorbackfan said:


> > To be honest, I've got this new cichlid fever and all I want to do is get more of them, make sure they have a good place to live, and find a new, bigger tank to start another setup. This is so much, but it can get pricey.
> 
> 
> Yep...be sure to pace yourself.....take your time in getting the right fish. I have had the bad habit in the past about getting whatever fish looked good at the time. I felt I wasn't "complete" unless I bought another fish.


That's something I'm learning now. Fortunately, I realized this early in my new adventure thanks to you guys.


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## TribalTwinSC (Mar 28, 2011)

When (if ever) should you do a complete cleaning of your aquarium? By this I mean removing the fish and putting into a temporary holding tank, removing all decorations and subtrate and cleaning under the under gravel filter. Our tank has a 30-60 gallons out of water filter as well as an under gravel filter (with 4 suction tubes). We have noticed some debris collecting under the under gravel filter. Sorry but I couldn't find a better place to put this post...sorry if there is already one.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

TribalTwinSC said:


> When (if ever) should you do a complete cleaning of your aquarium? By this I mean removing the fish and putting into a temporary holding tank, removing all decorations and subtrate and cleaning under the under gravel filter. Our tank has a 30-60 gallons out of water filter as well as an under gravel filter (with 4 suction tubes). We have noticed some debris collecting under the under gravel filter. Sorry but I couldn't find a better place to put this post...sorry if there is already one.


Really depends on load....I would clean it once a year or so. Personally I would just remove the UGF all together. Much better options for filtration where it is easier to clean.


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## TribalTwinSC (Mar 28, 2011)

13razorbackfan said:


> TribalTwinSC said:
> 
> 
> > When (if ever) should you do a complete cleaning of your aquarium? By this I mean removing the fish and putting into a temporary holding tank, removing all decorations and subtrate and cleaning under the under gravel filter. Our tank has a 30-60 gallons out of water filter as well as an under gravel filter (with 4 suction tubes). We have noticed some debris collecting under the under gravel filter. Sorry but I couldn't find a better place to put this post...sorry if there is already one.
> ...


thanks!!!! that actually makes alot of sense...then you would never need to do a total water change.


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## Pipsfc (May 25, 2012)

Yeah I never use an UGF. I did a long time ago but gave up on them. Too much of a pain in the butt.


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