# Is firemouth aggression a problem in my tank?



## matt-the-geek (Jul 8, 2009)

I have a 55g that I stocked about a month ago. Its current inhabitants are one Firemouth, a Jack Dempsey, a convict, and 8 serpae tetras. I've noticed that the Firemouth has become the "king of the tank." most likely because he is bigger than the other two fish, the JD is the smallest of the three. Whenever I watch the tank it seems that the FM is chasing around my JD. He never seems to actually attack him but he makes him run alot. He also will have show downs with the convict that consists of them just staring eachother down till one backs off. I'm worried though that with all the chasing my JD will become overly stressed and not develop as well which I really don't want considering hes my favorite in the tank. So I'm just wondering if I'm getting worried over nothing or if I should remove the firemouth and add another one later on when my other two fish have grown more.


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## AnnaFish (Aug 9, 2006)

I don't really know that much yet, but it seems to me like you have 3 alpha males in one tank. You know what I mean? You have 3 species that are sort of stubborn and strong willed. Also, I don't know that a 55 is big enough for any one of these fish when they are fully grown, let alone 3. The convict is probably okay. I don't know much about firemouths, but I'm pretty sure a lot of people wind up makeing JDs their "Wet Pets" Because they like a lot of space to themselves.

Someone with some real experience with CAs should answer you though.. I'm just mouthing off.


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## BRANT13 (Feb 18, 2009)

i think the tank is big def. big enough for a con or firemouth full grown .....id even feel comfortable having a JD in a 55g. There will always be aggression with cichlids id say if u start to notice the fish being beat up on ie torn fins missing scales ect...then i would take out the aggressor.


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## mlancaster (Jul 24, 2009)

Anna is right, the JD will eventually get big, some say a 55 gallon can only really house one full grown JD, and others even say that is pushing it. Are they juvies? How big?

Anyways, I think the fish you chose is a great combo, and if they are juvies should make for a great tank for a while and may even work out.

As of now (if juvies), I do not think you have anything to worry about. If there is no fin nipping on the JD, he gets away easily, and does not look stressed (pale, hanging out in the corner or by the filter, shaking), I would not worry. Everyone is just testing each other out, as they grow the ranking will likely change many times. As my fish grew up together the ranking constantly changed, a couple months one guy would be the boss then someone else would eat more get bigger and strut their stuff. I would just wait it out and keep an eye to see if anyone gets picked on too much and looks like they may not make it.

I guess what it comes down to, is all fish have different personalities, therefore, anything could happen.

This is just my opinion and what I would do. Have fun and keep us updated as they mature.

Thanks,
Matt


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## Diaster (Aug 17, 2009)

Let them have there fun once the JD gets bigger the con and firemouth will be dead and the JD will get the last laugh "or fin"


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

Diaster said:


> Let them have there fun once the JD gets bigger the con and firemouth will be dead and the JD will get the last laugh "or fin"


Not necessarily. I'he many a FM that made JD's look silly....


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## gnomemagi (Jun 13, 2009)

If you have a 29 gallon or something to put off to the side, putting the JD in there and letting him grow out in peace may be a good idea, or dividing the 55 and giving the JD a 1/3 section.

Once the JD is equal size or larger than the Firemouth he shouldn't be taking as much punishment. The Convict will be fine, there tough lil buggers.


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

I think that your tank is big enough for the 3 fish...but it is pushing the limits. Even in a larger aquarium, you'll have some chasing. I agree with the other post...if there is damage being done, or the chasing is constant, you could have a problem.

Try adding more hiding places so that the JD has some relief and has a chance to stake out a territory. Cichlids have very individual tempermants, but most likely, your JD will be the dominant fish, once it adds some size. JD males can reach 10 inches not counting the tail fin....though 7-8 inches is more common.

If you have too, you can divide a small section of the tank and put the JD on one side, and the other 2 fish on the other. Make a territorial visual barrier right next to the divider. Feed the JD more frequently (or a little more) than the firemouth and convict to get it to grow faster. Once it's quite a bit bigger....remove the divider.


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## matt-the-geek (Jul 8, 2009)

Hey, I might try the divider idea. I did want to put the JD in a seperate grow out tank but sadly I don't have one. As to looking stressed my JD does hang out by the filter a lot, though that might not be stress as much as it is his only "safe spot." So just to make sure I understand, if the chasing continues and seems to stress him out I should divide one third of my tank and have it just for him. Then remove the divider once he is big enough to fight back?


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## Joels fish (Nov 17, 2007)

The JDs going to outgrow the FMs so right now while the FMs rule the roost, down the road the tables may turn. Or at least find a balance. The sparing with the con seems normal enough for two very territorial species , since their pretty evenly matched in terms of size and temperment they ought to be fine so long as someone doesn't turn psyco.

One thing that's going to help is re-aranging the tank, and trying to aquascape it so that there are at least three distinct areas for these fish to claim as territories. Adding some extra hiding places helps as well so a chased fish can duck out of sight. Adding some plants (real or fake) to break lines of sight and some diftwood or rocks to make territorial borders that are defined(plants work here too) will help to slow down the aggression issues a good bit. Might not stop it but it helps a lot.


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## MonteSS (Dec 8, 2008)

Put hiding places (rocks, wood, pot, fake ornaments) that the smaller fish can hide in.

Once the JD getts bigger he/she should be dominant in the tank.

As TFG said. I have had firemouth that can be pretty mean when they are king.

Your tank and the three fish *should be fine long term.

...Bill


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## oldcatfish (May 27, 2009)

Yes, to your divider question. First try re-arranging and adding decorations, as suggested....then if you still have a problem--divide the tank. Once your JD is clearly larger than the Firemouth---remove the divider.


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## gage (Feb 7, 2007)

TheFishGuy said:


> Diaster said:
> 
> 
> > Let them have there fun once the JD gets bigger the con and firemouth will be dead and the JD will get the last laugh "or fin"
> ...


finally someone else...

Mine killed a carpintis... don't underestimate a PO'd firemouth like I did...


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

I have a male now in a 14' tank that 
HATES the male JD in there... To the point he'll actually hunt him down. He also defends a pipe right in the middle of the tank from every fish in there.. no fear what's so ever... Doesn't even back down to a 22" giant goramy who could swallow him whole!


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## FiremouthShogun (Apr 26, 2006)

Break up the LOS, that's great advice.

I'm against dividers LT in a 55g. Sort of a temporary solution. Better off moving a fish out than giving those fish an effective 25 gallons to work with.

I've found that rearranging, leaving the tank dark for 24 hours after that does wonders.

Sho


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## matt-the-geek (Jul 8, 2009)

I'm thinking maybe about just getting a really large plastic plant and putting it in the tank so that way the Firemouth won't see him unless he goes over there. it won't be permanent but just untill I judge that its safe to remove it. Sound good?


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## Leucistic Guy (Jul 8, 2009)

My FM( rescued female) owned my RD/Midas/FH for a while until the FH grew large enough to defend himself.
One day I woke of & found her fins a little shredded, I think he wanted to "do the nasty".

I removed her & moved her in my "mixed growout" tank.
She's in with a friendly blue acara(female), 2 young texas & a young pink convict.
She absolutely owns this setup even with rearranging & rescaping.
She doesn't hurt the others, but she'll push them around whenever she wants to. 
No damaged fins just a whole lot of chasing.


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## SiNFuLWaYs (May 18, 2009)

i have a pair of fm's in a tank only about 2" or so an they chase just about anyone but my adult midas 10-11" with tail they stay away from her but attack the jags or cons an any one they get near like a bunch of mini fish picking on giants... :lol: 
i love my fm they just had their first spawning but i have a pain in the neck aurautus in the tank so the 1st time didnt go so well eggs were dropped off an never seen...
great fish but once a pair kinda hard to keep others not big enough to fight back or defend themselves.


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## matt-the-geek (Jul 8, 2009)

So far I actually havent taken any action at all, things seem to have calmed down a lot lately. I still see my JD get chased but its much less common now so i'm not to worried. Hes growing up fast so he should be able to defend himself soon.


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