# Chipokae or Auratus?



## saucy1001 (Jun 19, 2015)

I picked this guy/girl up from the petstore the other day, can anyone help me figure out what it is? I was thinking Chipokae or Auratus - please help?
ps. Its only 1 in long


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## noki (Jun 13, 2003)

Definately Auratus.

Very colorful and cute when little. Not always so when adult.


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## Ten Tonne Tomahawk (Apr 24, 2015)

Noki, I wouldn't be so quick. That muzzle looks extended.
Saucy1001, I'd really like to see a shot from the side and not so much from above. The biggest tell for this is the muzzle shape.


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

noki said:


> Definately Auratus.
> 
> Very colorful and cute when little. Not always so when adult.


This is 100% correct without question.


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## Mr Chromedome (Feb 12, 2013)

Ten Tonne Tomahawk said:


> Noki, I wouldn't be so quick. That muzzle looks extended.
> Saucy1001, I'd really like to see a shot from the side and not so much from above. The biggest tell for this is the muzzle shape.


Actually, the best tell on juvies is the caudal pattern. Solid yellow on the lower half is unique to _auratus_. The tail on _chipokae_ has radiating dark lines from the caudal base that run top to bottom. And I'm reasonably sure there are hybrids out there.


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## Ten Tonne Tomahawk (Apr 24, 2015)

Mr Chromedome said:


> Actually, the best tell on juvies is the caudal pattern. Solid yellow on the lower half is unique to _auratus_. The tail on _chipokae_ has radiating dark lines from the caudal base that run top to bottom.


I must admit, I didn't know that, I have always gone off the muzzle. The Chipokae is almost gone from Australia, it's a step up to code extra red, from the code red of the Auratus, IMO, and that's likely why.



Mr Chromedome said:


> And I'm reasonably sure there are hybrids out there.


You are not wrong.


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## saucy1001 (Jun 19, 2015)

So its probably Auratus or hybrid? Either way I'm pretty sure the other one I bought is Kenyi now and they probably can't stay in the same tank for very long right? I'll be getting a second tank soon since I have a double stand - what can I have in with them respectively?


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## Ten Tonne Tomahawk (Apr 24, 2015)

The second photo is much better. The muzzle looks slighter on the second photo. 
With what has been said about the Auratus and it's trademark sold yellow lower tail, I think you have a pretty tidy example. I'm not 100% sure, but I would be suprised if a hybrid between the 2 species (Auratus & Chipokae) ruined this aspect of the fish to some degree.
As for compatibility with what looks to me to be a Kenji, (5 faceted bars and a 6th that is more of a collar), that will depend heavily on their respective sexes. If they're both girls, you'll likely be ok to keep them together. If they're both boys, you may experience some agro and may have to split them, that will be up to the individual fish. As far as species go, compatability should be ok, provided they are same sex. Lomabrdoi and Auratus are both the 'fish you're Mum warned you about' and folks here are often advised to exclude them from tank lists. As such, from my point of view anyway, it puts them both in the same category, which is something like 'too agro for most'. In that regard, they match and aught to be able to counter each other's aggression. This will of course, depend on the tank size and decor. You're problem may turn out to be "What else can I put in there?"
For what it's worth, I have both of these together, both male and although they are in an 8x2x2, their small territories border each other's. Aside from some frenzied territorial disputes/confirmations, which amount to lots of fast moving, fins up and shaking, they seldom make contact and have never been seen actually fighting.


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## saucy1001 (Jun 19, 2015)

Thanks for your help Ten, I'm pretty sure my tank is not big enough for both when they are full grown so keeping an eye out for a used one. About what size should I be able to sex them?


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## Ten Tonne Tomahawk (Apr 24, 2015)

ITs hard to tell. Female presence will quicken their adolescence, at about 2 inches, the kanji should show some signs of beginning to turn yellow. This will start in the fins and face.
As for the auraturd, um, I mean auratus, the yellow starts to get darker until it goes black along the bottom half of the fish and the top will pale to white. If this hasn't happened by the 2.5 - 3 inch mark, I would suggest you have a girl.


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## noki (Jun 13, 2003)

saucy1001 said:


> Thanks for your help Ten, I'm pretty sure my tank is not big enough for both when they are full grown so keeping an eye out for a used one. About what size should I be able to sex them?


What other fish do you have? Just these two? If there is a male, one will at least turn soon as they get 2" and bigger.

These fish need to be in a group, somewhat crowded to crowded. These fish can be very difficult to keep unless they are crowded or in a very large tank. You need to plan ahead what you want, since these fish often go psycho aggressive.


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## Ten Tonne Tomahawk (Apr 24, 2015)

noki said:


> saucy1001 said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks for your help Ten, I'm pretty sure my tank is not big enough for both when they are full grown so keeping an eye out for a used one. About what size should I be able to sex them?
> ...


This is right. The only tank mates compatible will be other maniacs.
Most maniacs will be too big for your tank.


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## saucy1001 (Jun 19, 2015)

it ate the blue one shortly after my last post. I have two cories it mostly leaves alone. Should I get more auratus then? or maybe give back to my lfs although I've grown attached to the little ******* lol


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

saucy1001 said:


> it ate the blue one shortly after my last post. I have two cories it mostly leaves alone. Should I get more auratus then? or maybe give back to my lfs although I've grown attached to the little #%$& lol


what are the dimensions of your tank?


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