# 75 gallon cookie cutter stocking question



## Amp (Dec 12, 2003)

I've kept Malawi Mbuna for several years but I've never kept any Tankanika Cichlids. I'm thinking of converting my 75 gallon aquarium into a Lake Tanganyika community tank. I've looked at the cookie cutter and Tanganyika community articles as well as some forum threads. I haven't been able to get a good read on whether or not I can keep the fish I want in that size tank and if I can how many. I'm hoping some you here can help me out.

The species that catch my eye and have me thinking about Tanganyikans are:

Altolamprologus calvus
Neolamprologus brichardi
Neolamprologus leleupi
Julidochromis ornatus or transcriptus

I know the Brichardi probably won't work so I'm thinking about setting up a separate species tank of those in a 46 gallon. Can I keep the other 3 in a 75 and if so how many? According to the first Tanganyika entry in the cookie cutter article I could keep 2 Leleupi, 3 Calvus, and a Julidochromis (assuming 1 since no number is given). 6 fish seems like a small number of fish for a 75 gallon tank. Could I add anything else? The Tanganyikan Community Tank: Part II article seems to suggest there would be room for some open water fish.

I appreciate any advise you all can give.


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

You mean this one?
Tanganyika Community

(Rockdweller I guess)

Select 3 types only:
Ã¢â‚¬Â¢ Neolamprologus cylindricus, mustax, leleupi or nigriventris - 2
Ã¢â‚¬Â¢ Altolamprologus calvus or compressiceps - 3
Ã¢â‚¬Â¢ Julidochromis or Chalinochromis
Ã¢â‚¬Â¢ Telmatochromis vittatus, bifrenatus or brichardi

Neolamprologus brichardi works fine untill they breed. Then all bets are off. Cutter is for Telmatochromis brichardi a far easier rockdweller to manage in a community tank.
Always read it as 3 breeding species myself start with a group of 4-6 of each and remove those that do not form the first pair or they get killed. Altolamps being different and can be kept (maybe best kept) two or three females per male.

Not a big fan of cylindricus, mustax, leleupi or nigriventris as I find em not to hold long term pairs.
So prob go with the other three.

Think if you drop any one pair you get em in separate rock piles with open sand between, then you can have a bunch of 12 Cyps and have em rest up in no ones rocky territory at night.
Thats the risk you run if you try all 3 pairs three rock piles plus cyps. The cyps slowly faid as they have no where to rest.

Think its prity good and reflects the territory holding of substrate spawners requiring territory space when paired.

I would though think instead of the Neolamps listed Neolamprologus caudopunctatus would be a better option.

If you want more fish then you can keep them as singles but never as many as a Malawi tank unless you go for Tang mouthbrooders.

All the best James


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

All the fish on your list are rock dwellers. You might be better to limit to two rock dwellers and add a bottom dweller (shellie) and a top dweller (cyp).

For example:
6 calvus
6 julidochromis
6 shellies like multifasciatus
12 non-jumbo cyps like utinta

The shellies and cyps will likely not need any fish removed.

The julidochromis will form a pair and may need the other 4 individuals removed.

The calvus will likely need any extra males removed.

PS caudopunctatus are some of my favorite fish, you could do them in place of the shellies but mine are not doing great with julidochromis in a 72" tank so the juli's will be going soon.


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## Amp (Dec 12, 2003)

24Tropheus said:


> You mean this one?
> Tanganyika Community
> 
> (Rockdweller I guess)
> ...





DJRansome said:


> All the fish on your list are rock dwellers. You might be better to limit to two rock dwellers and add a bottom dweller (shellie) and a top dweller (cyp).
> 
> For example:
> 6 calvus
> ...


Thanks you two for the advice. James, that's the cookie cutter example I was referring to. I was looking at selecting from the first 3 groups and dropping the 4th.

Both of you suggest dropping the leleupi so that I only have 2 rock dweller species. I have plenty of Texas Holey Rock. Does the amount of rock matter? If not could I drop the julidochromis instead? Without the leleupi I don't think I'll have enough color in the tank and the calvus is just a cool looking fish. I don't want to drop it either.

If the leleupi are a poor choice are their other options instead of cyps that would give me more color in the tank? Could I possibly add a few smaller open water Haps? I know they are from a different lake but they aren't that aggressive and have similar dietary requirements.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

You could do leleupi, calvus and cyps.

I had the same reason for wanting leleupi as you and added them in spite of advice that they would give my shellies a hard time. They did...even in a 72" tank and they also gave my caudopunctatus a hard time.

Maybe if you avoid any other bottom or rock dweller, you will enjoy them.

More rock does not enable more rock dwellers...a longer tank perhaps.


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Dunno mate leleupi longior have always been a pain for me in communities esp to anything else showing yellow. Maybe check out the yellow J.ornatus variants and the regani variants for colour.

To be honest far better to me than leleupi. (Unless maybe going for the super expensive orange German line bred guys.)
ornatus
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=2148
regani my fav kipili
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=2190
Or even better this example









Enough colour?

Thing is with most tangs always beaten for colour by Malawis (except Tropheus), but more than make up for it by being interesting to watch.

Yep you can mix em with Malawis, I do  . But its kind of a bit tacky? Kind of preffer an all tang tank or an all Malawi tank kind of more pleasing long term.

Must warn you if you use texas holy rock and Altolamps you will have a hard job separating em. The Altolamps lodge em selves in it every time you show em a net. :lol:

Had to get up in the middle of the night to separate one comp from her fav hidy hole. 

Yep agree some of the calvus variants are real cool looking fish and not a big pain aggression wise.

All the best James


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## Amp (Dec 12, 2003)

Those regani do look nice. Maybe I will go with those and some calvus instead. Shell dwellers hadn't really appealed to me before but I think I may give those a try as well. I'm still not sure about fish for the upper levels of the tank. I don't know where I would be able to get 12 cyps and Malawi haps would probably look better.

I've had my share of "fun" trying to remove fish with a lot of holey rock in the tank. I usually have to remove it all or almost all of it to catch anything.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

You're near enough to plenty of hobbyists and clubs that you should be able to score some cyps at a reasonable price.

Julies are awesome- I have raised and bred marleiri, regani, and transcriptus. Be aware that the larger julies (marlieri and regani) can sometimes kill female shellies while trying to get a fry in the shells. All of my julie pairs have tolerated extra julies in their tanks, so removing them may not be such an issue as some other pairing fish.

If you are not so keen on the shellies, you could go with a small group of xenotilapia instead. The stocking I'd recommend would be

12 non-jumbo Cyprichromis leptosoma
6 A. calvus
6 Xenotilapai (a smaller species)
6 J. regani

You would need to have tall, well separated rock/cave piles (3-4), and plenty of open sand for this set up.

More rocks in a Tang tank can just encourage a pair of fish to claim a larger territory. Open space (at least 8 inches is best) is not territory for the aggressive rock dwellers, and will keep them closer to their own pile of rocks.


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