# Jungle Vals



## edouthirt (Jan 22, 2008)

Ok... so this is my first run at live plants...

Everything I've heard is that Jungle Vals are super easy to keep alive... so of course I am already having issues trying to keep them healthy.

I have them planted in sand making sure that the crown is above the substrate and anchored down so they do not float.

They don't seem to be thriving so I changed out the light bulbs as they were kinda old (perhaps I should have done this sooner)

Anything else I need to do? is a fertilizer or flourish dosing necessary?


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## cevvin (May 2, 2008)

I would try fertilizer tabs that you put under the roots. Have not used flourish as we constructed our own DIY co2.


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## Chris-Indy (Jan 21, 2009)

What kind of lights do you have on your tank? You may have to start dosing with excel. I agree with the previous poster, go with the fert tabs.


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## edouthirt (Jan 22, 2008)

I just put on GE Aqua Rays... 1.24 watts per gallon... which I know isn't a whole lot, but from waht I read, should be fine for Vals?


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

My vals were a bit slow to start in the beginning. They are now taking over my tank. That said, I have 3 wpg, pressurized CO2 and eco-complete substrate. I do dose carefully with Excel, but I believe some have found that it's not good for vals. I think you have a combination of not sufficient nutrients in the substrate, not enough light and not enough C02. You might try a DIY yeast for C02. Plant tabs are a good idea. I do dose with Flourish (the general fertlizer, which is not the same as Excel) once a week at about half that recommended. Be careful, though. If you start to overfertlize when having insufficient light and C02, you'll just be feeding the algae . . .


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## 2ToneArmy (Feb 8, 2003)

I think he'd need more light for the plants to take advantage of the CO2, but yes, you can set CO2 up for about 20 bucks.

Try and shove a dual 48" shoplight fixture (around 10 bucks at hardware store) with a pair of 6500K daylight bulbs up there and you'll be heading in the right direction.


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## edouthirt (Jan 22, 2008)

alright... well I just bought a CO2 reactor on my lunch break from work... The place did not have any fert tabs which is what I was really hoping to find. I'm goin g to try another place closer to my house when I get home tonight... if not I'll order them online.

and I can't do the 4 ft light fixture since it's only a 29 gallon tank.

Anybody have issues with a pH drop when adding a CO2 reactor? I read somewhere online that I will have to be careful with that.


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## psyber (Jan 7, 2009)

Part of your problem might be trying to plant the vals in sand. From what I understand sand is a terrible medium for planting. You can try potting them in a terracotta flower pot filled with gravel. There are also many examples of DIY yest reactors on the web that are super easy to setup.


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

I'd heartily recommend the black Eco complete substrate. It looks like sand, but has great nutrients and is very easy to plant in.

Yes, C02 will bring your pH down, but it's not been an issue for me. Just monitor your kh to make sure you're not going to crash. My water is about 7.0-7.2 out of the tap and with C02 it's more like 6.2, which is quite a nice benefit for my SA fishies.


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## edouthirt (Jan 22, 2008)

I am actually going to avoid the CO2 reactor for now for two reasons:

1.) It's a brichardi tank and I try to keep the pH up

2.) after doing a lot of reading last night (including an article in the library of this site) and if I understand this correctly, a sign that you need supplemental CO2 is that your pH swings from morning to night due to "biogenic decalcification" during photosynthesis which means that the plants are absorbing all avalible CO2 in the water and still need more carbon so they get it by breaking down Calcium Carbonate bonds which in turn lowers your pH. So my understanding is that if you do not see a swing in pH from morning to night than the plants are being sufficed by the available CO2 already in the water and adding supplemental CO2 will be pointless and could actually lower the pH since a biproduct of the yeast reaction is an acid.

I will continue to monitor the pH and keep the CO2 reactor on hand in case I ever do need it (which I don't predict that I will)

I am going to try root fertilizer tabs... I think this is my best bet.

hollyfish2000, I've heard nothing but great things about Eco Complete and, possibly if I was starting from scratch I would go that route... but I don't want to remove the sand that i already have, and I have seen several tanks successfully grow Vals in sand (including other cichlid-forum members).

I hope the root tabs help along with the lighting change that I just made recently.

I would love to hear more suggestions and ideas if anybody has anything.

Thank you guys so much for the help thus far!!


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## BillD (May 17, 2005)

You might consider another type of val, such as spiralis, which only grows to 24". In my opinion, a plant that grows to 3 times the tank depth is a poor choice. Spiralis grows well with a minimum amount of light.


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## Donfish (Dec 24, 2007)

edouthirt said:


> ...Everything I've heard is that Jungle Vals are super easy to keep alive... so of course I am already having issues trying to keep them healthy....


Be glad of that if they did grow well you would be getting growth of up to a foot a day or more and you would have leaves 6 feet long and growing. Besides they get an ugly brown-gold tint when they hit the top in good light and lose that lime green that makes vals look good.

You say it's a Brichardi tank you may be best with non-rooted plants like Anubias species, Java Moss (Vesicularia dubyana) and Java Fern (Microsorum pteropus) which btw you can pick up at the chain pet stores in those little plastic plant containers, just read the label and make sure it's Microsorum pteropus, they also have Anubias nana in those containers. None of these guys need lots of light.

If you must grow vals then one of the spiraled vals (Vallisneria spiralis) types may be best like said above.

I grow mine in a just for plants tank and move them over to my other tanks when needed.


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## Donfish (Dec 24, 2007)

I should add Vals are a pain with digging fish anyway. They don't root real deep and the fish can pull up a whole chain like that, unless you weight each plant down you'll be getting wet.

I do weigh my non-rooted plants with those glass beads you can find in craft shops, they have a hole drilled in them and are about 1/2 to 1 inch in diameter, I use fishing line or nylon wire wraps to hold the bead to the plant. You can "float" the plant above the substrat with a length of fishing line and bury the bead or tuck the bead into a rock hole with it tied on real close to the plant.


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## edouthirt (Jan 22, 2008)

> I should add Vals are a pain with digging fish anyway. They don't root real deep and the fish can pull up a whole chain like that, unless you weight each plant down you'll be getting wet.


I already prepared for this and put plant anchors on all of them... if they end up flourishing and sending out runners, I'll decide then if I need to add more anchors.

If they don't end up flourishing, I'll look into the non-rooted plants that you mentioned or the Spiralis.

Thanks again!


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