# 20 Long Multispinosa



## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

I've decided to do Rainbows in a smaller tank than my 100 (which I'm keeping Tanganyikan.) I was thinking I'd get 6 juveniles and wait on a pair. What other tank mates would go well with these guys? No other cichlids, certainly. But I'm looking for ideas for a top and bottom fish.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

I got 5 false juli corydoras to keep the tank from loosing it's cycle while I wait on the rainbows to be delivered. Will they be able to stay in with the rainbows long term? What are some good suggestions for mid-upper shoaling/schooling fish that would be appropriate?


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## mlancaster (Jul 24, 2009)

Hi FedEXguy,

I do not have experience with Rainbows, but I have kept juli corydoras with aggressive cichlids in the past and they did fine. I just made sure to have driftwood and fake leaf litter for them to rest and hide under.

What is the difference between "fake juli" and "juli" corydoras?

Thanks,
Matt


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

There's really not much difference other than the true julii are uncommonly imported and what most fish stores sell as julii are usually trilineatus (as in my case) or sometimes leopardus.


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

Hey FedEX,

I was hesitant to answer because I had not bred rainbows yet and I was not sure if they were as docile as everybody says. But my pair laid eggs today! From my very brief experience coupled with everything I have read, I think you could get away with any of your normal tetras or swordtails. My pair seems to be guarding a 12" area, but I'm sure this will expand once the fry go free swimming.

I can't comment on the corys, as I never keep them with cichlids because of the egg eating. I will mention that I mixed darters (a native fish, reminds you of a goby) and the rainbows seem to be pestered by them and charge at them more often than other fish. I read in a article that this disdain for bottom dwellers is also seen in the wild. I'm posting the link for that article, as its an awesome read and really highlights why rainbows make an awesome display tank.

http://www.cichlidae.com/article.php?id=50


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

Congrats on the eggs! And thanks for the reply. Oddly enough, I read that same article today, haha. It looks like I'll have to play it by ear and take the corys out if they become a target. They're too cute to get murdered  Also, I've often thought about trying darters in a tank. You should get some pictures of those guys in there soon, I'd love to see them.


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## CjCichlid (Sep 14, 2005)

I've kept and spawned H. multispinosa. They are indeed a docile fish when compared to the rest of the CA complex. They also seem to do quite well in groups, so I feel multiple pairs is definitely not out of the question, even in a 20L. As for the cories, they should be just fine as long as they learn not to mess with the eggs/fry.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

CjCichlid,

What dithers did you have in with yours? Would cardinal tetras work or would a faster danio be better?


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## CjCichlid (Sep 14, 2005)

My H. multispinosa were in a 135gal CA community with a few other CA species, as well as a large school of Buenos Aires Tetra. In a 20gal, I'd probably skip dithers if your looking to keep multiple pairs. If your dead set on dithers however, I'd consider something a bit larger.. perhaps a harem of a livebearer species (molly and swords).


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

Nope, not set on them at all. If I don't need them to keep the rainbows from hiding, more's the better.


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## CjCichlid (Sep 14, 2005)

I don't think you'll have a problem with them hiding once they settle in. Mine were always pretty outgoing, especially in a small group.


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

Yeah, they are not really shy fish. Mine are spending a lot of time keeping each other in check. They seem to have a line drawn around their territory, once an invading fish crosses the line, the male will swim out and confront the invader. The confrontations have usually been body shaking (where they look like they are having a seizure lol), and gill flaring. Pretty entertaining fish. Also, from what I have seen from playing with the tank decor to see who will claim what, males claim territory and females kind of swim around and visit the different males.

Take my experience with a grain of salt, since I have only had them since Saturday. Mine my settle down and be boring eventually?


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

ahud, could you PM me your source for these fish? I'm having a hard time finding anyone that actually has them in stock.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

Ended up having to go the aquabid route for a group of 6. Hopefully I'll talk to the seller Sat or Mon and have these guys sometime next week!


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## CjCichlid (Sep 14, 2005)

I've used almost exclusively Aquabid when ordering fish online. I've never had a problem, just be sure to check the sellers reputation before placing a bid. I actually got my group of Rainbows from a guy off there as well..


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

Yeah, I've used it occasionally and not had a problem. I was just hoping to find a supplier my LFS could order from, so I wouldn't have to pay shipping  Also, unfortunately, I was just notified by the seller (which is a store, not an individual) that they actually sold out of them last week, but the online orders guy wasn't notified. So I'm back to square one with none to be found


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

They should get them in again soon. Rainbows are probably in the running with convicts as far as spawning frequency.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

True. Though it won't be long before it's too cold for non-waaaay-expensive shipping  I'm now wondering if I should just grow up something else in this tank over the winter, like maybe green fliers or sajica or something else suitably mild and small. Any suggestions?


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

Went ahead and pulled the trigger on green fliers. I'll update when I get them in.


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## CjCichlid (Sep 14, 2005)

Too bad about the H. multispinosa. A. centrarchus should make for an interesting fish too keep as well though. They are relatively similar to H. mutlispinosa, however they do get larger and I don't believe they fair nearly as well in groups. I'd look to end up keeping only a pair, especially in a 20L.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

Yeah, it is unfortunate. I read a number of people describe their A. centrarchus as bigger green versions of H. multispinosa, so that's why I chose them. But I'll be going for a pair in the 20, then let my friend make a pair in his 55 with the remainder going to my LFS' tanks (I got 6 juvies.) I've heard they grow pretty fast so I might switch the 20 Long for a 29 later on if I feel the pair is looking crowded. Or I still have the itch in the back of my head to turn the 5 foot tank into a CA/SA tank...time will tell!


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

I had a chance to pick some centrarchus up at a recent auction, but did not have the room. I am not sure they compare well with multispinosus, since they are quite a bit bigger and are not found in the same type of crowded environment multispinosus is. One key thing I like to look for is fish that come from very crowded environments, which usually means they show more ritualized aggression instead of seek and destroy aggression lol. No matter, they are very cool fish! I really want to try them some day.

Oh, and multispinosus was moved to the genus Archocentrus. Herotilapia is no longer a genus if I am not mistaken.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

You are correct about Herotilapia being defunct. But that's the way it still shows up just about everywhere you try to look for them, though, even on the profiles here. Also, I was basing some of my thoughts on the centrarchus because of this article http://issuu.com/nuttycichlids/docs/central_scene_3_new/11?e=0 in Lee Nuttal's e-zine. Check it out, it's interesting and the pictures are gorgeous!


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

Hey man,

How you liking your Archocentrus?

My tank came out awesome. Sadly, I ran into some trouble and lost a few of the adults, so I ditched them and stuck with my juveniles. Moved the 10 juveniles into the 125g a week or two ago, and now its like watching a nature documentary. Two pairs have set up shop on opposite sides of a wood pile, one has eggs and the other should be spawning in the next 24-48 hours. Really fun to watch them go 2v2 on each other. I have another pair forming, excited to see where they decide to settle down. I really wish I had a good camera or video recorder so I could capture some of the moments.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

I'm loving them! I ended up being able to get some multispinosus as well. I ordered 6 but only ended up with 5 as one turned out to be a juvie of something else. Seller said it's a red dragon flowerhorn, but it's too young to tell for sure. So I currently have 5 centrarchus and 5 multispinosus. 3 of the centrarchus were already about 2.5" when they came in, and now they're at least 3" and starting to get the darker colors in. The rainbows were all very tiny except one was about 1.5" and now he's about 2" and putting on some orange. Nobody has tried any spawning yet, but the biggest centrachus has peacefully claimed a corner of the tank.

I ended up putting everything in my 100g and selling most of my tanganyikans, except a few I'm trying to breed in a smaller tank. So there's also a group of 8 very young heros notatus in the big tank, too. Plus a couple firemouths and a shoal of colombian tetras. 2 plecos, 5 julii corydora, and 2 6" Dojo loaches that were dropped off at my LFS. Numbers will be paired down as things grow, but I'm also actively looking for an 8' 240g to upgrade to, and I have a few leads on that.

I'll get some pictures of everything soon and upload them. Took some not too long ago, but then everything started showing more color, so I'm waiting until I get some good shots of that.


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## BC in SK (Aug 11, 2012)

FedEXguy said:


> Seller said it's a red dragon flowerhorn, but it's too young to tell for sure.


Likely what the seller says. Fish is big enough to have a good idea. I have little doubt it's either Trimac or Trimac-based hybrid.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

Yeah, I don't doubt it's Trimac-based, especially not now that it's been getting a bit of color. But as far as I understand in the flowerhorn world (which I'm not into) a lot of Trimac hybrids and Flowerhorn "hybrids" get sold as red dragons, so I'm not going to say it's definitively that when I move it on.


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

Awesome man, glad it worked out! Good luck on the 240, such a great size big tank.


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## Darkskies (Mar 17, 2012)

Hey ahud,

How did your rainbow cichlid tank turn out? What did you think of the fish? Have they bred for you? Are they good parents?


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

Darkskies said:


> Hey ahud,
> 
> How did your rainbow cichlid tank turn out? What did you think of the fish? Have they bred for you? Are they good parents?


Love them. Check four posts up, I wrote a little blurb about the tank.


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## Darkskies (Mar 17, 2012)

ahud said:


> Darkskies said:
> 
> 
> > Hey ahud,
> ...


I had read that post and thought you were talking about centrarchus for some reason lol. Sorry. Great to hear that they're such entertaining fish. You had said once that multispinosa tend to quickly lose control of their brood, do you still find that to be the case?

Feel free to post videos/pics even if the quality isn't that great.. I'm sure we'd all appreciate it.


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

I'll be posting a write up on the tank soon :thumb:

Fedex, I want an update once everybody starts spawning. I'm interested to see how the two Archocentrus species interact with each other.


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## FedEXguy (Feb 24, 2005)

Will do. I think the centrarchus will have a leg up on the multispinosa since the largest one I have seems to be female and the rainbows, size-wise, are pretty behind.


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

I agree. But I still think they will carve out a little niche in your tank. I had a leftover male Apistogramma macmasteri that I tossed in the tank with my rainbows, even he bosses around the unpaired fish. Rainbows must be extremely laid back. But that makes sense given that they inhabit areas that don't have a lot of other fish. I don't think they have the tools to compete.


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