# Labs died



## BacktoFresh (Aug 21, 2007)

I added five labs about 3 weeks ago and after about a week, they started dying off. Usually one every couple of days. I have one left.

My four aecis and six danios are all fine. It seemed that the labs did not get enough food or were not eating enough. I know the food sank down to them because I watched the food float down there and would see them pick some of it out of the gravel. It's the only thing I can think of. I was feeding a spirulina-based food. I believe labs are omnivores, right? I even used just regular flake fish food and they didn't seem too interested in that either.

Anyone else experience anything like this? Could it have been a bad batch from the lfs? They also hid most of the time even after being in the tank for a week.

My water conditions are at zero ammonia and trites and less than 20 trates.


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## Cardiff (Jun 2, 2008)

unless they were stressed?


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## D-007 (Jan 3, 2008)

How did you acclimatise them?


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## Cardiff (Jun 2, 2008)

^^ good point


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## BacktoFresh (Aug 21, 2007)

Floated the bag for about 20 minutes and then added. Did the same with my other fish and had no problems.

As for stress, not sure what could have caused it. They were not chased or attacked by any other fish.


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

pH and temp?

I'd check with the LFS and find out what happened with the rest of the batch. Sometimes you'll find out all were in bad shape and you know it's not you.

BTW, I was taught when adding Africans to a tank not to do the adding of tank water thing. I was told float for 20 minutes and dump in. Apparently when you add the higher pH water from the tank to the bag, it increases the pH in the bag and makes the ammonia there more toxic.


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## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

It wouldnt be a problem with food it its only a week. Keep in mind females are designed to not eat for over a month at a time when they are holding. One week is nothing to them.


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## Dave (Feb 9, 2003)

This not a starvation issue unless the fish were already starved.

hollyfish2000 is correct about pH and ammonia toxicity.


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## BacktoFresh (Aug 21, 2007)

ph 8.0, temp. 78

As far as holding, I think they're still too young to be sexually mature. They were only about an inch and half long.


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## Dewdrop (Nov 20, 2007)

bac3492 didn't mean the fish were holding. Just using that as an example to show you that they didn't starve.

Sounds like your water is ok and you acclimated them right. You didn't add the store's water to your tank did you? Shouldn't do that in case the store has a disease.

Maybe they were stressed. What size tank is it and what other fish are in it? Or they might have been a bad batch of fish. In that case, I'd watch your other fish closely for signs of illness in case it's contagious.


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## D-007 (Jan 3, 2008)

*NOT* saying you acclimatised them wrong but I've had bad experiences doing it the 20 minute floating bag method.

When I purchase fish I ask them to fill at least half the bag with water. A lot of the time, I'll even ask for a seperate bag or two full of their water.

Then when I get home, I put the water into a 5g bucket, then empty the fish and their water also into the bucket. Then I setup an airline tube with an air control valve at the end that allows about 3 drops a second from the Quarantine Tank to the bucket. The QT will have the same parameters as the main tank that the new fish will eventually go into. When the bucket is Â¾ full, I siphon out enough water to where it is about Â¼ full and then let the bucket refill again to Â¾ full. I also top off the QT.

When the bucket is Â¾ full again (about 3 to 3Â½ hours) the fish are ready to be netted and placed into the QT. It may seem like a long-winded process and some might say a bit overkill but I feel it is worth it for both their benefit and mine in the end. They stay in quarantine for 3 to 6 weeks and then if all is well get moved to the main tank.

Just my 2Â¢


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## Dave (Feb 9, 2003)

D-007,

For basic water, the drip method is actually a very bad idea. The longer the fish are in the bag the more acidic the water becomes. The actually is okay, because ammonia is less toxic (soluble) at lower pH. If you drip your water into the bag water you are raising the pH and making the ammonia more toxic. Now, this method may be working for you, but that might be due to the length of time your fish have been in the bag. For these types of fish, the best thing you can do is float them, scoop them out, and put them in the tank. Acclimation was not the issue here.


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## Alisonj (Aug 24, 2008)

Maybe they had bloat?


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

That's awfully fast for fish to die off of bloat.

Were they eating at all?


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## Alisonj (Aug 24, 2008)

3 weeks is not really that fast, nothing saying they didnt have bloat when she got them


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

3 weeks is _very_ fast for bloat to move through 5 fish, unless they were noticeably ill when purchased. I have to assume they weren't visibly ill when purchased, or they wouldn't have been added to the main tank, exposing other fish.

Fish can linger for weeks in the final stages of bloat. By the final stages, you _know_ they are sick and you _know_ you have problems.


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## D-007 (Jan 3, 2008)

Dave said:


> D-007,
> 
> For basic water, the drip method is actually a very bad idea. *The longer the fish are in the bag the more acidic the water becomes. * The actually is okay, because ammonia is less toxic (soluble) at lower pH. If you drip your water into *the bag* water you are raising the pH and making the ammonia more toxic. Now, this method may be working for you, but that might be due to the length of time your fish have been *in the bag*. For these types of fish, the best thing you can do is float them, scoop them out, and put them in the tank. Acclimation was not the issue here.


As I said, I dont use the bag when using the drip method, 


D-007 said:


> ....I put the water into a 5g bucket, then empty the fish and their water also into the bucket......


I don't disagree that acclimatisation was not an issue, after all they could have been already sick before purchase.


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## mormodamballa (Feb 21, 2007)

How large were your other fish? I have a acei about 5" who recently killed three small labs about 1"to 2". Just a thought. No real sign of agression till morning in one was dead. happened over a couple days.


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