# One fish, two fish, red fish blue fish.. Stocking my 75gal



## zablalbaz (Oct 7, 2016)

Hi All,

First of all, thanks to all the generous posters for the great information shared in this forum!

I am just getting started back in this hobby again after about a 20 year hiatus, and I am learning that almost everything I did back then has changed. No under gravel filters anymore... who knew?  In the past, I kept and bred Oscars, discus and other South American Cichlids. And had a few planted "community" type tanks. And even a "temperate" aquarium filled with fish that were locally "acquired" from lakes and ponds. But this time around, I figured I try my luck out with the more energetic and colorful African Cichlid species. I think my kids will really get into them too!

To get back into the hobby, I have purchased a used 75 gallon aquarium, and I am currently cycling it with the "fishless cycle" method that others have suggested in this forum. I think I am almost done - Ammonia is being eaten almost as quickly as I add it, Nitrites are starting to fall, and the Nitrates are coming down as well. I am using the Caribsea "Ivory Coast" sand mix for my substrate - PH continually remains around 8.0 - 8.2. And I am running two Sun Sun canister filters (1x HW304b, and 1x HW303b). Once the nitrites come down to zero ppm, and the nitrates are down a little more, I'm thinking I should be able to stock the aquarium.

So my question now is, "What type and how many?"

Let me start out by saying that I am pretty lazy. I have the two canister filters (525gph and 370gph) on a 75 gallon aquarium in hopes that I can cut down on my maintenance. I also do not have a backup aquarium that can act as a quarantine tank for fish that are getting beat up on by other fish. And I have been told by my spouse that my previous habit of having an aquarium in every room would not be tolerated this time around. So I would like to stock my aquarium with fish that will "just" get along for the most part.

That being said, I am also hoping to stock my new aquarium with as many different colors of fish as possible. I'd really like to get some combination of blues, yellows, and reds in the mix. And I am thinking about doing this with Mbunas (for the blue and yellow) and Peacocks for the Red. What I would like to do is have P. Saulosi as my "anchor fish" in the tank. The males are blue, and females are yellow, so I can get two of the colors in one species. Then maybe some German Red Peacocks - Stuartgranti Chipoka and maybe some . But I've read that the P. Saulosi might be too aggressive for the German Reds, and this combination might not work. If that is the case, then I was thinking I might be able to get some Maingano, Yellow labs and some Jalo Reef cichlids along with the German Reds? I've seen pictures of the Red Zebras, and those are orange, so I'm not really considering them as an option at this time.

Conversely, I'd be willing to go all mbuna (or peacocks) too if someone out there can offer suggestions that get me a good mix of the colors I am looking for.

Thanks in advance!


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## Aaron S (Apr 4, 2015)

So I will let you know that red is a really difficult color. There are red cichlids, but it is normally just a male thing. So your German red females are not going to be red at all. There are victorian cichlids that show beautiful reds, but again it is only male color. Heck, even "Red zebras" are not red... the males are peach and the females are yellowy orange. I think the dragonsblood females have a bit of red-ish color to them (feel free for anyone else to correct that as I have not had any). You could certainly do dragonsblood and saulosi.

I will let others chime in, but how deadset are you on red? Have you considered replacing your red with iodotropheus sprengerae? You could probably do yellow labs, maingano, and sprengerae to have a nice mix of fish shape and color without being TOO over-the-top on aggression.


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## zablalbaz (Oct 7, 2016)

Thanks for the quick response! And it was pretty much what I expected.

I did look at the sprengerae since they are listed on this forum's profile page as one of the more peaceful species. But they seemed a little on the "brown" side to me. They kind of remind me of some of the intermediate stage damsel fish I used to see when I dived as a kid. Is there any more color on them "in person?" Maybe the pictures just don't do them justice? As for being invested in the color, I'd love to have some red in the tank, but not if it means unhappy fish and/or unnecessary injuries and death due to improper stocking practices.

You suggested P. Saulosi with Dragonsblood. What ratios? Do you think I could also have a few more of the "man made" male aulonocara in the mix if I also add some of the other species like yellow labs, sprengerae and maingano to occupy the saulosi? Also, what about the Jaylo Reef cichlids?

All the species I am looking at (except for the saulosi) are categorized as mildly aggressive or peaceful. I'm hoping the following mix would work out.

p. saulosi - 1m/4f = 5 total << aggressive
maingano - 1m/4f = 5 total
yellow labs (L. caeruleus) - 1m/4f = 5 total
Jaylo Reef - 1m/4f = 5 total
Peacocks - 1-2 male dragonblood + 1-2 0ther assorted males for some "different" color.
Possibly a Bristlenose Pleco? << I'm not sure about this one yet. I've read that plenty of people have success with them. But I've also seen my own South American cichlids tear them up in the past.

For a Total of 25 fish in a 75gal tank.

Or is this just asking for trouble? I could do without the saulosi and get my blues and yellows from the maingano and labs if need be. And I think the male Jaylo Reef cichlids just look plain cool! Of course, I'll be buying all these fish as juveniles - which means I probably won't know the sexes until it is too late.

Thanks!


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## awanderingmoose (Aug 11, 2016)

Some things to think about: the female saulosi will be close in color to the yellow labs. The males, to the afras. So, I'd recommend you find a different species choice instead if you want to keep both the labs and the afras. The peacocks will probably not do well in that mix. Also, 25 fish is probably a few too many, so you really aren't losing anything by leaving the peacocks out entirely.


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## Biciclid (Jan 27, 2016)

Although I have both my tanks set up for mbuna if I ever get to build the monster tank of my dreams I will be tempted to mix. I would stick to saulosi as they stay small, the females are almost as yellow as the labs and the male is probably even more colourful than the Cynotilaia afra. Some say that if you want to mix haps with mbuna it is better to put the has in first and let them get a size advantage before adding mbunas. Although despised by purists firefish can be very red and beind hap/mbuna mutts they can take the heat. Otherwise I have read peole keeping Aulonocara Jacobreibergi or stuartgranti maleri with mbuna? Personally if I ever do it it will be in a seriously big tank, ideally 12 foot long where I can have rocky areas and open sandy ones (the wife said you could only have one tank but she did not specify the size...)


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## Aaron S (Apr 4, 2015)

So the rusty males are quite interesting to look at with the purple color in his body surrounded by a rust color, but the females are more on the drab side. If you are more interested in the color of the jalo reef males then that is ok, just realize the females are drab (this is the same issue with the red fish).

If you are trying to keep the peace in your tank then you want to make sure that you don't have look-a-likes...fish don't see very well. In general you want to categorize your fish into the following groups: vertical bars, horizontal bars, blotched, and then the solid colors. Saulosi have vertical bars in the males and yellow solid in females, maingano have horizontal bars, yellow labs are solid yellows, jalo have vertical bars and solid lack of color, peacocks will often have vertical bars along with a general color. So I would suggest, much like bicichlid, that the combination is not a great idea. But! The problem is the saulosi...so if you remove that and go back to your original mbuna suggestion in the OP (yellow labs, maingano, and jalo reefs) then that would likely work. I would be concerned about adding a peacock because the bars on the peacock may cause aggression with the jalo reef. I saw this issue with one of my peacocks in the past. You can probably add a male dragonsblood to that mbuna mix though for some red-ish color and accent fish. I don't think you will be able to get away with many other peacocks due to conflicts of colors, but hopefull DJ or someone will chime in to suggest.

You can do bristlenose if you want. I always caution people about getting catfish/plecos and say that you should only get them if you like that fish because they may or may not really help you to keep your tank clean and certainly will increase bio load. I have a bristlenose and 6 syndontis petricola in my 125gal - because they are fun fish.


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## Biciclid (Jan 27, 2016)

Main thing is to get fish you really like! Philotos or the internet do not fully convey the looks of these fish. Ideally it would help to look at tanks with adults as juvies often look lees colourful. What does your lfs stock?. Between my two tanks I have all the fish you mentioned although they are still growing so maybe not at their best yet.


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## zablalbaz (Oct 7, 2016)

Thanks a lot all for the great suggestions. I'm going to stay away from the saulosi and go with the maingano, yellow labs, jaylos and a dragonblood I think. All of these are stocked at my LFS. Regarding the number of fish, I thought it was common practice to overstock - especially with juveniles since you won't know what the sexes of the fish will be for awhile? Then weed out any extra males to prevent aggressive behavior later? I was planning on getting juveniles and growing them up together with the Pleco in hopes that there would be less overall aggression.

So, if I am buying juveniles, do I still want to keep it under 25 fish total? Maybe only 18-20 maximum?

Thanks again!


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## tanker3 (May 18, 2015)

IMO, the Maingano and labs would make a very good color combo. I have seen tanks like that. If you really want a "redish" fish and are not going to save any fry, try for a few Cherry Red zebras. I know they are not naturally this color, and will very likely hybrid with the Labs, but if you can accept this, they would make a nice 3rd fish.


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## zablalbaz (Oct 7, 2016)

I don't mind having fry in the tank. In the past, when I had Oscars and other cichlids, I usually wound up with them regardless of my wishes. But I also don't have anyplace to keep them - unless I use one of those temporary, soft net hatcheries. And I've read that zebra hybrids can be aggressive. I'll ask my LFS if they ever get the cherry reds in. I didn't even know that was an option. The pictures on the Internet look cool. That would satisfy my red craving I think. Thanks for the suggestion!


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Most red zebras sold today (at least that I have seen in LFS) are the cherry reds. The orange in my avatar is that fish. I'd do the labs or zebras and maingano. My peacocks have never been happy with mbuna...I'd skip the dragon blood.


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## zablalbaz (Oct 7, 2016)

Thanks again for all the great suggestions everyone. One quick question I have though. If I were to go with all mbuna and have 3 species - zebras, maingano, and labs. And if those labs and zebra cross breed. Shouldn't I expect the resultant fry to be 'taken care of' by predation from the adults? Sorry if this sounds heartless to some of you. But I'm not interested in keeping any fry, so will that give me a little more flexibility in stocking options? Can I have the 3 species if I'm not going to keep fry?

Also, I still hoping for an answer to my 'numbers' question. Will 3 species with all juveniles be okay with 18-20 fish in my 85? Or shoild I go with less?

Thanks!


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

The fry may get eaten by the adults, but if you have survivors (I did) you then have to hunt them down and remove before they grow too much and you can't tell them from the adults. The one and only time I had to euthanize was just this scenario, and I will never do it again if I can avoid it.

If you leave possible hybrids in the tank then you can't sell or give away ANY of the fish, even the original pure ones because you don't know which is which.

If this is a 75G 48x18 rectangle 20 adults is a good number and if you need extra juveniles 32 is not too many for the first year or so.


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## zablalbaz (Oct 7, 2016)

Thanks DJRansome for the great advice. I think I'll stay away from the zebras after all. I really don't have it in me to euthanize any fry. Even letting the other fish in the tank take care of the problem through predation makes me think twice. I have little kids who could get upset about that - and some of the fry could actually survive per your own experience. I must say, the photos of fish you have listed in your 75gallon setup look nice. Does that combination work well for you? Is there a lot of fighting between the Msobo and Damasoni cichlids? Do the Msobo males and Maingano males have any problems due to similar appearance? With all that yellow I certainly wouldn't need the yellow labs. Do you think some Jaylo reef cichlids would survive that mix?

Thanks!


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## zablalbaz (Oct 7, 2016)

So. Just reread the posts again. Looks like the verical bars on the Jaylo reef would not go well with tje demasoni - so.... that's obviously out. Just take that species out of my last question. Thanks again for putting up with the newbie.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

The msobo are still on trial in the tank...but msobo/demasoni has worked for others.

You could alternatively do demasoni/maingano/estherae...just leave out the yellow labs.


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