# dovi with glass in mouth



## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

well to make a long story short, my 18" dovi decided he wanted to be a tough guy and eat my floating thermometer. he now has a piece of glass in his mouth and i dont know what to do for him, its to the point where he can no longer hunt down feeder fish, and he cant eat frozen cubes of food either, he is just eating pellets, but the way the tumor is growing its bound to block his mouth passage off soon. i just hope there is something i can do, id hate to put him down. here is a picture and if someone would please help me save my fish i will thank you forever!
here is a pic


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Boy, that looks like a tough guy to me. Tough situation for you, too. Boiloed down it looks like two choices to me. Do nothing he almost certainly dies a long slow death. Do something drastic and he has a little better chance. I have seen wild fish in the lake which have recovered from massive wounds. Maybe he can also. Fish can survive until a plug rusts and comes out but with glass, that's no good. I suggest catching him and you or an assistant use long-nose pliers or a hook remover to rip the glass out. Going to take some muscle and good hands as well as grit to do it but that seems the better way to me. Once removed he will need to be treated as for any wound and bare close watching for water quality and secondary type infections. I would love to know what you are able to do and how it works out.


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## ashilli48 (May 14, 2006)

clove oil is a good anesthetic for fish but I would have no clue how much to use on a fish that big. As I type my wife also warned that it does not work on all fish, some it may be lethal in any amount.

Not sure what shipping anesthetic is on the market.

Any chances of finding a vet that would be willing and capable of working on him?


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

well i cant see the glass is the problem. is there anyway to kinda put the fish to sleep, then maybe take him out of the tank and lance the tumor? how do u treat and operation/flesh wound on a fish. also i dont have a hospital tank big enough for him, and he is in a tank with other large agressive fish, where its the survival of the fittest anyway. i just feel bad for the big guy and dont know what to do. i figured it would be like a fish with a fish hook in its mouth, and maybe it would work its self out. but the tumor has just became larger. now its to the point where im afraid its going to prevent him from eating.


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

*** not tried the vet, im in rural kentucky and most people around here have never even heard of a cichlid lol. *** heard of the clove oil before but even once the fish is asleep what do i do and how do i "bandage" the wound i create by cutting on the tumor? im certainly no doctor, and i dont know how to stitch.. this guy is about 2 yrs old and *** had him since a fry.. he's my prize possesion and id do anything to keep him healthy.


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## CichMomma (Mar 3, 2010)

Oh my gosh! I'm so sorry...this is a horrible situation to be in. If I were in your situation, I would maybe see if there were a local vet that would be willing to come to your house and take a look at him. It would prob cost a considerable amount of money but might be worth it. I'd hate for you to have to euthanize him.....call around and try to find a vet that could help you with something like this and see what they suggest??? Such a tough situation. Hope it works out well for you and the fishy.


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

this is soo depressing...


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## CichMomma (Mar 3, 2010)

roman_back said:


> this is soo depressing...


Don't give up on him! You could even call around to some of the retailers on this site and find out what they use to sedate fish for shipping purposes. If you could get your hands on some and sedate him yourself to at least have a closer look at that thing it couldn't hurt. What if it is as simple as lancing it, squeezing out some gunk, and pulling out a piece of glass with tweezers or something? You never know til you get a closer look. He is only 2 years old. It would be unfortunate to lose him to starvation. Sometimes our pets can be so dumb!


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

my big question is how to treat the wound once its lanced?


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## CichMomma (Mar 3, 2010)

roman_back said:


> my big question is how to treat the wound once its lanced?


Well, if you are able to merely puncture it, like with a larger needle, and get some results with that...i.e. squeeze some pus out, get the glass out, etc, then you could quarantine him and use...what is it, melafix?? I'm not sure what the best med would be to prevent further infection.....I'm no expert and have never dealt with anything like this. (I am speaking from what I would think of if I were in your shoes.) If it needs to be lanced.....i.e actually cut a slit in it....that's where I think you would need to consult with a vet to find out what your best option would be. I don't know if it would be feasible to stitch a fish wound. It might be a matter of lancing, weeping, quarantine with medication til it heals and then re-admitting him into the tank. I really think you need to contact a vet that has some know how with fish and get some input. No vet will charge you to answer questions over the phone, even if you have to call out of your area to get advice. 
Either way, he will need to be quarantined after "surgery". You could go get an inexpensive plastic tote from Target, Lowes, HD, etc. to use as a tank, a submersible heater, throw an airstone, hopefully you have an extra filter......
It's hard to tell from the picture but how large is the growth? And again, I'm just trying to be helpful.....get on the phone in the morning and try to get in touch with a "fish vet" that could guide you in the right direction.


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

the growth is about 3/4 the size of a golf ball. pretty big really.


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## ashilli48 (May 14, 2006)

the vets may be less frequent in a rural area but tend to have greater experience with a larger selection of animals, IMHO.


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## Malawidolphin (Dec 15, 2006)

I know this may seem unrelated, but my dog had this huge "orange size" abcess on his thigh. There as a piece of spear grass that had worked its way under the skin. The abcess blew open before I got him to the vet. All the vet did was clean it and leave it wide open to heal from the inside out. The hole hwas ablout the size of the top of a pop can. It healed real qickly because the aggravator (speargrass) and the infection was out of there. What if you have someone hold him for you underwater in a small tank at eye level while you make an incision and at least see if it is a fluid/puss flled pocket, in which case you should be able to squeeze the contents out. The glass, if it is in there, should come out with those contents. If you open it up and it looks like a red fleshy mass or grey mass then it is a tumor and not an infection. I would still try and remove it......at least it is a chance he will survive. I know it is easy for all of us to tell you to go for it as we are not the ones that have to do it. I would probably be very shaky......After all I shake when I have to vaccinate our horse & donkey


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

My reason for removing the glass is that I feel if the glass is still there, the layer of skin in response will just grow back. Many of us have had metal splinters and if they are not removed they continue to be a problem. Glass seems to be worse as it does not degrade and fall out on it's own. I would not try to sedate a fish without some really good expertise. Even with people in a hospital it has to be done very carefully. Try not to let him go the way of M>Jackson. :roll: I would have to look at it much the same as catching an undersized fish that is hooked deep. It has to come out and the pain has to be endured to live. The other option is death so the sooner the better. He will not be any stronger a month from now if he can't eat.


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

i honestly dont have the guts to do this myself lol...


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

No farm background, huh? It often requires rad moves to save cattle. My wife can do a number of operations that I can't handle.


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

nah no farm background lol. i am going to get on the phone monday and check with some vets, then go from there.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

If you're ever by a farm when they are pulling a calf, it will put your fish trouble in better light. Think wire stretchers tied to the calf and you begin to get the idea!


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## kitana8 (Jan 20, 2010)

Isn't there an university or something near you where vets are formed, or a zoo or public aquarium? Zoo vets are able and equipped to anesthetize and operate on a fish, and vet schools will be able also. For fish and marine mammals vets it is routine. Depending of the general "value" (both economical and emotional) you put on your fish, you are the only one who knows how much time and effort and money you want to spend on that fish, but if it is important to you then I'm sure you can find a place within reasonable driving distance where your fish could be taken care of in a proper way. I am a vet, living in a very remote area of Canada, and I wouldn't hesitate driving the 900km to Montreal to have any of my pets treated. I did it before. Some of my clients from Northern Quebec have to drive 14 hours to get to my place but they do it when there is an emergency. But then, as I said you are the only one who knows if you would do it.


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## CichMomma (Mar 3, 2010)

kitana8 said:


> Isn't there an university or something near you where vets are formed, or a zoo or public aquarium? Zoo vets are able and equipped to anesthetize and operate on a fish, and vet schools will be able also. .


Good thinking and great suggestion!!! :thumb:


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

http://www.wchemical.com/TRICAINE-S-MS-222-P43C7.aspx

i talked to the local fish/wildlife people and they sent me to the local fish hatchery that stocks our lakes and such here in this area. he told me to use this product to sedate him because clove oil can be deadly on certain types of fish. he also stated that i could lance it myself, and use a ocytetracycline (spelling?) as the antibiotic and oraly feed him this untill the lanced wound heals. the gentleman also suggested taking it to a university as well. this fish means alot to me, but is a $40 fish worth 2-300 dollars to fix him. i hate to see him suffer, i just need to think on things, but i may try to round up one of my friends thats an avid fisherman, and see if he will help in handling the fish and helping me out. any more input is greatly appreciated!!! thanks for all that has helped so far!


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

well found out the sedatives are real hard to come by, clove oil is not recommended because to much can kill the fish. i was told to use "club soda" since its pure CO2 just pour it in the water the dovi will be in untill he passes out. take him out, wrap him in a wet towel and remove the tumor completly, and put iodine on the wound, and treat the water with marcyn/melaflix and he should be good to go. wish me luck!


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## kitana8 (Jan 20, 2010)

Wooo, club soda is not pure CO2, all it will do is raise the pH to unhealthy alcaline levels. It has no anesthetic effects whatsoever.
If you really wish to butcher your fish all by yourself, please at least do it correctly. Forget the anesthetic, even clover oil can be lethal, wrap the fish in a soft, wet towel with someone to hold him down, and apply some local anesthetic on the wound, there are plenty of them available over-the-counter, stuff used for babies with new tooth, etc. Ask the pharmacist for the most potent one. But I strongly suggest against that approach, as you could damage your fish a lot acting that way.


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## smellsfishy1 (May 29, 2008)

kitana8 said:


> Wooo, club soda is not pure CO2, all it will do is raise the pH to unhealthy alcaline levels.


Are you sure you don't mean acidic?
It should be somehwere around a pH of 5.
But I do agree, not sure how club soda would work here.


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## kitana8 (Jan 20, 2010)

No, baking soda will buffer the pH and make it alcaline.


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

i was told to use the club soda by the local hatchery here in ky. thats all i had to go by.


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## cindylou (Oct 22, 2008)

Any news on this poor fish?


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## ladybugzcrunch (Jul 26, 2009)

Yes, any news???? When I saw the photo, I thought abscess not tumor. If it were my fish, I would not try to sedate him at all. Just pull him out of the water and lance it quickly. Use a sharp knife and cut a slit along the lowest part of the abscess. When you stick it, it should pop like a pimple. This should only take a minute. Put him back in the water (not main tank, like bucket or something) and watch him. Hopefully it is an abscess and once you lance it the piece of glass will either come out right away or will be visible once the puss is drained. If you can see the glass, pull it out with pliers. If it is not an abscess, I do not know if I would attempt to remove a mass on the mouth. Tumors can have big blood vessels running through them. If it is a tumor, I would not try to cut it out. I would let him be for a s long as he can eat then make a call.


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

no, no updates yet. im trying to round up a hospital tank for this guy, or even just the nerve to do the operation.


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## roman_back (May 8, 2007)

well he died this am.. had to bury him in the rain this afternoon..


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## shaguars7 (Apr 12, 2009)

man you tried to do more than most and put in a considerable effort.. I am sorry for your loss and i am sure it wont be your last dovii. Once again you tried


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## cindylou (Oct 22, 2008)

Sorry for your loss..


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