# Why do my Geos keep dying



## apmorgan93 (Jan 29, 2013)

I don't seem to have any luck with geophagus. The story:

Last year, I bought a group of 12 Red top geos and then about 3 months later they all dropped one by one over the course of 2 weeks or so.

Now, *** got a group of 8 altifons. About 2 months ago, I lost 4 of them over a week period to the same thing that I lost my red tops to. So I replaced those 4 about a month or so ago. Over the last week and a half I've lost 5 of my altifrons again.

What happens that I've noticed is that a day or so before one dies its face turns a red-ish color around the mouth. My last 3 appear to have that right now so I'm not expecting to have them around much longer now. I've tried doing water changes and such when this appears but to no avail.

I do a 50% water change weekly (havn't missed out on one in months) and because most of my tanks inhabitants are small there isn't a large bioload. *** got 2 canisters for my media, as well as a bunch of java fern and giant duckweed to help keep things in check. I'm really not sure what the problem is with these fish, my angels and WC gbrs arn't effected at all and are completely fine.

Additional info, my PH is neutral or high 6's last I checked. Not sure on the hardness. Tank is cycled and has been setup for at least 9 months.


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## sumthinfishy (Jan 26, 2013)

what do i have for substrate. geos are called "eartheaters" for a reason. the geos sift through sand to get their food. if u have a course substrate then i would suspect that they are not getting the food they need because the cant sift through it. this would also explain the redness around the mouth. the redness is most likely wounds from them digging in the coarse substrate to try to get food


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## apmorgan93 (Jan 29, 2013)

*** got an inch and a half of pool filter sand from leslies pool supply. For food I give them NLS small fish formula sinking. I enjoy watching them sift it from the sand, the larger geos sift it through their gills and the smaller ones just take it in, roll it around and spit the sand back out. The sand is rather inconsistent in grain size but even the largest grains arnt larger than the NLS 1mm pellets that I occasionally feed. I hope the sand isnt the problem :/


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## sumthinfishy (Jan 26, 2013)

the sand u have is a good substrate for geos. unfortunately i dont have any further advice. sorry. good luck


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## notho2000 (Dec 8, 2012)

This is a tough one. Are there any other red areas other than around the mouth and is the red in the creases around the mouth? And are the lips distended (and maybe swollen) or not? Are the jaws locked and breathing labored or are the fish continuing to breathe normally? There is something called enteric red mouth that is bacterial in nature but several other maladies have similar symptoms. Just curious but do you have your water well oxygenated (i.e. air stones or sponge filters with good air flow). Geos need plenty of oxygen and if not given it, they can quite easily suffocate. Other fish may not seem affected so you can't go by their behavior. Just a thought.


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## apmorgan93 (Jan 29, 2013)

That's alright fishy, thank you for your input! 

Notho: the redness is above the mouth and appears as if it were under the skin. Their coloration on the rest of the body remains normal and doesn't appear to be faded although it might be just slightly. Appetite seems greatly reduced. Once their face turns red like that they usually refuse food and don't interact or swim with the other geos, and then I find them dead the following day. Their breathing is a little more labored than normal however it isn't extreme and I've seen worse. It's just a little bit more rapid than a fish that isn't exhibiting the red-face symptoms. I don't run air stones however my 2 canisters are hooked up to a spraybar that spans the length of the tank and keeps the surface quite agitated. The java fern also help out in the oxygen department (although I'm not sure if they make a significant amount). I didn't have time to do a large WC today but I did a 25% change anyways for good measure. If I loose my remaining geos I'm not going to try them again for a few years. As much as I love them it isn't worth the stress.


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## mambee (Apr 13, 2003)

Maybe a bacterial problem? Dosing with Melafix wouldn't hurt.


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## sumthinfishy (Jan 26, 2013)

hate to start throwing meds in without knowing exactly what your treating for. especially with others in the tank. i wouldnt recommend meds until u know what u have going on


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

What's your water temperature?

I have been keeping and breeding Geo's for many years and never found them particularly difficult or demanding. Not sure if any of my tips will help you but here is what I do.

1. Keep the water temperature at 80-86 degrees F. Except for the cool water Gymnogeophagus which I keep at 72 degrees. Both species you listed are warm water fish.
2. I use straight RO water so I can keep the water very soft. I don't bother much with testing or adjusting the pH but I do add almond leaves and driftwood which tend to bring the pH down. The important thing is maintaining the soft water.
3. Provide a lot of current. Besides the filter (canister or power) I put in a strong circulation pump on one end of the tank blowing down the length of the tank. Geo's tend to really like to orient into the strong flow. Particularly the rheophilic species like Retroculus.
4. Feed live foods regularly. I feed live blackworms at least twice a week most of the time. In between I feed small cichlid pellets or flakes. Keep the pellet size as small as possible as the Geo's are sifters and normally eat small foods.

Hope this helps.

Andy


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