# FX5 woes...



## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

I have 2 FX5s. I am experiencing the dreaded micro bubble issue with one. Here's how it started, and what I've tried to remedy it.

All trays filled with BioMax about 1/2" from the lid of each tray. 1 section of blue/white filter pad cut to fit on top tray. Stock white sponges in each tray. All was fine for approx. 6 weeks. The only time I saw any micro bubbles was after a water change(turn filters off for changes) and they worked themselves out of the filter within hours. I needed to seed another filter and went to borrow some biomax from my established FX5. I shut her down, valved off my intake and return, removed the filter, hosed down my sponges/media(well water, no chlorine), removed necessary biomax for the other filter, replaced all trays, filled up with water necessary for priming, placed back under my tank, hooked up hoses and followed Fluval's instructions for starting her back up. Since that day, I have had the micro bubbles.

I've had no leaks of any kind. The intake coupler to strainer is always underwater before starting filter. My media is most certainly not clogged whatsoever. I had no bubbles when it had more media in it than it does now. I've seen examples on this forum with FX5s containing more filter pads/media with no micro bubbles. I've tried draining the filter via drain valve, and following Fluval's instructions on starting up/preparing prime. I've dismantled the filter 3 times since then. Checked impeller, tubing for restrictions/wear- all ok. I've checked the air tube on top of the lid for any kinks/restrictions- all ok. I've checked o-rings on the lid and hose connections- no damage. I hand tighten the lid in a star pattern, with no overtightening. I've played with restricting flow with the disconnect valves. Turning it on and off to force a mandatory purge does not help.

Sometimes the bubbles don't seem severe or non-existent, such as when I dismantle the filter and start back up. But they always come back. I assume during every 24 hour shut down it removes some air. I can hear the air moving through filter- a swooshing noise. Meanwhile, my other FX5 plugs along with no issue. I've scoured the discussions on this forum, and all over the internet. Stumped and incredibly ticked off. I have added spray bars to both filters, but this bubble issue started before I began that project. Air is somehow getting into my filter, or just not being removed during startup. When I say following Fluval directions, I mean opening intake, then discharge to push air out before applying power.

I know this post is very long, but did that to provide all the details and avoid possible fixes being suggested that I've already tried.

Please... any ideas/suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I'm about to go nuclear!


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## mpowers (Apr 8, 2011)

Sounds like cavitation on the impeller causing the bubbles. I use to use the same bonded blue/white pads in mine and would get a 1 to 1-1/2 months out of them before I had to replace the pad. Bubbles were always the signs the pads we compacting and slowing the flow. Fwiw, I've tried all of fluval's pads too with the same results.

For the past 5 months in two FX5s' I have run only one basket of pre filter ceramics, one basket of biomax and the coarse white filters on the outside of each basket. Since the swap over I have had zero need to service either unit. The water flow is fantastic, clear and bio wise the tank couldn't be healthier. Now I'm swapping my 3 other cannisters (Rena and two aquatops) over to this as they need servicing.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Thanks for the response.

I forgot to mention that I have read about the cavitation. What puzzles me is that it was running without issue, until I opened it up for the first time to borrow some media. My bonded filter is clean. Are you suggesting that they break down in such a short amount of time, restricting flow?

I have both FX5s on a 125. One for bio(problem filter) and one strictly for mechanical. Do you think I should distribute the biomax between the 2? Do the pre filter rings do a good job on particulate matter the coarse sponges miss? I noticed after running for 6 weeks the stock sponges were relatively clean compared to the blue/white filter.


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## mpowers (Apr 8, 2011)

I have both of mine on one heavily stocked 75. Both are on opposite ends with identical intake heights (near the bottom corner). The blue/white pads (self cut bonded type) would collapse to near flat when they collected debris. When it collapsed, it would nearly stop the water flow.

I very happy both of mine set up the same and the pre filter ceramics seem to work well. Is my water as polished as installing the fx5 polish pad, no. But its very, very close and I no longer have to screw with them.

Even went on a three week vacation and left the tanks on an auto feeder that feed as much as I normally do. I was happy to come home to water that didn't need changing, a clean tank and happy fish. I normally do 50% every week for good measure.

YMMV, but I would set it up this way. For no cost you can always just remove the inner pads for a couple of weeks and see If your happy and then order some pre filter ceramics. Other than shape and coarseness (is that a word?) they are similar to the biomax.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

I use the cut pads as well and no issues. If you are using them and having issues then I would remove to see if that helps. If it was working fine, opened up and cleaned, closed back up and the bubbles started then I don't think the pads are clogging. Almost sounds as though air is getting in somewhere. I would remove pads first and see what happens then go from there.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Thanks for the replies. The single pad is definitely not clogged or restricted. I'll try moving some media into the other filter, but I have a feeling it won't work. There's less media in it now than there was when there were zero issues.

Razor: I put the same amount of biomax in the canister as you did when you initially set yours up, but with only 1 filter pad. I believe you do 3? Anyways... The mystery continues.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Thanks for the replies. The single pad is definitely not clogged or restricted. I'll try moving some media into the other filter, but I have a feeling it won't work. There's less media in it now than there was when there were zero issues.
> 
> Razor: I put the same amount of biomax in the canister as you did when you initially set yours up, but with only 1 filter pad. I believe you do 3? Anyways... The mystery continues.


I have 3 yes. No issues. Flow is great with no bubbles.

Has anything else changed as far as the intake or output placement? Are the connections the intake/output make with the hose itself submerged? If so then I would open the filter back up and put some vaseline or silicone grease on the O ring. I would then tighten the lid like you do when putting a tire on a car. Tighten in a star pattern. I tighten somewhat snug in a star pattern. I then repeat the star pattern making sure this time I tighten really well. You could try that and see what happens.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

It sounds like you are covering all the bases on troubleshooting the problem so I will only offer one suggestion. Have you checked the intake strainer to see if anything is plugging it up? Mine accumulates plant debris occasionally.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

I definitely tighten the lid properly. I have a non toxic silicone based o-ring lubricant but was hesitant to use it. I have the spray bars now and I used the design you did, so the discharge is not submerged as it would be out of box with the dual nozzle. I stated above that I have the intake connection submerged.

I'll go ahead and try to lubricate the main o-ring. I don't have any vaseline, just the stuff I have above from work. Thanks, man.

Deeda- I have not! But I don't have any plants. I can try blasting it out with some pressurized CO2, or pull it from the tank. Thanks.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Give us updates.....

I would wait a few hours just to be sure. I know when I start mine back up it starts the whooshing sound as well for 4-5 hours.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Will do Razor. I think if it's good after 24 hours I would consider it solved. I've torn this thing down 4 times now. Afterwards it's OK, then the following morning.... BUBBLES everywhere!

Thanks again...


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

I feel your pain and frustration. I had the microbubbles problem for a few days about 1-2 weeks after setting mine up. Mine started when I did a water change and the inlet was exposed above the water line - even though the filter was off at the time.

Don't know for sure what fixed it, but I took it apart, added the bonded filter pad as Razor suggested, put it back together - being sure to tighten in a star pattern - and they wen't away. I was REALLY happy, cause the microbubbles really uck the water up, plus my Cyps were constantly trying to feed on the bubbles.

I'm going to make a WAG - maybe this filter is dependent on a certain flow restriction? If that fluctuates, e.g., either too little/much media, or if the media becomes clogged, the issue appears. It seems through all the research I've done (and I did a fair amount when I had this issue), the only common denominator was the amount of media and/or condition, e.g., clogged. Just wagging here - but I know from a fluid dyanmics perspective, just about everything makes a difference, and if this filter has microbubble issues, as it appears it does, any one of those differences could cause it to show. I don't know. It's a stretch... but I don't understand how all that air can get in the filter in the first place. I guess the cavitation must 'extract' it from the water and it collects in the filter.

I will have a total of four operational within a few days. I'm hoping they are good, but just in case, yes keep us posted on what you find.

Sorry for your troubles... but I can give hope that the issue may clear as mysteriously as it appeared. Good luck.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

The more I read my WAG, the more I shake my head. Just doesn't pan out.

Have you tried contacting Fluval? I've read this is marginally effective at times, but maybe you'll get a good tech with some good tips.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Fluval is a last resort for help. I'd like to do each possible fix on it's own to pinpoint the problem. I seriously have not spent nearly enough time watching my fish as I did before this bubble issue. It makes me so mad. Look everyday of course for the basic check and feeding... enough to see another fish is holding. Yea! But not sitting down and listening to an album or two. Bummer.

One must wonder why a filter shuts itself down everyday to purge the system. Hmmmmmmmmmm

Unfortunately, I won't be able to mess with the filter til tomorrow evening.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Fluval is a last resort for help. I'd like to do each possible fix on it's own to pinpoint the problem. I seriously have not spent nearly enough time watching my fish as I did before this bubble issue. It makes me so mad. Look everyday of course for the basic check and feeding... enough to see another fish is holding. Yea! But not sitting down and listening to an album or two. Bummer.
> 
> One must wonder why a filter shuts itself down everyday to purge the system. Hmmmmmmmmmm
> 
> Unfortunately, I won't be able to mess with the filter til tomorrow evening.


Does it continue the whooshing sound the entire time or is it silent?


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

I notice the noise all the time. The filter that is running properly purrs like a kitten, right next to it.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> I notice the noise all the time. The filter that is running properly purrs like a kitten, right next to it.


Hmmmmm....

If it is to the point where you can't enjoy watching your fish then I would consider swapping baskets to see if it makes any difference. It is on the same tank? I would just try process of elimination. I feel your pain though. It would drive me nuts. Sorry to hear you are having issues.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Thanks. I'm serious. I've been stressing about it. lol


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Yeah when mine had those issues it kind of ruined watching that tank... and every morning I'd get up and go check for bubbles as the very first thing I did.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Thanks. I'm serious. I've been stressing about it. lol


Well...since you have identical filters it will make it easy to diagnose just time consuming.

Swap baskets
Swap tops
Swap filters itself
etc....

That is really going to be the best way to go about doing. It will be time consuming meaning you will try one thing and wait. I would start with the baskets first. Then tops. The top has the O ring so that is why I would try it second.

Just be glad you have a second otherwise you may never find the problem without having to spend some $$$$. I would call where you ordered it and tell them it is defective and to send you another one if you are unable to fix the problem. Just tell them it stopped working altogether. Did you fill out the warranty stuff that came with it? I will try and help any way I can.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Dawg2012 said:


> Yeah when mine had those issues it kind of ruined watching that tank... and every morning I'd get up and go check for bubbles as the very first thing I did.


Did adding the pads help you?


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

It did - though I hesitate to say it fixed the problem (though I'm not saying it didn't  ). The problem wasn't there for a week or so, then I water changed and the inlet was exposed, then the problem started. I disassembled and installed the pads and it stopped. Hard to say what actually fixed it - though those pads is the first thing I will put in my new ones :thumb:


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Dawg2012 said:


> Yeah when mine had those issues it kind of ruined watching that tank... and every morning I'd get up and go check for bubbles as the very first thing I did.


I've done the same thing everyday. After I would pull it apart, I'd call home during the day if my GF was home to get a 'bubble status report'

Razor- Dr Foster Smith. I DID NOT fill out anything. I will try to narrow it down, of course. Swapping stuff and waiting a day really sucks. Although if the problem switched filters it would be a no brainer. Dr F/S has really good customer service. Might be worth a try if all else fails...

Thanks again guys. Really appreciate it.


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## cichlid-gal (Apr 27, 2012)

mpowers said:


> I have both of mine on one heavily stocked 75. Both are on opposite ends with identical intake heights (near the bottom corner). The blue/white pads (self cut bonded type) would collapse to near flat when they collected debris. When it collapsed, it would nearly stop the water flow.


I'm just setting up my new Fluval FX5 so in some ways unhappy to see this post and in other ways happy to see it as maybe it will head off problems I might encounter. Anyway, I have set mine up with some 1 1/2 bonded pad that I found that was for pond use (it seems much more stable and firm than the regular blue/white bonded stuff...time will tell I guess), and then two trays of bio-media ... hopefully this will work. If not, by having this post at least I have some things to try if microbubbles show up.

Good luck Iggy...I hope things resolve.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Iggy, how are you injecting CO2? Is it anywhere near the problematic FX5?


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

No CO2 or air bubblers of any kind, Dee


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Cichlid Gal- its a great filter. Moves a lot of water and can make a difference in water clarity. My issue is a common one. Usually clogged media is the culprit. Don't be discouraged.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

No problem, I thought you had it since you mentioned CO2 in another post.

Just for giggles, on another forum someone had similar problems with constant microbubbles and couldn't solve it. This is what he wrote 
"I have been having trouble with micro bubbles coming from my fx5 for about a month now and i was getting reaally frustrated, i tried many pieces of advise from the forum but to no avail, so 9 days ago i was carring out my normal w/c regime plus my bi-weekly filter maintainance, i stripped the filter down, cleaned all the sponges as normal, put it back under the tank, connected it up and turned it on !!!!, "WHOA WHAT THE HECK", there was huge bubbles coming out from my intake strainer and outlet nozzle.
On inspection i had connected the intake and outlet pipes the wrong way round and it had loads of crud coming out of the intake therefore it must have losened up the crud by backflushing it.
Anyway i connected the pipes the right way afterwards and `hey presto` no more micro bubbles, nor has their been since, also the flow rate has improved and its a lot quieter".

Just a thought to try something quick and easy, rather than swapping parts between the filters.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Wow, wouldn't that be an easy fix! Sounds like it might be something to just do every now and then anyway to clean out the intake tube. Can't see how it would hurt anything... Very interesting.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Dee- I was talking about using some pressurized CO2 in a tank that I use at work from time to time. Pretty much what you would need if you had a kegerator! I appreciate you adding suggestions, of course. I will check the tubing as well. Thanks again... and keep any more ideas coming. I will be opening up the filters tonight, hopefully.

I'll be honest. I was putting off asking everyone here on the forum about my problem. I wanted to figure it out on my own. Since posting it, I don't feel as frustrated and pissed off as I did. Weird...


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Dee- I was talking about using some pressurized CO2 in a tank that I use at work from time to time. Pretty much what you would need if you had a kegerator! I appreciate you adding suggestions, of course. I will check the tubing as well. Thanks again... and keep any more ideas coming. I will be opening up the filters tonight, hopefully.
> 
> I'll be honest. I was putting off asking everyone here on the forum about my problem. I wanted to figure it out on my own. Since posting it, I don't feel as frustrated and pissed off as I did. Weird...


Could be because many people here are more than happy to help a fellow hobbyist. I know I am. What comes around, well, you know.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Indeed. Aint that the truth!

Unfortunately, I had to go into work tonight, and just got home. So nothing worked on... oh well. But plenty of overtime to spend on another project! Or bills.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Indeed. Aint that the truth!
> 
> Unfortunately, I had to go into work tonight, and just got home. So nothing worked on... oh well. But plenty of overtime to spend on another project! Or bills.


Let us know what you do step by step and the results. I think if you can narrow this down to something specific then it will help people in the future and possibly myself although I hope not. I think what makes it unique in your situation is you have two of these filters which will make it easy to diagnose.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

I don't have much time today, so I just did the easiest thing suggested so far. Blew out the intake. Some 'crud' came out but nothing to the extent that would cause a restriction. I can't determine if this had any effect at this time. I just fired it back up.

I was thinking... How could air get inside a pressurized filter? A standard circ pump or compressor has a discharge and supply. On the suction side there is still pressure, whether that be 1# or 112#. Look at an air conditioner in your home. On a warmer day, depending on your type of refrigerant, you may be running a 250# head pressure(discharge) and a 65# suction(using R-22 freon as an example). If there were a leak on the suction side, you would lose your charge, not suck in air since it's pressurized. If the compressor was allowed to run until the suction ran into a vacuum, then you would introduce air into the system. Same goes for a circ pump on a hot water system(boiler for example). If there were a loose fitting on your return, you would have a water leak, not sucking in air. Of course air can get into a system due to faulty a/c startup/maint, but for a boiler there are air vents installed for that purpose.

The examples I gave above are closed loop systems. Does the suction/intake on a canister run in a negative/vacuum? Or is it pressurized? If you were to make a small hole in you suction tubing, would water come flying out of it? I would think so.

I hope this makes sense...


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## mpowers (Apr 8, 2011)

The intake is under vacuum, negative pressure. So a really small hole or untight clamp would suck air and not leak water. To big of hole and any water coming out would be from the siphon effect if below the water line.

I'd still say keep it simple, remove the pads and see if the problem persist.

Thanks for keeping it updated, to many post a glitch with what ever and never return to say what the issue is/was.


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## Rob1984 (Jan 4, 2012)

hmmm, mine does the exact same thing... basically i took it all apart as well like you mentioned.... but what i found that work the best for MY situation was just putting only a bit of water in the canister just enough that the pump is and would stay sumerged... then id plug it in and she would blast out some air.. but then stop after only a few bubbles and then continue to fill the canister up with water.... and once it would fill up to where it should be or as far as it can go with the air that still in there it would blow air out for a good minute almost i bet... once it turns it self back on after the self priming procedure it would gasp out a bit of air and then be totally fine i havent had NO micro bubble's since i have been doing it this way now... not saying it going to work but it worth a shot ...


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Rob1984 said:


> hmmm, mine does the exact same thing... basically i took it all apart as well like you mentioned.... but what i found that work the best for MY situation was just putting only a bit of water in the canister just enough that the pump is and would stay sumerged... then id plug it in and she would blast out some air.. but then stop after only a few bubbles and then continue to fill the canister up with water.... and once it would fill up to where it should be or as far as it can go with the air that still in there it would blow air out for a good minute almost i bet... once it turns it self back on after the self priming procedure it would gasp out a bit of air and then be totally fine i havent had NO micro bubble's since i have been doing it this way now... not saying it going to work but it worth a shot ...


I knew you were having the same issue and glad you got it resolved.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Update:

Reversing the intake/return and allowing to run for 30 seconds to see if there was a restriction did not resolve the problem.

Today I applied a lubricant to the main o-ring, and also tried Rob's resolution by only filling the canister up a little. I believe filling it up with 2 gallons only applies for initial startup or if your intake has been allowed to drain(disconnect valve opened).

If I have the bubbles tomorrow, my next step is to swap canister positions, to eliminate hosing as a possible problem. I don't believe the hoses to be an issue, but I gotta cover the bases.

Till tmw...


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## Rob1984 (Jan 4, 2012)

Did ya use vaseline on the oring ? And ya I normally drain out the canister when cleaning it and fill with clean water... So far fixs my problem lol, also if your fine filter pads are old replace em.... I don't use fine filter pads in mine I only have one coarse/med pad in the middle basket on top and a coarse/med pad in bottom basket... Ya hopefully my method works for you too


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Rob1984 said:


> Did ya use vaseline on the oring ? And ya I normally drain out the canister when cleaning it and fill with clean water... So far fixs my problem lol, also if your fine filter pads are old replace em.... I don't use fine filter pads in mine I only have one coarse/med pad in the middle basket on top and a coarse/med pad in bottom basket... Ya hopefully my method works for you too


I used a non-toxic lube specifically for o-rings.

I also fill with fresh well water.

Just a single blue/white filter pad.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Update:

Still bubbles...

Swapped canister positions. Preliminary results point to the problem being in the filter, not the hoses. Will wait a full 24 hours though.

If they persist tmw I will even out the media between the 2 FX5s. This is starting to get very brutal.

Til tmw...


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Update:
> 
> Still bubbles...
> 
> ...


Swap tops and see what happens. The O ring is on the lid. It may have a small leak somewhere. I would then swap baskets.

I have been waiting on your updates to see what happens. Keep them coming.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

13razorbackfan said:


> I have been waiting on your updates to see what happens. Keep them coming.


Same here. We're with you buddy.

Have you configured a drain hose using that third valve they send so you don't have to carry that monster to a drain while it's full of water? I just set my first one up yesterday and it helped. A lot.

I now have four FX5's running... and am crossing my fingers I don't have a repeat of this problem.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Dawg2012 said:


> 13razorbackfan said:
> 
> 
> > I have been waiting on your updates to see what happens. Keep them coming.
> ...


Nah...I left my other aquastop valve hooked up to the ribbed hose with the dual nozzle. I didn't want to loosen the hose clamp since it is already making a good seal. I am pretty strong so lifting it out of my stand full of water is not an issue. I thought it was going to be worse than it was but I had no problems. Actually I thought my aquatop might have been a bit heavier.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

> Have you configured a drain hose using that third valve they send so you don't have to carry that monster to a drain while it's full of water?


I have a 5/8" hose from my old canisters that I hook up to the drain valve. I pull out about a gallon/gallon and a half, before moving it.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> > Have you configured a drain hose using that third valve they send so you don't have to carry that monster to a drain while it's full of water?
> 
> 
> I have a 5/8" hose from my old canisters that I hook up to the drain valve. I pull out about a gallon/gallon and a half, before moving it.


Now come on Iggy....if you can hold up that 12lb largemouth you should have no issues with carrying this filter! 

Nice fish BTW.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

HaHa! I wish... Thanks.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Update:

Still bubbles...

Took Razor's latest recommendation and swapped lids.

Tomorrow is media day!

Till then...


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Update:
> 
> Still bubbles...
> 
> ...


Swapping trays is all that is left besides the impeller/pump. Right?


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Well, pretty much. Remove the single filter pad? I've also thought about the drain valve. Not much I can do with that though.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Well, pretty much. Remove the single filter pad? I've also thought about the drain valve. Not much I can do with that though.


I would try the entire basket assembly first but it is up to you. Certainly the pad is something that would need to be removed next.

Also...another thing to think about is multiple things. I hope that is not the case as it will make it much tougher to diagnose. If you try the pad and the baskets and it doesn't fix it then I would contact the place you bought it and claim it defective or contact fluval.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

13razorbackfan said:


> Also...another thing to think about is multiple things. I hope that is not the case as it will make it much tougher to diagnose.


Yup. And with mine the problem just went away. Never did figure it out... so who knows. I am certainly going to fill out my warranty card now (I usually don't mess with them) and if I run into the issue will chase it up that way. Unfortunately this would leave you without a filter in the interim but... they are IMO completely unacceptable blowing bubbles into the tank.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Dawg2012 said:


> 13razorbackfan said:
> 
> 
> > Also...another thing to think about is multiple things. I hope that is not the case as it will make it much tougher to diagnose.
> ...


Unacceptable indeed. They need to figure out what is causing this.


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## cich2it (Jul 23, 2012)

With above comments...would you guys still recommend to purchase FX5?? I'm seeing other posts asking comments about it, and comparing to Fluval 406...etc..
don't know if they read your post...but I'm one gal who wants to hear the go-ahead and if this is rare fluke?? :?


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

cich2it said:


> With above comments...would you guys still recommend to purchase FX5?? I'm seeing other posts asking comments about it, and comparing to Fluval 406...etc..
> don't know if they read your post...but I'm one gal who wants to hear the go-ahead and if this is rare fluke?? :?


I would still recommend the filter. I love mine. I have no idea how rare or common this problem is. I hear people having this issue from time to time but there are A LOT of these filters on the market. As an overall % I would have no way of knowing. That is why I am interested to see from Iggy what he finds to solve his problem so we know what to do going forward.

I think this is a mistake on the part of fluval. They should be doing this work trying to resolve this issue and make recommendations. Instead they do nothing. It makes me really angry. They have a good filter here but apparently either us as the end user are causing this issue or there is a flaw that effects some units.

Maybe someone can do a poll of people who own this filter and who have experienced this issue.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

cich2it said:


> With above comments...would you guys still recommend to purchase FX5?? I'm seeing other posts asking comments about it, and comparing to Fluval 406...etc..
> don't know if they read your post...but I'm one gal who wants to hear the go-ahead and if this is rare fluke?? :?


Generally, micro bubbles are associated with clogged media/sponges. It is a very good filter, and will move a ton more water than a 406. I guesstimate that the FX5, when filled with media in the 3 trays is moving around 550-600 gph. The pump itself is rated for 900 gph.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Update:



> That is why I am interested to see from Iggy what he finds to solve his problem so we know what to do going forward.


Well, you won't be too happy then... there are no micro bubbles, as of 24 hours, from either unit. I just don't get it. All I did was swap lids.

As I've been battling this issue, my procedure when opening the canister is as follows...
1) power down the filter
2) close both valves(intake/return)
3) attach a 5/8" hose to the drain valve barb fitting, and open the drain valve
4) disconnect the quick disconnect return hose from the canister to allow flow through the drain port
5) empty about a gallon of water into a bucket via drain and close drain valve
6) remove canister from underneath the stand and perform whatever the **** was next on my list!

When I hook it back up, I open the intake, then return (per Fluval instructions) and purge air, before powering back up.

I can't say that I'm satisfied. Perhaps one o-ring didn't have a proper seal on one canister but good on the other? I saw no signs of damage to the lids, tops of the canisters where they seat to the o-ring, or anywhere else.

Of course, I will keep this updated. Probably not daily, as long as the bubbles stay away. Who knows...


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

I know right?! Mine just stopped... so I was happy... but not satisfied... and always worry they will come back. Mine resolved on July 11th and no more bubbles so that's what... about six weeks ago. I see bubbles every great now and then for a very short while, but nothing serious.

As for recommending them... I had the issue on the first one I bought and I've bought three more since then, so I guess I'd still recommend it. I might be sorry though... if one (or more) of them start with the bubbles again.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Dawg- weird I know. It is nice not having a massive cloud of bubbles clouding the water, even though I don't know exactly what the cause was.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Update:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am very happy it went away. If swapping lids fixed it then I am thinking maybe the O ring wasn't making a very good seal. Did you tighten the top any more than you normally do or about the same?


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

So weird ... maybe it was some very small difference in the shape of either the lid or the canister itself such that you could get a good seal on one canister, but not the other? Something you can't see with the naked eye ...


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> As I've been battling this issue, my procedure when opening the canister is as follows...
> 1) power down the filter
> 2) close both valves(intake/return)


Probably nothing to do with your problem but I thought I'd mention that I close both valves prior to pulling the plug. Otherwise, I have quite a bit of water spillage when disconnecting the hoses from the canister.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

GTZ said:


> Iggy Newcastle said:
> 
> 
> > As I've been battling this issue, my procedure when opening the canister is as follows...
> ...


Yeah....some people will close the intake valve wait a few seconds then shut the output valve followed by unplugging.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Razor- I tried to keep things consistent throughout the process, and lid tightening was included. I've seen a few photos somewhere online where an FX5 owner went Hulk on his 'hand tighten' knobs. Certainly didn't want to do that.

Storiwyr- Very weird. I didn't even empty the canisters yesterday or remove the trays. Just swapped lids.

GTZ- I always drain the canister first. When doing so, you lose a very tiny amount of water when you crack the return hose to drain. You don't even need a rag handy. For me, the FX5, when full, is pretty heavy to pull from my stand when I'm on my knees. 10 lbs lighter helps. Plus I don't have water to the brim of both return/intake fittings. I'll give your method a try in the future, perhaps.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Good to know...

Time before last I didn't close the valve at all before detaching it  . Had more than just a little spillage lol... :lol: . Sometimes I really need a dingbat smily.


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## [email protected]@n (Aug 28, 2012)

do you have any bubblers in your tank? if you do you will always have the micro bubble problem. the pressure changes in the filter cause the bubbles on tanks with bubblers. I fought this for a year until I had my air pump fail and the problem has not been back. you get more than adequate O2 in the water if your out lets disturb the surface in the tank.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

[email protected]@n said:


> do you have any bubblers in your tank? if you do you will always have the micro bubble problem. the pressure changes in the filter cause the bubbles on tanks with bubblers. I fought this for a year until I had my air pump fail and the problem has not been back. you get more than adequate O2 in the water if your out lets disturb the surface in the tank.


No bubblers and a spray bar for each filter, so tons of surface agitation.


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## mpowers (Apr 8, 2011)

Good to hear the bubbles went away, odd that a lid swap cured it. Thanks for following though with it!


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## toyster17 (Mar 31, 2012)

I cleaned my FX5 for the first time this past week, I think I have some air trapped in the filter. I'm getting a very minimal amount of micro bubbles, can't really see them unless you look closely, but do hear gushing in the filter occasionally. Sounds like it's right under the lid. It's possible air is stuck under there but I don't see how. IDK. I might try opening it again tomorrow and rearrange things.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

The FX5 shuts down approx. every 24 hours to allow any air that is trapped or accumulates in the filter to rise to the top of the canister and it's normally purged when the filter starts back up again.

It's possible that your media has trapped some air since you recently cleaned it. I wouldn't open the filter just yet. If it's still making noise in a couple days, you will need to figure out what has changed from the original media setup. The addition of polishing pads or filter floss may be causing the issue.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Update:

6 days and still bubble free. I did notice a slight wooshing noise from the filter with the possible problem lid. I will continue to keep an eye on it, of course.

I believe the lid design is flawed in a way. It is not smooth, but rather ridged in areas. I think it may actually trap some small pockets of air meant for discharge during purge shutdown. But I don't think in any way this causes micro bubble issues.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Update:
> 
> 6 days and still bubble free. I did notice a slight wooshing noise from the filter with the possible problem lid. I will continue to keep an eye on it, of course.
> 
> I believe the lid design is flawed in a way. It is not smooth, but rather ridged in areas. I think it may actually trap some small pockets of air meant for discharge during purge shutdown. But I don't think in any way this causes micro bubble issues.


This is very possible. I think what helps in my case is my OCD and my tendency to overtighten things. That may be bad for the O ring and bad for the hand screws. I am afraid I am going to snap off one of the screws.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Over-tightening the lid locks is a very common problem that often leads to snapping the locks, warping the lid or damaging the o-ring seal. You don't need a lot of compression on the lid to make a good seal, just enough so that it is evenly contacting the sealing surface of the canister body with the o-ring.

Iggy, I'm glad that the lid swap accomplished some results. It's possible there is a bit of material left over from the mfg. process that wasn't properly removed and that might be contributing to the air having a hard time to be purged because it is diverted by the ridges (flashing) that is in the way.


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## toyster17 (Mar 31, 2012)

Deeda said:


> The FX5 shuts down approx. every 24 hours to allow any air that is trapped or accumulates in the filter to rise to the top of the canister and it's normally purged when the filter starts back up again.
> 
> It's possible that your media has trapped some air since you recently cleaned it. I wouldn't open the filter just yet. If it's still making noise in a couple days, you will need to figure out what has changed from the original media setup. The addition of polishing pads or filter floss may be causing the issue.


I'll probably wait another day or two. The problem I'm having is the wooshing/gushing sound. I did remove two polishing pads from the top tray and replaced them with pot scrubbers (dollar store)...about 6 of them. Wouldn't say they were packed in, but idk.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Increased my bio load recently by adding new fish and have really stepped up on feeding. Over the last couple days noticed that my fx5 would spit some micro bubbles every 30 minutes or so then stop. It has been 5 weeks or so since I last cleaned it so I took it outside to clean. The blue/white filter pads were pretty clogged up with gunk. I went ahead and put some new ones in and what a difference. While water was still flowing through it wasn't flowing through nearly as fast. I could only imagine without one of these pads in each basket how much stuff would be getting through. I love having crystal clear water.

So I am going to need to clean this filter, as long as I am using the blue/white pads, once a month. The sponges were still fairly clean compared to the pads.

Just thought I would share.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

13razorbackfan said:


> Increased my bio load recently by adding new fish and have really stepped up on feeding. Over the last couple days noticed that my fx5 would spit some micro bubbles every 30 minutes or so then stop. It has been 5 weeks or so since I last cleaned it so I took it outside to clean. The blue/white filter pads were pretty clogged up with gunk. I went ahead and put some new ones in and what a difference. While water was still flowing through it wasn't flowing through nearly as fast. I could only imagine without one of these pads in each basket how much stuff would be getting through. I love having crystal clear water.
> 
> So I am going to need to clean this filter, as long as I am using the blue/white pads, once a month. The sponges were still fairly clean compared to the pads.
> 
> Just thought I would share.


Yea, what's up with that? I know the white sponges are very coarse, but they don't pick up much compared to the pads in the trays. I don't mind popping the lid and cleaning the filter every 4-6 weeks. Heck I think I can do it with my eyes closed now. Just seems odd that that much gunk is passing the sponges before reaching the trays.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

I may have learned something useful.

I was putting a tank back together after an issue, and had an FX5 blowing microbubbles, and making that swishing sound. My heart sank...

As I was working on everything, I was shutting off the FX5 and turning it back on. I noticed that every time I turned it off, a large bubble or two would float up the outlet hose (I have a clear hose connected, so I could see them float up). Every time I cycled power it would happen, though I noticed it less and less each time. I cycled power maybe six times, until no more bubbles floated up... I then turned it on and let it run, and the micro bubbles were gone. Hard to say if this was the same issue as before, but thought I'd throw it out there.

As for filter sponges, I've noticed the same thing. I think I may replace the upper sponges with something else... maybe the blue/white bonded pads.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> 13razorbackfan said:
> 
> 
> > Increased my bio load recently by adding new fish and have really stepped up on feeding. Over the last couple days noticed that my fx5 would spit some micro bubbles every 30 minutes or so then stop. It has been 5 weeks or so since I last cleaned it so I took it outside to clean. The blue/white filter pads were pretty clogged up with gunk. I went ahead and put some new ones in and what a difference. While water was still flowing through it wasn't flowing through nearly as fast. I could only imagine without one of these pads in each basket how much stuff would be getting through. I love having crystal clear water.
> ...


Yeah.....the sponges are just too coarse to trap smaller debris very efficiently. That is why I use the blue/white pads to help trap the smaller stuff and polish the water.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Dawg2012 said:


> I may have learned something useful.
> 
> I was putting a tank back together after an issue, and had an FX5 blowing microbubbles, and making that swishing sound. My heart sank...
> 
> ...


Yep I have heard of people doing that to help release the trapped air.


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

I do this after cleaning the filter. Cycle the power 5 or 6 times. Run for 5 seconds, unplug for 5 seconds...


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## cichlid-gal (Apr 27, 2012)

13razorbackfan said:


> Yeah.....the sponges are just too coarse to trap smaller debris very efficiently. That is why I use the blue/white pads to help trap the smaller stuff and polish the water.


I'm trying to get away from the filter pads in the canister and only use them in the HOB's in the hopes of increasing the time between canister maintenance. With the pads in the canisters I was opening them about once a month to clean/replace pads. Now I'm trying something different in the canisters...I'm using some Matrix in the place of the blue/white pads as it seems to have really good grabbing power and appears to build the biological up faster than the biorings. I'm using the blue/white pads (and I'm using ones that are an 1 1/2 thick) in my HOB's on the tanks for polishing and deeper cleaning. I just started this but I'm hoping that the 1 1/2 thick pad will hold up better than the thin pads and allow for routine cleaning and reuse.

All my tanks that have canisters also have HOB's and I know some of you are running only canisters on your tanks without HOB's so this plan of attack might not work for you.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

cichlid-gal said:


> 13razorbackfan said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah.....the sponges are just too coarse to trap smaller debris very efficiently. That is why I use the blue/white pads to help trap the smaller stuff and polish the water.
> ...


Let me know how it works especially in regards to water clarity. That is the main reason I use the pads but if the other media you are using does as good a job and will allow me to go longer without cleaning then I am all for it.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

cichlid-gal said:


> I'm trying to get away from the filter pads in the canister and only use them in the HOB's in the hopes of increasing the time between canister maintenance. With the pads in the canisters I was opening them about once a month to clean/replace pads. Now I'm trying something different in the canisters...I'm using some Matrix in the place of the blue/white pads as it seems to have really good grabbing power and appears to build the biological up faster than the biorings. I'm using the blue/white pads (and I'm using ones that are an 1 1/2 thick) in my HOB's on the tanks for polishing and deeper cleaning. I just started this but I'm hoping that the 1 1/2 thick pad will hold up better than the thin pads and allow for routine cleaning and reuse.
> 
> All my tanks that have canisters also have HOB's and I know some of you are running only canisters on your tanks without HOB's so this plan of attack might not work for you.


All my 55's have canisters as well as two HOB's... Kinda just worked out that way. I have to admit they have the clearest water of all my tanks.

My initial thought on not having pads in the canisters is that you're losing any mechanical prefiltering ahead of your bio media, which could get clogged depending on what it is... but then if your tank is that much cleaner of debris because of the HOB's, it might not matter. Just thinking out loud here. Yeah, opening the FX5's less often would be good. The HOB's always seem to produce that running water sound though... and with as many tanks as I have the GF is having problems not having to go to the bathroom all the time lol...


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## cichlid-gal (Apr 27, 2012)

Dawg2012 said:


> All my 55's have canisters as well as two HOB's... Kinda just worked out that way. I have to admit they have the clearest water of all my tanks.
> 
> My initial thought on not having pads in the canisters is that you're losing any mechanical prefiltering ahead of your bio media, which could get clogged depending on what it is... but then if your tank is that much cleaner of debris because of the HOB's, it might not matter. Just thinking out loud here. Yeah, opening the FX5's less often would be good. The HOB's always seem to produce that running water sound though... and with as many tanks as I have the GF is having problems not having to go to the bathroom all the time lol...


I kept the sponges in my canisters so I'm hoping that will be enough prefiltering. I know they will require cleaning but I'm also hoping not as often as the extra pads did. I'm just setting all this up so I'll have to see how it goes. I'll check the canisters at the one month mark and see how they are doing. My FX5 has the sponges on the outside of the rings, then from top to bottom....Matrix, Matrix/Biorings mixed, Biorings


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## Shahlvah (Dec 28, 2011)

Have you contact Hagen (manufacturer of Fluval products?) it might be that your unit is defective and they might step up to the plate. It happen to me with not one, but 2 light fixtures that fail. They replace them both. When I contact them I was just thinking in a good way to fix the fixtures, it came out that they were defective....and Hagen replace them both.
Just a thought....when nothing to fix y9our unit is working...call the manufacturer.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

THEY'RE BAAAAAACK.........


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> THEY'RE BAAAAAACK.........


F*&^! Have you tried cycling power a few times? I've had this fix it several times now. I turn the unit on for about 5-10 seconds, then turn it off for 5-10 seconds. After about five to six cycles most of the bubbles disappear.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

I would remove the blue/white pads all together and see if that fixes it.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

I will be trying both of these recommendations, along with other things if need be. Thanks, guys.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Patience. It's important. I'll be posting back when I don't want to strangle something....


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## eutimio (Aug 22, 2012)

Updates?Noticed microbubbles in my tank today coming out of the spray bar.What is up with that?****!


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

How's it going Iggy?

I've had two episodes now where cycling the power several times fixed the problem, though sometimes it took time (several hours, and in one case a day). I cycle it until I don't hear the swishing any more... though I have one now that is swishing but no bubbles lol.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Sorry for the delay.

The bubbles started back up on the filter with the possible 'problem' lid last week. All I did to remedy it, which did take a while, was cycle the power as Dawg suggested. I have a clear return/supply hose and could see the air escape when powered down. It was quite an easy fix, if you can call it that. No less frustrating than the bubbles disappearing before, though.

Been bubble free since Sunday I believe. And occasionally I hear a swoosh here or there but no bubbles. Baffled.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Sorry for the delay.
> 
> The bubbles started back up on the filter with the possible 'problem' lid last week. All I did to remedy it, which did take a while, was cycle the power as Dawg suggested. I have a clear return/supply hose and could see the air escape when powered down. It was quite an easy fix, if you can call it that. No less frustrating than the bubbles disappearing before, though.
> 
> Been bubble free since Sunday I believe. And occasionally I hear a swoosh here or there but no bubbles. Baffled.


Mine makes the same swishing sound after it powers down and back up again. The only time I have noticed bubbles is when my pads start to clog and it spits the bubbles every 10-15 minutes. I then clean it and works perfectly.


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## eutimio (Aug 22, 2012)

youre right razor I just took the blue fluval pads out of the canister and bubbles dissappeared .I was using them despite of the fact that i knew theyre bad ..i even split the pad in half to allow more water to pass and still no good.I barely had any water flow before i took it out.Now everything is back to normal.


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## toyster17 (Mar 31, 2012)

Even after rearranging the pot scrubbers in the top basket, I still had some micro-bubbles and the swoosh sound. I did cycle the power a few times and it seemed to remedy the problem temporarily. After a few hours the problem would come back. But about two weeks ago or so, the problem just went away. I don't know if doing the power cycle (on and off about six times) was the answer or if after doing a couple water changes the problem went away (only reason I say this is because when doing water changes the water line drops below the output nozzle and it takes in air, don't know if maybe this somehow fixed it...long shot, I know).

Either way, quiet as ever


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## MPKS92 (Nov 5, 2010)

Just beating a dead horse here! But I have three of these. Just purchased a new one and it has micro bubbles. Or a semi used . Got it off ebay for 100 bones. It had a broken lid. Purchased a new lid. Then placed inline and away she went. Strong as all the others. Week went by and bubbles. Turned it off and it vented the bubbles out on its own. Tweeked it a bit lubed and re-sealed the gaskets. Week later still the same. Again I uplugged it and it vented no bubbles for a while. Started thinking no more used stuff off ebay as this would be second time I was screwed.  As I was standing back and re-assesing my situation. I was thinking where is the weak spots on this thing. And I realised it was the intake side. See there is no real seal on the ribbed hose to the rubber coupling. the one inside the tank. So I pushed it further in the water below the water line and guess what? She is all better. Simple 10 seconds worth of time and its done. Even though the ribbed hose was seated all the way in and my others are above the water line this one has a small issue apparently. All is well now.


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## Michael_M (May 31, 2012)

Getting my first Fx5 tomorrow, at least I'll have 7 pages of trouble shooting should I ever need it.


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## blackedout (Sep 21, 2010)

could someone mesg me the best place to buy the FX5's. *** looked online, and see some really good deals, but i always here of people getting them for steals online!!


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