# Basic DIY water changing system help



## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Hi everyone! I am needing some help on making a simple water changing system. My usual method is the old 5g bucket method, but with two tanks now and a recent L4-5 and L5-S1 disc extrusion injury, I can no longer do this. :roll: I have an aqueon water changing system already, but am dead set on treating water with prime before adding to the tank. My idea is to replace the buckets with a large plastic container (thinking 60g + cooler or something that could then be used for other things as well), mark off 10g increments with tape inside or outside of it, and have some sort of pump in the container with hosing that would then pump the treated water back into the tanks. I would use my Aqueon to drain water as usual, then use it to fill the container with water @ correct temp, then turn on the pump with hosing in the tank to refill once treated. I would want this to be portable and able to be out of the way when not doing changes thus the idea of a large cooler with wheels. I'm not sure what kind of pump I would mount in it to get the treated water back into the tanks though. Any suggestions? :-?


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I used to use a 32G Rubbermaid Commercial Brute trash can with wheeled dolly to hold & treat water for a couple tanks and it worked extremely well. It only held 25 gallons of water to move comfortably over carpet. I used a spare Eheim 1260 pump to transfer the water back to the tank. The pump and hoses were stored in the can between uses.

I've since graduated to using an RV hose to fill the tanks directly, adding conditioner directly to the tank for the full volume of the aquarium and not the amount of water changed. I understand you don't want to use this method but it has worked for lots of people without any problems.

Just be aware that moving a large container of water, even with wheels, can still be a struggle with a bad back and water spills are still possible.

Choosing a water pump is relatively easy, just check the head height of the pump to see how many gallons per hour can be pumped at X height. Submersible aquarium or pond pumps are preferred but depending on the design, may not get all the water out of the tote. The ones with a threaded intake port will allow you to attach a fitting and hose to get most of the water from the tote.


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Knowing that someone with your experience uses the method of treating the whole tank volume makes me want to give it a try first. Prime is reasonably priced and highly concentrated and with both tanks matured I don't think it would disrupt my biofilter or anything @ this point. You also bring up a good point that some moving/lifting would still be required. Thank you for the helpful info Deeda that really helps and I really appreciate it. :thumb:


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I do want to mention that I use untreated well water for my home but I still use a water conditioner though it probably isn't needed. I have used Prime in the past but currently using ClorAmX which is a powdered product.

When I maintained a tank on city water, I still used the same procedure I outlined without any loss of fish or problems with mini-cycles.

There are also countless members on C-F and other forums as well as local fish club members that use the direct fill method without issue. You just need to remember to add your water conditioner prior to or during the fill to avoid problems.

If you are concerned, you could always try small water changes >20G using direct fill with water conditioner and see how your fish react. This should be a good indicator on whether your fish experience any problems.


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

I normally change out 20-25g/wk in my 65g and 40-50g/wk in my 120g. This has always kept my nitrates under 20ppm. I am currently on vacation and have someone feeding 1x/day instead of 2x because they are not capable of doing water changes. So, my tanks are going two weeks before I will get back to do water changes. When I do, this would be a good time for me to try this out with smaller water changes every other day until my nitrates (not sure what to expect them to read when I get home) are below 10ppm. I have explored the direct fill method before on the forum and the conclusion from Seachem was to treat first and then add, so it didn't bother me too much to do that. During that discussion on the forum though numerous forum members confirmed using the direct fill method with Prime and without problems. If my injury that sent me to the ER three weeks ago had not occurred, I would probably stick with hoisting 5g buckets, but I need to be smart and take better care of my back. The repeated lifting week in and week out caught up to me despite good body mechanics (I am a Physical therapist ironically enough) and the lifting/bending over involved with my 120g project and the oak cabinet build started it all back in April. I am going to confirm our city water parameters of chloramine etc. and make sure the normal dose will suffice and then go with several smaller water changes - which I was going to have to do anyways with them going two weeks without water change and see how they do. Again, thanks Dee for your help and guidance. :wink: Despite all this I am going through likely being related to my new found love for cichlid aquariums, I refuse to give it up. I still enjoy it and love the fish and tanks I have worked hard to put together over the past several months. :thumb: :fish:


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I understand. I also have occasional issues with back problems and with the increase in the number of tanks I have, the direct fill is perfect. I still sometimes add a bucket of water to tanks to top off when I get lazy on water changes and it's not fun.

Keep us posted on what you decide to do after vacation.


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## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

Deeda said:


> I understand. I also have occasional issues with back problems and with the increase in the number of tanks I have, the direct fill is perfect. I still sometimes add a bucket of water to tanks to top off when I get lazy on water changes and it's not fun.
> 
> Keep us posted on what you decide to do after vacation.


With only about thirty tanks and a smaller house and fish room, I am back for now with buckets to empty tanks and buying Prime or using something I win in a club raffle to dechlorinate the new water.

However I filled directly with a Python in the old 40 foot fish room. The city water ran through a "Big Blue" carbon block filter before reaching the water heater or any taps. This removed chlorine, chloramine, tastes, and colors. It probably reduced the amount of copper, lead, and other contaminants too. I did not use any dechlor since it would have been adding a chemical that would donate sodium to the water for (now) no good reason. We also had well water, and I aerated it by running it through a 48" long gravel cleaner set at horizontal and outfitted with a rake to further aerate the water.

I may install one of the whole house size carbon block filters in this house. Even with massive water changes in a lots of tanks, and four adults, three children, and a 2400 gallon pond, the carbon block only had to be replaced about every three months. One of the Lorain County Aquarium Society members put in an automated water change system. There was an article with pictures in one of their club newletters, which might still be online somewhere.


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

That's something I have never heard of. I'll look into it. Thank you for the info. Dee - I'll be sure to update when I get home. Counting the days when I can get back to all my little guys and get their water changed. :fish: One thing I think I'm going to do regardless, is go to the python. I have had more trouble with the aqueon than I would like. Had to replace the part that connects to the faucet 2x already despite being sure to not overtighten and am having troubles with the third one staying connected to the faucet and the hose staying connected to it. :x Maybe the python would give me less trouble. Thanks again everyone. :thumb:


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## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

I have had numerous Pythons and when the water bed stores were around lots of their brands. I looked at the Aqueon and it looked like it might be sturdier than a Python. The Aqueon valve is a lot longer which would be an issue in a shallow sink. It is easy to break these things, and if they last a long time, they leak. Right now, I'm omitting the valve and using the Python hose direct to refill, and siphoning into buckets. The venturi uses a lot of water, so without "free" well water to power it, I will either use buckets or some day set up a pump.


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## lilscoots (Mar 13, 2012)

If your python reaches the tank, you don't have to move the filling bucket when it has water in it. Wheel it empty to the tank, fill with water, condition water, pump water out, wheel empty bucket back to where you store it.


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## gilberbt (Aug 1, 2009)

Deeda said:


> I used to use a 32G Rubbermaid Commercial Brute trash can with wheeled dolly to hold & treat water for a couple tanks and it worked extremely well. It only held 25 gallons of water to move comfortably over carpet. I used a spare Eheim 1260 pump to transfer the water back to the tank. The pump and hoses were stored in the can between uses.


I am basically using this setup now with a 32G brute and dolly and it works well as an option. If you can reach the tank directly and treat in there that works well for many, I am mainly doing this because I recently moved and my tank and water source are on different floors now so I just fill up the Brute at the bottom of the stairs and wheel it over to the tank room.

Another option I have used in the past is I bought a large rectangular rubber maid container that fit into my bathtub to fill and treat there and then pump it to the tank. One less step then the brute trash can but may not work in every scenario.


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

When I first get home I know I'm going to have to do a water change ASAP since they have gone two weeks without one  I'm just going to try the direct fill then. You all are right that I can easily wheel the container directly to each tank as my aqueon (soon to be python I think) does reach each tank easily from our kitchen sink where I hook it up. I am going to get to work on setting up this system, but might take a week or so to get going. I do think I'm going to look into a large cooler with wheels so it can be used for other things as well. I believe I can get these in fairly large sizes and I will want a container with a larger volume than what I need to replace (up to 60g) for a 50% water change because the pump will not be able to drain the container completely. I think this system will work great and should be reasonable to set up. Thanks for the info everyone! :thumb:


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Mcdaphnia - so you've experienced the same problems with the python it sounds like. The aqueon is all plastic and the main problem I keep having are the plastic threads wearing down and not holding to the faucet - despite being careful to not tighten it too much. It is hard to find any really good pictures of the python, but it appeared that the part which hooks to your faucet is made of metal. Do you know if that is true? What went wrong with the pythons you had?


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## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

crazycolt42 said:


> Mcdaphnia - so you've experienced the same problems with the python it sounds like. The aqueon is all plastic and the main problem I keep having are the plastic threads wearing down and not holding to the faucet - despite being careful to not tighten it too much. It is hard to find any really good pictures of the python, but it appeared that the part which hooks to your faucet is made of metal. Do you know if that is true? What went wrong with the pythons you had?


The Pythons are not metal. They are all plastic. However there is a brass faucet adapter you can get that has more thread variety and can be used with more sink faucets than the plastic one that comes with the Python. http://morebeer.com/products/brass-sink ... ?site_id=5 As the Pythons age, they waste more water than they did to start, begin to leak and eventually fly off the faucet in pieces. The metal adapter does not prevent this. About 30 years ago another cichlid club member machined a venturi for me out of acrylic. That showed no wear, but one day it just vanished.


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Good to know Mcdaphnia. I went ahead and returned the leaking Aqueon and exchanged it for a new one. Sounds like they both have similar problems with the plastic. Did a check when I got home and my 65g was @ 20ppm and the 120g @ 40ppm, Did 50% and used the direct fill method. So far so good. Going to repeat the process on the 120g again tonight. I want to lower levels rather gradually over the next week until they are back down to 5ppm or so. I added all the prime right before filling. I aimed the gravel vac towards the side wall close to it so it would kind of splash in the back corner and hopefully diffuse the chloramine before it could reach the fish without binding to the prime first. Thanks again everyone!


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## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

CrazyColt, It is unlikely you have chloramine in your water. It is illegal in many countries. In the US you could take the position that the EPA encourages water companies to use chloramine since it can skew the results of some tests they require. But the odds are in your favor. 80% of US water companies never use it and the minority that does only use it briefly, when they need those tests to come out passing.


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Mcdaphnia, I looked into it and it so happens that Indianapolis city water is on the top ten list of worst city water based on levels of byproducts from sanitizing the water. My tap reads .25ppm ammonia which I assume is chloramine, but could not find out for sure from searching what the current composition is of indy water. Thank you for the info. :thumb:


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## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

crazycolt42 said:


> Mcdaphnia, I looked into it and it so happens that Indianapolis city water is on the top ten list of worst city water based on levels of byproducts from sanitizing the water. My tap reads .25ppm ammonia which I assume is chloramine, but could not find out for sure from searching what the current composition is of indy water. Thank you for the info. :thumb:


Indianapolis was surrounded by farmland last time I was there. Ammonia in tap water is often caused by agricultural runoff. Chlorine would react with ammonia to form chlorine I believe. If you use the carbon block filter to remove contaminants, you might have to replace it more often than I have.


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## ticman1 (Jul 18, 2014)

I have read numerous posts about how to pump water out of the tank. Finally took the plunge (no pun intended).

I got a 200gph pump from Harbor Freight==on sale for $10.88.

I took off the tube from my python and attached hose to new pump.

did a 50% water change in my 75 gal tank in about 12 minutes. took longer to refill the tank using the Python. All told 26 minutes.

I am very pleased.


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## spotmonster (Nov 23, 2006)

I'm very surprised you had issues with the aqueon. My experience finds the faucet attachment part of the aqueon to be far superior to the python part. The hose on the python is far better though.


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## spotmonster (Nov 23, 2006)

As others have stated, i use direct fill method and treat the entire tank volume. If I had to go back to buckets or tubs, I would not be in this hobby.

Also depending on what i'm doing and how many tanks I'm working on, i use three methods to drain.

1. i have a garden hose that hooks to the output of my FX5.

2. i also have adapters on the same garden hose that hooks to a submersible pump that i drop in the tank.

3. i can also remove the vacuum portion of the python and insert the hose into a rio pump.

The idea here is I can use these combo's to drain more than one tank at a time.


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