# is 28 mbuna in a 75 gallon tank too much?



## vinnyxgunz (Aug 4, 2010)

i have plenty of rock and caves and pvc piping for hiding and i'm over filtered on an eheim 2217. i do 20% water changes once a week.


----------



## benny71 (Sep 30, 2010)

28 is quite a few for a 75g, but I'd be more worried about only doing 20% water changes...I don't have that many fish per gallon in my any of my tanks and I do 50% water changes at least once a week to keep the nitrates in check.


----------



## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

The numbers don't count as much as some other things we don't know. Size, age, and type of fish will matter a great deal. Possibly even more important is how you feed and maintain the tank. Some people overfeed and some don't. Some clean and vac well, some don't. For me the only way to judge is by testing. You don't mention testing but if you do test and the water is running fine, I would call it good. If it works, it works. If you have ammonia, nitrite or high nitrate readings--- that doesn't work well over the long term. How you feel about giving fish room to act natural and grow better is strictly a personal choice in my book.


----------



## KaiserSousay (Nov 2, 2008)

*i'm over filtered on an eheim 2217.*

For that size tank and the amount of fish you want to keep, I wouldn`t agree, that you are "overfiltered".
As they grow, your going to have tankfull of poop machines.
Do agree, as they get bigger your WC routine will have to change.


----------



## vinnyxgunz (Aug 4, 2010)

they are all 2-4", so not too big. i don't overfeed - i feed twice a day, but very little. my parameters i have finally gotten at 0/0/5 when my nitrate usually would be between 30-80.

i also have a penguin 350 filter running with the eheim 2217. i think in a few months when they get bigger i'll upgrade to a 125 gallon.


----------



## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I currently have 28-30 Africans in a 75 running a 2217 alone. The largest are 5 Cyrtocara (hap)moorii at 5 inches. The others are 7 Lab hongi breeding group and various small growouts and 10-12 hap ahli just reaching 2-21/2 inch and beginning to color. i have had no trouble with this setup but at this point I just placed an ad to shuffle off some of the fish in other tanks so I can move some of these. The downside I have seen is that the Hongi are not coloring and breeding as well as they might. I believe this is due to the moori being larger. I do a 25% water on 10-14 days and clean the filter when I see the flow reduced. I rarely keep the same fish in this tank more than 6 months so I can't comment on the long term situation as I'm constantly changing it anyway. I keep a group and breed them until I tire of them and then switch to something else and usually only keep fry from the group that I trade off. 
Group with yellow labs before trading them









Group with Hongi after the swap. See the holding female in front of the rocks? 









This stocking is as much as I would want but I see no problems with it at present. I test frequently and never let the nitrate get over 20PPM.


----------



## benny71 (Sep 30, 2010)

PfunMo said:


> I currently have 28-30 Africans in a 75 running a 2217 alone. The largest are 5 Cyrtocara (hap)moorii at 5 inches. The others are 7 Lab hongi breeding group and various small growouts and 10-12 hap ahli just reaching 2-21/2 inch and beginning to color. i have had no trouble with this setup but at this point I just placed an ad to shuffle off some of the fish in other tanks so I can move some of these. The downside I have seen is that the Hongi are not coloring and breeding as well as they might. I believe this is due to the moori being larger. I do a 25% water on 10-14 days and clean the filter when I see the flow reduced. I rarely keep the same fish in this tank more than 6 months so I can't comment on the long term situation as I'm constantly changing it anyway. I keep a group and breed them until I tire of them and then switch to something else and usually only keep fry from the group that I trade off.
> Group with yellow labs before trading them
> 
> 
> ...


What do your nitrates look like after 14 days?

My fish are smaller and there are way less than that and after 7 days I'm due for a 50% change.


----------



## dielikemoviestars (Oct 23, 2007)

Yeah, I'd say you're being a bit irresponsible if you're not doing half the tank weekly, with that sort of bioload. Filters only work on ammonia and nitrite, remember, so no matter how much filtration you have, you're still going to get the same amount of nitrate in the end.


----------



## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Mine always stay less than 20PPM. If it appears they are working up I back off on feeding for a half day or do a water change. I kind of set 20 as an upper limit for me. That's part of my thinking when testing. You can never relie on things to stay the same at all times. With more fish it would be easy for one to go missing and that could blow the best routine straight out the window. I keep the test strips handy and log the readings so that it is easy to spot if something is changed from the last time. I feel the different response we each get can be laid to the different water as well as the way we each do things like feeding and cleaning. It may also be partly due to the frequent times when I drain down to do a fish catching. Maybe the occasional 50% does enough to knock things down.


----------



## KaiserSousay (Nov 2, 2008)

*penguin 350 filter running with the eheim 2217*

Now, that sounds more like it.
I still wouldn`t call your tank "overfiltered".


----------



## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

While it might seem obvious to me, some of you seem to miss the point that it works well for my fish. While it does not mean it would work well for you or in other spots, what could I gain from doing more water changes? The fish are growing, spawning to the point of making me trade them when I get tired of catching them, and have all the colors I could ask for. Do I just change more water for the exercise? This hobby can really be fun if we just drop back and stop with all this insane rule making. If it works-- it works!

I don't think tanks are ever overfiltered, just over fussed! If my fish get sick, I'll know I did something wrong, meanwhile I'm going with what works!


----------



## Mbunaaddict (Oct 28, 2010)

AMEN PfunMo! If it works it works! If it aint broke dont fix it!


----------



## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Many in our group seem to have reached a point where the object is not to enjoy fishkeeping as a hobby but to enjoy the thrill of buying/owning more and better equipment. Sad but I think the world would be a better place if there were more fun in simple things. Anybody been buying toys for kids lately? I bet you see what I mean.


----------

