# Sold as a Red Shoulder Peacock????



## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

It's not the best picture, but I got this fish in trade from a guy who said he was a Red Shoulder Peacock. He's beautiful, but vicious. He has a weird facial/eye stripe(similar to a Venustus) that I've not seen on any peacocks. As I have an all male tank, I'm not worried about breeding him, just thought someone would know what he is...Could he be a Red Empress ? I've not seen one in person..
He's in the "time out tank, and I may try him one more time before I pass him along...


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

It is not a Red Shoulder, nor a Red Empress.

Would need a better picture to give a positive ID, but chances are it is a Ruby/German Red, or hybrid.


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

I think hybrid..


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## ws812 (Apr 17, 2009)

looks like a german red type


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

Are German reds maniacs to every other fish?


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Floridagirl said:


> Are German reds maniacs to every other fish?


Nope but I hear the next generation can be when crossed with firefish. :wink:


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

But if he has an eye stripe there must I guess be more too it than that.
Maybe an Aulonocara x Protomelas Steveni Taiwan Reef. (may explain the agression a bit too)
But for sure not seen one before.
Have to say despite maybe being a hybrid its a glorious looking fish.

All the best James


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## SanDiegoCichlid619 (Jan 24, 2010)

I have 1 that looks just like it , its a German red


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

SanDiegoCichlid619 said:


> I have 1 that looks just like it , its a German red


Can you give a photo please.
Modern German Reds look like this








But I think I am getting that in the US pretty much any line bred or crossed Aulonocara with red in it is sold as German Red or red shoulder.
Just look at the profiles on this site  
Those are no where near the colour of modern German Reds.
Also there is the eye stripe.
No German Red has an eye stripe? Yes? Funny enough so called pure German Reds have this and no pure Aulonocara does. A bit of a puzzel if they are as claimed a pure but line bred species and variant?
Sure its a nice looking fish but its not a good modern German Red from erm Germany.
The eye stipe well yep thats fine lots of so called "Aulonocara" have em but its not a natural trait in Aulonocara.
It is a skillfully crafted fish with good colour but what it should be called is a bit of a puzzel.
A US version of a German Red perhaps?

All the best James


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## SanDiegoCichlid619 (Jan 24, 2010)

Was reading this article about them and a few others , I think all the "red" alunocara are bred from these Orange looking ones

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/red_peacocks.php


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

24Tropheus said:


> SanDiegoCichlid619 said:
> 
> 
> > I have 1 that looks just like it , its a German red
> ...


Eye stripe isn't a natural trait in Aulonocara? :lol: Actually... it is.

"Pure" "Modern" German Reds? :lol: So, the old German reds, aren't real? Only the German ones are good?

Thanks. opcorn:


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

Here are a few better pics. I took him out of time out to try him again. He sure is beautiful!


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## SanDiegoCichlid619 (Jan 24, 2010)

Maybe that is a hybrid I didn't see all that yellow on him. Nice fish tho!


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## noki (Jun 13, 2003)

Unique fish, I wonder if he will stay yellow with an orange shoulder.


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## LanceN34 (Mar 24, 2011)

Hybrid or not...that is an amazing fish.


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## Guest (Apr 19, 2011)

def hybrid i have one from a lfs that looks very very similar.. mines still sub-adult but ill take some pics when i can..


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Fogelhund said:


> Eye stripe isn't a natural trait in Aulonocara? :lol: Actually... it is.
> 
> "Pure" "Modern" German Reds? :lol: So, the old German reds, aren't real? Only the German ones are good?
> 
> Thanks. opcorn:


Oops yep I got that wrong.  
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=1409
Any idea why folk think this one is hybrid Fogelhund rather than just a line bred guy?
To be honest I am kind of giving up these days on telling the difference, they all seem so mixed up to me.   
Sad because I really do not mind buying/keeping/breeding line bred but its just not possible for me to spot the difference between these and hybrid line bred guys.
So as I said before. No idea wheather any German Red is pure anything.

All the best James


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

I have no idea if a "real" German Red from Germany, from the original sources is pure.... Nor the Ruby... nobody knows, except the original breeders, and they haven't really ever stated. Lots of speculation, but all we can say is they are man made fish.

I couldn't begin to guess if this is a "true" (I hate to say hybrid or not in a "strain" that might be a hybrid to begin with) German/Ruby Red....

What we can conclude, is it doesn't look like a natural species in the lake, and is some man made fish, could be a red variant... or not...


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

8) 
Thanks.


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## solgood (Sep 23, 2009)

How large is the fish? I have seen peacocks that look like that but they were hormoned.


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

solgood said:


> How large is the fish? I have seen peacocks that look like that but they were hormoned.


About 4.5 inches.


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Floridagirl said:


> solgood said:
> 
> 
> > How large is the fish? I have seen peacocks that look like that but they were hormoned.
> ...


At 4.5 inches it could well be free from being hormoned and be showing full colour.
Its the guys at 2" that are coming in showing this sort of colour that I worry about.
Saying that I have bred Aulonocara sp. "Lwanda" max size 6" and the young showed full colour at 2" and I was acused of treating em with hormones. So hard to tell with these Aulonocara guys. They can colour up real young if away from full size guys. Huge fins rather than good colour is I guess the way to tell em apart. Not that hormoning has been proved as far as I know to course long term damage to peacocks but it sure as **** makes getting females a bit of a pain. You never know the sex until you keep em for a bit. The dury is kind of still out on that one, Is hormoning a tool to sell fish that causes no long term damage or is it a crule practice. Sadly it is already illegal here so I can not experiment to try and find out. But it sure adds a lot of confusion and is a tool of the guys who want profit rather than sell good stuff in my humble guess.

All the best James


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