# Can Clown Loaches Survive in A. Cichlid Tank?



## LabLoVer1

The size is a 55g and i have quite a few A. Cichlids with lots of rocc work 
the current list are about:

5 yellow Labs
2 Albino Zebras
2 Johannis

they are no bigger than 2in. I was just curious and wanted to know
from more experienced owners and dealers with A. Cichlids so
please let me any info and suggestions you guys have thanks in 
advance...


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## lovemycichlids805

Well we had 2 clown loaches in with our african cichlids and at first they were fine. We developed ich (or so I thought) and ended up with dead clown loaches. I'm no expert by any means but I don't see why you couldn't. I know alot of ppl who have clown loaches in their A. cichlid tanks. Also the LFS has them in with their A.cichlids, and at my LFS they are pretty smart people.


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## QHgal

Some have had luck with them and some haven't. Guess it depends on the attitudes of your fish.

Just a note on your stocking, tho. Your gonna need to up your numbers of Johanni and Albino Zebra. Cichlids are not pairing fish. With both of those species you want one male to 3 or 4 females.


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## lotsofish

If you ask the experts on the loach forum they will say NO!

http://forums.loaches.com/index.php


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## stargirly1208

The guy at my LFS has clowns in with his africans and I questioned him about this. He said as long as you put them in there when the fish are juvenile they should be fine. I have kept clowns for a loooooooong time and I find they are a very aggressive fish and should be labeled as so. They ate my angelfish  I think I am going to try and keep mine with my africans... I'll let you know how it goes come July when I set up my tank in the new apartment. :thumb:


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## eyezak

I have one with my Haps and Peacocks.No problem here.If anything he bothers the other tankmates,but no aggresion either way :thumb:


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## Fischfan13

The toughest part of adding Clown Loaches into an African tank with be acclimating them into the tank. The last colony I bought (eight, in all) were acclimated using the "drip method"...leaving the Clown's in the water that they came in (I used a bucket) and using an airline tube, knotted, and dripping water from the tank that they will be going into. This process took all day, and it is worth it.
My Clowns have been in with a Tropheus colony, Yellow Labs, Demasoni and Cyno Afras...and there has never been an incident. 
Go for it.


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## BrianNFlint

I've had clowns in my mbuna tank for 3+ years with no problems. I did not add them while my mbuna were juvie, but i would suggest.

On a side note.. Clowns are more than capable of dealing with an offensive mbuna.. I would suggest keeping them in groups of 3 or more.. Keep in mind that they WILL out grow a 55 gallon tank. They do not stay small and cute but are actually a very large fish when fully grown.


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## ME_AND_GREENTERROR

just something would 4 clown loaches work with a pair of JD's in a 55?


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## QHgal

> They do not stay small and cute but are actually a very large fish when fully grown.


Yes, they will outgrow your tank. But, they can take up to 10 years to reach full growth.


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## BrianNFlint

QHgal said:


> They do not stay small and cute but are actually a very large fish when fully grown.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, they will outgrow your tank. But, they can take up to 10 years to reach full growth.
Click to expand...

But it wont take 10 years to out grow a 55 gallon tank.  I am not trying to discourage him just letting him know that at some point he will either need a bigger tank or they will have to be removed.


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## eyezak

BrianNFlint said:


> QHgal said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They do not stay small and cute but are actually a very large fish when fully grown.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, they will outgrow your tank. But, they can take up to 10 years to reach full growth.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> But it wont take 10 years to out grow a 55 gallon tank.  I am not trying to discourage him just letting him know that at some point he will either need a bigger tank or they will have to be removed.
Click to expand...

Yeah but not for a couple of years.Enjoy them :thumb:


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## LabLoVer1

I appreciate all the advice really, I was getting discouraged because a lot of people hear "Cichlids" and instantly sentence other kinds of fish death if ever put in the same tank. I also read that the Clown Loaches can maintain very well but everyone i had looked to advice to were very closed minded to it. So i appreciate the knowledge and opinions i really love the fish in my tank but I admit i have a thing for the Clown Loach...haha


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## stslimited84

I think the key word in your question is "survive". Clown loaches have developed to live in soft acidic water. Yes, they will survive in a cichlid tank, but that does not make it ideal for them. I admit I love loaches too, but it just doesnt seem right putting such a good looking fish in non-optimum water parameters.

Check out this link:

http://www.loaches.com/articles/why-loa ... i-cichlids

Its quite clear that Loaches should not be kept in a cichlid tank.


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## Oneeyedgeckz

I'm notorious to mixing species that don't normally go together... people generally say don't mix the lakes the fish are from.. I say as long as they all grow up together there should be no problems. In my one tank I have african cichlids with oscars and a catfish and they get along famously.  If you are still concerned about putting them together you can always set up another, smaller tank maybe a 30 long, and build it around your clown loaches.

I agree that you need to up the number of Albino Zebras and the Johannis, and that in the future you will most likely need a larger tank.


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## stslimited84

I'm sorry but recommending a 30 long for a clown loach isnt right, unless the loach is 1 or 2 inches. If you plan on keeping clown loaches into adult hood, a 6' tank should be considered a minimum.

Mixing loaches with cichlids is different compared to mixing african cichlids from different lakes. Clown loaches come from completely different water conditions.

Basically, the easiest way to put it is like this: Would you keep your tangs/malawi's in soft acidic water with a ph 6.5?


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## BrianNFlint

stslimited84 said:


> I'm sorry but recommending a 30 long for a clown loach isnt right, unless the loach is 1 or 2 inches. If you plan on keeping clown loaches into adult hood, a 6' tank should be considered a minimum.
> 
> Mixing loaches with cichlids is different compared to mixing african cichlids from different lakes. Clown loaches come from completely different water conditions.
> 
> Basically, the easiest way to put it is like this: Would you keep your tangs/malawi's in soft acidic water with a ph 6.5?


So then putting bristlenose plecos in a rift lake tank is wrong too?


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## Windsor

While I do not have any in my current tank (the LFS was out of stock), I have always considered them as 'staple' in any of my African tanks. They can really take a beating out of some of the more aggressive cichlids, but can defend themselves too. Clown loaches (and some other loaches) have a sharp, retractable barb, like a cat's claw, under their eye. It's used similarly to how a saltwater tang uses it's 'tang'. I've seen clown loaches give cichlids a shot with this barb when they tire from getting picked on and have had enough. Never had any problems and they are terrific scavengers. So comical when they 'play dead' too. haha... :thumb:


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## stslimited84

BrianNFlint said:


> stslimited84 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sorry but recommending a 30 long for a clown loach isnt right, unless the loach is 1 or 2 inches. If you plan on keeping clown loaches into adult hood, a 6' tank should be considered a minimum.
> 
> Mixing loaches with cichlids is different compared to mixing african cichlids from different lakes. Clown loaches come from completely different water conditions.
> 
> Basically, the easiest way to put it is like this: Would you keep your tangs/malawi's in soft acidic water with a ph 6.5?
> 
> 
> 
> So then putting bristlenose plecos in a rift lake tank is wrong too?
Click to expand...

Did you answer my question? Would you keep your african cichlids in soft acidic water with a ph of 6.5?

Answer that question, and you'll have your answer.

I dont know much about keeping bristlenose plecos so I cant speak to that. I only have african cichlids and syno's in my aquariums.

But the vast majority on this forum would cringe if you told them you were keeping your africans in that type of water. I'm just pointing out that the same goes for loaches.


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## BrianNFlint

Many fish stores, big chain and ma & pa stores keep African Cichlids in neutral water. Would I thrive for that? probably not, but because I want as much color as I can get out of them. If they were drab looking fish regardless of water chemistry I bet not many people would care about PH.

IME clown loaches are more colorful in my "high" ph than most that *** observed in neutral or low ph. As far as activity my loaches are as active as my mbuna and I see no signs that they are not infact thriving.

What it really comes down to is they WILL live in higher PH than their natural environment. I doubt many people will get wild caught clowns so its likely that the specimines we purchase from fish stores have ever even been in a low ph water condition. Its up to the owner of the tank if they choose to have them in there or not, in my case I choose to as they are great scavengers and are one of the few scavengers that can handle themselves in a Mbuna tank.

Most all plecos are soft water fish, yet no one brings that up when its suggested that bristle nose plecos work in Mbuna tanks. Again it is up to each tank owner what they want in their tanks.


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## Dewdrop

I'm pretty sure that I was told in here that plecos are soft water fish when I posted in here that I added 2 to my hard water tank. I think I was told the same thing about my Leporinus. They said they would live but not thrive. I even thought about getting rid of them at first but they seem to be doing so fine that I've decided to keep them until they outgrow me lol. I've always got great advice in here. The mods really know their stuff and there's lots of knowledgeable helpful members too. The only thing the advice givers can do is give their advice and the reasons for it then it's up to the individual if opcorn: they want to heed the advice.


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## Windsor

Basically, in this application.... Clown loaches are "hired guns" to clean substrate. Of course, they are not 'thriving' in African water conditions, but they do the job of cleaning quite well and show absolute zero ill effects. I guess some do not give them credit for all the credit they are due.


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## Guest

Purists will say no, but in all fairness, most fish are pretty adaptable. Even the discus can be kept and bred in hard water.

By the way, all loaches are wild caught.


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## stslimited84

BrianNFlint said:


> Most all plecos are soft water fish, yet no one brings that up when its suggested that bristle nose plecos work in Mbuna tanks. Again it is up to each tank owner what they want in their tanks.


Therein lies the problem. If you choose to keep fish, it is your responsibility to keep them in the best environment you can.

Not the opposite environment they are naturally suited for.


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