# 6' stacker, is it possible



## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

Has any one built a stacker that can stack a 6'X2'X2' on top and bottom. I'm thinking 4X4 posts with three 2"X6" cross braces on top and bottom levels, with 2X8s on the sides so the middle 2X6 can notch into the 2X8 side brace. Will this work?

I don't have the skills to do a computer sketch. If someone has done something like this or has info, I'd appreciate comments.


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

I'm a little confused on the 2x8 and 2x6 notching, want to elaborate on that?

4x4s will hold the weight, the trick is just getting the weight distributed onto those legs. With a better explanation (no offense) I may be able to help you out much more and even do a computer sketch to make sure I have the correct idea.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

The King Crabb said:


> I'm a little confused on the 2x8 and 2x6 notching, want to elaborate on that?
> 
> 4x4s will hold the weight, the trick is just getting the weight distributed onto those legs. With a better explanation (no offense) I may be able to help you out much more and even do a computer sketch to make sure I have the correct idea.


Hi King Crabb,

No offence taken, and I agree. I may try my hand at doing an electronic sketch in the future but I am not a fan of computers, so will try to explain verbally.

the 2X8s will run front to back on each side of the tank. There will be a 2X6 tenon joint etched 3/4 of an inch into the 2X8 so the middle 2X6 will fit into the joint. The fr4ont and back 2X6 will fit into the 4X4 posts. Unfortunatly the tank would not be able to sit over the 4X4 posts. The weight would have to be transferred along the 2X6 to the 4X4 post. Approx 1/2 inch.

If this doesn't explain it, I'll try a sketch. Can a pdf be posted?


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

I think I'm starting to get the picture, but not completely. The 2x8s are running the width of the tank (2' portion) and the 2x6s are running the length (6' portion), correct? I'm not too construction term savvy, more of a designer, what is a "tenon joint"?


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## pistolpete (Dec 28, 2009)

You do not need to complicate the joinery. If you want to do something more functional, then rabbet 1.5 inches out of two corners of your 4x4 post. that way you have mechanical support for your joists. Leave the posts about 3/16" shy of the top so that when your 2x6 is finished shrinking the posts will not be proud. cross braces in the middle are not necessary if you put a sheet of 1/2" plywood on top . The only real function of the cross braces that everybody wants to put in is to keep the joists from twisting.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

The King Crabb said:


> I think I'm starting to get the picture, but not completely. The 2x8s are running the width of the tank (2' portion) and the 2x6s are running the length (6' portion), correct? I'm not too construction term savvy, more of a designer, what is a "tenon joint"?


Basically it is a slot the dimensions of the end of the 2X6 etched into the 2X8. The reason I like to use the 2X8 is so it can hold the 2X6 and have some meat on the bottom of the slot. I am going to get up to speed with a sketch over the next few days.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

pistolpete said:


> You do not need to complicate the joinery. If you want to do something more functional, then rabbet 1.5 inches out of two corners of your 4x4 post. that way you have mechanical support for your joists. Leave the posts about 3/16" shy of the top so that when your 2x6 is finished shrinking the posts will not be proud. cross braces in the middle are not necessary if you put a sheet of 1/2" plywood on top . The only real function of the cross braces that everybody wants to put in is to keep the joists from twisting.


Although I didn't describe it, that is what I planned. I am intending to place a third 2X6X 6 feet long down the middle, making the 6 footers at 1 foot spacing. This is the one I intend to put into the tenon joint on the 2X8. That's why I'm using 2X8 on the sides If I don't need the additional brace, though the weight concerns me, I could get away with no tenon.. Will try uploading a pdf tommorrow, if that doesn't work I'll have to learn a sketch tool.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

Also Pistol Pete,

Thanks for the tip on leaving the posts 3/16 shy and placing the ply on top. Although I planned on capping with ply I was concerned about point loading inside the tank perimeter and having to be exact with my cuts.

Not sure if I've described this well enough. Again....need a sketch.


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## inurocker (May 9, 2011)

If you know some one with a arc welder and some skills 2" thin wall square tube steel would be ideal for this project and not much difference in cost of materials. It would look slick after some paint.
I you are going to go with wood I would
Lay all 4X4 side by side and clamp square. Mark top and bottom of both notches for the 2X8's with a square. Set the depth of cut on your skill saw to match the 2" side of your 2X8 should be 1 and 5/8 inches. Make your top and bottom cuts for each 2X6 first continue making cuts in between about 1/8" apart. Take a sharp chisel knock out chips and even out the bottom of the cuts. Cut 2X8s to length. Square everything up and screw, glue, nail or lag bolt it together.
I would put 2X8 cripples ( board to go from front to back) about every 16" to prevent lateral bowing on the front and back. Cap the top with 1/2" plywood maybe even the bottom.
Over engineering is far cheaper than structural failure.


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## BillD (May 17, 2005)

Do not use 4 x 4 posts. They are the worst wood for twisting due to the fact they are what is left of a log when it is cut up. Better to use a 2 x 4 for the leg and fill the spaces between the 2 shelves with 2 x 4 (effectively making a 4 x 4).
So, make 2 shelves from 2 x 6 and plywood top if you want, attach the legs with glue and screws. Done. It doesn't get any easier and you don't need a lot of skill or fancy tools. You might want to add some bracing across the back to prevent racking.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

Thanks for the input inurocker and Bill D.

Sounds like a good plan inurocker, how does changing the 2X8 cripples with 2X4s sound (if I understand you, there not load bearing just stabilizers) , so I have some room for DIY lighting for bottom tank. Also I like Bills idea of laminating 2-2X4s to make a 4X4 post.


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

Here's what I'm envisioning for this project:










Some of the finer points...

2x6 placed vertically at the bottom for the bottom tank. 1/2" plywood skin on top to distribute weight, notice the 1/2" of space between tank and all sides.









The main holding power goes into a 2x4 (or can use up to 2x8) hiding inside of the "L" shaped legs. It is nailed to the "L" legs and gets support from standing on top of the 2x6 at the bottom. With all weight distributed properly each support leg only holds about 900 pounds.









7" above the bottom tank the support leg will be cut and a 2x8 will be placed vertically to be the support for the top tank.

















By using a 2x8 as the main top support that should give enough strength to hold the tank up and give you plenty of room for hidden lighting.









In this plan the top tank will have a 4.5" clearance from the sides and a 2.5" clearance from the front and back.









As Inurocker stated, using a metal stand would make this much easier. A local high school may have a welding shop they will let you use, my local high school (Timpanogos) actually lets you borrow and entire welding set up.


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## inurocker (May 9, 2011)

juststayinthecave said:


> Thanks for the input inurocker and Bill D.
> 
> Sounds like a good plan inurocker, how does changing the 2X8 cripples with 2X4s sound (if I understand you, there not load bearing just stabilizers) , so I have some room for DIY lighting for bottom tank. Also I like Bills idea of laminating 2-2X4s to make a 4X4 post.


Yes most all standard and PT pine 4X4's are trash. You can find cedar and Fir but not a home centers.
Yes for stability and to keep the 2x8's running true.
Yes 2X4 would work just fine.
Might want to use 2X8 for the ends just to box it off.

I still would look into making it from steel. If that is a possible option for you.

We are talking close to 3,000 Lbs. to support here if you are talking about 125Gal. tanks.
This is going on a slab floor right?


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

inurocker said:


> We are talking close to 3,000 Lbs. to support here if you are talking about 125Gal. tanks.


125G tanks are only 18" wide, he mentioned these are 24" wide; Not sure on size but I'd assume around 170G.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

Early stages in the conception. 
Was originally planning 2' wide for 180 but may narrow up for 125G. My main question was making the 6 foot span. I like the idea of a metal stand but I have no experience with welds and would be nervous about the quality of the work. As far as flooring I have an unfinished concrete basement floor. A fishkeeper's dream in my opinion.

As a side note I can get fir but an 8 foot 2X4 costs $18 plus tax. Blew me away.

King Crab,

Nice design, looks easy to build, and would be addaptable if I want to shorten it up. that'll work, I'll give that a good look.

Much appreciated.


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## inurocker (May 9, 2011)

The King Crabb said:


> inurocker said:
> 
> 
> > We are talking close to 3,000 Lbs. to support here if you are talking about 125Gal. tanks.
> ...


I stand corrected over 4,200 Lbs for 180 Gal.. Couldn't find tank and water weight for a 170
Kinda like parking your car on it. :thumb:


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## pistolpete (Dec 28, 2009)

Not sure how you get 4200 lbs. 180 gallons of water weighs 1503 pounds. The tank weighs something like 340 lbs. Add 260 lbs of rocks and gravel (which displace a bunch of water) and you still get only 2100 lbs.


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## pistolpete (Dec 28, 2009)

Ok, I get it: for two 180 gallons it would be 4200.


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## swamphntr (Oct 21, 2011)

Holy Moses you guys like to complicate things beyond belief. I had to laugh at the "what is a tenon joint" comment.

I can build that stand in twenty minutes with 30 bucks worth of materials. The long and hard part of it is getting the tools out, cleaning up and putting the tools away. That will take forty minutes.

Simplify folks! You guys arent building bridges here.

All that said I do appreciate the passion for building something in a quality fashion. It is just that some of you are overdesigning and reinforcing stuff that is totally unneeded. Get this 2x4s stood on end with reasonably fastened plywood can support three story homes loaded with furniture flooring people and still take 100 mph hurricane winds. LOL

A couple 2xs made into a corner and square framed the size of the tank base x 2 a few filler blocks glued and screwed under the frames......plywood on the frames.....you can park a freaking pickup truck on the thing and it wont break. You can most definitely park a couple of fish tanks on it.

OK I'll shut up now. excuse me for my rant but I keep coming into this forum looking for cool projects underay and keep finding these overkill planning threads that never seem to amount to a finished product.


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

swamphntr said:


> A couple 2xs made into a corner and square framed the size of the tank base x 2 a few filler blocks glued and screwed under the frames......plywood on the frames.....you can park a freaking pickup truck on the thing and it wont break. You can most definitely park a couple of fish tanks on it.


I realize you have MUCH more experience than I, but that sounds as if you're forgetting the tanks are the exact same dimensions. Meaning you have to have the 2x4s on the outside and distribute the weight in between them, which is where our over building comes into play :lol:

[quot="swamphntr"]I keep coming into this forum looking for cool projects underay and keep finding these overkill planning threads that never seem to amount to a finished product.[/quote]

I've noticed many experienced builders mention the over building on this forum...


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## swamphntr (Oct 21, 2011)

> I realize you have MUCH more experience than I, but that sounds as if you're forgetting the tanks are the exact same dimensions. Meaning you have to have the 2x4s on the outside and distribute the weight in between them, which is where our over building comes into play


 Truth be told you dont even need a double 2x corner. Plain and simple four 2 x 4 cut to the desired height. Glue and screw the two frames at the desired height. Square the project and cover frames with glued and screwed plywood. Cut filler blocks to go in between floor to frame and frame to frame. glue and screw them in. You now have a 3 inch by 3.5 inch glued and screwed vertical post that is probably 3 to four times stronger than a 4x4. Its basically a glue lam. Add the second 2 x to make the corner and now your talking tank tough. And Im not talking fish tank.


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

swamphntr said:


> now your talking tank tough. And Im not talking fish tank.


 :lol:

By "filler blocks" do you mean just scraps of 2x4 cut to fit?


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## swamphntr (Oct 21, 2011)

exactly!


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

All in all this seems almost exactly like my design :lol:


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## swamphntr (Oct 21, 2011)

LOL it would seem so if you go for "tank tough". The point is exactly that, your design is overkill. You dont need a corner that consists of 3 2x4s. All your doing is adding cost and weight and assembly time to the project.

It does look pretty on computer sketch though. LOL


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## pistolpete (Dec 28, 2009)

Yes, it's always the same story on this forum. Experienced carpenters and cabinet makers arguing for simple, lightweight, and elegant designs and everybody else saying "yes, but ......"


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## skurj (Oct 30, 2011)

I know this is a DIY thread... but if the tanks are 125's you can buy a steel stand that will hold 2 tanks...

Though from what I have seen in the way of steel stands, alot of the 'retail' variety seem to barely meet requirements.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

swamphntr said:


> Holy Moses you guys like to complicate things beyond belief. I had to laugh at the "what is a tenon joint" comment.
> 
> I can build that stand in twenty minutes with 30 bucks worth of materials. The long and hard part of it is getting the tools out, cleaning up and putting the tools away. That will take forty minutes.
> 
> ...


I agree when construction starts it won't take long. The reason for the thread was to ask if anyone has done this or knows what dimensions of lumber I need.When it's done, probably after christmas, I'll post pictures.


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## inurocker (May 9, 2011)

swamphntr said:


> Holy Moses you guys like to complicate things beyond belief. I had to laugh at the "what is a tenon joint" comment.
> 
> Why not everyone has experience in carpentry?
> 
> ...


The exchange of different ideas is what makes this site great for me.
Your right enough shop talk back to fish and learning.


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