# Breeding live food



## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

I wanted to breed my own food for my adult fronts, I read in another forum (think so...) that a good option are covicts..... now, this got mt thinking:

a) fronts are about the laziest fish i've seen, so, will they be able to catch them?, or will the convicts be too fast?
b) will they let them live cause of the similar pattern (vertical dark lines)
c) Has anyone done this before?, if so... share some experiences

Any thoughts?, good or bad

Thanks for the help


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

i tried it with 3 pairs of hypsophrys. i got the idea to utilize their fry as feeders when i had a 75 gal. bursting with unwanted 1/2" fry. however, production never came close to matching demand, and i eventually found the effort exhausting. each pair of nics was set up in their own 40gal., and two 75's were used for housing fry. one to accommodate new spawn collections, and the second for growing/holding them out to 1" for harvest. murphy's law eventually killed the project: the fish stopped breeding and i ran out of fry.
also, any tank whose inhabitants are offered raw feeds, requires additional mechanical filtration, as well as increased water changes. HTH.


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

lloyd said:


> any tank whose inhabitants are offered raw feeds, requires additional mechanical filtration, as well as increased water changes. HTH.


hhhmmmm.... hadn't thought of that...... guess it makes a whole lot of sense....

thanks lloyd!!!


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

Convicts breed like rabbits. I know many who use them for fry to feed their other tanks. This would be the fish I would pick. Another options is to house Labs with the fronts. With enough females and rock for hiding, the babies will be plentiful, and the Fronts will get them as they emerge from hiding.


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## GJx (Mar 13, 2003)

Floridagirl said:


> Convicts breed like rabbits. I know many who use them for fry to feed their other tanks. This would be the fish I would pick. Another options is to house Labs with the fronts. With enough females and rock for hiding, the babies will be plentiful, and the Fronts will get them as they emerge from hiding.


The only reason that I stopped doing that, was that I didn't always remove my fry from the tank & I found out that having fry of some kind in with your Fronts for them to hunt & feed upon, kind of kept them in an ultra HUNTING mood all of the time. And subsequently when & if you have front fry in there with them, they are more prone to hunt them down & eat them, since THAT is what they are use to doing all of the time. Instead of having that reaction when some live food source is introduced to them from the top of the tank.


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

yeap..... i'd rather have the convicts in another tank and feed the fronts normally.... plus i don't want any fish around when they are spawning


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## tirzo13 (May 26, 2004)

convicts hide when they are fairly young.

angel fish juvies hang out closer to the top, making them easier to eat, as do live bearers such as guppies, swordtails and platys.


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

thats exactly what concerned me... and how much easier is it to breed guppies, platys and angels?

will they be as fast as convicts? can i do this with only a 20gal tank?


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## tirzo13 (May 26, 2004)

guppies, platys, swordtails, mollies are pretty easy to breed, and in a 20 will give you plenty.
if you get a good breeding pair, angels will also give you plenty of fry if you keep removing the eggs and grow them yourself, but much more work then livebearers.

swordtails are the best IMO, good size compared to guppies.
not that fast, and they are top water column oriented for the most part, as convicts will hide in the rocks.
plus red swordtails will never be confused as frontosa fry like a young convict may.


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## KoenEeckhoudt (Oct 28, 2007)

will convicts stay alive and breed in the same water conditions as you keep fronts in? I have ideal water to keep tanganyikans, but I don't think that convicts would do good in that water?

Grtz, 
Koen


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## eoconnor (Nov 24, 2006)

kribensis also breed quite easily


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

KoenEeckhoudt said:


> will convicts stay alive and breed in the same water conditions as you keep fronts in? I have ideal water to keep tanganyikans, but I don't think that convicts would do good in that water?
> 
> Grtz,
> Koen


The natural habitat for convicts (Central America) has rather alkaline water with a good amount of hardness. Convicts are also the champion species for breeding in adverse conditions, and tank rasied specimes can adapt and thrive in almost any condition. It wouldn't surpise me to see convicts happily breading in a mud puddle in the middle of a road.


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## KoenEeckhoudt (Oct 28, 2007)

:lol: :lol:


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## KoenEeckhoudt (Oct 28, 2007)

what size tank do they need to breed? maybe a good idea to keep a pair, for live feeding once in a while...


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

Most people seem to keep them quite comfortably in a 20 gallon (long) tank.

Dimensions: 20L (76 Litres) 30in x 12in x 12in (76cm x 30cm x 30cm)


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

when I got my first 2 fronts y had a left over of a couple of convicts, and although the fronts were almost twice the size, the convicts ruled the tank... :?

so now I fear that because they are extremely fast, the lazy fronts won't catch them and eventually they will grow, bite off the traitor fins and so on, and leave me with some crappy fronts.......


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## sldabclmnop (Jul 7, 2004)

Female brooding convicts are the most aggressive fish I've ever kept. I would not recommend keeping convicts in the same tank as fronts for extended periods of time. The fry should be fine as feeders and a good pair will keep you up to your ears in front food. Also, convicts are regularly returned to pet stores so finding large adults is simple and easy. Keep in mind that convicts can (and will) breed at just over an inch in size.

What I plan to do this summer to supplement my fronts' diet is to buy a home worm farm and raise tiger earth worms (red wigglers). My fish love them, they eat your organic (non-fatty) garbage and their biomass will double in 3 months (if you start with a pound of worms they become two pounds) under ideal conditions. These guys are small enough to feed whole and pack a lot of protein, plus after the initial investment - they're free.

Online, large worm farms are around $100 and a pound of worms is $35 +shipping. This beats the **** out of buying them from Wal-Mart (I loathe that place) $3.50 for two dozen.


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

sldabclmnop said:


> What I plan to do this summer to supplement my fronts' diet is to buy a home worm farm and raise tiger earth worms (red wigglers). My fish love them.


 an excellent idea. i am raising european crawlers for some of my big fish and stingrays. it's easy if you choose the right worm to start. i chose euros because they do not require refrigeration/cool temps for keeping long term.


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

well..... just got a couple of adult convicts and they're in a 15gal tank with some rocks.... NEVER in the same tank as the fronts.

I hope this works... :-? .......

I tried worms one time, but my fronts didn't like them, plus my girlfriend hated them..jejejjej


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## KoenEeckhoudt (Oct 28, 2007)

keep us posted on how they're doing... Buying myself a 20L to keep a couple of fish for feeding is something I would consider doing 

Greetz, 
Koen


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

sure!.... i'll post some pics of the convicts' tank later...


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

OK..... 2 weeks after the convicts (2 M, 6 F) were thrown in the 20gal tank they have finaly spawned.

Yersterday I saw about 150 eggs on one rock.... Now the cuople is super agressive, plus they've developed really nice colors...jejjee.... I've got to say, they're quite a nice pest!!! :lol:

I'll take some pictures later and post them!...., now, theres a small Internal Cascade inside the tank, i've lowered the strength of the filter to its minimum so no fry are sucked inside it.... should I turn it of and use bubbles instead?


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## KoenEeckhoudt (Oct 28, 2007)

****, they really do breed like rabbits :s

nice dude 

pics?


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## GJx (Mar 13, 2003)

KoenEeckhoudt said:


> darn, they really do breed like rabbits :s
> 
> nice dude
> 
> pics?


Rabbits :x are probably P.O. at you for even comparing THEM & how they breed to Convicts!!

 
gjx


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

well..... yesterday in the afternoon I had to get the eggs out of the tank..... I was afraid the filter would suck them in.... so I took an air hose (1/4" diameter) and sucked them out to a 2 gal tank with some water from the parent's tank...

Now I see more than 200 eggs.....jajjajja................ Plenty food!!!!!!!

Here are some pics....

The mom and her cave:









The 15 gal main tank:









Some of the females:









And half the eggs.... there's another pile....jejje:


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## KoenEeckhoudt (Oct 28, 2007)

external image, and they ask me to register... can you put them somewhere else?


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

yeap..... i'll post them later, from photobucket :wink:


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## lucrent (Dec 2, 2007)

Can't wait to see those pics!

I've got a spare 29G, sounds like a great project, I can't believe that they are producing that many eggs!!!

Even if it ends up being a supplementary food source, and they don't always breed in enough volume, it certainly beats buying feeders.

I would consider mollies though, one of my first tanks had them, I started with two and before I knew it, I didn't know what to do with the fry. They're cheap, slow, no aggression and live bearers. Though not as pretty as convicts. They should also be able to handle the high PH for the time that the fronts will eat them.


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

Sorry it took a little while, but here they are!!:

The main convict tank, 15 gals









A close up of the females!









The mom:









The babies.... half of them, there's another bunch at another corner...









Plus.... I checked on them today..... ALL alive....... seems like a 98% of survival....


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## KoenEeckhoudt (Oct 28, 2007)

****, that's crazy 

Are the other females ok with one spawning? Not trying to eat each other's young?


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

Nope....... the other way around!!!!!

They're planning on growing some of their own!!! :lol: :lol:


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## dogofwar (Apr 5, 2004)

Another option would be Oreochromis mossambicus.

I've kept a group in a 55g (1 male, 2-3 females). Mouthful after mouthful of babies.

"Giant" mealworms and earthworms also work well.


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

hhmmm.... which are those?...


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## dogofwar (Apr 5, 2004)

Tilapia - orange or natural (black) - either will work.

They start breeding in earnest at about 3"...


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## dogofwar (Apr 5, 2004)

Tilapia - orange or natural (black) - either will work.

They start breeding in earnest at about 3"...


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## dogofwar (Apr 5, 2004)

Tilapia - orange or natural (black) - either will work.

They start breeding in earnest at about 3"...


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## chago (Mar 4, 2008)

confrimed!!!!!...............  a new spawn, only a week apart... about 200 more eggs....

at this rate I will have 2 options: get more fronts o eat them myself! :lol:


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