# First Cichlid Tank 38 gal



## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

So as you know already I am new here and I started out with a 29 gal tank I was going to use for some rams. Well after reading some threads I decided I wanted to scrape this tank for a slightly bigger one and change a few things. So here is the new project and what is on its way in the mail.
I have a 38 gal tank dimensions are 36x12.5x17.5 glasscages.com says its a 38 tall that's what I am going by. I have a Filstar XP M (formerly Rena XP2) and 40lbs of Eco-complete on its way along with 30lbs of Texas Holey Rock. I also have 50lbs of PFS to mix with the Eco-Complete in case it doesn't fill out the bottom of the tank enough.
I didn't like the trim along the top and bottom of the tank it was a light oak color so instead of cutting it off and replacing it. I got some Rusteolum plastic paint in a flat black and changed that. While I was at it I also Painted the background black. I will try to post pictures tomorrow where I am at now. Now I have a couple questions I need help with.

Should I use a spray bar or will this filter be good for this small tank out of the box?

I seen a in-line heater when I was purchasing the filter. Are these any good? Recommendations?

The new tank has no top or lights yet. Is just a standard 36x12 fluorescent top good to use? What do you guys recommend?

Thanks for all the help friends and I will keep you up to date as we go along hopefully be dumping in some Dr.Tims this time next week and waiting for the new filter to cycle. A couple people told me if I was going to do it I should do it right and look what it started. :thumb: :thumb:


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## camelworm (Aug 16, 2011)

The spray bar would be ok

I've never used an in line heater but never herd anything bad about them

i have one of those and when it was set up i had the zoo med duel t5's and lots and lots of plants it worked well but i took it down (needed the room  )

also the 40 lbs of eco complete should do what u need it to but alittle extra never hurts, just be sure your plants roots will be abel to breath in there


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

A spray bar would be nice to have but if you cannot work it into the mix, you'll be just fine without it. Inline heaters are cool but unless you don't want excess stuff inside your tank to see it really isn't a big deal to have or not to have. I think it is mainly for keeping your tank clear of objects inside besides the decorations and the fish. If you don't mind seeing a heater in the corner of the tank....then don't worry about getting one. What kind of cichlids are you putting in this tank? 38 gallon isn't too big and it kind of limits you to what kind and how many you get to put in there. Are you doing dwarf cichlids? Shellies? Or are you just getting a few Mbuna to throw in there and plan on upgrading to a larger tank later on? I have a 75 gallon that I only have nine fish in. I didn't want breeding so I got one of each of a certain genus or species and left it on the under crowded size for filtration reasons and water change reasons. All fish were put in at one time and all were put in at about one plus inches big, so they all grew up together. Think that this helped out in the long run for the tanks hierarchy and that they get along as well as they do. Been told that the list of fish (on my signature) shouldn't necessarily get along too well together, especially not being crowded to disperse aggressions and such. I think the smaller the tank you have with these fish.....the harder it is to get it to work out smoothly if you decide to take a chance and overcrowd the tank with Mbuna or even Peacocks for that matter. I have a twenty gallon long tank I only have two small cichlids in. A Marlieri Burundi and a Pulcher. Both stay small. They share the tank with three Cory catfish and an Albino Bristlenose Plecostomus. Having something 100 gallons or larger it becomes easier IMO to keep larger amounts of African Cichlids together without having the small tank syndrome and these tanks look awesome overstocked with cichlids as well.


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## Bowfront (Jun 3, 2013)

I have one of those in-line heaters on my 72 bowfront and it is awesome. Its the 300 watt Hydor model, cost me $62 shipped and really maintains a good tank temp and warms water quickly after water changes. Its used in-line with one of my Fluval 305s. Highly recommended.

.


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

Although I have never used an inline heater before, I can also say that my tank which I run (always have) two heaters, a submersible 150 watt and a submersible 200 watt....I as well have no problems with water changes and getting VERY quickly back up to exactly the right temperature. I also make sure when changing the water when adding it back in I regulate it's temperature to as close to what the tank initially is so it matches as closely as possible so there is no chance there will be any shock of any type to my fish. I think an inline is great for someone who doesn't want "clutter" inside their tank to take focus away from the fish and decorations.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

Thanks. Being such a small tank I may go with the in-line heater. Just to keep the clutter down. As far as stocking the tank goes I have been think about getting a few rams. LFS around me has Electric blues and Bolivians and maybe a few community fish. Going to keep them small trying to do it right with this tank to keep it awhile.

I am trying to find a spray bar DIY build for this Filstar XP M but can't find anything. Is it difficult to make a spray bar?


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

Look a few posts down at "In The Process Of Setting Up My New Tank" and a guy that goes by Hawk or Hawker has a link to a DIY spraybar. It shows you how to make one and I am sure you could adapt it to work on any canister filter...not just the FX5 or FX6 they are talking about.


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

I meant to say 13Razorback posted it on page one of the four page thread so far. Not Hawk or Hawker. Don't know where I got that one. Anyways.....that is where the link is since I am illiterate and disabled when it comes to doing things via my Droid cell otherwise I would have posted the link here which I might do in a few hours.


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

Here is the link to the thread where he tells you how to fabricate a spraybar.......

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=248582


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

This is what I started with basic 38 gal. I painted the background and trim last night and fit the plastic in the bottom of the tank. Hopefully start fitting up the spray bar this weekend. If not beginning next week. I will add another pic when I get home tonight. Amazing transformation alittle paint will do.


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## ozman (Sep 7, 2012)

sorry your pic is not seen on my computer.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

Ok let's see if I can get this right this time. I removed all the gravel and wood. That will all be discarded.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

Like a brand new tank! Wish it would have made it get alittle bigger!!! Now just waiting on FedEx with the rest of the components. Going to work on a small spray bar while I am waiting. I will keep you guys up to date. Thanks brentt700 for posting the link for the bar.


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

No problem. I love to be of any assistance if I can. I wish the same with anything I ask here. That is what is great about forums! Plus....there are a lot of people who know quite a bit on here.


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## JoeU (Dec 27, 2012)

Looks like a nice paint job! Do post your process with the spray bar.


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## ozman (Sep 7, 2012)

got the pics now :thumb:

a great transformation, looks very nice now


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

I think your idea for Rams is a good one, especially for that tank. I love spray bars as well. They really keep everything suspended for the filter to eventually suck up.

My question is: Do Rams like high water flow? I honestly don't know. I viewed them as a perfect candidate for planted tanks, without a lot of turbulence. You can customize your bar to provide less/more flow based on drilled hole diameter, as I'm sure you know.

A cool vid of spawning rams. He's a member of this forum: 



 The guy making the video... not the fish.

Sorry. Don't know how to imbed the video.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

That's a cool video. I am not ready for breeding yet. Soon enough though I am sure I will have no choice. As far as flow goes with the spray bar. I planned on keeping the holes fairly small due to the size of the tank. I don't want it to mix the water up to much. Is there concerns with the size of your spray bar and holes putting stress on your filter? You can't burn out a filter by not letting the filter move enough water freely? I guess I should think about that while making this spray bar.

LFS has some really nice Rams I am really looking forward to getting them little guys.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

My rocks showed up today these are gonna look really good in the background with a few plants around them. Then more of an open swim area in the front. May need some more but these are a good start for now. As I look at them I am definitely going to need a few more rocks. Make sure I give them plenty of hiding spaces to keep the aggression about territory down.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

These rocks came from ttp://www.ntholeyrock.com Best place I dealt with hands down. I will definitely be ordering from him again and anyone looking for Texas Holey should check it out.


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## NJmomie (Jan 17, 2013)

Those rocks are nice. With German blue rams, they love a heavily planted tank so you will need to also get some of those. If you get a pair, they will spawn for you, just raise the temp up to 80F. The hard part is to actually have the eggs hatch and the parents taking care of the babies instead of using them as afternoon snack. My pair has spawned four times and still no fry. Someone suggested to move the rock that the eggs are laid on to another tank and hatch them yourself but my female has always managed to lay on the 3D background so I couldn't do that. Good luck to you. Post pics when you have the tank and fish up and running.


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## notchback65 (Apr 3, 2013)

Nice Rocks! :thumb:


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

crazywhiteguy said:


> That's a cool video. I am not ready for breeding yet. Soon enough though I am sure I will have no choice. As far as flow goes with the spray bar. I planned on keeping the holes fairly small due to the size of the tank. I don't want it to mix the water up to much. Is there concerns with the size of your spray bar and holes putting stress on your filter? You can't burn out a filter by not letting the filter move enough water freely? I guess I should think about that while making this spray bar.
> 
> LFS has some really nice Rams I am really looking forward to getting them little guys.


The smaller the holes are, the greater the flow. Just start off with small holes and test it out, with sand in the tank. If the flow is too great, up the diameter of the holes. Repeat til you get what you desire. I wouldn't worry about not having enough holes. Let's say your return to the tank is 5/8" I.D. As long as all your spray bar holes get somewhere close to that, you'll be fine.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)




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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

So I started working on my spray bar. I posted some pictures above going to finish gluing it tomorrow and give it a coat of flat black paint and it should be ready to be installed. When I glue it all the PVC should hide away in the 90's I don't have it all pushed together tight. I went with 1/2 in PVC instead of the 3/4 in since my tank is only 40 gals. does anyone think the smaller diameter PVC will affect anything?

All my other goodies showed up today. So should be moving along pretty good here the next few days hopefully post more pictures tomorrow.

Another thanks to 13razorbackfan for the perfect spray bar thread I followed.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

Going to finish painting tonight. Making progress. I also shortened the bar a bit on each side to make some room.


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## Bowfront (Jun 3, 2013)

Personally I think you have too many holes on that spray bar and I don't think you will have enough pressure to utilize them. I would have started with less holes and drilled more as needed. Hopefully it works out for you.
.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

Well there is 2 less on each side and the holes are pretty small. Hopefully it works. I didn't glue the bar itself in so if I have to change it it should be easy to change.


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## shelbynjakesdad (Mar 13, 2013)

Also, why so deep in the tank? I like my spraybar right at the surface of the water so that I get better surface agitation. It is also less visible if it is right at the surface.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

ok after couple minor problems the tank is done for now. the spray bar seems to be circulating the water properly after twisting the tube towards the surface. it was alittle low in the tank so I just got some suction cups and brought it up. other than that here it is. please leave your thoughts and let me know what you think.

Dr.Tims is added and the tank is currently going through the process. My daughter wouldn't let me get rid of the small zebra danios so they are in there for now. hopefully a week or two or three whatever it is it will all finally pay off. :dancing: :dancing: :dancing: :dancing:


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Nice. Sure the Rams will enjoy their new digs.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

My new German Blue Rams by tommy_h7474, on Flickr

My new German Blue Rams by tommy_h7474, on Flickr

My new German Blue Rams by tommy_h7474, on Flickr

So my Fathers Day wrapped up perfectly my tank water has fully cycled. So I decided to start stocking and I started with 3 German Blue Rams 1M 2F. Everyone was added to the tank about 2 hrs ago and seem to be settling in just fine. I am maybe going to add a set of Bolivan Rams next week or Apistos. Depending on how things go this week. I picked up a small jar of Tetra Cichlid Flakes. Is this the best food I should be feeding these fish? I was looking at some frozen bloodworms cubes at the LFS was maybe thinking about giving them a treat once a week or so with them. Thanks for all the help.


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

Nice looking set up. Good to see you worked everything out! You set up the spray bar so you are getting some surface agitation by raising it, didn't you? You want that surface agitation for exchange for oxygen. Nice looking fish! I was torn between getting what you have and are wanting to add and getting what I actually GOT. LOL! I ended up with a Pelvicachromis Pulcher and a Julidochromis Marlieri Burundi along with three Cory catfish and an albino BN pleco. That did it for my dwarf tank. It's pretty creepy how much the Marlieri looks like an eel the way it moves in and out of the rockery caves I have.


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

Thanks Brentt! Once you start it's crazy how this hobby takes over. I had some questions about there food are you fimiliar with there diet?


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

Here is something I found for you regarding your German Blue Rams........

The German blue ram is an omnivore that needs food from both the animal kingdom and the plant kingdom to stay healthy and happy. When they arrive to a new aquarium, it is not unusual for them to loose their appetite and become really finicky. Don't be surprised if your rams only nibble at the food or embarks on a full blown hunger strike. Try to coax them into eating by giving them really tasty morsels like frozen or live mosquito larvae or similar. Once they have started eating again, you can gradually let them try flake food, pellets and other types of food. After a while, most rams will readily accept a wide range of different foods in the aquarium.

I would assume you could give them any good cichlid pellet, like New Life Spectrum Thera A which is a great all around pellet (I use them a few times a week with my own fish although I vary my fishes diet between four different food brands and types) or even what you already purchased. I find that a variety of food makes my fish always scarf down whatever I put in there and never do they spit anything out like they aren't hungry or tired of eating the same thing. Plus it seems like it gives them a broader spectrum of vital nutrients from different foods with different protein percentages and different ingredients such as more vegetables and spirulina in one versus another. I am also quite sure that giving them frozen bloodworms as a treat once in a while or maybe twice in a while won't hurt them either!


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

I posted this video on another thread but haven't had much of a response. Do you think this behavior is normal? I also think they are about to spawn but there bellies could always have that red tint to it. thanks for your help everybody!


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

After much debating I added 3 Bolivan Rams into my tank a couple days ago. Everyone is getting along great. Every once and awhile everyone will be sitting together on top of the rocks. When I feed them they don't really pick at each other or anything. So we will see how it goes I think as of right now its a success. So now I have 3 German Blues, 3 Bolivans, and 6 Zebra Danios but I think these guys are going to be evicted soon. I am thinking to finish off the tank 3 Electric Blues and maybe a couple Apistos. Pictures to follow next week already looking to upgrade to a 90 gallon tank.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

I don't know anything about SA cichlids, but I think you should leave or replace the tetras. An active fish in the water column can make your other fish feel more comfortable. And, they add an active resident.

If contemplating a 90(4'?), just go the extra 2'!


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## crazywhiteguy (Jun 1, 2013)

hey all,
its been awhile but all has been well with the tank. Currently doing weekly 25% water changes and vacuuming every once and while. Having little trouble with the eco complete with vacuuming up the sand but I am working through it. The fish have been loving the new setup.

Current Stock:
6-Zebra Danios
3-German Blue Rams 
3-Bolivan Rams

I am pretty much going to wrap this thread up with one last question. The tank has been running for a solid 4-5 weeks now. When should I do my first filter cleaning? it is a new setup and I read somewhere 60-90 days everyone agree.


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