# New here and need some guidance



## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

Hi all. I have been out of the loop for a long time. Discus,Angels in the past. Have had aquariums all my life until the late 90's. My brother is retiring and tearing down a 125g setup with 14 Duboisi and petrochromis. They are 3-4 inch each. He is running 2 eheim 2028 canisters in his 125. I am setting up a brand new 75 at my house to house them going forward. I want to remove 1 of his canisters and bring it over to my house. He is about a 1/2hour away from me. But I dont want to harm his 125 setup while I wait for mine to cycle. So to summarize,

Is 75 gallon enought for the 14 fish load with 1 eheim ?
Is it safe to leave his 125 with a single eheim going until mine gets up and running with one of his operating eheims ? 
Will the BB live for a 1/2 hour car ride ?
I dont want to lose these fish in the process so if his tank will be safe I can speed my cycle using one of his canisters.

Thanks !


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## Old Newbie (Feb 18, 2017)

Belair62 said:


> Hi all. I have been out of the loop for a long time. Discus,Angels in the past. Have had aquariums all my life until the late 90's. My brother is retiring and tearing down a 125g setup with 14 Duboisi and petrochromis. They are 3-4 inch each. He is running 2 eheim 2028 canisters in his 125. I am setting up a brand new 75 at my house to house them going forward. I want to remove 1 of his canisters and bring it over to my house. He is about a 1/2hour away from me. But I dont want to harm his 125 setup while I wait for mine to cycle. So to summarize,
> 
> Is 75 gallon enought for the 14 fish load with 1 eheim ?
> Is it safe to leave his 125 with a single eheim going until mine gets up and running with one of his operating eheims ?
> ...


It looks like the 2028 flows about 270 gallons per hour, that is not enough for a 75 gallon tank, in fact, both running together would be less than ideal. Ten times your tank volume would be ideal. The bacteria would be fine for a 1/2 hour trip; I have gone through several power outages of 2 to 3 hours with no problems. One of the filters on the 125 would probably be ok for a little while as long as the bio load is kept low by feeding less or not at all; some air stones could help with circulation for oxygenation.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

Thanks for the reply. Glad I asked ! Wow 10 times . These are old units too so they may have degraded a bit. Looks like I will at least get my tank cycled with one unit and bring the other unit along with the fish when he moves out . That is going to happen very soon so I dont have time to cycle new filters. So, very small maintenance feed every other day may help me out. Time is of the essence because he had a buyer for his fish but buyer backed out and now he is stuck.He is moving next week So I have to take them.


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## Old Newbie (Feb 18, 2017)

Belair62 said:


> Thanks for the reply. Glad I asked ! Wow 10 times . These are old units too so they may have degraded a bit. Looks like I will at least get my tank cycled with one unit and bring the other unit along with the fish when he moves out . That is going to happen very soon so I don't have time to cycle new filters. So, very small maintenance feed every other day may help me out. Time is of the essence because he had a buyer for his fish but buyer backed out and now he is stuck.He is moving next week So I have to take them.


If you were to use both canisters and add a power head for extra circulation you would probably be alright. And, since both filters are full of established media you should have no problems with being cycled.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

Excellent. He may have a powerhead running. For sure there is a spnge filter in there. Setting up tank now so hopefull I can get this done without losing anything. Will post back.


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## NewkeeperRico (Feb 5, 2018)

Good luck!


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## nodima (Oct 3, 2002)

A 2028 is enough for a 75, particularly with the help of a power head for additional circulation. I ran a 75 tang tank for years that way, IMO the 10x rule is overkill. With a good canister like that Pro2 with large media volume, and a reasonable water change schedule it will be fine. Not to take this down a rat hole, but there is a huge difference in performance between a HOB and canister rated for the same GPH, so generalizing on some number like 10x just does not apply to all scenarios.

Ultimately the best test of how well a set up is working are the measured water parameters.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

Thanks for the reply. Last night I was checking specs online of various canister filter. It would get pretty pricey to turn the tank over 10 times per hour. Some list flow rate and some GPH.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Canister filter flow rates are usually computed by the mfg. after passing through their brand new suggested media while the GPH is what the pump of the filter is rated either without media, not installed on the filter or at zero head pressure.

For our purposes, the flow rate with clean/new filter media are the numbers we mostly look at though the general GPH rating by the mfg can be helpful with some searching on their website.

The suggested 8x or 10x turnover rate per hour is a generalization on some fish forums so not carved in stone. What you want to accomplish is enough filter capacity to process ammonia and nitrite for the bio-load of the tank and water movement or flow in the tank to aid in picking up debris + provide circulation.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

So the existing setup in my brothers 125 was 2 Eheim 2028. I assume going down to a 75 will create a higher bio load due to 50 gallons less water to dilute ? I hope in this case his old canisters will handle that load. I will be sure to not feed for a day or two after I bring over his canisters and livestock. In the future I hope to transition to FX4 or 6 Fluvals due to the ease in allowing me to do water changes and vacuum right at the canister. I like that feature.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

In anticipation, rather excitement to get this setup moving, I have my background , heater, lighting and substrate ready to go. I do not have the canisters yet because I will have to pull it off an existing setup a half hour drive away. Can I at least fill ,heat , decorate and circulate with a powerhead until I cant get the time to run over to the other tank and steal his canister ? I wont have filtration until that time. Any downside to this ?


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## nodima (Oct 3, 2002)

No, no downside. Be sure to use some water treatment anyway.


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## Cyphro (Mar 23, 2018)

On most canister filters you are not even guaranteed your water is going through the media at all, and it won't once it gets a bit clogged. The new marineland canisters are good about that.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

A little progress. Went and picked up a running canister and a couple extra from my brother that were spares because they leaked. Got the running unit home and intalled within 45 minutes. Repaired both leakers with paper "shims" under the latches and they held. So now have 2 canisters up and running. Ordered a few o-rings to repair permanently . Added ammonia immediately after. Today I see ammonia dropped from2 to 1 ppm and I have nitirite and a nitrate reading. Let see what tomorrow brings. I think I got it done fast enough to use the bacteria in his canister.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

Belair62 said:


> So the existing setup in my brothers 125 was 2 Eheim 2028. I assume going down to a 75 will create a higher bio load due to 50 gallons less water to dilute ? I hope in this case his old canisters will handle that load. I will be sure to not feed for a day or two after I bring over his canisters and livestock. In the future I hope to transition to FX4 or 6 Fluvals due to the ease in allowing me to do water changes and vacuum right at the canister.uote]
> 
> It won't create a higher bioload, but it will cause a higher concentrationl of nitrates. You will just have to do larger or more frequent water changes than your brother did.
> What do you plan on doing with the petrochromis? How many and what type are they?


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

Honestly I am not sure what sp the petrochromis are. There are only 3 or 4 non Duboisi in the tank. He has let the tanks go for the past couple months it seems. The filter was really filthy. My main goal will be to tranfer them to my 75 from a 125 and keep them healthy. It may be a tough transition for them to go from a 125 to a 75. There are 14 in that tank at 3-4". Once this tank cycles I will need to get opinions on how best to get them over here and acclimate.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

Belair62 said:


> Honestly I am not sure what sp the petrochromis are. There are only 3 or 4 non Duboisi in the tank. He has let the tanks go for the past couple months it seems. The filter was really filthy. My main goal will be to tranfer them to my 75 from a 125 and keep them healthy. It may be a tough transition for them to go from a 125 to a 75. There are 14 in that tank at 3-4". Once this tank cycles I will need to get opinions on how best to get them over here and acclimate.


The Petros are going to need a bigger tank, bud. Even the smallest and most docile Petrochromis needs a 6' tank.
This is coming from someone that tried to keep sp. yellow in a 5' 120g.
I find the best way to bring new Tropheus in is to do so in a bare tank (substrate only). This way there is no territory to fight over and nowhere to hide.
Also, keep the lights off and don't feed for 24 hrs. Thankfully Dubs are just about the calmest Troph there is.
If they are going into a new tank with 0 nitrates, make sure they are coming from water with low nitrates also. Get your brother to do water changes to get them right down before you pick them up.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

guess I will deal with the petros when I get them here. Bro is moving and he has to tear down the tank. I havent tested his water yet but I will. Something tells me his tank may be on the high side with nitrates but thats just a guess, he hasnt done a water change in a long time. I already have the tank set up with substrate and rock/cave type setup. If I have to I will pull the rock out. His tank is an old setup and the Duboisis are F1. The few petros...maybe 3 or 4 of them are a bit smallther than the trophs . Either way they have to come here. My main goal is to keep them healthy and then maybe trade some of them off to thin down the herd. Is there a need to medicate tank at all when I transfer ?


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

Belair62 said:


> guess I will deal with the petros when I get them here. Bro is moving and he has to tear down the tank. I havent tested his water yet but I will. Something tells me his tank may be on the high side with nitrates but thats just a guess, he hasnt done a water change in a long time. I already have the tank set up with substrate and rock/cave type setup. If I have to I will pull the rock out. His tank is an old setup and the Duboisis are F1. The few petros...maybe 3 or 4 of them are a bit smallther than the trophs . Either way they have to come here. My main goal is to keep them healthy and then maybe trade some of them off to thin down the herd. Is there a need to medicate tank at all when I transfer ?


Shouldn't be a need, but have metro or Kanaplex on hand and keep an eye on them. I prefer Kanaplex personally as it can be added to the water column.
The petros sound like they are young so you will have time to relocate them before they kill each other.
I wouldn't thin down the Tropheus group at all though. They need numbers to spread out the aggression.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

Thanks. My biggest concern now is transferring from his tank to mine when its ready. Probably have to use a 5 gallon bucket and try to get from his house to mine asap. Never kept African cichlids. Trying to read as much as I can so I dont harm them.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

Belair62 said:


> Thanks. My biggest concern now is transferring from his tank to mine when its ready. Probably have to use a 5 gallon bucket and try to get from his house to mine asap. Never kept African cichlids. Trying to read as much as I can so I dont harm them.


Piece of cake. Two or three 5g buckets filled 1/3 of the way with a towel over top to stop them jumping/splashing.
Make sure the car isn't freezing cold or sweltering hot and the water should retain it's heat give or take a degree or two.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

While cycling is it beneficial to add an air source to tank ? I have 2 spray bars moving the water surface right now but can add a powerhead with an air jet too if necessary.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Just running your filters should be sufficient.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

DJRansome said:


> Just running your filters should be sufficient.


Thanks DJ


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

Ok I may be there. 24hrs ago I had the folowing test results. 2nd columns is tonight. Should I wait 24 more hrs before I feed the beast more ammonia to keep the cycle going until I get the livestock here ?

Nitrate 0. Nitrate. 20
Nitrite 1. Nitrite. 0
Ammonia. .50. Ammonia .25


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

Yes we are cycled. Going to keep an eye on it for a week or so before I load it up.


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## Belair62 (Apr 11, 2018)

I am about a week away from getting my brothers stock. My tank has cycled and I am maintaing with ammonia per the fishless cycle post found in the library. Tank has been up and running with 2 Eheims but I cannot filter out the aragonite dust for some reason. Its visible with the naked eye. I have a spare Eheim running downstairs in a bucket to try and clean it out. Can I fill that up with plain old floss and try and get these particulates out ?i dont want to disturb the cycled filter currently running in the tank. Will floss even get this stuff out ? I really dont want to use flocculants.


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