# Getting plants got a few questions



## bertolli (Aug 18, 2009)

Ok got my tank 43G *36Lx25Hx12W*
I wasn't sure about plants until today I realized what i got on CL with it was a gravel filter (with many other things).
My biggest question is: Can i put fertilizer underneath the gravel filter and then my substrate(3Mcolorquartz) on top? I plan on getting low maintenance plants amazon sword and 1 other type _(if anyone can suggest a plant that will look nice with it and is also easy to maintain please do)_

Where would be a good placement for the power head that came with it? Near the plants? If so by the surface or lower down?

This gravel filter takes up slightly more than half the length of the tank. So I want that half to have plants and then the other half to be with rocks.
If this does happen to be a feasible plan, what fertilizer is recommended?
Will I need one of those CO 2 thingies? (my knowledge is very limited on these) if it will be needed a link to one would be appreciated if your in the giving mood. 

This is kind of unrelated but my stock plan is 6 convicts and 2 african jewels, i don't want babies so hybrids is not an issue for me whatever happens in this tank stays in the tank. That being said, would i be better off with 2 female jewels regardless? 
Are there any bottom feeders or additional fish that are compatible with the other two that would benefit my tank in some way?
Thanks for reading my long nubish post and for any replies in advance. :wink:


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## matthew1884 (Jul 24, 2009)

Convicts do not like plants.


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## bertolli (Aug 18, 2009)

matthew1884 said:


> Convicts do not like plants.


I'm pretty sure your wrong, especially since they are indigenous to central america....


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## matthew1884 (Jul 24, 2009)

check this site out and some more research they will destroy plants in your tanks.

http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/cichlid/convict.php


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## matthew1884 (Jul 24, 2009)

and here 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convict_cichlid

under the in the "in the aquarium" section


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## matthew1884 (Jul 24, 2009)

with 6 of them if they pair up they will be very territorial and chase and kill any other fish with them while their breeding


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## cichlidfeesh (Apr 6, 2009)

My male convict (alone) doesn't disturb plants. My breeding pair of convicts destroy everything in sight, including plants (both real and fake).

I don't think under gravel filters work with sand substrate. I don't have 3M color quartz but I think its a sand? Please correct me if I am wrong. The sand would fall through the filter.

With the low maintenance plants you mentioned, a CO2 system is not needed. If you want to see remarkable growth from your plants researching a CO2 system is a good idea, but its defiantly not required.

Are you planning on having different sex convicts? If so, with the breeding pairs that form, a 43 gallon tank may be too small for all of them to establish territories.

You might want to research other methods of filtration such as Hang on backs, or canisters, as UGF's are a little outdated.


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## matthew1884 (Jul 24, 2009)

The under gravel filters are not recommended for plants either, Sand is also not as good for plants as gravel is for them

I was thinking about a planted tank to but haven't got around to it, I did a lot of research, sand is no good because the roots have nothing to grab onto. and you have to have really good lighting, like 2 watts or more per gal.

If you want the planted tank I would recommend no sand and no under gravel filters,
cichlidfeesh has a good point on the territory issue.

hope this all helps

goodluck


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## bertolli (Aug 18, 2009)

Matthew, thanks for the links... Colorquartz is like sand but it is actually ceramic.
After reading what you guys had to say i think i will put in a potted plant or two and see how it goes.
thx for the help


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## matthew1884 (Jul 24, 2009)

yeah good luck I hope it all works out well for you.

try some fertilizer though I have a few plants in a tank and they are fading quickly.


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## bertolli (Aug 18, 2009)

what fish do u have with the plants?


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## redblufffishguy (Jul 16, 2009)

Matthew1884 has it right, plants and UG filters do not mix.

As for the colorquartz, it may be ceramic, but that is not the point. Any fine sand type media will compact and retain gasses. You will have to constantly (monthly) "fluff" or un-compact the media to prevent it from fouling and killing everything in the tank. That isn't the entire problem, the plants do not like thier roots disturbed. Constantly running something throught the sand, will disturb the roots.

You will have more luck removing the colorquartz and adding Flourite as media for the bottom of the tank! the plants love it, and it looks godd as well.


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## fmueller (Jan 11, 2004)

You've got some excellent responses already, but there is also a fair amount of confusion in this thread. Hopefully I can help clear some of that up. Some points:

- Undergravel filters are not recommended - neither with plants nor without. All an undergravel filter does is trap dirt under your substrate. Undergravel jets are a different issue (more about them in the library section).

- Low maintenance plants (Amazon swords, Valisneria, Anubias, Java fern, and so on) do not need fertilizer. They do fine with fish poop 

- These plants also don't need CO2, and light of 1 to 1.5 WPG is ok. You either want to go low tech planted (no fertilizers, no CO2, 1 to 1.5 WPG), or high tech planted (regular fertilizers, CO2, high wattage lighting). Mixing and matching is not a good idea. High tech planted tanks are very maintenance intensive - most need almost daily attention. Low tech planted tanks can be very low care. I do maintenance on my 240G low tech planted tank only twice per year - except for feeding and the occasional algae scraping on the front glass. (The tank does have an automatic water change system.)









_240G low tech planted Frontosa tank_

- In my experience with low tech planted tanks - I had some for many years - plants do better in coarse sand (T-grade Color Quartz and Pool Filter Sand) than in gravel. These types of sand are coarse enough that they won't clump and form anaerobic pockets. They are fine enough that excess food and other debris do not sink into the substrate like they would in gravel. So there is no need to stir up the substrate, and the roots of your plants can develop the way they like.

- Convicts are diggers. You will probably have little luck with plants that need to be rooted in the substrate (Amazon swords and Valisneria). Much better choices include Anubias and Java fern. These plants do not like to be rooted in substrate. They do much better if you wedge their roots between two rocks as seen in the picture below.









_The roots of this Anubias plant are wedged between the rock forming the side of the cave and the one on top. To see how it grew click here_

- As long as you have both sexes of convicts, they will breed. There are stories about convicts that bred in the bag while being carried home from the store. Anybody who has kept convicts for a while will start to wonder if these stories could be true. Breeding convicts will be aggressive and beat up any other inhabitants of the tank. Did I mention that convicts are always breeding? My brother once had a pair of convicts and a pair of bristle nose plecos in a tank about the size you are considering. The convicts chased a pleco out of the tank - literally! The pleco landed on the carpet right in front of my brother who managed to pick it up and put it in another tank! Aggression between the dominant pair of convicts that will develop and other tank inhabitants will be a huge issue for you. Either you will take the others out, or they will be killed. Cross breeding between the convicts and jewels will be a non-issue.


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## bertolli (Aug 18, 2009)

Thank you for your interesting and informative response fmueller. I also like the post to you webpage which i have bookmarked for future reference. 
I have opted to have no plants in this tank but I have a 28g that will definitely be a planted tank in the future.
Thanks everyone :thumb:


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