# Are Cyprichromis worth it?



## jrf (Nov 10, 2009)

IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢m about 2 weeks away (fingers crossed) from completing the cycle on a new 55, and IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢m debating whether or not to add Cyprichromis (non-jumbo) to the tank. Right now, the plans definitely include a trio of Calvus (relocated from my other tanks) and a group shell dwellers.

After some reading, I'm wondering if Cyps are more trouble than they are really worth? It seems that if theyÃ¢â‚¬â„¢re not jumping out of the tank, they are wasting away for no apparent reason. I was also surprised to see that inter-species aggression can be a problem if you donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t have the right balance of males in the group. ItÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s not something I see discussed much when stock list recommendations are tossed out there.

So IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢m wondering, am I just digging up isolated cases of things that can go wrong? Or are these fish really as fussy to keep as they appear?


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## alexlee04 (Jul 19, 2009)

I love mine. I can't imagine my community tank without them. They really add a lot of action as well as drawing other fish out into the open. I have 12 (50/50 ratio) in my 55gal and they're getting along great. I have found that they arn't fussy at all. They eat like pigs and breed like rabbits. Great fish. :thumb:


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## swk (Mar 16, 2010)

I've had no trouble with my cyps. My tank has a lid (solves jumping) and they're about as bullet proof a fish I have ever kept. They spawn like mad and the fry sell well. So...yeah, they're worth it.


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## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

*jrf*

I have found cyps to be bullet proof IF you provide flat thin slate up against the sides and/or back wall. As long as they have a structure to orient to, they get very content, fat and breed like rabbits!

Without tall (tank high) structures, I've had them jump to their death or waste away.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Mine are fine, but do cover the tank, LOL.


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## kshafer (Dec 31, 2005)

I'm glad to see the positive replies. I could use some encouragement right now. I bought 10 Specklebacks in July at 1.25". The seller would only ship airport to airport so by the time I added the cost of the fish, air freight, 150 miles roundtrip to the airport,and divided that by the surviving fish I've got $30 per fish invested in these guys. Two were lost in transit which I got credit for but now you divide the total airfreight and mileage costs by 8 instead of 10. Actually now 7 since 1 died last week for no apparent reason. My experience so far is that they are the wimpiest fish that I have ever owned. Initially, I was crushing 1mm NLS pellets. If a piece of food looked too big to them they would let if fall to the bottom and not even try to eat it. I swear they would starve to death with uneaten food on the sand bottom, which I must siphon out every night. They are in a 29 gallon tank with no other fish. If they are at the left side and I drop the food in there they will move to the right so most goes to the bottom before they realize it is there. My advice would be to buy the largest fish you can find and also buy local if you can to save on freight charges. I'm not giving up on these guys but any comparison to pigs and rabbits looks to be a long way off.


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## Razzo (Oct 17, 2007)

I am a cyp killer and am banned for life against ever getting another one. I watched 18 of my 22 wild caught cyps waste away one by one. I've kept many different kinds of cichlids the past 20 years and I just couldn't keep the cyps alive. I was doing something wrong I just couldn't figure it out


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## @nt!x (Feb 9, 2009)

My cyps breed like crazy. I have 8 males and 17 females in my 125g.


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## jrf (Nov 10, 2009)

Thanks for the opinions guys.



Number6 said:


> *jrf*
> 
> I have found cyps to be bullet proof IF you provide flat thin slate up against the sides and/or back wall. As long as they have a structure to orient to, they get very content, fat and breed like rabbits!
> 
> Without tall (tank high) structures, I've had them jump to their death or waste away.


My tank my not be appropriate then. I have rock piles on either end and a couple of boulders that stick up a bit into the water column. But no propped up slate - and I donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t think I really want to add any at this point to be honest.


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## alexlee04 (Jul 19, 2009)

Kshafer maybe the reason yours didn't fair too well was the fact you were keeping jumbos in a 29 gallon tank. For jumbo cyps a 6 foot or larger tank is required.


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## BioG (Oct 12, 2008)

I have only had problems with jumbos. Utinta and blue flash are fine in my tanks for some reason.


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## kshafer (Dec 31, 2005)

The 29 is just a quarantine/grow-out tank. They are going into a 125 soon. They only use a small portion of the 29 as it is plus I worry about them finding food in a much larger space. The largest one is is at 1.5" and they are in no danger of being eaten by anything in the 125. They haven't done that badly in the 29. I guess it is more impatience on my part in wanting these guys to reach their potential more quickly than they are. If anyone thinks they would do better in the 125 I'll move them now.


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## @nt!x (Feb 9, 2009)

They would probably grow faster in the 125.


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## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

*kshafer*
not using the whole tank is IMHO and IME, a very bad sign.

They are likely stressed by improper terrain, tank size, and/or shipping stress. I don't mean to be a pessimist, but you will likely lose those fish at this rate if my hunches are correct.

Jrf, I would be adding something tall, or swapping them to another tank. My 2 cents


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

My experience with cyps has been great (without high rocks, never any jumpers). My WC group of 10 did very well in a 55. Their fry have grown and bred (selectively), have been sold, bred again, and all in all do well. I think cyps are more resilient to transport and acclimation stress than many other fish (I've had a terrible time with altos!) I've had them in a empty 40 gallon for growing out- no rocks, no background and no substrate- and they did wonderfully. I think fat and happy cyps need five things:


- A place to sleep. Cyps sleep on the ground and need to have a place to do so. If all the floor space is claimed by substrate spawners, the cyps will waste away.

- A place to swim. Males do form 3D territories in open water. My breeding groups (10-20 cyps) in 4ft tanks have typically resulted with 2 territorial males. If there are 5 or more males, the others don't color up. If there are less than 5 males, I end up with two. The schooling behavior among females is much more evident in a 4ft tank than a 3ft.

- Good water quality. As with most Tangs, you can't expect cyps to thrive without large, frequent water changes.

- Appropriate tank mates. Tropheus, frontosa, and brichardi types are* not* appropriate. Sandsifters, shellies, altos, julies, gobies, and some neolamps are okay.

- Metronidazole. An essential (and inexpensive) drug to have on hand for cyps and other wasting/bloat prone fish.

They are worth it though. They bring other fish out of hiding, and their open water dancing is spectacular. Find some from a local breeder if you can- it's much cheaper that way. :thumb:


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## kshafer (Dec 31, 2005)

I think the terrain is good. I have some open area and one tall structure in the corner which they seem to like. I've been conservative in moving them to the 125 since I have so much $ invested in them and didn't want to rock their boat. Maybe it's time for a change of scenery by getting them into the 125. I've got nothing to lose if they are unhappy where they are.


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## jrf (Nov 10, 2009)

triscuit said:


> Find some from a local breeder if you can- it's much cheaper that way.


Yeah. If I can find a local source, I think I'll give it a shot.


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## swk (Mar 16, 2010)

Frozen cyclops is excellent for cyps of all ages. I keep mine with large petros and they do great. Young cyps have a hard time with nls 1mm. My growouts get spirulina flake, frozen cyclops and nls grow. Fry grow well in a bare 55 gal with sponge filters.


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## mel_cp6 (Feb 3, 2009)

i think a tanganyika community tank is not complete without a school of cyprichromis.
so, yes i think they're well worth it.


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## kshafer (Dec 31, 2005)

I moved the Cyps his weekend to a 125. Tank parameters that I could measure, temperature and pH, were the same but I still lost two the first day. The five that remain are doing fine. They like to hang out in front of a tall lace rock but they do use the whole tank now. They look better with darker fins and eat more aggressively than I have ever seen. I know they like to be in large groups. Will I have trouble with having only 5 of them?


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## Kerricko (May 26, 2010)

I haven't kept cyps or Tangs of anykind yet but this thread has me interested. opcorn:


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## Furcifer158 (Feb 16, 2008)

You can never go wrong with any kind of cyp...........well except kitumbas. there a pain well in the small 125 i had them in. Fighting all the time. They were wild caught. The F1 fry i got seem to be alot less aggressive. I'n playing to get some more cyps here too just not sure what kind yet.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

They are great fish. I have kept utintas, jumbo blue orchids, microlepidotus and now pavo.


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## Mr Mbuna (Nov 16, 2007)

I kept them with tropheus in a 5' tank and they did great. Try feeding them frozen cyclops or brine shrimp if they won't eat . This stays in the water column longer and its a little like the plankton that they eat in the wild.


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## Hurriken (Jan 13, 2006)

In my 55 my adult Cyps do great. They eat like pigs and breed well. In the 10g grow out tank they stay in the corner so I think enviroment is a big deal. M/F Ratio is a big deal too 4m to 10f works best in my 55.


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## kshafer (Dec 31, 2005)

The five I moved two weeks ago are doing great. I just wish I had started with more and moved them sooner.


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## emptyhead (Apr 16, 2007)

I have two groups - both still young. Males have had color for a few months.

I found two things to be of benefit for the cyps.

Groups of tall plants for cover - the larger the tank, the less this is needed.

The use of an air pump - increased circulation made an obvious difference in my tanks.

This is just my experience. I have found cyps to be hardy and active fish, once I made the changes to the tank stated above. I feed mine crushed omega one flakes.


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## Jamey (Jul 19, 2008)

triscuit said:


> I think cyps are more resilient to transport and acclimation stress than many other fish


Seriously? I brought home cyps from a local breeder twice now, the first time I lost one on the hour and a half car ride, the next time I lost 3 of 4. Conversations I had with other people on the subject of these mysterious deaths left me with the opinion that transferring them from one tank to another within the fishroom would likely as not kill them (one breeder actually said that.)

Maybe it's because I had them in less than a 4 foot tank to grow out, but I found them boring... just sitting there treading water against the current. They ate fine, they slept fine, their tank mates (multis) didn't bother them much, they were just drying paint to me... I have a 150 going up soon, and all the positive praise makes me want to try them again, but frankly, from my experience getting them home alive, and then getting them to do anything other then slowly swim around like a school of sardines leaves me conflicted.

On a side note, my wife took them after I decided I just didn't like them and put them in a 37g... I was going to give them away but she insisted... most died soon after, and then the rest died, except 1, who's taken up residence inside a cave where he's lived apparently happily for the last year and a half! She has the world's only cave dwelling cyp!


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## Furcifer158 (Feb 16, 2008)

Jamey said:


> triscuit said:
> 
> 
> > I think cyps are more resilient to transport and acclimation stress than many other fish
> ...


 :-? Really :-? Cyps are crazy easy to keep, Maybe your set up was not correct.


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## Jamey (Jul 19, 2008)

I didn't say I had difficulties with them, I said they were boring! The difficulties came in transportation only... all the featherfins and gobies I brought home made it fine, cyps, dead.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Jamey said:


> Seriously? I brought home cyps from a local breeder twice now, the first time I lost one on the hour and a half car ride, the next time I lost 3 of 4. ...I found them boring... just sitting there treading water against the current.


I've heard of cyps being difficult to ship, but I brought home 20 from a local breeder and all survived the 3-hour car ride and survived in the tank. I only lose cyps to jumping, LOL. Mine are so not boring as they constantly scrap and breed...never still. It's like the civil war between the yellow-tails and the blue-tails, LOL.


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## Jamey (Jul 19, 2008)

Maybe I'll pick up 10 or so of the orange and black ones and give them one more try...


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## jrf (Nov 10, 2009)

For what it's worth, I decided I'm going to give them a try - that is if my tank ever cycles (grrr). It does seem that a lot of the bad experiences stem from trying to keep them in a tank that's too small.


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## Jamey (Jul 19, 2008)

People will certainly blow me up for this but i cycle with real fish... unless you're cycling witha similar or greater bioload than what you plan to keep the tank is going to cycle again anyway when you put thr additional bioload on it, and you've introduced whatever diseases are currently running around your LFS to the tank.... I've never lost a fish except ones i accidentally killed by pulling shells out with fish inside and i think thats in part because no LFS have ever touched my tanks.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

Jamey said:


> People will certainly blow me up for this but i cycle with real fish... unless you're cycling witha similar or greater bioload than what you plan to keep the tank is going to cycle again anyway when you put thr additional bioload on it, and you've introduced whatever diseases are currently running around your LFS to the tank.... I've never lost a fish except ones i accidentally killed by pulling shells out with fish inside and i think thats in part because no LFS have ever touched my tanks.


Well, I'm not going to "blow you up", but I will offer a different view. :wink: A few issues with your post: once the biological filtration is established, it can quickly assimilate reasonable changes in bioload which means it won't cycle again. Secondly, just because you haven't killed a fish during a cycle doesn't mean its gill function or immune system wasn't compromised. Our goal should be to provide the best environment for them, not just keep them alive. Lastly, I'm not sure where the logic went with disease introduction from the LFS having anything to do with fish/fishless cycling.

As far as cyps being boring or umm, dead: keeping them in appropriately sized groups (10 or more) and tanks (48" or more) is what allows them to show off how awesome they are. opcorn: Transport shock can be mitigated, but the seller and buyer both have to know what they're doing, and is a completely species-independent factor, IMO.


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

I actually don't really like cyps either. I think its a matter of taste really, as I'm not all that hot for paracyps. I had a large group of micros some time ago, but I haven't kept any cyps since. I do enjoy sandsifters and featherfins, but cyps I find to be a bit boring, although they are an attractive fish. If anyone has the space, funds and patience the the Tang killifish is an amazing substitution for cyps.


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## Furcifer158 (Feb 16, 2008)

triscuit said:


> Jamey said:
> 
> 
> > People will certainly blow me up for this but i cycle with real fish... unless you're cycling witha similar or greater bioload than what you plan to keep the tank is going to cycle again anyway when you put thr additional bioload on it, and you've introduced whatever diseases are currently running around your LFS to the tank.... I've never lost a fish except ones i accidentally killed by pulling shells out with fish inside and i think thats in part because no LFS have ever touched my tanks.
> ...


 :thumb:


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## johnnyo513 (Oct 15, 2009)

I ordered my Cyprichromis leptosoma (Mpulungu) online, they were shipped overnight, didn't hear the UPS man knocking on my door so they sat on the porch for not sure how much longer then they needed to... I ordered 12, received 13, that was last May, all 13 are still doing fine in my 55gal, along with 2 Altolamprologus compressiceps (Gold Head) and 4 Neolamprologus leleupi (Orange) and 1 Julidochromis marlieri I find them very easy to take care and very amusing to watch.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

A lot of people talk about cyps being delicate and not shipping well. I have sold/given away hundreds of cyps and paracyps and have never heard that any had not made the move. I get people showing up at my door in the middle of winter and take the bus home. Those are the guys I expect to hear back from.


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## jrf (Nov 10, 2009)

Just an updateÃ¢â‚¬Â¦

I picked up a group of 1.25" 'Kerenge Island' Cyps last night. ItÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s obviously way too early to draw any conclusions, but so far I really like the little guys. They did seem to ship better than the Brevis I ordered along with them, and theyÃ¢â‚¬â„¢re not shy at all. Twenty minutes after going into the tank, they were merrily schooling around and watching me clean up the mess I made while un-bagging them. From some of the comments IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢ve read, I was half expecting them to be skittish and shy. So far, this doesnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t seem to be the case at all.

I ended up turning off the Hydor Korilla power heads I have on each end of the tank. Although the Cyps actually seemed to like playing in the current, it looked like they would fit straight through the protective grating on the intake side of the units. I was afraid I might come home to Cyprichromis puree if they got a bit too curious about the things. So, I decided to play it safe and just shut them down.

The Brevis, on the other hand, went straight for the nearest cover as soon as they hit the water, and I havenÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t seen much of them since then. If it wasnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t for the occasional plume of sand kicked up from among the rocks, you wouldnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t even know they were there. IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢ve had Brevis before. So, I know theyÃ¢â‚¬â„¢ll relax a bit more after they settle in. But, it is an interesting contrast to the behavior of the Cyps.


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## pkut (Feb 3, 2005)

I have no problem keeping Cyps and Paracyps. They eat well, live well and breed well for me. The problem I have is keeping the newborn fry alive. They usually die within less than 24 hours after they're released from the mother's mouth. My best results have been stripping the females right away and tumbling their eggs before they begin to form. I get a much higher yield from tumbling the newer, unformed eggs than I do tumbling the partially formed ones. I can't understand this!


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Mine grow well if they can survive in the main tank and/or if I can get them into a breeder net in the main tank. I did have a batch spit in a maternity tank who were fine until the first water change and then died within 48 hours. Have not tried it since.


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