# Do higher temp's make cichlids grow faster?



## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

I have
x2 3inch Frontosa's
x6 1.5-2inch Dimidiochromis Compressiceps
x2 1.5inch Nimbochromis Fuscotaeniatus

I am keeping the tank at about 87 degrees for a week or two, since I am still in the process of adding fish to my 125 gallon, and I am making sure that there is no ich from the new fish coming into the tank. But I heard that it is not bad at all to keep temps that high for longer periods of time. I am not worried about the aggression level going up, considering they are all so small, and there are no dominate fish yet. Will the higher temps make the fish grow, or is it just unnecessary? Will it harm the fish in the long term?
:fish: 
How long would I be looking at for the fish to get to about 5 inches with heat and without heat?

Thanks, Michael!


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

It will speed their metabolisms thus making them more hungry. It would likely help smaller fish but I don't think it is going to make a huge difference. I would drop it back down to 78-82 when you can. They should all grow fairly fast anyways especially the Fusco's. I would just do your weekly water changes and feed a good food and keep everything routine and stable.


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

Is faster growth desirable?


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## pfoster74 (May 13, 2012)

i read a post on a fish forum where they thought weekly water changes may help spur the growth idk if it is true but it cant hurt


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## matt121966 (Mar 6, 2012)

do more frequent water changes keep aggression down?

would it slow the growth?

I heard doing frequent water changes removes pheromones in the water.


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

Two biggest factors that enhance growth IME are water volume and quality of food.

I had mbuna on continuous, drip and never noticed faster growth.


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

I have read that water changes with a cooler water temp. will induce spawning. Haven't read anything about growth.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

So I am getting a bunch of mixed responses, so I have no clue what to do. Keep the water temp high? Keep it low? Do more water changes? Feed more? Feed Less? :-? HELP ME!!!!! :lol:


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## TangSteve (Sep 20, 2009)

Keep temp low. If something goes wrong a temp that high will cause the entire tank to wipe quickly as there is less dissolved O2 in high temp water. Anything that far outside of normal is going to stress fish as well.

If you want growth, feed good food, keep nitrates down...just the basics of good fish keeping


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## aicardi (Sep 15, 2012)

smitty814 said:


> I have read that water changes with a cooler water temp. will induce spawning. Haven't read anything about growth.


I can confirm this with Jewels.


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## TangSteve (Sep 20, 2009)

aicardi said:


> smitty814 said:
> 
> 
> > I have read that water changes with a cooler water temp. will induce spawning. Haven't read anything about growth.
> ...


With species from rivers this is typically true as cool water represents the rainy season. When I was a big SA cichlid breeder I would use large water changes to prompt species to breed.

Lake species are used to very small changes in water temperatures so would have little to no impact. The African lakes are more like oceans with stable temps and tidal influence


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

TangSteve is correct about water change temperatures. Frequent water changes tend to lower the waste in the water, the ammonia, nitrites, nitrates... and their absence increases growth rates dramatically.

Stuffing fish with foods, or high protein foods often results in fish that don't look natural, or are too large.

High temperatures shouldn't increase growth rates.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

And having the fish grow faster than natural with high temps, food of whatever is not really desirable either.


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## Fish on Fire (Dec 13, 2012)

Faster growth rates are very desirable for the slower growing species out there.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

A matter of opinion, perhaps, if the result is a mishappen or unnaturally large fish.


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## metricliman (Sep 3, 2012)

I think keeping fish speeds up their metabolism thus possibly making them grow faster but also shortening their life span.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

DJRansome said:


> A matter of opinion, perhaps, if the result is a mishappen or unnaturally large fish.


What do you mean unnaturally large? The max size is the max size, right? How large are we talking, I just cant seem to see a bad side of higher temps. The bigger the better, unless it harms the fish...


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

1025667 said:


> DJRansome said:
> 
> 
> > A matter of opinion, perhaps, if the result is a mishappen or unnaturally large fish.
> ...


Unnaturally large... like when a fish that grows to 3-4" in with wild, and is overfed, and ends up at 7" in the aquarium, with a shape quite different than what it does in the wild.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

Oh, okay. Are there any pics that i could see?
getting kinda curious


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)




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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

Wow haha! You guys weren't kidding!


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## Fish on Fire (Dec 13, 2012)

Yeah, it really just depends on what a person wants out of their fish.


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## BC in SK (Aug 11, 2012)

I don't doubt the first picture of yellow lab is more typical, or average. But that no old and more developed specimens are collected may have more to do with where and how the fish are obtained...as well as fishing/collecting pressure on the species. If a yellow lab were a sought after sport fish on hook and line......then maybe we would have a few more pictures of older and exceptionally large, in it's wild habitat.

Anyways, high temps for any significant length of time are probably not a good idea. Added stress a fish does not need. Many aquarists claim that fish live shorter lives at higher temps.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

:thumb: Yes I will only raise the temps when necessary. I want them to live long happy lives! :thumb:


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## noki (Jun 13, 2003)

Basically, as had been said, there really isn't any great reason to try to get cichlids to grow faster through high temps or overfeeding. The best way to get fish to grow is frequent water changes. In a decent size tank, with lots of water changes, the fish will grow fast from juvenile sizes. Malawi cichlids are not slow growers.

What keeps them from growing fast...
1) poor water quality
2) small tanks
3) stress from tankmates


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

I would argue that if this were a commercial enterprise, whatever means that were necessary to get the fish to 1" would not only be desired, but imperative.

Assuming sufficient water quality, they are going to grow faster than in the wild. The availability of a protein rich food source is exponentially more abundant in captivity. Even when fed modestly.

Keep the water clean., water changes every 5 days, at 78-80 degrees. In as large a body of water that you have room for.


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## Jmatson (Nov 16, 2012)

I agree with keeping up with water changes, regular feedings and largest body of water possible to help them grow quickly.

eg: I wanted to know if a large tank would help fish grow faster so when i ordered 6 F1 - Protomelas sp. "Spilonotus Tanzania" (Liuli) i placed 2 in a 55 with some juvie peacocks and the other 4 in my 125g with other medium size peacocks and haps. 
After 6 months the ones in my 125g are much bigger and showing better color. The 2 in the 55g are males and are smaller then a female i have in the 125g. 
Both tanks are kept at the same temp(78F), chemistry, feedings, and water changes each week.

With my fry, i strip the mother right away tumble the eggs at 80F for about 3-5 days until all the tails have popped out then i slowly raise the temp to 84-85F for about 2 months, 30% water changes every 2-3 days, then i lower it back down to 80F. Its a 10g tank so water changes are little and easy to do. The fry grow extremely fast, especially during the hatching and absorption of the yoke sac stage. The yoke is fully absorbed at 13-15 days.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

Wow that is really interesting! Would this be a good thing to feed them a couple days a week as a treat? 
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=253277&view=unread#unread


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

No, it's overkill for adult fish and fry/juveniles have special foods that already have a higher protein content than adult foods.

As stated in the thread, the krill is already in your staple food.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

Back to the frequent and large water changes... I have Frontosa's.. Not sure If anyone has experience with them, but I heard that they do not handle large water changes very well..

BTW this my filtration:
MAGNUM 350 CANISTER FILTER
MAGNUM 250 HANG ON CANISTER FILTER
AQUA CLEAR 110
QUIET FLOW 20
TOP FIN 20
1200 GPH WAVEMAKER


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I had heard that about calvus as well, but I did not find it to be true at all. I have problems with water changes with some fry (cyps), but all my adult fish thrive on even a 90% change.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

Great, thanks for all the help guys!


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## BillD (May 17, 2005)

If you look at aquaculture, the fish are grown as fast as possible, and it doesn't result in grossly mis-shaped fish. High temps do shorten life span, which is easily viewed with smaller species such as guppies. At high temps (80s) they grow rapidly, to large size but their life is shortened. Fish kept at lower temps, such as low (68 to 72) temps will live about a year longer, in my experience.
As well, higher temps will result in lower dissolved oxygen content and higher bacterial growth (more potential for disease), as well as speeding up the fishs' metabolism. My preference is to keep fish in the lower end of their comfort zone. the last Malawis I kept were 3 male P. flavus, which were kept in an unheated tank which ranged from 66F to about 74F. They grew to full size from juveniles, about an inch long, without issue. They were active and healthy the two years I had them. they really grew when I kept live food in front of them 24/7 for about a month each spring. The live food was predominantly daphnia with assorted other insect larvae such as bloodworms.
Clean water is the key to rapid healthy growth, assuming a reasonable diet. Clean water being water that is low in dissolved organics, achieved through large volumes, frequent large water changes or both.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

BillD said:


> rapid healthy growth


I think this is what we are trying to say. Seek a *healthy *growth rate as opposed to fast growth at any cost. BillD phrased it better.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

I thought that at higher tempatures, there is much less of a chance for the fish to catch diseases? I have never dealt with any disease besides ich, once or twice.


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## metricliman (Sep 3, 2012)

For diseases like columnaris, it accelerates much faster in higher temps, so any outbreak would get bad very fast.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

Okay thanks for the help! How common is columnaris?


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## metricliman (Sep 3, 2012)

Not really common, but I've had it before and it was not fun. These were at normal temps, like 75-76 and it was over within 2 or 3 days.


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## 1025667 (Dec 20, 2012)

Does it just go away after a few days?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

No. Columnaris is a serious fish disease which is not so uncommon if your fish has had a serious injury or stress situation. It needs to be aggressively treated and even with aggressive treatment some/all of the impacted fish may die.


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## metricliman (Sep 3, 2012)

Sorry, I worded it wrong. The fish unfortunately died within 3 days.


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