# Calvus - heavy breathing



## mx22 (Jul 13, 2009)

Hi guys,

One of the calvus I bought a few days ago is now laying on the sand in a corner and is breathing heavily. I'm not really sure if the a bit larger calvus stressed this one so much or something else happened (yesterday he was fine).

I'm going to remove this guy into a smaller tank. Any suggestions which medicine should I buy or is it a lost case?

P.S. Just noticed as the larger calvus was pushing/biting the smaller one on one of the sides. Small guy is in a seperate smaller tank now, but still need advise on medecine...

Thank You!


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## BRANT13 (Feb 18, 2009)

Is the fish hurt?....torn fins or anything like that?....what are your water parameters many things can cause a fish to be lethargic along with heavy breathing.....moving to a seperate was a good choice to start with.....if any damage is notice id recommend treating with melafix.


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## mx22 (Jul 13, 2009)

Well he died yesterday... No damage, coloration was fine.

Water the day before yesterday was:
ph - 8/8.2
gh/kh - around 7 or 8 (I'm not home right now; can't access my notes) each.

I knew I needed to buffer it up, so I've added one teaspoon of Kent Cichlid Buffer (they were in 29g tank) after I took readings. With all the mess yesterday, I forgot to take water tests - will do it today when I get back from work.

I guess this can be closed, though I'd rather get more opinions on this and what is the best approach if something like that happens next time...

P.S. Btw, there are 3 Black Fin Tetras in that tank right now (along with a second Calvus). I know water is a bit hard for them, but I'm going to be adding 3x Occies on Friday and I want the tank to be ready to accept them - Black Tetras will go back to the store. Question is - could it been them harrassing Calvus? They always swim on top, but after I added Calvus, I see them more often over the rock where calvus were hiding. They still swim around and I've never noticed any aggression from them towards the new guys.

Thank You!


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

Calvus are super sensitive to water.

You should be checking more than you are ...Ammonia, nitrites, nitrate...

Were they shipped to you?

How were they acclimatized?

What size tank were they in?

Was it a QT? Just the calvus?


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## mx22 (Jul 13, 2009)

cichlidaholic said:


> Calvus are super sensitive to water.
> 
> You should be checking more than you are ...Ammonia, nitrites, nitrate...
> 
> ...


Ammonia - 0, nitirites - 0, nitrates - around 5.

They were bought in LFS. They had 4 of them there - the two I've got were in one section and it looked like they get along just fine; I figured smaller one was female hence I went for this pair.

Acclimatization - I've put the bag with fish in the tank to let temperature even out. After a bit, I've added a bit of water from the tank to the bag and let it stay for a bit; did that 3 or 4 times before finally putting fish in the tank. There were no water changes since I've added the pair. I did however added one spoon of Kent Cichlid Buffer as water hardness was a bit too small (see my post above for values).

Tank is 29 gallon.

What is QT? Tank is new, I cycled it with Black Tetras which are still there. As I said in the above post - I will be adding 3x Occies on Thursday or Friday and I keep them in tank so that its properly cycled for 5 fish that will be staying there (well now it looks like 4, but I most likely will buy another calvus to replace the one that died).

Thank You!


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

Hmmm...

I wasn't very specific when I made my earlier statement...What I should have said is that calvus are very sensitive to water changes. (That they need clean water is a given, but temperature changes, ph changes, etc. can be very hard on them.)

The tank is also on the small side for calvus, especially if you wind up with two of the same sex by accident, so it may have been a combination of things. How big are the calvus we're talking about?

I would be very careful about buying another one to put in this tank. What are the dimensions? If they are smaller and we can rule out aggression, they grow quite slowly, so it might be okay for a bit if you get lucky on compatibility levels, but lets get the dimensions first. I had problems with a proven pair in a 40G long, it just wasn't big enough for all that attitude at spawning time.


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## mx22 (Jul 13, 2009)

Small calvus was around 1.5'' and a large one around 2''. How do you take measurments of them anyway? I do not want to pull him out of the water just for the sake of taking measurments.

Tank dimensions - a regular 29 gal; 30'' length

I did not notice any aggressions before (and its not like I had them for a long time). I have a big Texas holey rock in one corner - larger calvus took over the cave in the front and smaller one was hanging out in the back (he was hiding there somewhere), but he would come to the front of the tank to feed and swim. Larger calvus now pretty much took over the back side for whatever the reason - at least thats the spot he was in the whole yesterday evening after I removed the smaller guy. Also, I found smaller guy laying on sand not in his regular spot, but in the opposite side of the tank in a corner...

So you think it was me adding Cichlid buffer that caused the problem?

Thank You!


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## mx22 (Jul 13, 2009)

Just got home and found the remaining calvus harrasing black skirt tetras - as soon as one of them stays around the rock, he dashes toward it. I've switched lights off to keep stress to tetras and calvus down - hopefully tomorrow tetras will be replaced with shell dwellers...


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

It could have been a combination of things.

You can't be certain you had a pair. Two of the same sex certainly won't work in a smaller tank size. It sounds like your remaining one is a bit of a brute, period - although I really wouldn't expect the tetras to survive in a cichlid tank.

Water is always a concern with calvus - whether it be a fluctuation in temp, or additives. (If they weren't used to the additives, it might have shocked them a bit, but if you didn't overdo it, I doubt it...I'd be more concerned with just the change in water/water parameters in general.)

Or...It may have been sick when you got it...Did you ever notice it eating?


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## mx22 (Jul 13, 2009)

Well I only had him for a few days and both of them were pretty much hiding all the time. Even now, the remaining calvus hides as soon as there is a movement outside of the tank...

Tatras will be out as soon as shell dwellers arrive - my LFS is getting shipment today, so either today or tomorrow I will take tetras out.

I don't think he was sick. Its kind of easy to blame all on LFS, but the guy there told me they had them for 3 weeks by the time I bought them. I know I definitely seen them in store a week or so prior to the purchase. Plus I picked the two that looked better then others (good coloring, no heavy breathing, not hiding in corners and just being generally active and not laying on the surface).

Water has been stable, though tank temperature can swing a couple of degrees - its rather hot and air conditioners are running. When they are off, temperature inside of the tank is around 81, but yesterday I saw it went down to between 78-80. Maybe I should for now set the heater to 81 degrees? Would that be a problem if I keep this temperature for around a month or so?

Water condition as of yesterday:
pH - 8.0/8.2
kH - 11
gH - 8

Basically adding buffer the day before smaller calvus died increased kH by around 4 and gH by 1. I thought pH might have increased, but yesterday's test showed pretty much the same result as two days before.

I now wonder if moving the smaller fish to a smaller tank might have been a bad idea and what eventually killed him. Should probably tried putting an extra rock I have in the opposite corner and see if he hides there.


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

You do realize the calvus may eat the shelldwellers as soon as you put them in the tank?

Sorry I didn't address that earlier, I was focused on the fish you lost and got sidetracked.

I was referring more to the water changes between the LFS water and your tank. I wouldn't worry about the temperature, as long as it's not fluctuating anymore than that. Those are gradual changes - the fish have time to adjust as the changes are occuring.

I would just keep a very close eye on things for now.

Keep in mind that a fish can appear 100% healthy, right up until death...That's the biggest problem people seem to have with treating bloat. They _look_ okay, even though they aren't eating - so often treatment gets delayed until it's too late.

There's no way to determine what went wrong. Maybe it was sick when you got it, then the changes to your tank pushed it over the edge, but we do know that the remaining calvus seems somewhat aggressive, so this may have been a factor, as well.


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## mx22 (Jul 13, 2009)

Thanks a lot for your help! I do realize that at one point calvus will be big enough to eat shellies, but for the time being it should not be a problem - meleagris or ocellatus that I will be getting are almost as big as calvus right now. When calvus grows up a bit, I will move him to a separate tank (and will probably buy a female for him)...


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