# DIY Background Trouble. Suggestions welcome!



## Miles Davis (Oct 23, 2007)

I recently created my own background on my 55 gallon using the standard white Styrofoam, GE Silicone I kitchen and bath, and Quickrete Quicksetting cement.









I understand I shoulda used the Quikrete Hydraulic Water-Stop Cement and GE Silicone I window and door, but it's too late for that. I did water changes every 2-3 days for about a week and a half with softening salt, but my PH has remained constantly above 8.8(or higher). Last week i just let the water sit in there with just tap water because i had read that bacteria had to grow on there to block off the cement and stop the leaching. I just replaced the water yesterday, and my pH reading today was 8.8(or higher) again.. The PH has not budged! Mind you that all these water changes have been straight from the tap, which comes out at about 8.0 pH, also i haven't used any dechlorinate. Needless to say im beginning to worry.

Against my best ambitions water is behind the Styrofoam on the back and sides, but i cant imagine its flowing very quickly back there. Im not sure if that would have any effect.



















The pump and tube you see in there leads to the UGJ system. Which is hidden amongst the background. So water IS circulating rather well.

Please respond with suggestions. Might I need to coat and seel it with drylok?


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## Malawi_Junkie (Nov 26, 2009)

GE silicone I K&B should be fine as long as it doesn't say Mold and Mildew resistant.
You said last week you just let the water sit there. Do you mean it was running with out water changes or no water changes and no water movement? I would run the tank for about a week and then do a 50% water change and check PH. Drylok would seal it up but shouldn't be necessary at this point. How long did you allow for the concrete to cure? 28 days to air dry prior to submerging is recommended. Water getting behind it is quite common and shouldn't be anything to worry about.


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## Miles Davis (Oct 23, 2007)

The water has been circulating since the first water change.
I only let the concrete cure for about 6 days , I put plastic wrap on it for the first 4 days to let it slow dry.


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## R-DUB (Jun 3, 2007)

Keep doing water changes. When you think that you have done enough do about ten more. Then do a few more after that. There is only a finite amount of alkali in the cement to leach out into your water. Eventually it will have to dissipate. I would also not reccomend using any salts in the curing process. IMHO. Just keep doing changes. Be patient, this is not the time to try and force the issue. Your water parameters are more important.


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## Tristan_1202 (Apr 28, 2010)

I let my water circulate for 3 days and did a 100% water change for a total of 3 changes and 9 days. I let the concrete cure for about 9 days before putting on the final coloured layer and then let that cure for another week. I checked my PH, GH and KH today they were 8, 15 and 7 respectively. These are all within the parameters for a healthy tank so I presume I can add my fish within the week.

Just keep in mind to check your parameters often and to ensure that everything is good. I used the same cement as you so im not really sure why your PH is so high. Maybe you need a few more 100% water changes to do the trick??


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## Malawi_Junkie (Nov 26, 2009)

You need to allow time for the bacteria to establish to stop the leaching, excessive water changes will be counter productive and alot of unnecessary work. You may lower the ph this way but it wont stop leaching until bacteria is established. Not allowing the concrete to cure properly may lead to cracking, only time will tell. I know many others have not had the patients to wait the full 28 days maybe they could offer their experiences and results.


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## Tristan_1202 (Apr 28, 2010)

How long am I to wait for this bacteria to grow and seal the concrete? Is this the same bacteria that helps remove nitrogen from our aquariums? There has been water in my tank for about 11 days now. How much longer in your experience before this bacteria will take hold?

My general understanding is that the leeching of the concrete will boost the general hardness of the water as well as boost the carbon hardness. If both of my readings are within range then I would think that the bacteria has already started to grow? I took the reading today before I drained the tank, and prior to this the water had been circulating for the past 5 days.

I have added the acrylic fortifier to help with the curing and cracking. Its been about 25 or 26 days since the first two coats were on and about 17 for the top coat. For what we are using it for it doesn't need to wait any longer to cure as it wont gain any more usable strength after the first two weeks of curing.

I don't know, I am just trying to get a grasp on a time line. I have the patience and ability to wait but my fish are probably not the happiest in their 50 gal breeding drums/sump. Sorry Miles as I feel I have taken over your thread lol, but I believe we both have the same questions.


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## Miles Davis (Oct 23, 2007)

No worries Tristan, were in this together haha. And many thanks to all those who have replied.

Malawi_Junkie: will this bacteria continue to grow when i do water changes without dechloranizing the water. I dont want to have to dechlorinate every gallon of water i use to change the water. How often should i do a 50% water change?

My water test kit's High Range pH indicator solution and scale only goes up to 8.8. and several hours after my 100% water changes, the reading comes out at 8.8, and it may be higher bc of the limited scale of my indicator solution. I feel like if theres that much leaching into the water, theres no hope of this process ever ending :?


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## Malawi_Junkie (Nov 26, 2009)

The bacteria should have already began to grow, I wouldn't do any more 100% water changes, 50 - 60% water change every other day. Bacteria should take a good hold after about 7 - 10 days, keep checking ph, once stable give it a day or 2. I would advise using a good dechlorinator in at least 2 water changes prior to adding fish. Adding some bio-media from an established filter can speed things up. It's not an exact science, just keep tank running and moniter your water conditions. Good Luck


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## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

R-DUB said:


> Keep doing water changes. When you think that you have done enough do about ten more. Then do a few more after that. There is only a finite amount of alkali in the cement to leach out into your water. Eventually it will have to dissipate. I would also not reccomend using any salts in the curing process. IMHO. Just keep doing changes. Be patient, this is not the time to try and force the issue. Your water parameters are more important.


It is self defeating to do water changes while trying to get the pH to stabilise with a new background. There is not a finite amount of available alkali in the cement. A finite amount of total alkali yes, but you want that in there to hold the cement together permanently. Only a small amount naturally leaches out before the surface gets sealed by the nitrogen cycle bacteria. If you do constant water changes, drawing out that small amount quickly, you disrupt equilibrium and then have to do another water change to get that new alkali out, which can keep increasing the not quite so finite amount of available akali until you have only sand left. Water changes are counter productive.

Don't change the water. It is common advice to change the water, but it is wrongheaded and has simply been passed on and on with no one stopping to rub two brain neurons together at any point.


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## Miles Davis (Oct 23, 2007)

Ok so when i go to do a 50% water change the chlorine and other agents in the tap wont harm the bacteria that has established on the concrete?

and as soon as my pH sits at 8.0 for several days, im all set and can begin to test all my water parameters and begin to add fish?


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## Miles Davis (Oct 23, 2007)

or would it be beneficial to use a dechlorinator in my water changes?


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## Miles Davis (Oct 23, 2007)

The pH dropped to 8.0(same as tap) and so I set up my filtration system.. It seemed relatively stable, until last night when i checked it and it was back up to above 8.4.

My filtration includes:
sump with mechanical filtration(sponge pad from seeder tank) and bio balls. 
Ehiem 2217. I topped off the filter media with rock aquarium substrate which is high in calcium to buffer the pH

So here i am doing 50% water changes again..

Still having trouble.. :?


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## Malawi_Junkie (Nov 26, 2009)

How long was your filtration up and running before spike? What's your PH out of the tap?


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## Miles Davis (Oct 23, 2007)

pH out of the tap is 8.0

*** had the filtration in for about about 9 days


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## Malawi_Junkie (Nov 26, 2009)

Stop the water changes and just give it time for PH to level out. Next time use Drylok.


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## cgmark (Aug 18, 2010)

I think when doing backgrounds the hardest thing people come up against is keeping water from behind it. My solution is not to keep the water out, let it go back there and provide a path for it to flow back out into the tank.

I need to get another camera, the ccd sensor died in mine, but I will post some pics soon. I use vents made out of silicon air line tubing to allow the water pressure behind it to equalize. Basically just a tube at 1" spacing near the bottom that allow the water to flow through the back in and out. I considered just not sealing edges but the problem with that is buildup of gunk between the seems of the glass and back.


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