# Can Discus and Angels be together?



## MCKP

Well, the subject pretty much said it... Can Discus and Angels be together? Is there a certain size tank that they would be okay in or is it just a flat no??


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## Chromedome52

Generally it's given as a flat No, because the Angels are invariably carrying bugs that will end up killing the Discus, even tank bred Angels. Or so I've been told by Discus breeders...


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## MCKP

I have been reading and alot of people just take the Angels and quarantine them and treat them whether they show signs or not prior to adding them to the Discus..... is this an option or just a waste of time??


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## Lancerlot

I was always under the Impression the angels would stress the Discuss Horribly. Something about angles hating circles. (not realy lol) but them stressing the Discuss opens them up to the Bugs or what not the Angels are carrying. Something that doesn't effect the angels but is bad for the Discuss.

Then I just hear Circles and Triangles arn't meant to be?


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## M0oN

Several reasons it's not a good idea - but it's definitely possible.

Angels are more aggressive than discus, if they pair off there's a good chance of your discus stressing and getting sick nearly overnight.

You need a large tank, I'd say a bare minimum of a 150 gallon - and you would want to make the discus shoal significantly larger than the angelfish shoal.

Definitely NOT altum angelfish - they're psychotic in temprement by comparison to other species of angelfish.

If you are going to do it - quarantine your angelfish and treat them with metrodiazonale for a minimum of three weeks. Angelfish have a natural resistance to hexamita - a parasite that discus are prone to.

Other than that - it's just a matter of making sure the discus aren't out competed for food, and trying to get all male angelfish to ensure breeding behavior doesn't occur (even two female angelfish have a chance of pairing up and getting territorial).

All in all - it's more trouble than it's worth.

Better candidate for being kept with discus - and something much more original in my opinion - would be a black arowanna, and a large school of rummynose tetra, possibly even sting rays.

One of the most impressive tanks I've ever seen had 12 adult sized wild heckel discus, a 2 foot black arowana, 100+ rummynose tetra, and a pair of leopoldi sting ray in it. Absolutely stunning, and rightly so at around 5 grand worth of stock!


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## MCKP

Definitely could not do the arowana.....just not my type of fish.... a little too snakelike for me! lol I am trying to decide what to do. I love the Discus and my husband loves Angels... lol we may need two more tanks!!


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## Dutch Dude

> Generally it's given as a flat No, because the Angels are invariably carrying bugs that will end up killing the Discus, even tank bred Angels. Or so I've been told by Discus breeders..


One of the myths around discus. Discus and Angels share their habitat and have the same origin just as Mesonauta. They are also susceptible to the same type of internal parasites. Wild fish contain diferent parasites domesticated and the other way around. Wild fish are used to the illnesses and parasites from their natural habitat and developed immunity to a certain degree. The same for domesticated. Problem is that the illnesses and parasites from the wild are diferent to tank raised situations. The wild fish didn't developed immunity to the illnesses from domesticated situations and the domesticated fish didn't developed immunity to the illnesses from the wild. Often thats the problem in combining wild and domesticated fish. It is total BS that angels would be a source of troubles. Wild discus also contain numerous parasites. Also discus don't get ill over night. If so you probably missed the signs of an upcoming illnesses. Also a myth is that discus are more susceptible to illnesses. In all honesty I never seen a fish heal as fast from injuries as a discus. There are a lot of myths around keeping and breeding discus. To me they are not more dificult as the average SA cichlid but they are much more work becouse of the large and frequent water changes (to keep the water clean for the messy discus with poor metabolism).

From what I have reed and been told is that the temperament of angels and discus don't fit to well. Dough I read some people who kept both successfully in large tanks (150+). In a tank that size I rather would chose real geophagus as tank mates like the Geophagus pindare (small specie) Those are much more peaceful as angels. I keep a single 5 inch young discus temporarily with a group of 6 Guianacara without problems for over 6 weeks now. A single discus is the poorest situation imaginable but he/ she hold her selves well. Imo a recommendation of stingrays, arowana (both require huge tanks with large footprint) is IMO very poor and bad advice. Discus should be kept with *peaceful tankmates *and not with predatory larger fish.

Angels and Discus could share the same water but you need to keep the water clean and at good qualety all the time. If you want both, angels and discus you could divide the tank with egg crate or something similar but better would be a species only tank. So one discus tank and one angel tank.


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## gage

they had an arowana with rummynose tetras...?

:lol: :lol: :lol: I wish my arowana would live with rummynose tetras...


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## apistomaster

I began breeding wild Discus over 40 years ago and I have 2 pairs wild Alenquer Discus set up in breeding tanks and one more remains in the 125 gal tank with 10 F1 Mesonauta acora juveniles.

I am also a moderator on the wild Angelfish forum, www.finarama.com.
Very recently, I kept one of my Alenquer Discus pairs with my 8 wild Peruvian Scalares and 6 of them are members of 3 mated pairs. They are large adult Angels and they vigorously defend their spawns from the other Angels. However, after they completed spawning, the pair of wild Discus moved in without significant opposition from the breeding Angel pairs and proceed to eat every Angelfish spawn.
It is possible to keep angels and discus together.
I prefer keeping wild angels with wild discus and have little interest in domestic Angelfish strains.
I and most others with experience with wild Angels and wild Discus treat them with praziquantal, flubendazole and metronidazole in quarantine tanks before we move them to their permanent tanks. Fish which have been quarantined and treated properly will not infect each other with parasites. The Angels and Discus should be similar in age and size before you ever combine them and the tanks used should provide all the fish with plenty of room. 75 gal would be the small end and 125 gal are a good size to use. Bigger is better but the costs begin to become very high for aquariums larger than 125 gals as does all the filters and other necessary accessories.


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## MCKP

This has been very informative!! I am learning a ton and am going to keep doing research.....

Thanks everyone!! And certainly, if anyone has any other info, or personal experiences, please tell me!!


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## Dutch Dude

Hi Larry,

You wrote if proper quarantined and treated for bugs properly wild and domesticated fish don't infect each other with parasites. I happen to know you belive it is imposible to kill all the parasites and illnesses with today medicine. I ame a believer of that as well. So imo there is always a chance they infect each other with an illness / bug they are not used to. Maybe this is also the case between domesticated Asian fish and domesticated US fish for example? Is this putting things in a better perspective?

Larry indeed told me abouth his mix of wild Peruvian Scalares. If I'm right the introduction of the angels stimulated pairing up of the wild discus.

There are a lot of stories on the Internet abouth discus that belong to the myths. I never made the combination of angels and discus (I'm not a fan of angels except for the rare Leopoldi). Dough I know discus become more territorial after pairing up and are very well capable to claim their spot. I also seen in my 3 pairs each pair does have diferent behaviour. Two of my pairs can hold them selves very well and claim their spot while one of the pairs are easier chased and claim a small territory. The pair with tha small territory happen to be poor parents as well. I wonder what will happen if you keep a group of single discus (not paired up) with a group of angels. Would all discus hold them selves well enough or would the angels dominate the smaler or weaker fish? If so this can couse stress on the discus and stress can lead to illnesses (thats the case with all fish and not only discus). I also wonder what will happen if you keep a pair of discus with a lack on territorial behaviour (more likely with domesticated fish) with a pair of agresive angels? In other words,.....is the mix to doom or to succeed on the temperament/character of the discus? This might explain some people succeed in the mix while other rapport lots of issues. Save would be each specie its own tank or separate them with a divider.


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## Gordon C. Snelling

I believe along the same lines as Dutch Dude and Apistomaster. I have 6 leopoldi in with my tank of blues. All has been well with them since I introduced the fish to each other, and I have not seen any signs of aggression from either group. The angels pick at each other but never a move towards the discus. I know I have at least one pair of angels but currently have no clue which fish are the pair. I am considering moving the angels though not for any reasons of incompatibility but to make it easier to monitor any spawning activity.


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## apistomaster

I do believe it is impossible to completely eliminate all parasites from apparently healthy fish.
I also believe healthy fish are quite resistant to parasites and they are a normal fact of fish life.
The risks involved with keeping Angelfish and Discus together are manageable enough for me to not worry greatly over them.

Just use common Cichlid sense.
It is better to combine Angels with Discus while the Angels are younger and smaller than the Discus. Be sure to allow enough room for each to grow to it's adult size and a workable balance can be achieved.

Like Gordon, I prefer combining wild Angelfish with wild Discus but this is more a matter of personal tastes. Domestic Angelfish and Discus may be kept together, too.

The most likely source of problems comes when they reach maturity and begin pairing off.
But this is true of Discus only and Angelfish only groups as well.


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## M0oN

gage said:


> they had an arowana with rummynose tetras...?
> 
> :lol: :lol: :lol: I wish my arowana would live with rummynose tetras...


If you keep a really large school of tetra in with larger fish such as arowanna they don't pay them any attention. It's pretty cool. 

Though blacks are known for being a lot more peaceful than others. I don't know how well it would work with jardini...


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## DeadFishFloating

> I don't know how well it would work with jardini...


Ooooohhh an Aussie feesh makes an appearance. Interesting how Saratoga jardini and Saratoga leichardti are related to South Americas Arowana, yet we don't have any cichlids in our water ways. It's one of those mysteries how relatives of one species, three from South America, one from Africa, four from Asia, and two from Australia, can be found around the world. How old must this family be to be this wide spread.


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## apistomaster

Compared to the Arowanas, the Cichlids arose much later in geological time from a marine ancestor in common with Damselfish. With a very few exceptions, the Chromides, all Cichlids are found only in Africa and the Americas. The Chromides retained an affinity with the marine environment which allowed them to extend the range of Cichlids to the Indian subcontinent.
There are only 3 or 4 Chromide species.


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