# Feedback on hardscape



## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Hi,

I am totally new to trying to do aquascaping. In the past, I would just put a bunch of rocks and some plants in my tanks and call it a day. With my new 120G tank, I have decided to try my hand on trying to do something pleasing that would provide my intended stocking list (Angelfish, Geophagus Tapajo and Apistos) what they need. Getting materials at my LFS has been a really challenge as nobody seems to have much of anything, but I did manage to score some nice driftwood. Rocks have been a real struggle to get, hence why there is not a whole lot in the tank right now, as I am working on trying to source some. If I can source smaller similar rocks as what I have in there already, my plan is to build a few rock piles with caves on the left hand side of the tank, by integrating them with the existing rocks. The sand will also be slopped toward the back.

Any way, I thought I would ask for your feedback on what I have managed to put together so far. Plant-wise, the driftwood will have some java moss, java fern, anubias and christmas moss with some stem plants in the background. 

Oh and ignore the tags on the pieces of driftwood as I am not 100% sure I will keep them, as I am looking at other options.

Thoughts?
























Thanks a lot,
B.


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## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

Oh yeah!
That's looking pretty good. 
You've done some really nice work there! I do have some recommendations for you,
Have you looked into getting any of this stuff?








_Mountain Lace Rock_
Sometimes utilized in the aquarium by the salt water reef enthusiast folks. They use pretty good-sized chunks of it as base rock to build up structure and size to site their live rock pieces. I've found that Mountain Lace Rock works great in freshwater applications,

As big as those pieces can get, they are pretty narrow in cross-section and sometimes actually hollowed out. This means that they can be substantially lighter in actual weight than comparably sized landscaping rock (boulders?).
Rough surface texture on these things makes for an ideal surface to attach non-substrate rooting plants such as Java Moss, Anubias, Java Ferns, etc....
Mountain Lace will sort of 'lock down' onto each other in a stack or pile. These things WILL NOT slip or adjust position on you once they are emplaced in the aquarium.
-
Once you get your wood pieces set up into their desired locations and positions.... It is very helpful to get some long stainless screws and just fasten those things down onto each other. Stability!
-
Get just a bit more rock - MORE! - to site in the back area of the tank. This will build-in just a bit more rocky structure and mask out those pots for your potted plants. You'll have this thing down pat!


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Auballagh said:


> Oh yeah!
> That's looking pretty good.
> You've done some really nice work there! I do have some recommendations for you,
> Have you looked into getting any of this stuff?
> ...


Thanks for the feedback. I agree with more rocks. Right now, my issue is sourcing them as nobody seems to have anything I want in stock. Because of that, I am looking at online retailer in the US that would ship to Canada, but it is costing an arm and leg to do so. I have looked at mountain lace rocks, but have never been able to source any locally. Even the rocks, I currently have, I am not sure what they are. The one in the foreground was described to me as zebra rock by the LFS, but it was their last piece. And the other one was just called bulk rock, although, I think it is some sort of seiryu stone, hence why I am trying to source more of that and I like the darker color against the white sand.

I will look into the mountain lace and see if I can find some within Canadian retailers.

Good idea on the screws, although the wood structure right now is pretty sturdy as I have tried to move it and it doesn't really budge.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Try checking with a landscape supplier or business that sells rocks and stones, not sure what they are called in Canada.


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Deeda said:


> Try checking with a landscape supplier or business that sells rocks and stones, not sure what they are called in Canada.


Thanks a lot for the suggestion @Deeda . I thought about it as well, as have toured all the landscaping and garden centers around Calgary to no avail. All everybody has are massive rocks/stones and most of them are ferrous or limestone based, so definite no go. The only stones I am found in smaller size are river stones, but I am looking for something a little fancier.


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Alright, this has been a long time coming, BUT the tank is finally set up!!!!! I finally managed to get my hands on some rocks a couple of weeks ago and got the plants earlier this week. Today, I have set up the 2 filters and primed them with filter media from another tank to hopefully speed up the cycling of this one. Here it is!!!!! Thoughts on how I can improve on it?








Once the cycle is done, the plan is to start with some congo tetras, then angelfish, then apistos and then some geos. I can't wait to get the fish.


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## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

Wow!
The aquarium came out amazing! It looks a little young now, but I can definitely see the 'bones' in that set up for a really killer aquascape. Beautiful work! 
-
On another note - BE CAREFUL in your staged stocking events with the new fish. The illness section of the Forum is getting a little crazy these days with folks unintentionally bringing in nasty things to their community tanks. So, if you are going to build the tank up one species at a time (go most peaceful first - that's good!), then you really do need to look into the purchase and setup of a quarantine tank. Something that is a minimum of 10 gallons in size will work fine. Get new ones in, and then keep an eye on 'em for a month. If nothing? All clear! Add those to the tank, get more fish in quarantine - rinse - repeat.
And yes, SLOW can be fast in this hobby. 'Cause if you don't have time to do it right the first time?
It always seems like you have the time to do it over again.... (Or treat sick fish).
Don't be - THAT GUY!


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Auballagh said:


> Wow!
> The aquarium came out amazing! It looks a little young now, but I can definitely see the 'bones' in that set up for a really killer aquascape. Beautiful work!
> -
> On another note - BE CAREFUL in your staged stocking events with the new fish. The illness section of the Forum is getting a little crazy these days with folks unintentionally bringing in nasty things to their community tanks. So, if you are going to build the tank up one species at a time (go most peaceful first - that's good!), then you really do need to look into the purchase and setup of a quarantine tank. Something that is a minimum of 10 gallons in size will work fine. Get new ones in, and then keep an eye on 'em for a month. If nothing? All clear! Add those to the tank, get more fish in quarantine - rinse - repeat.
> ...


I agree with you on the tank being a little "bony". Hopefully the plants grow nicely and fill things up pretty good. It was hard figuring out the balance between spending $$$ on plants and having the tank look great from day 1 vs not spending much money and having the tank be super boney. 

Totally agree on the quarantine tank. Better be safe than sorry, right?


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## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

"Bony"?
Yer killing me here... THAT girl (your aquarium!) has got 'good bones'! Just like a super-model, y'know? When young, they gotta grow into all that wonderful symmetry & bone structure to be, well, super models right?!!.
So, okay... since we're talking about super models and all. I DO have a few 'squiggles' I can recommend for your aquascape. And yes, the tank is really IS, that good. So, you can choose to follow - or discard, (IMO the tank really is THAT good), at your discretion.
So....

There is an abrupt demarcation between your rocks and the sand. This is something in riverine settings that just does NOT occur. To fix, set/sprinkle some smaller stones (pea and pebbles) around the base of the larger stones. Doing that will make it look like the river current sort of 'washed' the stones into aggregate buildup areas.
NOT feeling that stick-on thermometer placed on the front glass. Take the side, man!
The PFS is REALLY uniform in color. Bright! That is something found in an African Rift Lake - NOT in the riverine biotope. Nope. To fix, get some very small, natural colored aquarium gravel and just sprinkle/mix that stuff in throughout the PFS. That non-linear/uniform look is EXACTLY the look of a sandy bottom found in just about any river throughout the world!
And.... OMG - are those rocks, ON TOP of the bogwood in the back, right part of the picture?!!! Oh no.... bogwood pieces can totally emerge from those rocks. NEVER will bogwood have rocks just sitting on top of it.
-
So yes.....
_AHEM_
Just so your head doesn't get TOO swollen out by all of that aquascaping praise earlier, yo'.


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Auballagh said:


> "Bony"?
> Yer killing me here... THAT girl (your aquarium!) has got 'good bones'! Just like a super-model, y'know? When young, they gotta grow into all that wonderful symmetry & bone structure to be, well, super models right?!!.
> So, okay... since we're talking about super models and all. I DO have a few 'squiggles' I can recommend for your aquascape. And yes, the tank is really IS, that good. So, you can choose to follow - or discard, (IMO the tank really is THAT good), at your discretion.
> So....
> ...


What I meant by bony is that right now the tank needs to put on some meat, ie the plants need to start growing and propagating. For instance, the moss on the bogwood needs to start spreading. Once that happens, I hope it will look half-decent. 

Regarding your recommendations, here are my thoughts:

 I was looking at that abrupt demarcation and felt something was missing, so I am glad you were able to articulate that. Do you think the type of pebbles matters? The reason for my question is that, locally, it is a real struggle to find any kind of hardscape. I know one LFS carries some Marina decorative pebbles and they have either "beach" or "black" pebbles. I am thinking that black would look nice against the white sand and carries the colour of the stone as well.
I know about the thermometer and it bugs me too, but I don't really have a choice as the left side of the tank is painted and I am afraid that the reading on the thermometer will be off because of the thickness of the paint. I have a thermometer on the other side of the tank, but I wanted 2 thermometers to ensure proper temperature across the whole tank. In the end, I might remove the one of the front glass. 
Funny you should mention that as I have a bag of coloured sand, that I was planning on putting in the tank, but I am afraid that the grain will be to big/coarse for the Geo's, so I might need to buy a different kind.
Unfortunately, the rocks have to stay as they are my step-daughter's contribution to the tank and it will be a riot in the house if I remove them, hence why I put some plants on them. 🤣🤣🤣 
Thank you for the suggestions. I can't wait for the plants to spread and gain some volume. Now I just need to be patient with the cycling of the tank and get the quarantine tank set up as well.


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Auballagh said:


> "Bony"?
> Yer killing me here... THAT girl (your aquarium!) has got 'good bones'! Just like a super-model, y'know? When young, they gotta grow into all that wonderful symmetry & bone structure to be, well, super models right?!!.
> So, okay... since we're talking about super models and all. I DO have a few 'squiggles' I can recommend for your aquascape. And yes, the tank is really IS, that good. So, you can choose to follow - or discard, (IMO the tank really is THAT good), at your discretion.
> So....
> ...


This is the spare sand that I have. Do you think it is fine enough for the Geo's? I am also thinking of maybe going with something a little darker as it is in the same tone as the PFS. Thoughts?


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## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

Darker!!!
That sand looks like almost a perfect match with the bright color of your PFS. You want just a little color contrast to look more natural and provide some texture to the substrate. And yes, if the grains of that sand are anywhere from 2 to 3 times larger than the size of the PFS? It will mix in great with the PFS, and work just fine with your Earth Eaters.


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Auballagh said:


> Darker!!!
> That sand looks like almost a perfect match with the bright color of your PFS. You want just a little color contrast to look more natural and provide some texture to the substrate. And yes, if the grains of that sand are anywhere from 2 to 3 times larger than the size of the PFS? It will mix in great with the PFS, and work just fine with your Earth Eaters.


Awesome. Thank you!!!


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## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

Oh, and those Earth Eaters you are counting on? Ummm.... don't get too upset if they wind up digging out all of those substrate plants you have placed in the PFS of that nicely set up tank.
Earth Eater Cichlids can be VERY hard on substrate sited plants in the aquarium.


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Auballagh said:


> Oh, and those Earth Eaters you are counting on? Ummm.... don't get too upset if they wind up digging out all of those substrate plants you have placed in the PFS of that nicely set up tank.
> Earth Eater Cichlids can be VERY hard on substrate sited plants in the aquarium.


I probably won't get them in the tank for another 3-4 months, between quarantining them and getting all the other fish, so hopefully, the substrate plants have time to establish strong roots that will be able to resist those Geo's. If not, oh well, it will be what it will be.


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## Aussieman57 (Dec 18, 2021)

You can get rocks from a landscaping supply place. Worrying about "ferrous rocks" is a bunch of nonsense; that will not be a problem. Don't know if you have stores similar to Lowes/Home Depot in your area but they sell rock. Some really good rock on the cheap is the Mexican Beach Rock they sell by the bag. Big bag of nice rocks for @$14 that look a lot more natural than what you have in there. Don't let the pet shops tell you you have to buy tank safe rock from them and go broke, Here's a good read.





Rocks in the Aquarium


All rocks found in a rock yard, stream,backyard or woods are perfectly safe in the aquarium with NO treatment.




aquariumscience.org




Also...




__





Aquarium Wood


What wood can I use in an Aquarium?




aquariumscience.org




I've always sourced my own rocks; not going to pay $50 bucks for 2 rocks that's just foolish. You can also source your own driftwood. And do not boil driftwood as some suggest it just speeds up the decomposition process.


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## dbblackdiamond (Sep 30, 2021)

Aussieman57 said:


> You can get rocks from a landscaping supply place. Worrying about "ferrous rocks" is a bunch of nonsense; that will not be a problem. Don't know if you have stores similar to Lowes/Home Depot in your area but they sell rock. Some really good rock on the cheap is the Mexican Beach Rock they sell by the bag. Big bag of nice rocks for @$14 that look a lot more natural than what you have in there. Don't let the pet shops tell you you have to buy tank safe rock from them and go broke, Here's a good read.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


While I appreciate the feedback and the suggestion, as I have mentioned previously, before resorting to buying the rocks from the US, I went through most of the garden centers and home improvement stores, such as Lowe's and Home Depot, to see if they had rocks and the answer was "no they don't". If I could have sourced them locally, I would have saved myself a few bucks and weeks of waiting, so you can believe me that I would have, but unfortunately, it wasn't an option, so good for you for always being able to source your own rocks, but some of us just can't, especially when most of the rocks around us are limestone based. 

As for the driftwood, 99.99% of the trees around here are conifers which can't be used in fish tank, so again, not everyone is able to walk down the beach and get a nice piece of driftwood. Some of us have to contend with different circumstances, which are forcing us to either source our wood from specific places.


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## Aussieman57 (Dec 18, 2021)

I used to spend some time flyfishing rivers/streams in Canada. There are rocks outside every where that are suitable for aquascaping. Most of my rockwork I collect on my own. Just trying to save you some money.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

In some areas there are regulations about taking rocks from public areas. I had luck with mason suppliers (definitely not Lowes/Home Depot or "regular" garden centers. The kind of place your masonry contractor would go to obtain rock for a fireplace or rock wall. A place like this: Stone | Morris Brick & Stone | Morristown, NJ


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