# the eggs have all gone white?



## karatejo (Apr 10, 2003)

Hi so I had two females spawn over wknd with Big Male. This time I'm sure I do have a Male he was doing a lot of fanning and circling whilst female following and vice verca. 1st spwan Female didn't hold after 3 days I noticed the eggs were gone and the male had still been harresing her gently so maybe reason for dropping. 2nd Female spawned last night so I decided to Strip this morning and boy was I nervous!!! I managed to net her without to much stress and wearing a new pair of rubber gloves managed to strip 30 big yellow eggs into a little hatchery I've just set up. I've got em moving gently in there in a make shift tumbler. Now qeustion is...this is my 1st time! Are they fertile. The colour is yellow? And they look a bit like little potatoes with another bit sticking out of the side? Almost like a cirle withn a circle? That's best I can describe. I just hope the male did his job. Well soon know in around 30 days. My 1st ever bacth so fingers xd!

Please comment would be appreciated.

Cheers


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## karatejo (Apr 10, 2003)

I've been tumbling some eggs gently since monday. They were all yellow a sort of potoatoe colour. Now theve all gone white? Is thta bad news?


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## Charles (Feb 25, 2003)

how many days? Usually, within 5 days, you should see some changes. You will see blood vessal starts to form and spots starting to appear. But usually when they turn white, means they are usually not fertiled.


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## Charles (Feb 25, 2003)

I merged your topic and I hope you don't mind.

Can you show a photo?


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## karatejo (Apr 10, 2003)

Thanks Charles they are now on day 6 and to be honest I don't think that they are fertile unless I did soemthing wrong when I moved them all. The water has also gone a tad yellow and smelly.
Its a shame. Its possible the Male just didn't fertilze this time...but he was showing a lot of interest in both females which are arond 2 years old and are about 4 to 5 inch. I have 11 Fronts in a 150Gal.
The Male I've got is less than a year old but he's huge!!! He's already at 5inch and has a large hump already. I wish someone would post a thread on how to post pics straight into post cas I have no idea how to do this? Is it possible that although he's showing interest the male is just not mature enough albiet that the females are actually laying eggs tho.


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## karatejo (Apr 10, 2003)

I should say I have the eggs in a seperate little tank I just set up on monday. I used water straight out of the Frontosas own 150gal tank put a heater and airstone in there. I gently removed the female and she dropped all 30 eggs straight from the mouth straight into the tumbler net. They are moving around v gently in there. The water has remained a steady 27c 80F. But the eggs are all white on day 6 and bad smell in water also cloudy and a tad yellow. Shame


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## Charles (Feb 25, 2003)

next time, you should get a tumbler ready and tumble the eggs in the main tank.


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## karatejo (Apr 10, 2003)

Why did I do something wrong do you think?


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## Razzo (Oct 17, 2007)

karatejo said:


> ...2nd Female spawned last night so I decided to Strip this morning...


That is way to soon to strip. Ideally, you should wait till about day four or five. If they are swallowing them before that, the eggs probably have not been fertilized.

White eggs are dead eggs. Fertilized eggs will be a light tan-ish (light creamy brown) color and they will develope a vein (which is a very good sign).

Sorry. Better luck next time mate.


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## karatejo (Apr 10, 2003)

Thanks for the comments Razo. Why do you say this is too soon? At what stage does the male fertilize? I have heard people say on posts that they strip on day one to prevent swallowing? Whts the reason for leaving that long?

Cheers


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## Razzo (Oct 17, 2007)

karatejo said:


> Why do you say this is too soon?


On several Frontosa sites, of all the experienced (successful) people that I respect, not one of them strips at day 1. Actually, I don't know anybody that strips on day 1. Before day four or five, usually, with fertilized eggs, the earlier you strip, the more eggs you will lose. I would suspect, if your females are swallowing after day 1 that your eggs have not been fertilized..

I don't know why, but those ealry days are very important days to be tumbled by the mom. Perhaps somebody else could offer a more scientific explanation.

If your females consistently swallow at 24 to 48 hours - I think you may have some fertilization issues. In a fertilzed batch, you might be able to get a few viable eggs after 48 hours but you will most likely have a hard time and will lose most eggs. Best of luck to you though - I hope you prove me wrong.

Take Care,
Russ


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## karatejo (Apr 10, 2003)

Thanks Razzo I can't remember who it was who said do strip day 1 but they defo said it. I thnk the idea being that you'd get more eggs out the female cas if you stripped that early shed have another try day after before she lost the tube.

The longest I've had a female hold is 6 days so in future I will take your advice and strip on day 4. Why do they take so long tho too produce eggs the last time my females laid was just before xmas. Shame.

I have no idea how to post pics straight onto post wish I knew how?

Thanks


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

Razzo said:


> Actually, I don't know anybody that strips on day 1. Before day four or five, usually, with fertilized eggs, the earlier you strip, the more eggs you will lose. ..


 well, now you do. i have two specific moba females that i strip at day one consistently. why? if her and the male are still with dropped vent, they continue to spawn, even after being stripped, and the egg count from either of these girls doubles easily. 
i would speculate, that those who feel they get better results if allowing the female to hold longer, have simply missed HER culling of the lot during those first days. IMO.


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## Razzo (Oct 17, 2007)

lloyd said:


> ...well, now you do....


LOL  I knew once I put that statement in print somebody would show up.

Allow me to revize my statement: there is now one person I respect that strips on day 1


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

Razzo said:


> LOL  I knew once I put that statement in print somebody would show up.


 no one is ever safe making definitive statements on a forum... :lol:


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## Charles (Feb 25, 2003)

I actually took out the eggs on day 1 as well. My old group of kitumba is very bad at holding so after 1 year of trying to let them hold, I strip on day 1 every time.

I merge the topic cause it is basically the same topic thread.


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