# ID issues German Red, Ruby Red or Rubenscens



## fishboxjunkie (May 31, 2013)

I have bred German reds for years an I'm trying to figure out if my new fish are what they told me they where when I bought them. :-?

1)Ruby red 









2)Ruby red









3)German red









4)German red









5)Was bought as a German red but i think its a ruby red









Please post what you think they are they just are so confusing everyone has their on version of a red peacock :fish:


----------



## brinkles (Jan 30, 2011)

I just read this article because of a response to my post suggested I might have a german red:
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/red_peacocks.php


----------



## noki (Jun 13, 2003)

You make a big assumption that people have kept these bloodlines separate and pure. Maybe some breeders have, but I doubt most are. Also, it seems like some believe that the name "Rubenscens" is just a german for "German Red". The name "Ruby Red" seems just like another way to say "Rubenscens". I'm not sure how many people actually know what their fish came from...

It used to be that a "German Red" was more of a darker fish with blue on the body. I read once that they may have been a line bred A. korneliae once, or had that in it. I've seen some look like a redder "Red Shoulder".
I've read that a "Rubenscens" was more of a "stuartgranti maleri" line bred. But there are more than one "Maleri" type. The "sunshine" Chipokae has more orange and has some blue on the body while the Maleri Island has more of an all yellow body, maybe similar to the last picture you posted. Personally, I doubt there are many pure lines out there, whatever they are.

I would have thought that the first fish was more like a "German Red". I don't think the names have much meaning any more.


----------



## fishboxjunkie (May 31, 2013)

noki said:


> You make a big assumption that people have kept these bloodlines separate and pure. Maybe some breeders have, but I doubt most are. Also, it seems like some believe that the name "Rubenscens" is just a german for "German Red". The name "Ruby Red" seems just like another way to say "Rubenscens". I'm not sure how many people actually know what their fish came from...
> 
> It used to be that a "German Red" was more of a darker fish with blue on the body. I read once that they may have been a line bred A. korneliae once, or had that in it. I've seen some look like a redder "Red Shoulder".
> I've read that a "Rubenscens" was more of a "stuartgranti maleri" line bred. But there are more than one "Maleri" type. The "sunshine" Chipokae has more orange and has some blue on the body while the Maleri Island has more of an all yellow body, maybe similar to the last picture you posted. Personally, I doubt there are many pure lines out there, whatever they are.
> ...


It is very all confusing really this is what people have told me German reds are more orange in color and have no blue in the body. They have all blue heads that are solid blue. Rubenscens are more red and have blue horizontal lines down the body that line up. Ruby reds do not have a all blue head are kinda in the middle of both I think. Like you say I guess it's whatever you want to call them. The German reds I have in the pictures that are orange I do not own anymore I'm trying to get away from German reds.


----------



## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

If they don't come from a known line, with a known label, they are simply red peacocks. I wouldn't get too worked up about which they are, as they are a non-natural ornamental fish anyway. Most of them have been mixed, so I'm not certain there is anything "pure" anymore anyway.

This was an explanation from Ken Armke, from 1997, who got his hands on some of the early imports.

_As the newest peacock color variety finds its way from Germany to the U.S., it's not surprising that A. sp. "Rubescens" is wrapped in some controversy.
In a recent issue of an American Cichlid Association publication, there is a view expressed that all of the "Red" peacock color morphs being developed in Germany are really the same fish being offered under different names.
I don't agree with this thinking. 
I phoned and explained to the writer, who admittedly does not keep the fish, that our aquaria housed "German Red Peacocks", "Rubescens Peacocks" and "Eureka Red Peacocks"-all of which share a German origin-and that these fish decidedly, emphatically are not the same peacocks in terms of looks.
To be brief:
Auloncara sp. "Rubescens" exhibits a bright orange coloration through the body and fins which contrasts with a small amount of blue on the head. Females have a distinct orange outline across the dorsal fin. In my experience, it is much more peaceful than the average peacock. From a color standpoint, it is my favorite peacock.
Auloncara sp. "German Red" differs from "Rubescens" in that it has many more blue striations in the head, body and fins-enough blue all over that the impression is of a red-orange and blue fish. We have kept groups of "German Reds" from several different sources, including one group which was direct from Germany.
Auloncara sp. "Eureka Red" has a longer body and more sloped head and, moreover, has an entirely different pattern of reds and blues than either of the previous two fish. It is also much more aggressive-no doubt because of its probable origin as a jackobfreibergi.
The "Rubescens" and "German Red", according to knowledgeable worldwide sources, derive from another peacock species. The original sources say the "Rubescens" was developed from A. baenschi (Maleri Island) and the "German Red" from A. baenschi (Chipoka). Until someone convinces me differently, I'll accept this information. The color patterns fit the original fish quite well.
It's important to note in this discussion that the "Red" peacocks from Germany do not appear to be the products of hybridization. Instead, they are produced by line-breeding special morphs of a species-the same type of development which originally produced albino corydoras, fantail guppies, lyretail mollies, etc.
(Note: The "Rubescens" is sometimes called "Ruby Red Peacock" in an attempt to Americanize the German name.)_


----------



## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

You said it yourself ....


----------



## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

You said it yourself...................everyone has their own version of a red peacock :fish:
Not confusing at all if you reolise the names are just made up.

Now going to be a UK observer. US Rubisens seem to have gone backwards towards wild type.
The Germans and Dutch seem to be breeding em with ever more colour and longer fins.


But yep me, I never swallowed the idea that they were pure anything.
Would kind of need to see some evidence to believe that.
May come, DNA stuff getting easier and cheaper to use.

Funnyest thing some UK breeders are now claiming Dragons blood are pure line bred. :lol:

All the best James


----------



## noki (Jun 13, 2003)

Well the picture above is an above average fish in a over saturated picture.

If it was easy to have fixed "pure"strains with consistent fish, and do this on a commercial level... they would do this already. 
Most standards are more along the line of what will sell better, not what is a "pure" line.

The Asian breeders seem to have completely different standards towards ornamental fish, as in "natural" is the LEAST desirable. The Flowerhorn people problem think this discussion is uteerly bizarre.


----------



## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

I kinda like the blatant lie of a fiddled about photo. Kind of goes with a fiddled about cichlid. :wink:


----------



## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Sadly yep the love has gone. Its all about market these days. What will sell. Kind of why they try and pass n hybrids then line bred as simply line bred. Sells better in some places were some try to care about such things.
Kind of like it when they call em cichlid cultivars, kind of implies hybrid and line breeding and colour feeding and hormoning without actualy saying it. :wink:
To be honest I see little difference pure or hybrid (or geneticly altered) or fed colour enhancing stuff and hormones) they are clearly man made. None of these things are particularly crule just kind of unpleasant to see the results. 

All the best James


----------

