# First cichlid - shellie tank



## jlgvusn (Aug 6, 2013)

Greetings from Nashville, Tennessee! I'm Janice and I have gotten much help from the beginner tank setup forum. Special thanks to Dee and Iggy  Now, my tank is setup and cycled, and I think it's time I swam over here. I have a 29 gal tank and plan to have two pairs or harems or whatever of l.multis and n. caudopunctatus. My LFS is getting them for me, but it will be sometime next week  In the meantime, I am continuing to add some ammonia daily to keep the filter cycled and fed.

I've been using Seachem additives, but I am questioning the wisdom in that (other than to use up those BIG bottles). I think it will become an annoyance to me. I'm also familiar with the DIY recipe in the Library, but, again, I've got those big bottle of Seachem additives. My tap water is pH 7.4-7.6; gh 6-7; kh 3-4; no nitrates.

Is it possible to have success --fish that are healthy, active, live long lives, have good coloration, and maybe even spawn-- with Lake T shell & rock dwellers without doctoring my tap water?

I welcome all thoughts, opinions, wisdom, and suggestions. Thanks so much!


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Your tap water is fine except for chlorine. The caudopunctatus would like to have some more rocks. The mulitpunctatus shells should be piled up 2 or more deep and each fish would like a dozen shells. Given that you want to pile the shells I'd leave 6" of bare sand between the shells and the rocks.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

+1

Pile your shells and create a rocky enclave for the punks.


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## jlgvusn (Aug 6, 2013)

Greetings, everyone! I decided to forget about adding any other cichlids; just stick with the multis. So, after weeks... no, MONTHS... of preparing and waiting, and working with suggestions from helpful forum members, I finally got my multis about 4 weeks ago. Currently, there are 12 juveniles in my 29 gal, and have no idea what gender any of them are. (Some are visible in the pic, if you zoom in.) There is occasional flashing, that appears to be about dominance. I spend hours watching them and really, really wish they were in a different location.

Here's what I am wondering about, and don't hesitate to tell me I'm in the wrong forum, if that's the case ;-)

Before I got them, I took the sand substrate down to 1 - 1.25 inch as was suggested. I think that shows in an earlier pic I posted. (It was 2-3 inches deep.) As you can see in the pic, the shellies have created all kinds of bunkers that are deep. With great trepidation, I have used the handle of an algae scrubber to gently aerate the dark areas. (You can see one has already begun to form.)

How do I deal with this? :-? Is it mean and disruptive to the shellies to stir things up and destroy their bunkers? I'm afraid I'll accidentally bury some little fishie who's hiding in his/or shell.

The 2-4 shellies who have taken up residence on the right side of the tank don't seem to be unhappy, but there aren't any shells on that side. Should I move some of the shells that don't appear to be used over to that side?

Sizeable areas of the two back corners have been taken all the way down to the glass. Left with shells; right no shells. I guess that normal and ok?

Am doing ≥ 30% water changes about every 5 days. The Fluval C4 filter output really blows their food around, but I guess they're all getting some.

Some will eventually be transferred to a 10 -12 gallon setup. How will I know which ones? And how many could I relocate?

Thanks in advance for your help and answers & suggestions to my many questions. These fish were $$$ and I want to take good care of them.

Janice


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## NJmomie (Jan 17, 2013)

At a quick glance, I will immediately suggest more shells. I have about the Same number of shells in my 12-gallon multi tank. As for when or who to remove, just keep an eye in interaction and you will mostly figure that out once they pair off. I would think in your 29 gallon, you can get away with two or three males.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

Agreed- you need many more shells. 5 per fish is not too many, and pile them in 2-3 locations in the tank. Next, don't worry about keeping the sand aerated. Your little bulldozers will keep the sand clean enough for their purposes. It does seem that you could take out some more sand, but it really isn't necessary. Once you have defined shell areas and non shell areas, use your fingers to agitate the sand in non-shell areas during water changes.

You could conceivably keep all the multies in there, but chances are a few males will be rejected. If you wanted to start a colony in the other tank, grab one of your three shell beds after they're established and you should get a m/f mix.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

NJmomie said:


> At a quick glance, I will immediately suggest more shells.


Agree. Multies like a dozen shells per fish and piled all together in two layers.


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## jlgvusn (Aug 6, 2013)

I've pulled out the "building" with the (dumb idea) artificial plant. Only rocks. Added a dozen shells, though I am pretty sure you can't tell anymore ;-) Got rid of the ugly glass heater; not only was it ugly it turned itself off about 2-3 weeks ago. I nearly had a stroke when I decided to do an early water change... put my hand in the water and found it cold (compared to 81 degrees). Nary a multi in sight and I almost cried. We got thru it and all are alive and well.

Now I am again thinking about making some changes AND I have questions about pairing. I think the two topics are interrelated. 
1.The 4 multis along the left side enjoy the heater and there is little aggression; basically happy family though I am too much of a novice to shellies to determine this. 
2. There are 3 multis along the front glass. The multi in the left front doesn't seem to be sure where s/he belongs, with the front row or with the left side family. The center and right-sided multis either avoid each other, spar including liplocks w/o obvious damage (the others gather to watch), or buddy up a bit. The one on the right flashes his/her white belly often, not just to this multi.
3. There are 2 multis in the right front corner; fairly independent of each other, no antagonism that I witnessed. The one who frequents the shells & triangular rock formation tends to shoo away the other one. (Though s/he will sometimes allow the one along the front glass closest to his/her territory visit for a moment.)
4. The remaining 2 have territories along the back wall from center to right. They are all pretty independent and they, too, will sometimes shoo away visitors or sometimes allow others to check 'em out.

We can't be sure of their age. I'd think they'd have to have been at least a month or more old when shipped on 10/23, and they were all an inch long, I think. When are they considered mature? I can't seem to find info about pairing behavior at all. All I seem to find is that two fish will either share his or her shell(s) and then, if all goes well, tiny specks appear. I've not seen any shells guarded that zealously, either.

So, back to the interrelated thing.... Because of temperament and territory as I've described, I'm thinking about messing with the aquascape. If I did, and recognizing that all 12 must stay in that tank for a while, what would you recommend? The second thing I'm thinking about is moving them to a new, empty 55 gallon 48" tank. That would be a major undertaking at this season. Could I half-fill it, transfer EVERYTHING from the existing tank, add a little more sand/rocks, and still have a CYCLED tank? Then, later, could I fill it up, and maybe add a rock dweller cichlid and paracyps?

Thanks so much!
The tank overall: 

The heated beach lovers: 

The Liplocker:


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

WOW, they sure are doing a job on rearranging the tank but I knew they would. I would still be comfortable removing more sand and adding more shells. Small rock piles will help define the different fish groupings but you are kind of limited in a 29G tank.

I really hate disrupting my multie and my similis tank sand beds because I feel bad for the fish having to re-landscape to suit their preferences. I usually just siphon out some of the sand piles during a water change and pour off the water through a strainer in case I've sucked up any fry. The excess sand usually just goes into another tank or cleaned and dried for later tank setups.

What filter(s) are you using on this tank?

You could set up the new 55G tank with similar substrate, any additional rock work and more shells :thumb: , add 1/4 tank of conditioned water, add heater and bring to temperature. You could then transfer all the multies and their shells, including substrate to the new tank and then fill the tank full with conditioned water. Add the filter from the old tank and any new filter. It shouldn't pose a problem with cycling since the existing substrate and filter should have enough beneficial bacteria.

I like to move any shellies that hide in their shells into a tote or plastic shoe box filled with enough tank water to keep the shells submerged and transport them to the new tank. It's tedious but I feel better about. I then lower the water in the original tank to 1/4 depth full and net out any remaining fish. I've discovered that most shellies are quite adept at jumping out of a 15" tall tank, even with 3" of water in it while you are trying to net them.


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## jlgvusn (Aug 6, 2013)

Thanks for the tips and comments, Dee. The current tank has the sponge filter (pre-filter) on the intake of a Fluval C4. If I go with the 55, I have options for add'l filters. I've got 2 Penguin 330s (used). I also have a new Fluval 205 canister that's been hanging around here for 5 years ;-) Relocating all of the multis is gonna take some thinking: I can "see" the entire colony in that 55 gallon tank... the same tank I envisioned five or six angelfish enjoying! If I decide to move the multis into the 55, which of my existing filter options would you suggest?


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