# 36 inch tanks Vs. 48 inch tanks...



## Andras (Jul 17, 2010)

I just stocked a 40 gallon breeder earlier this week and throughout my researching cichlids I've continuosly read that many people say not to use a 36" tank, but that somthing like a 48" 55 gallon is almost like the standard starting point to be allowed to have a variety of fishes. Anything less and you should only have one species. Does the shorter length not give enough room to swim? I've read that the footprint itself is more important than the total gallons for territory establishment, but doesn't the 40 breeder (36"x18")actually have a larger footprint than the 55 gallon(48 1/4"x12 3/4"). My math could be wrong but I come up with 648" of floor space with the 40, and 615" with the 55. So why so down on the 40 breeder? Is it water quality issues...which would actually make the total water volume matter more than what I've read? Or have people just seen bad aggression in a 36" tank and alleviated it with a 48" tank? I question not out of spite but out of curiousity and of the fact that I just see, "because a 55 or larger should be the minimum" type of answers and I'd like to know what I should actually be looking out for with my 40 breeder which is the tank I will be using as my main tank for a long while.


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

footprint matters more than gallons, but length is the most important factor, longer is always better, long and wide is the best, a 24x24 tank has the same footprint as a 48x12, but can you see how a 24x24 could cause issues?

i think a 40 breeder is great, for single species that stays 4 inches or less, i'd always suggest a 55 over a 40 breeder, and a 75 over a 55

length first, then width, not total area

the best explanation of why i can give is that is that fish aren't going to split territory front to back with only 9 inches of space each, they are more likely to split the length of the tank


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## Godsten (Jun 24, 2010)

I have been thinking the same thing thing since I am currently cycling a 40 gallon breeder tank as well. I was thinking along the lines of area for fish to swim. The cookie cutter setups say it is comfortable for fish who get to 6" or 7" of length to be housed in a 48" aquarium or 7 to 8 times the length of a full grown fish. By the same math a 4" fish in a 36" aquarium has 8 times it's full grown length for swimming as well, even a 5" fish in a 36" aquarium has a larger ratio of length to swimming length then a 7" fish in a 48" aquarium (but no that much larger). I know it depends on activity level and the particular temperment of the species but I think the emphasis on length is more a focus on a particular fishes available swimming area. Though I have not read much about it in a 40 breeder I plan on 2 different species 4" or so and possibly a 5" male peacock but not sure on that yet. This might be all rambling nonsense because I am not all that experienced it is just my thoughts so far from all I have read. Hopefully more experienced people will weigh in.


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## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

I have a 40 breeder as well with many of Mbuna juveniles... I haven't had any problems thus far.

This guy also has a 3ft tank and all of the fish look fine: http://cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopi ... 55e308da20


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## jrf (Nov 10, 2009)

Agreed with cjacob. Territorially speaking, a longer tank is generally better than a wider tank. As far as how many species you can keep in your 36Ã¢â‚¬Â


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

limpert said:


> I have a 40 breeder as well with many of Mbuna juveniles... I haven't had any problems thus far.
> 
> This guy also has a 3ft tank and all of the fish look fine: http://cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopi ... 55e308da20


that tank had only been set up for about a month, that doesn't mean it works, it takes at least a year to really tell if something is going to work, especially if they are young, he also has a frontosa in a 24inch tank just for a reference on how responsible he is with keeping fish


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

my general rule of thumb is you want a tank length that is about 8 times the length the largest fish will be as an adult, i do make a few exceptions, but not in tanks less than 48x18

the width is good for turning room more than anything else imo, might gain you an inch in fish, but i'd stock a 36x18 the exact same as i'd stock a 36x12 since no fish that can live with the length would need the extra width


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## Rick_Lindsey (Aug 26, 2002)

Andras said:


> I just stocked a 40 gallon breeder earlier this week and throughout my researching cichlids I've continuosly read that many people say not to use a 36" tank, but that somthing like a 48" 55 gallon is almost like the standard starting point to be allowed to have a variety of fishes. Anything less and you should only have one species.


I'm no expert, so don't assume my opinion means anything... but that said...

Personally, I like the 40-breeder and am planning to set one of those up as my next tank instead of a 55 (unless of course I stumble onto a rockin deal on a 75+ on craigslist). The advantage of the longer tank, as I see it, is that it lets fish be 4' apart instead of only 3' apart... that allows their territories to be just a bit further from each other, and maybe make them feel a bit safer or less cranky.

That said, though, I think a growing family of shell-dwelling L. Multifasciatus might prefer an 18"x18" shellbed over one that's only 12" wide. Likewise I can make a much more "interesting" rockpile in a tank that's 18" wide rather than 12" wide for some Julidichromis or Altolamprologous to call home.

In the end I'd probably have one fewer species in a 40br than a 55 (cyprichromis leptosoma would be in that 55 for sure, but probably not in my 40br), but honestly I think the species that are left might be "happier" in the 40br than the 55. I doubt the rockdwellers will covet the shells, and I doubt the shelldwellers will covet the rocks, and the gobies will only covet each other, so life will be good.

-Rick (The armchair aquarist)


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## KaiserSousay (Nov 2, 2008)

*the best explanation of why i can give is that is that fish aren't going to split territory front to back with only 9 inches of space each, they are more likely to split the length of the tank*

:thumb: Could not have said it any better :thumb:

*width is good for turning room more than anything else imo*

Would add, the extra width gives you more room for your rock piles, while still not having your rock up against the glass.


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## SoDakJeep (Mar 21, 2009)

I have a 36in bowfront. Stocked with Yellow Labs and Scolifi (powder blue) about 6 of each and things seem to be going good so far. I change the water once a month or so and all the fish seem happy. Just had my 1st batch of fry spit this week and they are doing good. I would say 2 species in a 36in tank is a good combo. tank has been established for about a year or so now.


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## Andras (Jul 17, 2010)

Yeah I had bought my 40 breeder years ago when I was really big into planted tanks and the extra depth helps out immensely with aquascaping. Plus I don't really like the look of really narrow tanks. I put in trios of maniganos, red zebras, red top hongis, and a single red fin caudopunk. They are all getting along great now, though I'm sure things have the possibilty of going wrong as the tank matures.


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

i would not be surprised when the mainganos finally go nuts and start killing everything because of the lack of space, the zebras might get mean at some point too since they get so big, but I would bet on the mainganos being the ones to want to take over the tank


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## n00pster (May 14, 2010)

cjacob316 said:


> i would not be surprised when the mainganos finally go nuts and start killing everything because of the lack of space, the zebras might get mean at some point too since they get so big, but I would bet on the mainganos being the ones to want to take over the tank


well said Jacob, I am going nuts with mainganos in my 55g.. once in while 2 of them starts fighting to be the king of the tank and I have to take the meaner one out and return him to LFS. Then another one grows bigger and challenges the king maingano.. and again I take the meaner one away and this cycle continues.. I would say stay away from anything with horizontal stripes and save yourself some time and effort.. (Note that it was all fine when they were juvies.. )


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## ahud (Aug 22, 2009)

I'm stocking two 36x18x24 tanks. I will let you know my choices and how they work out. I will be stocking tangs and as a personally preference I always stock light.


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

tangs are different than malawi and the same tank size rules do not apply. you guys should always keep things like than in mind, some tangs can live in a 10 gallon, what malawi cichlid would you ever keep in a 10 gallon?


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## Andras (Jul 17, 2010)

The way I scaped the rocks and the way I planted the tank gives the fish tons of spaces to retreat to so I hope that at least can help alleviate some problems.


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

well see, it doesn't matter how many places they have to retreat to, if it's still in one fish's territory he's going to continue to harass it until it leaves, if you have one or two males claim the entire tank, then there is no where the others can go to get away from them. a male fish isn't just going to lay claim to one little spot or cave in the tank, he's going to take over a good chunk of the tank

take my cynos for example, in my 55, i had two males showing pretty good color, i moved them to the 40breeder, and now only one male shows color, he's the dominant one and the sub dom just can't manage his own territory in the smaller tank. and that's just a little cynotilapia and only a foot less length, plus they shared the 55 with trewavasae


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## Andras (Jul 17, 2010)

Oh I see.


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

I would also add, when comparing the quality of space between a 40 breeder and a 55, that the extra 4 inches in height _can _matter.

I only keep a single species in my 36x12x20, but my rocks are stacked quite high. The extra territory I have created with the height may be why I've peacefully kept three males in a 38 gallon for a year and half (knock on wood).

kevin


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