# Oscar/Salvini/Convict - 75 gal.



## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Tried this once before.
Wasn't working out to my liking, so I split them up.

Guess what?
Now I'm trying it again, and I think it has a decent chance at working.
Think of this as the 'journal thread' for this particular setup...

BV


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## cage623 (Feb 2, 2008)

I would say that this has a chance of working. It will all depend on the individual fish and how large the oscar's mouth gets :lol:. Good luck and keep us posted!


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Thanks, cage.

In a nutshell, my previous convict had a clear size advantage over the salvini.
Convict was easily dominant over the salvini, and he remained fairly vigilant about letting him know it. This in turn created constant friction between him (the convict) and my oscar (who was put in the position of having to constantly 'referee' things).
This time around, I have purposely designed things with the aim of ensuring that the convict starts off at the _bottom_ of the pecking order and stays there. Oscar and salvini are currently together in the tank, whereas the convict (despite what my sig. says) is still in a different tank. All of this should help for establishing and maintaining a more 'natural order' of things (i.e. where the pecking order is oscar--->salvini--->convict).

Aquascaping changes made yesterday should also help...
BV


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

The aquascaping in this tank will play a huge role in whether or not the setup works.

Excuse the cloudiness (pic was taken right after rearranging the tank).








Salvini mostly sticks to the cave on the left side of the tank. He can use the one on the right as well, and the oscar can't get to him there either. Both caves are of sufficient size to allow a full-grown male salvini to occupy them (some excavating may be required on his part, depending on how big he gets).

What I'm envisioning is that the convict (not yet in the tank) will end up with whichever cave the salvini is not occupying.

BV


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## cage623 (Feb 2, 2008)

That looks great. I really like the plant in the middle, is that real or fake? You will have to let us know how all these guys get along. Good luck.


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Plant is fake. Thanks!





That's ^^^ what happened during the introduction! 

I kept a close watch on things after lights-out, and the salvini kept chasing the convict out of one cave and then the other (controlling the whole tank bottom, essentially). Didn't take long for the convict to just give in and start hovering at the top of the tank. He's a bit tattered, to say the least. He has some missing scales---some of which you can see were removed by the oscar during the video. Some tattered fins as well, which is a shame, because he's got such nice flowing finnage.

Question is...
IF/when it hits the fan, which of the two would you remove (oscar stays)? :-?

I have plans to be out of town this weekend, so I need to make a decision before leaving tomorrow afternoon. I'm obviously a fan of both sals and cons, so personal preference is basically moot at this point. Here's the big question (two, really, but they go hand-in-hand):
1) *Which of the two would have the better long-term outlook in with the oscar?*
2) *Which of the two would the oscar have an easier time with and/or be more accepting of in the longrun?*

BV


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

I feel for you. I'm kinda in the same boat. I have an oscar whom I'm trying to find a good tankmate(s) for. Actually it's very much the same. My tanks is a 70g and my oscar is 10" and just like you, no matter what, the oscar stays. I am currently trying a salvini(male I think), female JD, texas, and synsipilum (probably spelled that wrong). I guess I'd base my decision on what works best for the oscar. So far my JD is really aggressive so she won't be staying. The salvini is starting to show some aggression, but not toward the oscar. So far it actually looks like the synspilum is working out the best, but I know they get pretty big so we'll see. I previously had convicts (2) in with this oscar and one of them was actually attacking him. So I know I'm not that helpful but I guess I'd stick with the one that gets along best with the oscar


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Actually, shef, what you wrote is quite helpful.
Since the oscar is staying, it makes perfect sense to keep whichever fish seems to be getting along best with him...thanks for your input! 

I've been sitting here watching the convict get chased all over the place by both fish.
Salvini is relentless and forces the convict to stay at the water's surface. Even then he'll still attack him. Whenever the salvini lets up, the oscar is either swooping up under the con and attacking him or doing the 'show-down' move to him (the exact same 'move' he used to do when in confrontations with the previous convict I had to part with). And this whole time the convict is getting more and more tattered...

As a result, _*I've decided to keep the salvini and part with the convict*_.
I moved him to another tank a little while ago, so he should be just fine. Moments ago, when I glanced in on the oscar and salvini, I saw the two side-by-side within about 6 inches of one another---both attacking reflections on the back wall of the tank. It's the first time I've seen them so close to one another without any chasing happening, so that's a good sign. They even seemed to cooperate in their efforts to unite against the convict earlier, so maybe his short-lived presence in the tank will have led to some sort of camaradarie...

Thanks for following along, and thanks to all for the input.
Even though it didn't work out, I'm glad I tried. With the right mix of individuals, I think it's possible, but it just wasn't in the cards for these particular fish. For what it's worth, I wouldn't recommend that anyone attempt this sort of setup unless they've got an immediate backup plan in place. Things can get nasty in a hurry, and the salvini and oscar can pack one heck of a punch.

My 75 gal. tank is now officially 'BV's Oscar & Salvini Tank.'
It'll be interesting to see how these two work out together in the long-run... opcorn: 
BV


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

I'm glad you were able to make a decision. I always find it hard when deciding to get rid of a fish, but I also hate watching a fish being tormented. I hope your salvini and oscar continue to get along, good luck!


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## trimac (Mar 27, 2003)

Even if you take out the JD that is too many fish. Let's see Oscar can reach 14" Texas anywhere from 10-12" Salvin 6-8" and the Syn. can reach anywhere from 14-18' If it were me I would keep the Oscar and Salvini and get rid of the Texas and Syn. Maybe you could add a convict or FM.


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Exactly, shef!
Deciding between the two would have been tough, but these guys made it easy for me this time 'round. Giving up the con won't exactly be fun, but I know it's definitely in his best interests.

Now I can just sit back, relax, and watch the oscar and salvini...maybe I'll try getting some pics.

As for your situation, shef...
I agree with Trimac. I'm thinking the salvini would be the best bet too...mainly due to its smaller size (and the fact that he and the oscar seem to be getting along, based on what you've seen so far).

BV


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

Oh I know I'm overstocked. The JD is going for sure, mostly because she's nasty (pretty though), the texas is also on the list to go. I'm having trouble giving up the synispilium though, really nice fish and gets along with the oscar wonderfully. I've also been told they are slow growers . As for the oscar, I know they can reach 14" but mine is already 2 years old and is 10" and has been there for a while. I've been told some oscars just stay smaller. I'm not saying he/she isn't going to grow any more, it just seems rather unlikely that it will be a 14" one. But the JD and the texas are going to be going pretty soon.

The salvini hasn't attracted the oscar's attention yet, but it's still pretty small. It has started scraping with the other fish which are all bigger than it, so I don't know if that's a sign of things to come or not. We'll see. I always keep a pretty close eye on my fish.


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## cage623 (Feb 2, 2008)

BV, I am sorry that eveythink didn't work out will all three of these fish. At least the sal is working out for now though and hopfully they will from now on.

shef, if you want to keep the synispilium then I would say you are going to need a bigger tank. As far as the sal scraping with the other fish, it could just be standing up for itself. It is hard to tell who is starting what.

Good luck to both of you.


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

I think you are right, the sal doesn't actually seem to start any fights, but it doesn't back down from one either. A bigger tank may be in my future, we'll have to see.


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

By the way BV, I really like your aquascaping. Chances are I'll end up with a similar set up, Oscar and Salvini, maybe try a firemouth or convict. I have a bunch of cutteri fry, they are just as feisty as a con myabe that could work.


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Thanks, shef.
It'll be interesting to see how this works long-term.

My main lingering question is this---what happens if/when the salvini has grown and tries to take on the oscar?  :-?

BV


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

Big Vine said:


> My main lingering question is this---what happens if/when the salvini has grown and tries to take on the oscar?  :-?
> 
> BV


That's my biggest concern with keeping the salvini as well. My oscar is by no means a pushover but like most of them I think his bark is worse than his bite. I've heard salvini's can be quite the nasty little buggers if they want to be!


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

What I'm hoping is that they'll co-exist amicably for long enough that the salvini just doesn't even bother trying to 'oust' the oscar. BUT, if he does, what might happen with our precious oscars? What would be the expected outcome?

BV


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## slh666 (Jun 10, 2007)

I'd expect a male Salvini to devastate an oscar if he wanted to. I've had two different males and they at one point both decided to make the tank there own. Note this was a 55 gallon, but there very unpredictable from my experience and when they do there damage they do it very fast.


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

Uh oh, that's not what I wanted to hear  . I would be so upset if my oscar got killed!


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

If/when the salvini got to the point of becoming the dominant fish in the tank, would he just chase the oscar away and be content with that? Or is it more likely that the sal won't stop until the oscar is dead?

Warning signs? Or you wake up one morning to a dead oscar?

I haven't yet deal with this sort of aggression in 'larger,' mature CA/SA cichlids.
Can anyone who has got some 'war vets' in their tanks chime in on this whole sal vs. oscar business?

BV


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## slh666 (Jun 10, 2007)

*** only dealt with sals in smaller confines ie- 55 gallons so im not sure how they act in a larger setting. there might be enough room in the tank for the both of them just never introduce a female


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

Well the foot print of a 55 is fairly close to a 70/75, just not as wide. I hope since my oscar is the mature one and the sal is the juvie, like BV said they'll coexist long enough that the sal won't even try it.

After much watching of my tank I've come to this conclusion (sorry to hijack your thread BV): the Oscar is obviously staying, no question there. The JD and Texas are going because of their eventual size and the aggression they are already displaying. The synspilum, as much as I like it, the oscar hates it (It doesn't really hide and I think my oscar hates the fact that it is always in his sight), and isn't very nice to it. I believe I will try what BV is trying and keep the salvini, it is only about 2" or so right now but the oscar doesn't even notice it and the sal doesn't bother the oscar. I'm just wondering if I should try a FM or convict. I also have some cutteri fry (just as tough as cons) I could try but they are way too small right now.


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## trimac (Mar 27, 2003)

It's funny you mention what might happen when the Sal reaches full size-my brothers had a 7 inch Salvini with a 14 inch Oscar-the Oscar was in charge. However, when the Oscar was not facing the Sal, the Sal would bite at his tail-the Oscar didn't even know the Sal was biting him. Then, when the Oscar would turn around the Sal would swim away-it was funny to watch-but outside of that they really got along-plus the odd thing was it was in a 55 gallon tank-which in my opinion was too small. 
BV, good luck and I think it will work! We always learn from past events and our observations always help for the next time!


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## trimac (Mar 27, 2003)

shef-it's a shame cause Syn. are beautiful fish-and they color up more as they grow!


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## shef (Oct 3, 2004)

Yeah, it's sad to have to get rid of it, really nice fish but I feel bad for it, the oscar really doesn't like it at all so I think it will be better off somewhere where it is not getting picked on. Besides the more I look at the tank, the more I realize how crowded it would be with a syn and an oscar, even the oscar by himself makes the tank look small. Maybe down the road when the oscar is gone I could try another syn (or a regani if I could ever find one!)


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Trimac...thanks for that bit of info. on your brother's experience with a sal and oscar in the same tank. What size tank was it?



shef said:


> (sorry to hijack your thread BV)


Don't be sorry...you're not hijacking it at all!
We're both on the topic of housing an oscar in with a male salvini. I'm enjoying everyone's part in this discussion. :thumb:

BV


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## trimac (Mar 27, 2003)

Yeah I know your going to freak-it was a 55 gallon-he had Tiger Oscar Salvini FM breeding cons Pleco Silver Dollar and a lot of other fish-I would not recommend this type of set up to anyone!!
This was almost 20 years ago when I lived with my parents and we first got into fish.


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## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Well, it sounds like that salvini of his was just giving the oscar nothing more than what amounted to a few love-nips...you know...to keep him on his toes. Would have taken a lot of 'patrolling' and 'policing' on the oscar's part to keep all those fish in line, lol. :fish:

BV :lol:


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