# Internal Parasites?



## lmhollist (Aug 7, 2009)

Hello all! I'll go ahead and get the basics out of the way:
pH: 7.2
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 5 ppm

I've recently noticed that my Jack Dempsey male appears to have a slightly sunken in belly. I'm concerned that he has internal parasites but I'm not sure what the cause could be. I've had him since June and never had any health issues with this fish. I recently placed him and his mate into a newly set up 75 gal. in my living room (with a mature filter). He was kind of getting on his mate's nerves without any dithers in the tank so I added some gold barbs and swordtails that I'd been keeping another tank cycled with. I'm not sure which fish did it, but one of the JDs ate a gold barb so I removed them. I've since placed a juvenile venustus cichlid (it's been in the same tank with the pair since June as well) back in the tank with them. It pretty much beat on my other Africans when I briefly mixed it in with them so I put it back with the JDs since they seem to be the only ones who can keep it in line until I can take it back to my LFS.

So basically the only "new" fish my JDs have been in contact with were some gold barbs and a couple of swordtails which I've had for quite a time, no signs of disease in these particular fish either. What other factors lead to internal parasites? I've included a youtube video of my JDs because I couldn't get a decent picture of him. If you look close you should be able to see the dip in his belly, it's not very significant but it's there.


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## Robin (Sep 18, 2002)

Such beautiful fish.

I wouldn't have noticed a sunken belly if you hadn't told me he had one but I do see a slight dip.

Fish can get sunken bellys from internal bacterial infections or from parasites. It's difficult, if not impossible, to determine which it is and it's also possible that this fish isn't eating as much due to an increased interest in spawning, aggression from other fish or a combination. You have seen him eating recently, haven't you? Like today or yesterday?

What you can try doing is feeding all the fish metronidazole soaked food for a couple of weeks. Metronidazole is effective against some bacterias and some parasites. You can either make it yourself of buy some pre-made-(only negative with the latter is some fish don't like the food the met's in--if you make it yourself then you use the food they're already eating)

If the met-soaked food route doesn't appeal to you then you could treat the entire tank with Jungle Parasite Clear. It has metronidazole in it.

Fish can get internal parasites just from being stressed. The parasites are already there, in their intestines existing harmlessly until the fish becomes stressed and it's immunity is lowered. The parasites, (intestinal flagellates) multiply rapidly and overwhelm the fish.

Likewise many of the bacterias that cause bacterial infections are already present in the tank and only become a problem when the fish becomes stressed.

Stressors for fish include: rough handling, aggression, poor diet, eating too much, improper water conditions, etc.

Robin


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## lmhollist (Aug 7, 2009)

Thanks Robin, both for the compliment and your help! 

It's possible that the stress could be either from the move or from the pretty much non-stop spawning behavior that's being going on for nearly a week between the two JDs. He's definitely been eating, and I haven't witnessed him spitting out any food. Hopefully I don't overfeed, most of the time they get NLS sinking 1 mm pellets and on occasion frozen brine shrimp. Anyway, what they do get they gobble up in less than a minute. Of course, I think the fish would eat all day if I let them, judging by the way they start to beg whenever I approach the tank.

Anyway, I bought some Jungle Parasite Clear tabs today. The tank is a 75 gallon ... would it be better to just treat the whole tank rather than remove fish and put them into hospital tanks? The packet has 8 tabs (treats 80 gallons) so I could do it, and according to the directions I can treat, wait 48 hours, do a water change and treat again.

I don't know what would be the best course of action here ... I don't want to interrupt their spawning. They haven't had a sucessful one since their first spawn and I think that was because I put some cory cats and a banjo catfish in the tank with them. Now that those fish are gone, I'd like to see some eggs actually make it.

How can you make your own metronidazole soaked food? Do you just buy the liquid medication and soak their regular food in it or what? I have a feeling they'll refuse to eat the pre-made stuff. Even though my JDs aren't picky, I'm sure they must have a limit somewhere. I pondered buying some today but ended up not.


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## Robin (Sep 18, 2002)

> How can you make your own metronidazole soaked food? Do you just buy the liquid medication and soak their regular food in it or what? I have a feeling they'll refuse to eat the pre-made stuff. Even though my JDs aren't picky, I'm sure they must have a limit somewhere. I pondered buying some today but ended up not.


I've never seen it in liquid form. I've usually bought the Seachems powdered met and then you add a very small amount of water and soak their food, preferably pellets.

Just do the JPC in the main tank. It's a little uncertain here since we don't have a clear illness and there is the possibililty that the fish has a slightly sunken belly because he hasn't he eaten enough--this due--_possibly_--from the recent changes--esspecially the addition of the venustus. Hard to see in the video but I thought his fins looked a little beat.

If there's no illness then its not going to do any harm to treat just this once with the JPC. Do a water change, 30% just before.

Robin


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## Geddonight (Aug 7, 2009)

The male Jack's fins are a little ragged because the lady likes to pick on him, not from the venustus.

On the bright side, we're getting rid of the Venustus this weekend. We're thinking of doing Giant Danios for dithers, that way Illadriel (male Jack) has something to chase.


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## greenwood (Nov 23, 2009)

the relationship of internal parasites to the host is often complex. larvae can go through phases in which one stage bears no resemblence to another.some parasites require more than one different species of host, while others can alternate between free living or parasitic forms.


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## Aleron (Nov 24, 2009)

This won't work the guard is just to help prevent parasites with a small dosage of the medication this is to weak to cure the parasites. try jungle medicated anti parasite food but if the fish isn't eating try a powerful anti parasitic such as prezquantrial.


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