# Help: Can I do this to quiet my noisy sump?



## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

Below is a picture of my sump with an arrow pointing to the problem. For some reason (I don't understand why) there is a little slit in the pvc right around the water level. The result is a terrible gurgling sound as water flows down the pipe into the sump and air tries rushing out the slit.

To resolve the problem I want to use this epoxy: http://doitbest.com/Epoxies+and+glues-P ... 386944.dib

So the questions are:
1. Is it safe to use? I was told it can be used on pipes that water flows through to a faucet so I figured if it is safe for that it ought to be safe for fish. Also, I'm using very little of it, so if it was a problem in large quantities perhaps it is not such a problem in very small quantities?

2. As I said above, I can see no purpose to this slit in the pvc. Does anyone know why the AGA Model 3 has this hole? When I've written about it before those who had it seemed to think it's pointless. I just want to make sure if I permanently seal the slit with the epoxy that it won't cause problems with the flow of the water.









(for some reason when I copy and past the image from photobucket the arrow I made which points to the problem doesn't appear. if you go to my photobucket site you can see it. http://s221.photobucket.com/albums/dd5/cholile/)


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I'm not familiar with this model but instead of doing a permanent fix, why not try slipping a piece of tubing or pvc over it? Just cut the piece lengthwise, spread it apart & slip over your tube.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

the problem is the noise is due to a lack of an airtight seal so these things wouldn't fix it. also, the main problem with the model is that the column on the left is almost inaccessible so it is difficult to access except the very top (where this slit is) and even there only with a few fingers.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

I don't know about that stuff, but this will work:

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... catid=3961

Are you sure though that this solves the problem? Gurgling is usually an issue regardless of a slit like that.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

yes i'm sure. i've found other ways to make it less noisy and they all involve covering up that slit.

there could be other areas making a very slight gurgling sound that this won't address, but they'd be very slight. this is the key problem.

i tried the putty, but because of the design it is very difficult to reach the whole slit and obviously the slightest air passage will mean even more noise as all the air will try to squeeze out of that little area.

but the bigger problem was that even though this says it cures in 30 min and fully hardens in 12 hours, i can't stick it on and leave it for 30 minutes and then run the sump. the pressure was too much for it and obviously i'm not leaving my filter off for 12 hours so i guess i'll have to figure something else out.


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## boredatwork (Sep 14, 2007)

Can you post a better picture showing what is going on? If you plug that slit it seems like you haven't removed the air problem. From that picture it looks like the slit is underwater so the air cant be coming from it. It must be coming from somewhere else. If you still have the air after your cover the slit you will probably still have noise.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

I agree the picture is a little misleading, but it's the best I can get. I can assure you the slit is just around the water level. I managed to clog the water's path so that instead of the slit being totally above water level it is at, or 1cm below, the water level.

If you think something else is the problem then let's just pretend for now this is the problem. How do I seal this ?


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

As the person responsible for that slit being there in the first place I feel I would be best to comment on it.

In 2006 we were tasked with improving the AGA megaflow sumps without increasing and if possible reducing cost. The slot addition was one of the design changes we made.

One of the common complaints received from consumers was the excessive surging with the sumps. This is caused by air bubbles being trapped in the top of loops in the drain line. The air bubbles would build up and then when there was sufficient water pressure to push them all the way down to the bottom of the pipe in the first chamber they would push free. The result was a very noisy sump and a periodic loud surging followed by sucking sound in the overflow caused by the constantly shifting water velocity in the drain line. To eliminate this surging we added the vent holes near the top so the air could escape the line more easily and reduce and/or eliminate the surging which it does do much better.

If you cover up that slot the bubbles will now have to travel down to the bottom and the result is likely to be a periodic surge and flush of your drain lines which is even more noisy.

The best thing to do to make your sump quiet is to eliminate any dips in your drain line. I find the best solution is simply to put a 90 degree elbow on the top of the intake pipe and attach the tubing from the side. This way the drain hose makes a smooth loop without any dip that allows it to trap air at the top. Air bubbles and surging are almost eliminated with that adjustment. If your drain hose is long you may have to use a little pvc pipe strapping or even a piece of string or rope to support the drain hose and prevent it from dipping. You can get 1 inch pvc elbows that are male on one side and female on the other for easy connection at most hardware stores.

Andy
Central Aquatics
Research and Development


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

Have you solved the warping lid problem? Mechanical filtration was pretty lousy too since most of the water ended up flowing under the edge of the pad into the drip tray instead of through the pad.


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

We changed both lids from acrylic to abs which doesn't warp as much. It will with time bend a little but not to the same extent as the acrylic. Not much else we could do about it without a major design revision which wasn't part of the task at the time. The lids are a very large unreinforced surface and some warping is inevitable. And truthfully about 80% of customers use them on marine tanks with protein skimmers or other devices in the sump that prevent the use of the sump lid anyways.

Not much we could do about the mechanical filtration. We did extend the spillway out a little bit to get the water entering the drip tray to come in closer to the center of the pad than the edge. But once the pad gets clogged the water is going to flow over the edge. That's typical of all wet/dry filters. Wet/dry's being open systems cannot force water through mechanical media. They have to let gravity provide all the force. We also added material to the sides of the filter to stop the water wicking out over the edge at that corner where the biochamber meets the sump area.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

Nice to see all the issues I was complaining about for a long time addressed. Especally glad to see u extended the bridge so water flows into the center of the pad....and around it only when it clogs like other wet/drys.

Unfortunately for myself, mine is sitting in my garage unused & rotting for said isues.


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

Sorry about that fishy. Hindsight is always 20/20 and fixing the problems is one of the things we do. I only started working for Central in July 2006 and this project was one of my first. I have one of the original samples of the original version that I use on my 90 gallon at home. It has the same problems as you but I still use it anyways. For mechanical filtration I added an Aqueon 55 filter which does a really good job and I like the extra water movement.

Andy


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

First let me thank you Andy for addressing the issue in this forum. I greatly appreciate that.

Having said that, I actually have the sump designed as you described (at least if I understand what you wrote). A picture is attached.

What is particularly frustrating about the noise is that I am only using a Mag Drive 500. As I understand it I ought to be able to use at least a 950.

In addition, I can tell you there was even more noise before I placed some sponges atop the the column on the left where the water flows into the mechanical filtration. By doing this I forced the water level higher so that this slit is now at least slightly below water. It certainly did not eliminate the noise but greatly reduced it.

The other major complaint I have is that the column on the left is virtually inaccessible. One can barely squeeze their fingers in to touch that pipe and it is impossible to clean the gunk on the bottom. Now, due to the pressure the gunk doesn't constantly accumulate until it is out of control, but this still is a bit bothersome. More importantly though, it is just not ideal to have part of a sump that is inaccessible. Easy accessibility is a hallmark of well-designed items.

But if the sump did not have the gurgling sound then I wouldn't care nearly as much about the inaccessibility of the column. So ultimately my main problem is how loud the sump is.

If the water simply fell from the pipe into the sump from a 1-2" hole would there even be any noise at all other than a slight splashing sound?

Again, despite my incredible frustrations with this sump I truly appreciate your responding.


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

No problem.
Unfortunately I was not around when this sump was designed. The first chamber being accessable would have been my choice as well but I understand why they didn't. The main reason was to eliminate salt creep. In older style wet/dry filters (old Amiracle designs are a good example of a circa 1989-1995 style) the water inlet was suspended directly over the center of the drip tray. As the water hit the tray it splashed a lot creating a lot of salt creep around the lid. By submerging the inlet in that first chamber and sealing that area you prevent salt creep in that section which is traditionally the worst area for it. Keep in mind that wet/dry's are designed primarily for the marine hobbyist who purchase at least 80% of them.

If you think the Megaflow is loud those older designs are very loud. 500 gph hitting a tray 1-2" away just makes a lot of splashing noise. A slight splashing sound is an understatement.

But noise is all relative I suppose. I can say that the newer Megaflows are some of the quietest wet/dry's I've worked with. And I have been in the industry for 21 years and am intimately familiar with about a dozen different brands of wet/dry's going back to the very first wet/dry (JP Burlesons Pisces). Only my Oceanic Plus series is quieter and they haven't made them in years unfortunately.

Wet/dry's are not canisters and there is going to be some water movement noise. What each person considers loud is going to vary. If you haven't had a wet/dry before just give it some time. Pretty soon it will be like background noise and you won't notice it. Most people just notice the difference from before and after. That was something I always cautioned customers when I was installing aquariums.

One thing I can suggest. If you really want to remove the vent the best thing to do would be to just yank the pipe out and put a new solid pipe in. It's just a standard piece of 1" pvc pipe with some slots cut in it. You can saw or cut some new slots in the pipe anywhere you want and put it back in.

Oh and the wet/dry can handle more than a Mag drive #5 no problem. I run a #7 on mine and I have even had test tanks running with Model 12's. What it's able to handle and noise level are really different things. When testing what it's going to handle we look for how much water flow the drip tray can drain before it overflows.
Andy


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

Thanks for the suggestions.

As for the noise, I've had this for some time and the flow of water is no problem. It does turn into background noise and I actually like it at times. It is the gurgling sound (the air and water clashing) that is awful. That is what I want eliminated.

You think if I sawed off the pipe so that the water simply splashed into the left column the gurgling sound would be gone? The water level would be so high I figure the splashing couldn't be too loud could it?

Another problem I'm having (though I doubt this is specifically related to the AGA sump itself) is that I often hear the vibrations of the pump. It has small sponges on it but I wonder if the problem isn't the particular materials, either the acrylic, or the cover, or the hoses and that one, or some, of these materials causes a particularly noticeable hum vibration noise when it barely comes into contact with another (e.g. the flexible pond hose touching the cover of the sump which touches the acrylic itself).

Also, I don't understand, if the Oceanic Plus is so quiet how hard is it to copy that? These aren't that complicated so if someone figured out a design that works perfectly why not just imitate it? Especially if they don't make them anymore there shouldn't be any issue with that.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

The first chamber doesn't eliminate salt creep for long anyway. Soon, the plastic piece holding the pvc in place begins to loosen and salt creep works it's way up onto the the outside of the pipe and works its way down the sump.

As far as pump vibrations, rather than use sponge material, try and get your hands on the antii-vibrations pads that comes with the danner/mag pumps. You can buy them from Danner/Pondmaster directly if necessary. They really work.

One of the things you can do to quiet your sump is to put some filter pad material into the area where the water flows out of the first chamber and onto the bridge that carries the water over the drip tray. It'll act as a muffler in a sense. You could also fill the chamber with something like pot scrubbies to stop the "boiling of the water" noise as well. Just make sure it's something you can remove for cleaning due to the limited access you have to that chamber.

You can also try putting a piece of eggcrate underneath the filter pad. This helps smooth out the the flow and disperse the water more evenly through the area under the drip pad itself. By doing so, it helps minimize the sound of water splashing into water as well. It can make a very significant difference...on my 450g, it's literally the difference of drip tray being able to handle the flow.

As far as 500gph hitting a tray a 1/2" away (on other sumps), it's easy to quiet. Just shove a piece of open, coarse filter material between your regular pad and the outlet. It'll act as a muffler as well. I've got well over 2000gph with 2 1.5" drains running into my sump about 1.5" above the tray and it's way quieter than my megaflow 1 was with less than 600gph running through it...and I'm a nut about noise.

For the sump lid, you can trim it so the tubing doesn't hit it or just eliminate using it. Adding fresh topoff water is good. Besides, the lid will eventually warp anyway, even though they changed the material. What will start happening is water starts condensing on the underside of the lid and begins to works it's way to the outer edges of the lid and from there starts to drip down the outsides of the sump.

This seller and maker of sumps has it right. I have no affiliation other than I bought one to replace my megaflow and loved it. I've had many other sumps as well and other than the big one I made myself for my big tank, this is my favorite by far. All my other tanks use them and I've repeatedly bought them for other tanks I've set up for friends/family.

http://cgi.ebay.com/AQUARIUM-WET-DRY-FI ... otohosting

Less than half the price of the megabuck megaflows and a simpler, better design. It used a piece of slotted pipe to spread the water out over the drip pad which also helps is run quieter. The area is also enclosed and the drawer for the drip try sits recessed to water doesn't splash outside. And it has guides so the drawer easily slides out over the sump area where the pad can drain off a bit for easy no mess removal for cleaning/replacing.

A simple design but it works.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

Cholile,

Looking at your pic as well, keep in mind that rigid PVC pipe can add more noise as well compared to flexible tubing. It tends to amplify the splashing sound within the pipe itself as well. The perfectly horizontal position along with the sharp 90 degree turns doesn't help either. A gradual downward slope without hard returns is preferred.

I used 1.5" rigid pvc on my 450g, but instead of the 90 degree fittings for the first turn, I used sweep elbows which have a more gradual 90 degee turn. I have a length of horizontal pipe as well, but I terminated it in a 45 degee fitting into a pvc of pipe with a downward slope (like a slide) and into another 45 degree fitting at the sump inlet to complete the 90 degee turn so I didn't have a complete run of horizontal pipe.


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

One of the best ways to dampen vibration noise is to put a rubber or foam mat underneath the wet/dry itself. This keeps any vibration in the sump from resonating through the wooden floor and walls of the stand. You can buy rubber mats for camping at Kmart and just cut them to size.

Fishy- that wet/dry design is very similar to older Lifereef and Sealife Systems designs. Overrall it's a good design for a freshwater application. Just be sure to keep the slots clean in the inlet pipe. If the slots clog with debris they can back up the overflow and cause a flood. That's one of the reasons you don't see rotating spray bars on wet/dry's any more.

Oceanic Plus series were a very expensive glass filter with a large biochamber relative to the sump size. Modern sumps favor more open space for skimmers or refugium sections. It's a design for a bygone era.

In reality wet/dry filters should be in two designs. One for marine systems with minimal biological filtration and lots of open space and a freshwater version with a lot of biological and mechanical filtration. However with such a large disparity in the market it's hard to justify the freshwater version for so few customers. So wet/dry's have been increasingly geared towards the trends in the marine hobby.

Andy


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

cholile,
If you wanted to cut the pipe down I don't think its a problem since your inlet pipe will hold it vertical. Most customers use the flexible drain hose and without the full length inlet pipe it wouldn't stay vertical and the hose would pull it over at an angle. Just don't cut it too short or you may have some leakage at the gasket.

Andy


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

Yep, yah gotta watch the slots, but more so with salt. Haven't had to clean in mine in 2.5 years on my fresh. Even so, no worries for a flood though, I've got all my levels set so that it's impossible for anything to ever overflow.

Good tip on the foam underneath the wet/dry itself. I also put foam under mine...I actually used some leftover noise/vibration reducing meterial left over from my Pergo type flooring.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

fishyfishyfishy said:


> Cholile,
> 
> Looking at your pic as well, keep in mind that rigid PVC pipe can add more noise as well compared to flexible tubing. It tends to amplify the splashing sound within the pipe itself as well.


Again, there is no problem with splashing noise. The issue is the gurgling sound caused by the slits in the pipe at the top where water and air clash. That, combined with the area being virtually inaccessible is what makes this design a nightmare.

Thanks narwhal for the rubber mat tip. I will try to do that to address the other, more minor, problem of vibration noise. I'm guessing even a 1/4" thick should be enough to address any vibration caused by the sump touching the wooden stand.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

The orientation of pipe/hose can be all the difference with the gurgling. I'm not saying it's the source or cure of your problem, but it may be adding to it. That sharp right angle at the input of the sump can also be adding to your problem. One thing I've found over the years is that often, the slightest variations can bring about huge differences in noise.

That being said, I see you had good foresight to use a union so that the sump is easily removed from the stand. That PVC pipe in the first chamber is not glued in. It's just a tight fit through the rubber bulkhead they use. You can easily pull it out to either modify it or replace it.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

I didn't actually put this together. I paid "professionals" from a LFS to put it together. Had I known then what I know now I would have built my own DIY sump and used trial and error to perfect it. Still, I think I follow your points and perhaps the sharp right angle PVC above the glass of the sump on the left is adding, but it definitely is not the key to the problem.

I'll try to address that at some point. For now I'm going to see if I can't put a foam mat underneath the sump to minimize the other noise -- the vibration from the pump.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

I put a foam bath mat underneath the sump. Wasn't ideal due to the suction cups, but it seemed to help a bit with the vibration though the vibration is still noticeable.

As for the gurgling I'm not too handy and I'm worried if I try removing the pipe and replacing it with a short pipe that just spills the water into the column I might mess something up and not be able to fix it. I don't have another tank to put my fish in so I just can't risk it.

Similarly, I won't try this, but I'm just curious, would it be better or worse if that long white pvc pipe through which the water flows into the sump had some very small holes on the top of it to let some air escape that way, but too small to let any water flowing down start spilling out.


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

I wouldn't suggest it. I did some prototype setups using a T fitting instead of an elbow on the top of the filter and even with a 6" tall vent pipe I was still getting sporadic overflows. These were caused by air bubbles in the vertical pipe pushing water up the vent. The same thing could occur if you drill holes.

Andy


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

Figured if it had made sense it would be done routinely.

Anyway, I've thought about trying to make my own sump. I've liked the simplicity and the utility of this design but have never heard people discuss the noise level. Have you tried this type of set up?

http://cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopi ... 55&start=0 (ignore the rubbermaid since I'd use a tank instead for the sump itself).


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

There's never really a way to predict noise. Every tank setup is different and you never really know what you're gonna end up with. Everyone's perception of what's noisy or bothersome is different. And, if you read these forums enough, you'll also find that the same person who is recommending something to you because that's how "he did it" is also complaining about it in another thread.

I've had and designed many sumps over the years. I've had the Tidepool, Amiracle, SeaClear, Megaflow, Kent/Cellpore, Pro-Clear and aside from the big one I designed for my 450g...nothing has been as simple and quiet as the previously mentioned ones on ebay. And not that I mean to keep picking on AGA, but nothing was more overpriced and caused me more grief than the Megaflow.

You can try tinkering, but again I have no affiliation, check these guys sumps out on ebay. They're very reasonably priced and capable of running almost perfectly silent.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

I also consider ease of use, which is why I like the design so much.

That bucket thing you linked to would require the tank to be shut down to service the pad and you're gonna drip water when you remove that lid. And then there's always the chance that as you remove the lid and push the hose aside to do so, that it puts a little pressure on the bulkheads fittings on the tank and next thing you know you have a leaking bulkhead.

I just love a simple slide out drip tray. That's how I made the one I designed as well. No need to even shut down the tank. Just slide out the tray and it drains over the sump area. Then simply replace the pad or remove it for cleaning. Put it back in and slide the tray back in. It's just so simple and makes maintenance a breeze.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

shutting off the system is not a big deal to me since you need to for water changes anyway. and a few drops of water after removing a lid doesn't bother me either. guess it could bother others.

in any event, i don't like that one you linked to if for no other reason than it is really small and definitely not designed for submersible pumps.

Certainly have no disagreements from me that the AGA sump is the worst possible sump. I've been given very good advice by the one person I work with at the one LFS I trust, but when it comes to this sump he could not have been more wrong. It's just awful.


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

The diy design does not feature a drip tray. The water will not spread out over the bio media but will just run through the center. In addition you will have to periodically empty out the entire bucket and clean it or the holes at the bottom will clog with debris causing water to back up. You also have to reinforce the sides of the container to keep it from bowing out from the water pressure.

Andy


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

The bucket did show a drip tray but right now I no longer see the pics.

May not be a big deal to shut it off...true...but for myself anyway, with 4 tanks in the house, the simple mainenance is greatly appreciated. Also for my father, who at his age has difficult bending down and servicing a sump so he especially loves it.

Removing the lid can be annoying and I hate having to force the lids out of the way puts pressure on those bulkheads so it can shift ever so slightly and you get a leak that could potentially that could be a nightmare to stop if dirt/sand gets underneath the seal.

As far as being small, that sump (not to keep talking you into it) comes in various sizes. I have the 2 of the smallest ones, both with submersible sumps. Not sure why you think they'd not be designed for submersible. One is actually submerged in the sump and the other I decided to drill instead and mount it externally. Both use Mag 9s.

That AGA sump can actually be a pain for sumerges though. That last chamber can really restict the size of the pump and for saltwater, makes it difficult to fit many proteins skimmers. The worst part though is that it requires an especially high operating level compared to other sumps. First, if you continue to use the sponge that goes in it, as it clogs water backs up behind it which leads makes the operating level in the pump area lower and the pump begins to start sucking in air prematurely due to the lower level. A right angle adaptor on the pump intake to suck water from a lower level can solve this if your pump allows for it.

Evaporation is a similar issue as the pump starts sucking in air at a fairly high level of water in the sump. You cannot let megaflows go that long without adding top off water before water drops below the level of the middle sump area and stop the flow of water to the pump. You may be able to solve it by raising the water level enough, but that may overflow your sump during a shutdown. Another pain since you need to top them off more and if you want to go away for a few days, you may have to put alot of water in the sump to keep it operational if you're not around to constantly top it off.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

Again, let me point out that I'm not specifically trying to sell you on a particular sump brand or idea.

The things I point out are not "made up". Everything I mention is from personal experiences from having these products and from various things and problems that I've observed and dealt with.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

That's a great point about placing the pump intake to the side rather than directly upward so as to ensure that the pump is taking in water even when the water level gets very low.

And you're right that yet another flaw with the mag drive is the very small chamber for the pump which is extremely restrictive.

Still, despite all the issues I have with the sump I've never once had a problem with the water levle in the sump getting too low. My sump sits inside my stand and even when I did not use the covers my mag 5 or 7 (haven't tried a 9.5) never had any problems. Even when I was delinquent and didn't change my water for 2 weeks there was no problem.

As for your continued recommendation of that one on ebay it isn't anything I'd ever want. No room for a submersible pump, very small (even the larger sizes) and it is not that difficult once you know a little to build your own sump which can be far larger and far easier to maintain than that one. And it can be done for less too.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

Again, I'm not trying to sell you on that sump...I'm just pointing out its practical design. Still not sure why you think there's no room for a submerged pump. The one I linked to was only for reference as far as design, not size. Sure the sump area is not as big as your can do yourself since there's really no limit on that, but his sumps actually have some of the largest sump areas I've seen of all the brands I've previously mentioned. Plenty of room for the tray to completely slide out over the sump area along with a pump and other devices like protein skimmers and/or uvs. Then again, I prefer external pumps anyway. Having the pump out of the way from inside the sump makes it easier to service...no annoying tubing getting in the way, no added heat to the water...etc.

You can definitely build better and cheaper on your own. (Although without the overflow, his really are quite a bargain). I like nice finished products though. I can't deal with making stuff out of rubbermaids and buckets. Just not my thing.

Evaporation can vary greatly and every setup is different so I was speaking generally and not specificic to your tank. Evaporation increases greatly in the winter when there is less humidity in the air and even more so if you have to blow a cooling fan across your sump water during the really hot days. All sumps can suffer with the same evaporation issues, it's just that they're amplified in the megaflow because of that wall leading to the pump area. You need several inches of water in the sump just for the water to reach the height of that wall. So megaflows need a higher operating level than most sumps.

As far as putting the pump in the middle chamber, the only drawback is that you'll get some stagnant water in the pump area due to the lack of circulation.

Bottom line though and you're definitely right about is that nothing is better than building yourself. I designed a huge sump for my 450g...works great, runs quiet and is super easy to maintain.

So anyway, what was your question again?


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

Ha. Well glad to see you like the sump you linked, but do you realize you said that DIY is not your thing and then said you designed your own sump for your 450G?

If your DIY sump for the 450 works well, is quiet, and easy to maintain (the trifecta) then maybe you can post pictures of it with a detailed explanation of its set up?


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

Ahhh, but I said making stuff out of rubbermaids and buckets is not my thing...not that I don't design and build. 

Plenty of pics on my link under my signature. The 58 shows the ebay sump and from there you can link to my 450g with detailed pics and summary of my tank. The 450g has since been switched over to Africans and updated pics of the tank itself can be seen by clicking my TANKS tab below. (The 54 on my webiste is an old discarded sump as well...it now has the ebay sump as well as the 58).

Some slight changes to the 450g sump setup since include dual 57 watt UVs on the main return pump, removal of the protein skimmer and Nuclear canister, in favor of a double high 1.5" in/out 25 micron polishing canister instead.


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## cholile (Oct 28, 2007)

Well, like I said before a few times, no rubbermaids for me. Tanks only for the sump itself. So I think we're on the same page.

I was looking more for detailed pics of each aspect of the sump as it is in the current 'ideal' state. Still, great looking tanks.


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## fishyfishyfishy (Dec 24, 2005)

I'll get around to more pics and update my website, but not much different. Skimmer/pump gone. Canister replaced with a bigger one. Everything else is the same as on the website.


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