# Bought these as Hap. 44 fry, what are they really?



## Ruu

I bought these off of aquabid as a group of 12 Lake Victoria Hap. 44 fry from a local hobbyist here in Michigan. I sold off a few extra males and now have three males with 7 females. After doing some research and looking at photos of Hap. 44's, I'm really not sure what these are. Of the three males, 2 of them are showing darker color with redish fins, and the other male is showing more orange. Any suggestions as to what type Victoria hap these are? and whether the different males are the same species.

Here are the 2 different colored males:









This is the orange male with a couple of females









Here is the darker male









Any help in identifying these is appreciated.

Thanks,

Paul


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## sicetnon

the #3 is a Pundamilia Nyererei for sure.


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## kezza

I'd say the fish in #3 is actually a male Pundamilia Pundamilia:

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=2575

The Nyererei has more colour in the body.

As for the first two, I can't see anything there.


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## samaki

Hi The dark fish has some sp 44 affinities , the orange back one seems to have a similar morphology but the orange color seems too intense for me. It make me think to a cross(sp44/nyererei) but I can't be sure at this stage If it's possible to have more pics, it would be appreciated.
Sorry to announce you such a thing but don't deseperate it could be due to the light and photo, so it would be helpful to see more pix 
Xris


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## Ruu

Thanks for the replies, I will try and take some more pictures tomorrow after work and get them posted.

Paul


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## nick a

This is what we commonly see in the US hobby for 44s. It's pretty hard to tell from your pics--sorry-- but #3 is a definite non44--can't quite tell for sure what he is. Do any of them resemble the above pics?


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## Ruu

They definately don't look like the Hap 44's in the posted pictures. I finally got around to taking some more "bad" pictures of the fish (I really need to improve my photography skills). Hopefully they will enable someone to I.D. these guys.

Here are 2 pictures of the dark males:

















and 2 pictures of the orange male (the young males from the 1st batch of fry are starting to look like this, but he is no longer the dominant male and I assume the small fry I have are from one of the dark males):


















I have to agree with you guys so far, the orange male seems to be a type of nyererei or a cross of some type. The black one does look like the photo of the Pundamilia Pundamilia, but I am not really familiar with them at all. Thanks again for everyone's help.


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## jts_aquatics

Who did you pick these up from?


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## danielratti

yeah id like to know too cause im from michigan and i don't want to hybrid fish.


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## Ruu

The Aquabid seller ID was Seansrarecichlids. I sent him an email through Aquabid last week but I didnt get a response. I don't know if he is still in the hobby, as I have not seen any listings from him in awhile.


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## jts_aquatics

I have not seen much of his postings either. :-?

I heard once that he was leaving the hobby but thats about all I have heard thru the grapevine. opcorn:


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## jts_aquatics

I have received some bogus vics from the Detroit area this winter that was suppose to be sent on to another person but they never made it to their destination because of questioning their line.

Looks to me they were hippo points mixed with another specie or there was 2 species together.

They didnt go far from their. Someone got a quick buck over that way 

Thats why I dont care much about getting things from unknown people or sources that are not reputable.

With vics you have to be careful.... alot of hybrids out there that we need to clean up and get rid of or we will keep having this problem.

Another issue is we need to stress the knowledge and conservation to people that want to keep these species to not mix them in any way and to keep them seperate to prevent hybridization and then pass them on to someone else that will pass them on again not knowing anything about them.

Almost like a huge chain reaction...


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## Ruu

The common conclusion is that I have either hybrids or two different types of fish. Either way, there is no way for me to ID the females in the group. Unfortunately, the only ones that will appreciate the fry I have from these fish will be my Buccochromis Nototaenia.

I obviously have not had much luck with finding good victorians lately. Hopefully they will continue to import new fish from Lake Victoria. Maybe then it will make it a little easier to find some quality fish.


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## jts_aquatics

Ruu said:


> The common conclusion is that I have either hybrids or two different types of fish. Either way, there is no way for me to ID the females in the group. Unfortunately, the only ones that will appreciate the fry I have from these fish will be my Buccochromis Nototaenia.
> 
> I obviously have not had much luck with finding good victorians lately. Hopefully they will continue to import new fish from Lake Victoria. Maybe then it will make it a little easier to find some quality fish.


I'm sitting on a ton of F1 fry right now. I will let you know when I have some ready or some F2's available.

I have a bunch of rock krib mwanza ready thou.

I shouldnt be too far from you. Maybe 2 hrs tops. But not sure.


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## Adrnalnrsh

Dang lots of Michiganders here!

Not trying to Hijack the thread, but I am from Taylor (Taylor Tucky as they use to say).

Grew up in Westland too but live in Phoenix now. :thumb:


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## thepitclub

The First two do look like they could be sp. 44's. The sub-dominant males will have very different coloration than the dominant male. But the subs don't usually have quite so much orange... If you move them them too another tank away from the dominate male, you should be able to get a better idea of thier actual coloration pretty quickly.

The third fish looks like an Astatotilapia nubilus / Pundamilia cross.. Is that possible? :-?


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## anthonyoakes

type in Daves rare aquariam it is in texas but u can click on pics 2 see 4 ur self


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## tropical_tails

If you're looking for some quality vics here in michigan we've got some good stuff. We have some real sp. 44s if you want them. We've also got everything from Crimsons and pundamilia nyererei to red tail shellers to ruby greens. You're close enough that you should really stop on in. We're just south of the Mount Pleasant city limits.


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## Alistriwen

What I found interesting is that this:










is what is commonly sold as sp. 44 around me and it doesn't really look like the fish pictured earlier.


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