# julidochromis dickfeldi lethargic/sick?



## fishestate (Jul 7, 2015)

I've got an african cichlid, julidochromis dickfeldi, that I have been keeping an eye on. Very lethargic, rests on the bottom or directly on rocks and has stopped coming out for feedings the last 3 days. Missing several days of feedings is not terribly unusual for this fish. Other than this strange behavior I can't tell anything that might be wrong with it. Colors look fine, though the stomach is a bit recessed. This fish has always had a fairly recessed stomach.

Julidochromis dickfeldi love spending their time in rocks, so it's difficult for me to say how unusual this behavior might be (but he isn't using his pectoral fins hardly at all to remain in place, which seems odd). It's also difficult to get a good picture. I have put together an album


http://imgur.com/uPsOT

 that includes the best pictures I could get (i told you he is deep in the rocks, also sorry for the juvenile duboisi).

He is in a 55gal tank that is heavily populated by tropheus duboisi (7 breeding adults and about a dozen juveniles between 0.25 inches and 1 inch. I do very regular (read every few days 10%, if i miss timing on that then I do a 20%) water changes. I run an oversized filter with lots of purigen and just removed my phosban yesterday because my phosphate levels have started to come back up.

pH - 8.0 Ammonia - 0 Nitrate < 20 Phosphate < 1 GH/KH - 200-250 ppm

I don't like the phosphates (or the nitrates for that matter) which is one of the reasons I'm so diligent about changes. I will be adding some phosguard this time, see if maybe it works better than phosban. These levels aren't too far out of norm, if at all really, and the tank has been stable for 3 years and has been a breeding ground for the duboisi for a year. I will say that I'm not noticing any current holds, which I think is strange.

I do not have any algae issues in the slightest, and that is the metric i've been using that my phophates/nitrates aren't too out of control. Like I said, I'm not a fan of those numbers and I'm actively working to bring them down.

I am strongly considering getting this guy out and into a QT/Hospital tank. I'm just not sure what to do at that point. If I'm overreacting I don't want to break down the whole tank, take all the rocks out and scoop him (that's what it would take to get him with the minimum stress).

There is very little information about julidochromis behavior/illness. I tried numerous wordings here in cichlid-forum but couldn't find anythign matching this sickness.

Any help is greatly appreciated.


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## fishestate (Jul 7, 2015)

I found this article

http://www.gcca.net/2011-06-25-05-2...cally or horizontally to match the rockwork."


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## euphr (Aug 9, 2015)

What are your NITRITES? I am concerned that you have 0 NITRATES because its an indication that your tank is not cycled. NITRITES should be 0 and NITRATES should be around 20ppm.


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## fishestate (Jul 7, 2015)

Ammonia is zero, nitrate is < 20ppm.

The tank is cycled, it's 3 years old.

Edit: To give you an update, I have removed the fish from the DT and he is in a hospital QT. I have not started any treatment. Here is a link to the latest updates in the pictures


http://imgur.com/dBGES

 it includes a shot of his tail.

He is breathing steadily but has not moved in hours. I cannot see anything else wrong with him, I don't know what to do. I don't want to treat haphazardly. I have had the fish since i first started the tank, and he was fully grown when i got him. He is at least 4 years old, then.

No sign of parasites. His fins aren't even as chewed up as I thought.


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## fishestate (Jul 7, 2015)

*Today, he ate!!!*

During the first 4 days of treatment his symptoms only worsened. His fin rot became widespread- instead of just his pectoral and some of his tail he lost his other pectoral fin and a large hole started forming in his dorsal fin. His stomach was more sunken than ever, and he looked like he had started to hunch over.

My treatment during those first 4 days was this:


Placed him in a 10gal hospital tank, a small amount of cover and filtered using a HOB and sponges from the DT filter.

1 tsp of *Melafix* and 100mg *metronidazole* once a day.

Covered the tank to keep the fish calm and to allow it to rest undisturbed

After the fourth day his condition had worsened to the point where I felt I needed to change course. This is when I ditched the melafix/metro and went with good old *maracyn*. When I switched medications I did a 50% water change to remove most of the melafix and to give the little guy some clean water.

Did you know that some people (even in threads in this forum) think maracyn isn't available anymore? It was bought by a different company (or something to that effect) and is now available as Maracyn (along with Maracyn 2 and other former mardel medications. The new company distributing/manufacturing maracyn is called _Fritz Aquatics_. Spread the word!

After the second day of maracyn he was looking noticeably better. He went from being unresponsive to light and breathing irradically to steady breathing and reaction to stimuli. It was at that time I thought his fins started looking better, but couldn't be certain because hope makes a sick fish look like it's getting better sometimes.

The third day I tried offering a small piece of garlic to see if he would eat (he had not eaten since entering the HT and for 3-4 days prior when in the DT). He reacted to the garlic in the water, but did not eat it.

*Today, he ate the garlic and a pellet (or two!)*. He left the 'cover' (a hollow stump) and swam slowly around the tank. He went in and out of the several enterances to the stump. His fins are all looking better, his dorsal has healed and he is swimming steadily-- not resting on the bottom!!!

Still far too weak for the DT, but ladies and gentlemen we have some positive progress!

Today at noon will be the fourth dose of maracyn.


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## euphr (Aug 9, 2015)

Glad he is doing much better.

When i treated my GT for bloat i used 250mg per 10 gallons of water. 100mg is typically a bit too low. Are you using the General Cure from API?


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## fishestate (Jul 7, 2015)

He died today.

I had switched to maracyn for the treatment when he seemed to be doing better. I had been leaning toward piscine tuberculosis. his death immediately after his final feeding seems interesting to me, like perhaps there are internal nodules or other tell-tale signs.

Because of the risks in dealing with piscine tuberculosis and the risk posed to human transference I will be treating this as such.

Also I usually do more metro to treat bloat, but this was not bloat. I'm well-versed in treating bloat. I did the minimum metro dose because i was combining with melafix.


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## fishestate (Jul 7, 2015)

Well WTF he's not dead. Lol. He must have been resting? On his side?

When I went to remove him he swam away. I figured, okay, well then let's see if he eats again. He gobbled everything up.

He's actually out swimming around freely now.

I'm blown away.


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## plug (Nov 10, 2013)

That is an interesting story

I noticed in the pictures that your fish looked perfectly fine...


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## fishestate (Jul 7, 2015)

I love that.

He degraded quickly in the HT, his tail got worse but most importantly his pectoral fins are almost completely gone.

I'll get another picture of him.

Do you know much about this species? Are you familiar with any of these behaviors (lethargy, resting on the bottom)?

Looking at that album of pictures i agree- he looks great comparatively  Here's one of his tail I took that same day but in the HT http://i.imgur.com/3zVvrip.jpg


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## fishestate (Jul 7, 2015)

I euthanized him yesterday using a clove oil method.

He had the telltale signs of piscine tuberculosis- bent spine, disintegrated fins and nodules along his organs.

I did not take any pictures of that.

His name was Submarine Fish, and he was a good fish.
http://i.imgur.com/Q6qrjsq.png


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## plug (Nov 10, 2013)

sorry to hear about the death of your fish...


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