# Permanent under sink python alternative



## Harkinstein (Aug 23, 2009)

The reason for this project, is because I have a water filter on my faucet, and I didn't want to be taking it on and off to use a python every time I wanted to do a water change.

I completed this project in about 30 minutes yesterday for about $30 (less than the price of a python?). The hard part is finding the right pieces, which took me quite a bit longer.

I just tested it and it works like a charm. No more buckets! Here is a picture of the entire setup.










A close up of the drain/fill valve.










And the connections to the water line and drain.










Definitely worth the time and money.


----------



## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Congrats on the step forward. I might suggest one small additional thing to save some frustration. I found it really hard to get the end of the hose to stay in the tank when I turned the pressure on. A small "J" shape at the tank end to hang over the edge made this go away for me. Saves extra work mopping the floor when the end flips out. =D> A bit of copper tubing if you have the bender to do it without crimping or CPVC pipe and a couple elbows will do it.


----------



## newfisher (Dec 20, 2008)

You may want to be prepared to take it apart should ever a licensed plumber or building inspector ever; drop by. What you have is a direct connection between potable water source and sewer line, which in most jurisdictions is against plumbing code. The same issue applies to water treatment systems, where backwash discharge cannot be hard-connected to the sewer line ... there must be an air gap (two inches I believe, per most codes) between the end of the backwash discharge and the sewer line it enters.

I have seen discussions regarding the "legality" of pythons, where the venturi stream (potable water) is in very close contact with tank waste water ... although there is no "real" hard connection between potable water and "sewer". I have seen no confirmation as to how they fit plumbing codes, or whether the use of a python has ever been "tested" in a plumbing code dispute. Perhaps there's a plumber out there who could give some clarity on this?


----------



## KaiserSousay (Nov 2, 2008)

Not a fan of python myself. Think it an overpriced, cheaply made....just stopped myself from going on a rant.  
Would suggest, you keep an eye on your "Y" with valves. Those little ball valves tend to leak, bypass with use.


----------



## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

I would not be concerned about the building inspector or a plumber seeing your connection between the sewage and water lines. I would be concerned about contaminating the water that goes into the fish tank with sewer germs and material, and the water that I wash, cook, and brush my teeth with anywhere in that house... and when there is a drop in line pressure as may happen during a main repair or water company activities, that I could be contaminating the water supply of all my neighbors or an entire city. I would be concerned about someone from Homeland Security assuming you are a terrorist after the contamination is traced to your house.


----------



## cosmiccow (Jun 10, 2007)

Can't you add a check valve to keep back flow from happening?


----------



## planenut007 (Mar 21, 2009)

ditch the "Y" add a second hose, problem solved.


----------



## iCichlid (Sep 21, 2009)

Great Idea! My tank is opposite my powder room so this just might work!!


----------



## ben1988 (May 2, 2009)

i really think that you all are over reacting to this whole thing. as long as he flows the water a little right after doing the water change (which will happen as long as he refills the tank after suction. relax guys no one is going to arrest him or fine him for this. i bet at most they would tell him to remove it and go about their day.


----------



## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

At least he has made an effort to avoid buckets of water carried through the house. I think it might be worthwhile for us all to be a bit more cautious when we look at others work. There are always things that could/should be different. Have we all looked at our own house and truly admitted that there are a few errors that we could correct? If you think your house is perfect, put it up for sale and have an "independent" inspection done. When you get down to inspections it is like it always has been. They don't have a job if they don't find something wrong. Go with improving something and they will still pick it apart.


----------



## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

cosmiccow said:


> Can't you add a check valve to keep back flow from happening?


That would be my suggestion... I just installed an R/O system which is just a large fancy version of the same thing... live water line in, bunch of valves, connected to the drain and those pass code so I'm guessing that the difference must be in the check valve.


----------



## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

Number6 said:


> cosmiccow said:
> 
> 
> > Can't you add a check valve to keep back flow from happening?
> ...


The difference is the air gap, not a check valve. Check valves are not 100%. An air gap will work all the time as long as the gap is maintained. Check valves are only a flapper in the gravity type that must be installed in a particular postion, and a flapper with a spring of one kind or another in check valves that can be installed in any position. They are vulnerable to particulates and scale building up near them.

No reason an air gap couldn't be under the sink. Just be sure there is a U-shape pipe below it so that gasses from the sewer won't escape into the house. That U part should always have water in it because it is a barrier to the gasses. The little Y-valve is for splitting garden hoses, so it's not meant for indoor or permanent use. Eliminating it and separating the hoses is a start, but the air gap still needs to be installed on the waste line side.

Pythons and the nearly identical waterbed drain/fill kits are OK if the discharge is a few inches higher than the tub or sink they are above could ever fill up to. If you have it lower than the sink top, it should always be monitored when in use and removed when not in use.


----------



## Harkinstein (Aug 23, 2009)

Didn't expect this type of response. I think there is some exaggeration, but...

By air gap, you mean something such as a mini sink under the sink? Maybe a funnel, that a hose can drain into? Then it would be fine to still use just one hose? I could put a check valve beneath the funnel to prevent a backup, if the drain were to back up during normal use.

As far as the "Y" thing leaking, I will eventually replace it because it is touchy. If anyone is considering doing this, make sure you read about the valves that you use. Some of the brass ones say that they contain lead.

I am considering using a cheap faucet as a "Y" valve. I figure this will handle the pressure better since that is what it is made for. I could use the hot water side as the input, cold side as the drain, and the faucet for the hose to the aquarium.

Assuming I did that, AND made the mini sink under the sink thing, would that be legal? And when did DIY become about sticking to code? :wink:


----------



## R-DUB (Jun 3, 2007)

The solution is very simple. Do not connect the "drain" side to the actual house plumbing. Add a few inches on the "drain" side and let it go directly into the normal sink drain. When done place it back into the cabinet. No reason to tap into the drain line when the sink drain is just above the cabinet. I assume that the set-up runs only on a siphon and not requiring the "supply" pressure to boost the python, like the original set-up does. Good Luck


----------



## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

Harkinstein said:


> .....And when did DIY become about sticking to code? :wink:


 I think this is more about safety than about code. Building codes start out with the goal of safety and protecting the consumer. Political baggage and bureaucracy can lead them far afield. I don't believe there is any exaggeration needed when it comes to not wanting sewage contaminating your tap water, or the likelihood of law enforcement over-reacting to the contamination of a water main.


----------



## Harkinstein (Aug 23, 2009)

R-DUB said:


> The solution is very simple.


Wow, no kidding. Too simple to think of. I'll probably make some changes to it this weekend.

I don't think it'll kill me before then. :lol:


----------



## R-DUB (Jun 3, 2007)

Im sure you and all of Texas will be fine! :l :lol:


----------



## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

R-DUB said:


> The solution is very simple. Do not connect the "drain" side to the actual house plumbing. Add a few inches on the "drain" side and let it go directly into the normal sink drain. When done place it back into the cabinet. No reason to tap into the drain line when the sink drain is just above the cabinet. I assume that the set-up runs only on a siphon and not requiring the "supply" pressure to boost the python, like the original set-up does. Good Luck


 That is the right solution. Back to the original on the waste side.


----------



## robn69 (Dec 10, 2008)

i was going to do a diy drip system like this. Sounds like a bad idea  . I was going to have a line going from my tank tapped into drain pipe. Then a line from water line to sump.


----------



## yearmax (Aug 11, 2010)

I did a similar thing but instead of connecting under the sink I went thru the wall followd my drain pine down to the basement and connected to the sink down there. I got a 25ft and the 50th python unit on closeout for $25.

I am about 25ft from my tank to my kitchen sink so it works out great. Now when I need it I just pull what hose I need to my tank clean an refill and then when I am done I just let the hose fall back down to the basement and I just keep the tube part under my sink. A very clean look and no hassle with the kitchen at all.


----------

