# otopharynx 'silver torpedo'



## Gibbs

What do you guys think?
I trust the guy i bought these off but there is very little info concerning them


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## Guest

Definitely not Otopharynx 'silver torpedo'.

Instead, that looks EXACTLY like another rare species of Otopharynx...which is Otopharynx 'torpedo *blue*'

That first picture is very strange though. Mind taking another shot of that male? The color seems off but the body shape is right.

And if you have Ad Konings's Malawi Cichlids in their Natural Habitat *4th* edition your fish is on page 334. The silver torpedo is on that page as well. If you want I can take a scan or photo of that page later.

If you have ad konings's 3rd edition of that book, the torpedo blue is on page 260, and the silver torpedo is on page 234.

Again, definitely not silver torpedo. The colors, head shape, and stripes all match the torpedo blue. (Personally I think the torpedo blue looks better anyway).

Konings says males can reach up to 12cm (4.72in) and males in the wild aren't territorial, or at least not when Konings observed them. Konings does not mention the diet at all, but I'd say it is likely a carnivore and a omnivorous diet/pellet/flake would be best (pellets such as NLS, Dainichi, etc).

Anyway congrats on this rare find. What are they? Wildcaught? F1s? Tank raised? I've only seen the silver torpedos available here once last year and they sold quickly...

Be sure to take another shot of that first pic of a male. It could just be a male in full breeding dress, but the colors just look a little odd to me from that photo.

~Ed


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## Gibbs

That first photo i took was with the tank light off and the flash of the camera on. It looks nothing like it does in that first picture i shouldn't have posted that pic.

I have taken a few more shots for you to. I traded in a whole bunch of fish for 5 of these otopharynx which come to $130. As he bagged them up we had a good talk about fish as usuall and he sprung on me that they are the first batch of juvies from a wild group from the eastern states which males them first gen tank raised fish, it's just to bad he got the name wrong.

Anyway Marduk i don't have Ad's book but would love a scan of that page when you get a bit of spare time, i have googled Torpedo Blue and the pics i found look very close to my fish. Thanks alot for that, heres some more pics.


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## Guest

Yep definitely torpedo blue.

Here's a picture I found online of the silver torpedo:









You'll notice two major differences besides the different colors, is the torpedo blue has three spots (silver torpedo has them too, but they are different shapes that of yours), and the silver torpedo head is more straight while the torpedo blue is rounded off.

I'll scan those two pages later of the fish pictures.

Really though I HIGHLY recommend you get a copy of Ad Konings's book. It is very much worth the cost. You can get it at amazon.com (they do ship to australia) for $60usd, or directly from the publisher/ad konings himself for $76.

Here are the links:
http://www.amazon.com/Malawi-Cichlids-t ... 964&sr=8-1
http://cichlidpress.com/books/details/malawi4th.htm

Lastly I found a seller on ebay.com.au selling it for $91 australian dollars. It is pricey, but definitely worth the cost. http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Malawi-Cichlids- ... .m63.l1177

~Ed


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## Guest

Here's more online pictures of the torpedo blue: http://www.malawitreff.de/otopharynx%20 ... tekete.php


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## Gibbs

Thanks a bundle Marduk. I like the look of the adult females in them pics, plain yet very pretty and petite. I can't wait to breed these guys, they are all still juvies so i'll be waiting a while. I'll just enjoy watching them mature until they do breed, it seems there is very little info on this fish available so i might document my observations and spread the info. I can already tell that they are a very placid fish and are enjoying a tank of their own.
Gonna have to get me 1 of Ad Koning's book to :thumb: 
Thanks alot Marduk you been a big help


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## strelnikoff

Othoparynx decorus "Ntekete"...

I have them...


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## Gibbs

I had to prove my LFS owner wrong today. He said there is no such species so i pulled out Ad Konings 4th edition and what do you no. I don't think i fully convinced him which may cause issues down the track in terms of these 2 species hybridizing in my local area due ignorance but atleast i can say i'm doing the right thing.

Any info you can provide on these fish would be great, I have had already run into problems with bloat which i have never really ahd to deal with in the past.


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## strelnikoff

These are mine Othopharynx decorus "Ntekete".

this is probably a female










this is a group with male in front (when he is showing off the spots are gone)










Another photo attempt of the group - male in the front, female on the left and another possible male back on the photo










Male in front and female on the left










Probably sub-dominant male










There is little known about this species except it was described in 1935 as Haplochromis decorus. Most of the stores don't have them in the stock usually, perhaps because the male takes long time to develop any color. Even then they do - it's not as impressive as Sc. fryeri or other Haplochromines and it is hard to tell apart female from male. I got them at 2.5" to 3" and seller was convinced they are all females. One practice I don't like is that in most of the stores - you seldom find male/female combination in a group larger than 10, only males if it is possible.

The fish is quite different in behavior from say Sc. fryeri or Aulonocara's and other typical haplochromine or aulonocara species, it is a "nervous" fish, always on the move. What little information I could get is - it lives on a sandy bottom, comes from the eastern side of the Mallawi lake, feeds on invertebrates thus it's not very aggressive even to his own kind. With such silver (or chromed  ) color and shape they resemble marine fishes especially when they grow up.

I feed them with NLS for cichlides and Hikari Excell - mostly because I have few herbivores in the tank and because such food contains enough protein for carnivore fishes to develop. 
The photos are taken just after feeding so they are a bit "bellied".


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## strelnikoff

Gibbs said:


> I had to prove my LFS owner wrong today. He said there is no such species so i pulled out Ad Konings 4th edition and what do you no. I don't think i fully convinced him which may cause issues down the track in terms of these 2 species hybridizing in my local area due ignorance but atleast i can say i'm doing the right thing.
> 
> Any info you can provide on these fish would be great, I have had already run into problems with bloat which i have never really ahd to deal with in the past.


I have found similar problem although the seller I usually go to - is well informed and get's fishes from serious breeders. But, I can bet that half of the Sciaenochromis fryeri he has (large males) are mixed with aulonocara's. Usually they don't care since people are buying the fishes just for display with no intention to breed them. And if there are different haplochromines in the tank - large male is not picky and will breed with them.

With respect to bloat, I had nasty experience with that. To this day I have (my fault) killed at least 4 colonies of Tropheus (duboisi, bemba, brichardi and moorii) on various sizes. In addition to this - Eretmodus cyanostictus paid the price (now I have only two survivors from 10 fishes initially). Actually, they were killed by fresh tap water - I've changed water after a vacation and when I stirred the substrate Ph dropped, all **** that was trapped went up and fresh water was added in period immediately after the rainy days - that's when they put extra chemicals here in Houston.

I've found that Clout works well - but only if the symptoms are recognized as early as possible and fishes removed from the main tank to a smaller one. If one reacts just few days late - chances of recovery are minimal.


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## Gibbs

*strelnikoff* your experience with these fish sounds much like my own short experience also. My fish are in a species only tank, i would hate to think the outcome if i mixed them with mbuna or even some haps, they seem very timid and i could see them getting stessed very easily. I have managed to save the 2 fish that a fallen ill from bloat with cloat, the minute i see 1 mouth then spit a pellet they are straight in the hospital tank. I feed a good diet of NLS and Sera flora sparingly once a day.
What fish do you have them mixed with?
Oh another question almost all of these fish that i have purchased seem to show a blue sheen in their face as if they are male (one especially definately male). Is it safe to say that these are males or do females show small amounts of blue along the snout also?


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## Guest

Females can sometimes show color but not always. I know my Taeniolethrinops females have a gold coloration on their undersides and face. I'm not 100% familiar with females of this species so I can't say for sure. Take a look in Ad Konings 4th edition malawi book and take a look at the *Otopharynx sp. "torpedo blue"* females. That should give you an idea...

How is locating more for sale from your lfs going? I remember you said you were looking to get more...

~Ed


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## Gibbs

Hey Marduk. Not goin to good with the order but the guy is trying really hard to get them for me. I'm gonna give him a call on my next set of days off. He gave me full refund on the males i took back.

Just recently i have noticed a blue in the nose holes and a little on the lips so the next few days will be interesting, i have a feeling the blue will get stronger and ill have another boy on my hands. It's just strange how out of 5 fish all of them are males :-?


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## strelnikoff

Gibbs,

what can I say - you have to wait and see. For my decorus I can say that one is definite male, but they all have a blue hue on their lips. For example - the bigger fish are - more chance is they will show some blue on the face. 
Good indicator on the 3-4" size would be the shape of the anal fins - for females it is usually quite round and male have a pointed end.

My Sc. fryeri - let me mention this - so - male is male... ok I have few females - one is quite large and I thought it was actually uncolored male, one that was very very submissive... but - one day I have found "him" with full mouth of eggs. Another one - it was smaller size - I thought it will be 100% male. It started showing a bit of blueish color on the scales. Then, the "chewing" appeared so - my prediction was out. So - only option is actually - wait and see. Decorus don't really color as quickly as fryeri therefore there is no 100% indication if a fish is male or 100% female.

I have found that they can be kept in a community tank. They are not dominant - far from it, but they find their way. And as for most "shy" fishes goes - having other more active fishes around will bring them out more often, they'll be more active.

I have experience with 7 striped frontosas. I had few of them alone in the tank for some time. Now, they would hid themselves under some hole (they were reasonably young and small). Then I got 6-7 hysteric Ps. acei - and immediately they have started going out and taking food regularly.

So, it is not bad to mix decorus with for example - aceis or some mbunas (not big ones for sure) because sheer presence of other fishes helps the shy ones to become more active.

Once they are bigger this is not a big issue as before.

My Otho. decorus are in the tank with Sc. fryeri, aceis, frontosas etc - and they are doing quite fine - they are very different fishes in any aspect so - even male is showing off from time to time (although he is still young). They will not be on top of the fryeris but - they'll be ok.


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## joker4466

looks like my Otopharynx lithobates (Thumbi West) did when it was coloring up.


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## Gibbs

Have you got a pic of your litho joker


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## joker4466

joker4466 said:


> looks like my Otopharynx lithobates (Thumbi West) did when it was coloring up.


i have pics but don't know how to load them on here


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## aussie123

Hi
I was just wondering if you have any current pics of your blue torpedoes and also if they have bred yet.
I just found what we believe to be blue torpedos and your post here seems to be the only little bit of info on the net of anyone else having these here in aust that i can find.
Here is some piccies of the ones I have here which is supposed to be a small breeding colony of 1m and 4f.



















Thanks
Lance


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## Gibbs

They are blue torpedo's yes! Rare fish on my side of town.

I no longer have mine as for some reason most of them died and i was only left with the one male that i sold. Looks like you have 3 males there. My batch of 5 consisted of atleast 4 males and maybe one female. They are a really timid fish. My male didn't do well at all in an all male hap tank so i sold him to a good friend. Shame because i wanted to do some documenting on them.

You might know a man called pierre aka "spud", he is a big name in WA and exports to the east coast, he has a site called auscichlids.com. It would be good to get intouch with you there and maybe bring some out west if or when they breed.

Don't ever let anyone tell you these are "silver torpedo" because they aren't. Silver's are yellow and not as pretty as your fish.

Good score mate, makes me miss mine.


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## aussie123

Hey thanks for the quick reply.
These were traded into a LFS here and they had no idea what they were so i bought them having a feeling at the time they may have been rare.
The shop was told that it was a breeding colony of 1m and 4f so i dunno.
The guy who identified them for me also gave me the link to your post here and he had bred the silvers before so i knew it wasnt those from the start.
They are digging nests all over the tank and showing every sign of breeding so hopefully they are females but at this stage all the other fish in the tank including cuckoos are stopping them from doing what ever they are trying to d.
Late next week when they finish their qarantene period they will get a tank to themselves to see how they go for a while.
I will definitely let you know if they ever breed.
Thanks heaps again
Lance


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## aussie123

The first Blue Torpedo bred today so I stripped the girl to see what she had.
I got 11 good looking eggs so now they are in the tumbler and hoping most hatch.
Can't wait for the other 3 girls to breed now.
Lance


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## Gibbs

Good on ya Lance. Glad they are going well. How big is your male? Ad Konings describes these fish as growing to less then 5inch but my male outgrew that by far and is still growing for the new owner.

Wouldn't mind getting some of your fry over here mate.

Steven


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## aussie123

The male would have to be around 17cm and the girls are around 14cm.
They have all filled out so much in the few weeks I have had them and the other girls look like their full of eggs too.
I will be keeping the first few fry to grow out a new colony but we can definitely work something out later on for you.  
I was beginning to worry that they were all males because the girls are so blue but they are definitely females now,,lol.
Maybe the previous owner craned them but time will tell if the blue colours dull down or stay the same.
Lance


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## Gibbs

There is not much info out there but im pretty sure females may colour up some. Good luck with it all. You can find me on any of the ozy forums. PSC, auscichlids etc

Really glad they worked out for you mate, look forward to seeing a pic or 2 of the fry and the parents :thumb:


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## aussie123

I stripped another girl today which was the one i thought was a sub dom male.
It was day 10 and near half of the eggs were hatched so the rest should hatch within the next 24 hrs.
There's about 25-30 wrigglers so far and I am so happy,lol.
Lance


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## Gibbs

Well done mate im happy for you.


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