# Should I buy this setup?



## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Heya folks, quick question for you. I was going to buy a 75 gallon tank/stand/canopy from someone on craigslist but it fell through. I've been in contact with someone else, and I'm very close to taking my truck and getting it. The one thing I'm apprehensive about is that it's already stocked. It's already stocked with 5" Five Star Generals and Cobalt blues, I'm sure there's a little more diversity than just that, but those are what he was most proud of.

Now, I don't know much about all of the fine parts of this hobby yet, so this may mean nothing. Apparently they are all wild caught, and the five stars have spawned for him consistently. To me that sounds like a really cool perk, but maybe it's not "all that". Some more details on it all would be that it's a 135g with the rounded corners on the front only, comes with stand/canopy, lighting (not sure what type), an Eheim 2075, and a what looks like a whole mess of holey rock. All for $250.

It's late now and I need to hit the sack, but I'm planning on calling him tomorrow with my verdict. Gimme a hand figuring whether I should go through or not.


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## Pali (Dec 22, 2009)

a 135 g for 250 bux incl light, stand, eheim canister and breeding W/C fish - Don't sound like a bad deal at all!

You can always just sell the fish off if it's not you, I would pick it up if I was you!


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## demonsoni (Feb 10, 2006)

Just take the fish to the lfs, tell them you bough them there and want to trade in for store credit and take whatever they offer.


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## Manoah Marton (Feb 17, 2009)

hey....no lying now. IMO, get that tank. It sounds like a good deal, and I would totally go for it. If you don't like the fish it 'comes' with, I really, REALLY doubt you'll have trouble getting rid of WC fish. Heck, you could probably make a few bucks off 'em. :thumb:


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## Tshethar (Jul 20, 2009)

Sounds like a good deal to me, though every local craigslist market is a little different. The replacement cost of the Eheim filter alone is close to $250, and anyone who starts with one of those and is interested in wild caught fish sounds like he has tried to "do things right," or at least probably did not just patch something together, I'm thinking. Make sure the stand works for you, check the seams for damage and the glass for any problems (cloudiness, scratches, etc.), but if it were me I'd be psyched about this one. Also, if you choose to let go of the fish, you can also put up an ad on the trading post here or on Aquabid for local pickup and a hobbyist might give you a fair price for the WC fish. (It would help if you could identify everything there is, and not just with trade names, and also verify that they were sold to him by a reputable source as WC.) Lastly, I've priced Texas holey rock on Ebay before, so if you decide you want to landscape differently for a different type of fish, you can sell that for some $ as well.

Have fun! :thumb:


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

While the price sounds stellar for my area, there is a point you should keep in mind. People are sometimes not totally honest! I have seen fish sell at ACA auctions as WC and some were born in my tanks!!! I had sold them as fry. Just keep in my that it is very dicey on that point. It is a system that makes it very hard to trace who decides what is WC. The deal without the fish sounds fine though, so I would go for it and not worry the fish part.


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Wow thank you so much for all the replys. Its sounding pretty hands-down so I'm gonna give this guy another ring right now.


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Ok so I squared it up, I'm going to pick it up Friday woohoo!. Thank you all so much for giving me your opinions on that. In talking with him more, turns out he's moving shortly and needs to get rid of the setup asap, hence the really low price. I went ahead and told him that once I get to see it in person if all is well I'll pay him more, just to be fair. I want a good deal but I dont want one so good I feel guilty haha. Plus that's a good reason for him to not go wishy washy and sell to someone else before Friday.

This tank is pretty much twice the size I was expecting to be getting. Anything I should do to prep for such a large tank short of making sure the floor is solid and level? lol

My wife and I are planning how we're going to move it all down here, as its about a two and a half hour drive from there to our home. Our plan thus far is:

-purchase 3 buckets for the fish to make the journey in, and I'm guessing airstones will be important (hope I have an inverter lying around somewhere). Should I concern myself with any kind of heating for the buckets, or would I be fine keeping them in the cab of the truck for the drive.

-We're thinking we should purchase one or two large rubber-maid containers. Our goal is to bring no more than 75% of the water, no less than half of it. Is that a good idea, or a bit overkill?

-Set the tank up just how he had it for at least a couple weeks, let the fish calm down after the move before I think of re-arranging the tank.

Obviously my biggest concern is the transport of the fish. Any great ideas on doing that or am I thinking in the right ballpark already?


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Sorry one more question to add to my last post. I have 2 fish I want to transfer from my current tank to this new one, but I'm not sure if they are suitable for a cichlid setup using a sand substrate. First is just a common pleco, about 7 inches long. Only reason I'm concerned for him is the sand. I'm guessing it's fine but I wanted to make sure.

Second fish in question, is,,, well, a catfish. I have to admit I don't know what it is. Here is a picture of it, he's about 5.5" long, and the top fin has a spike. If anyone knows what this is, will he be a decent tank-mate for my incoming cichlids? Google decided not to help me with this haha.


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## Canis Lycaon (Jul 27, 2010)

That's a syndodontis of some kind, they are great with cichlids.


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Fantastic news, I love this little guy. Thank you!


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## Manoah Marton (Feb 17, 2009)

Just my opinion, since I'm assuming that the sellers 'WC' fish weren't the selling point, and since the guy is being forced to sell, I would say it's safe to say they are indeed wildcaught. 
Congrats on the super steal, and I would love to see pics!


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Thanks Manoah, good point on the WC thing. I'll have it set up I'm guessing late Friday, I'll definitely get some pics soon as I get it set up


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## Manoah Marton (Feb 17, 2009)

wow that was a fast response! :lol:


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Hahaha, ya I'm checking this pretty much every 30 minutes or so. I'm a tad bit excited I guess lol.

Speaking of fast responses you all have been really helpful by posting up for me quickly, thank you. We are getting everything ready, buying and cleaning buckets, etc. So the fast responses have been even more helpful.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Sounds like a good way to spend a bit and gain a lot. Some suggestions for moving the fish??

Buckets may do but have some problems. The water tends to slosh around while driving. You don't need the fish dry nor the distraction. For keeping the temperature stable and not losing water I go a different route. I've moved fish a number of time with trips as long as two days. I have had or bought cheap styrofoam coolers and lined them with garbage bags. Test a bag or two before you go to get some that don't leak a lot. The bag, half filled with water inside any box will do fine if it stay in the car, etc. If you are comfortable , the fish will be for a reasonably short trip. The styro just makes it more stable. Leave plenty of room for air above the water. No airstones needed as the water will be sloshed around and circulate plenty. Wire or tie the bags to avoid losing water. Fish out of water is way bad! Close the lid and don't look till you are home.


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## Tshethar (Jul 20, 2009)

Good advice (as usual) from PfunMo on moving the fish... I agree, especially this time of year, that fish in styro boxes in the cab will do fine. You might have him hold off on feeding them for a day before the move so they produce less waste en route.

Main thing I have to say is not to worry about trying to move water from the existing tank. What you really want to do is to preserve the existing beneficial bacteria from his system, and these guys are not concentrated in the water itself, but mainly in his filter, and to a lesser extent on tank surfaces such as rocks and in the sand substrate. I would just keep enough water to keep the sand wet, and maybe some rocks (or maybe not), and especially take care of the filter media. I would keep it in the cab and make sure it stays wet and at a reasonable temperature. Whatever you do, don't clean it, and don't clean the sand either.

The only other thing I might do is test the water for pH (or have the owner do so) before you break it down, so that when you refill the tank at your place, you can bring your pH in line with his, if need be. Get your temp around 75 or so, and then (people differ on this), either drip the fish in their boxes with your new tank water for a while before netting them out, or else (especially if they're stressed, cold, or what have you), just net them out and drop them in the nice conditions you've got waiting for them, with lights off. Most folks recommend not adding the transport water to the new tank.

Maybe others will chime in with more or slightly different ideas, and there are probably old threads on transport you can search, but in general there's no reason it can't go well with only a limited amount of planning. Some of the fish I have were sent to me by priority mail!


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## ebjdftw (Aug 24, 2010)

I would love to see pictures of this tank when it's all done! I wish you luck on the transport :thumb:


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## Jamey (Jul 19, 2008)

just make sure your floor can hold close to a full ton of weight


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## AC (Jul 26, 2010)

I've moved two set ups around this size since July...

It has taken every inch of bed, cab, and front seat to move it.

You need buckets for substrate, rubbermaids for the rocks and any decorations, a sink to tank vac/fill, towels, net, and a basic tool kit in case you get there and find anything needs to be unscrewed et.

And excellent ratchet straps!

Pump out the water into your buckets first just using a simple tube drain, once they are filled start the sink to to tank vac to suck out the remained.

Pull out rocks and decs while doing that.

Wait until there is very little water left in the tank to start netting.

It goes easier that way.

Add prime to each bucket to keep ammonia levels low on the trip.

Leave water in the eheim so that you get an instant cycle going on the reset.

I don't think you need all that water saved....

Lowes has 5 gal buckets and lids for about $4.

I would get the new set up matched to temp of the buckets and then add the fish.

Don't add at a drastic temp difference of several or more degrees.

It will take time to do the reset so the buckets will probably end up about 1 degree below room temp.

You are looking at a very very long day....

5 hrs driving 3 -4 hours break down and load with another 3-4 hrs reset.


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## AnThRaXx (Apr 21, 2008)

just my 2 cents. dont use any cleanser on the buckets. just rinse well with tap water. also the bubbler for that long drive is a great idea. extra stress coat wouldnt hurt either (wat i use reduces ammonia which fish produce in bulk when stressed) well GL to you on ur cichlid adventures!


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## Tshethar (Jul 20, 2009)

Really good advice from AC... :thumb:

He nailed it.

Makes me think that you might want to look into renting a trailer, especially if there's extra furniture like a wooden canopy and you're bringing help. I dunno, maybe the smaller rubbermaid containers can both hold rocks and fit in the empty tank...

Also, a scoop for getting the sand out really helps.

By the way the 120 I have has 5/8" glass and while I'm not a big dude, three of us could barely handle it empty. So you may need to bring help to lift it...

It is a big day... hopefully worthwhile in the end. :wink:


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

While it does conserve space, I might consider the idea of putting things inside the tank. Make sure there is no way for what you put inside the tank to get up speed if you have to stop suddenly. With a wet bottom and maybe a little sand, a box of stuff inside can get a pretty good run going if you slam on the brakes or turn suddenly. Probably won't happen but that's what gets us in trouble if we don't plan for it. Just pack it in tight if you do use the inside for extra space. Plan for the worst but hope for the best?


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## mel_cp6 (Feb 3, 2009)

i dont know what kind of temp you have there but it may be better if you just bag all the fishes separately. i didnt read the whole thread but you wont need to bring the water back. lol.
just make sure when you set it up, ph is about the same.
make sure you keep all the biomedia submerged in water.

thats an awesome deal btw.
i also have that syno tanganyika catfish and its so much fun to watch.
they like to swims upside down below the surface of the water.


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## AC (Jul 26, 2010)

I wouldn't put rubber maids with anything like rocks in the tank for moving purposes.

Just too risky on them sliding and hitting the glass.

They can be stacked three high in the back of the truck cab...

You can also place some things in the base of the stand.

Just make sure those items cannot slide into the tank glass.

I just moved a 150 with fish, three canister filters,a custom designed protein skimmer, four lighting fixtures, stand, rocks, substrate with just a little less driving than you did.

I used three 5 gallon buckets (two for fish, one for substrate) and three large rubbermaid storage bins, and one banker's box.

Renting a trailer really isn't a bad idea as it will give you a lot of extra space, but I would go with an enclosed unit as opposed to an open unit that sits low to the road allowing the tank to be hit by any small road debris that might be kicked up by traffic such as small stones.


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## AC (Jul 26, 2010)

Oh, and one other thing you will find helpful is a small wet vac to suck up any remaining water from the very bottom of the tank and bits of substrate.

It will just save you time...


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

I'm about to head out to buy some rubbermaid containers to take at least half of the water with me. Good idea? Bad? Unnecessary? I'll of course be cleaning all containers I use diligently. Also, I did want to have a sand substrate, though this tank has gravel currently. Should I not bother yet with the sand, and just focus on getting the fish moved with as little stress as possible (as in not changing the layout or biology in the tank at all yet), or should I take advantage of the fact the tank will be empty and go for it?

My first priority will be the health of the fish. I don't care what the tank looks like if it means risking killing these guys. What do you think?


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## Manoah Marton (Feb 17, 2009)

First, good call. Many people would put the equipments safety over the fishes health. 
I would say forget the water. It's unnessesary, because there's almost no BB in the water at all. Keeping your sand and filter media wet and oxygenated is far more important. We moved recently, and I dumped all my water, but focused, as far as equipment/decor, on the sand and filtration. That is by far the most important, and my tank turned our great.
Best of luck with the transport...and your going to have a very fun day...I know from experience. :thumb: 
And on a final note, you mentioned that the tank currently has gravel, but you would like sand. What I would do, is get your sand (PFS, Play Sand, the like...) and get it cleaned and put in there. Then, take the gravel, put it in old stockings/socks, and let it sit on the sand bed. Even though it'll look pretty strange, :lol: , it will help get a colony of BB going in your sand.

Manoah Marton

P.S. Don't forget to take pics. of the entire process...I really want to see exactly how you are going to go about this. Oh, and did you decide if your going to keep the fish it comes with yet?


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I have never felt the water of much value, especially if you can maintain the bacteria in the filter and some of the decor. Whether to change to sand at this time is a pretty close call to me. Upside of keeping the gravel might be potential good bacteria riding along on it. Maybe difficult for it to survive when the gravel is scooped into buckets. One of the big downsides I see to changing to sand right now is the amount of work and time it takes to get the sand ready and settled. Adding sand is by itself quite a lot of work. Almost any sand will require a lot of rinsing and even then there will be some fine stuff floating. It can take a day or more to settle. If there is not a strong will to change to sand, I would not. The fish will be fine with either. One of the things about moving the water is that you may want to change out quite a lot of water to get the tank cleared up enough for the fish. Any time I've moved tanks I only took what was needed to let the fish swim well during transport. I thought one major bump in water qualities better than two. We may be over thinking this a bunch because fish truly are pretty hardy.

Given good clean water after they arrive at home, most will make it fine. Much better than being put in a box and loaded on trucks and planes for 2-3 days. At minimum you won't be throwing them across the room!


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

I posted my last comment without having noticed there was a page 2... sigh haha.

I'm now not going to plan to bring any water with me, thank you for clarifying that for me. I'm lucky enough to have a good buddy willing to meet me over there and help load/move everything using his truck as well, so we'll have 2 trucks woot. I'm going to go get some foam coolers as soon as I have an exact count of fish from this guy, so I know how many I should get. Since I have just realized the existence of page 2 on this post, I'm digesting everything here having just read it. Thank you very much for all of this. I feel like I'm ready now and a lot less nervous than I was 20 minutes ago.

I'm planning on keeping these fish, as from what I hear they are very very cool. This guy certainly loves them to death, so I can only guess I will too. As for the sand I'm thinking it will be best to keep that for its assistance in cycling the new water quickly, since I'm not taking any of the water with me now.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

It sounds like there might be a bit of confusion about what we working on with the cycle. We all talk about getting the tank and water ready but to many of us the real process is getting the bacteria ready. Where it lives and how much is in the filter gravel or water is open to discussion. I think most will agree that the water holds little of the bacteria compared to the rest of the tank. Getting the water ready is much more simple and direct. Get it up to the correct temperature and more or less in the same PH and the water is ready. The bacteria is what takes a long time. Bacteria to turn ammonia to nitrite maybe a week or two. Then when you have nitrite a second bacteria begins turning nitrite to nitrate- maybe another week or so. You can see where keeping the water might be nice but keeping the bacteria alive in the filter is much, much more important. Killing it can put you back a month or more leading to all kinds of struggle to keep the fish alive in a tank developing ammonia.

Sorry, if you knew this already. Just don't like to leave others who might be reading along with the wrong impression. I think you've got a good plan going. Enjoy the trip.


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Thanks PfunMo I have all of you to thank for having that "good plan" you speak of lol. I did want to clarify real quick from what you just said, will I be able to get these fish back into their tank in a reasonable time? Or will I need to wait for the new water to go through all the steps you just listed (ammonia to nitrite to nitrate) while using all gravel, rocks, and filtration freshly moved over. Sorry for getting a bit confused I know you were clarifying for others, and even said my plan is fine, but at this point I want to make absolutely sure I'm not going to find myself in trouble. I'd love to send some pictures to this guy in a couple months showing him his babys are alive and well.

Oh and a side-note, I found my laser thermometer that I use for my computer work. I tested it on both tanks in the house and it reads exactly what the mercury says inside the tank. Maybe you all are aware of this already but, if not, yay I'm helping. Sure it wouldn't be ultra useful for an established tank with a standard thermo in it, but for things like what I'm undertaking tomorrow I think it will be a blessing. For those who may be interested here's the one I have. http://www.amazon.com/MicroTemp-MT-100-Digital-Infrared-Thermometer/dp/B000EIVWSW


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

Btw, not sure if anyone told you yet, but the syno is a Synodontis Eupterus, grows to be about 8" or so, great fish!


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## AC (Jul 26, 2010)

keep the canister filter filled with water during the move and get it up and running on the set up as soon as possible and you should be fine.


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Great. I can safely say I'm excited on all fronts now. I'll be sure to snap some pictures throughout the process of moving and setup as well


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Yes. I believe you are good to go. The water other than temperature and small things is pretty much second to getting the bacteria working. That you will have from all the other things. All your good buddies will be set up and waiting for their chow, once you start feeding again.


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## Tshethar (Jul 20, 2009)

What you might find happens after you go through this process is that the tank goes through what some call a "mini-cycle," which happens when the normal population of healthy, beneficial bacteria are disturbed for any reason. Most likely you won't have to do anything while this process runs its course (and it may not amount to much of anything if you don't disturb the contents of the Eheim), but you might want to read up a little on this site (either in the library or by searching old threads) about "the nitrogen cycle" or "cycling an aquarium." Until your bacterial population can fully re-establish itself, it's possible you'll see some cloudiness in the first weeks after the move, and more importantly, you might get elevated levels of ammonia and nitrite, which are normal but toxic byproducts of the fish that are normally broken down quickly by the "good" bacteria. You might want to get some test kits for these to have on hand, and then keep an eye on the levels of these for the first couple of weeks. I'd also get a water conditioner such as Prime (recommended above for the transport as well) that will reduce the toxicity of these compounds if they start getting elevated enough to be dangerous for the fish.


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## AC (Jul 26, 2010)

Teggy said:


> Great. I can safely say I'm excited on all fronts now. I'll be sure to snap some pictures throughout the process of moving and setup as well


I was so excited about the 150 I picked up a two Fridays ago that I couldn't sleep the night before and did it all on 1 1/2 hrs of sleep.

:lol:


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

I'll spend some time on that Tshethar it would only make sense to know about that stuff before I do all this. If only I had a large empty tank in which to store these guys while I make sure their water is good to go. Though I guess that would kind of defeat the purpose of getting this tank in the first place :lol: . I hope I can find some Prime on my way out of town or on the way.



> I was so excited about the 150 I picked up a two Fridays ago that I couldn't sleep the night before and did it all on 1 1/2 hrs of sleep.


Lol I was already wondering how I would sleep tonight. After how much time I've spent with research and cruising ads it's definitely exciting. I'm still quite nervous about keeping the fish healthy through the process, course I wont feel better about that until all is said and done.


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Well I'm gonna call it a night. I imagine I'll be posting up on Saturday about how everything went, since I'm sure I'll be quite tired by the time I'm all set tomorrow. Hopefully I dont have any hiccups but if I do I'll make a thread, and I'll be sure to put an exclamation point on the title, lol.


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## hbbyhorse (Oct 15, 2010)

IMO, I think the price is very reasonable! I picked up a 75g bowfront, complete w/fish for $150, it too was a craigs list find. As far as moving them, you're on the right track, are you gonna put lids on the buckets? I used grocery bags, allowed for air, yet kept them from jumping out.
Congrats on you find, can't wait to see pix!


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## BoilerFan (Jun 20, 2010)

opcorn:

Just read through this whole thread.

Congrats on the find :thumb:

I will definitely check back to see how the process went for you. If you follow all the advice in this thread you'll be just fine.


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

Alrighty, I got the tank and set it up. What an ordeal haha. Tell me what you think  
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=1540181#1540181


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## jchild40 (Mar 20, 2010)

Well done!


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## Teggy (Nov 5, 2010)

> Well done!


Thank you! I'm so darn sore after moving all of that and being so non-stop that day and a bit of the next. I woke up this morning feeling like an 80 year old man after having tumbled down 2 flights of stairs. Darn lack of upper-body strength.


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