# smaller frontosa



## Alexpol08 (Jun 29, 2014)

*** been looking into frontosa's lately and *** been reading that they get rather large.

Are there any subspecies that would be suitable for a 75 gal tank?


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## Razzo (Oct 17, 2007)

Alexpol08 said:


> I've been looking into frontosa's lately and I've been reading that they get rather large.
> 
> Are there any subspecies that would be suitable for a 75 gal tank?


Nope. A 75-gallon tank is typically used as a grow-out tank for the first year of life.

You can try 1 tret in a 75?

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=1639

I don't have a lot of experience with trets but hear they are SUPER aggressive. You might be able to build a community tank if you do your homework.


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## Alexpol08 (Jun 29, 2014)

well ****. Thanks for the response.


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## BratmanXj (Feb 11, 2013)

I preface ALL of my posts on tank stocking with "Individual Result May Vary" but this is my current stocking for a 75g community Tanganyika tank:

4 N. Tretocephalus, 6 N. Helianthus, 4 Temporalis Shell, 6 J. Ornatus (didn't intend to get this small of a species), and S. Lucipinnis

I've had this tank together for about 6 mo. now, heavily planted & rock-scaped with quite a bit of water current and so far have not had an issue with aggression. I do know I've over-stocked for the tank and have a lot of inhabitants that SHOULD create issues within this environment but I've been lucky. The Trets, Helianthus & Temporalis are all full adult and the Ornatus aren't far behind; yes the supposed calmest species in this tank is also the smallest. The Temporalis are the most aggressive fish in this tank and will push around the Trets & Helianthus.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Are the trets or helianthus spawning? I'd see how it's going in a year.


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## BratmanXj (Feb 11, 2013)

No spawning in this tank, not even a particular species really "staking out" their own territory. The easiest way to describe it is a constant tug-o-war but they only move about 3". The fish don't really chase each other but will flare up and move someone off a rock pile, they swim away and 2 hours later return. I admit by every account this tank shouldn't work but some how....


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I'd expect it to work until they start spawning...maybe you will have some time to enjoy it first.


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## BratmanXj (Feb 11, 2013)

I usually keep my tank on the cooler side to quell aggression & keep breeding habits to a minimum.


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## Als49 (Jul 11, 2014)

BratmanXj said:


> I usually keep my tank on the cooler side to quell aggression & keep breeding habits to a minimum.


My friend who's a wild betta breeder also uses the same strategy: cooler water. Less activities and aggression, more fish in the tank, less food, less WC.

However it looks boring because the fish seems hibernating and does nothing.


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## BratmanXj (Feb 11, 2013)

I keep the tank at 72-74 deg, not cold to the point of hibernation but definitely keeps the aggression issues at bay. If I crank it up the 80's I have fish flying every which direction so much so as you can't get a good picture.


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

Really they are in a state of semi-hibernation, given you are keeping the temperatures low enough that you don't see normal behaviour out of your fish. I can't really say that I can endorse keeping fish in a manner that results in them not behaving normally. I mean I get it, instead of housing them in a manner where they could be kept best, and managed within effective territories, they are being suppressed and not killing each other... I guess that is something.


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## BratmanXj (Feb 11, 2013)

I've seen that response before. I've also had the discussion that the natural habitat isn't always 90 deg water temps, average water surface temperature is 78deg. If you go down 10' or 20' below the water surface what is the temperature? With previous tanks I've had spawning at 72-74 deg from helianthus, cylindricus, calvus, petricola, as well as South American & Malawi species.


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## BratmanXj (Feb 11, 2013)

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/lake_tanganyika.php

I stand corrected...I am 2-4 deg below the lake but still within a reasonable margin to still have healthy, active fish without massive aggression issues.

Edit:
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/lakes_east_africa.php
And here is another article in our library that states 80ish surface temperatures and 70's below; anything into the mid-80's causes oxygen deprivation.


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

80's is too high.. but somewhere in 76-78 is about right.

If it is too cool for normal behaviour and breeding... well there is a problem.


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