# metriaclima estrethae question



## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

I read somewhere that in the wild, metriaclima estrethae males are actually blue. I never seen blue males in common petshops.... does it breed out that easily? The other thing is, does the blue come later on in life? Or are the fry of wild metriaclim estrethae sexable upon their release from their mother?


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## Dewdrop (Nov 20, 2007)

I don't know the answers to your questions and I've never seen them either but I've seen some members here post that they have the blue male variety.


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

It isn't that it is easy to breed out, just that in what is known as the red x red "strain" it has been fixed several decades ago to only have red males.

Blue males are born blue from birth, and yes they are sexable from day one.


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## trigger (Sep 6, 2002)

They are blue from day one. Meaning they don't change from orange to blue during their life. As far as my experience goes, it's a gamble if offspring if blue or orange (males that is). I've had both orange and blue offspring from the same parents.


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## trigger (Sep 6, 2002)

I knew I had this picture somehwere. Some brotherly love 








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## Afishionado (Jun 6, 2006)

As an illustration, here is a pic of some bluexred fry still with yolksacs. Although the eggs were all bright orange and the yolksacs are also orange, it's unmistakable which are the 'blue' males (they look more brown/black than blue at this size). The proportion of blue males I get from each spawn (always roughly 50:50, if not more blue males) leaves me doubtful there are any orange males in there. One would have to think it's possible there's the odd orange male, but in the proportions I consistently see it's reasonable to assume an orange fish is a female.


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## Super Turtleman (May 21, 2007)

I found a blue male at PetSmart once and bought him along with 2 females. He was a beautiful fish. Unfortunately, after I put them into the tank, the end of the intake pipe came off and he got sucked up in there.  I haven't found another one since. If I find one though, he's going home with me.


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

Super Turtleman said:


> I found a blue male at PetSmart once and bought him along with 2 females. He was a beautiful fish. Unfortunately, after I put them into the tank, the end of the intake pipe came off and he got sucked up in there.  I haven't found another one since. If I find one though, he's going home with me.


The bulexred strain is almost non existant in the box stores. It is much more likely that the fish you got was a Metriaclima callainos (cobalt zebra) whixh is a different species though they look very similar (cobalts are all bule, both sexes)


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## Mudkicker (Apr 2, 2003)

In 10 years i have never seen the blue M.Estherae male in any LFS.
how difficult are they to obtain from online dealers?


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## Dewdrop (Nov 20, 2007)

I was thinking the same thing as Malawilover about Super Turtleman's post. I doubt I could tell the difference between a blue red zebra and a callainos (even though I have some callainos). Other than sexing them how would you tell the difference in males of those 2 species?


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## plow (Feb 19, 2008)

I have a blue male, which I obtained from my neighbour. He was the only surviving fry of a batch in a show tank, and I think his parents were both zebras. obviously I need to check this out. I have always wondered if he was a callainos but in all the photos I have seen they are much bluer, and much brighter. my guy often seems a grey blue...

I'll try and get a photo of him up here.


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## noki (Jun 13, 2003)

Esthere "blue" males are more variable in color than Callainos. Callainos are bright blue from a young age.


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## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

1 LFS around here sells frost blue males and OB Females. Although that store is hardly and LFS, they are too good to be considered one in my opinion.


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## Afishionado (Jun 6, 2006)

Mudkicker said:


> In 10 years i have never seen the blue M.Estherae male in any LFS.
> how difficult are they to obtain from online dealers?


They are around in Montreal, you just may have a hard time finding them at lfs. I obtained mine from a well known african cichlid importer east of the city (mine are not w/c). I breed and sell them to lfs occasionally - but I'm concerned they may not realize/understand what they are (despite my say-so) and mix them up or sell them as something else. (Some stores just don't deserve to be entrusted with decent stock...).. My original trio cost me $10 ea. PM me for more details if you wish.

I agree about the variability of the colour of the blue males - not that thay are different looking from one to the next, but that they can change from almost pure white to turquoise to a darker grey-blue depending on mood. As adults, that is; it is true they are darker in colour as fry (as shown in my earlier pic in this thread).


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## plow (Feb 19, 2008)

here is my male, would be cool to hear your opinions, zebra or callainos? he normally looks a bit bluer than this photo, depends a lot on the angle of light reflecting off him.


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## Terrence23 (Oct 2, 2008)

I'm pretty sure I had a blue M Estherae last year in my newbie days that I picked up from Petsmart that was in a tank of red zebras and mediocre looking yellow labs. At first it was M Callainos but when he got excited I could clearly see the faint barring that an M Callainos doesn't have and he would turn an almost ice white color from a dark blue. Of course, he might have been a estherae/callainos cross hybrid but still a beautiful fish. Died late last year of bloat, alas.


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## Dewdrop (Nov 20, 2007)

Looks like my callainos to me. Maybe mine aren't great quality. Sometimes they are a real pale gray and even show some slight barring. I have 3 males and one female (I know it should be the other way around and find it odd but have never had her hold). My female is usually a prettier blue than the males (if she truely is female, maybe I should try venting her) :roll: .


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## Super Turtleman (May 21, 2007)

I guess it could have been a Callainos....but we'll never know. It was a beautiful fish though. I think I may have to pick up some Callainos for my tank now that I keep picturing him/her.... :roll:


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## Guest (Oct 11, 2008)

Afishionado said:


> I agree about the variability of the colour of the blue males - not that thay are different looking from one to the next, but that they can change from almost pure white to turquoise to a darker grey-blue depending on mood.


Have seen the same thing with my male. He also often shows barring.


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## Afishionado (Jun 6, 2006)

The barring is something I have never seen in mine. Differences between blue males from different collection points from what I've been able to gather. I'm convinced they're not estherae x callianos hybrids as I've grown on numerous spawns and every single juvie has had clean colouring, either brilliant orange or very dark grey-blue. (The lighter shades are mood-dependent once the fish matures.) In the case of hybrids, an offspring may look exactly like one parent or the other, or something muddled in between - however, if _not a single juvie_ out of multiple spawns looks even slightly muddled by 2" - 2.5" that's pretty conclusive to me.

A less typical colouring (possible influenced by the lighting in the pic.









Semi-subdued colouring.


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## Mudkicker (Apr 2, 2003)

Afishionado said:


> The barring is something I have never seen in mine. Differences between blue males from different collection points from what I've been able to gather. I'm convinced they're not estherae x callianos hybrids as I've grown on numerous spawns and every single juvie has had clean colouring, either brilliant orange or very dark grey-blue. (The lighter shades are mood-dependent once the fish matures.) In the case of hybrids, an offspring may look exactly like one parent or the other, or something muddled in between - however, if _not a single juvie_ out of multiple spawns looks even slightly muddled by 2" - 2.5" that's pretty conclusive to me.
> 
> A less typical colouring (possible influenced by the lighting in the pic.
> 
> ...


Very nice fish.


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## Dewdrop (Nov 20, 2007)

Afishionado's blue male M. estherae appears to have a touch of yellow on the back tip of the dorsal fin and on the tail. Is this an indicator to identify estherae over callainos? I'm starting to wonder which I really have now :lol: . There really is no difference in head or shape is there?


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