# Filter Types



## smiller613 (Aug 3, 2014)

What is the preferred filtration setup for a 60 gal with approx. 20 Malawi Mbuna? I'm considering canisters, but I have only ever used HOB.


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## mambee (Apr 13, 2003)

I use canisters on my 2 large tanks and like them. For a 60 gallon tank, I would do both a HOB and canister so that you will have excellent mechanical and biological filtration.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

mambee said:


> I use canisters on my 2 large tanks and like them. For a 60 gallon tank, I would do both a HOB and canister so that you will have excellent mechanical and biological filtration.


Excellent advice. I always use two filters on my tanks- if one malfunctions (which always happens on that long weekend when you're out of town) the second filter can keep disaster averted.

For a heavily stocked 60 gallon tank, combined filtration should rate 500-700 gph. My favorite HOB filters are the Aquaclears... an AC70 combined with a XP3 Filstar canister would be good. You can pack either with whatever works best for your set up (ceramic rings, sponges, filter floss, eg).

But, no matter how good your filters are, you will need to keep up with water changes. :fish:


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

> For a heavily stocked 60 gallon tank, combined filtration should rate 500-700 gph.:fish:


Okay, okay&#8230;I've heard this soooo much. Why do you feel the need to have 500-700 gph in a 60 gal. tank?
You only need enough filtration to keep your water parameters in check. Over filtration although not harmful
is definitly a waste of money. :dancing:


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

It is a rough guide that can help a new hobbyist make decisions. :thumb:

Under-filtration is disastrous, while "excess" filtration can be helpful. If you know what you are doing and can design a filter whose flow path is ideal, then you can get by with much less filtration. However, the off-the-shelf filters are rarely ideal, and are not sufficient for the tank sizes they usually suggest. Nor are their idealized flow rates accurate. Tanks are often not maintained regularly, thus the biological capacity offered by the 6x - 10x guide is often utilized with cichlids. The additional water agitation achieved with higher turnover rates is nearly always helpful, and encouraging the use of dual filters to meet the higher turnover rate can prevent a disaster in the event of a filter failure.

So- waste of money? I strongly disagree. A $5 sponge filter can save a hobbyist a lot of grief.


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

triscuit said:


> It is a rough guide that can help a new hobbyist make decisions. :thumb:
> 
> Under-filtration is disastrous, while "excess" filtration can be helpful. If you know what you are doing and can design a filter whose flow path is ideal, then you can get by with much less filtration. However, the off-the-shelf filters are rarely ideal, and are not sufficient for the tank sizes they usually suggest. Nor are their idealized flow rates accurate. Tanks are often not maintained regularly, thus the biological capacity offered by the 6x - 10x guide is often utilized with cichlids. The additional water agitation achieved with higher turnover rates is nearly always helpful, and encouraging the use of dual filters to meet the higher turnover rate can prevent a disaster in the event of a filter failure.
> 
> So- waste of money? I strongly disagree. A $5 sponge filter can save a hobbyist a lot of grief.


What's the gph of a $5 sponge filter? "Excess" filtration is just that excess. You only need to bring your ammonia and nitrite to 0 and have a nitrate reading. Gph should go the way of the 1inch per gallon rule for stocking.


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

there is no real "1 inch per gallon rule". Stocking depends on species, size, aggression, foot type, and a lot of other factors. I have had tanks stocked at 2 inches per gallon and tanks stocked at way less than an inch per gallon.......both at what would be considered a reasonable capacity for the tank

As far as filtration, i think EVERY hobbyist should have a sponge filter hidden in their tanks. They do a spectacular job of both mechanical and biological filtration, and if you have to get a hospital tank set up for any reason they give you a fully cycled filter you can pull out of the tank and use in a hospital tank.......

I filter over 60 tanks on nothing but sponge filters run off of a central air supply in my fishroom. My show tanks run on a combination of aquaclear HOB filters and Fluval Fx5 canisters.


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

Wow&#8230;..really? No 1" per gallon rule? I thought this was a filter discussion.


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

smitty814 said:


> Wow&#8230;..really? No 1" per gallon rule? I thought this was a filter discussion.


you brought it up in relation to filtration :thumb:


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

Maybe you should read it again.


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

smitty814 said:


> Maybe you should read it again.


Are you saying i read too fast????  :roll: :zz:

Cause if you are you would be right  :lol:


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## clhinds78 (Jul 27, 2012)

10x your tank volume in GPH is just a good way to make sure you have enough filtration. With a heavily stocked mbuna tank is almost necessary to have that much. If you had less fish you could go with less GPH.


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## BillD (May 17, 2005)

Once again, we have the opinion that 10X flow is necessary and the manufacturers have no idea of what they are doing. How is it that they are still in business? As mentioned above, once your ammonia and nitrite are zero, adding more filtration won't lower those numbers nor lessen the need for water changes. In fact, having more filtration that isn't cleaned regularly will result in nitrates rising more quickly. If you look at Hamburg/mattenfilters, they use a very low flow and are extremely effective. Ditto for air powered foam filters. So, perhaps,it is time to put to rest the 10x flow myth, along with the pH shock and salt is good myths.
You can add all the filtration you want or makes you comfortable, assuming you have the budget. Just know that other than redundancy, which is a good thing, you don't have more or "better" filtration, and you still need to change the appropriate amount of water. Personally, If I look at the cost of a cannister,for lets say, a 75, I see a complete 75 set up for that cost including lights and substrate if I use air powered sponge filters, or a used HOB.


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

clhinds78 said:


> 10x your tank volume in GPH is just a good way to make sure you have enough filtration. With a heavily stocked mbuna tank is almost necessary to have that much. If you had less fish you could go with less GPH.


So if you had a 55 gal. with say 3 $5 sponge filters. Had it stocked with 15-20 mbuna. The water parameters were steady at 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 5 nitrate. You would still buy an FX5 or equivalent because the GPH wasn't at the recommended rate? That's just throwing money away.
:fish:


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

A lot of good points being made here...

Oxygenation (and other equilibrium exchanges) through sufficient circulation is an important quality of any filtration system... along with total surface area of the filter media available for colonization. Mattenfilters are great at those things, while big box store brand filters may not be. However, the cheaper, readily available filters with the easily replaced cartridges (shudder) are actively marketed to new hobbyists.

Some of the myths are dangerous or flatly wrong... the guidance of 6-10x volume circulation is neither. Imperfect- yes, not applicable to every situation- sure, but it is *practicable *advice for most people who are asking about sufficient filtration.

So- if you are a filter geek and meticulous about testing and maintenance, have at it- create your own perfect system. If you're looking for advice and want a predictable low-fuss system, then follow the long standing advice of using flow:volume ratios to determine filtration needs.


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

So ppl that maintain and test their aquarium water are "filter geeks" and apparently don't give the proper advise? I guess we just disagree. I stand by the facts that although over filtration (10x) is not harmful it is not necessary. :thumb:


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## clhinds78 (Jul 27, 2012)

smitty814 said:


> So ppl that maintain and test their aquarium water are "filter geeks" and apparently don't give the proper advise? I guess we just disagree. I stand by the facts that although over filtration (10x) is not harmful it is not necessary. :thumb:


Of cours not! But, as with many things in this hobby, there are multiple methods to do one thing and, depending on the system, all work quite well. I would not tell some one who has a 20G tank with 3-4 fish in it that they need 10x the tank volume in filtration. For example. I have a 29G tank with six fish in it and it only gets about 5x in turnover an hour and it does just fine.


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