# 125g Mbuna Stocking



## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Hey guys. So this tank isn't gonna happen anytime soon but I'm planning for the future. Have my heart set on my next tank being a 125g mbuna tank. Looking at the standard 72"x18" footprint with plenty of rockwork and filtration with pool filter sand as the substrate. So far from reading a ton of articles on this forum, this is my planned stock list so far:

Idotropheus sprengerae "Rusty"
Labidochromis caeruleus "Yellow Lab"
Metriaclima callainos "Cobalt Zebras"
Pseudotropheus sp. Acei (Msuli) "Yellow Tail Acei"
Pseudotropheus Socolofi (Albino)

All of the above I plan on starting with 10 juvies and weeding down to 1m:4F when mature. My questions are these:

1) Anyone see a problem with the proposed stock?

2) Would a 6th group be possible and if so, what are your recommendations?

And 3) When I was considering using my 60g as an African tank (ultimately chose to use it for SA to wait to do a bigger African tank) I was told that I could add 5-6 Synodontis catfish (either lucipinnis or multipunctatus). Since this is a 125g stock, does that mean I could do either a dozen of one or a half dozen of both? Or should I just stick with a half dozen of one or the other?

Sorry for the novel, thanks in advance for the responses


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## Kevin in Ky (Dec 31, 2013)

I don't see a problem with your stock list whatsoever..and you are right on with your target ratios. I would say though..considering you are in Chicago..and are still in the planning stages, to really look around at some different species of Mbuna as well. With a 125g 6' tank any Mbuna species will do fine, and there are some great ones out there that are quite a bit more interesting looking and less common than the ones you list. Nothing wrong with your list though... I would stick to 5 species of Mbuna and also 6 to 8 of one of the catfish types.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I'd probably try something different with either the callainos or acei...not enough contrast in the two colors for my taste.

I have found 5 to be the ideal number of Synodontis...once the groups get larger than 7 you end up with more problems and the level of socialization does not increase beyond what you get with 5 individuals.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

DJRansome said:


> I'd probably try something different with either the callainos or acei...not enough contrast in the two colors for my taste.
> 
> I have found 5 to be the ideal number of Synodontis...once the groups get larger than 7 you end up with more problems and the level of socialization does not increase beyond what you get with 5 individuals.


I see what you mean about the Acei/cobalts. Do you think White Tail Acei would work better than the Yellow Tail Acei? In the profiles the White Tails seem like a dark purple/black instead of lightish blue, which would create a lot more contrast with the very light, bright blue cobalts.

When you say 5 individuals for the Synodontis, is that per tank or per species? As in, are you saying I should choose 5 lucipinnis or 5 multis, or is 5 of each ok?


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

And I'm assuming you also agree with keeping it at 5 mbuna species DJ?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I like 5 mbuna species and one Synodontis species.

White tail acei would give you more contrast, yes.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Sweet. I'll probably go lucipinnis then. Don't mind a little breeding and the lucipinnis look cuter/more active


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## gillmanjr (Jan 27, 2017)

You should substitute Red Zebras for the Cobalts, its still a Metraclima species and it'll give you another bright color. Then keep the Yellow Tail Acei for the blue. I think thats the exact stock I would do if I had a 125 gallon, which I am hoping to get at some point.

Of course if you do that you can't keep fry because they will cross breed with yellow labs. Just an FYI


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Yeah, having cobalts instead of reds was because I was worried about red Zebra/yellow lab hybrids


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Ok, so the White Tail Acei, Cobalt Zebra, Rusty, Yellow Lab, and Albino Socolofi stock is my fallback, know it works option. Anyone have ideas for more interesting options? Possibly substituting in Saulosi, cynotilapia, Red Top Hongi, or other more interesting species?


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

What are your opinions on a tank of say...

Red Top Hongi
White Top Hara
Saulosi
Rusties
Either OB or Albino Red Top Zebras


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Too many blue barred fish for me. And the hongi females are drab.

If you could only have one blue barred fish, which would it be? From your list I would choose either saulosi or hara.

If you went hara you could do maingano for the bright blue.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Oh. Sorry, I thought the Hara and Saulosi would be able to go together because the Hara are such a light blue they're almost white and the Saulosi look more dark like a Demasoni.

Ok so I'm that case I'd keep the Hara. I like the Mainganos. And I'd like to regain the lost yellow from the Saulosi, but not with Yellow Labs. Maybe Msobo? Crabo? And true on the Hongi, I'll drop those. So maybe...

White Top Hara
Mainganos
Rusties

Would you add Msobo to that mix? Or would that cause problems with the Msobo males being too similar in coloration to the Mainganos? And are Crabo too aggressive to add?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I tried demasoni and hara...the hara did not show well.

The msobo would be fine with those 3.

Crabro turn brownish black when mature...and they are aggressive, but if you love them you could make them work.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Do only the males turn the brownish black? The females keep their yellow? And yeah I know they're more on the aggressive side, but hey so are Mainganos and Msobo right? As long as they aren't total berserkers/tank destroyers like auratus


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

No they are more on the berserker side. And huge. Not sure the females keep their bars.

If I had to have a yellow barred fish I would look at Pseudotropheus flavus.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Haha that's actually the next one I was gonna ask you about. Ok so

Maingano
White Top Hara
Rusties
Msobo
Flavus

You have M:F ratio recommendations? I know Rusties are 1:4 and Mainganos should be around 1:7. What about the others?


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

If this is a new move into mbuna, I might point out that you have gradually moved from a "somewhat" peaceful group into some that are going to be less than peaceful. If a first effort, I might advise moving to a safer bet at the start and then once running well, try some for the simple appearance. I never consider choosing fish as a set piece item that will work in all cases but look at it as something to sort through as each species and each fish in that species will have different behavior. I feel it works pretty much like it does for people. Some who would try to be great, cannot if put in a bad situation. Fish can grow up and learn to be great or they can grow up learning to fight for every scrap and become terrible fish.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

The first list (White Tail Acei, Yellow Labs, Albino Socolofi, Cobalt Zebras, Rusties) is going to be my first 125g tank. To be a more peaceful tank to gain experience. The latest list is for a future 125g that I'm planning on being more aggressive/difficult to deal with, hence I'm doing the other stock list first as a beginner tank. I'm only asking about the 2nd list now because I like to plan ahead


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Flavus I would do 1m:7f. Females are drab.

IDK...socolofi and zebras are not timid either...just a little more peaceful than maingano and flavus.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Sounds good. Thank you very much, that gives me my next 2 125g tanks to look forward to. Also while we're here... I eventually plan on converting my 60g tank to mbuna as well. I've seen Demasoni/Yellow Lab tanks I really liked the look of. If I went that route, how many should I stock of each? I was thinking start with 20 Demasoni and 10 Yellow Labs with the intention of finishing with 12-15 Demasoni and 5-8 Labs. This sound about right?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

What are the dimensions?


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

48"long,13"deep, 24" high


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

So basically a tall 55g


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I'd do 12 demasoni and a trio of labs.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Sounds good. So if that's the stock I'm going for, and I initially stock with juvies, start with 20 Demasoni and 6 Yellow Labs and remove the problems from there?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

That would work.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Awesome. Appreciate all the input


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Sorry guys, last question on this post I swear... The more I'm looking at my first tank stock like (White Tail Acei, Yellow Labs, Cobalt Zebras, Rusties, Albino Socolofi), the more I'm thinking maybe I could do better than the Albino Socolofi. As far as a replacement species... Maybe a milder Cynotilapia species? Like Cobue or Jalo Reef? Or, I know that generally mixing lakes is considered a bad idea, but I've heard that kribs are one of the few species of non-mbuna that work well with mbuna because of similar size, water requirements, and temperament. So, what do you guys think? Keep the Albino Socolofi? Or switch to either Cobue, Jalo Reef, or Yellow Rock Kribs?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Cynotilapia would work, but females are drab. Metriaclima dolphin? Some find them skittish...I have never kept them.

Or maingano.

I would not underestimate the appeal of a white fish though. Caudopunctatus are a favorite of mine (not for this tank though).


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Well let me ask you this... The species profile on Albino Socolofi make them look like they have a uniform white, except for the red eyes. But I'm finding a lot of pictures of them with the red eyes, white bodies, and ice blue fins. Which do you think is the more realistic representation? Because I love the ice blue fin pictures so if that's what they wind up looking like more often than not I'd be happy to just go with them after all. And I'm assuming you're advising a no on the Yellow Rock Kribs?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I have kept socolofi with your other species...I know that works. Never kept the albinos...so IDK about blue fins but I have never noticed this in pictures. As you know, albino's tend to be hybrids so they may not be consistent in appearance.

I have tried various Victorians with mbuna...I did not like the result but I never tried Haplochromis "Paralabidochromis" sauvagei. I wouldn't because I would expect the same result with such a similar fish. But you never know.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Fair enough. I'll just stock with the albinos and hope for a good coloration then


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Ok so looking at the 2nd 125g stocking list (Maingano, Msobo, Flavus, White Top Hara, and Rusties), I'm thinking that maybe the Rusties would be too peaceful for the rest of the aggressive species? And plus I'm already gonna have them in the 1st, more peaceful tank. So I've been looking at replacements. Would anyone see a problem with substituting the Rusties with Labeotropheus trewavasae Thumbi West Marmalade Cats? The species where the males are a blue and white blotch with red/yellow fins and the females are OB? To give a stock of
White Top Hara
Maingano
Msobo
Flavus
Marmalade cat


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

The combo would work but I don't think the marmalade cats are so easy to get. Females aren't so great looking IMO.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Yeah that's why I didn't consider them before but I found someone selling juvies for $5. And the females aren't exactly an awesome looking OB, but then again the female Rusties aren't exactly stunners either so it's an even trade and it's something different between the 2 tanks. Would they also be best in a 1:7 ratio because they're a more aggressive species? Or is 1:5 ok? Also, I realized I didn't ask about ratios for the Msobo or the Haras either. So so far I'm looking at:
Maingano 1:7
Flavus 1:7
Hara 1:?
Msobo 1:?
Marmalade Cats 1:?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I'd do 7 females on the trewavasae and 5 will work for hara and msobo.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

Sweet. Thanks brother


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