# Using Flourish in replace of co2 injection?



## teqvet (Mar 24, 2008)

I'm in the process of setting up a 75gallon tank and wanted to have a few pieces of driftwood with some plants attached to and around it. I was thinking of java ferns since I knew they weren't a hassle to manage. I'm looking at getting a GLO T5 HO Linear Fluorescent Fixtures 48" Double. I am trying to stay away from having to purchase a CO2 system if possible, but if it needs to be done I can.

What are some easily maintained plants that I could put around the tank that would Give it some green contrast and not require so much CO2?


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## frozennorth (Dec 16, 2008)

I found Anubias the easiest to grow. I bought 1 plant for my 25g and split it in two before putting it in the tank. They grow at a decent rate and even have frequent flowers. The lighting on that tank is only 20w so less than 1 watt per gallon. I do use fertilizer but no CO2.


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

I second the anubias. Great plants!

Crypts are relatively low light, and might work. Swords, too. I don't see a WPG for your set-up, so I'm not sure.

Remember it's Seachem's Excel that works as a carbon substitute (and I do recommend it) while Flourish itself is a trace fertilizer.

The one issue of going with a low-light set-up can be algae. The pressurized C02 tends to give the plants the upperhand against the algae. But Excel will help with that, too, as it has some anti-algae properties.


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## teqvet (Mar 24, 2008)

The light fixture I listed would run some pretty high output lights I thought. Is that fixture I have listed not able to put out much light? I was under the impression it was.


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

I'm unfamiliar with your light fixture.

Usually there is a watt-per-gallon ratio that is useful. What is the wattage output of your lights? That will help you determine if you have a low, medium or high-light set-up. I do 3 wpg, which is a fairly high light set up and for which I think pressurized C02 is a must. I have heavily planted tanks with this level of light with mostly vals, swords, giant hygro and crinium (onion plants) crowding the top of the tank (and growing out of it in some cases), allowing lower-light plant below due to the shade above, such as anubias, crypts and java fern. I have to trim frequently.

With lower light, you can usually get away with just Excel for carbon. 1.5 wpg gives you a low-light situation, where java fern and anubias would do well.


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## traumatic (Sep 28, 2006)

the light fixture you have is a very nice low cost fixture and will work great for your setup.I have the 24" light on my 28. Anubias and ferns are great choices for any setup, low or high light. Flourish excel will be a good additive to use two or three times a week. I recommend going w/ the bigger bottle because it is quite expensive for the small bottles.

WPG is a bunk rule and doesnt' apply to all tanks. It was originally established to reflect the output of t12 lights on a 10 gal tank. once yougo bigger and smaller in tank size the wpg rule doesnt' apply.


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## 2ToneArmy (Feb 8, 2003)

If you have high light without CO2 you're going to have algae issues.

I didn't want to spend money on a pressurized system either so I spent about 20 bucks setting up a DIY yeast CO2 system. You should look into it


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## madmax666 (Sep 11, 2008)

i am wondering if you could get a shop light fixture and then put the t5 bulbs in those???? seems a lot cheaper!


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## 2ToneArmy (Feb 8, 2003)

You can definitely go the shop light route and put T8 bulbs in. I have two dual 48" strips over my 55 gal (4 bulbs) equaling 160 watts, and an additional 20 watt bulb I was able to squeeze in also. I am using T12 bulbs, however. My 55 is more of a 48-50 gallon as it's about an inch shorter than a standard 55.

If you don't want to pay for pressurized CO2, go with DIY CO2. Startup only costs about 20-25 bucks and you just have to buy more sugar and yeast every few months. I'm getting awesome plant growth in my tank from this


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## LJ (Sep 12, 2007)

teqvet said:


> I'm looking at getting a GLO T5 HO Linear Fluorescent Fixtures 48" Double.


I have this exact fixture. I have tried it over my 55 g for numerous different low tech set-ups and have never produced much besides severe algae. I've never injected co2 and perhaps that's the problem. There could be other factors as well.....but sometimes I wonder about this fixture. It is sitting in my closet now.


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## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

If you want some plants, no CO2 and no algae, please consider NOT lighting the entire tank.

E.g. if you wanted to place 2 bits of driftwood with crypts and anubias on and around the wood then why not use reflectors and spiral fluor. lamps directly over those two spots in the tank and leave the rest of the tank either unlit or just less lit. A Wooden hood on your tank can hide so much...

I frequently use this spot light trick (you can even buy spiral fluor. spot lights if you wanted to).

hollyfish2000, I'm not a fan of the watts per gallon rule... I find it confuses people more than helps. 
E.g. a 100W bulb over a 50g tank would be 2W/G regardless of a reflector... but we all know which tank will have TONS more light... I prefer to think about the amount of light I can manage to shine down onto plant leaves... period. E.g. 4 HO T5 bulbs with a great reflector behind them will grow almost anything fresh water... lotta light, shining down.

Hope that helps.


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## teqvet (Mar 24, 2008)

Number6 said:


> If you want some plants, no CO2 and no algae, please consider NOT lighting the entire tank.
> 
> E.g. if you wanted to place 2 bits of driftwood with crypts and anubias on and around the wood then why not use reflectors and spiral fluor. lamps directly over those two spots in the tank and leave the rest of the tank either unlit or just less lit. A Wooden hood on your tank can hide so much...
> 
> ...


Canopy/hood really isn't an option. If I can find a decent lighting system that has a reflector setup in it, that'd be a better route to go?

CO2 injection just isn't feasible at this point and won't be for awhile.


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## LJ (Sep 12, 2007)

That's really good advice Number6. I bet the spotlight effect looks pretty cool too.

That GLO t-5 HO double just produces a lot of light for having no cO2.


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## teqvet (Mar 24, 2008)

LJ said:


> That's really good advice Number6. I bet the spotlight effect looks pretty cool too.
> 
> *That GLO t-5 HO double just produces a lot of light for having no cO2*.


What about using co2 tablets?

edit:

How much light (what bulbs are recommended) if all I am growing is java fern, anubias, and java moss in a 75 gallon tank?


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## alicem (Jul 26, 2007)

I have 2 coralife double T5 fixtures over my 75G with those types plants growing in it.
My fixtures are not HO. 
The replacement bulbs are a PITA to find and when you do, they are expensive.

I prefer the AllGlass triple T8 fixtures I have over my 90G and 46bow, same plants are growing. 
I think you would be happy with the 48" triple T8 fixture. Nice bulbs and easier to find.

btw
I am sure the T5 bulb will not fit in a standard shop light fixture. 
If I remember correctly, T8 bulbs can fit T12 fixtures.
hth,


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## LJ (Sep 12, 2007)

> What about using co2 tablets?


I've never tried co2 tablets. I would just use Excel. You should be fine with those plants and some of the other lighting options mentioned, i.e., less intense than your original plan.

I still like Number6's idea, but alicem has some sweet looking low tech planted tanks so you probably can't go wrong with her advice either.


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## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

not sure how a canopy cannot be a possibility... but assuming there is some strange reason it can't be done, there are still options.

If all you wanted was some greenery, then you could stick to just anubias and put something to cover the light over the area of the tank you don't want lit.

Your other idea is to try a low light planted setup... key there is to plant at least 60% of the tank floorspace to outcompete algae. For the best plans for a low-light setup, check out this article: http://www.aquariaplants.com/lowlighttank.htm

Steve H. is one of the planted tank gurus out there... I can recommend his info easily! :thumb:


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## teqvet (Mar 24, 2008)

Number6 said:


> not sure how a canopy cannot be a possibility... but assuming there is some strange reason it can't be done, there are still options.
> 
> If all you wanted was some greenery, then you could stick to just anubias and put something to cover the light over the area of the tank you don't want lit.
> 
> ...


The reason it can't be done is the location of the tank. There are several rows of wall mounted shelving over it containing pictures and various other ornamental objects.

Thanks for the other info.. I'll look more in to those links.

edit:

If I go with that Glo T5 fixture, what type of CO2 system would be best to work with at a reasonable cost? I really didn't want to get in to the CO2 stuff if I didn't have to due to $$ and my inexperience with planted setups. I wouldn't want to kill off fish because I don't know how to manage the CO2 setup.


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## teqvet (Mar 24, 2008)

alicem said:


> I have 2 coralife double T5 fixtures over my 75G with those types plants growing in it.
> My fixtures are not HO.
> The replacement bulbs are a PITA to find and when you do, they are expensive.
> 
> ...


Will the AGA triple T8 fixture be compatible with a Perfecto aquarium? I ran in to a problem with those 2 brands with my glass tops I picked up yesterday.

edit:

is this the fixture you're talking about Alicem? The only thing with that is I need a way of elevating it over the tank. That was part of the reason I liked that GLO fixture.. it attached to a stand that elevated just far enough off the tank and didn't interfere with the shelving above.


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## alicem (Jul 26, 2007)

> Will the AGA triple T8 fixture be compatible with a Perfecto aquarium? I ran in to a problem with those 2 brands with my glass tops I picked up yesterday.


Here are the dimensions of this light, I have it over my 46bowfront:
along the bottom 36 1/4"
front to back along the bottom 5 3/8"
height 4"



> edit:
> 
> is this the fixture you're talking about Alicem? The only thing with that is I need a way of elevating it over the tank. That was part of the reason I liked that GLO fixture.. it attached to a stand that elevated just far enough off the tank and didn't interfere with the shelving above.


Yes, that's the one I measured for you above. It sits on the glass tops and tank trim, no need to elevate it at all.



> If all you wanted was some greenery, then you could stick to just anubias and put something to cover the light over the area of the tank you don't want lit.


Were you wanting areas of lower light? Sorry, I must have missed reading that.
This fixture will light the whole tank nicely. 
It's not a "super nova" fixture, tho, so anubia, java fern, crypts, vals etc should grow well under it w/o co2.
hth,


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## teqvet (Mar 24, 2008)

alicem said:


> > Will the AGA triple T8 fixture be compatible with a Perfecto aquarium? I ran in to a problem with those 2 brands with my glass tops I picked up yesterday.
> 
> 
> Here are the dimensions of this light, I have it over my 46bowfront:
> ...


No I wasn't wanting to have spotty planting/lighting. I had planned to blanket the foreground of the tank with crypts and some moss balls(maybe? not sure still), some anubias and java fern and some java moss tacked on the sides of the tank with some a patch or two of water sprite for top cover for the EBJD's while they are juvies.

Regarding that GLO T%HO Dual light fixture, I think the lights I looked at ranged from 24-54.. so max I'd have 108 wtts which was something like 1.44wpg in the 65g tank.

End goal was for a light strip to show the fish colors and another light to enhance plant growth.


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