# Petrochromis: Tanganyikan Aquarium Failure?



## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

It was 2009, and Cichlid-forum was just getting 'LIT UP' with all of these glowing reports of aquarium keepers purchasing these so-called 'Unkeepable' Tanganyikans.
They were stocking these extremely large (250 - 450 Gallon) aquariums with all of these incredible, Wild Caught Petrochromis cichlids.
These are quite possibly the absolute NASTIEST, Most Aggressive Vegetarian Cichlid - ON THE PLANET!!!!  
And, I remember back then getting inspired. Excited! And ultimately coming so close to making the plunge with this species. Attempting the impossible?
I mean, c'mon. This yellow adult P. sp. 'Moshi' looks awesome!









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For so long it had been thought that Petrochromis trewavasae was the only one of this genus that anyone had any sort of chance of keeping successfully. And though they were considered more mild-mannered in the aquarium by many.... disaster was only a case of bloat or a rampaging male away from destroying an entire tank of these fish.
And when you're talking 80 to 100 bucks - APIECE - for these things, in numbers exceeding 10 to 12 individuals (more is better!!).... the risks were just unbelievably high.
But then we started seeing these incredible pics and keeping anecdotes of C-f members getting and growing out these larger, so much more aggressive Petrochromis species such as P. sp. 'Moshi', P. sp. 'Bulu Red Point'. These was even a C-f article about these cichlids,

https://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/ ... ro_pt1.php

But, where P. trewavasae was going for the rather 'princely' sum of 80 to 100 dollars apiece? These other, larger and rarer species were starting at around 150 to 200 each. 
* *GULP**
And with minimum, recommended stocking numbers ranging anywhere from 15 to 30+ of these brutes to attempt control of (out-of-control) aggression... things were getting out of hand.
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And, I suspect the ultimate success rate for keeping these 'Unkeepable' Cichlids just about cratered. There were just many problems to overcome.
- Beyond 'Enormous' Tank Size
- Highly sensitive to Bloat and other maladies
- A willingness in this species to just wage absolute WAR in an aquarium... Until - _EVERYONE DIES!!! _
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So, can we consider Petrochromis, a Tanganyikan Aquarium Failure?


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

Auballagh said:


> -
> And, I suspect the ultimate success rate for keeping these 'Unkeepable' Cichlids just about cratered. There were just many problems to overcome.
> - Beyond 'Enormous' Tank Size
> - Highly sensitive to Bloat and other maladies
> ...


It seems to me, that there are a ton of people keeping Petrochromis successfully. I see more success in Europe though.. plenty of breeding, and successful tanks. Pam Chin has had great success in North America, I'm sure there are many others. I don't think you are on Facebook though, correct?


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## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

Thanks for the reply. And no, the Facebook thing was really driving me out my mind. Had to call that quits over a decade ago! :lol: 
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So, from the You Tube videos I've seen of these fish in aquariums, most of the Petrochromis being kept 'successfully' looked beat up. With the exception of a few dominant fish, the rest tend to show deformed, scarred up lips from constant lip-locking battles, plus a lot of missing scales and split fins. 
Maybe those Europeans over time will be able to breed the hyper-aggression down a bit from WC fish, into something more manageable? Plus, a search showed that this post has been one of the only Petrochromis posts on C-f in almost a decade! Anecdotally at least, it seems there are not very many people out there keeping Petrochromis in their aquariums.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

Mixed results for me. I had success with Trews and not so much with sp. yellow Mtoto. Getting the right ratio is a key factor.
The prices are ridiculous now. Even w/c Trophs are no longer affordable to the average keeper. 
Last time I checked ilangi were going for $65 ea. Imagine buying 30 of those.


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

Auballagh said:


> Thanks for the reply. And no, the Facebook thing was really driving me out my mind. Had to call that quits over a decade ago! :lol:
> -
> So, from the You Tube videos I've seen of these fish in aquariums, most of the Petrochromis being kept 'successfully' looked beat up. With the exception of a few dominant fish, the rest tend to show deformed, scarred up lips from constant lip-locking battles, plus a lot of missing scales and split fins.
> Maybe those Europeans over time will be able to breed the hyper-aggression down a bit from WC fish, into something more manageable? *Plus, a search showed that this post has been one of the only Petrochromis posts on C-f in almost a decade! Anecdotally at least, it seems there are not very many people out there keeping Petrochromis in their aquariums. [*/quote]
> ...


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## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

Shall we dance, Sir.... Herr, _'GERMAN SHORT HAIRED POINTER_'?
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I disagree with you. 
But, I definitely do appreciate your views! And, can only dream of ever attaining the African Cichlld knowledge you hold. And yes, I am only that (die-hard?) New World Cichlid enthusiast - who in truth - should know better... But, I DO wonder if this Tanganyikan Petrochromis dream will ever be actually attainable for those of us who live in well... the real world?

Yes, I know.... they are beautiful! Gorgeous!!! And indeed, I admit that I too once wanted to grow and raise those impossibly aggressive Tanganyikan, Petrochromis Cichlids. But, I can only look at those fish kept in that 180 gallon tank in that video and feel.... nope - that tank is just - _NOT BIG ENOUGH_.
All I could see in that video was that those Petrochromis Cichlids are just one dominant male away from destroying - AN ENTIRE TANK - of 200 dollar fish (apiece!!!) in that tank. 
I mean seriously.... 180 gallons? It's a tiny - too small - tank for these fish!
And who, in this hobby has the means and dedication to set up the minimum 300-400 gallon tank required to (hopefully - successfully) keep these hyper-aggressive beasts?
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I would MUCH rather be faced with the (unlikely) success of spawning a pair of (OMG!!!), New World _AMPHILOPHUS_ species, Tri-Macs - or Gawd Help Us - (Partially divided) Red Terror Cichlids in that 180 gallon tank, than achieving success (?) in that tank of a single mouth-brooding Petrochromis cichlid.
I'm serious!
And, outisde of those privileged few of us who can actually afford to set up and maintain 300-400 gallon aquariums - is this Cichlid species basically beyond our reach to keep succesfully?
And I ask again: Is the Tangyanikan Petrochromis Cichlid, a failure in the Aquarium Hobby?


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

I get the feeling this isn't a discussion, just a proclamation that you've made your mind up, and nothing would change that. Nobody discusses it on Cichlid-Forum, and a couple of videos on YouTube seal the deal.

Disagree if you wish, I'll just go back to the Petrochromis Facebook group, with 1000's of videos, of successful Petrochromis colonies, including in 180 gallon aquariums.


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## Auballagh (Jan 29, 2003)

Who knows, never say never! I mean if those crazy Europeans can succeed with their Petrochromis breeding programs (or Pam Chin here in the states) and get those things bred down a notch or two in aggression. Plus, the price per fish definitely has to come down to below a 100 bucks, esp. if you need 15 plus individuals, to get the numbers right.... well, there may be a lot more successes, and we could start seeing more available in the hobby.






Whew... they are definitely an eyeful. 8)


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## sir_keith (Oct 30, 2018)

Fogelhund said:


> ...It seems improbable that potential Petrochromis owners, will be coming to CIchlid-forum for advice. This is a great site, that caters mostly to beginners, of which Petrochromis is absolutely not. This is hardly the place to draw conclusions, about what advanced aquarists keep in aquariums, but probably a decent place to get an idea of what beginners do.


Totally agree with you on this one. Just peruse the content (stocking suggestions, fish ID's, water chemistry/disease/aggression issues) and you will quickly come to the conclusion that this is a forum mostly for beginners. Nothing wrong with that, and it is fun to help people with issues, but this is not a place to look for a wealth of specialized knowledge.

There are not that many aquarists in this area that specialize in African cichlids, but that said, I know of at least two individuals locally who have had great success keeping _Petrochromis_. One of them had specialized mostly in _Tropheus_, but then set up a colony of _Petrochromis_ 'Bulu Point.' I don't recall all the details, but the colony was housed in a 180 or 240, and it was stunning. The fishes were all in great shape and bred regularly, and when I asked about their husbandry he replied, 'They're just big _Tropheus_.' I don't know this for sure, but these were reasonably large fishes when he acquired them, so my guess is that they were WC. I have never kept _Petrochromis_ because I don't have the space to dedicate to them, and generally don't see the point of monster fishes, but in my experience there is a world of difference in _Tropheus_ and _Ophthalmotilapia_ between WC fishes and TR specimens, and I'm sure the same is true of _Petrochromis_. 
:fish:


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

Auballagh said:


> Who knows, never say never! I mean if those crazy Europeans can succeed with their Petrochromis breeding programs (or Pam Chin here in the states) and get those things bred down a notch or two in aggression. Plus, the price per fish definitely has to come down to below a 100 bucks, esp. if you need 15 plus individuals, to get the numbers right.... well, there may be a lot more successes, and we could start seeing more available in the hobby.
> 
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> 
> ...


She's got all males... LOL


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## sixball (Feb 24, 2021)

I have been keeping Petrochromis for about five years and can share my experience, although I know there are plenty of folks out there with much more experience with these guys than I have. I kept and bred Tropheus for about five years before making the switch to petro's. They are much less susceptible to bloat than Tropheus (I have never had a case of bloat with the petro's) and require a lot more food. I feed them frozen krill and mysis a couple times a week which was always a big no-no with the trophs for me.

I started with a group of about 20 F2 Famula Gold's which I grew out in an 80 gallon tank and then moved to a 6' 150 gallon tank. Although they are a small petro, they proved to be very nasty, and as the male's outgrew the females, they slowly picked them off until I was ultimately left with three beautiful males and one scared female. They probably would have fared better if I could have started with a larger group and/or a larger tank. As my Famula population dwindled, I was able to get a group of 15 F1 Sp. Red's and a little later a group of 14 F1 Moshi's. I was hoping to grow them out together and that there would be enough numbers to disperse aggression. This might have worked in a larger tank, but the Moshi ended up being considerably more aggressive than the Red's, and as they reached maturity (6-7"). They would terrorize the Red's and also single each other out. I ended up rehoming the Moshi to someone with a larger tank where they could be alone so I could just focus on the Red's. I was also able to add a small group of wild caught Red's from a local gentleman that was breaking up a large colony.

I now have 17 total Red's, a mixture of F1's and wild caught, that have been together for over 2 years. The F1's are in the 6-7" range and my largest wild male is over 10". I have had some breeding activity, but I think my F1 females need to mature a little more.

Ultimately, I think the species makes a big difference, as the Red's have been much less aggressive in my experience. Here are a couple of pictures of past and current fish:


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