# hello everyone, new here. Discus owner and pics



## rickztahone (Nov 5, 2008)

As the title states, i am new here. i just wanted to let everyone know that i've learned a plethora of info in the last few weeks from this site. i've had my main discus for over 3 years and i've recently got the new small discus which has gotten me to research them more. i would do a lot of things differently now that i've read up. for one, i wouldn't have gotten so many discus for my 55 gallon tank. also, i wouldn't have purchased the under gravel filter i have. regardless, i know that now and i'm taking proper steps soon to correct those things. i plan on upgrading to a 90 gallon as soon as my 2" discus get bigger. i will remove the UGF but am debating whether i should keep the power heads. my large discus is not doing well, as well as another smaller one. i gave them some food that made them sick and they are just recovering. they had gram positive, and gram negative bacteria. they are doing much better. well, i don't want to bore any of you so here are all the pics. there are two pics that have combined names and that's due to the fact that i'm not sure which is which. also, know that the names that are given to them were given to them by the breeder i got them from in florida. the names might be different. i have no idea what my larger one is. no real plants besides the wisteria that's floating above. also, i have 10 corydoras that i couldn't capture, and 4 ghost shrimp. please, any advice is welcome openly. i know that there might be a lot of things wrong with my setup but like i said, i just recently started researching. thanks again for all the info you guys post.








left side of tank








right side








prism green








millennium red








tortoiseshell








dusty blue sapphire-aztec envy








aztec envy-dusty blue sapphire








large discus








rummy nose tetra and otocinclus








pleco








both reds in this pic


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

Rick man whats up!

It looks ok. I would just do some things like get rid of that awesome looking Pleco  he looks pretty good but he may bug the **** out of the Discus. Any of those shells should go also.

Other than that and the over stocking it looks like it could do for ya.


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## Dutch Dude (Sep 14, 2006)

Well I can think of a couple of more issues on your set up. Peckoltia, Corydoras and BN pleco's are fine with discus. Most of the other algea eating fish and cleaning crew is not suitable. So the Oto's have to go also. Those feed on the slime coat during the night. The curent aquascape makes it almost impossible to keep the tank clean. I suggest to reduce on plants and get ride of all the stones in the tank but add some driftwood. Discus don't like high currents. You could aim filter outputs towards the background so it will be diffused and the currents will reduce without decreasing filtration. Discus also like high oxygen levels. On C-F are some discus owners but unfortunately the specie isn't highly discussed. No problem becouse there are plenty of sites that are specialized to discus like www.simplydiscus.com.


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## rickztahone (Nov 5, 2008)

thank you both for the advice and i have followed it so far. the shells are gone but i left 2 stones. also, the power heads i directed towards the glass. the plants are not as bad as they look in the pics, they are quite thin and do not bother the fish. cleanup is easy since they are simply weighted and i just pick them up and siphon the mess up and put them back. i'm also going to follow your advice about getting rid of the oto's and possibly the pleco since i saw him being somewhat of bully yesterday. i'm thinking of getting a bristle nose pleco which they tell me is a little more docile and sticks to themselves for the most part. i plan on getting rid of the UGF soon and i want to change the gravel to one solid color, debating on white or blue. i heard the darker colors wash them out somewhat though. i do not want to do the driftwood due to the fact that i'm fairly new to understanding how the pH works. if i add driftwood then i know it will lower the pH but when i do a water change won't the pH of the tap be too high? do i have to put chemicals to condition it? currenly i'm only treating the water for de-chlorination and copper and stuff like that. i would like driftwood but again, i'm not sure how to keep it maintained. i've heard of mopani wood, also, malaysian wood. i'm sure there are plenty more but wouldn't a fake plastic driftwood be just as good? and i wouldn't affect the water chemistry. anyway, too much info on my part. thanks for the advice so far. more is definately welcome


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

Keep the Oto's, they will be fine. I never heard of people advising against them I only hear people suggesting them as substitutes for ANY Plecostomus be it bristles or even small little clown pleco's.

I agree with everything else but the plants, as long as you can keep up the maintenance work they will only benefit in the end. Like I said on LVC Rick, a bare bottom helps out a lot but if you want a more pleasing look then go with the sand as its really not much more of a hassle to work with while vaccing.

I say add real driftwood. The PH should be fine just adjust it in advance to adding it in. I know you live in LA and Im not sure of the water but I can imagine its loaded with chems so I would suggest buying a cheap De-Ionizer or even a cheap RO unit. Some people advise against using distilled water but I feel that is just a bunch of BS. I have used distilled and DI water for many different setups for years before I shrank down to the few tanks I have now and I only witnessed its benefits by growth and coloration in both my Marine setups and Fresh along with amphibians in some of my terrariums. I had a nice DI unit but the cartridges are expensive and only support use for up to 10g's.

Discus are pretty advanced, some people get away with keeping them in low-tech conditions without much of a hassle but I point my finger at them having good source water straight from the source itself. :fish:


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

Keep the Oto's, they will be fine. I never heard of people advising against them I only hear people suggesting them as substitutes for ANY Plecostomus be it bristles or even small little clown pleco's.

I agree with everything else but the plants, as long as you can keep up the maintenance work they will only benefit in the end. Like I said on LVC Rick, a bare bottom helps out a lot but if you want a more pleasing look then go with the sand as its really not much more of a hassle to work with while vaccing.

I say add real driftwood. The PH should be fine just adjust it in advance to adding it in. I know you live in LA and Im not sure of the water but I can imagine its loaded with chems so I would suggest buying a cheap De-Ionizer or even a cheap RO unit. Some people advise against using distilled water but I feel that is just a bunch of BS. I have used distilled and DI water for many different setups for years before I shrank down to the few tanks I have now and I only witnessed its benefits by growth and coloration in both my Marine setups and Fresh along with amphibians in some of my terrariums. I had a nice DI unit but the cartridges are expensive and only support use for up to 10g's.

Discus are pretty advanced, some people get away with keeping them in low-tech conditions without much of a hassle but I point my finger at them having good source water straight from the source itself. :fish:


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## rickztahone (Nov 5, 2008)

ok now i'm considering keeping the Oto's again. as far as the sand goes, to be honest, it seems confusing. i have been reading all posts in regards to it and they really cause more questions than answers. i wanted to go with silica sand, and then some members said no. others said pool filter sand and also others disagreed. i heard of 3M quartz sand as well. i'm at a loss as far as the sand goes, i want to go to home depot and get some sand there which they say is ok but i'm scared of getting something that is not the right type and messing with the chemicals inadvertently. i am going to get rid of the pleco though, he is being a bully as of late but not sure if just the oto's will do the algae cleanup alone. i will also look into RO and a DI unit


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

Play sand is fine, you'll see lots of creditable members here love it! Its just a pain to clean the stuff. I have been using it for a very long time with no problems at all.

The 3m is awesome as well. If you do a search around here you will find a dealer relatively close to you I think that sells it cheap and if it is to far of a drive it ships free of charge.

The good thing about Oto's is that you can add quite a few without impact on bio-load and they do better in schools anyway.

My Tanganyikan tank however does not have anything to clean the algae, I scrub it of the glass and let it grow on the rocks and background. I like to think that eventually the algae that is left behind grows and grows and hinders the growth of algae else where by out competing but Im not sure if that is how it is. I have Lupis in it and they benefit from bright lights they say so I have some pretty bright lights on my Tang tank!

There are a;so others like snails. Do research on them. I have some snails like black mystery snails and they don't reproduce like others do. I have a golden inca and that mystery for a very long time in my kids tank and I have yet to have them reproduce anything at all but they are steadily growing.

Another key on the algae battle is just to try to prevent it by water changes and keeping the nutrients down. Also since you dont have many live plants dim the lights a bit and shorten the cycle and some low light level plants would help. Or keep the lighting cycle and drop in some nice live stuff.


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## rickztahone (Nov 5, 2008)

where exactly can i get the 3M? i looked at all the links. are they site vendors like on LVC?


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

http://www.vbpstore.com/50-lb-bag-of-3m-color-quartz.html


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## Dutch Dude (Sep 14, 2006)

J werner,....Discus is something different compared to other fish. Oto's are a bad choice I I never seen the advice of Oto's in a Discus tank! For most tanks Oto's are great fish but are bad tankmates for Discus. I already told why. Rikztahone,....you can check it on simplydiscus.



> do i have to put chemicals to condition it?


 Chemicals are often the reason for a lot of troubles!!! Driftwood will leak tannins for a long time and soften the water, In most cases this isn't a problem at all. The effect of the tannins is determined by the hardness of your tapwater. Before we can predict the possible effect we need to know the GH and KH.

Playsand depends on the origin. In most cases it is fine but in some cases it contains a lot of calcium,...causing hard water. Poolfilter sand is the safest to use. Quarts sand contains sharp edges and I would not recommend it for any tank.

I suggest to do some more reading before you make your decisions. Simplydiscus is THE site if it comes to info on Discus. You can get advice from real discus experts like Discus Hans, Heiko Bleher and many more.


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

I am very well aware _"Discus is something different compared to other fish"_ and I have had many breeders suggest them to friends of mine that kept them and suggest them to myself if I were to ever decide keeping them. I have read lots of articles about keeping them with Discus both online and in TFH. Algae eaters with Discus must be cautioned but Otos are nowhere near rambunctious enough to bother discus at all and unlike many other algae eaters Otos do not make attempts to harass the fish for slime coats.



> Quarts sand contains sharp edges and I would not recommend it for any tank.


It also comes in many different grades and the smaller grades are not sharp or harmful at all.


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## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

I have to go with Dutch Dude on the Ottos... I tried them and it irritated the Discus when the Ottos would occassionally treat themselves to the Discus' slime coat.

I truly think that if I had left them in, it could have stressed the Discus allowing for illnesses to set in. Since your Discus are LFS quality (not intended as a put down at all), they probably don't have a huge resistance to illnesses, and I think it would be wise to avoid anything that might become a stressor.

If you're shopping for a new tank for the Discus, might I suggest a 6 footer? At 125 or 135g at 6ft long will allow for that many Discus to spread out from each other when they need to and group together when they are getting along. With any luck, your eldest Discus will keep the youngsters in line when they hit the 3 inch mark but the toll that so many might put on the eldest might be mroe than you'd like to see in a 4ft tank.

Hope that helps.


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

Well I'm looking into this. I don't understand how the one algae eater that has always been suggested for docile fish that never eats slime coats now does everything the opposite.

I never in the many, many years once noticed Otos bothering any fish at all, especially for slime coat.

Otos are way more gentle than ANY Pleco even the bristle nose!!!!!!!!


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## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

*JWerner2*
I would never call it aggression from the Ottos... but this trick has been noted by others as well as by Dutch Dude and me when Ottos have been kept in aquariums with large slow moving fish...

http://www.fishpondinfo.com/otto.htm

Over on Simply Discus, they warn against them as well and you'll even find the converse warnings on some catfish forums that Ottos don't fare so well up at the really high temps that young Discus do best at and shouldn't be subjected to it.

So, I'm not sure if it's really "new" info, just another case of how "your mileage might vary".

Hope that helps.


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## Dutch Dude (Sep 14, 2006)

> Well I'm looking into this. I don't understand how the one algae eater that has always been suggested for docile fish that never eats slime coats now does everything the opposite.


 Possibly you were wrong informed. Oto's prefer slimy algea, diatom algea and soft new green algea (and small food particles). Slime coat of discus will fit their menu as well,...and that's the problem. Oto's are active at night and thats the time Discus are easely stressed. A slime coat snacking Oto can couse some major stress and causing the fish to jump around the tank. For most tanks Oto's are great funny cleanup crew only not a good choice for Discus. Bristlenose like to clean wood and scavenge for food particles. They are not as interested in slime coat as Oto's are.


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## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

Dutch Dude said:


> Bristlenose like to clean wood and scavenge for food particles. They are not as interested in slime coat as Oto's are.


I've never had a Bristlenose pleco cause a single issue in with Discus, so I'd second a nice healthy BN pleco if you want a clean up crew.


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## dwarfpike (Jan 22, 2008)

I must have had psycho bristlenose plecos, but with my experience with them I would never trust them with discus. Fish that push around convicts and pikes might be a little stressfull for discus. Maybe the males are more mellow though. :lol:


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## Dutch Dude (Sep 14, 2006)

I keep a single male and no problem at all. They are suggested on Simplydiscus as suitable tank mates and were also recommended by Larry (Apistomaster). I also have a peckoltia and he is realy great! Cleans up spoiled food and avoids the discus. My BN also avoids the discus and is busy burrowing caves and cleaning wood. No issues so far. The BN is an A. Dolichopterus

Dwarfpike,....the behaviour you see from yours I recognise from my A. leucostictus. Still I'm not woried abouth them to put in with discus. They only show this behaviour during feeding time and don't let them chase away by the Guianacara. They never attack any fish dough and only try to get some food.


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## dwarfpike (Jan 22, 2008)

*Dutchdude* - Mine deffinately was unusual then, she chased even outside of feeding. Several times she would chase the cichlids even when they didn't start things. It was so disruptive I eventually had to switch her out for rubberlip plecos.


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## rickztahone (Nov 5, 2008)

hello again, i have taken much advice from many members here. first off, i didn't go with the sand, rather, light blue gravel. i really like it, it makes their color pop up more than with the white. also, i got a fake driftwood. i didn't want to start messing with the lower pH that the driftwood causes due to my tap being kind of hard. so with the fake one it doesn't cause any chemistry variance. i took out all the shells, and only left two river rocks. i got rid of my large pleco but did keep the oto's. so far i have not personally witnessed them helping themselves to the discus' slime coat. of course they are night creatures and of course i can't see them at that time. the discus do not seem stressed at all. also, i got rid of the under gravel filter, and man, what a mess. i see what you were talking about Jwerner. as soon as i picked them up there was **** all over the place. i think it looks a lot cleaner without it, and also, the fish seem to like the fact that there isn't a strong current now. they are more relaxed. all in all, you guys gave me great advice and i hope i can keep learning. only thing i want to do now is buy a sponge filter and put it in one corner. i also got rid of one of my discus so i'm down to 5 2", and the one large. here are some pics. the last one is me trying to get a shot of the ghost shrimp.


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