# Always Sad to Shut the Pond Down



## notho2000 (Dec 8, 2012)

I live in Canada (a COLD part of Canada) They don't call my city 'Winterpeg' for nothing. At this time of year, we're getting those cool nights, followed by 'not so warm' days. The water temperatures are dropping and despite the increase in dissolved oxygen, the fish are starting to become lethargic and are not as interested in feeding ... unless your a goldfish. They're having great fun out there these days. But not so much my tropical cichlids. The water temperature in the big pond is still marginally okay for them (~18-20 oC) but a few degrees cooler, and ... I checked the temperatures outside on Sunday evening after the ASW meeting. The air temperature was 15.3C (59.5F). The large pond was 20.3C (68.5F) and contains 'beani', 'rivulatus', 'hartwegi', 'breidohri', 'dimerus' and Red Ceibals along with a few native species from Florida. The small pond (100G stock trough) was 13.3C (56.0F) and contains many small 'dimerus' (a Uruguayan cichlasoma) and a few 'breidohri'. I put a 300W heater in there and the water temperatures have gone up into the low 20s. I have a bit of a problem. The tanks I was going to house the pond fish in are presently occupied by other inhabitants. A little problem solving will be in order, especially in housing the 8 'beani' ranging in size from 5 - 9", and the large 'rivulatus pair. I also expect to find Ceibal and GT fry (and I hope 'beani') out there. I took a few pictures of the pond today and 'on the surface of it' (no pun intended) all looks well. Here are a handful of pictures taken today. But it's what's going on underneath that counts. So I'll be setting up for the pond shutdown this week, when the big pond hits 14-15C. The fish can take it since the changes are very gradual. Three years ago, I pulled out a 12" pleco on November 1st. The water temperature was 3C. And once it thawed out  , it was fine. BTW, the last picture is of a bunch of 2" C. dimerus fry (F2s) in the stock trough.


----------



## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Such a cool pond! Good luck getting all your fish out, and into inhabited tanks...


----------



## notho2000 (Dec 8, 2012)

Thanks Iggy. A couple of nights ago, the weather forecast predicted a low of ~38-40 F. I was concerned that my little 2" Cichlasoma dimerus, outside in the 100G Little Giant stock trough would end up as fish 'popsicles by morning. So I put a 300W heater in there, full on. At that time, the water temperature was 55 F. The next morning (Wednesday) I checked the temperature and it was about 72 F ... much better. Figuring that the temperature would stabilize (heat lost = heat gained) at around the middle to high 70s, I left the heater in there. One thing I didn't check on was the low last night wasn't going to be really very low. I suddenly woke up in the middle of the night  , realizing that I might be "cooking" fish stew outside (heat lost << heat gained). I rushed out at 3:30 am with my flashlight, and put my hand into the trough. It felt like bathwater. Needless to say, I pulled the plug on the heater and shone the flashlight in, looking for fish corpses. What I saw were some very startled and ACTIVE babies. The next morning, I checked the temperature in there, and it was 80 F. I figure that the water must have been at least in the 88-92 F range. So for tonight I put in a 100W heater. I think the fish are going to be more comfortable, and as well, I'll be getting a better night's sleep :thumb: .


----------



## NJmomie (Jan 17, 2013)

Those are such nice looking ponds too. I love the floating plants. Do they survive the winter or do you have to bring them in too?


----------



## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

> I figure that the water must have been at least in the 88-92 F range


Let's say you had an intense heat wave. What temps can the fish tolerate for extended periods? I've never been to Winnipeg, but up to northern Ontario. There was a week of temps in the 90s. Do the cooler nights prevent the pond from getting too warm?


----------



## notho2000 (Dec 8, 2012)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> > I figure that the water must have been at least in the 88-92 F range
> 
> 
> Let's say you had an intense heat wave. What temps can the fish tolerate for extended periods? I've never been to Winnipeg, but up to northern Ontario. There was a week of temps in the 90s. Do the cooler nights prevent the pond from getting too warm?


We have had hot spells for a week at a time where the daytime temperatures have climbed into the low 90s. But the pond has never gotten much above ~80 F in the large pond. Your right about the cooler nights moderating the temperature. The pond stays pretty much the same in the summer (70-75 F) since there is a fairly large volume (~1100G) with little fluctuation. If the water temperatures did get really up there, I'd be inclined to aerate the water. The pond is well shaded with surface plants (water lettuce and water hyacinth) so that would help moderate the temperature too. I use a canister filter (lots of surface turbulence) on the stock trough and it is in the shade, so it doesn't really overheat either.


----------



## walzon1 (Jun 17, 2013)

Why don't you keep the pond heated?, seems like it would be a good alternative than hauling everyone inside.


----------



## notho2000 (Dec 8, 2012)

walzon1 said:


> Why don't you keep the pond heated?, seems like it would be a good alternative than hauling everyone inside.


Spoken like a true Californian :lol: . You can't have any idea how cold it gets up here in winter. -20 to -30 F is normal with -40 possible. I have kept goldfish outside through the winter but covered the pond with a layer of 4" styrofoam and had to use a stock trough heater to keep the water temperature at 34 F. Probably the two feet of snow that covered the pond helped insulate it somewhat but I didn't see the fish nor feed them for 5 months. They survived but not much of a life out there. I guess I could try a 1000W immersion heater running 24 hours a day, day and night for the tropicals but that would be very costly. Also I would need a good air supply. And I wouldn't be able to enjoy those fish for 6 months. Also, the pond would be a total mess in the spring. No, it's much better to bring them in. Now if I lived where you do, it would be highly likely that I would do what you suggested... lucky you, living where you do.


----------



## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

The pond 'I' had growing up was always a handful in the spring. We had koi, goldfish and sunfish. They survived the winters here in Illinois, but we also had a submersible heater running on a timer to keep the ice from covering the whole surface.

Walzon... get on that pond idea dude!


----------



## walzon1 (Jun 17, 2013)

Yea I guess your right, I am a "True" Californian I'm spoiled I guess was born and raised here, I did do a stint in Texas but even then the lowest it got was in the teens and to me that was ****. In Cali we wear Parkas when it gets below 50 degrees :lol: One thing though, it is pretty monotonous, summer and winter looks the same here nothing ever changes. I loved the fall and spring in Texas all of the colors changing, gorgeous, it was worth the heat and the ice storms and there is nothing like having a river in your backyard.


----------



## notho2000 (Dec 8, 2012)

Well. phase 1 is about done. I caught the fish in the 100G stock trough and emptied it. I'll be getting it set up to house some of the larger pond fish from the big pond along with a number of other tanks that I'm setting up for next weeks exodus. It turns out that there were about 80 Cichlasoma dimerus at 1.5-2" and maybe 5 or 6 Paraneetroplus breidohri, about 2". They pretty much doubled their size from when I put them in at the beginning of June. They are so-o-o-o colorful for immature little 'guys' but it always seems that way. Here's a couple of pics of them as I netted them out.


----------



## notho2000 (Dec 8, 2012)

NJmomie said:


> Those are such nice looking ponds too. I love the floating plants. Do they survive the winter or do you have to bring them in too?


Nothing alive survives our winters, aquatically speaking :? . I'll take some plants indoors and try to keep them alive over the winter. They don't do very well indoors for me, but I'm hoping some survive to the point where I have a start for next spring. Incidentally, in June I started with 2 or 3 plants and over the course of the summer, I've thrown out two full garbage cans of them. They're great for using up nitrates and providing refuge for young fish in their extensive roots.


----------

