# Help followed LFS advice but worried about selection



## pennyc (Jun 8, 2014)

Just back from the aquarium. I followed the advice as the aquarium came very highly reccomended. We are in Australia

I am a little concerned now. I showed them the list (which I had carefully researched all Mbuna and would get along quite well) but they steered me in the direction of some different choices and groupings.

Not having a complete knowledge of which ones are Mbuna which ones are haps etc I just told him we wanted an interesting colourful tank and went with the 6 fry he chose.

Freaking out now as coming home and googling these fish are from all over the place!

Here is what we now have

3 x Electric yellow (sex unknown)
2 x Red Zebra (both male I believe)
1 x fairy cichlid (male)
1 x venustus (male)
2 x red jewel (male)

It appears they are a mix from Malawi Tanganyika and also haps, mbuna one only comes up as miscellanous. Some like super high PH some like lower.

I am worried there will be deaths by morning.

Can the fish adjust to an average of say 8.0? Or should I be prepared to say goodbye to a couple by morning.

Perhaps I should not have relied on the lfs so much for advice but he has had african cichlid tanks and they came so highly recommended I just trusted their advice.

Should I be trying to swap some out asap? Assuming a lfs closer to us will take them as the one I went to is an hours drive away!

ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Welcome to the forum.

Picking one of these, two of those, one of this, etc. is a bad way to go about stocking a tank. And yes you do have Malawi, Tanganyikan and a West African riverine species.

What are your tank dimensions. How did you cycle your tank?


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Cookie cutter quick guideline for stocking-
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/quick_reference_list.php

Cycling a tank info-
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=239823


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## AlmightyJoshaeus (May 2, 2013)

The PH is the least of your problems...all of the fish you mentioned either like high PH, or have been captive bred so long that the PH doesn't really matter much to them. As for stocking, you have several problems;
1: Mbuna need to be kept in harems of a male and at least 5 females; otherwise, the males may literally chase the females to death. Depending on your tank size, multiple males might not tolerate each other in that tank.
2; Red zebras and yellow labs hybridize extremely easily, which is strongly frowned upon in the cichlid community. Hybrid fry also tend not to look as good as either parent, although exceptions exist.
3; As you mentioned, the 'fairy cichlid' (a Neolamprologus brichardi complex fish) is a Tanganyikan and has very different stocking requirements from mbuna, though water preferences are similar to those of mbuna.
4; Jewels are riverine cichlids, and again have very different stocking requirements than mbuna. In addition, male jewels will not tolerate each other in all but the largest tanks, so if they are not swapped asap, you'll only have one male jewel in the tank.
5; Finally, the venustus is a Malawi hap, and haps tend to either eat mbuna or get stressed to death by them, depending on the hap.

Long story short, you have some major exchanging and restocking to do. Before you start, though, can you give us your tank dimensions? Tank dimensions, especially the length, are much more important than volume in determining what you can keep in that tank.


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## pennyc (Jun 8, 2014)

Thanks for the replies it is a 4 ft tank I believe 4 ft x 18 inches deep and 2ft high it holds 180lts. It has been cycled for 1 month total before adding 3 electric yellows water had a nitrogen cycle current parameters are
Temp 25.5
Ammonia 0
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 5ppm
Ph 8.0
Gh and kh also within range but would need to restart my computer in the morning to see exactly what.


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## AlmightyJoshaeus (May 2, 2013)

pennyc said:


> Thanks for the replies it is a 4 ft tank I believe 4 ft x 18 inches deep and 2ft high it holds 180lts. It has been cycled for 1 month total before adding 3 electric yellows water had a nitrogen cycle current parameters are
> Temp 25.5
> Ammonia 0
> Nitrites 0
> ...


Sounds quite large to only hold 180 liters! Sounds more like a 90 gallon/about 340 liters to me! I think you should choose one of your current species, get a more appropriate stocking level for each species, and then choose tank mates based on your choice. If you went with yellow labs or the red zebras, for instance, you'd set up harems of that species and get two more harems of mbuna that are unlikely to hybridize with that species (I.E not in the same genus, and not having similar females...similar males are also an issue, but more for aggression than hybridizing issues.)


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## hose91 (Mar 5, 2014)

Sounds like you did your homework properly then fell into the occasional LFS trap. They don't have any incentive to tell you they don't have the fish on your list, they DO have incentive to sell you what's in their store, and to convince you they'll go fine together. I'd go back to your list, make sure they are all compatible (maybe post it here for some advice), then look for a good online dealer in Australia. There are some Oz members here as well, who could maybe help you out via PM if you would like local recommendations. Shipping is more, but you have the advantage of knowing what they have in stock, and making your decisions without a salesperson breathing down your neck. I often go to LFS to look at the fish I've researched on line, if they have them, but I rarely buy from one. Looking online also gives you an idea of what's available, as there are tons of species listed in profiles that you don't ever see for sale. I stocked my 75G tank with 37 juvenile Mbuna from an online dealer without a hitch. They're a month into my tank and not a single loss. Might have different results in Australia depending on where you are, but I think it would be my first choice!


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## pennyc (Jun 8, 2014)

Thanks so much for the advice I did my research till my eyes rolled about then trusted the LFS as they came so highly recommended silly me.

The ones I had been considering were
Yellow labs
Psuedo Acei
Cobue
Maingano

I love demasoni but read they are quite aggressive and you need a lot of them.

It is definately a 4ft that holds about 200lt so please feel free to cull or suggest fish I may not have

Thanks


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Maingano are aggressive as well. Cobue(Cynotilapia zebroides Cobwe) are gorgeous fish but tend to not color up nicely when they're not dominant in the tank. It happened to mine. If you want a more mild tank, sub the Maingano for something Rusties(Iodotropheus sprengerae). But be absolutely sure you have a tank with 18" of depth if you want to try 4 species. I'd suggest doing the 3 on your list minus the Maingano. You could always add them later after the others mature a bit.

How did you cycle your tank?


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## pennyc (Jun 8, 2014)

We filled it with sand and treated water added rocks the LFS gave us water from their filter to get the cycle going once the ammonia rose and fell and the nitrites returned to 0 we added three yellow labs after water parameters remained stable for 2 weeks we added these latest fish which are going back this weekend.

We are very keen on the demasoni can you advise the best things to mix with them?


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## AlmightyJoshaeus (May 2, 2013)

Demasoni and yellow labs are said to mix well.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

What are your current water readings? Water from a filter could help. We're you dosing the tank with ammonia?


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## hose91 (Mar 5, 2014)

Lots of good threads here about Demasoni. In short, beautiful fish, a little boisterous, mostly among themselves, start/keep a fairly large group (like 12-15 minimum), and if you bumped up your yellow labs to 7-8 total, and just did 2 species, that would be a striking tank, and probably keep you busy tending the Demasoni. They sort of take up 2 "slots". I have a 75G that's a little narrow and tall, and 3 species in it, and it's just right. I wanted four initially, but am really glad I held off. I underestimated the enjoyment I would get out of watching the species groups interact, and VASTLY overestimated the need for "variety and color". (I have Membe Deep, Lab Perlmutt, and Mainganos, and 5 tiny dwarf syno lucipinnis/petricola).

(not to derail the cycling discussion, which is pretty important!)


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## pennyc (Jun 8, 2014)

Thanks for the advice current parameters are listed in my second post. I did not dose with ammonia but used the LFS filter water to get a cycle going and once ammonia and nitrites returned to 0 and nitrates were at 5.0 added 3 yellow labs waited three weeks to see how they went and added the recent fish.

We run a canister filter and have an air stone along with quite a bit of rock.

30% water change once a week.

I think I will do as you suggest and start with a demasoni and yellow lab tank and see how that goes.

Is it possible to add single male fish of other species in the future? I can't seem to find an answer to that (perhaps that means it is an insane question lol)


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

If you go with demasoni, read up on them and be sure you're prepared what can happen with them.

Must have missed your water readings earlier. My bad. I'd add your labs in and keep tabs on the parameters. Let things settle out for a few weeks. Then add your group of demasoni, again testing water frequently. You may experience an ammonia spike. Daily water changes and using a product like Seachem Prime will help you through that.

I'd say no to adding a lone male of another species. I think you'll find the contrast of Labidochromis caeruleus and P. Demasoni very appealing. If you decide to add anything down the road, pick a mild mannered mbuna. Avoid bold, barred fish and other Labidochromis. Something like Rusties(Iodotropheus sprengerae). It may sound crazy, but start with as big a group as possible of demasoni. Like 20, if you can swing it.


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