# 40 Gal Long Dwarf Mbuna Setup Questions...



## scifisarah (Jan 4, 2013)

New to the forum and looking for some advice on getting my aquarium going. I would like to set this 40 gallon long up as a densly stocked Dwarf Mbuna tank. I have a small 1000 ft house, two young children, chickens living in my basement (until they are old enough to keep warm outside), and an Etsy business to keep up with so anything bigger is out of the question right now or I am going to be overloaded for space and what I can do with my time.

I got some free crushed coral that I rinsed and added yesterday. I had mistakenly gotten very large gravel and then found out that many mbuna like to dig. I plan on getting more rocks to make lots of caves and hidey places. I'd love to find some limestone rocks to stack, but think most of what I have in my yard are granites. When I feel like braving some Michigan winter air, I will go have a look as I do have large quantities of rocks in my yard.

I feel a bit overwhelmed by what species to get. I found a list of dwarf mbuna species and have that printed to bring to the fish stores with me. Every type of fish seems to have a million different names though, so I am finding that frustrating. Still not sure if I want to get one male of ~dozen species I'd like, or try to keep one male with several females each for 3-4 different species. So far I have one yellow lab/electric yellow, one white lab, one mixed breed rusty, and a pair of kribs. All are about 1-2 inches.

What I really need help with right now is choosing a filter(s). As you can see from the photo I am using the top of the stand as a table and have the tank below, so there is no room for a canister filter, even though I know they are generally considered "the best". Currently I just have the Penguin 200 on it that was on my old 20 gallon tank, and I would like to replace it asap. I believe I have my options narrowed down to either one Aquaclear 110, or two Aquaclear 50s (one at each side of the tank). The 50s are 3" deep from the back of the tank instead of the 4" of the 110, so they would allow me to have the table top all the way against the wall. The 110 costs $65 and the 50s are $30 each so about the same cost. The 110 is rated 500 gph and the 50s are 200 gph each but I wonder if they would work better having one on each side rather than the 110's single intake. I like that I can put whatever media I need in the Aquaclears and they seem to get very good reviews. Or is there a different HOB or combination you'd suggest? What are you thoughts on my filter situation?


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## eTrain (Oct 15, 2012)

I would go with the 110. Less stuff inside the tank the better, IMO. Either setup should work.

Kribs are probably not a good idea to mix with mbuna. I'm no expert but once they start to mature they will likely be bullied. Especially with so few fish.

I like your setup as a table though. Thats a good idea.


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## metricliman (Sep 3, 2012)

I'd go for the aquaclear. No need for cartridges and you could always add a powerhead for more movement.



scifisarah said:


> I feel a bit overwhelmed by what species to get. I found a list of dwarf mbuna species and have that printed to bring to the fish stores with me. Every type of fish seems to have a million different names though, so I am finding that frustrating. Still not sure if I want to get one male of ~dozen species I'd like, or try to keep one male with several females each for 3-4 different species. So far I have one yellow lab/electric yellow, one white lab, one mixed breed rusty, and a pair of kribs. All are about 1-2 inches.


Go for males and females of 3 peaceful species. Yellow labs and rustys are a great start. Stock 1m:4f. Take back the kribensis, they are not mbuna and are not from Lake Malawi.


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

I second that on the Kribs, they will most certainly get bullied with mbuna. I would just do the single 110. Should be more than sufficient. If you want two filters, i would actually do two 70's so that you benefit in GPH and bio media area, but i dont think you will have any problems with one 110


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

your also going to need a lot more structure in there, the rocks you have wont help with aggression


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## metricliman (Sep 3, 2012)

Mschn99 said:


> your also going to need a lot more structure in there, the rocks you have wont help with aggression


+1, also might want to put a black background on.


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## eTrain (Oct 15, 2012)

metricliman said:


> Mschn99 said:
> 
> 
> > your also going to need a lot more structure in there, the rocks you have wont help with aggression
> ...


+2


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## scifisarah (Jan 4, 2013)

Now now - I only just set this up a few days ago so it is work in progress as I said. I spent an hour today chipping limestone rocks out of my frozen Michigan yard today, so I am on it.  My husband bleached and scrubbed them while I was at the movies tonight, bless his heart, and they are going through some soaks in our bathtub. I'll do that several times and then dry the heck out of them and let them sit a few days before adding them to the tank.

Yeah, my dad saw the kribs in the pet store and got super excited about it and bought them for me. I may just put the Penguin 200 filter back onto my 20 gallon and keep them in there instead of selling it like I intended. I think they also prefer a lower ph than the mbuna. I tested and it is at 8.2, so perfect for everything else but the kribs.

What do you think of Iodotropheus sprengerae ("Rusty"), Labidochromis sp. "Mbamba" and Labidochromis caeruleus ("Yellow Lab") for my three species? What other relatively peaceful ones are out there? I know mbuna as a general rule are not the most peaceful fish, hence the "relatively" peaceful part. There are some Pseudotropheus polit (Lions Cove) at the fish shop I really want, but I've read they are quite nasty.


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

you could also consider saulosi. cool fish since its almost like having 2 species. 2m 6f should work.


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

Is the tank cycled?


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## scifisarah (Jan 4, 2013)

GTZ said:


> Is the tank cycled?


The filter was running on my 20 gallon with about 15 mollies and platy in it. I am going to add the new filter, keep the old one on a month or two.


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## cichlid-gal (Apr 27, 2012)

scifisarah said:


> Now now - I only just set this up a few days ago so it is work in progress as I said. I spent an hour today chipping limestone rocks out of my frozen Michigan yard today, so I am on it.  My husband bleached and scrubbed them while I was at the movies tonight, bless his heart, and they are going through some soaks in our bathtub. I'll do that several times and then dry the heck out of them and let them sit a few days before adding them to the tank.
> 
> Yeah, my dad saw the kribs in the pet store and got super excited about it and bought them for me. I may just put the Penguin 200 filter back onto my 20 gallon and keep them in there instead of selling it like I intended. I think they also prefer a lower ph than the mbuna. I tested and it is at 8.2, so perfect for everything else but the kribs.
> 
> What do you think of Iodotropheus sprengerae ("Rusty"), Labidochromis sp. "Mbamba" and Labidochromis caeruleus ("Yellow Lab") for my three species? What other relatively peaceful ones are out there? I know mbuna as a general rule are not the most peaceful fish, hence the "relatively" peaceful part. There are some Pseudotropheus polit (Lions Cove) at the fish shop I really want, but I've read they are quite nasty.


I can relate to the chipping limestone rocks from frozen yard...I went to our local rock/landscape dealer yesterday and he was closed so I went to Home Depot as they had bags of smaller river rock but they didn't tell me that the bags were all frozen together and it was a skating rink trying to get to the outside stuff...OMG...I feel for you...but sounds like you have great things happening with those rocks...

Anyway...sharing my wishlist fish...these are two species I've been looking at recently...pink (a girls best friend)http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/species.php?id=1440 and another group that are yellow/red http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/species.php?id=2582 . I know nothing about these two species and think possibly a 55g would need to be a species only for one or the other but do know that they have caught my eye. Just another thought for you.


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

cichlid-gal said:


> scifisarah said:
> 
> 
> > Now now - I only just set this up a few days ago so it is work in progress as I said. I spent an hour today chipping limestone rocks out of my frozen Michigan yard today, so I am on it.  My husband bleached and scrubbed them while I was at the movies tonight, bless his heart, and they are going through some soaks in our bathtub. I'll do that several times and then dry the heck out of them and let them sit a few days before adding them to the tank.
> ...


Sounds like my trip today to get rocks at the frozen creek. I brought a broom so I could find them... :roll:

Back to topic


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## anthraxx4200 (Aug 16, 2012)

i personally would steer clear of rusties. my big male is easily 5+ inches and quite hefty. so long term i dont think theyd work. yellow labs have always stayed small and taken a lot longer to grow out for me so theyre a good choice. honestly i think saulosi would be the best choice, seems like theyre always an awesome choice for a smaller tank, plus you get the added benefit of having lots of females so there is a good amount of breeding. another thought is tangs as there is a lot more variety for smaller tanks imo. kribs could also do okay in there with the addition of more logs and rock for structure maybe even some lowlight easy to grow plants. after that just some random dither like tetras and the like and itd be a nice little setup. dont get too dead set on just mbuna imo they look and feel better in a truly massive tank (just my opinion) anyhoo hope some of this helps a bit.


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## mbamba_boy (May 12, 2012)

If you go with aquaclears stick with two of the 70s. I personally own both the 50 and the 70 and the 50 does not move very much water. Although it is rated at 200gph the penguin 200 I have does a much better job. Aside from replacing the filter cartridges I actually prefer the newer style marineland filters over the aquaclear. As far as stocking I would do two groups of mbuna at a ratio of 1 male to 5 females or the saulosi at 2 males to 10 to 12 females.


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## mbamba_boy (May 12, 2012)

Also forgot to mention that although they are both from the ladichromis family the yellow labs and mbamba should be fine. When I had both I never had an issue with cross breeding. Depending on where you are located at in Michigan I might be able to recommend a good local breeder for the electric yellows. Nice bright yellow with good black marking


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## scifisarah (Jan 4, 2013)

I ended up purchasing the Aquaclear 110, and it should be here on Tuesday. I'll leave the Pengiun 200 in there until the new one has some good bacteria growing in it. Then I will move the old filter and Kribensis pair back into my 20 gallon tank. Should one month be long enough for the new filter to take over or should I wait longer than that?

I got the rocks in and the five cichlids I have presently seem to be enjoying it. In Spring I'll do a better search of the yard for aquarium rocks, but this will have to do for now. I really suck at rock piling, but I'm sure I will get the hang of it eventually. My husband was watching me and making it even worse, since the rocks kept falling down.

I am located in Rockford, just north of Grand Rapids. It would be nice to find a breeder in the area - maybe I'll post a craigslist wanted ad and see if I get any responses. The local fish store does not take orders for specific fish so I was a little bummed about that. I am supposed to call on Wednesdays and see if the fish I want will be available. Petco is checking on a list I gave them to see if they can get the fish I want but said they are limited to their corporate providers for buying them. If I can't get them local, any other suggestions?

I ordered two 18" bubble stone wands for the back, since I think it looks nice coming up behind the rocks. Hopefully that won't bother the fish. Right now I just have one that keeps floating to the surface and won't stay buried - very irritating. The black background really made everything look nicer I think.


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## eTrain (Oct 15, 2012)

Check the retailer reviews, for the most part you can get anything shipped to you from someone.

This is just a suggestion but you may want to try putting that large rock right in the middle leave a little gap on each side of it and stack the rest on each side. Again its just a suggestion its your tank.

My LFS disappointed me also, they will special order anything but African's... Their response was they just come as mixed...

Also be careful with Petco and all big box stores as they tend to sell hybrids.


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## metricliman (Sep 3, 2012)

Looks good. The only thing is those two rocks on top of the big rock on the right- it looks very unnatural.


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## mbamba_boy (May 12, 2012)

I would possibly mix up the size off the rocks to give it a more natural feel. Maybe move the larger rock closer to the middle as a center piece and work around that with the smaller ones.


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## scifisarah (Jan 4, 2013)

I'm going to do another water change when I get my new filter and airstones in a couple days and I'll try to set them up more naturally then. I think it will work well to have the large one in the center like you mentioned since it will help cover up the water intake and air tubing which will all go up the middle. Also when I pile them, I realized I should do it two deep instead of just one deep so it is more stable and they have darker caves to go into and feel more secure.

I was going to buy one of those water changing kits from Aqueon or Python, but didn't like the price and fact that everyone said the plastic parts broke in no time at all. I already had the siphon part anyway, so I bought 25 feet of 1/2" clear tubing from Lowes (came to $9.37) and a swiveling brass 5/8" female hose coupler. I just had to put the hose end in hot water to get it to fit around the slightly larger hose adapter. I have a faucet to hose adapter coming in a few days that cost under $3 with free shipping from Lowes, so I can just get water directly from my sink without dealing with buckets. The 25' hose I can throw over the side of our deck to create enough suction and put the water right into my garden where hopefully it will help my plants grow better.


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

scifisarah said:


> I was going to buy one of those water changing kits from Aqueon or Python, but didn't like the price and fact that everyone said the plastic parts broke in no time at all. I already had the siphon part anyway, so I bought 25 feet of 1/2" clear tubing from Lowes (came to $9.37) and a swiveling brass 5/8" female hose coupler. I just had to put the hose end in hot water to get it to fit around the slightly larger hose adapter. I have a faucet to hose adapter coming in a few days that cost under $3 with free shipping from Lowes, so I can just get water directly from my sink without dealing with buckets. The 25' hose I can throw over the side of our deck to create enough suction and put the water right into my garden where hopefully it will help my plants grow better.


My siphon uses 5/8 hose...and thats exactly what i did using a 50' garden hose. I also purchased an in line ball valve from home depot so i can get my water temp set and then just turn the ball valve off so the temp stays the same. I use a digital aquarium thermometer to check the temp. I just add my declor....and fill them up after a water change and it has been working great for years!!


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## scifisarah (Jan 4, 2013)

Mschn99 said:


> scifisarah said:
> 
> 
> > I was going to buy one of those water changing kits from Aqueon or Python, but didn't like the price and fact that everyone said the plastic parts broke in no time at all. I already had the siphon part anyway, so I bought 25 feet of 1/2" clear tubing from Lowes (came to $9.37) and a swiveling brass 5/8" female hose coupler. I just had to put the hose end in hot water to get it to fit around the slightly larger hose adapter. I have a faucet to hose adapter coming in a few days that cost under $3 with free shipping from Lowes, so I can just get water directly from my sink without dealing with buckets. The 25' hose I can throw over the side of our deck to create enough suction and put the water right into my garden where hopefully it will help my plants grow better.
> ...


Thanks for the tip. My husband was trying to describe that but did not know what is was called. I was completely confused by the end of it, but now I know I can look for an "in line ball valve". I use a digital meat thermometer to test water temp haha. Nice well water here, so thankful not to need a declorinator.


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