# Comps help.



## boostspike (Apr 3, 2007)

Purchased a trio of gold head comps (1.5-2") 2 months ago. All was well, they were eating, swimming around, bright colors. About a month ago i noticed one just laying on its side breathing heavy, days later it died. 2 days ago, same thing happen again. now my third one is mostly on its sides, not acitve, not eating, curled up against a rock.. whats going on here??
All water param is fine, temp is 82, feeding NLS, tank 40g breeder.


----------



## Furcifer158 (Feb 16, 2008)

do you add ph buffers to your tank? I have had many different altolamps and when ever I put to much ph buffer in the tank on accident they would go on there sides, and if I didn't take some of the water out and replace it they would die. Also were they eating OK?


----------



## boostspike (Apr 3, 2007)

well, its official, i lost all 3 comps... the last one passed on tonight.. in all my years of fish keeping i've never lost a group of fish w/o knowing why.. i have zero clue on why they died.. 

I used a bit of baking soda, the ph was ou 8.4 last i checked. They were eating good for about a month or so. coming out of their caves and going after the pellets.. lately they've been ignoring the food


----------



## jh82 (Oct 26, 2007)

I know it's not as common in carnivores but it kind of sounds like bloat or some other internal parasite. And I'm assuming that were certain it's not a water parameter issue.


----------



## APII (May 17, 2008)

I am sorry to hear. But I am going to be honest with you and I dont disrespect anybodies opinions here.

But I am getting tired of seeing people say that their waters were good. They usually always are. We see this all the time,,,,,,,water was good,,,ph is good,,etc.etc.etc.

*BUT,,,*I have had many years of exp. with these fish and will tell you I have also gone through ALOT of them trying to figure out WHY I was losing them.

These fish a way to sensitive to *WATER CHANGES*,,,regardless when you do them,,,,
I tell you,,,,try NOT doing water changes for as long as you can stand it. These fish are AFRICANS,,,,,they will swim in toilets and survive. 

People tend to believe that they are "supposed" to do water changes to keep fish alive,,,true in some cases,,,but NOT most.

Experiment with NOT doing a water change with your fish,,,if you do water changes weekly,,,skip a week,, if you do every 2 weeks,,,skip 2.

When I learned about these fish's sensitivities towards WC,,,,I/they were lucky to get them ONCE a month.  Before you debate me,,,,,,try it.

kEEP US POSTED.

APII.


----------



## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

Contrary to what APII has said I frequently change the water in my Alto tanks and I always have. I change smaller amounts more frequently and I usually drip it in the aquariums with a section of airline tubing. If you don't change the water in the aquarium the levels of nitrate slowly increase and this can result in a lowering of hardness and pH. Just because a fish is apparently "sensitive" is no excuse to skip water changes out right, but everyone has different experiences. In the future perhaps exercise caution with water changes and these fish. Add the water back to the aquarium more slowly, or do smaller water changes. Depending on the readings from your tap you may try to keep the fish in an environment where the water parameters are closer to the tap water.


----------



## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

Indeed Comp and calvus fry are sensitive to chlorine, changes in temperature particularly and changes in water parameters. They are also sensitive to deterioration of water parameters.

Typically when I raise Alto's, I do a 5-10% water change every other day when they are less than 1/4", and I use water from an established aquarium.

Above 1/4", I'll use tap water at the same rate and percentage. As they get larger, I'll increase the percentage of water change, and decrease the frequency. They seem to get used to the water changes.


----------



## Reel North (Sep 23, 2006)

I had WC Yellow Calvus for a while (dont ask). They were awesome - I did 20% Water changes every week or so, to great effect. But I killed a bunch of cyps 3 weeks ago by changing water & not using Prime. So it happens.

Get the fish on a program, but I agree, more changes is better at a smaller percentage


----------



## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

As mentioned in the previous post, I wonder if the key is an exact match of the new water? I've done 50% or more weekly water changes since the Calvus were 1" and they showed NO symptoms or concerns. I have a well and naturally hard tap water (no adjustments), plus I carefully match the temp using the tank thermometer under the flow during the water change.

After reading this I feel VERY lucky!


----------



## gedtranter (Feb 25, 2007)

My experiences have been the same as DJRansome. My comp fry grow out tanks got a 50% change every other day for several months. They showed absolutely no ill effects and scoffed any food immediately after the changes, no lying on their sides or anything like that.

The change water came from my main display tank so was of the correct temp every time and the parameters were always stable. I then topped up my main tank. This way it was win/win, regular water changes for everybody, no swings or changes in water chemistry. No fish loses.


----------



## APII (May 17, 2008)

Boy,,,after reading all your success stories. I am starting to think I was doing something wrong all this time????

But then I see most of you guys are using water from established tanks???? Your cheating. :lol:

Like I said somewhere esle on here,,,the only time I ever used water from a main tank,,was when I was putting fry in a grow-out.

Has anybody had success with *raising *fry from original parents,,not buying them????
Are you perimeters the same? Or do you use all water from the main tank???? (if you put in fry grow-outs) I am talking Calvus or Comps of course. :thumb:

Furthermore,,,I am not telling you/anyone to stop/avoid water changes altogether,,,,just understand that all these water changes are NOT necessary. IMO.

APII


----------



## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

APII said:


> Furthermore,,,I am not telling you/anyone to stop/avoid water changes altogether,,,,just understand that all these water changes are NOT necessary. IMO.


A sweeping generalization that I cannot agree with. In your case, it appears as though they are not necessary. That isn't to suggest that in other cases, or as your absolute statement suggests, all cases they aren't necessary. While it seems that you are getting away with the practice, common sense dictates that the regular removal of chemicals that are known to be toxic to fish, is proper husbandry. Congratulations on successfully raising your fry with this method, but I most certainly wouldn't suggest it is a recommended practice.


----------



## jh82 (Oct 26, 2007)

If the original posters problem was caused by water changes then it should have been obvious that it was an issue. If you do a water change and then your fish is laying on it's side breathing heavy, it doesn't take a genius to realize that there's a problem there. Since he didn't mention that I assumed it had to be something else.

I agree that these fish are more sensitive to water changes than most but I change about 50% of the water in my tanks once a week and haven't had a problem. I always treat the entire tank with Prime at every change. My calvus spawned just a few hours after a large water change.


----------



## APII (May 17, 2008)

Can I ask you guys a question,,,and I am not trying to be an arse or anything like that??

You guys actually do WC [u*]automatically*[/u],,once a week/twice a week?????

Shaking my head here,,,,dont you guys have time to enjoy them?

Do you realize the stress you are putting these fish through everytime you stick the syphon hose in there,,,possibly messing up a spawning place, moving things around, etc. etc. etc. By the time they get "used" to the surroundings,,,your changing it AGAIN.

Everything I state in my post are just JMO, and IME.

APII


----------



## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

APII said:


> Do you realize the stress you are putting these fish through everytime you stick the syphon hose in there,,,possibly messing up a spawning place, moving things around, etc. etc. etc. By the time they get "used" to the surroundings,,,your changing it AGAIN.


Honestly, I don't see much in the way of stressful behaviour. When I do a good clean, I'll siphon off the bottom, maybe once a month. Nothing is disturbed or moved. The fish do not hide, breath heavy etc... in reality they seem to enjoy the process. I've had more spawnings the same day, or day after a water change than any other time. There is no need to remove or move rocks, or change surroundings.

On the other hand, there is stress when and if water conditions deteriorate.


----------



## APII (May 17, 2008)

Hey "fog",,,are you following me???? :wink:

AH HA,,,,,so what you're saying is you just "replace" water. In other words,,as stated in your last post,,,.you do a good clean once a month.

Thats a big difference as opposed to "cleaning". Me...I just add water as it evaporates. 

When most/some people do water changes,,,they,,,I am assuming,,, do just that. Syphon and do a good clean everytime they do WC???????? Thats one thing I should have clarified in earlier post. Thats what I try telling people to stay away from. :thumb:

My bad if I was misunderstood. Or if it were the way I interpreted it. 8)

AP.


----------



## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

APII said:


> Hey "fog",,,are you following me???? :wink:
> 
> AH HA,,,,,so what you're saying is you just "replace" water. In other words,,as stated in your last post,,,.you do a good clean once a month.
> 
> ...


Nope, not following you, I tend to be pretty active... :wink:

I call cleaning the tank, cleaning the tank. Water Changes, water changes... :thumb:


----------

