# Snail Infestation



## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this, if not please move to the correct location.

I recently purchased some fish from a local pet store here.

As an aside we do not have great fish stores but I have used this one for a long time.

Unbeknownst to me I brought home some unwanted guests.

They are now multiplying. I an killing 20 a day.

I went back to the store and told them my problem. Found some in their tanks and showed them to them.

Let me back up a little, my tank is a 110 gal "high" that I keep African Cichlids in.










Since this picture was taken I have weeded out a lot of the larger fish and restocked with smaller fish and added more stone.

They suggested adding some Crown Loachs, but they did not have any large enough that they thought would survive with the African Cichlids.

They then suggested adding some snails they call Snail Assassins, which I have done.

This is a picture of the unwanted guesses. You have to look close, these guys are no bigger than a 1/16 of an inch.










I would really like to put a stop to these guys. I lost a whole tank to snails once and do not want to have that happen again.

Any help or guidance would be appreciated.


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

Pity you aren't closer ... my LFS has a large Clown Loach that I assume someone traded in ... it's probably 6" to 8".

Probably make short work of your snail problem ... or at least keep them somewhat under control.


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

He'd probably enjoy the extra room as well ... I think they have him in a 55g.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

So...will they eat the snails?

They are getting out of hand.


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## Samadhikash (Jun 16, 2015)

While you are figuring out a long-term solution (like reducing excess food in the tank or introducing predators, or both) keep up with the manual removal. Removing snails by hand can be a real pain in the tookus, but you can't beat it for efficiency. You'll soon reach a tipping point that will allow other approaches to make a significant difference. But until then, if you can see one, you need to pluck it.


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

GlennLever said:


> So...will they eat the snails?


No personal experience myself, but a quick trip out to the interwebz - via Google - and the survey sez:

_Yes_ ... smaller ones anyways.



GlennLever said:


> They are getting out of hand.


Sounds like they might be pond snails ... which, in my experience, can be pretty prolific.


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## CSchmidt (Apr 15, 2004)

Do you have any access to assassin snails? They are always on hunt. It might take awhile but they are stealthy.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

CSchmidt said:


> Do you have any access to assassin snails? They are always on hunt. It might take awhile but they are stealthy.


I have four in the tank now. I have been told they will not reproduce unless there is salt water.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

Samadhikash said:


> While you are figuring out a long-term solution (like reducing excess food in the tank or introducing predators, or both) keep up with the manual removal. Removing snails by hand can be a real pain in the tookus, but you can't beat it for efficiency. You'll soon reach a tipping point that will allow other approaches to make a significant difference. But until then, if you can see one, you need to pluck it.


I am very careful how much food goes in the tank, I count the pieces of food before each feeding and only put in what gets eaten voraciously


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Assassin snails will work but it will take a few months to deplete the existing pest snail population. Hand picking the pest snails is tedious so I find a piece of zucchini or lettuce attached to a fork or similar and on the bottom of the tank will attract the pest snails where they can be collected easier.


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

Deeda said:


> Assassin snails will work but it will take a few months to deplete the existing pest snail population. Hand picking the pest snails is tedious so I find a piece of zucchini or lettuce attached to a fork or similar and on the bottom of the tank will attract the pest snails where they can be collected easier.


Great idea :thumb:


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

Deeda said:


> Assassin snails will work but it will take a few months to deplete the existing pest snail population. Hand picking the pest snails is tedious so I find a piece of zucchini or lettuce attached to a fork or similar and on the bottom of the tank will attract the pest snails where they can be collected easier.


Just put four more snail assassins into the tank and four Clown Loachs. I do not know if the Clown Loachs will survive one is being picked on and is not smart enough to hide.


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## CSchmidt (Apr 15, 2004)

I started with 4 assassin snails and I have 20+ and they breed in hard water I know cause I breed them. I think they are better because they work behind the seens.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

CSchmidt said:


> I started with 4 assassin snails and I have 20+ and they breed in hard water I know cause I breed them. I think they are better because they work behind the seens.


I hope I do not end up with a second infestation of snail assassins?

I was told by the fish store guys the clown loachs would take care of the snail infestation, I just came across this on the interweb

"Clown loaches, like most other species of loaches, will also eat any available snails in their aquarium. However, they tend to ignore the larger species of snails and have trouble eating Malaysian trumpet snails. They should never be purchased to clean out a snail infestation, but they will help to keep snails numbers in check."

If you look at the picture in the first post and you look at this picture of a Malaysian trumpet snails it looks like what I have.









I hope I have not made my problem worse?


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## zimmy (Aug 13, 2010)

GlennLever said:


> I hope I do not end up with a second infestation of snail assassins?


Very unlikely. They breed very slowly. They may end up being eaten by your loaches anyways. I don't think the loaches are going to be choosy between the ones you don't want and the ones you want to keep.

Deeda's advice to put in some vegetable to attract them is right on. The snails tend to be nocturnal so just put a lettuce leaf in every night before you turn the lights off. When you wake up pull the lettuce out and you should find it covered with the little buggers.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

zimmy said:


> GlennLever said:
> 
> 
> > I hope I do not end up with a second infestation of snail assassins?
> ...


I read somewhere that this was a good technique, what was also added was putting it in a Tupperware box with holes. I'm going to try this.

I was thinking the Clown Loach would not bother the snail assassins because of there size.

Is there any way to get e-mail notifications when a post has been added to this thread?


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

GlennLever said:


> zimmy said:
> 
> 
> > GlennLever said:
> ...


Added note, I will make the holes small enough so that the clown Loaches cannot get into the box


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

GlennLever said:


> Is there any way to get e-mail notifications when a post has been added to this thread?


Go to your User Control Panel and click on Board Preferences, highlight the appropriate radio buttons to get notified of updates to your posts.

Also, when you are composing a reply to a thread and you want to be notified of any updates, scroll down the page and check the Options>Notify me when a reply is posted.

Hope this helps!


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

Deeda said:


> GlennLever said:
> 
> 
> > Is there any way to get e-mail notifications when a post has been added to this thread?
> ...


So this is my Board Preferences page.










On that page I see nothing about notifications on subscribed topics.

Go a little further there is Edit Posting Defaults.










There is an option "Notify me upon replies by default" which I have checked, but I am not getting notifications and would like to.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Glenn, try also clicking the Subscribe Topic at the bottom of the page. It's been awhile since I've requested receiving email alerts for topics. I apologize for not getting it right yet.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

Deeda said:


> Glenn, try also clicking the Subscribe Topic at the bottom of the page. It's been awhile since I've requested receiving email alerts for topics. I apologize for not getting it right yet.


That has been clicked and if I check my subscriptions in my control panel it shows up.

I'm thinking my e-mail address is screwed up. I had a hard time getting a login in verified (never received the verification e-mail). I send an e-mail to Verticalscope http://www.verticalscope.com/contact-us/email-us.html who set my account up. Is there someplace I can check my e-mail address?

The trap has been set. See the left corner of the tank.










close up of the trap, I hope it works


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

Update, The Clown Loaches are surviving well, they are no longer being picked on, I think they are just to fast.

We have a learning curve with the trap

When I first looked at it this morning there did not seem to be that many in it.

However when I picked it out I was not very careful, and at lest 30 were washed out when the water ran out of the trap.

I will deploy it again tonight and tomorrow pick it out with the net so as to catch any that get washed out when the water empties out of the Tupperware box.

Suggestions?


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

_Double your pleasure, double your fun:_

Add a second box


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Feed less is my #1 best success factor.

I have also torn down tanks to get rid of snails (both pond and MTS). Usually this works best if you replace the substrate because snails/eggs hide there. I do this when I get tired of the daily lettuce removal without significant results, LOL.

Then once the population is dramatically down, feeding less works to keep them gone. Even the best suppliers ship fish with MTS...I've always imagined the larvae must be in bodily fluids.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

I have not had a snail problem in the last 20 years, I'm surprise that there so many people having problems.

I do not like snails in my tank


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

Update

I did a gravel cleaning this morning (I have and love my under gravel filter).

I did a 1/4 water replacement (did one last week when I found the snails).

I will clean both 350 Magnum filters, and am running a third one as a polisher.










This is this mornings caught using a net to lift the box out of the tank.










The four Clown Loaches seem to be doing fine.

I read on the internet that you should feed them Zucchini occasionally.

I do not have any, so I tried Cucumber, they seem to be ignoring it, does it have to be Zucchini?


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

This should be part of the post above, but I missed the time frame to edit that post.

This guy, I do not know the name, is more interested in the Cucumber that the Clown Loach (the blur in the foreground is a Clown Loach swimming right by.

In the picture in the above post the Cucumber is located in the bottom left corner of the tank.










How long can the Cucumber be left in the tank?


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## zimmy (Aug 13, 2010)

GlennLever said:


> How long can the Cucumber be left in the tank?


I wouldn't leave it in more than 24 hours. The seeds from the cucumber could make a bit of a mess so you'll want to vacuum them up or it could make your snail problem worse.

Personally, I wouldn't bother with the vegetables for the loaches yet. You don't want to distract them from the job of eating snails.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

zimmy said:


> GlennLever said:
> 
> 
> > How long can the Cucumber be left in the tank?
> ...


I I went an purchased some zucchini, The clown loaches were not interested in it.

I have pulled it.


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

GlennLever said:


> In the picture in the above post the Cucumber is located in the bottom left corner of the tank.
> 
> How long can the Cucumber be left in the tank?


I've left a couple of small chucks of blanched broccoli stems in the tank for 3 to 5 days. (I don't think that vegetable material tends to breakdown and foul the water as quite as quickly as meat)

Over that time period, they gradually get smaller and smaller, as my Bristlenose Pleco (2") and two Chinese Algae Eaters (2") nibble away at them. I also have 5 Red Wag Plattys that seem to like it as well.

Just for reference, the size of the pieces I'm talking about are roughly 3/8" to 1/2" cubes ... at most. Even blanched (for a couple of minutes in boiling water), there is some fiber to it - that takes them awhile to work over, chew up, and consume.

If I'm feeding my own homebrew fish food (either vegetarian variety or the one with shrimp added), I'll throw several (2 or 3) in slightly smaller-sized chunks (1/4" to 3/8" cubes) and usually it is gone within 12 hours at most. But then it has been well cooked, run thru a food processor, and then dried - so it comes pretty well ground up to begin with ... just needs re-hydrated.

I've added more fish since I made the homebrew fish food and last fed broccoli, so that plays part in how quickly it goes away I'm sure.

Now when I feed my homemade stuff, in addition to the fish named above, there are two Black Mollies (3"), a Yo-Yo Loach (3 1/2"), two Kuhli Loaches (3") a Peppered Coryadoras (1 1/2"), and about five Zebra Danios that are all fighting over it.

I think the whole "All-food-must-be-totally-consumed-with-5-minutes" thing can be carried to extremes ... partially because it depends on what type of food is being fed, what form it is in, and how large a piece it is.

A large chunk of large, solid vegetable probably isn't going to foul your tank overnight. And you really want it in there long enough for them to discover it and maybe develop a taste for it ... particularly if it is unfamiliar.

Just use common sense.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

wryan said:


> GlennLever said:
> 
> 
> > In the picture in the above post the Cucumber is located in the bottom left corner of the tank.
> ...


Thank you, that was informative.

I have keep tanks since I was 16, I'm now a young 65, I have never feed anything but purchased food.

A whole new field to look at.

All fish seem to be doing ok.

I have never paid much attention to fish names, just purchased what I liked, I think I will have to see if I can find out the names of the fish that are in my tank.


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

GlennLever said:


> Thank you, that was informative.


You're quite welcome.

Hope it was helpful, at least in some small way ...



GlennLever said:


> I have keep tanks since I was 16, I'm now a young 65, I have never feed anything but purchased food.


Well, I started when I was a few years younger than 16 (younger than 10 mebbe ?) ... my first tank was a 15 gallon Metaframe, with a slate bottom, which probably dates me  ) ... but I was in and out of the hobby for quite a while, recently got back in.

So you got me as far as years of experience go (and overall age ... but not by very much ... at least on the latter :lol: )



GlennLever said:


> A whole new field to look at.


After looking at the _per unit_ price on some fish food items at a large chain recently and seeing that the price _per pound_ was over $225.00  , I thought I might try my hand.

Worst case, I could waste a few bucks for some ingredients and a few hours of my time ... and the fish wouldn't touch it.

Glad to say it turned out otherwise.



GlennLever said:


> All fish seem to be doing ok.


Good deal :thumb:



GlennLever said:


> I have never paid much attention to fish names, just purchased what I liked, I think I will have to see if I can find out the names of the fish that are in my tank.


Whatever works ... as long as you are having fun ... :wink:

Many years ago I bought a thick book (2" ?) called "Exotic Tropical Fishes" written by Dr. Herbert Axlerod and about five or six others.

Served as a fix for the habit when I didn't have tanks set up. I just found it enjoyable and actually quite fascinating reading about fish I guess.

BOL on the snail issue :thumb:


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## CichlidAdmin (Jun 4, 2013)

GlennLever said:


> wryan said:
> 
> 
> > GlennLever said:
> ...


Admin testing for GlennLever. Ignore this.
AS


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## CichlidAdmin (Jun 4, 2013)

Testing reply notice


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

Just an update.

The trap is only gathering about 20 snails a night now.

I put 8 Assassin snails in the tank and have not seen one of them for days.

The Clown Loaches are alive and well.

They show no signs of interest in the zucchini when I put a slice in the tank.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

So....

The trap seems to be coming less effective.

I am getting fewer and fewer snails in the trap and I am seeing more on the walls of the tank eating the algae (not that there is a lot).

I will clean the walls of the tank and clean the algae off of some of the surface rocks.

This will cut down on the snails food supply and hopefully they will be more interested in the lettuce in the trap.

I wonder if there is such a thing as algae food that could be put in the trap? On the other hand I do not want to introduce an algae bloom in my tank.

Thoughts?


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## zimmy (Aug 13, 2010)

Are the loaches eating the snails at all?


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

zimmy said:


> Are the loaches eating the snails at all?


I have not seem them do it, they seem to just swim up and down the glass and across the rocks


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

GlennLever said:


> zimmy said:
> 
> 
> > Are the loaches eating the snails at all?
> ...


Try crushing one or two snails and dropping them back into the tank to put them on the scent.

Here's probably what it will look like once they figure it out:


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## wryan (Dec 6, 2015)

Let's try this one:

[youtube][/youtube]


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

wryan said:


> Let's try this one:
> 
> [youtube][/youtube]


I will take tomorrows haul out of the trap and crush them and put them back in the tank.

I had been crushing them against the side of the tank but stopped before the loaches were put in as I was warned about putting organic matter into the tank.

I watched your link I hope this does not happen to my assassin snails but if it gets them on the track I can live with it.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

The clown loaches just do not seem interested in the snail, the trap works ok, but the clown loaches just seem to swim up and down the glass and across the rocks


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

Well I have almost given up.

Think I'm going to have to take it apart, clean everything, throw the substrate out and get new gravel.

The trap gets twenty to thirty a night, but the problem does not seem to be getting any better.


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## zimmy (Aug 13, 2010)

GlennLever said:


> Well I have almost given up.
> 
> Think I'm going to have to take it apart, clean everything, throw the substrate out and get new gravel.
> 
> The trap gets twenty to thirty a night, but the problem does not seem to be getting any better.


To really do it properly you'd have to bleach everything, including the filter and anything else in the tank. This means you'd also need to cycle the tank again.

Do you have a place to move your fish to?


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Malaysian trumpet snails are notoriously difficult to eradicate, they can even survive months in dry gravel so I don't think the bleach will help, according to some posts I've seen.

Limiting the amount of food that gets missed by the fish will usually keep the population under control but it can take months to reduce their numbers. I've just learned to live with them in a couple of my tanks.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

zimmy said:


> GlennLever said:
> 
> 
> > Well I have almost given up.
> ...


I do not have a place for the fish, Not sure what I will do about that.

Buy another small tank, maybe of craigs list? I have always just had one tank.

I have dreamed about doubling the size of the tank I have??????

I would have to build a new base, and the wife would have to agree to lose the cabinets on either side, and I wounder if I would have to support the floor?

When I put this tank in I lag bolted 4X4's across the floor joists and tied the cabinet to the wall studs so that there was no shake when walking by the tank.



Deeda said:


> Malaysian trumpet snails are notoriously difficult to eradicate, they can even survive months in dry gravel so I don't think the bleach will help, according to some posts I've seen.
> 
> Limiting the amount of food that gets missed by the fish will usually keep the population under control but it can take months to reduce their numbers. I've just learned to live with them in a couple of my tanks.


I would lose the gravel and replace with new.

I feed twice a day, and the fish are waiting at the top to be fed. Food is gone in less that three minutes.

They do spit some small pieces out, other fish generally compete over the scrapes.

I do not know if I can live with them.

I have always been miticulas about how clean my tank was.


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## zimmy (Aug 13, 2010)

GlennLever said:


> I feed twice a day, and the fish are waiting at the top to be fed. Food is gone in less that three minutes.


It sounds like you're overfeeding, which would add to the snail problem. It would also contribute to the loaches not being interested in the snails. Unless my fish are juvies, I feed only once a day and the food is gone in 30 seconds.

Fish waiting at the top is not an indicator of how much they need to be fed.

Dee may be right about the bleach but I've managed to keep my tanks snail free by using it despite having bought countless plants from MTS infested tanks (I even give my plants a bleach dip before adding to them to my tanks). I've never seen a single snail in any of my tanks unless it's a nerite I put in the tank. Could be I've just been lucky.

I totally agree that leaving the tank empty without water and letting the substrate dry out is completely ineffective against snails.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

zimmy said:
 

> GlennLever said:
> 
> 
> > I feed twice a day, and the fish are waiting at the top to be fed. Food is gone in less that three minutes.
> ...


OK, maybe I should start a new thread on feeding.

I did a search on feeding and found lots of stuff, so maybe not.

I have been feeding TetraCichlid floating Cichlid Sticks optimal Growth Formula.

My feeding habits come from having keep tropical fish for a long time.

I take 8 of the sticks and break them into four pieces each (results in 1/16 inch in diameter, 1/8 inch long pieces)

The fish in the tank range from 1 1/2 to 3 inches long (all young new fish, this brings up a new topic, I have never purchased fish online, hate the "fish" stores here, I would like some in site into the process and does it work))), and there are about 25 in the tank.

I found lots of references to New Life Spectrum, sinking pellets.

When I break these sticks up, even though they say they are floating most of then sink (some do float and after the fish get the sinking ones they eat the ones still floating), and the sinking ones never make it to the bottom of the tank.

Should I convert to pellets?

This is a summery on what I found, do you agree and whit what philosophy?

Copied from a post from Kanorin, memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=49169

"Feed once per day the amount they can eat in 20-30 seconds. Or twice per day the amount they can eat in 10-15 seconds.

For fry and young juveniles I increase to two or three times a day, but the overall amount of food fed per day is only slightly more (about 30%) more than I feed adults as far as how long it takes to consume.
2x - the amount they can eat in 15-20 seconds
3x - the amount they can eat in 12-15 seconds

Adults I feed NLS cichlid formula almost exclusively (maybe every other week I give them one day of spirulina flakes). Fish under 1" I feed NLS grow. "


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## zimmy (Aug 13, 2010)

You may be feeding too much. I have a tank with 5 uarus (each fish is 5-6" long), 3 angelfish (each a bit bigger than the size of the palm of my hand), 6 cories and about 9 2.5-3" tetras. I feed a little less than 1/4 teaspoon of Northfin pellets once per day. I also skip a feeding day a couple of times per week.

It takes them less than 30 seconds to eat everything.

My tanks that have smaller younger fish get fed much less but two to three times per day. This is probably similar to your situation.

My fish are growing and none of them look thin.

A rule of thumb to consider is that each fish needs a food serving the size of its eye.

Converting to 1mm pellets is a good idea. NLS is a good choice as is NorthFin.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

zimmy said:


> You may be feeding too much. I have a tank with 5 uarus (each fish is 5-6" long), 3 angelfish (each a bit bigger than the size of the palm of my hand), 6 cories and about 9 2.5-3" tetras. I feed a little less than 1/4 teaspoon of Northfin pellets once per day. I also skip a feeding day a couple of times per week.
> 
> It takes them less than 30 seconds to eat everything.
> 
> ...


So decrease food amount but stay at two feedings a day?


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## zimmy (Aug 13, 2010)

GlennLever said:


> So decrease food amount but stay at two feedings a day?


Yes. Go with 1mm pellets and start with 1/8 of a teaspoon. The smaller pellet size will increase the likelihood of every fish getting something. Some of them may get nothing at some feedings but don't worry about it. They'll get something at the next meal.

It's better to underfeed than overfeed. Snails being out control can be a sign of overfeeding.


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

zimmy said:


> GlennLever said:
> 
> 
> > So decrease food amount but stay at two feedings a day?
> ...


I have placed an order for New Life Spectrum Cichlid Formula 1mm Sinking, 250gm

Currently 12 outside, how does online fish ordering work?


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## GlennLever (Dec 29, 2015)

PaulFowler said:


> You can get help from pest control experts.


I have been living with the problem, a good cleaning once a month puts a hurting on them for a month.

It is actually time to do it again (cleaning).


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