# Why is my Salvini Grey???



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

Okay, this is probably a really stupid question, but I have to ask..... Why is my Salvini cichlid grey. I got him/her from my LFS and he is a dark grey with blue/green flecks and a orangish tail. I went to my other LFS yesterday and saw a ton of Salvinis (1/3 the price that I paid for mine) that are fully colored up. I have heard that as Juvies they can be grey, but mine is a full 6 inches. Does the grey color mean that he/she is stressed or unhappy or is the yellow/red coloration exclusive to breeding time? I am so confused :lol:


----------



## esob0i (Oct 5, 2008)

ktluvsfish said:


> Okay, this is probably a really stupid question, but I have to ask..... Why is my Salvini cichlid grey. I got him/her from my LFS and he is a dark grey with blue/green flecks and a orangish tail. I went to my other LFS yesterday and saw a ton of Salvinis (1/3 the price that I paid for mine) that are fully colored up. I have heard that as Juvies they can be grey, but mine is a full 6 inches. Does the grey color mean that he/she is stressed or unhappy or is the yellow/red coloration exclusive to breeding time? I am so confused :lol:


can you post a pic?


----------



## illy-d (Nov 6, 2005)

ktluvsfish said:


> Okay, this is probably a really stupid question, but I have to ask..... Why is my Salvini cichlid grey. I got him/her from my LFS and he is a dark grey with blue/green flecks and a orangish tail.  I went to my other LFS yesterday and saw a ton of Salvinis (1/3 the price that I paid for mine) that are fully colored up. I have heard that as Juvies they can be grey, but mine is a full 6 inches. Does the grey color mean that he/she is stressed or unhappy or is the yellow/red coloration exclusive to breeding time? I am so confused :lol:


That almost sounds like a GT so a pic would probably be essential!


----------



## steve_58 (Jan 20, 2009)

Please post pic if u can. I have Salvini's around 3" and they are great looking especially now that they just spawned and have fry.


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

Okay here's a few pics. Sorry for the poor quality. I really need to clean my glass, lol. You really cannot see the blue/green flecks in the pics, but other than that, the rest of the coloring is pretty accurate. Not to mention that this guy is really skittish so if I move to quickly he/she freaks out and hides. I am very interested to know what you guys think.


----------



## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Not a bad looking male salvini you've got there.
I agree that the color is drab at the moment, but I'm guessing that's because he's being housed alone---am I right about that?

I'm asking this because I used to keep a lone male sal in a tank to himself, and he pretty much stayed the color yours is in those pics. Actually, even with some black skirt tetras he still had that drab coloration.

His coloration took a 180 degree turn for the better as soon as I got him into a tank with other cichlids (my oscar and a convict I used to have). He and the convict, in particular, were somewhat in 'competition,' and I think this fueled his tendency to get a much more vibrant coloration. Even with just the oscar (after having removed the convict) his coloration remained quite exceptional.

What size of tank is yours in, and what are his tankmates (if any...please list sizes as well, if applicable)?
BV


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

Okay, I am so glad that I do have a Salvini. He is in a tank with other fish. I have him in with a 7 inch Rotkeil Severum, 2 BN Plecos, and 4 Red Red Rainbows. I am moving in 2 weeks and after the move I am planning on adding a couple more cichlids to the tank. The tank is 80 gallons (4 ft long) and has tons of driftwood for territories/hiding places. The sev chases him everytime he comes out of his hiding spot. He doesn't seem like he is really competing with my sev as much as he is submitting to my sev  Would it help if I added a female salvini? He is eating very well and seems to be in excelent health. Any other suggestions to help bring out his color would really be appreciated


----------



## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

You're right, it does sound more like he's just 'avoiding' that severum rather than 'competing' with him. This being the case, it is only natural for him to show subdued coloration. Unless in 'competition' mode or breeding mode, his coloration isn't likely to change much, in my experience.

How long has he been in this tank? How long has the sev been in this tank? (I'm assuming the sev was there first, correct?) If the sal is only a relatively recent addition, his 'true colors' (pun intended)---both appearance-wise and personality-wise---may not show for a few weeks until he has gotten more settled. Then again, the sev is likely to always be the bigger fish in there, so things may not change as far as the dynamic between these two goes. By the same token, it would not be completely unheard of for the sal to have just simply 'had enough' one day and give the sev a taste of his own medicine...which could change things up as well.

I'll give you a chance to digest all that...definitely lots of factors at play here.
Personally I would not be inclined to add a female sal. My reluctance stems from what I've witnessed firsthand with a breeding pair, and also what I've come across on this forum from others who have bred them in a 4-foot tank. The consensus seems to be that the pair would completely 'own' a 4-footer, which IMO would not bode well for the sev...
BV


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

Wow, you are right, that is definetly a lot to think about.....

My severum was moved into the tank 6 weeks ago and the tank was a fully stocked SA tank. After he killed my largest angel, I moved all of the other fish besides the rainbows and bn plecos from the tank. I went to the LFS looking for a fish that could stand up to him and I came home with my salvini. He was added to the tank about 3 weeks ago.

I was thinking that adding a couple more medium sized cichlids to the tank might help. I was thinking that they might divert my Severum's attention away from my Salvini and give him a little more breathing room. My salvini could also have a little competition amongst the other cichlids......What do you think?

Honestly, if my salvini is going to be constantly stressed in my tank, I will re-home him and find a tankmate that will be more compatible with my severum. I think that my only option may be to buy a large cichlid (larger than my severum) who will be on a little more even footing with him. I was thinking of an Oscar (large ones are not expensive and they are not hard to find), , but I am not sure if an oscar could hold its own against him. Stocking this tank has been very frustrating. Please let me know if you have any insite to the situation. I really appreciate all of the help you have given me so far


----------



## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Okay, thanks for the extra info...definitely helps.

As far as adding an oscar...
Your theory makes sense to a certain extent (in that the oscar will provide an added distraction for the sev), but you'd still be faced with the very real possibility that you end up with two larger fish pushing the salvini around. I can envision the two dividing the tank in half...which puts the salvini (now faced with 'double trouble,' so to speak) stuck in the middle somewhere.

Personally, I wouldn't do it.
Aside from what I mentioned above, I just don't think the tank is big enough down the road for a full-grown oscar, sev, and male salvini.

If it were me, I'd wait until after the move and then start these two (sev and sal) together again in a relatively empty tank (substrate is fine, but leave out the decor to begin with). It would even be more ideal if you could give the sal some time in there alone (in which case adding decor is fine) before adding back the sev, but I know this might not be feasible. Basically whatever you can do to give the sal a 'head-start' would be good.

See how things go from there...
If at least a couple weeks go by and things still don't look good, you can revisit other stocking options. For now, I'd say your best bet is to just focus on having everyone survive the move---use a divider in there in the meantime if things start getting out of hand and you're really worried about the sal.
BV


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

I will definetly try giving the salvini some time alone in the tank after the move. I can keep my sev in a rubbermaid tub with a filter for a few extra days. Hopefully that will help even things out.

I think you misunderstood my statement about the Oscar. I was saying that if the Salvini continued to be really stressed, I would re-home him and replace him with an Oscar who would be more capable to standing up to my sev  If I added a couple cichlids to serve as a distraction I was thinking along the lines of a convict and firemouth (both of which are much smaller than a full grown oscar). Maybe I could add these after the Salvini is alone in the tank for a day or so and then add my severum last?


----------



## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

As for the plans revolving around keeping the salvini and sev...


ktluvsfish said:


> If I added a couple cichlids to serve as a distraction I was thinking along the lines of a convict and firemouth (both of which are much smaller than a full grown oscar). Maybe I could add these after the Salvini is alone in the tank for a day or so and then add my severum last?


Yes, that could work. I'd add these along with the sal at the same time.
Just be aware that there is always the possibility of pairing amongst the sal/con/FM, so I'd be sure to get a male convict (I'd aim for about a 4-incher) and try for an even slightly larger male FM (sexing could be tricky, but just try your best for one with long, pointy dorsal finnage and lots of red coloration).



ktluvsfish said:


> I think you misunderstood my statement about the Oscar. I was saying that if the Salvini continued to be really stressed, I would re-home him and replace him with an Oscar who would be more capable to standing up to my sev


You're right...I didn't read carefully enough---I must be getting tired. Sorry about that!  
This could work as an alternative plan, provided you get the right oscar with the right personality. If you end up attempting this, I'd go for one that is close to about the 10-inch mark. Some oscars (like mine) won't tolerate other cichlid tankmates. Then again, I have known of others whose adult oscar shared a 75 gal. tank with an adult sev just fine.

I'd say either of the two plans mentioned _could_ work.
BV


----------



## illy-d (Nov 6, 2005)

Hey guys my $0.02 should you decide to try adding another Cichlid (to end with a trio; Rotkiel, Salvine & ___ ):

Try a male convict of 4 or more inches if you can find one.

Keep it male as CA cichlids have been known to hybridize and Cons will apparently pair with anything - go with a male and you don't have to worry about an inadvertant pairing between the sal & con.

Convicts are great foot soldiers. They can take a licking and keep on ticking. I had a male convict that went into a rage on my spotted raphael catfish and came out a lot worse for wear... One large water change and two days later and you could hardly tell he had been in such an epic scuffle.

A nice looking male convict is a good looking fish IMO. Understated to be sure, but very cool looking in their own right.

Big Vine did this very thing I believe so he can probably add more real world experience but with lots of caves etc it could work - at least for awhile.


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

Big Vine said:


> As for the plans revolving around keeping the salvini and sev...
> 
> 
> ktluvsfish said:
> ...


I would love to keep my Salvini, so I think I will try the first plan and see if it works. I'll keep you guys posted and let you know what happens. Thanks so much for all of your help


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

illy-d said:


> Hey guys my $0.02 should you decide to try adding another Cichlid (to end with a trio; Rotkiel, Salvine & ___ ):
> 
> Try a male convict of 4 or more inches if you can find one.
> 
> ...


Hey Illy-d, thanks so much for the imput. I actually saw some larger Male cons at the LFS not too long ago. Maybe I'll see if they have them. I saw a really cool 5 inch long GT on craigslist today, but I think he would probably be too agressive.....what do you think? I'll try to get a pic of my tank later tonight and post it up. I would love feedback on the aquascaping.


----------



## steve_58 (Jan 20, 2009)

I have salvini's and maybe it's just the picture but the colors and markings on that one just don't look right to me.Like i said maybe its just the picture.

In my experience if you want 2 salvinis in the tank then go for a pair and put nothing else in the tank. If they decide to breed they will become one of the most aggressive cichlids.If you put two males together they will fight eventually. I'm just speaking from my own personal experience with them. A 3" salvini can and will beat up an oscar over twice it's size.If they fight with convicts it will eventually lead to the death of one of them.A lone salvini in a tank with other cichlids will most likely hide all the time.Put 2 together in a 4' tank and they will most likely rule it.


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

UPDATE:

Well Big Vine, you know that "snap" that you said that my salvini might have when he has had enough of the severum...... well that happened tonight! I came home from work and my severum was hiding in a corner and his coloration was very dark (he turns this color whenever he is stressed). I had no clue what was wrong. My salvini was hiding in the opposite corner of the tank. I fed the fish, and he ate very well and even chased my Salvani away from the food, but my salvani kept coming back and didn't back down. Well soon after I fed them, the two of them were in the middle of the tank flaring at eachother. On the spot, my salvini turned this gorgeous gold color and his black markings were very prominant. Now he is swimming all over the tank very confinently, and my severum looks scared *&^%less. Well I am hoping that things will balance out now. I am hoping that the tables don't turn drastically in one direction resulting in one of them getting hurt. Hopefully this will work out though. If it does, I don't think I will be adding any more cichlids to the tank. I'll just let the two of them be.....this has been complicated enough, lol.


----------



## Big Vine (Feb 26, 2007)

Wowsers!
Well, I'd say just keep a very close eye on things to make sure no one is getting killed in there. In my experience, salvinis have generally kept to themselves and minded their own business. BUT, when push comes to shove, they could take a lot of roughing-up, and they would push back. Very tough fish capable of inflicting some serious harm on tankmates...

Like I said, keep a close eye on things.
I'd be much more concerned about the severum's well-being at this point. The fact that he's a bit bigger will continue to work to his advantage, and maybe he'll learn not to bite off more than he can chew when it comes to that salvini (who is now 'fighting back').



ktluvsfish said:


> ...flaring at eachother. On the spot, my salvini turned this gorgeous gold color and his black markings were very prominant. Now he is swimming all over the tank very confinently, and my severum looks scared *&^%less.


Got any new pics of the salvini?

Quite the rollercoaster ride, eh? :lol: 
BV


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

Yup, things totally flipped a 180 last night, lol. I tried to get a pic of the salvini, but he is skittish around me, so its hard to get close enough to the tank to get pics of him. I'll try again on my lunch break and see if I have any luck. I felt so bad this morning....my severum has a chunk missing out of his tail. Poor guy didn't know what hit him last night.

I am going to keep a close eye on things and if things don't improve, I think I may rehome the salvini or try to get a separate tank for him and a female. I think that my severum may just be an only cichlid kind of fish. He doesn't bother the rainbows or plecos in my tank, so I may just put some more dithers in with him and maybe a school of cories. I just want to make sure that nobody gets hurt.

I guess this has taught me a very valuable lesson.....even though an 80 gallon tank seems like a lot of room, if the fish don't get along, it is a very small space for them to be confined in.

Just out of curiosity, what is the minimum tank size that I would need for a mated pair of salvini's? I may try to set this up after I move.


----------



## klumsyninja (Aug 14, 2008)

I'd love to see an updated pic of this Salvini!

I find that If I pull up a chair right in front of my tank and leave it there for an hour then come over and sit in it with my camera (I'll even set up my tripod with my cam on it too when I set up the chair) The fish are already used to something being there and If I sit there for a bit they settle down and I can snap some decent shots of my fish..

Just a tip, try it out if you feel inclined.

But I'd love to see some pics.

On another note I think that that Sev has more to worry about ah this point as they've got smaller mouths don't they and although they can beat it up pretty good, that Salvini and tear some serious chunks. no?


----------



## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

Okay, I finally got some pics 

My poor sev has been hiding in the corner behind some driftwood all day. His coloring is black as pitch because he is so stressed. My salvini has been hanging out in the center of the tank and has even started chasing away my rainbows. My sev has a pretty good chunk missing out of his tail from last night. I feel that I should separate them asap to prevent further casualties....


































And here's a pic of my sev....this is the brightest his colors have been all day


----------

