# New to Victorians with a question.



## joescaper1 (Feb 14, 2013)

I have been keeping Tanganyikans for quite some time, so I am not a stranger to African cichlids. What I have is no experience with mouth brooders. I read some text in the C.A.R.E.S. section of the forum and as a noble endeavor is well worth the time needed to participate. With no experience breeding mouth brooders, I decided to start with a vulnerable species instead of one that is critically endangered. I purchased two broods (1" or less) of Pundamilia sp. Blue Bar Hippo Point from the Breeders Award Program Auction at a G.C.C.A meeting, 17 fry in total. After a month they are, remarkably, still alive. Eight of them are around 1 1/4" now. Only one of the eight has an egg spot. I know that egg spots are not a way of determining the sex of a fish; I am not concerned about that, their permanent home is still being prepared so determining the proper ratio is a bit down the road. However, it made me wonder; do all male mouth brooders from Lake Victoria have egg spots?

Thank you.
Joe


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## AlmightyJoshaeus (May 2, 2013)

I'm no expert, but I've never heard of a species that does not have eggspots on males. A better way to figure out genders is to look for fish color...most female vics stay grey or brown and the males tend to get some very bright colors, often at about that size, although this species is an exception (males are greyish-purple, and females are somewhat yellowish). By the way, if I recall correctly, blue bar hippo point is actually the same thing as Pundamilia pundamilia, which would be the correct name if I am right.


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## joescaper1 (Feb 14, 2013)

AlmightyJoshaeus,

I was using this post (I know it was a long time ago) to determine what I called them. Dave's website still refers to them as Pundamilia sp. Blue Bar.

quoteby ds1196 » Thu Jun 12, 2008 6:20 am 
They are different from the Pundamilia pundamilia. They're a larger species that can grow to about six inches. They also have much more blue to them than the Pundamilia pundamilia.
Dave Schumacher 
Dave's Rare Aquarium Fish

I am not saying you are wrong, I don't know anything about it. This is just to let you know why I called them Blue Bar and I am not above changing how I refer to them if I need to do so.

Thank you for your response.
Joe


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## Chester B (Dec 28, 2012)

You are correct there is Pundamilia sp. "blue bar" which is one of the more common Vics in the hobby. As far as whether all male Vics get egg spots, I personally don't know as there are hundreds of species. It does seem to be present in the majority of males, but I can't say if its "every" male.


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

Eggspots on victorians are an interesting thing. Every species is different, but in general the males usually get very big, bold eggspots in comparison to the females. Some females show no eggspotting even. Take my Dayglow for instance, the males ALWAYS have 3-4 distinct large eggspots. The females do not start showing any eggspots until 3" or so and even then they are faint and barely there. I cannot think of a victorian i have ever kept that the females had eggspots that were even half as noticeable as the males. I was just out in my fish room looking and of the five species of vics i keep, i could only see any real eggspots on two of the species females.


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## Mschn99 (Dec 24, 2012)

And that is not saying to sex fish by eggspots, but it can give you some indication with some victorians.


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## AlmightyJoshaeus (May 2, 2013)

Guess I'm wrong then...carry on.


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## joescaper1 (Feb 14, 2013)

You are not wrong, you just relayed information provided by someone that differed with the opinion I saw. If you said it was ok to keep your 20 - $200 discus with 20 - wild caught piranah in a 20 long, that would be wrong. Anyway, the frequency with which the names change in this hobby, tomorrow what you read may now be right.  Since it doesn't have a species name after all these years, must be no one can figure it out.

Joe


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