# multie and julie aggression



## merissa (Jun 22, 2008)

I couldn't leave well-enough alone!

So, I added a group of j. transcriptus juvies to my 20 long multie tank...the multies have recently been upgraded to this tank, and I kept their shell bed toward the left side with bare sand and a rock pile on the right waiting for the julies. I only have 1 multie colony going: 1 male with 3 females and their fry/juvies, some of which are approaching adulthood.

Well, the multies are NOT playing nice...the 4 julies were added yesterday, and they're already pushed to the upper corners on their side. Even the multie babies are chasing them around!! So, I obviously need to do some major aquatic engineering of the tank, but I wanted some expert advice first. I plan to rearrange the shellbed and put more space between the territories...Would adding a bubble wall or something be any good? Any suggestions on how to shake things up to give the julies a chance here?

:-? 
Thanks much!!!!


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

You can try to rearrange again, but I don't think you'll have much success. As the colony grows the julies will just run out of space. I think they've been added to the aquarium a little too late. Perhaps larger julies will have a better chance.


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## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

Im in almost the exact situation but prior to the adding of the julies.

I have a colony of 8 similis. Going into a 20 long. Rocks on the right side. Shells on the left.

They are going into the tank within the next few hours. I am getting a mated-pair of transcriptus within the next week. I hope this doesnt happen with me.

With the rocks... i currently have them set up as a big cave. Would it be better to just stack them somewhat randomly? The pair i am getting will be around 3 inches and about and inch and a half.


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## rsretep (Apr 12, 2007)

i did my transcriptus first and added gold occies in after(simply by luck i got the julies first lol)
but they are in a thirty breeder with rocks for julies and shells for lamps....their are minor squabbles but all and all things are peaceful...got both species readily breeding and am extracting fry as i need to....good luck to all


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## merissa (Jun 22, 2008)

Well,
I'm way more stubborn than a bunch of shelldwellers, so here's what I've put together today that has, at least temporarily, solved my problem...

I spent my Mother's Day rearranging the tank:
*totally rocked my multies' world by moving their shells around, so they think they're in a new place...
*added a tall rock, plus moved my tall holey rock, to create a visual barrier between the shell bed & rock pile
*added several tall plants around this rock wall to create a little "forest" you'd have to swim through to bully someone
*and, last but not least, added a small bubble wall along one of these rocks.

SO, I've basically created a little Alcatraz for my fish...the julies are really loving life now. Swimming around all the rocks, venturing even past the wall, and although the multies might dart at them to get them away from the shells, no more chasing!!!!!

Granted, it's only been a few hours, but the tank looks nice and everyone's getting around.
The only bickering is among the multies who found themselves with new neighbors in the colony who they're having to readjust to...

I knew I could do it!!! (hopefully I won't be reposting about this tomorrow...)

:dancing: 
Merissa


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## baitfish2000 (Mar 11, 2005)

add some pics - I have a 20gal long for my multies - they evicted my black calvus and I would love to see how you are making it work.


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## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

Here is a few pictures i took. Not great quality, i took them with a cell phone.


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## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

The big shell in the back of the first picture has two or three little babies being heavily guarded by their mother/father.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

I went through the same thing when I added j. transcriptus to my simili's tank. At first the 
simili's were relentless. After a while and after much rearranging shells and rocks, settled on this.










The juli's hung at the top of the rocks where the simili's didn't see them. After some time,
the simili's stopped going after them and simply defended if they ventured over the shells. It's 
working well. Everybody has a space. And today I saw my first simili fry. Popped up out of the 
shells for an instant and then back down again. So, breeding has begun and all is still well. It just 
takes time. They seem to have an understanding now between the species. I just had to move 
things around until I got lucky and hit on what works. Even within the simili's, there are actually 
two groups that share the shell bed, but have an invisible boundary down the middle. The 
dominant male on each side flares at the other, but then retreats to his side and his female. I 
think this is going to be one of my favorite tanks to watch.

So, don't give up on it, keep moving things around if you have to. In time the juli's will get 
comfortable and stick up for themselves. Mine did.


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## merissa (Jun 22, 2008)

Here are some photos of my newly divided tank...still so far so good!!!


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## merissa (Jun 22, 2008)

Love your similis/julie tank, Prov356!!! Amazing!!


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## AquaProbey (Apr 1, 2009)

i know this is a bit off topic but are they realy plants merissa? if so what wattage do you have??

the tank looks great btw


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

> Here are some photos of my newly divided tank...still so far so good!!!


Looks good, and should work out for you. I like two species tanks. Some interaction is good. :thumb:
Be ready to eventually remove some juli's though. At best you'll get two pair, and it won't be long 
before they start pushing each other around.


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## merissa (Jun 22, 2008)

Few real plants in this one...I did recently add a few java fern plantlets from my planted tank and tied them to some of these rocks, but they're hardly visible yet. I only keep the light on in this tank for about 5 hours in the evenings, and I have a VERY sparse sand substrate for the multies.

I do hope to get a pair out of my 4 julie juvies, so I'll be keeping an eye on them for aggression. They're little bitty guys so far...
Thanks so much for the replies and encouragement!! I'm loving the set-up so far!!


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

Merissa, you do know that you have different types of Julies in there right? I don't see any real transcriptus in this picture. Some ornatus and some marleiri Gombe.


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## merissa (Jun 22, 2008)

I have 4 transcriptus...not marlieri gombe or ornatus. Sorry you can't tell from the picture, but that's what I have. Certain (or at least as certain as you can ever be with cichlids!)


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## football mom (Feb 19, 2006)

I have multis and J. transcriptus in my 33long tank (48X13X12) going from left to right:
a pile of stones, a flat area with plants, a shell bed and another small pile of stones on the far right side.
I first put in a pair of multis and some of their fry from my overcrowded 15long, and a single 
Juli that was the odd guy out when a pair formed in another tank. I put 2 more young Julis in with them, and almost immediately there is one that was the "reject". So in this long old tank, there's only 2 Julis and a small multi group. The multis keep the Julis on their side of the tank.
I'd like to add another species to the tank, but I don't know how that would work.


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## overleaf (Jan 18, 2009)

merissa said:


> I have 4 transcriptus...not marlieri gombe or ornatus. Sorry you can't tell from the picture, but that's what I have. Certain (or at least as certain as you can ever be with cichlids!)


Fogelhund is right...

Here are photos of the different julie breeds from PamChin:

http://www.cichlidae.com/article.php?id=422

You can see that the transcriptis doesn't look anything like the ones you have.

Also, if you look at your fish you'll see some have vertical barring, some horizontal. The transcriptus has blocky patches on a black body.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

There's no line under the eye that I can see, so I don't see marlieri. And even though the pattern isn't 
typical of what we think, when we think transcriptus, it can vary. The horizontal barring can be strong, 
so they could very well be transcriptus. I received 7 transcriptus from a very reputable breeder, and one 
had marking that was a bit unusual, but still transcriptus.

Merissa, can you get some closer side shots?


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## merissa (Jun 22, 2008)

I'm not worried about getting help identifying my fish...I'm perfectly comfortable with their identification. I just posted asking for suggestions with the aggression, and that problem's solved.

Thanks!


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## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

I got my julies yesterday. Both beautiful fish. The female has enflamed gills. Any idea why???


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