# Another Emperor 400 media question



## Noahbody (Jan 12, 2007)

I am tired of wasting money buying filter media. From what I have read, it is not necessary.

What do I need to replace the filter media (blue on one side, black plastic on the back and filled with carbon).

I have 2 Emperor 400s in my 75gallon African Cichlid tank.

Much Appreciated.


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## afoctober2 (Apr 7, 2007)

if you get a utility knife you can cut off the blue filter media and take out the carbon. Than put scotch brite pad on it and if you want put bio media inside the plastic. What I do is I have white felt from walmart glued to the plastic and a scotch brite pad over that. It does an amazeing job for polishing but it has to be cleaned every few days. I have to get some pics.


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## addicted2cichlid (Apr 8, 2008)

scotch brite institutional size (6x9) scouring pads, look for them at sams club. package of 20 is like 6$. they fit perfect and last a while, awesome mechanical


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## stuckinthemiddle (Feb 26, 2008)

any need to glue them to the black plastic?


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## afoctober2 (Apr 7, 2007)

You can use rubberbands on the top and bottom or even use silicone


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## bulldogg7 (Mar 3, 2003)

foster and smith makes reusable baskets, you can clamp some floss in there.
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=13371
I use the scothbrite pads, all I have to do is rinse them once a week and replace them every few weeks.


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## addicted2cichlid (Apr 8, 2008)

stuckinthemiddle said:


> any need to glue them to the black plastic?


why would u want to glue a filter pad into a filter.... ur going to have to replace it eventually.

so no u dont have to secure it in, they sit firmly in the track, almost like they were made for it!


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## stuckinthemiddle (Feb 26, 2008)

Awesome, Im definitely gonna have to use this method. What color are the scotchbrite pads? I know they make different types...heavy duty, regular, etc.

thanks all


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## bulldogg7 (Mar 3, 2003)

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/view ... highlight=

They're green, they paint for logo doesn't bleed off. These are safe if you can find the 6X9's I haven't tried any other brands like the industrial brown pads.


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## cvillanueva21 (Mar 10, 2008)

I use Morning Glory Low Loft Quilter's Polyester Batting from Wal-Mart. They cost me about $6(Maryland) for an 81"x96". Comes in a purple plastic bag.

I bought two extra gray media containers and filled all four of them using this media.


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

cvillanueva21 said:


> I use Morning Glory Low Loft Quilter's Polyester Batting from Wal-Mart. They cost me about $6(Maryland) for an 81"x96". Comes in a purple plastic bag.
> 
> .


Good lord!!!! Thats what I use and it cost me $1.85 give or take few cents!

I am trying out one of the new Tetra Ex filters ( EX70 ) and I just toss a bunch of it in.


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## cvillanueva21 (Mar 10, 2008)

I used to use the other Polyester Batting by Morning Glory that was in a green bag ($2.36) but switched over to the low loft one because they are attached to each other instead of just clumps which break down and swirl around in the aquarium. I prefer the _Low Loft_. If it is the same one that you are using then probably location is the only thing I can think of that makes the price difference. Maryland, outside of Washington D.C. Your location?


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## afoctober2 (Apr 7, 2007)

Here is how my emperor 400 is set up I have the scotch brite on outside to catch bigger stuff than I glued these white polyester felt cloths inside to filter out everything else







This is what it looks like when its dirty to clean the felt cloth I use a high pressure nossle for the sink in the basement. The white felt actually will do an amazing job to polish the water but it has to be kept up with this time I let it go almost 2 weeks before cleaning it but it should be done every week.


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## lotsofish (Feb 28, 2008)

My Emperor came with re-fillable plastic cartridges. I put floss in them. I've also used the Bio-3 cartridges with blue bonded pads cut to size. You can even put carbon between the layers of the bonded pads. I've even used Seachem's "the bag" with purigen in the cartridges. I like the Emperors because there are many options that require only sliding the cartridges in place.


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## Noahbody (Jan 12, 2007)

afoctober2 said:


> Here is how my emperor 400 is set up I have the scotch brite on outside to catch bigger stuff than I glued these white polyester felt cloths inside to filter out everything else
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Why scotch pads and white polyester do you use? How often do you throw them away and replace?

Thanks


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## afoctober2 (Apr 7, 2007)

The scotch pads are industrial scotch pads I am only able to find them at home depot in the cleaning section. The white felt can be found at walmart in the hobby section. They have them in differant colors. I have never thrown them away yet I just clean them. I don't rely on them for bio filtration so I just spray them down and get all the dirt and waste out. Scotch pad shouldn't have to be replaced but if you wanted to replace the white felt there only 8cents a sheet.


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## Chris Derrick (Aug 31, 2008)

addicted2cichlid said:


> scotch brite institutional size (6x9) scouring pads, look for them at sams club. package of 20 is like 6$. they fit perfect and last a while, awesome mechanical


Hi there, I like this idea so I went to sams and purchased a set of 20 great Idea! Only problem I have is on the back it says not for aquarium use???? This worries me, could some one reassure me this is ok!???? Thanks Chris Derrick :thumb:


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## bulldogg7 (Mar 3, 2003)

Think that's just a liability thing, to keep people from cleaning thier glass with them, I've been using them for a few months now, no problems yet.


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## Chris Derrick (Aug 31, 2008)

Great Idea! thanks for the quick reply I am headed home to install them now. Chris


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## bulldogg7 (Mar 3, 2003)

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/view ... highlight=


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## afoctober2 (Apr 7, 2007)

has anyone else tried useing the white felt?


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## Chris Derrick (Aug 31, 2008)

bulldogg7 said:


> foster and smith makes reusable baskets, you can clamp some floss in there.
> http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=13371
> I use the scothbrite pads, all I have to do is rinse them once a week and replace them every few weeks.


I went and purchased a box of 20 for my 4 emp 400 hanging out back because I thought it was a great idea. I got to reading on the box and it says in bold print NOT FOR AQUARIUM USE! So I called 3M the company that makes scotch brite and talked to a rep about why this is and he told me it will kill the fish because they use aluminum oxide in the material to help it clean stuff better.  I was so glad I didn't use it on my new wild caught tropheus tank and thought I would pass it along here maybe save some one else's fish also! Now lets find out a new idea on what to use to save money on these filters. Thanks and hope this helps. Chris Derrick


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## JessiLou (May 31, 2008)

After reading this, I just pulled them out of my filters. Now I don't know what to put in there lol I have an empty slot in 3 filters now. I really don't want to go back to buying the filters that are sold for these.


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## bulldogg7 (Mar 3, 2003)

are you talking about the green pads or the brown? I had no idea the green had the aluminum oxides in them no troubles yet out of them, nice to know.

here's the MSDS for the green pads from my post, I'm still looking through it.

http://multimedia.mmm.com/mws/mediawebs ... G5LH2CNt--


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## JessiLou (May 31, 2008)

I had the green ones in mine


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## bulldogg7 (Mar 3, 2003)

They do contain some Al2O3, and it is toxic to fish in acidic water. It's also an ingredient in blasting sand. They should be safe for use in alkaline waters, IMO.

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/rock_metals.php


> Heavy metals (lead, zinc, copper, cadmium, etc etc and even iron) are toxic for fish, inverts, and mammals, including us, when they reach certain-enormously varying-concentrations. In the case of fish, such metals are primarily dangerous in their free ionic form in the water where they are available for uptake by the fish metabolism.
> 
> In the form of compounds, such as oxides, they are inert and not free for metabolic uptake. For example water conditioners which 'detoxify' heavy metals actually bind them into compounds which cannot be absorbed by the fish
> 
> ...


My apologies to anyone who's experience trouble with these.


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## JessiLou (May 31, 2008)

I haven't had any trouble witht them. I just pulled them out when I read they could kill my fish. I thought they worked very well actually.


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## Chris Derrick (Aug 31, 2008)

bulldogg7 said:


> are you talking about the green pads or the brown? I had no idea the green had the aluminum oxides in them no troubles yet out of them, nice to know.
> 
> here's the MSDS for the green pads from my post, I'm still looking through it.
> 
> ...


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## natalie559 (Dec 6, 2007)

bulldogg7 said:


> foster and smith makes reusable baskets, you can clamp some floss in there.
> http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=13371


The above is what I use. I use the blue sponge and fill the clamp shell with poly fill. I don't buy the refills, just bought the product for the clamp shells. I also use the two gray cartridges that came with the filter and have one filled with poly fill and the other with pot scrubbers.


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## ssondubs (Nov 16, 2008)

I too have the scotchbrite pads on my two, 4 pads in each power filter. Best $8 I have ever spent.

One thing I would recommend is to reuse the black plastic media tray and add the scotch-brite pads ahead of them. One per side is all you need to keep the filter pad from deflecting when it starts to get heavily soiled. The emperor is by far my favorite filter for ease of use and affordability. I also like that it agitates the surface to improve gas exchange and keeps the film away too.


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## KaiserSousay (Nov 2, 2008)

* I just pulled them out when I read they could kill my fish*

You have a better chance of a lightening strike hitting your tank than the pads doing any harm.
You would need water so acidic it could clean pennies for the pads to do any badness.


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## R-DUB (Jun 3, 2007)

Just a thought.... The green "scotch-brite" pads are the premium brand. Kinda pricey and from what I read they maybe caustic. Solution-- buy the off-brand cheapo pads. They are not the same material (I think they are just nylon) cause 3M has the rights to that exact material that scrubs pots and pans so well. Just get the look alike and your water is still polished.


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## pretty-nifty (Nov 4, 2009)

Would you put charcoal or some other chemical filter, if so what, in the plastic cage/media holder if you use this scotch-brite on the outer slot?


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## KaiserSousay (Nov 2, 2008)

pretty-nifty said:


> Would you put charcoal or some other chemical filter, if so what, in the plastic cage/media holder if you use this scotch-brite on the outer slot?


Most do not use charcoal on a regular basis.
You could make it real easy on yourself by getting a roll of quilt batting and put that in your Ã¢â‚¬Å"clam shellÃ¢â‚¬Â


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## pretty-nifty (Nov 4, 2009)

What's the charcoal for anyway? Most of the cartridges being sold have charcoal enclosed and floss on the outside. Is quilt batting the same as floss?


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## KaiserSousay (Nov 2, 2008)

*What's the charcoal for anyway?*
It can trap/absorb some organics.
Remove odors.
Clear medications from a tanks water,

*Most of the cartridges being sold have charcoal enclosed and floss on the outside.*
True, why??
I couldn`t tell you.

*Is quilt batting the same as floss?*
Yes


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I suspect the truth is that many filters are sold to a much less informed group than many of us. We can all look pretty dumb sometimes but just the fact that we are here trying to learn more, makes us a cut above lots of filter buyers. With that in mind, I think filters may need to be a bit better for some buyers. While many of us feel the carbon unnecessary, it gives just a bit more slack for the ones who really just struggle with keeping the fish alive. I'm thinking of the group that about once a month takes the tank all apart and sets it in the sink to really clean everything with good hot water. They need all the help they can get from filters because it's a bit of an uphill climb anyway. We may have been there, done that????

And carbon does do a good job of filtering when it is new and used right.


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## pretty-nifty (Nov 4, 2009)

This quilt batting is the same one you buy at a craft store like Michael's or Hobby Lobby? This is the white stuff. What about the blue stuff, like on the cartridges being sold. Does not the blue stuff filter more than the batting? This is the mechanical filter? I suppose this is all you really need. The Biowheel does the biological filtration.


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## krfhsf (Dec 25, 2008)

Quilt batting works way better than the blue bonded stuff.


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## pretty-nifty (Nov 4, 2009)

Where's the best place to buy this? Walmart? Are there different kinds and grades? I asked my wife if she had any quilt batting left and where she bought it, she looked at me perplexed.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

I get mine at wall mart and I just look for the stuff that doesn't say anti-bacterial on the bag.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I tried pillow stuffing as a replacement for filter floss and found it seemed to sog down and cut off the flow pretty quick. Quilt batting is the same only it has glue to hold it in shape somewhat better. I found for my methods it still blocked flow quicker than I wanted. I now buy the blue bonded pad in a bulk roll very cheap and cut it to fit. With the different layers bonded together, I find it requires changing less often for the way my tanks work. Not quite as cheap but not quite as much work so I'm going kind of middle of the road.


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## pretty-nifty (Nov 4, 2009)

The blue bonded pad... is that the one where with the white stuff behind it? Where do you get it cheap?


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

My last need I found a local guy who operates a garage type place. I went in with another guy and split a huge roll. For the number of times I will reuse it, I think I have a lifetime supply so really don't have a current source. It is the blue pad with maybe 1/4 inch of white bonded to it. I like the stiffness and find I can wash it many times if I don't just rip it apart. You might make a specific request of some of the shops around you. I'm pretty sure it will be around Dallas to pick up to avoid shipping. If you frequent Hill Country Cichlid Club forum, you might get a lead on a local source for you. My friend buys it in a roll that looks like a roll of insulation. No idea now how much it has but pretty sure it is a lifetime supply!! Splitting four ways would be good.


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## krfhsf (Dec 25, 2008)

I work for a flooring company. Our pad vendor is Carpenter. They make all of the polyfill and batting in the USA. I buy a 7'2" x 300' roll of quilt batting for $106.00. It's a BIG roll. They just deliver it when they deliver our carpet cushion. In a heavily stocked tank a emporer400 will clog in a week. But a .01 a sq ft I just toss it. I cut this batting up into 10"x16" pc's for the emp filters. Cut & stack up 100's every 3 months. In canisters I only use the blue bonded stuff though.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I may have lost the thread here when you mention quilt batting and floor covering in the same thought. Are you saying quilt batting is used under some floor covering???? I can't think of any use like that. Explain , please?


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## krfhsf (Dec 25, 2008)

PfunMo said:


> I may have lost the thread here when you mention quilt batting and floor covering in the same thought. Are you saying quilt batting is used under some floor covering???? I can't think of any use like that. Explain , please?


I can understand your confusion. Carpenter is the manufactuer of carpet pad and quilt batting. They are locatted in Temple,Tx. Their name is on the bag of all polyfill and quilt batting sold at Michaels,Hobby Lobby,Walmart and all other hobby stores.

http://carpenter.com/


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Negative on the Carpenter for my fiberfill. It is from Wal-mart and from Fairfield Processing Corp in Danbury, Ct.

I quess my main question was about how quilt batting might have related to floor covering. Maybe it isn't? I thought maybe there was some use for it under laminate or such that I had missed. No problem.


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