# I have a 55G tank to stock



## butter_fly382 (Feb 24, 2009)

and i need advise!

It will be planted... and *** already picked out the rocks I want... and I'm still trying to convince myself to take on dome driftwood as well

so all I need to figure out is te fish part.

I want Bolivian rams for sure. They are what inspired me to get the new tank in the first place....

so how many do you suggest with an appropriatly planted 55G... and what else to go with them?

have fun with this! I'm not very experienced with stocking tanks and have no preference other than the rams... I'll take as much advise as i can get


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

A planted South American tank with plants and driftwood (don't really need many rocks) and Bolivians would be nice. I've not had them so I'm not speaking from experience, but I've read that they do well in groups and give you some good behaviors. So I think five might work, but let the experts weigh in. (I do blue rams and would only do two pairs in a 55).

In addition to the rams, you can have a nice large group of smaller tetras. Rummynoses are my hands down favorite. You could do 12+. I personally wouldn't do a second tetra (although you could) because I like the large group of rummynoses . . .

You should also get 5 or 6 cories. I like false juli's (trilineated) or sterbai.

I'm also madly in love with my long-finned albino bristlenose pleco. You MUST get one of these!

In my South American tanks, I have vals, swords, crypts, onion plants, java fern and anubias and they're very, very nice. The eco-complete plant substrate (or similar plant substrate) really does make a different. I also have 3 WPF and injected C02 . . .

Good luck!!


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## butter_fly382 (Feb 24, 2009)

thanks, that was a great help!

I looked at the "cookie cutter" 55 south american tanks with rams.... and i was really surprised with the amount (types) of fish they listed.

â€¢ Pterophyllum scalare - 4 
â€¢ Mikrogeophagus ramirezi or altispinosa - 4 
â€¢ Hyphessobrycon pulchripinnis "Lemon Tetra"- 8 
â€¢ Otocinclus affinis or vittatus - 2 
â€¢ Corydoras myersi - 5

As i think I said, I really know nothing about stocking tanks, especially one this big (my biggest tank in the past has been a 29G)

so is that supposed to be an angelfish OR ram... or is it really suggesting both?

I never put much thought into keeping angles because of my new found affinity for rams.... but if i could have perhaps a pair? That would be great.

any opinion?


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

You can do a pair of angels with some Bolivians, tetras, cories, BN pleco just fine. I personally wouldn't put more than one pair of angels in a 55 (OK maybe I'd do two pairs) but only if well planted and in that case would probably only do one pair of blue rams rather than a group of Bolivians (IME blue rams were milder than Bolivians who squabbled a lot amongst themselves).

I'd also not recommend 2 otos. They prefer groups and are so sensitive that if you start with 2 you're likely to end up with 0. They are not really needed if you do a BN. There's unlikely to be enough algae for all of them. If you do want them, I'd recommend 6 with a veeerrryy slow acclimation to a fully cycled and stable tank.


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## butter_fly382 (Feb 24, 2009)

As of this moment my plan is: 
5 rams (I'm sticking with bolivians because I heard blues are less hardy)
A pair of angels (only one because I prefer the rams) 
8-10 glowlight tetras ( so far they are my favorite)
A few corys
And the reccomended albino pleco

Any changes you would make?

Thanks for all the input already!


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## dwarfpike (Jan 22, 2008)

Glowlights and adult angels would be a bad mix, at least for the glowlights.

I'd deffinately go 5 oto's over the bristlenose for a couple of reasons. One, they will keep it cleaner and two, bristlenoses produce so much waste. I traded mine in for rubberlip plecos instead. Well that and I was tired of it chasing my cichlids. :lol:


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## naegling23 (Jan 4, 2008)

I would stick with 4 rams, they tend to pair up, so get 2m/2f, if you get 5, one will be on the outside, and likely wont make it due to terriories.

The rams will say in the bottom half of your tank, the angels the top half, so you can mix the two, I have 1 pair in a 55...I wouldnt think of adding any more than that. However, glowlight tetras will eventually be angelfish food. Most people recommend a cardinal or larger tetra, but I wouldnt push it, go with a larger bodied tetra, rummynose work, as do lemon, I personnaly have black neons, but I dont think ill restock with them when they die off. I highly recommend about 10 oto cats, they are great at cleaning, I have both oto's and a bristlenose, and plenty of algae for both to eat. However, dont add the otos until the tank is 6 plus months old, build up the algae first otherwise they will starve.

cory's most people seem to suggest 6. If you go with the smaller pygmy dwarf ones, add more of course.


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

Everyone has a different view! I prefer my albino long-finned BN over the otos, which I do love, but rarely see. While my BN has learned that I'll give him algae wafers at the end of a tong and every morning he's out front waiting for his breakfast! 

Rummynose work with angels (get a large-ish) school.

Pristellas are also pretty and a better shape so as not to become angel-food

Black phantoms are also pretty, and a good shape/size AND they have the added benefit of the females having red on them.

Another good smaller cory are pandas.


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## dwarfpike (Jan 22, 2008)

There have been posts of adults angels eating rummynose tetras, but I do find this hard to believe ... even so, they are expensive enough that I wouldn't try it.


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## butter_fly382 (Feb 24, 2009)

yes... a lot of different answers :lol: but I'm picking through to see what i like.

I keep seeing red phantoms? I think they are much more attractive... will they be ok too?

and I think I'm going to stick with the pleco... at least for now because im not a very experienced fish keeper (*** had a few tanks, but with the hardiest fish i could find) and *** never had south americ cichlids so Id like to keep it with as few new expeiences as possible to avoid failure

but if i end up not liking the pleco ill change over in a few months.


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

Female black phantoms are red . . . Yes, they are a very attractive tetra.

I have a school of rummynose in with two HUGE, mature angels and there are no issues, so I was somewhat confident in recommending them. But the black phantoms would definitely be OK as they're wider bodied.


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## dwarfpike (Jan 22, 2008)

Red phantoms (_Hyphessobrycon sweglesi_) are a differant species than black (_Hyphessobrycon megalopterus_ ... red from colombia, black from mato grasso region of brazil/bolivian) but both prefer the lower temps that angels enjoy more so than the rummynose would. Of course some people don't have trouble keeping rummy's at lower temps, but I never did. Those newer four eye phantoms from Guayana are prettier than both IMO though.


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## butter_fly382 (Feb 24, 2009)

thanks for clarifying that... i was getting a little confused... I was almost positive they were a different species

so... for tetras its a toss up between red phantoms and cardinals (my boyfriends choice)

is there any downside to cardinals.

*naegling23* said something about them... but my impression of what they were saying was that cardinals are the smallest tetras that i should consider with angels, but bigger (such as phantoms) would be better.

Is this interpretation correct?

sorry i have so many questions, this is a huge step up from mollies (which my last 29 community was years ago :roll: ) and right now the only other tank i have is a 10 G with a single male betta.

so in short I need all the help I can get

which you all have been great with.


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## dwarfpike (Jan 22, 2008)

Now worries, angels were my first fish and first bred cichlids. :thumb:

Rummynose would be the smallest tetras I'd trust with angels, cardinals can be snacked on by adult angels. They aren't always of course, but it would be a risk.


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## DeadFishFloating (Oct 9, 2007)

G'day *butter_fly382*,

Wow I don't where to start. You've had some good advice, and even though some of it is a little conflicting, it's not really wrong either.

OK, I like the idea of one pair of Angels. However just bying two Angels and hoping they get along may not really work out. Believe it or not, but Angels have an ornery reputation. I have seen many of the Angel experts, and a Mod or two, reccommend buying six juvenile Angels and growing them out, untill a bonded pair forms. Then you return the unwanted Angels to the LFS for store credit. Make sure you speak to your LFS first about this. You should be able to get store credit to the value of the original cost of purchasing those four Angels you return.

Hmmm otocinclus versus bristlenose plecos. I don't know how big otocinclus get in the States, but if anyone is afraid of an Angel eating one of the slimmer tetras, then they really ought to compare the size of oto's and tetras. A fully grown female rummynose is waaaaay larger than an oto. I am in the same boat as *dwarfpike*, I find it hard to believe Angels are going to eat an adult rummynose. With that in mind, and having kept glowlights as well, adult glowlights should be fine with Angels. And back to the Bristlenose discussion... A common observation down here is that many bristlenose start to neglect thier algea eating duties around the 4 inch mark. With that in mind, I have deal with one of my LFS, that I trade my bristlenose in when they get to around 3 to 3.5 inches/ish and get three new >1 inch bristlenose. Only problem is catching the buggers in a semi planted tank. I'm happy as the little ones are much better algea eaters, and the LFS is happy becuase they can sell the larger bristlenose for more $$$. If you can find them, Ancistrus dolichopterus L183, Starlight Bristlenose Catfish are really cool bristlenose.

I do agree that 5 Bolivian rams may not be the best number, but again I'd be tempted to start with 6 juveniles. You can keep an eye on them, and if/when pairs form, if it looks like 6 is a bit cramped, remove 2 and keep 2 hopefull pairs. OH and back to the tetras, if only going one pair of Angels, definately think about having 20ish tetras.

OK off the live stock for a bit. Could you tell us what type of equipment your thinking of using on your new tank.


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## DiscusQueen (Jul 16, 2007)

Hi.. Just a quick comment.. Everyone has already given you great advice.. :thumb: :thumb: 
I've also had a school of rummynoses (30) with adult angels and no problems until the sevs entered the picture and then they were gone almost overnight LOL.. I also had no problem with the adult angels going after ottos in either tank.. same for the black phantoms?? or maybe they are called black skirts (black with red on them) ( I'm not good with tetra id)in my husbands small 29 gallon..and there they really have few places to escape LOL.. If you go to my thread on my geo/angel tank you can see I have very big adult angels..
As to the angels and rams If you really want to have pairs in there, ..I agree work with your lfs and get 6 and then cut them back as they grow out.. Unless you buy a proven pair, with angels especially, it will be some time before you can tell if you truely have a pair. As to the amount of credit, each lfs is different so talk to them up front...
Good luck with your tank.. Great that you are asking questions beforehand. :thumb: . Sue


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## edouthirt (Jan 22, 2008)

> OK off the live stock for a bit. Could you tell us what type of equipment your thinking of using on your new tank.


Hey all,

I am butter_fly382's boyfriend and she asked me to jump in and answer this one for her.

We are still in the decision making process for this... but we have for the most part decided on: 2 Emperor 400s for filtration, 250 visatherm stealth heater, coralife 4X65 watt compact flourescent fixture that came with the tank.

We toyed with the idea of a canister for a while but she assures me that the noise and few bubbles that will be created by the HOB will not bother her and the two emperors will be more than capable of maintaing quality water conditions. And considering that we can get two of them for less than the price of one can (and budget is an issue)... seems like the way to go... plus she has the piece of mine knowing that if one filter fails for whatever reason, the other can cover her for a while.

Feel free to offer any suggestions.


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## dwarfpike (Jan 22, 2008)

Actually, you could go two Emperor 280's if you want, might save you some money. Angels don't like being buffeted around alot. Two 280's would still be 560 gallons per hour before media, ie 10x your tank's volume. The 400's would be over 15x. Good filter choice though, I use either Emperor's or Penjuins on all my tanks.


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## edouthirt (Jan 22, 2008)

dwarfpike,

Thanks for the tip... and actually, I was debating bewtween emps or peguins and if you see in the equipment discussion board I just posted a request for people to tell me what the pros and cons of each are. I have only had Penguins up until recently when I moved to cansters only for my tank.

Care to share your feelings on the issue?


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## dwarfpike (Jan 22, 2008)

I'll post over there to keep this one track with the fishy stuff!! :thumb:


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## ktluvsfish (Jan 13, 2008)

Congrats on the new tank  It sounds like everyone has given you fantastic advise already. I have a suggestion as far as your algae crew goes. I have 2 albino bristlenose plecos in my tank as algae eaters and they do a fantastic job. However, there are certain types of algae that they will not eat (such as the black algae which happened to attack my tank). I would suggest adding a Siamese Algae Eater to your stock list. They will eat any types of algae that your bristlenose won't


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## hollyfish2000 (Aug 23, 2007)

Yes, Siamese Algae eaters will eat black beard algae. But they also get very large, can sometimes be aggressive and are often sold mislabeled so you don't even get something that will eat the BBA. I'd wait on those to see if you even get BBA and then think long and hard before getting any SAEs . . . I've had them on and off and I really end up hating them after a while. They just mess up the feng shui of my tanks!! :wink:


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## butter_fly382 (Feb 24, 2009)

sooo....

I fell in love with the cute rolly polly little figure 8 puffers that i saw at the store yesterday when I was checking on the stocks of my future fish (my tank isnt set up/cycled yet so i couldnt actually buy) and i was wondering how realistic it would be to add to my stock list?

*** seen a post or two with people on here who have puffers.. but i dont know their enture tank set up.

I posted a thread about this in the general fish section of the site... but so far *** only gotten info that i didnt believe to be very accurate.

if not in the 55G... I have a 10 G that i was planning on keeping a betta tank... but if that is a reasonable size for a puffer (with possible tank mates?) or two (i heard they can only be kept with their own species from other sites)?

if its not possible i can just admire them in stores until i have space for a new tank :wink:


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