# cleaning up w/ muriatic acid?



## ixc (Dec 19, 2005)

Well I've got several tanks that have hard water stains that I will be cleaning up. After reading several posts on the easiest/quickest way to get rid of them I made my way to the HW store and picked up a box [2-1G jugs] of muriatic acid (coudnt find smaller quanitites).

*** done a search here and no one specifically states how to use the stuff other than in well ventilated areas and to rinse rinse rinse and rinse again. I assume that since the directions for adding it to a pool say to add in small quanities, that i should be diluting this stuff for my purposes as well.

What is the ratio? Also are the rubber cleaning gloves enough to protect my hands? My plan is to simply wipe down the insides w/ a sponge or rag once i have the correct ratio.


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## K20Z3 (Jul 18, 2008)

I know it's nasty stuff. Don't breath the fumes while you are cleaning with it.

I used some once when I used to mix my own plant ferts. I used a couple of drops in the chleted mix to keep them from growing mold.

Just be careful!


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## illusions2281 (Jan 25, 2009)

thats crazy, i've never heard of that. i usually just vinigar acitic acid. I use to use murac acid on broze boat props they would change color and smoke would rise from them i couldnt imange using it an aquarium. What are you cleaning?


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## ixc (Dec 19, 2005)

illusions2281 said:


> thats crazy, i've never heard of that. i usually just vinigar acitic acid. I use to use murac acid on broze boat props they would change color and smoke would rise from them i couldnt imange using it an aquarium. What are you cleaning?


im cleaning the glass of the tanks. We have really hard water here and if im not adamant about keeping the tanks topped off, a residue builds up at the top. On the two worst tanks (10/20g) I tried keeping them cycled after the fish were moved but being as they were unoccupied the water levels fluctuated a lot.

if you search 'muriatic acid' in on these forums you will see it come up in a lot of threads having to do w/ cleaning the glass. thats how i found it in the first place (searching tank cleaning)


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## caseyof99 (Aug 5, 2009)

i would try doing a six or even a eight to one ratio with it at first to see meaning 8 cups water 1 cup acid. Its really not that strong of an acid compared. I would still try to not get it on the plastic top or the silicone and if you did just rinse it off quick. I've always just used vinegar. I know non-diluted it will bleach the **** out of some concrete. Still i would try a weak solution first and go from there.


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## WillieB (Jul 4, 2009)

+2 on suggested mix ratios above. Never personally used it to clean glass or remove scratches in glass... Was a tile setter for 20+ years though and used it often to remove grout residue and efflorescence. Mix ratio for that was 1/3 for real nasty cases (going behind someone else; my installations rarely required it) Probably bears mentioning to remember to add acid to water instead of the other way around.
One thing you might consider too, is to try your various mix ratios on a test spot instead of going hog wild.
Last thing to throw out there, I know you said you are aware of using it in well ventilated areas.... add "well away from all metal" to that (even the fumes will etch some metals), but if you just can't avoid doing around some metal, one trick is to coat the metal with some vasaline to protect it from the fumes....... and like someone else alluded to earlier, "away from all your concrete and mortar". Good luck.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

I have also used it to remove grout and mortar, I also used to make brass railings and furniture for a living and we would use it to put an antique finish on brass. I would definately wear thick rubber gloves (not the ones for doing dishes) and I would do it outside. Actually, I personally wouldn't go near the stuff again.


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## front-fan (Nov 2, 2005)

I think that if you alternate vinegar and ammonia washes with a little scrubbing that hard water crust is history. The ammonia needs ventilation, but the good thing is you're putting nothing in the tank that's not there naturally. You don't have any worries if your rinse isn't complete enough.

-- Front-fan


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## Natedawg63 (Sep 13, 2008)

Go to the grocer or discount store and look in the bathroom cleaning supplies for Lime-Away or Rust-Away - that is a premixed commercial product for hard water stains - again wear rubber gloves. I am positive it has a mild muratic acid in it. I use it when cleaning my sons trombone slide to flush the gunk out of it.

I have purchased a few used aquariums that had the hazy hard water sections on them. Cleaned and cleaned them, but the discoloration was permanent. Maybe was not tempered glass and the glass was holding the stain - not sure... but it may not ever get really clear again. Usually when you refill with water - it is not horribly noticeable anyways.

Nate


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## zazz (Apr 5, 2008)

it will never remove scratches.... it just removes everything that isnt glass or silicone ..mainly calcium and gunk. Do it all in the open air and hold your breath when you are over the tank .. otherwise you will get a lung full of toxic acid!!!

but as long as your an adult its safe..just dont breath it in.


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## ixc (Dec 19, 2005)

Well i wanted to come back and update my post.

I'll let you all know right up front that I chickened out on using the Muriatic Acid. Instead I went with a product I found at Ace Hardware while picking up some ammonia. The stuff is called Acid Magic: you can see the product website and demo video here:

http://www.certol.com/AcidMagicHome.aspx









Acid Magic next to Ammonia. The ratio for Acid Magic is 1-4 as can be read on the bottle. I used 1 cup of acid magic to 4 cups of water.









this is the tank before









This is the 'hood' before. You couldnt even see through the glass.

I applied using a paint brush. I would dip the bristles in the solution and then paint it on the areas that were affected.

















This is the end result.

sorry for the crappy cellphone pics, but in my mind this is a great solution for cleaning tanks.


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## caseyof99 (Aug 5, 2009)

throw that 10 away and buy a 55... fit mo fish


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## ixc (Dec 19, 2005)

caseyof99 said:


> throw that 10 away and buy a 55... fit mo fish


 I actually have 3 tank projects going at the moment. This 10g is going to be a planted experiment for my office.

Then I have a 20-tall which is going to be a multies tank, and above that (literally) im converting my 55 to a tang tank.

oh and after i get settled w/ these the plan is to redo my 135 mbuna tank that is in the living room.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Thanks for saving my day (I think). I have recently picked up a cheapo, cheapo tank and one of the real bummers was finding no way to clean the glass. Looks much like your before shot only worse!  Off to the store because seeing your results makes it worth the shot. Thanks for the pictures as they do really say more than words ever can. :thumb:


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## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

Concerning Muriatic Acid and toxicity....Muriatic Acid is nothing more than hydrochloric acid in a diluted water solution. It is nasty stuff, but the Muriatic Acid you buy at the store is generally diluted down to about 40% acid. This doesn't mean that is it not still extremely corrosive, because it is, and it will still burn you badly, as well as dissolve active metals.

That being said however, in an aquarium application, as long as it was rinsed out well, some muriatic acid residue would not be toxic. Hydrochloric acid is found naturally in the environment, and is the acid found in the human stomach. Adding a water conditioner to the water would remove most of any acid left in the tank (in the form of chlorine ions or HCl).

Lime away and CLR both also contain hydrochloric acid as the main cleaning ingredient. Many cleaners (including Lime Away and CLR) contain other chemicals that can be very toxic to animals even at very small concentrations. Residue from cleaning products can kill fish. This is why I personally only use vinegar or a stronger concentration of acetic acid. You should not use household and/or industrial cleaners to clean aquariums or aquarium equipment.

Ammonia Hydroxide in water is a base, and therefore will not dissolve many hardwater deposits. An acid solution is required to dissolve most hardwater scaling, which is why ammonia alone usually won't remove hardwater deposits from a tank.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I don't know about IXC who started this blurb, but in my case the normal ammonia and vinegar was not going to get the job done. I am down to having a really sick looking tank or a new one, if other cleaning methods are not to be found. I got a cheap deal knowing it had problems so I'm still gambling on making it work with the Acid Magic. Right now it reads good and the pictures say it works. Will it fix mine? :roll:


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## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

Did you read my last post?

If you look at the contents of Acid Magic, you'll see that the active ingredient is still Hydrochloric acid. The other contents are "a proprietary blend of ingredients". Whatever those ingredients are makes me worry, as acid is _supposed_ to burn skin.

Additionally, if there is an additive that is non polar, it may not be water soluble and may not easily rinse free with water. Chemicals can also be absorbed into aquarium silicone. These kinds of things can leech into the water over time.

If you look at the MSDS sheets for both Muriatic Acid and Acid Magic, you'll see that they are equally as dangerous to your health. The weird part is, Acid Magic is more chemically reactive. Must be those "proprietary blend of ingredients".

I'm sure lots of people will say "I've used ______ for years and never had a problem" and that might be true. In my time though, I've seen too many mystery fish deaths (some in my tanks, most in other people's tanks) to wonder if maybe some stray chemicals aren't to blame.

It is your tank, but for me, I have too much time and money spent on my fish to risk it.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Yes, I did read your post. It did not seem helpful in my case. I have stated that I am down to last ditch methods to clean a cheap tank. As to the fish, They were given to me with the tank. Perhaps you would frown on my using dynamite, also?


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## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

PfunMo said:


> Yes, I did read your post. It did not seem helpful in my case. I have stated that I am down to last ditch methods to clean a cheap tank. As to the fish, They were given to me with the tank. Perhaps you would frown on my using dynamite, also?


Dynamite is fine....just make sure you have it firmly gripped when you light it 

j/k 

In my post, I said that of the cleaners, Muriatic Acid/Hydrochroric Acid is naturally occurring (to a point), it will dilute down to non harmful levels when rinsed, doesn't contain extra cleaning agents or unknown solvents, and whatever is left should be neutralized by the sodium thiosulfate found in water conditioners. If you have to use something strong, hydrochloric would most likely be the best.

If you do use muriatic acid, make sure you wear goggles, gloves, and use it in a well ventilated area. Dilute it down as instructed or even more. Just be careful, as it is pretty hazardous!


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

At long last I was able to find the Acid Magic product referred to above. I was able to find it at the local hardware where they sell it as pool cleaner. They use the local name "safer acid" rather than the official name. Quite cheap at $9.45 a gallon. Thought it worth a try as it is a last ditch attempt to save a pretty junky tank. :-? I was careful to read all warnings and advise even though I was only using it on the outside of the tank. Sounds fine if you follow directions. Does not burn skin but gloves are recommended. I could not detect any fumes though I did not stick my nose in the bottle. :lol: For my problem, I have really bad water or salt stains on both sides of the glass. I worked on the outside first. I am sure the stains are on the outside as they dissapear when I wet them. I had tried ammonia, vinegar, scraping and even fine grit emory paper. No change with any of those. I started with the 1/ 4 dilution the directions suggested for other uses. No good. When the glass dried, the stains were unchanged. :x Went to full strength. Tried letting it set for ten minutes. No good! At this point I wondered if the Acid had lost it's "magic". Taking it to the garage floor I tried it on some stains there with mixed results. At this point the dynamite idea begins to appeal to me. Glad I did not spend the lunch money on this tank!


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