# maracyn vs metro? Parasite vs bloat?



## gregga (Jul 30, 2002)

I brought in 12 new fish recently. I try to quarantine as often as possble. But I didnt have enough Q-tanks open, so some fish went straight into what was an already-stocked 125g.
As usual, I got what I deserved. 
After a week I noticed some twitching and flashing. I did a 70% water change and added melafix. A few days later I notice some clamped fins, so I knew I had a problem. I treated with maracyn plus (broad-based gram negative) because thats what I had at home. The fish that I believe started the outbreak stopped eating and developed one cloudy eye. That fish, plus two others, died. I've continued treating, including soaking their food in meds, but I still dont like what I see in the tank. I do not, however, see any white poop.
It's been a long time since I had to treat for anything, so I have some questions:
How do you differentiate between a bacterial infection or a parasite?
What are the differences between Maracyn, Maracyn 1, Maracyn Plus and Metro? If it's not bloat, what would you recommend to treat with? Would you continue to change large doses of water?


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

gregga said:


> How do you differentiate between a bacterial infection or a parasite?


Often it's a best guess, especially with internal infections. External bacterial infections often present physical symptoms such as lesions, red, white or grey patches of skin, erosion of skin, etc., whereas parasites can be visible (ich) and can also cause physical changes such as sunken stomach (tapeworm). 


gregga said:


> What are the differences between Maracyn, Maracyn 1, Maracyn Plus and Metro?


Maracyn contains Erythromycin, an antibiotic which is effective primarily against gram positive microbials. 
Maracyn 2 contains Minocycline, an antibiotic which is effective against both gram negative and gram positive microbials, although it's efficacy is diminished in high calcium content water (high GH(mild to hard water)).
Maracyn Plus consists of Sulfadimidine (gram negative) and Trimethoprim (gram positive), the former being an antibacterial and the latter being an antibiotic. This product has a reputation of yielding better results when used in saltwater as opposed to freshwater, however this is somewhat anecdotal.
Metronidazole is an antibiotic and antiprotozoal effective against anaerobic bacteria and various protozoans.


gregga said:


> If it's not bloat, what would you recommend to treat with? Would you continue to change large doses of water?


Water changes are almost always beneficial. Are all of the remaining fish still eating? An early symptom of bloat is spitting or avoiding food. If they're still eating, then it's unlikely bloat.

Need some additional info, please post:
Tank Dimensions-
Water Parameters (Temperature, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, pH and if possible GH and KH)-
What and How Often You Feed-
Stocklist-
How long the tank has been running-
Regular water change amount and frequency-
List any water additives-


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## gregga (Jul 30, 2002)

Thanks for the feedback....

Tank is a standard 6' 125g, which has been running about 9 years. Stock list consists of mainly haps, peacocks and some assorted mbuna. Feeding is usually NLS, with an occasional frozen brine shrimp and/or flakes. Water changes every 7-10 days, about 30%....Not sure of exact parameters, but maintenance routine has been about the same for a decade. There is no doubt in my mind that the fish I introduced without quarantine started the problem....

I understand when you said, "often it's a best guess". But judging by the symptons - rapid breathing, twitching, flashing, clamped fins and loss of appetite - what would be your best guess as to what to treat with....

thanks in advance


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

Never underestimate the importance of checking your water parameters when you have an illness. Finding the problem is very much a process of elimination, especially when more advanced methods, like culturing bacteria or preparing microscope slides aren't an option. Start with what's easy to eliminate.
That being said, rapid breathing, twitching/flashing and clamped fins can suggest anything from a fish simply being stressed to changes in water hardness or something more specific like gill flukes.
When you say loss of appetite, are the fish eating less voraciously than in the past or are some not eating at all? Are the existing fish exhibiting these symptoms or just the new fish?


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## gregga (Jul 30, 2002)

All fish in the tank seem to be eating normally. There is still a lot of twitching and flashing going on, so I did another 70%water change today, jacked up the heat and treated with quick cure...Will watch and see what happens over the next 24 hours....


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

You've been in this hobby a lot longer than I, but I wouldn't treat with any meds unless I knew what my water readings were. I've had experience with bloat and had limited success with metro and clout.

Is it possible these larger and more frequent water changes are causing your fish to flash so much? Is the flashing as frequent as it was before your increased water changes?


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## gverde (Mar 3, 2010)

Is it possible these larger and more frequent water changes are causing your fish to flash so much? Is the flashing as frequent as it was before your increased water changes?[/quote]

I do 70-75% every week with Safe conditioner on my 220G hap/peacock tank and never had any issues. Some may flash for an hour or so because of the ph fluctuations but that's about it. I have been doing the 70-75% water changes for over 2 years. Your newly acquired fish must have brought in some type of disease or parasites.


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