# Please help my id this disease



## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

I apologize for not having any pictures.
I am not able to find an accurate match to the symptoms of my fish. It sounds like a cross between ich symptoms (sunken belly but no spots) and a fungus disease.

My p.demasoni, which have very vibrant striping and colors, now has ALL coloring faded out with a very light whitish blue color on its belly. The striping discontinues in this whitish/blue area and his belly appears to be sunken in. (think sucking in your belly).

He is swimming very poorly/awkwardly. There are no white spots (ich) and the coloring around his mouth is normal.

I have him in a QT tank and have done a 30% water change on the main tank.

Please, if anyone has any suggestions of what this could be and how to prevent it from happening to my other fish it would be appreciated. I think this little guy is a goner.... but I will be devastated if I lose my whole tank.


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## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

It looks exactly like what was posted here:
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=172136

No comment as to what it was in that thread though... :-?


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## Cook.MN (Mar 11, 2008)

And my fish died a few days later


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

How long has this tank been set up?

What are the water parameters on the tank?

What is your usual tank maintenance routine?

What size tank is this?

What is the full stock list?

Have you added any new fish recently?

Have you lost any other fish recently?

You don't have a sunken belly with ich. I'm a bit confused.

Sunken stomachs are usually caused by internal parasites. Any white stringy feces? Is the fish eating at all?

We're going to need alot more information in order to help.

Kim


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## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

Thanks for the reply!  ... here is all the info :thumb:

How long has this tank been set up? 2 years - complete new stock added 1 month ago

What are the water parameters on the tank?

What is your usual tank maintenance routine? 35% weekly water change

What size tank is this? 36inch long - 30 gallon long

What is the full stock list? 4 yellow labs 8 p. demansoni

Have you added any new fish recently?Yes - all 1 month ago

Have you lost any other fish recently? No

You don't have a sunken belly with ich. I'm a bit confused.

Sunken stomachs are usually caused by internal parasites. Any white stringy feces? Is the fish eating at all? No white feces that I can see, no the fish wasn't eating he could barely swim


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

Why did you restock the tank? Did you lose the other fish? If so, give details on what happened.

Were there fish in the tank at all times? (If not, your cycle would have started all over again with the new additions...)

Water parameters???

Kim


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## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

Why did you restock the tank? --First fish selection was poor. 
Did you lose the other fish?--None of the previous fish were lost.

Were there fish in the tank at all times? --Yes

Water parameters??? --I tested last night and everything was great. No ammonia, great hardness, and low nitrites/nitrates.

There are gold/reflective/shimmery scales around the front side fins(the ones that sick out like ears). I assumed this was how P.demansoni looked, perhaps this is actually a fungus/virus?

It isn't very noticeable in normal light, but when I turn on my blueish colored like you can really see their scales shimmer against the light. Not all of them have this....


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

It sounds like you might be dealing with velvet, and there are several medications available to treat it. Check with the LFS in your area and see what they have.

Kim


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## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

I think so too, but it is like another illness was what ended up killing the fish. The suken belly, white growth/discoloration.

I am going to add some parasite killing solution from the LFS and salt.
Perhaps raise the temp a bit?


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## Cook.MN (Mar 11, 2008)

So you know Whitespy, I added aquarium salt and left the temp the same (77F) and it didn't help.

Let me know how it works out as I'm interested to see if you have any better luck.


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

You may have more than one problem in the tank. It's not uncommon for secondary infections to develop.

Kim


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## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

Well small spots are becoming noticeable on some of the fish. Their mouths are beginning to look worn as well. (If that makes any sense).

I have added 6 table spoons of dissolved salt.
1 recommended dose of mardel cppersafe for 30 gallon tank
1 recommended dose of jungle parasite clear

I am contemplating adding another medicatin if the coppersafe doesn't seem to work.

Going out of town this weekend. I hope they make it through the few days and I will do a 30% water change and re-dose.


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

You may be dealing with Columnaris rather than ich. If so, the Coppersafe isn't going to help. The reason I think this may be what is going on is because you said their mouths are affected.

Don't raise the temp on the tank, in fact, lower it to about 76 slowly.

If these white areas start to look cottony or fuzzy, you'll need to switch meds quickly. You'll need to treat with Maracyn and Maracyn II or Kanamycin.

IMO, Coppersafe isn't worth bringing home...I've never used it with any good results.

Kim


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## Cook.MN (Mar 11, 2008)

If you end up with Columnaris my advise is to go out and buy a nice bottle of Vodka. Half of it for your fish, half of it for you with having to deal with that disease.

Seriously...I HATE Columnaris! :x


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## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

update:: 3 days ago I treated the tank with Jungle - Fungus Clear.

Symptoms 3 days ago:: white stringy poo, small white spots on some of the fish (ich/velvet like) and mouths slightly white.

Today::
The small white spots on the fish have completely cleared up.  
The white stringy poo has continued and the growth around their mouths has drastically increased. :x 
I am hoping this could because of the jungle fungus clear going to work.
Here is EXACTLY how the mouths look, no white cotton growth as in the pictures:









There is no white cottony growth anywhere else along the fish, but the velvet like scale (gold sparkly) growth is still around the pectoral fins. All fins all fully intact, but seem to be slightly clamped.

Looking forward to a 25% water change tomorrow and another dose of the jungle fungus clear, per the boxes instructions, and the addition of more salt. I will also supplement with a fungus medicated food tomorrow.

Water just tested: 
Ammonia 0
Nitrate 20ppm
Nitrite 0
250 hardness
180 alkalinity
8.0 ph
Temp 80 (I am going to slowly bring this down tonight/tomorrow)

Anymore information or post of encouragement appreciated! 
I'm prepared for a total tank loss.....


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## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

Here is an exact picture of how the first (and only so far) has died. All scales were intact, but the white/clear growth on the belly is represented perfectly. This was 5 Days ago today.


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## Whitespy9 (Oct 8, 2007)

Yesterday: 30% water change
2nd dose - Jungle - Fungus Clear. 
1st dose - Maracide

Today: 2nd dose Maracide


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