# Advice wanted - 55gl Tang Tank



## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Hi folks, I've so enjoyed reading the posts on this forum in the last several weeks, and now I'm coming to y'all for advice on expanding my 55gl tank. I am just learning about african cichlids, although I've kept tropicals for many years. Long story short (which I've detailed in another post), as of today I am left with 3 orange leleupis and one tropheus (black with lovely red patches), as well as one common pleco. This tank is definitely looking a little empty.

I had thought of getting more tropheus to keep the little guy company, but after reading all the profiles, I'm not sure they are the right thing for me, with the leleupis and all. So my next thought was a school of Cyps. I especially love the look of the Blue Orchids.

But I worry about that lone tropheus. Would it be better for him if I traded him in? Any other options? I'm rather fond of the funny little guy. I would love to hear some advice and suggestions. I'm open to other ideas, as well, in addition to or instead of the Cyps.

As for equipment and whatnot...

Tank: 55gl (48"x12"x20") 
Filters: Emperor 400 and Penguin 170, plus I have a small sponge filter (I moved from my 10gl time-out tank which is empty as of today) 
PFS substrate and several limestone holey rocks
Heater - no idea what type, but keeps water at a constant temp so I'm pleased
Water conditions:

pH: 8.2
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 30
GH and KH: 10
Temp: 79
I expect the Nitrates to go down even further over the next few weeks - I've been battling it for a while when there were more fish in the tank, with 50% water changes every 3 days. Plus I just swapped gravel for sand this past weekend. I love the new look...now I just need more fish! :fish:


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Check out this link to the 55 Gallon Tang setup.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Hi thanks Dee! I saw that, but nothing in there about mixing one tropheus with leleupis and cyps :wink:

I'll keep reading through profiles though.. maybe some other fish will pop out as a possibility. Plotting and planning... so much fun


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Tropheus are better suited to a species only tank and in a large number.

Tangs are awesome - you just have to approach them a little differently than mbuna. I highly suggest reading this article. It will explain the logic behind a Tang tank. It's all about selecting fish for the different environments in your tank - open water, rocks & caves, shells, and open sand.

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/tang_community_ii.php

Let's see... If I were setting up a 55 Tang tank, which I am considering as part of my mid-life MTS extravaganza :lol: , and assuming it's a 4' tank, I'd probably landscape a rock pile on either end of the tank, with a smaller-ish rock dweller in each, like maybe Chalinochromis in one and a smaller Julie in the other, like Transcriptus or Ornatus... Then I'd put open sand between the rock piles and select a shell dweller, like Ocellatus (Occies) or multifasciatus (Multies), and give them plenty of shells to colonize. You could also do a non-jumbo Cyp for the open water.

Anyway - just kind of fantasized there. Give it some thought and let us know what you're thinking for more opinions.

Good luck!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Dawg2012 said:


> Tropheus are better suited to a species only tank and in a large number.
> 
> Tangs are awesome - you just have to approach them a little differently than mbuna. I highly suggest reading this article. It will explain the logic behind a Tang tank. It's all about selecting fish for the different environments in your tank - open water, rocks & caves, shells, and open sand.
> 
> ...


Hey Dawg, thanks for the link, that article is really wonderful. I love the idea of a community tank, and I never realized how possible that is with the Tangs and not with the Malawis. Oooooo ... so many possibilities!! I hadn't thought of dividing up the rocks like that into two piles. Good thing I have so many rocks to play with! 

Yep the 55gl is 4'. I've got the rocks & caves covered with the leleupis on one end. I like the idea of adding Chalinochromis at the other end, as well. I hadn't thought of that! If I go with the Cyps, then I've got the open water covered too. I worry about the shellies though - I've read that leleupis will eat the fry right out the shell, maybe even killing the mama. Or will they leave them alone if the shell colony is at the other end of the tank, rather in the middle (would that mean I must forgo the Chalinochromis?) A few Telmatochromis were included along with leleupis in the cookie cutter 55gl example, so perhaps it is possible. What do you think?

And where will that poor lone tropheus live? He might need to be rehomed as well - though I'd love to keep him, he is such funny little monkey.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I would not do shellies with leleupi. My leleupi killed not only my shellies but also my caudopunctatus in a 72" tank.

So if you are locked in to the leleupi, I agree the cyps would be a good choice. Agree, you want non-jumbo in a 55G.

Be careful with some of the Tang articles and cookie cutters...they might be a little over ambitious. Better to post your stocking here for feedback.

In a 55G think in terms of 3 species: bottom, rocks and top. You have rocks and top. Because of your choice for the rocks (leleupi) your bottom options are limited. Maybe others will chime in with options.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

DJRansome said:


> I would not do shellies with leleupi. My leleupi killed not only my shellies but also my caudopunctatus in a 72" tank.
> 
> ... Be careful with some of the Tang articles and cookie cutters...they might be a little over ambitious. Better to post your stocking here for feedback.
> 
> In a 55G think in terms of 3 species: bottom, rocks and top. You have rocks and top. Because of your choice for the rocks (leleupi) your bottom options are limited. Maybe others will chime in with options.


I learn something every time you post LOL! Didn't realize that about the leleupi's - and very good to know as I will be putting together a new Tang tank soon.

I also agree regarding the Tang article suggestions. When I read the article, and the suggested stocking for a 75, I thought... hmm... that's going to be a mighty sparse tank! I then posted the idea, and saw the recommendation was in fact LESS than the article suggested. After setting up the tank, I now understand... conservative is good with Tangs.

... and yeah, I believe the lone Tropheus is going to cause problems in a community setup. Just my $0.02.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

DJRansome said:


> I would not do shellies with leleupi. My leleupi killed not only my shellies but also my caudopunctatus in a 72" tank.
> 
> So if you are locked in to the leleupi, I agree the cyps would be a good choice. Agree, you want non-jumbo in a 55G.
> 
> ...


Thanks, this is really good to know! Definitely no shellies! Now, I need to plan another tank just for shellies - in my research I've really taken a liking to them! As for the leleupis, I'm quite fond of them as well. Today, they seem really happy with the new substrate and rocks (changed out this past weekend from gravel to PFS), already digging out areas and guarding their turf.

I think for now the cyps will be my best choice. As for the bottom region... I'm at a loss too. Any one with suggestions? Must play well with leleupis and cyps!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Dawg2012 said:


> [snip]
> I also agree regarding the Tang article suggestions. When I read the article, and the suggested stocking for a 75, I thought... hmm... that's going to be a mighty sparse tank! I then posted the idea, and saw the recommendation was in fact LESS than the article suggested. After setting up the tank, I now understand... conservative is good with Tangs.
> 
> ... and yeah, I believe the lone Tropheus is going to cause problems in a community setup. Just my $0.02.


Sigh, yeah I'm starting to come to terms with the fact that the tropheus will most likely have to go to a new home. Someday perhaps I'll dedicate a tank just for them, but not this time.

Really good to know about going conservative on the Tangs! Right now my plan is to get 12-15 cyps (juvies) and see how it goes. My favorite was the Blue Orchid, but reading through the profiles I realize this is a jumbo, so I'll keep looking for the regular, not-so-jumbo variety. Any experience with microlepidotus? Or with the Paracyprichromis?


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Ladyfish said:


> ... Any experience with microlepidotus? Or with the Paracyprichromis?


Oooo I REALLY like the Paracyps! They're kind of an inbetween rock/open water dweller. The males like caves and overhangs, while the females are a little more open.

I had one in my mixed mbuna tank before I knew any better. Didn't think much of him other than he was 'unusual' - which was all that mattered in those days. A couple of months ago I got him his own setup with Tangs... he started eating better, and turned into a beautiful fish. Probably my favorite fish at the moment. Just got him four friends a couple weeks ago.

They're relatively timid - so I don't know how they'd play with the leleupi's, being as though the Paracyps will want to at least be near the rocks. Might not be a good mix but I'll let others comment.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Dawg2012 said:


> Ladyfish said:
> 
> 
> > ... Any experience with microlepidotus? Or with the Paracyprichromis?
> ...


I can see how they'd become a favorite - really lovely colors! Hmmm, but yeah if they are also rock dwellers, the leleupis may not tolerate them.

Say, how about Callochromis? The species article mentions a max of 4 (1 male: 3 females) in a 4' tank. Since they are bottom dwellers, perhaps rocks for the leleupis on one end, sand for the Callochromis on the other, with the Cyps above them all? Thoughts anyone?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I believe callochromis are best in a 72" tank, they are aggressive, some more than others. In my 72" tank I bought groups of 6 twice, and I have one left. You will find leleupi will not stay on one side or the other.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

DJRansome said:


> I believe callochromis are best in a 72" tank, they are aggressive, some more than others. In my 72" tank I bought groups of 6 twice, and I have one left. You will find leleupi will not stay on one side or the other.


Thanks, that answers my question perfectly! And I've noticed the leleupi really spread out. One on the left, one on the right, and the other in the middle, wherever the rocks might be. I can't even tell if they are male or female at this point, although two of them were digging caves...


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

My Chalinochromis Brichardi did a similar thing in my 75. I stocked them along with Eretmodus Cyanostictus as rock dwellers, with three piles of rock. Unfortunately the Chalinochromis have claimed all three piles , and the Eretmodus have only crevaces to hang out in, and only then until they're found.

I think I may move them to the 33 I'm currently setting up. I'd LOVE for them to make it they are such awesome little fish!


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## Darkskies (Mar 17, 2012)

Ladyfish said:


> DJRansome said:
> 
> 
> > I believe callochromis are best in a 72" tank, they are aggressive, some more than others. In my 72" tank I bought groups of 6 twice, and I have one left. You will find leleupi will not stay on one side or the other.
> ...


If you really want a shelldweller in your tank, try lepidiolamprologus hecqui. I think they get up to 3" and are very aggressive fish that will have no problem defending its territory and fry from leleupi and the larger julidochromis species. I don't know how easy they are to find at local shops though.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Darkskies said:


> If you really want a shelldweller in your tank, try lepidiolamprologus hecqui. I think they get up to 3" and are very aggressive fish that will have no problem defending its territory and fry from leleupi and the larger julidochromis species. I don't know how easy they are to find at local shops though.


Hey, that's an idea, thanks Darkskies. I hadn't heard of hecqui before. After your suggestion and some googling, I found a good article about them here: http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/e_Neolamprologus_hecqui.php
I am already in the planning stages for a smallish tank devoted to shellies. If they didn't seem to be thriving with the leleupis and cyps, I could move them there. I wonder if the hecqui play well with other shelldwellers?

And how cool is this - there is a recommended shop in San Antonio which claims to have some in stock at the moment. They have Cyps in stock too. hmmmm, I feel a road trip coming on...


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I wouldn't hazard putting L. hecqui in with actual shelldwellers as they can be a trifle more agressive. I have 2 pair in a 125G tank along with J. regani and N. pulcher 'daffodil' and they definitely hold their own territory.

I actually prefer to have my shellies as the only Tang in the tank and use dither fish as companions. Dither fish could be any mid to upper swimming fish that are used to help a species only tank feel more comfortable. I've used Neons, Rice fish, livebearers and Rainbowfish as dithers in my small shellie tanks without any problems.

Besides, you've already commented that you have MTS so maybe you can dedicate a few 20G longs for species only tanks.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Deeda said:


> I wouldn't hazard putting L. hecqui in with actual shelldwellers as they can be a trifle more agressive. I have 2 pair in a 125G tank along with J. regani and N. pulcher 'daffodil' and they definitely hold their own territory.
> 
> I actually prefer to have my shellies as the only Tang in the tank and use dither fish as companions. Dither fish could be any mid to upper swimming fish that are used to help a species only tank feel more comfortable. I've used Neons, Rice fish, livebearers and Rainbowfish as dithers in my small shellie tanks without any problems.
> 
> Besides, you've already commented that you have MTS so maybe you can dedicate a few 20G longs for species only tanks.


So true  I've already been scouring CL for a 20 long. Great idea about the dither fish. And noted about the L. hecqui. Do you think he would do well with the leleupis then or just stick to the Cyps?

You know, work is really starting to interfer with this hobby. I've had to put off looking at tanks and picking up fish due to meetings and projects. Don't they realize I have things to do?! :?


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Will who do well with the leleupis?


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Deeda said:


> Will who do well with the leleupis?


Oh, sorry for being unclear Dee, I was still pondering on whether one or a pair of L. hecqui would do well in the 55gl with the 3 leleupis and the soon-to-be-purchased Cyps.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I honestly don't know. I've never kept leleupis.


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

For a 55 gallon with Leleupi, I'd recommend Calvus/Comps or largerJulies, and Cyps. The Leluipi get almost get too large IMO for a 55. My old male seemed to dwarf my 100 gallon. So, you may have territory issues.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Floridagirl said:


> For a 55 gallon with Leleupi, I'd recommend Calvus/Comps or largerJulies, and Cyps. The Leluipi get almost get too large IMO for a 55. My old male seemed to dwarf my 100 gallon. So, you may have territory issues.


Thanks for the advice Floridagirl! I've been reading about calvus and comps - they look very sweet! I'll keep an eye on the leleupis as the months go by - right now they are about 2". How old was your male, and how big did he get? Amazing to think of my little ones dwarfing a 100gal!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Exciting news - just ordered 15 Cyprichromis leptosoma (Utinta) through a really nice LFS I found last week. Far from my house, but worth it. Getting a nice sale discount on them too, always a plus. They will be juvies, at about 1.25". Should be here on Friday!!!! :fish:

I've decided to re-home my little tropheus as well, although the hubby is very sad - it is his favorite fish. But as others have pointed out, since I'm clearly developing MTS, I could get a tank to devote just to tropheus... I'll work my way up to that though!


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Congradulations!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Dawg2012 said:


> Congradulations!


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

Cyps are seriously so much cooler than you think they're going to be just looking at them at first. I have Kerenge Island, and while they haven't colored up yet, the males are trying to attract the ladies. They'll develop darker bars really rapidly, and the dorsal fin gets a blue sheen and they shiver in the water and waggle their fins. Then the bars fade in seconds and they're off swimming around again. SO entertaining to watch.


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

Ladyfish said:


> Floridagirl said:
> 
> 
> > For a 55 gallon with Leleupi, I'd recommend Calvus/Comps or largerJulies, and Cyps. The Leluipi get almost get too large IMO for a 55. My old male seemed to dwarf my 100 gallon. So, you may have territory issues.
> ...


Okay..maybe dwarf is a stretch. But, here is my male in comparison with some Wild Caught Mikula, that I used to own.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Storiwyr said:


> Cyps are seriously so much cooler than you think they're going to be just looking at them at first. I have Kerenge Island, and while they haven't colored up yet, the males are trying to attract the ladies. They'll develop darker bars really rapidly, and the dorsal fin gets a blue sheen and they shiver in the water and waggle their fins. Then the bars fade in seconds and they're off swimming around again. SO entertaining to watch.


Nice! Thanks Storiwyr. I was looking at the Kerenge Island and they look marlevous, but my LFS didn't have those coming in, so decided to go for the Utintas. Love the color changing and the showing off!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Floridagirl said:


> Okay..maybe dwarf is a stretch. But, here is my male in comparison with some Wild Caught Mikula, that I used to own.


Yeah, he is a big boy!! I'll definitely pay attention for any outgrowth. Perhaps they can move into the 125-150 I'm hoping to get by end of year.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

I finally ordered 15 Utinta Cyps (juvies) earlier this week from a reputable LFS. Picked them up yesterday!  :fish:

Sadly one didn't make it from the breeder, but the other 14 seem to be doing well. At first, most of them huddled together in one corner of the tank, although three took off in the other direction. I covered the tank for the day, to help reduce their stress levels. They are very small, only about 1". A few are a bit larger at 1.25" or so.

One of the leleupi caves was too close for comfort, and the leleupi seemed a bit worried at having so many neighbors move in, so I rearranged the rocks to give the cyps a clear area of sand to relax in. Today, after I uncovered the tank, I watched as the same leleupi went over to investiage - he didn't chase them or seem at all agressive, just checking them out. Since then, he has been industriously digging himself a pit in the sand in another corner. Funny fellow!

Any advice as to what to feed the little ones? I've read the profile and species article, but would love to hear what y'all have had the best success with. As I mentioned, they are between 1" - 1.25". I did try feeding the 1mm NFS pellets, but they weren't interested. I supposed they are still a bit shocked at the move? I thought after a day they would be hungry. Or would they prefer flakes or a smaller pellet?

Meanwhile as the day has gone by, the wee cyps have relaxed and are swimming about more freely. However, one poor fellow was still huddled under a rock in the opposite corner - I could just see his little head poking out. I assumed he would find his way back to his buddies at some point and I really did try to refrain from meddling. Finally I couldn't resist and carefully removed his rock - he immediately darted out and found his way back to his mates. He seemed relieved 

It is evening now, and the cyps are swimming about, still lower in the rocks, but no longer in a huddled mass. The other fish (the three leleupis and the tropheus) seem calmer now somehow - they had been hiding since I rehomed the big fish, but now they are out and about, seeing what all the activity is about.

My next move is to put in a black background - I really don't like the one that's up there now, especially now that I've added the Cyps. Otherwise, I will leave things as-is for now. If all goes well, I might try adding the hecqui at a later time. Or not. Here's hoping it all works out! And thanks for all the great advice thus far! 

Here are some pics.

My kitties were of course fascinated by whatever might be in the big white bucket. Me too!









Opening the bag. One little guy didn't make it, but the others were looking good. 









Here is the tank after rearranging some rocks - the little ones are hiding beneath the heater, lower left corner. 









Today they venture forth! They seem much more calm and relaxed now.









One of the little fellas - such delicate, pretty coloring. I can't wait to see the males color up as they grow!


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

Squee!!! They're so cute!  I love little fish. They will get more and more daring with time as far as wandering the tank.

I have a Cyp as well who seems to have decided that he is in love with one of the Shellies. He colors up (as much as he can at his young age) for his multie buddy and does his little shiver dance. Poor confused little critter. XD The multie just looks baffled by the whole thing.

EDIT: Also, that's a beautiful cat! I have three of those myself!


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I like New Life Spectrum Grow for fry. Your cyps are young juveniles, but they will be happy with the smaller pellet and the extra protein is fine for them. You can also crush the regular NLS.


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

Nice tank and fish!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Storiwyr said:


> Squee!!! They're so cute!  I love little fish. They will get more and more daring with time as far as wandering the tank.
> 
> I have a Cyp as well who seems to have decided that he is in love with one of the Shellies. He colors up (as much as he can at his young age) for his multie buddy and does his little shiver dance. Poor confused little critter. XD The multie just looks baffled by the whole thing.
> 
> EDIT: Also, that's a beautiful cat! I have three of those myself!


LOL, I was "SQUEEEEE"ing too  Funny about your confused wee Cyp! Mine are much braver today, and very calming to the tank. They don't mind the leleupis or the tropheus to come into their midst (as long as they aren't bursting out of a hole in the rock - then they scatter for a moment. I'm thrilled they don't seem be threatening to the little ones at all. Oh, and perhaps it is that macro-lens that makes it appear that way, but I swear the Cyps have GROWN already! Amazing little fish! Some are definitely bigger than others. I love it when they yawn, that is so cute!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

DJRansome said:


> I like New Life Spectrum Grow for fry. Your cyps are young juveniles, but they will be happy with the smaller pellet and the extra protein is fine for them. You can also crush the regular NLS.


Okay great, thanks! Oh and they started eating today.  This morning I crushed some cychlid crisps, and they ran after the crumbs. This evening I fed them the 1mm NLS pellets, but the just watched them sink to the bottem. After several minutes, though, they nibbled them all up off the sand. Perhaps they needed to be soggy enough to pick apart. I'll pick up some of the NLS for fry (the .5mm?) for them, so they don't have to wait!


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I've had good luck with the .5mm NLS for any small mouth fish, Cyps included.

They are so cute when they are small but wait until the colors start showing, you will be completely amazed.


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

Ladyfish said:


> LOL, I was "SQUEEEEE"ing too  Funny about your confused wee Cyp! Mine are much braver today, and very calming to the tank. They don't mind the leleupis or the tropheus to come into their midst (as long as they aren't bursting out of a hole in the rock - then they scatter for a moment. I'm thrilled they don't seem be threatening to the little ones at all. Oh, and perhaps it is that macro-lens that makes it appear that way, but I swear the Cyps have GROWN already! Amazing little fish! Some are definitely bigger than others. I love it when they yawn, that is so cute!


I added a couple BNPs today to clean the algae out of the tank, at one point I looked over and all the Cyps were right next to one of the plecos, nose in and staring at him. He moved and they all scattered in a panic. It was hilarious. I find them to be beautiful in appearance and behavior, curious by nature, and just all around a really fun fish.

Deeda is right, too, mine are starting to color up and I think I got really lucky and have mostly males. Even with just the tiny bit of color they currently show, it's lovely, little flashes of blue and darkening bars. I'm thrilled with them!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Deeda said:


> I've had good luck with the .5mm NLS for any small mouth fish, Cyps included.
> 
> They are so cute when they are small but wait until the colors start showing, you will be completely amazed.


Wonderful, I can't wait  And thanks, the .5mm sounds like a good option for them. Oh, how long does it take them to start showing colors? Of course, I don't even know how old these little ones are, only their current small size.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Storiwyr said:


> I added a couple BNPs today to clean the algae out of the tank, at one point I looked over and all the Cyps were right next to one of the plecos, nose in and staring at him. He moved and they all scattered in a panic. It was hilarious. I find them to be beautiful in appearance and behavior, curious by nature, and just all around a really fun fish.
> 
> Deeda is right, too, mine are starting to color up and I think I got really lucky and have mostly males. Even with just the tiny bit of color they currently show, it's lovely, little flashes of blue and darkening bars. I'm thrilled with them!


Nice, how cool for you! I've been watching them on and off all day, just sitting on the floor. The kitties keep me company, occassionally pawing at the glass. The fish ignore them :lol:

Oh, and thanks for the compliment to my Bengal boy. He has a brother who is even more beautiful! But this guy is my companion - "where you go, I must be" is his motto!  And you have three? Wow that is very cool!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

So here is a question I've been meaning to ask. What about a cleanup fish, like a pleco? Do I need one? I used to have a common pleco in this tank, but I rehomed him - he was such a dirty fish, I was afraid he was contributing significantly to the high nitrates I had been experiencing. So with the current occupants (3 leleupi, 1 tropheus, 14 Cyps), is there any need for a pleco-type critter? And if so, what type do y'all usually use? :fish:


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

Ladyfish said:


> Oh, and thanks for the compliment to my Bengal boy. He has a brother who is even more beautiful! But this guy is my companion - "where you go, I must be" is his motto!  And you have three? Wow that is very cool!


I was wondering if he might be a Bengal! He has those lovely clear markings.  I have three girls ... a Ragdoll mix, a Manx/Ragdoll mix and a who-knows-what shorthair with extra toes. Together with the fish tanks they keep my life very busy.

I just asked about cleanup crew after doing a bit of research myself, and here's the scoop as far as I know. You don't need a clean-up crew unless you want a clean-up crew. If you DO want a clean-up crew (I decided I did because I like plecos, and because I'm getting brown algae that looks icky on my glass), then there are a few options. You can do snails, with which you have a choice. The more popular ones seem to be Nerite Snails because they won't reproduce unless they're in brackish water so you don't have to worry about ending up with a million of them, or Malaysian Trumpet Snails because they like to dig into the sand and can help aerate it for you. I don't like snails, so I chose to do two Bristlenose Plecos. The Bristlenose is the best choice because they can live happily in cichlid water chemistry, and because they don't get huge like most of the other Pleco species. If you do go the Bristlenose route, my recommendation is to do the regular ones and not albino ones ... the albino ones stand out more and other fish are more likely to pick on them, I feel.

But like I said, you don't need clean-up crew unless you feel like you do. If you feed small enough amounts and do regular maintenance, and the algae you grow doesn't bother you, or you don't mind pulling out rockwork and scrubbing it away, then go without cleanup crew!


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I find my Tanganyikans kill the nerites. And I find the MTS to be pests and you DO have to worry about ending up with a million of them. For Tanganyikans, I like BN.

I've had best success with nerites in my hap/peacock tank.

Live plants do an even better job of keeping unwanted algae under control IME.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

DJRansome said:


> I find my Tanganyikans kill the nerites. And I find the MTS to be pests and you DO have to worry about ending up with a million of them. For Tanganyikans, I like BN.
> 
> I've had best success with nerites in my hap/peacock tank.
> 
> Live plants do an even better job of keeping unwanted algae under control IME.


Okay thanks, DJ. It isn't an issue yet, but I'll look into getting a BN at some point in the near future. Live plants look so beautiful, but I'm not sure I'm ready for that. Looks like lots more work and knowledge to keep them alive and thriving. I'll have to do more research - I do have a 10g to play with, so perhaps I'll start there.

Meanwhile, I have to work on bettering the filtration in this tank. I just replaced the background with a glossy black paper (can't paint it yet of course, as I don't want to disturb all the fish) and it really shows the tiny floating particles at least when I get close up. I've got an Emperor 400 on there now which seems a good start, but the little Penguin 170 that I inherited isn't doing much. I plan to move that little one to my new 20L, at least to get it started up, and get a cannister for this 55gl. I've seen lots of suggestions for cannisters, but usually for much larger tanks. Suggestions for cannisters anyone?


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Ladyfish said:


> Meanwhile, I have to work on bettering the filtration in this tank. I just replaced the background with a glossy black paper (can't paint it yet of course, as I don't want to disturb all the fish) and it really shows the tiny floating particles at least when I get close up. I've got an Emperor 400 on there now which seems a good start, but the little Penguin 170 that I inherited isn't doing much. I plan to move that little one to my new 20L, at least to get it started up, and get a cannister for this 55gl. I've seen lots of suggestions for cannisters, but usually for much larger tanks. Suggestions for cannisters anyone?


I don't know why my fingers keep insisting on typing "cannister" instead of "canister". Poor upbringing is all I can assume. :-?

So I've done yet more research, and have read good things about so many different models that I'm a little overwhelmed at this point. More advice from y'all about canisters would be appreciated! (got it right this time, yaay!)


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Nice new additons. They look pretty cool... Wish I had some.

Check out the Equipment and Supplies section, and search past discussions on canisters for 55 gallons. From there, make your own decision. Do you want a canister for mechanical, biological or both? Or just post a question there! Good luck


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Nice new additons. They look pretty cool... Wish I had some.
> 
> Check out the Equipment and Supplies section, and search past discussions on canisters for 55 gallons. From there, make your own decision. Do you want a canister for mechanical, biological or both? Or just post a question there! Good luck


Good suggestion, Iggy, thanks. I am looking for mech and bio... I'll keep reading!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Latest update: The Cyps are growing and looking great. No losses, all looking spunky and healthy. I picked up some NLS .5mm pellets, and WOW not only do the Cyps LOVE them, but the Leleupis and the Tropheus too! I haven't seen them all eat like this before; they go nuts! Very rewarding sight to behold!! 

On another note, the leleupis changed almost overnight earlier this week. They had spread out, the middle-sized guy with a great cave dug out on the right, the smallest leleupi in the middle, and the biggest fella on the left. Well, Big Boy (from the left) decides to team up with Little Girl (in the middle) and they both start chasing Little Boy (I'm assuming now he is a male) on the right into a corner. It was amazing to watch - basically they "treed" him! Then they would swim away, and eventually he would "climb" down - but he rarely went back into his lovely cave. Instead, he acted like he was just waiting for them to come chase him again. So this said to me that the two had partnered up, and Little Boy was now the odd man out (you know, three's a crowd!) :fish: :fish: :fish:

I watched this for two days. I tried rearranging a rock or two, caving in some caves, that sort of thing. The chasing stopped for a day, while they sorted themselves out. I warned them that if they didn't straighten up and fly right, then dire consequences would ensue. Did they think I was just making idle threats? Did they listen? Of course not. The chasing started up again yesterday. What is it with kids today?! Sheesh! :? So I called my LFS and asked if they would rehome Little Boy. They said "Sure" and away we went. He is now in a tank full of his mates, and will hopefully find a happier home with a girl who loves him. (Hey, I like to imagine happy endings!)

Meanwhile, Little Girl has moved into Little Boy's awesome cave today. Maybe the two remaining leleupis will live in peace for a while. If not, there is always store credit to be had... :wink:

As for the Tropheus (my hubby named him "The Red Baron"), he is doing very well so far. I've got my eye on him, though...

Latest pic, before rehoming the Leleupi on the right (the Tropheus is in front of him). New black background. All the fish are out, which is great to see - I think the Cyps make them all more comfortable.


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

That was a very enjoyable post to read! Thank you for sharing. 

Isn't it amazing what a difference the Cyps make for the activity level of the tank? Everyone seems to come out to play when they're around. They seem so curious too, and are a BLAST to watch at feeding time. Mine go nuts over NLS as well, I just switched last week and I'm glad I did. Have any of your Cyps started 'barring up' and showing little hints of color yet?


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Storiwyr said:


> That was a very enjoyable post to read! Thank you for sharing.
> 
> Isn't it amazing what a difference the Cyps make for the activity level of the tank? Everyone seems to come out to play when they're around. They seem so curious too, and are a BLAST to watch at feeding time. Mine go nuts over NLS as well, I just switched last week and I'm glad I did. Have any of your Cyps started 'barring up' and showing little hints of color yet?


Glad you liked it!  Oh yes, I love the Cyps - what fun little fish they are! I am starting to see the bare hints of bars on many of them, starting at the tops of their little bodies, then fading out towards their middles. I'll put my macro-lens back on the camera and take another picture. Hopefully they will hold still!

I've started feeding them smaller amounts 3 times per day, and that really seems to be working well. I put the NLS (.5) in first, then add a few larger pellets for the bigger guys. Everyone acts like they are starving - I'm SUCH a bad mama, they try to tell me with those big sad eyes. Nice try, I'm not falling for THAT one again. The first day I WAY overfed cuz they were sitting up and begging for more, the little gluttons! :lol:


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

Ladyfish said:


> Storiwyr said:
> 
> 
> > I've started feeding them smaller amounts 3 times per day, and that really seems to be working well. I put the NLS (.5) in first, then add a few larger pellets for the bigger guys. Everyone acts like they are starving - I'm SUCH a bad mama, they try to tell me with those big sad eyes. Nice try, I'm not falling for THAT one again. The first day I WAY overfed cuz they were sitting up and begging for more, the little gluttons! :lol:


It's really hard to resist the big googly eyes, isn't it? Bad enough with Mbuna. I overfed this morning because they're so crazy and awesome when they're in feeding-frenzy mode ... and now my Aceis look like ping pong balls with fins. OOPS. >.>


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Storiwyr said:


> It's really hard to resist the big googly eyes, isn't it? Bad enough with Mbuna. I overfed this morning because they're so crazy and awesome when they're in feeding-frenzy mode ... and now my Aceis look like ping pong balls with fins. OOPS. >.>


HAHA!! That totally cracked me up. "Ping pong balls with fins..." that image will be in my head for a while! :lol: :lol:
Hey our little fish smiley looks kinda like that... :fish:


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

Ladyfish said:


> HAHA!! That totally cracked me up. "Ping pong balls with fins..." that image will be in my head for a while! :lol: :lol:
> Hey our little fish smiley looks kinda like that... :fish:


IT DOES. That's my defense. The emoticon made me think that's how they were SUPPOSED to look!


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

LOL! :lol:


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Storiwyr said:


> Ladyfish said:
> 
> 
> > HAHA!! That totally cracked me up. "Ping pong balls with fins..." that image will be in my head for a while! :lol: :lol:
> ...


Yeah.. I'm TOTALLY buying that.


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## Razzo (Oct 17, 2007)

Beautiful tank and I really enjoy the story  I especially like that large piece of holy rock on he right. Is that one piece -it looks big.

Regarding the Leluipi: they should be fun to watch when they have little fry swimming around them. Leluipi are on my short term wish list.

Russ


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Razzo said:


> Beautiful tank and I really enjoy the story  I especially like that large piece of holy rock on he right. Is that one piece -it looks big.
> 
> Regarding the Leluipi: they should be fun to watch when they have little fry swimming around them. Leluipi are on my short term wish list.
> 
> Russ


Thanks, Russ, glad you like the story and the tank too! That big one on the right really is one VERY large rock. I hiked about a mile out of our family property on the lake with it in a backpack, my hubby shaking his head at me the entire way. There were more rocks in the backback as well. Oh, and I had a few in my arms too. They were all so pretty, how could I leave any behind? Of course, now I have a porch full of holey rock!

Little fry, wouldn't that be something?! That really would be a nice ending to all the madness that tank has seen! I sure do love watching them, digging out their caves and coming out to posture with so much bravado! :fish:

And Russ, I have really loved looking at your pictures. Your photography is top-notch! =D> I'm trying to learn to use a "real" camera. It is very challenging. The lighting is so hard to get just right so the fish are illuminated but the rocks and sand aren't glaring. And those fish - will they NEVER hold still?!?! The little squeaky toy that works so well for the kitties and the kids just makes all the fish scatter! *sigh*


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

Ladyfish said:


> Thanks, Russ, glad you like the story and the tank too! That big one on the right really is one VERY large rock. I hiked about a mile out of our family property on the lake with it in a backpack, my hubby shaking his head at me the entire way. There were more rocks in the backback as well. Oh, and I had a few in my arms too. They were all so pretty, how could I leave any behind? Of course, now I have a porch full of holey rock!
> 
> Little fry, wouldn't that be something?! That really would be a nice ending to all the madness that tank has seen! I sure do love watching them, digging out their caves and coming out to posture with so much bravado! :fish:
> 
> And Russ, I have really loved looking at your pictures. Your photography is top-notch! =D> I'm trying to learn to use a "real" camera. It is very challenging. The lighting is so hard to get just right so the fish are illuminated but the rocks and sand aren't glaring. And those fish - will they NEVER hold still?!?! The little squeaky toy that works so well for the kitties and the kids just makes all the fish scatter! *sigh*


Oh my goodness. I am so jealous right now that you can just hike out and pick up some holey rock. That stuff is expensive up here!

I am sure you will eventually get some fry. If not from the Leleupi, from the Cyps.  It's so much fun, and so rewarding.

Also, I laughed when I pictured you with a squeaky toy, trying to make the fish hold still. And then I pictured a little fake brine shrimp distraction tool for photo taking, and I laughed harder.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Storiwyr said:


> I was wondering if he might be a Bengal! He has those lovely clear markings.  I have three girls ... a Ragdoll mix, a Manx/Ragdoll mix and a who-knows-what shorthair with extra toes. Together with the fish tanks they keep my life very busy.
> 
> I just asked about cleanup crew after doing a bit of research myself, and here's the scoop as far as I know. You don't need a clean-up crew unless you want a clean-up crew. If you DO want a clean-up crew (I decided I did because I like plecos, and because I'm getting brown algae that looks icky on my glass), then there are a few options. You can do snails, with which you have a choice. The more popular ones seem to be Nerite Snails because they won't reproduce unless they're in brackish water so you don't have to worry about ending up with a million of them, or Malaysian Trumpet Snails because they like to dig into the sand and can help aerate it for you. I don't like snails, so I chose to do two Bristlenose Plecos. The Bristlenose is the best choice because they can live happily in cichlid water chemistry, and because they don't get huge like most of the other Pleco species. If you do go the Bristlenose route, my recommendation is to do the regular ones and not albino ones ... the albino ones stand out more and other fish are more likely to pick on them, I feel.
> 
> But like I said, you don't need clean-up crew unless you feel like you do. If you feed small enough amounts and do regular maintenance, and the algae you grow doesn't bother you, or you don't mind pulling out rockwork and scrubbing it away, then go without cleanup crew!


I did get one BNP (non-albino), but he was so tiny I put him in my 10G for a while to let him grow a bit. I would like him to stand a chance with the Leleupis! I will probably get a few more, perhaps when I pick up my multis. He might have some older/larger ones. I like the looks of the BNPs, I'm not very partial to snails :?

Yep the Bengals are my baby boys! They are both closing on 15 lbs now, and not an ounce of fat. I love the look of Ragdolls, although I've never actually seen one. Are they as soft and cuddly as is said? I miss that a bit - Bengals are not often lapcats. And a kitty with extra toes - how funny!! :lol:


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Sad news today - one my dear little Cyps leaped to his death during the night. I don't know how he managed it, but he got himself wedged onto the center brace. I found him this morning as I was giving them their first feeding of the day. I tried the CPR technique I read about somewhere on this forum (swishing the fish in the water to allow water to flow over his gills) but even after 15 minutes, I had to admit it was no use. 

My big concern now is what might have caused him to be leaping around like that.


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## Storiwyr (Apr 24, 2012)

Oh no! I'm so sorry.  They are a species that likes to seek their freedom, I have read. Sounds like he made a jump for it and just had the bad luck to find one place where he'd get stuck. Fish do that! Sometimes if there's aggression, one fish will drive the other out of the water, but this is a Cyp and they're generally pretty laid back with each other, he probably just got a bit too exuberant about life.


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Aw that sucks . Sorry for your loss Ladyfish.

DJRansome has commented more than once that Cyps are jumpers... I assume these comments come from painful lessons learned.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Big, big, big jumpers. Don't leave 1/2" uncovered near a filter outflow. Don't leave the tank uncovered while you feed the other tanks.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Thanks y'all. Yeah this was a real freak accident. I had read this little Cyps were jumpers, so I had covered up the holes around the filter intakes, but he found the one place I didn't think of - onto the cross bar. I'll have to add a wedge of foam to block that off on both sides. Now I'm paranoid!

Stori, I like your outlook - he was exuberant about life! And Dawg and DJ, yep another tough lesson learned the hard way. And I'll remember that about not leaving the lid open while I feed the other tanks - or even while I prepare their food! I'll have to watch it during water changes too.

Sheesh, it is like child-proofing a house. Who knew?!


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## Super Turtleman (May 21, 2007)

Nice story and tank. Good luck growing the cyps out.


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Super Turtleman said:


> Nice story and tank. Good luck growing the cyps out.


Thanks appreciate it, glad you liked the story!


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## Ladyfish (Jul 21, 2012)

Okay, I just finished inspecting the tank and sealing all gaps, including the cross bar. Fortunately we had loads of little acrylic rectangles that fit perfectly into that space. Sealed off that small gap between the filter and the lid as well. Now I can rest easy tonight.


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