# New here, question about frontosa growth?



## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

Hello, I am new over here. I am TheFishGuy's wife, Lora. I don't have much expierence with fishes except being married to TheFishGuy :lol: I have always loved Frontosa though and for christmas this year Jonathan has given me his 240gal. and set me up with some of my fav. fishes. He won't give me any information :lol: Making me come on here and ask my questions. So here goes...(I did read one article on Fronts in the profile section).

The tank dimentions are 8'x2'x2' with a 110gal. sump. Tank temp is 78 degrees.

I have:

10- Mpimbwe
16- Neolamprologus brichardi
7 - yellow labs
6- julidochromis marieri
3- altolamprologus compressiceps "yellow"

What is an average rate of growth for the Mpimbwe? They are about 1" at the moment.

Ok, well I thought I had more questions but I forgot them already....sure I will be on again with more. Thanks!


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## Charles (Feb 25, 2003)

i say your first year will reach 5-6", a little smaller for the female.

Great tank size to work with for frontosa. The only problem fish you might have is the labs (never a big fan of them with frontosa; great color contrast though but that is about it), and Brichardi. With brichardi, 2 result: 1) adult frontosa might be able to clean them up, or 2) they form a colony and pushes the frontosa into smaller and smaller area; therefore making your tank shorter than it is.


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## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

Thank you Charles  Oh boy! That'll be great if they hit 5-6" within the first year! I love them!

The tank has roughly 6.5foot of swim space in the middle with rock piles on either side of the tank, My husband was hoping the brichardi and labs would hang out more by the rocks and give the frontosa the chance to pick off the ones they want if they so choose  We shall see I guess!


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## cichlidgirl1 (Sep 17, 2007)

Hello. Congrats on the tank and your fishes. I love fronts and got my first fronts a little over a year ago. Mine are now a wide range of sizes, the largest ones are easily 5 or 6 inches, the smallest ones are 4. Then in april i got some mpimbwe, same results there as well, wide range of sizes from all the same size juvies. some larger pushing 4 to 5 inches some smaller nearing 3 to 3.5. I have mine in a 7 foot 265 gallon tank so that should give similar results for you.

I have also kept the brichardi, with that many brichardi you are going to run into serious problems. I started out keeping 3 tiny (two inches or less) brichardi in a six foot tank with 14 other various haps and mbuna. two of the three paired off, tried to kill the third one and then proceeded to herd all other 14 fish (including a 7 inch venustus male) into one foot of tank space in the back corner, from there they launched VICOUS attackes on all fish . Get those brichardi out of there, you will be much happier having them in their own tank. Two paired off fish will live and breed in peace in a smaller tank .

I noticed the same thing about the yellow labs as you were told earlier, i have a single one because he is deformed and has the tinest little mouth on the side of his face, he cant bite but he sure does try...

I have seen lots of people keep calvus with the fronts , with many of them being success stories.

Hope my experiences help you avoid some of the same mistakes i made LOL


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

Interesting... I guess mabey I should have waited to get the smaller fish for you honey... There's always fish traps to get them out...

What about the 6- julidochromis marieri? Did I screw up getting those for her too? :lol:


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## cichlidgirl1 (Sep 17, 2007)

I think i will wait to let someone who has kept them respond. In general i have found that fronts do best when kekt in species only tanks. If i feel the need for some fish with higher activity levels or a dash of different color i have found single specimens of the peaceful large growing haps work best. Such as a female red empress or other peaceful species. I stress single specimen male or female so you can avoid the spawning these fish might do, it is during the spawning episodes that i noticed them being aggressive to my fronts. Other times i did not see any problems. Most important to avoid is the malawi mbuna species such as yellow labs, red zebras and similar. (brichardi too LOL). we have been doing real good with having single specimens in with the frontosa, not had too many problems and it ads in some color and active swimmers. Just dont want too hyper a species. Hope this helps and wait for someone who has kept those other fish you mentioned to respond. In general though frontosa are best kept with other frontosa, it allows them to avoid fin nipping so they get those fantastic trailers (fin extentions) and helps them avoid stress. For some reason frontosa can be mean to each other but when a much smaller fish of a different species chases them or flares up against them they cower and run away, stressing till near death. Go figure.


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## Charles (Feb 25, 2003)

you might end up with 2 pairs and the rest will get boot out once the pair claims one area.


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## Stuey (Nov 24, 2008)

Have three burundi in with my mbuna in a 6x2x2 the fronts are about 4 to 6 inches no problems at all with aggression have plenty of rock work so i guess that helps..


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## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

Thanks everyone....I put TheFishGuy to work last night trapping the brichardi  We'll start there for now. Its really too bad, they are very cool fish! We do have 2 huge piles of rock going on both sides of the tank....maybe I should load some pics. Would the rocks help with agression and territory? I will try to get some pics up later on to show you the set up


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

I wouldn'y say the piles are "huge" honey... But I think it's good for the moment  I can honestlt say I'm a bit disapointed about not being able to keep the labs and brichardi in with them. I've never had an issue with labs being aggressive. I had my 185 mostly mbuna set up a while back with two fronts in it that seemed to be just fine... We'll see I guess... I just want the fronts to be happy...

Incidently was $5 a piece a good price for the mpimbwe?


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## Charles (Feb 25, 2003)

$5 is a stealing price for mpimbwe.


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## GJx (Mar 13, 2003)

TheFishGuy said:


> Incidently was $5 a piece a good price for the mpimbwe?


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:   :thumb: =D>

$5 !!???

Bwah-ha-h-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!!!

That price is soooo "good" that I feel pretty sure saying that the only way that anyone gets mpimbwe for THAT PRICE or any lower...

...is if they ran from a store or breeders place _w/_ a mask over their face, dressed in black, in the middle of the night!!!

BRAVO!!!! =D>

gjx


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## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

:lol:


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

Well, it pays to go to auctions then! I met the breeder and he was selling them for $15 a piece. Then dropped his price to $10, then $8. I was going to offer him $50 for ten but didn't want to offend him. He didn't sell a single one at the show so he entered them in the auction. The first to bags of 10 sold for between $50-$60. I bid on the last bag and won at $50. Which after the club percentage and entry fee he's going to walk away with less... I should have just offered him the $50....

What do they normally go for?


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## cichlidgirl1 (Sep 17, 2007)

That was such a good price for them. I thought i got mine at a steal for 10 each LOL. I think some pics are in order. We want pics LOL.

Have you thought of keeping the brichardi in their own tank ? They really are a wonderful fish when you get a bonded pair raising their broods, best parents i ever saw. Its so cool to watch the younger fry help rear the newly hatched fry along with both parents. I had mine in a 3 foot 70 gallon tall tank, they each (the male and female) had their own tiny rock cave with some plants seperating them, they selected one of the caves for the babies and would rear them and swim back and forth between the caves caring for their babies, it was so cool. I bet you could do them in a 30 long or breeder with little or no problems. I was suprised at how peaceful the tank was too. I think the key to the peacefulness was having just mom and dad with their babies in the tank. I bet you would really enjoy them. They are so beautiful too.


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## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

I am loading pics at the moment, may take a while....how many pics can I post? :lol: Is 12 tooo many?


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## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

Ok, that went faster then I thought....ok first off let me appoligize for the dirty glass:

Baby fronts:


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## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

Calvus:


















Brichardi:









Marieri:









Red Empress?:


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## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

Group:









Full tank view:









Sorry, I just realized now that you can only do a few pics per post  I am new to posting hope no one gets mad,...


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

Newbies..... I tell you :roll: :lol:

 I suppose I should go clean the glass


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## cichlidgirl1 (Sep 17, 2007)

Those are so cute. Nice looking babies. I like the way you did the rockwork in your tank as well. IT must have been hard to catch all those brichardi LOL. I dont envy you that task.


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## JJ'sGirl (Sep 17, 2005)

Thanks


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

Catching them is easy using a trap


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## cichlidgirl1 (Sep 17, 2007)

Hi, i tried to make my own fish trap and had no luck. Can you tell me how you did it and let me know what materials you used and what bait etc.. A pic would also be great. I got around 20 or 30 red empress juvies (1 to 1.5 inches) to catch in my 7 foot long 265 gallon tank. YIKES LOL.


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

:lol: I can't seem to find the article so I'll just explain it with a couple of pictures.

You'll need a clear two litre bottle and a razor knife.









Cut the threaded part of the bottle off just below the neck.

And cut the bottle just after the round part where it goes flat.









Then take the part that looks like a cone and invert it into the other part. Drop some food in and sink it!

















The fish can find their way in but not out 

Works like a charm for me every time! The trick is skipping a feeding or two.


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## cichlidgirl1 (Sep 17, 2007)

Thanks, i did the exact same thing but the bottle was not clear, that must be the problem. I will have to try it out over the holidays. see if i can catch those little buggers. I cant seem to sell them and even if someone had interest in them i could not catch them anyway LOL.


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

Clarity is definately the issue :thumb:


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## GJx (Mar 13, 2003)

Thanks for the info FishGuy, I have 2 brichardi & 5 leleupi that I need to catch in a 150 g., who share the tank w/ 13 Kitumba Fronts! I'll try this!!

Got a feeling that I'm gonna catch a few of the little fronts before I catch the ones that I want, but trial & error SHOULD get me where I want in time.
opcorn: :thumb: 
gjx


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## Fogelhund (Dec 3, 2002)

Notes;

the marlieri are actually transcriptus.

The red empress, is actually some type of Aulonocara peacock.


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

I'll give you the Aulonocara... It was a rescue...

As for the malieri, they sure look a heck of a lot like these:
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=1527


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## travis2k (Apr 23, 2008)

> What do they normally go for?


They have them at the lfs near me for $30 a piece at one inch
prices tend to be a little higher here though, I think.


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

WOW! Really? WOW....


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## boredatwork (Sep 14, 2007)

I didn't think anything of it at first, but I think those could be transcriptus. But I also think they could be marlieri. How big are they?

I don't know the technical difference between the two, but to me marlieri have more markings that are smaller and rounder on the bottom row, and have more black than white coloring. But having said that I have seen pictures where I can't tell the two apart except to look at the caption.

As for marlieri and frontosa I can give you my experience. I have 11 2"-3" Frontosa, 10 2" Calvus, and 6 2"-3" Marlieri. I have noticed what seem to be 2 pairing of the marlieri, but in general I would rate them at medium aggressiveness but only conspecifc. So far they leave the frontosa alone. But my understand is that could change if they were to breed. My intent was to leave in one pair and if they cause problems then find them a new home. So far no problems though.


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

They are only about an inch and a quarter... Good info though! Thanks!


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