# P. elongatus or demasoni



## cancichfan (Dec 23, 2009)

Is there anyway to tell juvenile demasoni from juvenile p. elongatus? I recently bought a small blue/black striped cichlid that is about 1 inch long. The girl at the LFS thought it was a demasoni but it wasn't labelled and she wasn't 100% sure. I'd like to get some more now that I have found out that if it is a demasoni, I need more to keep the aggression down. Right now it is the smallest fish in the tank and it is pretty timid around the rest of the fish (all juveniles).

I've already made the common newbie mistakes (too many species, mixed types - Haps/Peacocks/Mbuna) so I don't want to make it worse. I know that in the future, I'll have to make some changes and move some fish out. Right now there are about 14 juveniles in a 90 gallon tank (48x24x18) with decent rock. Things are peaceful for now.

If the fish is a demasoni, how many would you suggest? I would prefer not to have a single species tank. My thinking is to buy more small ones now so that they are the same or similar size as they mature. Or, should I just leave well enough alone until things start to go wrong and try to deal with issues then? Eventually, I expect I'll end up with only mbuna. The haps are: 1- otopharynx lithobates (I hope I can keep this one), 2 - cyrtocara moorii, 2 - protomelas sp (taiwan reef) and 1 placidochromis milomo. Mbuna are 2 - yellow labs, 1 - metriaclima emmiltos, 1 - labidochromis sp Hongi. Peacocks are 2 OB peacocks which I expect to be the first to go. Didn't know they were hybrids. If I get a second tank, can I keep the Habs all together? My wife would love it if I got a second tank (did the sarcasm come through ok?).

Sorry for so many questions in one post.
Thanks


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

cancichfan said:


> Is there anyway to tell juvenile demasoni from juvenile p. elongatus?


I believe juvenile elongatus are not colored, but maybe someone with elongatus experience will chime in if I am incorrect.



cancichfan said:


> If the fish is a demasoni, how many would you suggest?


One or fifteen. If you do 15 Demasoni, you should also have 1m:5f of the other mbuna. That would be a properly stocked tank.



cancichfan said:


> The haps are: 1- otopharynx lithobates (I hope I can keep this one), 2 - cyrtocara moorii, 2 - protomelas sp (taiwan reef) and 1 placidochromis milomo. If I get a second tank, can I keep the Habs all together?


Maybe. Will it be all-male with one of each? Haps are harem breeders and you would want to keep multiple females for every male if you are mixing genders. How big will the tank be? Do any of the females look alike?


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## calleja_aquariums (Apr 22, 2009)

DJ your right. lol when i first fot mine they didnt have their stripes yet, they were a dull navy blue but now this is how they look. [URL=http://cichlid1.free.fr/hybrides/ps.elongatus.mpanga.M5bis.JPG]http://cichlid1.free.fr/hybrides/ps.elo ... .M5bis.JPG[/URL]

beautiful to look at.[/url]


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## bosco0633 (Dec 31, 2009)

fixed your link for you


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## calleja_aquariums (Apr 22, 2009)

Thanks  *** never posted one, But yeah thats what mine looks like.


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## cancichfan (Dec 23, 2009)

Thanks. I am more sure now that it is a demasoni. The stripes are very apparent and there is no yellow on the tail as in the picture. If having only 1 is an option, then that is where I will stay for now and see how things develop as they grow.

If you need 1:5 m:f ratios, how do you ever get that with young fish? I have no idea what sex any of them are. Do you buy extra and then cull or only buy adults?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

cancichfan said:


> Do you buy extra and then cull or only buy adults?


Yes, buy extra juveniles :thumb:


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## PiePuncher (Feb 1, 2005)

Looks like some sort of elongatus, not demasoni. The dorsal would be black like in DJRansome's photo. Here is a pic of a demasoni from behind. I am posting so you can see the differences in color and fins. They look to be different fish. Regardless, your fish looks nice.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Wow cool looking cave!


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## PiePuncher (Feb 1, 2005)

The cave is on a rock that is 125lbs+, probably more around the 150 mark. I used a jackhammer and took the rock off a near by area. Took 4 people to put in the tank. There is four holes on the front like that and two big ones on the back, with the entire rock being hollow with many small caves inside. The rock i started with was over 200lbs and 5ft long, I just didnt know how to get it into my tank without an engine hoist or something...lol

Canci, there is nothing wrong with a mixed tank. The problems arise when a new person tries to mix species that will not work. Mbuna, haps and peacocks can be together if the tank is big enough and you have the right species. A mixed tank is awesome if done right. My mbuna keep to the bottom of the tank along with my lethrinops, while the rest of my haps and peacocks swim around slowly throughout the water column. I keep many species in one tank but they all look different. When it comes to spawning, the haps and peacocks usually take one side of the tank and the mbuna stay in their protected rocky area. The big boys spawn where ever they please. If you want a mixed tank, have at it. Just make sure you introduce more than one fish at a time and make sure the fish look different and you should be fine. It is also easier to introduce smaller fish to a tank than larger fish. If I put a large fish in my tank, all the big fish in the tank will kill him trying to show they are dominate. Good luck and if you are going to change your tank, spend time finding out what you really want and get to work.


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## cancichfan (Dec 23, 2009)

Thanks everyone. For the most part, I think for now I will leave things alone and see what develops. I may add a few more mbuna soon (trying for a good m:f ratio) to try to spread out any aggression when they get older and see how things develop. I don't think I have any real killers in the tank and reading others posts on the forum has given me tonnes of advice on what to avoid going forward.

If I get to the point I have to move things, I will be much more aware of what I need to do. I'd like a second tank for my office anyway so there are other reasons to make the investment if I need to.

How big will the tank be?
As for the question of size, at least 90 gallons but it depends on what I can find at a good price on the net. I'd like to go bigger if I could.

Breeding isn't my goal today. I just like watching the fish and learning about them. If I end up with fry and I don't know what they are, I will probably just let nature take it's course. But, if I end up with some survivors, that is fine with me. I won't be selling them to anyone, I can assure you.

Glad to hear that there is potential for the tank residents to get along. I will keep an eye on things and hopefully intercede before anything happens. 
Thanks again,
Graham


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

don't cull the extras, just bring them to the lfs for credit or try to give them away


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