# stripping mouthbrooder problem



## borohands8593 (Apr 15, 2009)

OK so I am relatively new at stripping a fish or breeding in general. *** only been at it a few times and the first time I did it I lost the female cyp and 4 of the 7 babies. 2nd time I managed to keep both female alive and only lost 1 of 14 fry.

Last night was attempt #3 and now I have an issue. I stripped 2 females again, 1 gave only 4 fry, , but mom and all babies are doing great. Second female gave 9 fry which are doing great, but she was pretty bad. I had a ahrd time handling her and getting her to spit and her side fins are torn but she can mvoe them just fine. After putting her back she hid in a hole and looked like she saw a ghost as she shook back and forth in place. I turned the lights out and this morning she looks to be doing ok. She is swimming around again and schooling with the other females, so hopefully I am out of the wooks and she will make it.

Now the problem is she still has a baby in her mouth!!! I was hoping she would just spit it as I rather lose the single fry left than risk losing the mother since she produced such a large brood and only her second or third time breeding! But after 12 hours she still has the baby in her mouth and wont open up to accept food! I believe its just one and Im afraid to strip her again so soon and put her through all that stress! But at the same time I feel like she needs to eat and get some protein from me handling her and some of her fins are torn up a little. I do have time on my side as today is only day 15 since she last eight since I stripped at 2 weeks. (A little early but the other mom was at 3 weeks and I wanted to do both together).


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

Let her be. Turn out the lights, don't feed, skip a water change, and let her hide. She should spit eventually.

If you are having troubles stripping, perhaps we need to talk about technique. I've never ripped fins from stripping, but it's common to dislodge a few scales. Tell me about your process, and maybe we can suggest a few things to make it more predictable and safe. The goal should be to not leave any marks on the fish, and to have her back swimming and eating within a few hours. It does take some practice...


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## Carmesi (May 8, 2008)

leave her to hold it or spit it. Dont worry about the mother, she will not continue to hold if she feels she can't make it. make sure when you are stripping that you hold them with just your thumb and finger on the gill flaps right behind the eye. (this is hard and durable). holding back on the mothers body can cause damage if she struggles.


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## borohands8593 (Apr 15, 2009)

'that must be my problem. I put her girl in a small bucket of water. I then reach in and grab her trying to hold her whole body as I press down and forward gently right behind the mouth to pop the babies out. I try to only go a few seconds at a time and my biggest trouble is getting the right hold because theyre so small and struggle to free themselves. I have got better she is missing a few scales but not many, but the side fins are slightly damaged. *** had this issue before and the fins have always healed themselves back to normal within a week or so, its just like if a dominant fish was biting at their fin and tore it up a little.

Im thinking of using the funnel method *** heard of where you place the fish in a funnel in the bucket of water and push her face into the hole, and then dump cups of water forcing her mouth open like a pez dispenser. I was tempted to try this but was afraid it would hurt the cyps, although I guess my method already does hurt them.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

I thought maybe you and I had chatted about methods before- and I use the Pez dispensor method for cyps and paracyps. It's a completely different experience than stripping mbuna or larger, hardier fish.

Just thinking about trying to hold a cyp behind the eyes- there's no room, and if you press on her gills, I don't see how you can get her mouth open.

The water boarding (funnel) method may work well for you- find a funnel with a spout that is about 1/4 in diameter, but has a good sized bowl on it.


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## borohands8593 (Apr 15, 2009)

I think you did mention it to me earlier. There is no room to hold these thin fish, esp since I have a nonjumbo variant so the body is only 3inches or so in length and so thin. Exactly how do you waterboard?? Head down with the body out of the water and water level right behind the gills? How much water do you pour and how fast? DO you do it just once and they all come out or do you have to pour water multiple times to ensure? 
I have a female pregnant now so I might try this method in 3 weeks lol.


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## borohands8593 (Apr 15, 2009)

Well I think it is hopefully safe to say the female is going to make it. Its been about 36hours and she is breathing and swimming normally with the others. The mouth looks smaller I cant tell for sure but I think and hope she may have spit the final remaining fry I missed, havnt fed yet today so I guess Ill know for sure when i see if she eats. All 13 fry are alive and well 36 hours post stripping as well!!


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## punman (Oct 24, 2003)

I use a twist tie from garbage bags to strip the cyps. I used to use the edge of a toothpick like I do for mbuna but someone suggested the twist tie and it is flexible and much more gentle.


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## BioG (Oct 12, 2008)

I use a big net and a little invention of my own. Don't get excited, it's just a pen. I take the ink reservoir and writing portion (The ink part that has springs and stuff attached to it.) out of a plastic pen, I use the kind of plastic pen that unscrews in half. I grab her with a larger net (I think it's about 8 inches squared or something, then i give her about 1/2 inch of water to breathe in.

Next I gently shove ( :lol: ) the half pen in her mouth, which lodges it open and the little guys swim one by one through the hole and into the net. I flip her upside down for a second to get the pen in, then I just kinda cradle herbetween my thumb and fingers without even squeezing. they don't seem to struggle as much when the net is around them. whole process takes about 30 seconds once she's in the net.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

Okay- here's the visual that seems so hard to explain! :wink:

My demonstration of how to strip a paracyp:


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Very interesting video.
Folk tell me stripping Paracyps causes em no stress. :-? Why not pop her in a tank with lots of cover on her own and let her spit?
I have trouble breeding some mouthbrooders that seem to require stripping to get large numbers of fry quickly. Dunno but I tend to just give up on those. But Paracyps do not require stripping although for sure it is the quickest method of getting the most young. Call me squeemish or old fashoned but for more young, well I just do not think it worth the bother and stress on the female for species and types of fish that are freely available from the wild and can be bred fine without stripping.

I notice the video is of quite a mature Paracyp, would you strip a young one?

But I agree in this case strip to get that last young out. She is prob so traumatised already she may starve herself before releasing it. Could try flake food as even brooding mouthbrooders can sometimes take flake while holding.

All the best James


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## wvh (Jan 21, 2010)

Very useful video, and what a calming voice


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

24Tropheus said:


> Very interesting video.
> Folk tell me stripping Paracyps causes em no stress. :-? Why not pop her in a tank with lots of cover on her own and let her spit?
> ... Call me squeemish or old fashoned but for more young, well I just do not think it worth the bother and stress on the female for species and types of fish that are freely available from the wild and can be bred fine without stripping.


I know that the debate on whether to strip is a long one with valid points on both sides. For each hobbyist, the decision will revolve around several factors that they'll need to weigh for themself.

It is my personal opinion that isolation of a schooling fish is more traumatic than what is shown in this video. The reason I shared this video was that there are bad ways of stripping cyps and paracyps, and that this may help someone who chooses to strip to do it efficiently with little trauma for the fish.

The worst of it is trying to net a holding fish, which your method also requires. Since I can get her back into her tank with her school in under 2 minutes (even while filming a demonstration video), I feel it is the best way for me and my fish. I've also had zero luck with paracyps spitting in their own tank- they'll eat the fry.


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Yep it kind of depends on your set up.
Me I like to set up brooding tank and main tank side by side with the same decore and water in both and so the fish can see each other.
Then at night with a torch move the brooders using a net herd them into an empty ice cream container (without removing em from the water). And pop em into the other tank. Less stress from chasing and catching with a net I think.

If there is nothing but Paracyps in the main tank you can let em spit there too (you get some survivers but not all) but I guess that is a dedicated breeding set up not open to most hobbyists who want to keep a community.

If you have multiple brooders they tend to practice sycronised spitting. Ie when the first one releases it incouracges the others to release. Kind of another reason it is nice to keep these guys in large groups. In the main tank or brooding/rearing tank.

You kind of need a third tank at some time for raising young from the size they can not be mixed safely with brooders newly released young and the time they can safly go back in with the adults or be sold.

Sadly with this method you can flood the local market for Paracyps and the price you can get for em goes down and you kind of have to move on to another species to cover elec costs.

Dunno if you can get rich breeding fish, it always stays as a hobby to me and as I am no good at stripping and do not enjoy it I tend to try and find other methods of breeding cichlids.

I for sure do not dislike folk who strip cichlids, most of my cichlid keeping friends think me a little wierd but I kind of like to give the other options when folk recommend stripping.

All the best James


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## Kevinthecichlidlover (May 30, 2010)

I have a female and wild caught male electric blue ahli and he is about 8 in how big wil the female be before they will mate she is about 4 inches i need babies

I also have a male albino red shoulder peacock wild caught does anyone know where i can get a female because i need more practice at sripping fry and i want some babies


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## punman (Oct 24, 2003)

Kevinthecichlidlover said:


> I have a female and wild caught male electric blue ahli and he is about 8 in how big wil the female be before they will mate she is about 4 inches i need babies
> I also have a male albino red shoulder peacock wild caught does anyone know where i can get a female because i need more practice at sripping fry and i want some babies


Those are Malawi cichlids. I'd say post that in the Malawi section and start your own thread. you might get more responses that way.


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