# Very high nitrate please help



## rl1oyd (Mar 6, 2005)

Right tank is 720litres 6'6" (190 us gallon)
Amonia 0 Nitrite 0 Nitrate 160+ as red as it can go
Tap water tested for nitrate 0
Tank set up for 2yrs plus has 2 eheim pro 2's one side and a eheim pro 3 the other side
Was quite sparcely populated but i have since added say 10-12 large haps.
I consider my tank more than over filtered
Like i said i tested the water it was very red on the nitrate test so i did a 50% water change before bed, tested on the morning no better bright red, so did another 50% change last night still bright red??????????
What could make it like this? Is it the filters trying to catch up because iv added more fish?
I have changed 90% of the water in two days so im very confused? :-? 
Thanks Richard


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

If it is as red as it goes, then it is likely much, much higher than the top possible reading. As you do regular water changes the nitrate levels will drop.

What was your water change schedule during the last 2 years? Did you vacuum the substrate each time?

Nitrate is the end product of biological filtration. The it slowly starts building the day the tank is cycled. The only way to remove nitrates is by doing routine water changes. Most people on the forum will recomend during between 30%-50% at least weekly depending on your stocking levels


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## rl1oyd (Mar 6, 2005)

Yea i understand the cycling
I always do 30-40% every week without fail
But obviously if iv taken so much water out in 48 hours and it still looks say 80mg/l minimum?
I also have some amazon swords in there to so that should help take out nitrate too?
What is the max water change you can do 50% :fish:


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## canuckle (Nov 30, 2004)

How old is your test kit, and what kind is it exactly?


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## rl1oyd (Mar 6, 2005)

Doc Wellfish

Its a few years old like you i thought it maybe faulty untill i tested my tap water and that was perfect?


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

The most reliable kits are the liquid reagent tests. You will get a lot of vote for the API (Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Inc) master kits. Great kit for the price.

If your test is that old, it could very well be giving you false reading.

Technicaly, as long as you matched temp, Ph, Gh and Kh with the old water, you could do 100% changes daily if you really felt like it.

If the fish do not appear to be affected, I would get a new kit and recheck before tearing the thing apart or running your water bill through the roof.


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## rl1oyd (Mar 6, 2005)

Haha yea didnt think of the water bill :lol: 
It is a liquid kit 
The one i have is the one that is most popularly sold in the UK
I dont think it is faulty mind you but i will check
Just thought it would at least be Orange this morning not red still :-?


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

Are your filters clean? If they are full of gunk they can leach nitrates back into the tank.


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## fishman13 (Jul 27, 2009)

Stop feeding your fish for 4 days and then check back in with me.javascript:emoticon(':thumb:')


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## ricksconnected (Oct 18, 2008)

*** had this problem with my salt tanks. every expensive fix indeed,though *** not beat it yet. if you have a bio wheel, trash it. they dump nitrates back into the water. i dumped mine and my nitrates droped 20% in 24hrs. im still in the 40-60 range but we are still working on it.
i did 50% water changes for a week daily, no drop. cut back feedings. change foods even. 
food and waste play major roles in high nitrates. huge.
might try replacing your rock as well. cleaning might not be doinbg a good enough job.


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

MalawiLover said:


> ...Did you vacuum the substrate each time?


 this is an important question. you can change all the water you want, but if you are not reducing wastes from the system (and that includes wastes collected and trapped in your filtration devices), then you will never achieve low nitrates. HTH.


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

ricksconnected said:


> if you have a bio wheel, trash it. they dump nitrates back into the water. i dumped mine and my nitrates droped 20% in 24hrs....


 bacteria colonize on apparatus such as bio wheels. hence, their name. if nitrate production dropped, after removing them, it should alarm you. IMO.


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## ricksconnected (Oct 18, 2008)

why should that alarm me if desired effect was reached, or at least headed in the right direction?


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

ricksconnected said:


> why should that alarm me if desired effect was reached, or at least headed in the right direction?


 the removal of bacteria often leads to a slow of nitrate test results, because it is a measure of their waste accumulation. so, the results will be only short term, until bacteria in other areas realize the advantage given in that absence. the aquarium might also spike in ammonia or nitrite levels while bacteria adjust and/or recolonize to the new situation. 
IMO, you would have been better off to install additional mechanical filtration. bacteria thrive in well oxygenated areas. the more gunk you can collect into sponges, the slower the process of breakdown. and the more efficiently you can collect/remove that waste, the less bacterial activity your aquarium will support. 
if your aquarium is testing high nitrate, and your filtration devices are not that dirty, then one must assume water movement is insufficient to feed waste into the filter's intake. this means the waste is being allowed to accumulate into the substrate. a siphon tool, capable of sifting wastes from the substrate, is needed to reduce bacterial feed accumulation then.


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## ricksconnected (Oct 18, 2008)

when you mention substrate are we talking rocks or sand? if sand, then is there a way to make your sand live sand like in salt aquariums? rocks hold nitrate causing "stuff" a lot more readly than sand.


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## gage (Feb 7, 2007)

what kind of gravel is it? if the gravel is to porous, the bacteria will continue to stick to it even after it dies not allowing more bacteria to grow which will cause bad parameters between rotting bacteria and not good bacteria.


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## ricksconnected (Oct 18, 2008)

just talking about your standard aquarium gravel. so then wouldnt sand be better than gravel?


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## gage (Feb 7, 2007)

I'm talking gravel like Chicken/Turkey grit and stuff like that, if it is just standard pea gravel or colored aquarium gravel it is fine.


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## ricksconnected (Oct 18, 2008)

ok so let me ask you gage, how do you set up your aquariums water for say convicts?
what type of filtration are you useing? media? do you or any you know set up a sump like we do in saltwater aquariums? this would help control nitrates as well right?


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## gage (Feb 7, 2007)

Filtration - cycles through water 10 times an hour
Media - Foam, Carbon, Biomax, PolyWool

assuming you are talking of a wet dry filter (the big glass tank like structure that requires a pump) then yes, people do use these for freshwater as well, but with proper water changes (25-50% weekly, cleaning filter monthly) you should not need a filter like this.


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## ricksconnected (Oct 18, 2008)

i have a eheim classic a friend gave me. needs serious repairs. was about to fix it up when i was told that these type filters also add to the nitrate problem. what say yee on this? 
would this type filter with different media help the original poster of this thread as well?


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

ricksconnected said:


> ...i was told that these type filters also add to the nitrate problem. what say yee on this?


 although filters can be one of the places that house bacteria responsible for nitrate production, a tank without one would do far worse than that, so it is a fallacy to refer to them as nitrate problems. the fact is..we need them, because fish create copious amounts of waste. as a result, all freshwater set ups produce nitrate. the only easy way to maintain a tank within healthy levels of nitrate, is to collect the waste into filters, and dispose of that waste on a regular basis. if this type of maintenance is being done, and nitrates are still too high, then excessive amounts of waste are remaining within the aquarium. usually, we find it within the substrate. 
freshwater tanks can not sustain 'live sand' like salt tanks. but sand can help to limit waste build up, because it compacts dense enough to slow waste penetration into it, allowing filters to collect more. HTH.


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## gage (Feb 7, 2007)

it is not the type of filter, it is how long the filter inserts are in the filter... they do need changing once and a while.


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## ricksconnected (Oct 18, 2008)

i was told that these fish were better suited for sand than the gravel we tend to put then in.


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

ricksconnected said:


> i was told that these fish were better suited for sand than the gravel we tend to put then in.


 convicts are a substrate spawn type so the gravel should be of a size that they can move and mouth to suit their needs. substrate spawners will often dig their pit to bare glass, so i do not suggest excessively deep substrate. i keep mine approx. 1" deep. a light mix of pebble size, mixed with sand, seems to allow them to bank the nest edges a bit better. HTH.


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