# Need second opinion on Id



## Jeff W

I bought a group of what were suppose to be Cynotalapia Afra White Tops from a LFS. now i have been in a cuople of homes of fish breeders and they Have white tops. mine look nothing like theirs. I believe this is a Pseudotropheus Kingsizei. Could someone please let me know if I am correct in this. Here is a picture










Thanks 
Jeff


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## bac3492

Looks to me like a Psuedotropheus Pulpican. Still a nice fish though. I think i heard/read that this fish might change classifications/or changed from cynotilapia.

I imagine you went looking for cynotilapia sp. hara (commonly known as White top hara)

Are the females very brown?


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## noki

Unfortunately it is very confusing.

The "White Top Hara", also sold as Gallireya Reef or some variation is a newer discovery. It is different from...

Fish sold as "White Top Afra" or "Clown Afra" or "Kingsizei" that have been in the hobby a long time, may be more than one fish. The scientic info on these fish have long been confused. Some have claimed there was a white top C. afra as well as the "Kingsizei". Some fish sold as "White Top Afra" or "Clown Afra" may even be hybrids, who knows if they are pure "Kingsizei" or something else, but they are all more aggressive than true Afra it seems.

Yes, "Kingsizei" or hybrids of such as been commonly sold as "White Top Afra" for years.


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## Jeff W

Thanks I understand what you are saying but still not sure what I should be calling these. Anyone have any ideas on what they should be called.


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## 24Tropheus

Well I am not sure about this but my reckoning is
It started off as Pseudotropheus sp.'kingsizei' (in the trade),
then became Cynotilapia afra "white top" (in the trade),
then got officially described as Cynotilapia pulpicans
and now is being called by Konings Metriaclima pulpicans.

poor fish has an identity problem? :wink:
And many still use the older names. 

PS this is not an ID from me. I can not tell these guys apart from other Mbuna myself.

Seems a bit harsh to label em hybrids just because of a few name changes?

All the best James


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## why_spyder

There is a Likoma variant of Cynotilapia (C. "white top" Likoma) - not sure if that is the same as the kingsizei though.


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## Jason S

There is a Cynotilapia afra species from Likoma Island known as "white top". See: http://www.malawi-dream.info/Cynotilapi ... Island.htm

As shown in the link above, Cynotilapia afra species should be stocky and have connecting bars across the forehead.

In addition to this C. afra species, I often see Cynotilapia axelrodi listed erroneously as Cynotilapia afra "white top" or just Cynotilapia "white top". Here's C. axelrodi:










Notice these guys are more elongate than Cynotilapia afra species.

However there is also the fish first known as Pseudotropheus sp. "kingsizei" Likoma [aka. "kinsizei Likoma blue frost"]. This fish actually occurs at the smaller Maingano Is. which is just off the NE shore of the much larger Likoma Island. In 2002, P. Tawil described this fish as Cynotilapia pulpican despite the fact this species has bicuspid dentition [teeth] -a character not fitting with the genus Cynotilapia known for having unicuspid dentition. Tawil suggested the boundary [list of anatomical characters] between Cynotilapia and Pseudotropheus was poorly described as the reason for the placement of this species in Cynotilapia. This description was met with much skepticism, so the fish has since been often listed as Pseudotropheus pulpican. Since the fish is a member of the vertical barred mbuna in Pseudotropheus the designation of Metriaclima [or Maylandia -wow there's another debate] would be correct for this species. Here is Pseudotropheus [Metriaclima] pulpican:










This appears to be the fish you have obtained and your fish appears correct for this species. These are a correct true breeding species. I'd be willing to wager the Cynotilapia "white top" kept by your fellow hobbyists are either the C. axelrodi -shown above- or C. sp. "white top hara" -shown below.

As mentioned above, to make matters more confusing there is also a Cynotilapia known as Cynotilapia sp. "white top hara". This species occurs at Gallireya Reef near Chilumba and was first introduced by Konings in Cichlid News [2004] as Pseudotropheus sp. "zebra hara". Further observation led Konings to conclude this fish was a member of the genus Cynotilapia and was then designated as C. sp. "white top hara", shown here:










This fish is also mistakenly sometimes called Pseudotropheus/Cynotilapia "blue reef" :wink:


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## Jeff W

Thanks jason you have been a major help. I now have a name for my fish. This will make it much easier at the Auction that i'm selling the fry at. Tahnks again to all. I'm sure i will post more Id problems in the future.

Thanks So Much,
Jeff


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## bac3492

are you positive on and ID? If not, you shouldnt advertise them as anything. Never know if someone will buy some by accident and then intermix them with their 'white tops' which could be a completely different species.

and nobody wants hybrids.


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## why_spyder

As long as Jeff uses the correct name - and not the trade name, he should be fine.


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## bac3492

what did he decide on???


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## Jeff W

Decided on Pseudotropheus (Metriaclima) Pulpican. Jason explained it really well and the picture is like looking at a mirror image of mine. So this is what i am going with and advertising them as. I am really happy to put a name with the face (fish )

Thanks Again 
Jeff.


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## bac3492

yeah thats what i thought too


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## why_spyder

This is one ID that I would be very confident in genuinity (is that a word?).


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