# First DIY background - 50gal breeder



## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

Hey all. I've been an avid reader for a while now. I got the cichlid bug a few years ago, and set myself up a tank straight away, after not having had tanks in over 10 years. I decided to take my fish and put them in an older 20gal and make myself a custom background. I started off with the 2" thick pink insulation board and some Great Stuff. I'm not artistic in any way, shape or form; so I just grabbed a bunch of different pics from all over the web and I'm going to attempt to incorporate a lot of them into this background. Not so much because I want all these different features crammed into one background, but more so I don't feel like I'm doing one straight ripoff of someone else's background.  As is stands now:


















































































Comments and suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I have a bag of Quikrete Mortar Mix on standby. It seemed logical to use this because of the aggregate used in it, but if anyone wants to suggest something else, PLEASE DO. I would really like to put acrylic sealer on it too, since a lot of people say that it will make it last longer and because of the ability to dye the sealer to get some contrasting colors on the background. Any suggestions on where to get that sealer/dye would be appreciated as well.


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

*BUMP*

Nobody's got any comments/suggestions?


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## JWerner2 (Jul 7, 2008)

Haha, I like the screen name you chose :wink: If its after the person I think it is 

I suggest you add some more detail and come back with pics 

Have you checked Home Depot or Lowes?

You dont need much artistic experience with the great stuff. I suggest you start with a nice thick layer at the bottom and work your way up so that it slopes down. Dont put to much on at first cause it does expand. If you want a cobble like look or a back ground that looks like a pile of rocks you would be best to make one section/rock at a time then letting it expand and dry before you do the next. It will help add the looks of cracks and crevices between the rocks.

To get it nice and level across the bottom I would place it against some thing flat across the bottom and along the back. Then I would add a layer or foil under ( along the bottom ) it wide enough so that any great stuff would not pass it after it expands. Once the bottom is dry and cured you can take the foil off and you'll get a supper smooth level surface.


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## imusuallyuseless (Dec 28, 2005)

That one piece is interesting, but we need to see more. What is the theme you're trying to achieve?


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## R-DUB (Jun 3, 2007)

I like the start. Keep us updated with pics!!!


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

Thanks for the input guys. I'm not going after any particular theme, persay. I just have a bunch of pictures here of other peoples backgrounds, a few of those backgrounds you can just buy and some ideas from my mind's eye.  Trying to meld them all together into something that looks halfway decent. I just got my Rio 2100 pump on Friday. I'm going to notch out a space for that on the back of the background before I get to any more carving. I wanted to see where everything would sit, so I would have an idea of how deep (or how not deep) I could cut when shaping the rest of the background.

Is it sufficient enough to just have some inconspicuous holes drilled into the background for the filter and the pump to take in water? The holes for the filter are on the inside of the "cave", so they're pretty out of the way to begin with. The Rio, however, is right in the middle of the background, so I was thinking of making the holes for that on the underside of a "rock".

Oh, and another idea I wanted to bounce off you guys: The air pump I have is a real simple Aqua Culture MK-1504. It's got two outputs which was why I wanted it. Right now I have two 1" diameter airstones. What I would like to do, is carve two standalone "rocks" that sit off the background. I would like to get rid of the airstones altogether, and run the air hoses underneath these "rocks" which would be semi-hollow. I was then going to run a bunch of 1/16" or less holes into these "rocks". That way they themselves would be the airstones. I wouldn't have huge bubbles of air just coming out of the end of the hoses then. They'd be broken up and filter through the "rocks" as smaller bubbles. I realize that even with concrete on them, they'd probably want to lift up with the air being pumped under them like that. I suppose I'd have to fasten them to the eggcrate somehow.

Thoughts?


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

**UPDATE**

**NEW PICS**

So, I pretty much have all my carving done. I just want to do another fit on the AC 110 and make sure I cutout for the spillway correctly. A friend suggested maybe carving it so rather then flowing straight down, it flows a little towards the center. I'll post more when I get that done, and begin to apply the cement.


















































































Well, that's all for now. As always, comments/suggestions are very much welcomed!


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## Drowned (Mar 16, 2009)

Hey,

This is a nice material to model and as you have quite thick base, why don't try to carve it a little deeper, because when you'll add a layer of some cement, those cracks will be hardly visible and the whole surface could look IMHO kinda flat.

Anyway, I think this will be a great background but don't be afraid to push the knife a bit harder!


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

Haha! Thanks. Yea, that's another thing my friend pointed out last night. I need to go deeper with all the cuts so as not to end up with a flat surface again.


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## ctinsley (Apr 24, 2009)

Hey everyone im new to cichlid-forum but not to the hobby. I would like to know how do i mark this thread so i dont loose it and i can keep up with it. Also i just started my first DIY background and i will be starting a thread soon with lots of pics


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## jfly (Feb 17, 2009)

ctinsley set it up to email you when new posts are added.. at bottom of reply check the last box "notify me when a reply is posted" and WELCOME !!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## ctinsley (Apr 24, 2009)

Thanks jfly


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

**Update**

**New Pics**

Just a few new ones. I split the background and did a dry-fit. Everything looks good so far. Hopefully tomorrow I can touch up any detail carving and maybe mix some concrete.




























As always, comments/suggestions are welcomed.


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## R-DUB (Jun 3, 2007)

How about trying Dry-Lok instead of crete. No time curing the crete. Easy to use too. I am not sure if it will stick to "pink" styro. I used the white beaded type. Worked fine for me. Just a thought. I would definately make my rocks much more pronounced. The crete (if you use it) will hide almost all of the detail. Good Luck!


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

R-DUB said:


> How about trying Dry-Lok instead of crete. No time curing the crete. Easy to use too. I am not sure if it will stick to "pink" styro. I used the white beaded type. Worked fine for me. Just a thought. I would definately make my rocks much more pronounced. The crete (if you use it) will hide almost all of the detail. Good Luck!


Are you saying to use JUST the Dry-Lok and use no concrete at all? If so, how would that look texture-wise? Is it thin enough to show the texture of the carved foam?

One thing I'm starting to think about here is the cutout for my heater. If you look at the background from the front, the heater is on the right. I was planning on just popping some holes through there for water to move through. Is that going to be good enough do you think? The heater itself doesn't move any water, so, there's not really anything to force the water past it. The only other thought I had was to carve a trench on the back in between the notch-outs for the heater and the Rio. That way maybe water would get pulled past the heater, over to the Rio, and pumped back through the UGJs. does that sound like it would work? Just FYI, the Rio and the heater are approx 14"-15" apart.


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## R-DUB (Jun 3, 2007)

The Dry-Lok has a consistency of ordinary latex paint, with some type of sand. Very fine sand. It dries with a rough texture almost like crete. It painted rite onto white styro for me. I put several coats due to my color preference. It comes in white, tan and grey. I had Lowes tint it to a darker grey. Then after that I added some concrete tint to it to make it almost black. My pics are on this DIY section under: My Way to Hide OverTowers. Take a look at the idea. Just a thought. I have not actually secured my background yet. My test pieces have been in another tank for several months with no problems at all. Just a thought good luck.


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

So, if I were to go the Dry-Lok only route, is it hardy enough to hold up in the tank? I mean, it's meant to go OVER concrete and just block moisture. Will it hold up on it's own completely submersed in water?


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## mikesl (Nov 12, 2003)

I just made my first background, and I had a good result using the foam only to define the basic volume, and provide channels for fitler intakes and retursn and powerheads.
Instead of deifning the texture and details in foam, i enjoyed "sculpting" the detail right in tinted quickwall, with some sand sprinkled over it at the end. You can keep working the sand and little details like cracks and pits after the concrete has started to set.

Granted, I was not making rocks with fine detail, but rather large round sandstone looking things.


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## R-DUB (Jun 3, 2007)

I have had a sample piece in a tank for months. No problems. It stays stuck to the styro very well. It has stayed hard. With several layers it formed a "shell". I had to actually pry the styro apart to get any Dry-Lok to come off. I also let it cure for weeks before submerging it. It dries in the same amount off time as latex paint. But I changed colors several times. Keep in mind that I AM A GUINEA PIG. I dont know of many others that have done this. My tank is still in waiting. I have all the parts ready. But the time to get the BG siliconed to the back and make a sump has been a real pita. I bought the 180 in May of 07!! Been working on it on and off since. There are some other threads that have others using Dry-Lok check them out. Good Luck!!


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

**UPDATE**

**NEW PICS**

Ok, first couple of pics are the one stand-alone rock that will be near the center, and also act as an airstone.




























So, I decided to go the Dry-Lok only route. I've got my first basecoat down of a medium grey color. So far I'm very pleased with the look and texture I'm getting now that it's relatively dry. I apologize though, these pics are from when it was still wet, so the pieces look pretty shiney. Rest assured though, they are definitely NOT shiney.





































As always, comments/suggestions are welcomed.


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## @nt!x (Feb 9, 2009)

looking good. I am about to try this myself. Are you going to seal the back?


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## illy-d (Nov 6, 2005)

What sort of filter are you using? If you have a cannister filter I would get a Hydor inline heater - you splice it onto the return line of your filter so it's less equipment insider the tank - at least that's the way I would try to do it if I did a background...


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

> Are you going to seal the back?


What do you mean by seal it? Put the Dry-Lok on it? Or something else?



> What sort of filter are you using?


I have an AC110 right now. I think I'll eventually switch to a Marineland Canister. Honestly, water flow past my heater is the only think I'm concerned about right now which is why I carved a groove from the notch-out for Rio over to the notch-out for the heater. I'm hoping that will pull enough water past the heater to warm the water properly. Though, I'm going to run this thing for a while and check out temperature and chemical levels for a while before I think about adding any fish at all.


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## @nt!x (Feb 9, 2009)

goretex11 said:


> > Are you going to seal the back?
> 
> 
> What do you mean by seal it? Put the Dry-Lok on it? Or something else?


I thought I read somewhere that you should seal the back with some sort of epoxy. Helps keep it from breaking down over time.


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## ctinsley (Apr 24, 2009)

looking good


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## ctinsley (Apr 24, 2009)

looking good


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

Thanks for all the kind words people. I just threw a second coat on tonight. I'd still like to know if someone has a suggestion for sealing the back on what to use.


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## Drowned (Mar 16, 2009)

I don't think it's necessary to seal the back.

Great job so far :thumb:

I've just started with my first background two days ago and the thing I fear the most is the pressure or displacement (whatever you call it :-? ) of the styrofoam.


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

I'm not sure what I'm going to do about sealing the back yet. Whether I should do it or not, and if so, what to use.

I too, am also worried about the flotation factor of the background, especially since I went all Dry-Lok and skipped the concrete. Does it sound like a feasible idea to pop a couple of holes along the bottom and use small, clear zip ties in addition to the silicone? Or is the silicone enough (if I use enough)?

Also, should the UGJ system be fastened down somehow? And the eggcrate as well? All things I never thought about, but I'm thinking of them now (thank god) since the background is quickly approaching the finish line.


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## Stickzula (Sep 14, 2007)

coating the back is optional. the styro will not degrade, but it can be rubbed causing pieces to come off. if it is siliconed to the back of the tank, don't worry about coating it. The boyancy of the styro will be a problem. Using zip ties won't do much to keep the styro in the tank. They will either be pulled through the styro or pull the eggcrate up with it. I would however use a zip tie or 2 to hold the ugj's to the eggcrate. it isn't totally necessary, but it will hold the pipes in place. I've done it both ways and I would recomend tying it down. One trick to help with the boyancy of the styro is to hollow it out and fill the cavity with something heavy. Most people just pour more concrete in the cavity, but since you aren't using concrete... maybe you could fill it with sand and silicone a thin sheet of styro to the back?? I don't know if it would work or not, but I would be nervous about having just the stryo held in by silicone and not have any weight to counter the boyancy.


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## gminor (May 6, 2009)

goretex11, 
Your DIY background looks great. I've done a couple of these using Quikrete Quikwall and just moved my Mbuna's to the new tank about 3 weeks ago. I'm wondering if the coating you used may be easier to work with than the Quickwall. The pic below is my lastest effort.

As you mentioned, credit is due to all the folks who've tried this type of project in the passed and shared what they've learned. Thanks for sharing your experience!
Glenn










More pics and info regarding my experience building this background
http://www.kcfishclub.org/forum.html?func=view&catid=18&id=9239


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## mrwong41 (Mar 9, 2007)

opcorn:


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## Harley915 (May 7, 2009)

Goretex11....Looking Good!

I'm about to start my DIY background within the next couple of days. I pretty much have a good idea of what I'm going to do, but I wanted to know if there was a certain type/based paint I can use to give it a more natural look. (lacquer based, oil based, water base, etc.) Can I just use regular canned spray paint?


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

To be honest, this is my first one. Searches on the forum will probably yield a lot more useful information that I can provide. But I'll certainly try to help.

I'm not totally sure about what type of paint is or is not safe. But I figured I'd be pretty safe with a latex-base. Though, I have seen plenty of people use spray paint.

Definitely make a post when you start your project and keep us all updated!

Good luck! :thumb:


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## ctinsley (Apr 24, 2009)

goretex11, do you plan on painting your background and then sealing it. it seems the drylock that you used is white or lightly colored. The drylock did allow you to keep the fine details of your carving though and thats a plus. Im just interested in what your next steps will be. Im on my first background and im going the quickcrete route.


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

ctinsley said:


> goretex11, do you plan on painting your background and then sealing it. it seems the drylock that you used is white or lightly colored. The drylock did allow you to keep the fine details of your carving though and thats a plus. Im just interested in what your next steps will be. Im on my first background and im going the quickcrete route.


I think I'm sticking with the Dry-Lok only. What I did was get Tints-All and tinted the Dry-Lok grey. I put 2 thick coats of that on there. Then when it dried, I mixed more a very dark grey and did all the crevasses. (pics below) I don't think I'm going to seal the back, because what I did right before I put the Dry-Lok on, was to hit it lightly with a heatgun to melt back all those little bits that are hanging off after you carve it. That actually made a little bit of a shell on the back, so it's pretty solid and smooth now. Not really porous anymore. Here's some pics with the paint finalized. I was going to add a little brown in here and there, but that's well above my artistic ability. I'll just let algae do it's thing. 





































This one give you a little feel for the depth of the background.










I did take the suggestion of another poster:



Stickzula said:


> One trick to help with the boyancy of the styro is to hollow it out and fill the cavity with something heavy. Most people just pour more concrete in the cavity, but since you aren't using concrete... maybe you could fill it with sand and silicone a thin sheet of styro to the back?? I don't know if it would work or not, but I would be nervous about having just the stryo held in by silicone and not have any weight to counter the boyancy.


What I ended up doing was hollowing out any flat parts on the back of the background, and filling them with Quickrete Stucco and Mortar Mix. And here's how it came out. Still curing of course. This was only done this afternoon.




























So, I'm on the homestretch now. One night this week, I'll get out there to rinse my sand. Then I'm pretty much ready to drop the background in, substrate, water and start cycling.


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

Ok, so turns out, tonight was the night I got to go rinse out my sand. :grin: I also prepped the background by drilling the holes for flow of water to the filter head and heater. In addition to that, I drilled the holes in my stand alone rock for the air stone. I'm hoping this will work.

The holes in the top:










The check valve:










Then the airstone itself:



















I'm going to give the concrete another day or so to cure, then I'm ready to install this bad boy and fill it with water. Right before I do that though, I may be drilling a few more small holes where I'd like to have some plants permanently attached to the rocks. Maybe. We'll see. :grin:


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## Dook (May 13, 2009)

gminor said:


> goretex11,
> Your DIY background looks great. I've done a couple of these using Quikrete Quikwall and just moved my Mbuna's to the new tank about 3 weeks ago. I'm wondering if the coating you used may be easier to work with than the Quickwall. The pic below is my lastest effort.
> 
> As you mentioned, credit is due to all the folks who've tried this type of project in the passed and shared what they've learned. Thanks for sharing your experience!
> ...


that is just wicked... I love the step effect and the plants...


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

**UPDATE**

**NEW PICS**

Well, I finally got the background installed, the substrate put down and filled it with water. Still kind of cloudy, but here is the result:





































I tested the water and everything seemed to be right on, including the temperature. I added a dozen goldfish because I like to use them to cycle the water initially. I'll bring them back to my LFS when I'm ready for my real fish.  Here it is with it's temporary blazen tenants:





































As always, comments and suggestions are welcome.


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## non_compliance (Dec 4, 2008)

looks pretty good.... nice job.


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## goretex11 (Jun 24, 2008)

Thanks non_compliance. I appreciate the feedback.

I took a few more pics now that the water has cleared up. I did add a few rocks to sort of hide the UGJ's.




























I think when it comes time to stock the tank, I'll end up doing approx. 9 mbunas, 1 syno and 1 pleco.


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## jfly (Feb 17, 2009)

=D>


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