# My fishless cycling journey



## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Tank is filled and just dosed with the first of the ammonia. I'm going to keep this post for a log of the cycle.

Could use some help though....what does this reading look like to you guys?

This one is with the camera flash









And this one is without the flash









This is with one t.spoon of ammonia dosed.


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## kittyk (Sep 20, 2012)

The one without the flash I would go by.....I say it's a 2. How did you start your cycle ? I started mine Sept 22....still stuck on ammonia (no nitrites yet)


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

kittyk said:


> The one without the flash I would go by.....I say it's a 2. How did you start your cycle ? I started mine Sept 22....still stuck on ammonia (no nitrites yet)


That's kind'a what I was leaning towards was the no flash one and I was thinking between 2ppm and 3ppm. But after looking at it for the past 15 mins my eyes are going crossed :lol:

I just started mine the way way the article here in the library says...filled it with water this morning, added some declorinator after filling it. Then just added 1 teaspoon of ammonia (55g tank) at about 7:20pm this evening and let that move through the tank for 20 mins and then checked ammonia.

Steve


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Okay barley even 5 hours into this and I have noticed in the past hour the cyrstal clear water I started with has turned a bit hazy looking (almost like a bacteria bloom?) is this normal in the first few hours of a fishless cycle??


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## syoung22 (Jun 15, 2012)

Both of my tanks turned hazy and everything got slimy when I went through the fishless cycle. But not that fast....it took days to maybe a week before it happened. If you are using sand then my guess would be when you added water it just got everything stirred up. it will eventually settle.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

It's definitely not the sand. I washed the sand for many hours and it was crystal clear even with everything running the whole four hours before I added the ammonia dose and declor. This is more of a white haze (see pictures)
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Clear with water filled and everything running ...








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Couple hours after dosing with Ammonia (clear ammonia from ACE hardware)








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Side view through tank so you can see the haziness better









:-?


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## PaNiK (Dec 10, 2003)

I started my cycle yesterday too, and that's how mine looks.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

PaNiK said:


> I started my cycle yesterday too, and that's how mine looks.


Okay that makes me feel a bit better then, I was a bit concerned something was amiss in my cycle for a bit. Thanks PaNiK


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 2*
Did the ammonia check today at 8pm. It was a very very slightly lighter shade of green than it was yesterday, I'd say for sure a 2ppm today. Water is still about the same as yesterday with clarity, just a little hazy. Been holding the temp at a steady 85.7 F as the fishless cycling article here at CF suggest to do to help promote the growth with a bit warmer temp during the cycle. I am really liking the Hydor inline heater, it seems to not let the temps fluctuate more than about .5 of a degree so far.

Hard to say as this is my first fishless cycle attempt, but everything seems to be going okay.


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## dsouthworth (Sep 7, 2011)

Oh man! I remember seeing the build thread for this one. 
One step closer to seeing some fish!


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## kittyk (Sep 20, 2012)

Yes, I also saw the building of this...awesome. I thought I did a lot....and I only sanded a badly scratched acrylic. Started my cycle on Sept 22....still haven't had any nitrites.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 3*

Ready for the major update today?....No change lol Still 2-3ppm Ammonia. Wont update again till there is a change I guess.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

Hey Steve if you want to speed up your cycle ten fold for $20 grab some Dr. Tims One and Only. Works great.


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## PaNiK (Dec 10, 2003)

Did it clear up?


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Hey Steve if you want to speed up your cycle ten fold for $20 grab some Dr. Tims One and Only. Works great.


Funny you mention that because I was just looking at some of that online the other day and wondered how it worked. I think I might order some on Monday.



> Did it clear up?


Yeah I noticed yesterday it started clearing some and now this evening it is just about all clear.

Steve


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## DrgRcr (Jun 23, 2009)

Be patient. It will take a week or more for it to start processing the ammonia. More patience will be required for the nitrite stage. Learning to be patient now will go a long way in keeping African Cichlids!


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Ammonia hasn't dropped yet, probably wont for about another week or so I'm guessing, but I did test PH today just out of boredom more than anything and found it seemed to be a bit higher than it was out of the tap. Wondering what the reason for this is?

Out of the tap- 7.6
After 24hrs in a bowl with a bubbler- 7.4/7.5

Now in this pic I'm not sure but I think it seems higher than 7.6 doesn't it? (Ph on left and high range PH on right ...what would you guys say it looks to be? And is it normal that it would raise all on it's own like that if it did?


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## PaNiK (Dec 10, 2003)

Rocks? Substrate?


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Only have a small amount of rocks in it and they are not limestone or anything that should affect parameters that I know of (plus they are drylok painted to match the background so should in essence be basically "sealed" for lack of a better term . Substrate is all sand so nothing there that should change anything.


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## matt-sheeran (Sep 10, 2012)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> Hey Steve if you want to speed up your cycle ten fold for $20 grab some Dr. Tims One and Only. Works great.


woohoo thank god i read this thread.. i would have never herd about that stuff.. i'm going to get some asap


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 6*

Still not processing Ammonia as of yet. Ammonia is still around 2-3ppm. Decided against picking up any of the "one & only" bacteria. I've read good things about it, but I just decided to let the cycle ride out on it's own and not try to force it with any additives.

I did bump the temp up another degree and also added a bubbler to give it some more O2 just during the cycle stages. Hoping to see it start processing the ammonia maybe in the next 3-4 days.....fingers crossed!

Steve


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 8*

Well I think this is good news. Tested ammonia just a few mins ago and ammonia is still reading 2ppm...but I did test for Nitrites and it is now reading .25ppm on nitrites. So if I am understanding this properly then it is starting to form the proper bacteria now and I hopefully should now see the ammonia drop very shortly correct?

Steve


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## kittyk (Sep 20, 2012)

Yes, you will see the nitrites go very high. Converting nitrites to nitrates will come next


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 10*

Seems to be going very well now. Today Ammonia is down to between 1-2ppm (closer to 1ppm) and Nitrites are starting to spike now as I'm seeing 2ppm Nitrites today. I'm sure there is still a ways to go but I'm happy to see things starting to change in the tank now :dancing:


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## TheJ0kerrr (Aug 14, 2012)

Do you know anyone who has an established tank who would be nice enough to give you some of his filter media? That would speed up things a lot. If not, maybe a trusted local fish store could do that for you. Otherwise, you are in for a long journey


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

I don't trust any of the local stores enough to chance any of their media. Only one I know with an established tank is my nephew but he does not keep up on cleaning it often or even bother with checking parameters so I wouldn't want to chance his media either. I feel that my cycle is progressing well though and I feel a few more week it should be cycled, so I have patience to wait for it to cycle on it's own :thumb:


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

Getting there steve


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## TheJ0kerrr (Aug 14, 2012)

All good points to be patient! Just make sure you keep an eye on that PH once it starts converting nitrite into nitrates. If it crashes, it might halt your cycle.

Also, if you can keep nitrites under control with water changes, it's more fun since you can actually see progress. Too much nitrites can also be a bad thing for bacterias.

On the right path, keep it up!


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 11*
Had to do the tests a few hours earlier than normal today due to other obligations, but there's more changes just since yesterday now. Ammonia is close to being gone, Nitrites are definitely spiking big time now. Also checked the PH, I'll have to do some re-reading of the article here on fishless cycling again later tonight but from what it looks like I think I should be ready to start redosing ammonia and doing small water changes within the next day or two if I read the article correctly. Parameters are now...

*Ammonia- .50ppm
Nitrites- 5ppm
PH - 7.6*


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 12*

Good news! I think the first step of the cycle may be over and it has processed the orginal dose of 4ppm Ammonia now. Would you guys agree that this color is zero? (I hate tryin to read these things still till I get more use to it)


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

They are hard to read, id say its 0


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Thanks fusion. So should I start today doing a small pwc and dose with ammonia? or since it just went to zero this morning should I wait 24 hours and start dosing & pwc tomorrow?


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

no need to wait, small water change, add ammonia every other day and small water change every day trying to keep the nitrite bellow 5ppm


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Okay cool I'll start it now. Yeah Nitrites are through the roof right now. I tested them about an hour ago and it was brighter then the highest one on the chart which is 5ppm...So it's over 5ppm for sure right now.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Well all done...I actually was thinking the PWC and redosing and all was gonna be a real pain in the rear, because I haven't had tanks for almost 20 yrs now and forgot most of what I knew, and even then never had a 55g or bigger like this. But I just did about a 20% WC, declorinated, refilled and dosed with ammonia and didn't take more than 30 mins tops. I love that Python water changer, wish I had one of these back in the day lol.

So I'm good to go. I'll let this run and then check it ion 24 hrs to see if it has converted the ammonia as well as check nitrite to see what effect the pwc had and I think I know what I'm doing now hopefully lol.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 13*

Ammonia is Zero today after dosing it with 3-4ppm of ammonia yesterday so it is now converting ammonia within 24hrs :thumb:

Nitrites today are still over 5ppm even after doing a 20% WC yesterday. Question... Should I increase the WC to maybe 30-35% today?


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Well I did about a 35% water change today, but Nitrites are still over 5ppm even after the wc. Is there anything else I can do to lower them? I've read that you don;t want to do too big a wc during the cycle stages so should I just keep up with the small daily wc's and not worry too much about the nitrites right now?


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

25% to 30% is the recommended amount, sometimes the "nitrite phase" can take longer than the ammonia phase, patience lol


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Yeah I just wanted to make sure that they weren't too high which I had read could inhibit the cycle. But long as these super high nitrites are normal then I wont worry too much.


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## TheJ0kerrr (Aug 14, 2012)

The percentage of water you replace will lower nitrites by the same percentage... So if your nitrites are up to 10ppm, a 35% WC will lower them to 6.5ppm. If you do another 35% WC they will drop at around 4.2ppm.

Also have to consider any additional nitrites that could have been converted in between WC's.


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## matt-sheeran (Sep 10, 2012)

sorry to hijack ur thread here but i tested my water today in my new tank that i'm fishless cycling been about 2 weeks or so this is what its reading at the moment








any advice?


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

Hard to tell what the ammonia is, if you think its 0, do a 30% water change and re dose with ammonia to 2 ppm, if its converting the ammonia to 0 in 24 hrs, 30% waterchange everyday and dose with ammonia every 2 days, do this until you have 0 nitrites


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## matt-sheeran (Sep 10, 2012)

do u absolutly have to dose with ammonia ?? i haven't been :S.. and i recon the ammonia there is about 0.25ppm, nitrite 5.0 nitrate 5.0... cant show pH there because i broke 1 of the test tubes lol


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

How have you been doing it? either way you need to do a waterchange, your nitrites are high and will slow down the cycle


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

> do u absolutly have to dose with ammonia ?? i haven't been :S..


If I'm not mistaken you dose ammonia because the bacteria you just created lives off the ammonia and if you don't dose ammonia it will die....at least that's how I understand it, maybe fusion can correct me if I'm wrong on that?


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

Yes, the good bio your building needs food to convert ammonia and nitrites, normally its done with ammonia, im thinking they cant get pure ammonia in australia so im not sure how they do it.


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## matt-sheeran (Sep 10, 2012)

well i've never herd of pure ammonia around here :S.. i'm getting a filter from an established tank tomorrow for a while anyway so hopefully that will speed it up


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Matt it looks like you guys down under have ammonia on your "anti terrorisim" list of products. I did a bit of googling though and found this on another site where someone just last year was asking where to buy ammonia in Australia. Sounds like there is a product by another name that you might be able to use. Maybe this will help you..The link doesn't work but at least there is the name of what someone else suggested that might help.
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> G'day, I'm Ken from Sydney.
> 
> You won't find pure ammonia in oz, it's on the anti terrorism hit list lol. If you want to do a fishless cycle the best way to get ammonia is by visiting this web site: http://aquadiso.com/shop/aquashop_index.html
> 
> They sell a product called ammonchlor (google it) it is ammonium chloride salt and when added to water is pure ammonia. They are in Sydney and I think they are the only ones who sell it. I used a little bit of ammonium chloride (wife's chem set lol) and it gave me an instant ammonia reading. Good luck.


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## matt-sheeran (Sep 10, 2012)

thanks for the effort on searching for it haha  and yeah that would probably be right lol, we are very restricted down here!... but i may just stick to this established filter idea.. the only 1 i can get and its from a turtle tank :S... but oh well thanks anyway man!


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 18*

Cycle is still rolling along. Been keeping up with 35% daily water changes and dosing ammonia every other day. Nitrites are still pegged sky high but the water changes do seem to help to get them down at least somewhat closer to the 5ppm range. Water has really cleared up nicely with the water changes. Seems to be going as it should be so far :thumb:


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## matt-sheeran (Sep 10, 2012)

sorry again but my water has been testing like this for 24 hours now.. would u say it is almost cycled ??


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## TheJ0kerrr (Aug 14, 2012)

Definetly not cycled, but on the right path. Nitrites should be a clear turquoise (looks like 0.50ppm now) and then nitrates will probably be darker (orange/red).

Let it sit another 24 hours without dosing to see if your nitrites go away. If they do, dose again and watch how long it takes to clear everything up.

What would you say your PH is at? Doesn't seem to match anything on the chart. Have you tried the regular PH test?

EDIT : I just realized you don't have ammonia for dosing... what is your source of ammonia again?


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## matt-sheeran (Sep 10, 2012)

yeah nitrite is going down slowly. tested this morning and its now 0.25 .. i would say my pH is between 8.0 and 8.2 but my phone camera didn't really show that colour on the chart is more brown..
and i'm downing a fish in cycle (the very disapproved way) but they showed no signs of stress or scratching on things, and i've been checking the water once in the morning and once at night to see if its spiked or not..
btw i think my nitrate isint a pure light yellow it looks to have a bit of orange in it ?


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## TheJ0kerrr (Aug 14, 2012)

Yeah, it does. Since you're in a fish-in cycle, once your nitrites are gone, it means your filter can handle the current load of fish you have in the tank. That means it's cycled! Just don't add fish too fast after that!


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## matt-sheeran (Sep 10, 2012)

ahhh ok cool.. and i wont be adding more fish yet.. the fish in there atm are only small about 1 inch or so.. waiting for them to grow a bit before i add my others from the old tank which are bigger


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## Meisterkiyoh (Oct 12, 2012)

I have optimal ranges pretty much for everything except Nitrates. Mine cant make up its mind. Its currently sitting at 160+. heres my ranges for my tank as of today.

~pH 7.0
~Ammonia 1.0 ppm
~Nitrite 1.0 ppm
~Nitrate 160+ ppm

It'll go down, and then it will spike back up.
Btw, I had very little issues cycling my tank when I started up this one. Its only recently it has spiked


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

*Day 25*

I THINK I MAY BE CYCLED! :dancing: If someone could just confirm this for me...

I've been doing as the article here says and dosing ammonia every 2 days, 35-40% water changes every day, and testing for nitrites because it started converting ammonia in 24hrs about a week to ten days ago, then the past week Nitrites have been off the chart. On Friday Nitrites were still off the chart so I did my normal 40% daily water change. I was not around to do anything yesterday because I was on a trout fly fishing trip at my cabin from Friday night till just about an hour ago when I got home, so soon as I got home I tested my water parameters. To my surprise here is what I have right now.....

*Ammonia- 0*
*Nitrites- 0*
*Nitrates- 0*
*PH- 8.0/8.2*
Am I correct that I am cycled and ready for fish now??


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

MMMMM you should be seeing Nitrates, i would keep dosing and stop the water changes for a few days, have you seen any Nitrates at all?


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Yeah I did test for Nitrates on Tuesday or Wednesday of last week and it showed about 20-40ppm of Nitrates, but the article said if you have Nitrites present which mine were still off the chart at that time, then it could skew the Nitrate reading (but you know how it is I couldn't resist testing for Nitrates last week lol). But if that test is perhaps correct, then I did have 20-40 ppm of Nitrates early last week.


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

Your probably there then, maby dose 1 more time?


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

Because you were away, I would dose to 2-3ppm ammonia for a further 2 days, testing prior to the 2nd dose and 24 hours after the 2nd dose to be sure that you're reaching 0ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrite and that you're producing a nitrate reading.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Okay sounds like the safe thing to do, I'll dose again tonight and see what the readings are tomorrow and let you guys know and then go from there.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

GTZ said:


> Because you were away, I would dose to 2-3ppm ammonia for a further 2 days, testing prior to the 2nd dose and 24 hours after the 2nd dose to be sure that you're reaching 0ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrite and that you're producing a nitrate reading.


Missed this when I just posted but see it now. I will do that, and let you guys know in a couple days what it does. Thanks.


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

:thumb: Close to seeing fish
Im on day 10 slight ammonia drop but no sign of nitrites yet, still a ways to go


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Okay here's a question for you guys. I just dosed Ammonia 2 hours ago with 2ppm Ammonia. Now two hours later this is my readings...

Ammonia- 1.5ppm
Nitrite- 5ppm
Nitrate- looks like between 10ppm and 20ppm

Is it normal for it to start converting it that quickly when everything was 0 before the dosing 2 hours ago?


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

Yes it's normal, however I would disregard everything but the ammonia reading until it reads 0.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

okay here's what I got guys.

After 24 hrs dosed...

Ammonia- 0ppm
Nitrites- .25ppm
Nitrates.- .50ppm

So??


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Hello? any help here guys?


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Well if any cares.... Ammonia 0, Nitrites 0, Nitrates 0 now at 1:30am. So I am thinking I am cycled and ready for fish?


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

The 0 nitrate reading is odd. Are there plants in the tank? You should have a nitrate reading.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Nope no plants at all. Think I should redose and check it again tomorrow?


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

I just tested again. Today it is 0 Ammonia, 0 Nitrite, and between 5-10ppm Nitrate.


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

where's the fish?
Comon steve your slow  
Congrats lol


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

lol I actually spoke with Billy at Cichlid Express (site sponsor) last night so long as everything still looks good then I will probably be ordering fish this Friday then Billy said they would ship Monday and be here on Tuesday. Needless to say I'm excited :dancing:


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

Now im envious my ammonia hasnt moved, no nitrites but its only been 12 days, patience i guess.
What you ordering? decided yet?


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

So far I think I have these for sure.....

Aulonocara jacobfreibergi Mamalala (Lemon Jake)
Aulonocara stuartgranti Blue Neon
Aulonocara stuartgranti German Red
OB Peacock
Aulonocara stuartgranti "Ngara Flametail"
Red Top Lwanda 
Yellow Lab

All Males, Then Billy said I could probably do two more so I'm going to have him pick out a couple more that will fit in with the rest.


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## Woundedyak (Oct 19, 2007)

Question Steve! When you started to do your water changes. Did you add any detoxification to your new water? I'm on day 9 and my second dose. I assume I will be doing water changes here shortly.


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Yep I checked to see what my city water supply has in it and they use clorine but not chloramine so I add 1 drop per gallon that. So I was adding about 15 drops when I would change about 15 gallons daily. If you google your city water supply you can find a report online which will tell you where your city uses clorine or chloramine. If they use clorine then 1 drop per gallon, or if they use chloramine then 2 drops per gallon is what you'd use.


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## mrbeadheadful (Oct 24, 2012)

Gosh, all this trouble, I recommend cycling with bacteria in a bottle, be done in ~1week. 
I used nutrafin cycle lat time because it was all that was left, and lets say I was skeptical, but 0 issues!


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

There was no trouble at all, I just had some questions is all because it was the first fishless cycle I have done, but certainly was no trouble. I cycled fully in 25 days and feel very confident that I now have a very healthy cycled tank that I can stock all at once. I did a lot of reading on the bacteria in a bottle and just decided that it was just not really for me.


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## Woundedyak (Oct 19, 2007)

Thanks Steve


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

Steve C said:


> So far I think I have these for sure.....
> 
> Aulonocara jacobfreibergi Mamalala (Lemon Jake)
> Aulonocara stuartgranti Blue Neon
> ...


Lots of color there steve, will look great :thumb:


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## Steve C (Oct 9, 2011)

Thanks, Billy suggested a couple as well so looks like this should be the final stick list, and with this amount if I have to rehome one or two I will be able to do so without being under stocked...

Aulonocara jacobfreibergi Mamalala (Lemon Jake)-
Aulonocara stuartgranti Blue Neon
Aulonocara stuartgranti German Red
OB Peacock
Aulonocara stuartgranti "Ngara Flametail"
Red Top Lwanda 
Benga Sunshine
Ethelwynnae
Red Shoulder
Albino Red Diamond 
Catfish-Synodontis hybrid (angelicus x eupterus)--- Two of these


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

mrbeadheadful said:


> Gosh, all this trouble, I recommend cycling with bacteria in a bottle, be done in ~1week.
> I used nutrafin cycle lat time because it was all that was left, and lets say I was skeptical, but 0 issues!


Did you dose with ammonia while cycling with the Nutrafin product or did you add fish and the product at the same time? What was the tank size and stocking? New tank and filter(s)?
I'm curious because in the past it's been suggested that this product contains the wrong type of bacteria for nitrification. Also, it's been suggested that this product is basically an ammonia/nitrite detoxifier and doesn't establish beneficial bacteria at all.
Sorry for the hijack Steve, congrats on finishing your cycle!


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## mrbeadheadful (Oct 24, 2012)

I added a couple fish. I read the same thing after buying it, but decided to give it a go anyways. Tank is now fully stocked, 2 weeks later, with 5 fish ~1.5 inches each. This is a 20g. cycled with a penguin 150b with aquaclear sponge, and just added a whisper 20, with purigen in place of the carbon. The tank does have a live plant (red crypt). Water params are very good, and with my ph of 8-8.1, any ammonia would be toxic.


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

Interesting, perhaps they've made changes to their product. Thanks for the info!


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## thefishermann (Apr 24, 2012)

i woul get it up to <4ppm add an aerator and raise the heat to 88-89. i would jot down how much NH3 you added and keep adding the same amount of NH3 until your Nitrite spikes. Once it spikes keep adding 1/2 the amount you initally have been adding until NH3 starts to drop.

don't change water and don't panic if stuff starts growing in your tank. it will get worse before it gets better believe me. just by looking at your pics you are nowhere near a finished cycle.

I did this for my wet/dry on my 75g in 3 1/2 weeks pH 7.9-8.0, NH3 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0. once you reach these levels do a 90% waterchange and clean glass.

kudos for doing the fishless cycle man... its the way to go (not hurt the little guys). the best part about it is you can probabbly overstock your tank immediately after a successful cycle. the amount of bacteria you generate is incomparable to a fish cycle.good luck!


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## thefishermann (Apr 24, 2012)

yikes i didn't rea down lol... gratz on your cycle bro!


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