# Female Jack Dempsey in with Male Jack Dempsey to breed



## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

Please give me some tips on attempting to introduce a 6 inch Female Jack Dempsey Cichlid in with a Male Jack Dempsey.

I want to have a go at breeding but this is the first time I have had to introduce a female to my Male Jacks territory...and believe me it is his....

He recently forced a 7 inch Jaguar Cichlid out of the tank.

He has bred before though but not for well over a year and a half.

Thanks for your time


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

I forgot to mention that he is 7.5 inch in size


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## homerl (Jan 6, 2009)

Maybe a divider to start in your tank to see what aggression if any is there.


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## jagz (Nov 1, 2009)

What size tank? Any other fish in the tank? I would start with a divider. Provide lots of hiding places.


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## twohuskies (Mar 1, 2008)

I second the divider. ^^


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## Briguy (Aug 10, 2009)

Divider is a good idea. Further it is a good idea to introduce the male into the females territory. She will feel more comfortable. If you are using a divider then put her in the side where they will most likely spawn. When she starts to prepare the area then remove the divider to allow the male access.

Good luck.


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## jason_nj (Feb 24, 2010)

You can try rearranging the tank as well so your male JD may not be as territorial.


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

I put a divider in for the past two days and the male showed no aggression whatsover so...I removed the divider....and now she is in my hospital tank recovering....completely destroyed, bite marks, scales missing and fins shredded.....she was only in for about 3 minutes

Does anyone think that maybe he thought she was a male ? Any ideas?....


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## mlancaster (Jul 24, 2009)

Hi *mariner*,

Once she recovers I would try the divider again, but keep them divided for much longer, more like two weeks.

What is the divider made of?

What size is the tank?

What size is the female?

Maybe she is a he, could you please post some pictures of both so we could take a look?

Was your male relentlessly chasing her around the tank or were they tolerating each other and just had some wounds. My fish always lose some scales and have some ripped fins during spawning. But if it was more of a relentless chase that is not good.

Another Idea (depending on tank size) is to add some target fish, such as a convict. Therefore, the male will have some thing to protect the female and spawning site from. Two fish i have that paired up use a team effort to keep the other larger cichlid (third wheel) at bay, kind of gives them something to do together. But i would not recommend this unless you have room in your tank.

Unfortunately, you may just have one of the jack dempseys that rightfully earned its name. If he took out a 7 inch Jag, that is saying a lot for his aggression level.

Keep us posted and we would love some pics.

Thanks,
Matt


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

Okay so I have posted two photos of them both...male and female JD

Here is a photo of my 7 Inch Male ( 1 and a half years old)










Here is a photo of the female (Or what I believe to be a female) before she was attacked and she is 5 inch (1 year old)










Yeah basically she was chased relentlessly non stop....He went over to her and swam next to her but she showed no interest and wanted to get away asap.....That is when he flipped out....He expanded his jaw to almost double the size of what it currently is and flared up, very very aggressive.......he was chasing her and flying into the glass if she moved quickly out of the way...so after a few minutes I had to get her out !


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## bigcatsrus (Apr 15, 2009)

You have another female. See that pale part on the lower half of the gill, there should be spangles of the blue on that part of the gill. That would be the female marks. My partner has JD's and this is what we go by and I'm sure many members do the same.


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## bigcatsrus (Apr 15, 2009)

You have another male. See that pale part on the lower half of the gill, there should be spangles of the blue on that part of the gill. That would be the female marks. My partner has JD's and this is what we go by and I'm sure many members do the same.


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

bigcatsrus you may be on to something there ! Anyone else agree?

It is annoying because the store sold it as a female...


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## bigcatsrus (Apr 15, 2009)

They would do for a sale. Well in my area they do. My partner has 5 in his tank, 4 of which are male and you can see the difference between the gill plates.


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## thinking_fish (Aug 13, 2007)

I see two males  yep they will see you anything at some stores


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## mlancaster (Jul 24, 2009)

marinerm10 said:


> bigcatsrus you may be on to something there ! Anyone else agree?
> 
> It is annoying because the store sold it as a female...


I agree that you have two males (based on the same gill plate analysis). It is just one scared pale male from a LFS and one dominate well colored male who has had run of his own tank. Take the second male back to the LFS and get a trade in. When you get a new female look closely at the lower jaw/gill plate. A female should have blue splotchy coloration on her lower jawline/gill plate. Where as the males (like yours) have sharp distinct blue markings under the eye and on the upper gill plate.

Total bummer, the LFS should be happy to exchange once you explain your analysis (just don't be too upfront, some LFS workers can be a little defensive/touchy in my area).

If you get a female, post some pics please.

Thanks,
Matt


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## jason_nj (Feb 24, 2010)

They look like 2 males to me. A female will have spangles on their lower jaw\gill plate and not as much spangles on the body.


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## bigcatsrus (Apr 15, 2009)

Here's an pic of my partners JD's.

female









male









EDIT: Excuse the reflections, quick snaps just taken now!


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

I rang the store back that sold me it and they apologised and said I can exhange this weekend so I am going to do that..... I did think it was a female myself when I looked at it but now that Big Cats Rus has shown me the comparison, it is easy to tell.....

How big is your partners JD male it looks huge?

I will post a photo of the new female soon so you can all confirm......Thanks for your help with this too !


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## bigcatsrus (Apr 15, 2009)

This is the tank that they are in. 6' long. The pots are a temp measure as we ran out of slate and wood.










The biggest I think is around 7-8". Awesome to watch. They are in with 3 bristlenose plecs.


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

Wow that tank is great, you have a whole pride of JD's they look great, post some more pics if you get chance those JD's look awesome....


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## bigcatsrus (Apr 15, 2009)

Hi

The boyfriend here! lol

Here's some more pics of my jack's. I got "Mum & Dad" as less than 1" juvies about six and a half years ago. They bred and the other 3 are the surviving offspring.

Enjoy, Dave.


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## bigcatsrus (Apr 15, 2009)

EDIT: deleted double post! :-?


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## Dave Jones (Feb 27, 2010)

Finally put my butt in gear and registered. These little pains in the ar$e are mine!


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## mlancaster (Jul 24, 2009)

Hi *Dave Jones* & *bigcatsrus*,

Your JDs are awesome, how big are they again? they look huge.

Thanks,
Matt


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

Amazing Jack Dempseys Dave.....easily the best I have seen...... Great shape and great colours!
How old are the parents?

Getting my female JD pic up tomorrow after I exchange !


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## Dave Jones (Feb 27, 2010)

Hi Matt, "Dad" the largest male is around 7-8"'s "Mum" the only female is around 4-5", the 3 boys are 6-7.

@marinerm10, thank you, I got the parents as juvies in August '03 so they must be heading for 7 years old at the moment. The boys are about 4.


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

Hi everyone, sorry about the late response......I said that I would post a photo of the new female that i exchanged with the previous male........here is a photo of her.....she is in with my male and she is around 5 inch......apparently she has bred before....she is great


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## mlancaster (Jul 24, 2009)

Hi *marinerm10*,

Nice works, new JD looks to be a female. How are they geting along? Did you use a divider again?

THanks,
Matt


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

Hi Mclancaster...

Yeah I used a divider for a week that is why i didn't post a pic just yet but now she is successfully in with the male....all is looking good.....he was very interested in her following her around peacefully and she has her own cave as can be seen in the photo.....he is constantly waiting by the cave door it looks funny and she pops her head out from time to time.....no aggression at all


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## marinerm10 (Feb 2, 2010)

Sorry, Mlancaster**


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## c333davis (Apr 2, 2010)

Curious for an update. What's the latest, marinerm10?

My current situation might provide some answers to your original question.

Yesterday, I introduced a 6" male JD and a 4" female JD to a tank with a single 6" female JD. The three JDs swam around side-by-side for the first hour. The male then began slowly shimmying and flaring his gills. Each female, one on either side of the male, began mimicking the shimmy. All seemed harmonious.

After a few hours, the two larger JDs began separating themselves by bullying the smallest one, crowding her into various caves or corners. Before the tank lights turned off, I put a divider in the tank to give the smallest one some space. The large female & male stayed at the opposite end of the tank and began moving sand and cleaning off a piece of slate.

This morning, one of the larger JDs nosed its way into the smallest JD's enclosure, and the bullying escalated. The smallest JD was pretty well scraped up and had some nips out of her tail. I relocated her to QT tank, and am treating her with Melafix now.

In their own tank, the male/female pair have continued their collaborative housekeeping, digging bowl-shaped indentions at each end of the tank. I'm happily anticipating eggs from the pair soon. It'll be my first batch with JDs... my only experience with eggs and fry is with Jewels.

The smallest JD seems much more content in her own tank, swimming at all levels, checking out all of the nooks and crannies around the fake mangrove root in the tank. She's also eating well, so I'm taking that as a good sign.


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## jason_nj (Feb 24, 2010)

Hey c333davis.

Once a pair forms any other fish will be in trouble in the tank, especially a potential rival of the same species.

Also I'm not surprised the 2 biggest JDs paired, that usually what happens, they pair with the strongest fish available.


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## c333davis (Apr 2, 2010)

jason_nj said:


> Once a pair forms any other fish will be in trouble in the tank, especially a potential rival of the same species.


I did find it a little surprising only because the smallest JD female and the male had produced at least one batch of fry in the past, before I inherited them from someone else.



jason_nj said:


> Also I'm not surprised the 2 biggest JDs paired, that usually what happens, they pair with the strongest fish available.


I guess it shouldn't surprise me that "survival of the fittest" trumps any biological loyalty to a prior baby-momma who happens to be smaller.


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## c333davis (Apr 2, 2010)

c333davis said:


> I'm happily anticipating eggs from the pair soon.


Eggs from my JD pair!


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## Riceburner (Sep 3, 2008)

Congrats. I've had 2 pairs of JDs spawn in the same tank...opposite ends though.


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## jegrego1 (Jan 24, 2011)




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## jegrego1 (Jan 24, 2011)




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