# Tropheus



## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

I have a 55 gal 4' tank im working on, making a 3D background, need to make a stand and hood ect and was thinking to have a mixed Tang tank
Calvus, cyps and shellies.

Latley iv been looking at Tropheus, read a lot of articles on them both on this site and others and im getting conflicting info, so i have a few questions.

1, is a 55 suitable?

2, is it ok to mix them, say kasanga with ikola

3, i havnt come across any male/female ratio info, is there a recommended ratio?

4, i realy like Calvus, are they ok with Tropheus?

5, Had aquariums in the past but very new to Cichlids, will i be in over my head with Tropheus?

Thats all for now, im sure there will be more as i go along


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

Much like you on my thread, I will be curious to see where this goes. 

I have an empty 55g right now as well and am trying to figure out what might be cool in it - and Tropheus are on the list. I used to have one in with all the misfits and I really like him - other than he was mean. If he didn't like a perticular fish, and it was only an occasional particular fish, he's go after them relentlessly. But yeah, he was cool. Kinda goofy and playful and just looked like he swam around and had fun all day lol.

opcorn:


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## camelworm (Aug 16, 2011)

dont mix them you will most likely get a hybrid and that is a big no no on that note of Tropheus my less then local fish guy told me Ad Konnings just got back from a 2 month trip to lake tang and in the whole time he was there could not find even one Tropheus and said to tell everyone you know to breed them if you have them, how true this is i don't know but the guy has been in the business for 20+ years so i tend to take his word for fact in most cases, im interested in keeping them and have read 75 is a good size tank for them, best of luck


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## brucem (Aug 12, 2009)

That's not good.

Makes you wonder where all the "wild caught" are coming from then.


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## Morpheen (Jul 21, 2010)

1. 75G should be the minimum size for keeping Trophs.
2. I wouldn't mix them, especially in a small tank.
3. Maybe 3:1 male to females minimum.
4. They shouldnt be kept together. They have different dietary needs and also the Troph's are voracious when it comes to feeding times. The Calvus probably wouldn't be able to compete.
5. You are taking the right first step in asking questions. So I would suggest doing more research first before you commit to them. They are not hard to keep but they do have specific needs.


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## camelworm (Aug 16, 2011)

it turns out what i was told is not all true Pam Chin that he was only there for a cupple weeks and that in the usual spot he looks for them he couldn't find one of the species, my bad sorry for any unnecessary confusion


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

Thanks for the replys,

So far its a no on mixing, i could live with that
No calvus  bummer but not a deal breaker
55 is too small, getting conflicting info on that
3:1 Female/Male ratio

Need to do more research, which i will, im in no hurry, want to take my time and do it right


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## Dawg2012 (May 10, 2012)

So let's say you get a bunch of Trophs... and they do good and grow to adults... What does that yield? Is it like a single species tank full of mbuna - so you have spawning, action and a little drama? Is there any type of community behavior? E.g., is there any attraction to these guys other than they look nice? I hope that's not an insulting question. I am drawn to them as I had one and liked it... I'm just wondering and really even not sure what I'm asking lol... I'm thinking maybe a tank full of a single species would get... boring... after a while.

I love your avatar though Morpheen... This may be what they're all about.


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## Nantunes (Oct 8, 2005)

fusion said:


> Thanks for the replys,
> 
> So far its a no on mixing, i could live with that


It's better to avoid mixing, however there are some species that can be mixed with minimal chances of interbreeding. It really depends on m/f ratios and tank size. Two species on the same tank may lead to one being dominant and not letting the other breed or less frequent spawns.
On a general rule,avoid mixing on small tanks. 


> No calvus  bummer but not a deal breaker


Not only the diet is different but the calvus would certainly prey on the tropheus fry. 


> 55 is too small, getting conflicting info on that


You get conflicting info because each case is different. 
I didn't knew the sizes of your tanks so i searched online and please correct me if i'm wrong but:

55 gallon is 48" x 13" x 21"
75 gallon is 48" x 18" x 21"

So 75G is just 5'' wider. Is that important? Depends on the stock and decoration. From experience, on 13'' wide you get some troubles with decoration because you end up with too little space between the decoration and the front glass. So a running fish may hurt itself on the decoration or having trouble turning around at higher speed (Ancient "rules" here in Europe say fish need 3x their body length to turn. Tropheus are in average 5" long, so they "require" 15" of free water to turn)
Bottom line is, if you stock WC fish, they are usually more aggressive so those extra 5" from the 75G will be valuable. If you want to decorate, either with rock or 3D backs you'll want those extra 5" also.
If you plan to stock with pond raised, or F1 they tend to be less aggressive, so you can house them safely on a 55G, but you'll have to use rocks/3D back with care. In the end it's just a matter on what and how you plan to house the fish.

Just my opinion though


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## TropheusFriend (May 15, 2005)

Dawg2012 said:


> E.g., is there any attraction to these guys other than they look nice? I'm just wondering and really even not sure what I'm asking lol... I'm thinking maybe a tank full of a single species would get... boring... after a while.


From personal experience with Tropheus, IMHO, they NEVER get boring  Used to have a colony of 20 Golden Kazumbas and now 20 Ikolas and 20 Duboisi in a 180g. They are constant movers; always doing SOMETHING in their water column, and feeding time is exciting! I realize some Tropheus sp. are not as colorful as other fish (like Malawis), but Trophs have SO much character!

Just my 2 cents


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## phishman (Feb 3, 2012)

You can keep 15 f1 Tropheus in a 55 gallon tank if they grow up in it as juvies. Only one group in a tank that size. The deeper 75 is a better option, but a 55 can work. I keep a group of F1 Red Ndole in a 55 at work. I kept comps once with Tropheus. They did ok, but did not like all that activity and ate all my fry. My gobies get most of my Tropheus fry now. Both ate NLS. I would mix Ikola and Red Rainbows in a 120 gallon or larger. There is a small possibility that they may cross. The Ikola would be the dominant breeders. I keep 4 groups of Tropheus. Trophs Rule!


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Must say I think Morpheen advice excellent.



Nantunes said:


> 55 gallon is 48" x 13" x 21"
> 75 gallon is 48" x 18" x 21"
> 
> So 75G is just 5'' wider. Is that important?


Yes very. It gives you just enough bottom space for two full adult dominant males to hold breeding areas.
If you are lucky and get a lucky sex mix or no problems then yep folk have managed to keep Tropheus for years in a 55g.
Not me though. It just never seems to work out. That extra 5" is very important with my groups. Even better a 100g.

Here in the UK we tend to get the choice of 48"x15"x18" or 48"x18"x18 (at far greater cost as the glass has to be thicker).
I would still recommend a 48"x18"x18" or pref a 60"x18"x18" (and not a 48"x15"x18") to anyone keeping a group of Tropheus for the first time.

All the best James


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

If you do not get two able to hold areas then you are best keeping em without any rockwork so no territories are set up or you tend to get one hyperdominant male that kills others by bullying.
Its about the only way a 55g can work. But you miss much of the enjoyment of keeping them.


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

Thanks 24Tropheus

If i did go with them, i realy like kasanga red rainbow, are they easy to find? (noticed your in UK, maby someone from US could answer this)

Also what initial stock numbers would be suitable

Iv been looking on CL for a bigger tank, dont know how id swing it past the boss


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## kazfish (Aug 1, 2012)

I have Leleupi and Calvus with Tropheus....doing fine. Not sure what diet difference is? Tropheus are definitely Veggie eaters but good Spiralina food has protein as well. What do Calvus prefer?


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

I love the Black Calvus

I did find some F1 Kasanga red rainbow but im still not ready to stock the tank yet, i just hope i can find some when i am ready


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## Backdrifts (Aug 1, 2012)

kazfish said:


> I have Leleupi and Calvus with Tropheus....doing fine. Not sure what diet difference is? Tropheus are definitely Veggie eaters but good Spiralina food has protein as well. What do Calvus prefer?


How many Trophs do you have and what size are they?


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## madsnarf (Jan 9, 2012)

phishman said:


> You can keep 15 f1 Tropheus in a 55 gallon tank if they grow up in it as juvies. Only one group in a tank that size. The deeper 75 is a better option, but a 55 can work. I keep a group of F1 Red Ndole in a 55 at work. I kept comps once with Tropheus. They did ok, but did not like all that activity and ate all my fry. My gobies get most of my Tropheus fry now. Both ate NLS. I would mix Ikola and Red Rainbows in a 120 gallon or larger. There is a small possibility that they may cross. The Ikola would be the dominant breeders. I keep 4 groups of Tropheus. Trophs Rule!


I have 16 Trophs in a 55 = no problem.


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

I think im pretty set on the Tropheus, im trying to get a bigger tank but still working on the 55 for now, making a 3D background (slowly) iv made it as thin as possible towards the bottom maby 3/4" and it gradualy gets thicker in places towards the top, ill be using some kind of sand for the substrate, just havnt decided what yet.

Few more questions

My tanks are running with a PH of 7.6 and KH of 4(drops) will i need to buffer for the Tropheus?

Im feeding my Mbuna Jungle labs flake and NLS pellets, should i go strictly sprinula?

I guess i should have some Bloat meds on hand, any suggestions?

sure ill be asking again, thanks to all for your help up to now :thumb:


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## phishman (Feb 3, 2012)

CaribSea Seaflor grade argonite will get you to 8.2. NLS cichlid or Thera A plus a veggie flake. Metro on hand for bloat.


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## Vamze (Feb 16, 2012)

fusion said:


> My tanks are running with a PH of 7.6 and KH of 4(drops) will i need to buffer for the Tropheus?


Not if you can keep your PH stable at 7.6



fusion said:


> Im feeding my Mbuna Jungle labs flake and NLS pellets, should i go strictly sprinula?


You shouldn't feed 100% spirulina powder if that's what you mean. You should feed NLS or Spirulina Flakes



fusion said:


> I guess i should have some Bloat meds on hand, any suggestions?


Never had to treat bloat myself, so I can not speak from personal experience on this one.

Best regards


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

Vamze said:


> fusion said:
> 
> 
> > My tanks are running with a PH of 7.6 and KH of 4(drops) will i need to buffer for the Tropheus?


I would for sure take your KH higher as 4 dh with a pH of 7.6 it is not going to be stable.
KH is used up as filter bacteria work.
I would take the waterchange water to at least 8 with baking soda each waterchange.
http://dataguru.org/misc/aquarium/calKH.asp (ignor the " KH should be at or above 4.5 DH / 80ppm to keep pH from becoming acidic" thats for goldfish Troph being more alkali loving still 8 being a good min)
add 1 teaspoon (5g) baking soda in 50 liters of water to raise KH by 4 dh
And maybe backup with crushed oyster shell in the filters.

I run mine at KH 14 dh (German scale).

All the best James


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

CaribSea Seaflor grade argonite does the same as oyster shell just about x10 the price. :wink:


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## fusion (Jun 21, 2012)

So i now have a 83 gal 60 x 16 x 20, do i now have more options or just a better habitat for single group?


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## phishman (Feb 3, 2012)

Put two different groups of trophs in there if you'd like. It's your tank. 12 to 15 of each.


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

For what its worth, yep kept two types in that size aquarium but always wished I had stuck to one. You get more breeding with one type, no chance of hybrids and I think more interest.
A few places have two types in the wild, maybe pick two of those? (except those that are known to cross, producing Tropheus sp. "Red Belly" etc).

All the best James


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