# My first 75!



## SomethingIsFishy

Hey guys, I'm new here but not new to fish. I just picked up a 75 for $70 that I am going to set up as a cichlid tank. The plan is to stock with yellow labs for sure (a friend has a ton of babies- too small to transfer yet...) and possibly something blue (demasoni, maingano?).

Here is a pic of the tank:









and the DIY stand:








(I am going to "skin" the stand with plywood.)

Planning on either black sand (first choice) or pool filter sand (second choice). Lots of rock. Maybe a few plastic plants, not sure... possibly a DIY 3-D background...

Any comments or suggestions welcome!

Jon


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## Iggy Newcastle

Welcome to the forum, Jon!

Sweet pickup and a nice size tank. I know you said you're not new to fish, but I'll link these fishless cycling articles, anyways...
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=239823

If you're in SE Wisconsin, look into the GCCA(Greater Chicagoland Cichlid Assoc). Here is their site: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=239823. You may be able to find what you're looking for within a reasonable distance, depending on where you live. I know there is demasoni and maingano in the classified section right now. They're also holding a swap next month right outside Chicago.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks! I do use fishless cycling, but I also appreciate the link. I have a bunch of ammonia left over from my last tank...

I will have to look into the GCCA... I am about 25ish minutes south of Milwaukee, so Chicago isn't too far...

Jon


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## sumthinfishy

welcome to forum. i like your name, but mine is a little better. lol. if you do get demasoni then i would buy at least 12.


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## SomethingIsFishy

haha I was kinda surprised that "SomethingIsFishy" wasn't taken already...

I do know demasoni are aggressive, if I do them I will get a bunch of juveniles and remove problem males as they mature...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Resealed the tank today as a precaution, and because the old silicone was green... now the hard part- waiting for it to cure! (Is it cured yet? ... how about now?) 

Got a bit of a sand dilemma... do I go with the inexpensive natural looking pool filter sand, or the more expensive black aquarium sand? I like the natural look, but wonder if the light colored sand will make the fish look "washed out". I've heard of using black sandblasting grit but have read of nasty stuff happening with it and I don't want to risk it. That means if I go black it will be a lot more expensive than PFS. If you have (or had) yellow labs over light sand do they look "washed out" to you?

Thanks!
Jon


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## GTZ

Works both ways. When I switched to black from aragonite, I noticed my fish darkened considerably.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Hmmm... I love the look of your 75 with black sand... How much sand did you use?


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## GTZ

Thanks, I don't recall exactly how much sand I used but I'd ballpark it around 60 pounds.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks GTZ!

A lot of people claim that the black sand really shows fish poop. Is this a problem in your tank?


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## GTZ

I'm using a spray bar with an FX5 which creates a lot of water movement, down the front of the glass and across the sand towards the back of the tank, so no, it doesn't get a chance to sit on the sand.


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## SomethingIsFishy

So I guess it comes down to $$. I like both looks, black and natural. Hmmm... can I justify the extra cost for black sand?


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## IanR29

Another way to make your fish pop plus it makes the tank look better is painting the back of the tank black. Still lets the fish stand out but doesn't make the tank "dark". I think you can see the contour of the pool sand better than the black (hills, craters, landscaping in general). I had black in my tang tank plus peacock tank and I personally didn't like it.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks for the input!!

I've already painted the back black. I think I am leaning towards PFS at this point... I do like both looks (watched a lot of tank videos on youtube). If the black background will make the fish "pop" I think I will save money and go PFS. Will look more natural too...

Now that I think of it an "all black" tank may be too dark anyway...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Well... I have 100 pounds of pool filter sand in my car. If I decide I don't like it I'm only out $18.


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## SomethingIsFishy

It holds water!!










(the patio is wet because it rained)


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## JP_92

Interested to see how the tank turns out! Keep the picture updates coming!


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## SomethingIsFishy

I might go rock shopping tomorrow... will post pics if I do... I am getting closer to setting this thing up!!


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## SomethingIsFishy

Couldn't find any rocks but I did get a sheet of 1/4 ply, some 1x4's, and some corner trim to finish off the stand...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Skinned the stand this morning!

Top and bottom trim on:









One side skinned:









Front:









Corner trim added:









Full shot:









And just for the fun of it a shot of my 20 long...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Need to cut out and frame the doors, paint the stand, and build the canopy. Then it's rocks, filters, cycle, and fish!!


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## JP_92

Great work. That 20 long looks really nice!


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks!!


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## Iggy Newcastle

Wish I had tools and the know how. Well done.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Don't really have much for woodworking tools... just a small "crosscut" saw, a small miter box, a cordless drill, and a power chop saw. The skinning was done entirely with hand tools... Building stuff has always been fun for me, just comes naturally I guess...


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## R6RaVeN37

The stand looks good, nice job! Keep the pics and updates comming. Im on the last and longest part of my "build" on my 150 gal.....the dreaded cycle


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## SomethingIsFishy

Oooh, cycling... the waiting game...


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## SomethingIsFishy

So here's a stocking question for the 75. I was wandering around a big box pet store last night while my wife was shopping and saw some synodontis eupterus that I thought were cool. I have always loved catfish...

I did some quick research online and it seems some have been able to keep them with african cichlids, but it also appears that they are more of a tanganyika fish. Would they (or another syno.) work with yellow labs in a 75 or is that a bad idea?


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## Michael_S

I use synodontis eupterus with my mbuna and they get along great. I got mine a few months back when they were around 1.5-2in, but since they have grown to close to 3in. Some people have told me they can get to big, but I don't plan on replacing mine until they do. I suggest getting some syno. multipunctata


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks... those multipunctata look interesting too! Anyone have longterm experience with them and yellow labs?


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## Iggy Newcastle

It's common to stock synos with mbuna.

Look into synodontis lucipinnis(dwarf petricola). Stay small and will school if you buy several. Get 6 of them.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Going rock shopping tonite after work... will post pics...


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## Kanorin

SomethingIsFishy said:


> Thanks... those multipunctata look interesting too! Anyone have longterm experience with them and yellow labs?


Yes they are fine with Yellow labs. As Iggy says - the Lucipinnis are probably more appropriately sized for a 75 gal tank.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks!! Will keep my eyes open for the luci's...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Landscape shop closes at 5, bummer. Did get more work done on the stand, pics soon...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Doors cut out and first coat of paint on the front:









Glueing up a door:









Door sitting in place with hardware mocked up:









Need more 1x3 to finish the other door and then all the stand needs is paint...


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## SomethingIsFishy

My awesome wife went to the landscape shop to get rocks for me (I am at work). We will see what is waiting for me when I get home...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Set up a quick scape just to see what I have and if my wife got enough rock:



























I am open to criticizm of the scape. I do have more rock to play with:









And I made a little progress on the stand:


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## SomethingIsFishy




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## amcvettec

It's looking good. If you are stocking Mbuna, I would recommend stacking your rock higher.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks! I will be stocking yellow labs and possibly syno. lucipinnis.

I will make the stacks higher, and I may try to make two seperate stacks, one on each end of the tank...


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## SomethingIsFishy

First "real" try with rock stacking:




































I like it!


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## Michael_S

Lookin' good!


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## SomethingIsFishy

Sand and water are in!!


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## Woundedyak

Nice work! I like the color of the rocks.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks!

I added a few more rocks on the left:








I thought the top of the pile looked a little too "level". I like this better.

I picked up an aquaclear 110 today so the cycle will be started tonite...

Question: how big should yellow labs be before they are transported? I am getting my labs from friends about 1/2 hour drive away who are raising fry. I am hoping they will be big enough by the time my cycle is done...


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## TheJ0kerrr

This is how big I got mine from a breeder a little over a year ago... So don't worry, basically, as soon as they can swim decently, you can take them home. Some will prefer them to be at least 1.5 to 2 inches though...Just make sure you acclimate them properly before tossing them in.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks! They should be more than big enough by the time my cycle is complete (started the cycle today btw). I cut the sponge in the AC 110 down and added 780 grams of ceramic media on top of the biomax that came with the filter...

I am planning on drip-acclimating the stock, so we shouldn't have any issues there...


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## SomethingIsFishy

How many yellow labs should I stock? I have decided to do just the labs (unless I can find syno. lucipinnis). Would a dozen be good? Too many?


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## NJmomie

SomethingIsFishy said:


> Thanks!
> 
> I added a few more rocks on the left:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I thought the top of the pile looked a little too "level". I like this better....


I like the updated version of your rockscape. My suggestion is to make one pile even higher and have it a little more haphazard instead of symmetrical lengthwise. I would push one side towards the front of the tank a little more and the other to the back and make the rock line slanted (instead of straight) if you look at the pile from the top down. I hope I am not rambling....just my opinion.


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## Iggy Newcastle

If you're just going to do just labidochromis, then buy 20-25. You can add the cats later on without having an impact on your mbuna stock numbers.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Will be picking up 25 fish as soon as the tank is cycled.

Should I expect some fish to be "rejected" by the "community"?


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## Iggy Newcastle

Most likely. If you're buying fish at 1.5" it could take some time. Any fish that are forced to hide up in the top corners or behind equipment are stressed and should be removed. Or the aggressor could be removed.

If you're going species only, I would suggest looking into a sexually dimorphic mbuna. Pseudotropheus saulosi is a perfect candidate. This will give the 'illusion' that you have two different kinds of fish in your tank.

A stunning example of a saulosi tank:


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks but I'm set on the labs. A friend has a ton of juveniles that I can get super cheap, I really like the fish, and I am fine with a "monochromatic" tank.

Added an "instant cycle" product last night as an experiment to see if it actually works. Tested this morning and ammonia has dropped from 2ppm to 1ppm. Nitrite is still at 0ppm and there appears to be the slightest trace of nitrates. Will test again after work. I won't be doing any water changes until I add fish, and will dose ammonia when it hits zero like a regular fishless cycle, so we will see if it cycles faster than without the bacteria supplement...


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## Iggy Newcastle

Good luck. Any nitrate reading you have will be inaccurate when there's nitrite present. What product did you use?


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## IanR29

Sounds like you have an idea and a plan of wh t you want. If you were here in as I'd bring you some white top haras if you wanted some. My wild caught group is at it again and 1 of the females is holding.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Iggy: wasn't sure if I could post the brand name... it's a very popular one...

The only reading I care about right now is ammonia. Once it drops to zero I will re-dose and watch for ites/ates. I just posted all the readings for information's sake...

Ian: thanks for the offer...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Update: ammonia continues to fall and I am now starting to get nitrites! Adding the supplement definitely speed things up, I added ammonia for the first time one week ago and I've already got nitrites... Yay!!


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## Zoolander

Tank looks awesome. Labs are a great fish to keep. Will look awesome at the beginning of 2014 when they start to mature. Keep the pics coming, especially when you finish cycling!


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## SomethingIsFishy

Here's a pic for you:









Ammonia-Nitrites-Nitrates

That was last night. Ammonia was almost 0 this morning!


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## SomethingIsFishy

Was thinking about getting some of the nicer silk plants for some color. What do you think? Are there any plants in lake Malawi, or is it just algae, rocks, and sand?


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## SomethingIsFishy

Processing ammonia nicely, just waiting for nitrites to drop...............


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## SomethingIsFishy

Nitrites are starting to drop!!! Almost there...


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## Iggy Newcastle

Sounds good.

As far as those plants go, you could add some. Others on the site here do some live plants with mbuna, like anubias and java fern. If you're going for a natural look at Lions Cove, just rocks would be perfect.


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## SomethingIsFishy

I'm still on the fence with the plants. If I add the syno's it's not gonna be 100% "biotope" anyway, so that's not really a concern. Just not sure if I would like the look...

Don't really want to go through the balancing act of live plants... the only one I was able to get to work was my HEAVILY planted shrimp tank. Everything else just ends up being an algae farm... don't feel like going there with this tank...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Should be able to pick up the fish some time this week!!! Will keep dosing ammonia until I can get the fish and do a HUGE water change before stocking (nitrates are super high).

Yay!!!!!!


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## jimmie

My opinion., no plants, kept it natural, algae an rocks..mbunas going to eat those plants


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks for the input Jimmie! I think I will skip the plants for now at least...

Just went to get the glass for the lid during my lunch break. Glass ordered, and picked up a standard 20 gallon tank for free (sitting on the side of the road)! Perfect QT/Fry/Timeout tank!


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## jimmie

Hahaha I hear ya,


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## SomethingIsFishy

Fish are in!!! Got at least 20... (they won't stay still for me to count them). Drip-acclimated them in and they never even lost their colors. Gonna be a while before I can get the syno's though... these labs are tiny!

Will get pics up tomorrow, Monday at the latest...


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## Cichlidman14

Can't wait to see, hope the fish enjoy their new home.


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## K5MOW

Welcome to the forum. I also have a 75 gallon.

Roger


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks! Fish seem happy in their new home! :fish:


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## SomethingIsFishy

Quick shot before I turned the lights on...









stand by for video...


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## SomethingIsFishy




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## SomethingIsFishy




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## Iggy Newcastle

Nice. Good luck with them.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks! These guys are so fun to watch! Would be interesting if they stayed this small... I kinda like the tiny fish in a big tank look...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Started building the canopy:


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## k7gixxerguy

oops, I didnt see the multiple pages and commented on the amount of sand to use. Quick idiot edit, lol


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## SomethingIsFishy

And here it is with the canopy:


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## SomethingIsFishy

Lost a few of the smaller fish, but the bigger ones are doing great. There were two different spawns in the group, I expected to lose a few of the smaller ones to the move when I saw how small they were.

The group is doing well. They already are "food trained"- they come over to me (or my wife) anytime we go near the tank! FYI I am feeding Omega One cichlid flakes crushed up. They love them!

I also resealed my 20 gallon QT tank. When that is cured I may start looking into juvie s. lucipinnis...


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## Iggy Newcastle

Your tank looks great. Nice job on the canopy.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks! I love the way it turned out...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Well I kept going back and forth on adding artificial plants... I knew I wouldn't be satisfied until I saw how they looked in the tank... So I bought some nicer ones. Here is how it looks:










I like it!


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## Michael_S

I am not a fan of artificial plants, but that does add a nice contrast.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Here's a new video:


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## Iggy Newcastle

Looks real good. The fake plants do add some nice color.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks! I am not a huge fan of plastics, but I think they stand a better chance of surviving the cichlids... and I really don't think these ones look bad at all... and (most importantly since this tank is in the living room) my wife likes them...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Syno. question: stopped in at an LFS that I don't go to as often and discovered that they usually have syno. petricola in stock. Will a group of these work in this tank? Checked "planet catfish" and they list the petricola at 5", and lucipinnis at 3.9". They don't have a listing for dwarf petricola... Your thoughts?

Thanks!


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## Iggy Newcastle

Dwarf petricola is the lucipinnis. True petricola are very rare, so I've heard. I'm sure what your LFS has are lucipinnis.


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## SomethingIsFishy

I thought that was the case for the dwarf petricola, thanks for confirming that.

The syno's at the lfs could very well be luci's. Just to play "devil's advocate", if they are in fact true petricola, will they fit in my tank? I would think 1" longer wouldn't make much difference...


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## Iggy Newcastle

You'd be fine and you only have the one species of mbuna. How much are they selling the cats for?


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## SomethingIsFishy

Can't remember the individual price, but they had a 3 for $75 deal (most of the fish have a similar "3 for" discount). I could find them cheaper online, but depending on shipping it could end up being the same or more to order online (didn't get actual shipping quotes, just guesstimating). I have never ordered fish online, not necessarily opposed to it, but I do like seeing the fish before buying, and I like to support the local shops if possible.

Your thoughts?

Edit: their prices do seem to run a little higher than other shops, but their fish also tend to look a little nicer...


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## Iggy Newcastle

Well you're not terribly far from the GCCA swap meets in Hillside, IL. There's one in February if you can hold off til then. At the last one I saw groups of 6 lucipinnis for $20 for 2 inchers. Larger ones available as well. Or hit up the classified section on GCCA.net. You can probably get some way earlier.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Hmm... one ad on gcca. 1" fish, $4 ea. Tempting... but my wife will probably be mad if I get them before Christmas. $24 is a lot better than $150 though... hmm... gotta run that one by her...

Thanks!


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## Iggy Newcastle

Happy hunting... And good luck with convincing.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks! She has technically already ok'ed the cats... it's just the timing...


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## SomethingIsFishy

E-mailed the guy... he sent a few pics, the fish look good. Texted my wife, waiting for her response...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Got the OK from the boss!! Will post pics when I get the new guys home and into QT...


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## Iggy Newcastle

Nice. Getting from someone on the GCCA is almost a guarantee that they have bred the fish. So no LFS nonsense.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Yup... parents are wild caught.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Oh yeah... by the way... Thanks for pointing me towards the gcca!!!!! :thumb: :thumb:


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## Iggy Newcastle

You're welcome! When you're ready to do another mbuna species, you'll know where to look first.


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## SomethingIsFishy

Yup!!


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## SomethingIsFishy

Got the cats!!! Ended up being $5, not $4, per fish; but I wasn't complaining... they are being drip-acclimated into the QT tank right now!! I will post pics in the next day or two...


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## SomethingIsFishy

SynoPics, round 1:





































Stand by for round 2...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Round 2:




























And one with the flash:









uploading a quick video...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Here's the video:


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## Iggy Newcastle

They look good!


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## SomethingIsFishy

Thanks!! Can't wait to get them into the main tank...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Cats are in! They looked good after 2 weeks in QT, (and I needed the QT tank for a brichardi from my 20 long who decided to be a bully) so I transferred them into the 75. They are settling in nicely! I will try to get some video up in the next couple days...


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## SomethingIsFishy

Forgot to post the video... oops!

Here it is:


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## SomethingIsFishy

Here's another video:


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## Iggy Newcastle

Tank looks great! Glad the cats are working out for you.


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## SomethingIsFishy

This thread needs an update... Tank is doing great! I think I have about 20 labs (so hard to count... they keep moving...) and I catch a glimpse of all six cats every once in a while...

Here's another video:


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