# HELP my diy canopy is 1/8" to small! can i remove top b



## sangi1a (Jan 11, 2009)

can some one please help me.

i recently took a woodshop class and i made a diy canopy for my 75 gallon tank. the canopy looks amazing but my problem is that i didn't account for the the top plastic brace (STUPID!!) 

i made it deep enough so i can leave the middle, front, and back braces on.

does anyone know if you need the brace? i only need to take the side off.

my tank is a standard 75 gallon.


----------



## BillD (May 17, 2005)

Does the canopy sit on top of the tank trim? If it does you could probably add decorative molding to go over the trim.


----------



## sangi1a (Jan 11, 2009)

yes, right now it sits on top. but if i add decorative molding it will look weird and be "too far out" from the tank.


----------



## projectpat (Dec 24, 2009)

what if you get really thin wood and have it run the entire sides of the canopy covering your canopy and the trim? that would hold it in place and would not be very thick. I know home depot sells large sheets for like $6 or $7 and theyll cut it to the right size for you.


----------



## justinf67 (Jul 19, 2009)

do not take off the brace on the tank, as it provides structural integrity to the tank. I dont see why you dont flip it over and trim the inner portion down an 1/8''. Thats what I would do


----------



## SoDakJeep (Mar 21, 2009)

Best bet is to get some sandpaper and cut your losses. You should be able to sand 1/8 in out no problem. Just get some ruff sandpaper and go to town. Post some pics when your done I would like to see this?


----------



## sangi1a (Jan 11, 2009)

i will try sanding, hope it works out. but if it doesn't i will just put thin sheets of wood around it.


----------



## newfisher (Dec 20, 2008)

An 1/8" is a long way to sand! If I understand your problem correctly, perhaps trimming a bit off with a router would be a better option? But it's hard to say for sure without seeing it. Why not post some pics BEFORE you start at it? That way it might be easier for someone to guide you in the right direction.


----------



## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

newfisher said:


> An 1/8" is a long way to sand! If I understand your problem correctly, perhaps trimming a bit off with a router would be a better option?


A router would make quick work of this problem but is not a tool that someone who just took a basic woodworking class should be using. They are not forgiving and do not leave anything that can be sewed back on in the event of a careless mistake.

Good luck with your project.


----------



## newfisher (Dec 20, 2008)

Agreed. That's why I suggested posting pics before doing anything.


----------



## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

Is he thinking of just peeling off the ends of the plastic frame on the outside of the tank, leaving the top and inside of the frame in place? Without a pic or drawing and the terminology being ambiguous, I am not sure that's it, but it sounds like there are lots more braces on his tank than I've seen, unless he is calling every part of the frame a brace.

I've had chunks of the top and bottom frames chip, rip, and fall off old tanks without any effects other than ugliness. As long as the cross braces are not counting on those missing parts for support, nothng happens, and the outside left and right part of the frame is as far from the center brace as you can get. Still sanding or planing, or rasping out the wood seems less likely to nastify anything.

Sanding an eighth inch is not so bad, with a power sander. Unless you have to shell out $300 for a new cool sander like the one below. In that case a scrap cut off from a board as a sanding block looks ingenious.

http://www.buenatool.com/estore/product ... ctid=16879


----------



## alfadog (Dec 18, 2009)

without any pic. its hard to give you correct advise. but if you are going to sand it. remember that you can sand 1/16" off the back and the front to get to your 1/8"


----------



## Dutch Dude (Sep 14, 2006)

imo your problem is a bit larger. If you sand down the 1/8 inch the canopy will barely fit. When you fill the tank the silicone will stretch slightly making the top of the tank slightly wider compared to the botom (becouse of the water pressure). When wood becomes warm (lighting and temperature from the water) and moist (evaporated water) it will expend. If the canopy tightly fits there will be no room for expansion of the wood cousing pressure on the top part of your tank with the risk of cracking.

I made a wood canopies for 3 of my tanks. I put lids on the tank to reduce moisture and put a small computer ventilator in the canopy to reduce the temperature and moist. I pained it with Polyurethane reinforced acrylic paint. I left a space between the top of the tank and the canopy of around 1/10 inch. In case of the 75 gallon the tank is 40 inch long, the inside dimension of the hood is 40 1/5 inch. The tank is 16 inch wide and the inside dimensions of the hood is 16 1/5. This allows the tank to expand during filling but more important the canopy to expand coused by moist and temperature.

Never ever remove enforcements of the tank!


----------



## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

alfadog said:


> without any pic. its hard to give you correct advise. but if you are going to sand it. remember that you can sand 1/16" off the back and the front to get to your 1/8"


 I think he was saying the back and front already fit. It is the ends that are tight.


----------



## newfisher (Dec 20, 2008)

We need pics. Otherwise it's only speculation and ill advise.


----------



## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

newfisher said:


> We need pics. Otherwise it's only speculation and ill advise.


 Maybe not. If you allow for him calling the plastic top frame a top brace, it seems pretty clear sanding the insides of the canopy ends should do the trick. Pictures don't always tell the story either.


----------



## alfadog (Dec 18, 2009)

*Mcdaphnia wrote: *I think he was saying the back and front already fit. It is the ends that are tight
thats even better. cause the ends are a lot shorter.... less sanding. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## sangi1a (Jan 11, 2009)

sorry for the confusion i can't get pics right now but ill make a drawing for better understanding. the part in the red is the part i was thinking of removing(the right and left sides of the trim).

http://i940.photobucket.com/albums/ad24 ... nktrim.jpg

i wont have a problem with expanding because the tank is already up and running.


----------



## sangi1a (Jan 11, 2009)

i dont have any fancy tools, i have to sand by hand. what type of grit of sand papper should i use?


----------



## Mcdaphnia (Dec 16, 2003)

sangi1a said:


> i dont have any fancy tools, i have to sand by hand. what type of grit of sand papper should i use?


 Start out with coarse, then go to medium and then to fine. Balance the canopy on top and mark it so you have a guide when you sand. Sand a little past the marks so you have a little play.


----------



## newfisher (Dec 20, 2008)

Your sketch was a bit small, but I think I understand the situation. Correct me if I'm wrong: you want the canopy sides to overlap the exterior of the top frame of the tank, as opposed to sitting on top of it, and you have cleats installed inside the canopy either front and back and/or on the sides that rest on the top of the tank frame?

I'm hoping that if you've built the canopy using solid lumber that the grain is running horizontally? If yes, or if the canopy was build using plywood, then you should probably aim for about 1/16" clearance between the tank frame and all 4 sides of the canopy to allow for minor dimensional changes in canopy material. If you've used solid lumber and have the grain running up and down, don't use the canopy at all, as in time it's dimensions will change too drastically regardless of whether or not it currently fits.

Assuming the use of plywood or horizontal grain, and assuming also that the side panels are thick enough to remove material, it would appear that you need to remove ~3/16" from each side panel. Believe me, that is not a job for sandpaper of any kind, with or without power tools. If you have a cleat in place, it will never go on right again after sanding. The corners will not be right (you simply cannot get sandpaper in there close enough). And the job will end up looking very amateur and rough.

My $0.02: don't sand! Sanding will only ruin your project.

What you want to do is to cut away material to create what's called a rabet. You do not want to sand it or wear it away. A rabet need to be cut.

I had mentioned a router earlier. That really is the tool you need, but do not attempt that free-hand! If you can get hold of a router, you'll want to clamp support material to the canopy to prevent the router rocking side to side, and guides of sorts attached either to the canopy or to the router to make certain your cut goes where you want it. Routers are unforgiving. And you'd still need to chisel out the corners.

A great tool for your situation might be a bull-nose plane. Here's an example:
http://www.veritastools.com/products/Page.aspx?p=114

I have one and find it's the best tool for cutting rabets in tight spots and inside frames, but it not an inexpensive tool!

An alternative might be to pare material away with a chisel using small boards clamped to the outside of the canopy side as a guide. This would be easier to do in solid lumber than in plywood.

The chisel must be very sharp (i.e. sharp enough to shave hair of your arm) to get the job done right and to avoid injury. Chisels off the store shelf are never sharp enough. So if you plan to do any amount of woodworking in the future, invest in a decent chisel and a couple of honing stones. Google for instructions on how to properly tune your chisel and how to properly sharpen. Read, practice, take your time sharpenign, and you'll get it.

As for the chisel guide, clamp a board that is maybe 4" to 5" wide and at least as long as the canopy side. Then clamp a second narrower (~2") piece of wood of same length and whose thickness matches the desired finished thickness of the canopy side, to the first clamped-on board. To use, lay the chisel flat on the second piece as a guide, always with the chisel bevel facing up. Be very patient and slide the chisel along the cut in a shearing action as you gently push it into the canopy side, chipping already-cut material away as you go.

Note that before starting with the chisel, use a sharp utility knife and a straight edge to score as deep a line as possible (depth in the end = amount of material you want to remove) where you want material removal to stop up the canopy side (i.e. at the cleat level). If there's a cleat in place, then simply use the cleat as straight edge. You don't have to score to full depth all at once. You can score, remove material with the chisel up the the score line, score again deeper, chisel again, etc.

You can also use the chisel as scoring tool, once you become more experienced with the chisel. When scoring with a chisel, generally always keep the back (flat side) of the chisel flush with the straight edge (i.e. keep the chisel bevel facing the material to be removed).

When done, you should end up with a rabet cut that is straight from corner to corner and from the bottom of the canopy up to the score line, with a new surface that is parallel to the old one and to the exterior of the canopy. This should take same or less time than sanding, and will result in a much superior job.

Don't hesitate to PM if you have further questions, and Good luck.


----------



## newfisher (Dec 20, 2008)

P.S. Forgot to mention, a 3/4" wide paring chisel should do the job and would be a required size for any set, should you choose to do woodworking in future. A good one can be bought for ~$15 ... don't bother buying a set unless you think you'll need all sizes for other work. For example, Marples chisels are decent for general use and inexpensive.

While I generally prefer to sharpen to 8000x, a 1000x/4000x combination water stone should work fine and can be had for ~$40.
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.a ... 43071&ap=1

If used properly, a water stone should last you many years.


----------



## sangi1a (Jan 11, 2009)

wow, thanks for all the advice. i can easily get a hold of the hand planer. ill try that first.


----------



## newfisher (Dec 20, 2008)

If you can shoot it the full length of the side (take the canopy apart?) then a bench plane should be able to get you through most of it. But a standard bench plane may not get you tight into the corners of the rabbet because bench plane blades do not extend the full width of the plane's body. A shoulder plane is best for that, as the blade in it extends to the full width (slightly beyond, in fact) of the plane body. See:
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.a ... 41192&ap=1

With a bench plane, be prepared to used use a chisel to finish corners. Alternatively, you can always take the bench plane iron out and use it as a chisel (not kosher, but will work in a pinch), as I've described earlier. But the "handle" on a plane iron (oops, there is none) is just not as comfortable as on a chisel. :wink:

Regardless of the tools you use, remember to keep'm sharp. Also, try avoiding using cutting tools after sandpaper has touched the work piece, as any grit left behind (there ultimately always is) will dull the tool rapidly. I've never forgotten one of my apprenticeship instructor's favourite sayings (in his rich/thick Swedish accent): "the only thing worse than a dull tool is the dull tool behind it!"

Take your time, work cautiously and Good luck. :thumb:


----------



## Guest (May 14, 2010)

Any type of hand work will be extremely labor intensive and will not be symetrical. It will not give you the type of result that will be in keeping with the quality you have already invested. You can rent a commercial grade router from wood working businesses or a Home Depot type store. The key is to get the proper router bit. The type you want has a roller at the bottom of the bit that limits the depth into the wood the blade goes. Then you limit the height the bit goes by adjusting the length of bit sticking out of the router. You can use a router table and move the piece rather than the router to keep things square. This will be much faster and truer than any hand driven solution. If you handled the making of the canopy you can handle this type of solution.


----------



## newfisher (Dec 20, 2008)

A rabbeting bit with the right size pilot bearing would work, but they're $30 to $45 to buy, plus router rental costs, and let's not forget that sangi1a is only just learning woodworking. Proper support for the router would be necessary whilst one slip of the router (even with a pilot bit) could ruin the project altogether. And would sangi1a have any use for the rabbet bit afterwards ... probably not?

I totally disagree that doing it by hand would give inferior results. I could work through this repair with a bull-nose plane in less time than it would take to set up a router, and the final quality would be better (not bit marks or burning). Doing it as I had described earlier would without doubt take sangi1a a bit more time to do than someone who is experienced with a router, but: 1) what's the rush, 2) why take the risk of ruining the job by having a router slip during first-time use, and 3) what's wrong with sangi1a taking the opportunity to learn proper, basic hand-working skills? Patience and care will get the job done!


----------

