# Mayhem in my tank



## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

Really weird things going on.

It all started with my three Aceis. they started to show bite marks on their skin. Now two of them look like they are definately in some kind of disease, looks like ich. white spots on their skin, etc.

but the weird part is that none of my aceis have died. Instead, i have lost two of my very healthy zebras. Everydy i check the tank because i think my Aceis have croaked, but its other fish that are dying. i find them at the bottom, stiff, and darkened.

what the heck is going on? this tank was established, but i recently did a move. i did a water change today too. amm, nitratees, are normal. really baffled.


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

also, my aceis are tiny, like 3 inches tops.

i lost my kng of the tank Cobalt, he was a monster abuot 4-5 inches.

i also lost a nice hap that was showing no signs of bad health.

neither of these fish were in any fights, etc. they seemed to just croak over night.


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## Robin (Sep 18, 2002)

Hi,

well when fish 'croak over night' its quite often because of aggression from an other fish. Were they eating and swimming normally the day before they died? Most diseases have a progression of symptoms that eventually lead up to death. Aggression from another fish is quick and often symptom free.

Other things that will kill fish fast without time for much in the way of symptoms are Columnaris--a bacterial infection and also a toxin in the water. Usually with a toxin in the water you'll see all fish showing distress of some kind.

Columnaris usually shows as patchy white, often fuzzy areas on the fish's body that erode into open sores. Depending on the strain Columnaris can kill a fish in a few hours or a week. It can be internal in which case you might not see any outward signs of it.

We could use some more information about your tank. What size is it, how many and what species of fish? How often do you normally do water changes and how much water do you remove? Have you tested for ammonia?

Robin


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

THATS EXACTLY what it is!!

about half my fish are showing signs of stress. they have fleshy spots on their skin and they sit around lifeless at the bottom of the tank now.

how do i solve this!


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## Robin (Sep 18, 2002)

If it is Columnaris then this is the treatment:

>Do a 40% partial water change using a good declorinator. 
>Slowly turn the heat down to 76
>Add aquarium salt at the rate of 1 tablespoon per five gallons. Dissolve it first and add it gradually over several hours time
>Increase water movement in the tank, if possible
>Treat the tank with one of the following treatments: 
Maracyn and Maracyn-two, used together
Kanamycn
Furan 2

It's impossible to know for certain if this is in fact Columnaris without actually looking at a sample under a microscope and since we can't do that it would help to have more information from you about the fish, tank and water parameters, but if you feel confident that it is Columnaris from everything I've told you then you should treat right away.

Good luck with it. Please post back with any additional questions or concerns. 

Robin


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

Well, *** lost 7 fish in the last 24 hours.

I dosed the tank heavily with salt for a few hours, then i did a 70% water change and dosed it moderately with salt.

i havent added any treatments yet.

the water looks kinda cloudyish and theres weird white things (very hard to see) clinging to the glass.


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## Robin (Sep 18, 2002)

There's an article in this forum's library section under Health 
on Columnaris and in it the author gives some very specific intructions on treating Columnaris with SALT BATHs. I don't know how much salt you used when you dosed 'heavily' and 'moderately' but if you want to try to beat this with salt you really need to be dosing correctly. Check out the article.

If you want to treat it with meds then I would go with one of the medications I suggested and also follow the other directions I gave you. Adding salt at 1 tablespoon per five gallons is only going to help prevent the bacteria from adherring to the fish's skin. You can't expect it to cure the fish of Columnaris as such a low dosage.

Cloudy water may indicate an ammonia spike so test the water for ammonia asap.

Sorry for the loss of your fish. I'll just repeat what I said above that having more information from you about the tank may help to figure this out. From the little you've told me it sounds like it _could be Columnaris _but I can't be sure.

Robin


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

yea i have been reading that article over and over.

I lost two more today, its really weird which fish this hits. I lost a yellow lab that i knew would lose because he was idle all day, by Kenyi was looking extremely healthy yesterday, even chasing around other fish.

today, he was a stiff at the bottom.

i gave him a salt dip but it was no good.

Out of my original stock of 18 fish, i only have 6 left.

Im going to the store right now to look for disease treatment.


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

Ammonia was .25 ppm i dosed with a little ammolock. my remaining 6 are healthy looking, no abrasions on their skin.

my big daddy Cobalt still looks good, and theres a few yellow labs that are still left.

cant believe i lost so many fish so quick. If i would have only know what was happening 4 or 5 days ago, when my Aceis started showing signs of slime coast deterioration. at first i thought it was ich, but at how fast these fish are dying, its DEFINATELY columnaris.


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

My Cobalt, Venustus, Socolofi, and a baby yellow lab are all that remains!

i dosed the tank today with Furan 2, it says to wait another 24 hours before next dose.

My last four guys arent looking the greatest, they are kinda just sitting around, im crossing my fingers that i dont lose anymore.


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## Robin (Sep 18, 2002)

Is there anything on their skin? Patchy/fuzzy areas? Since you had an ammonia reading there's a chance that you are also dealing with ammonia and or nitrite poisoning. Make sure you're using a declorinator that detoxifies nitrite and removes ammonia. (Amquel Plus and Prime are two of the better ones for this)
Do the fish seem to perk up at all directly after a water change? Is there a good strong flow coming out of the filter return?

Sorry you've lost more fish. Hang in there.

Robin


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

well the good news is that the FURAN 2 worked perfectly. after two doses my five remaining fish look very healthy, they are darting around grabbing food, etc.

im gonna change out the water and see what happens.

i dont think its my ammo/nitrates because i took several readings and it shows steady levels for all. i will probably switch my declorator though, i currently use stress coat from API.


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## Robin (Sep 18, 2002)

Glad to hear the remaining fish are doing well. 


> i dont think its my ammo/nitrates because i took several readings and it shows steady levels for all. i will probably switch my declorator though, i currently use stress coat from API.


'steady levels' isn't necessarily a good thing when it comes to ammonia and nitrite. Both need to be 0 Ammonia and nitrite can outright kill your fish or cause them internal injury which leaves them more suscepitble to disease. 
StressCoat may not neutralize chloramines in your tap water so upgrading your declorinator is a wise idea. There's a good article on declorinators linked below if you're interested.

What species of fish do you have remaining?

Robin


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

WOW. so i discontinued FURAN treatment because my fish were looking perky and good to go. I do a 70% water change add a new filter and within 2 days my bid daddy cobalt blue is dead. Actually hes still somewhat alive but im pretty sure *** lost him. He is upside down and i have him in the hospital tank under a salt dip.

Im wondering if your diagnosis aboiut the declorinator is true. But i have two other tanks and they are fine. I have a ten gallon with baby cichlids that is not affected at all.

Im tempted to remove my last few fish into the hospital tank, then just drain and let the main tank dry out for a month.

WHat should i do?? How can i sterilize my tank and kill this virus?


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## khaki (Jan 12, 2008)

IMO since you only have a couple of fish left. You should start out clean (over)


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## Robin (Sep 18, 2002)

Well if your tap water is heavily treated with chloramines and you're using a declorinator that does not neutralize chloramines then the larger the water change the more stressful the untreated chloramines would be to your fish. So this might explain why the fish in other tanks are okay since you're not doing huge water changes in their tanks. So that's one possibility. . .

Also: did you stop the Furan treatment before it was finished? Unless the fish are having a reaction to the medicine itself then it's never a good idea to cut the treatment short.

How were all the fish in the 24 hours AFTER the 70% water change? 
Did you remove the old filter when you added the new? 
How are the rest of the fish? 
What symptoms is the cobalt having? 
What species of fish remain? 
Besides the StressCoat is there anything else you add to the tank?

Robin


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## Regulatorocks (May 10, 2007)

OK here is the update.

The Cobalt is still alive!!! But he looks VERY bad. he is in the hospital tank now and he is developing red spots and rash looking things on his skin. he doesnt look that concious, half the time i think hes dead, and when i go to net him out, he suddenly awakes and swims sideways to another resting point. this has been going on for 36 hours, he is somehow hanging on but barely.

On the other hand, the 3 remaining fish in my main tank are doing fine. I have a tiny baby lab, a venustus, and a socolofi that just wont quit. they are eating acting like normal fish.

i wonder how much longer my cobalt has, i dont know what else to do with him. part of me wnats to put him out of his misery.


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