# don't know who to listen to...



## frank testagrose (Sep 22, 2010)

what in your opinion is the best water conditioner to use after a 2o% routine water change. i have been using amquel plus but my LFS said i should not use that and that i should use stress coat. he said the amquel is too powerful and doesn't give the fish the slime coat they need. *** been doing 20% water changes and adding 2 capfuls of the amquel plus and thats it. My tank has been set up now for 5 weeks, i havent vacuumed the gravel yet and my cycle completed at 3 weeks, how much longer should i wait to do a full gravel vacuum, should i gravel vacuum every month or is that too much..i have 13 assorted africans(peacocks,labs,pleco,) in a 75 gallon with two fluval 405's on it.i dont want to overdo the maintenance and i keep hearing different things, one guy told me to vacuum my gravel every 6 months(that doesnt sound like enough).whats a good schedule between gravel vaccuming, filter breakdown and cleaning and such??Thanks for the replies in advance i am new to cichlid keeping and want to know the right way to keep them.


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## LordDracula (Aug 4, 2010)

Let me guess the Stress Coat product is more expensive compared to Amquel.....

In my opinion, you do not need any stress coat protection, unless you're fish are stressed, injured or been transported, but that's just my opinion. :wink:


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## Number6 (Mar 13, 2003)

*frank testagrose*
I will sell you the stresscoat for cheap, as well as a bridge, and some anti-tiger amulets. I wear my anti-tiger amulet every day and no tiger has ever shown up here in Tampa, florida! 
:lol:

Your tank routine sounds like it's a good one. Monthly gravel vacuuming should be good. Don't change it based on the poor advice from the LFS. :thumb:


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

I personally think Stress coat is junk.  Aloe vera for fish? Really? Your fish produce their own slime coat, and I guarantee you there's no aloe in it.

A potential problem with Amquel is that it does not bind heavy metals, which some other products do. But I can't imagine what he's thinking saying it's too powerful. What does he think it does? Bind ammonia too well? Sodium hydroxymethanesulfonate is the main ingredient in many of these products, all of which have been in use for a very long time.

I have used Prime or Chlor-AmX (precursor to Amquel) with sensitive Tanganyikan cichlids and their fry for years. They are both high quality products that are affordable for doing frequent, large water changes (50% weekly) on my many tanks. I barely measure when I use it, and I know that they are both safe at several times the recommended dose concentration.

As far as tank maintenance, watch your nitrate concentration to tell you if you are doing what's right for your tank. My goal is to keep nitrate at less than 20 ppm between water changes. That said, if you are not overfeeding and doing weekly water changes (bigger is better), once a month for a good gravel vacuum should be sufficient. If you see your nitrates creeping too high, vacuum more frequently. A good routine might be for you to start at 50% WC every other week- cleaning one of the Fluvals each time (never both the same week). Doing 50% every other week ends up being much more efficient than weekly at 20%. But again- your nitrate concentration will be the best guide for determining your routine.


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## frank testagrose (Sep 22, 2010)

THANKS FOR REPLIES...i'm currently housinG in the 75:
2 H. MOORI
1 TROPEOUS DUBOISI
2 YELLOW LABS(THAT SEEM TO NOT LIKE EACH OTHER)
2 ELECTRIC BLUES
1 ROBERTI
1 PEACOCK GOLD 
1 PLECO
1 DWARF BLUE ZEBRA
ALL MALES, WHAT WOULD YOU CONSIDER AS I WANT TO ADD MORE TANK MATES, I WAS THINKING A SIDODONTIS CAT, ANOTHER PLECO, AND MAYBE A COUPLE MORE PEACOCKS, ALL MALES, I WANTED A VENUSTUS OR A COMPRESSEPTS, BUT SOMEONE TOLD ME THEY ARE TOO AGGRESIVE. ALL MY FISH ARE AROUND 2 TO 3 INCHES, what about a Labeotropheus Trewavasae, or a fullebourni????ALLreplies would be greatly appreciated.THANKS ALOT. SORRY ABOUT THE CAPS, IM NOT YELLING


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## maddyfish (Jul 23, 2004)

I use DeChlor by Weco. It is cheap and seems to work fine.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I'm pretty much with the others on the water conditioning. To me the best is what does the least. There are some basics I want it to do. Get rid of chlorine or chloramine and most seem to do things for heavy netals. Whether there are heavy metals in my drinking water is pretty doubtful as those are controlled by most state DNR water inspections. I bet Florida checks theirs as well. After that I look for what is convenient and cheaper is always nice. I've settled on Prime but there are quite a few that fit my bill. I feed my fish and clean their water, after that they do quite well without the marketing glitz. :wink:

Maybe going back to some basics on how to treat the water is in order? Once you get down what the water and filtering are doing, how often and how much water changing and vacing will be something for you to decide. All tanks are different so there is no one answer. Do you know about the nitrogen cycle? How about testing the water for ammonia, nitrites and nitrates? Sometimes the LFS doesn't take the time to make sure you know the details and just sell more products to treat the fish. Better is to keep them healthy first. I find this site has good info about water:
http://www.freshwater-aquarium-fish.com/water_chemistry.htm

For me, all I work on is to keep the water good (testing) and then vac to keep it looking good. 
I don't think you can vac often enough to hurt anything -- other than your arms and mind.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

On the yellow labs-- If they have not worked it out yet. They are most likely trying to decide who is boss. If they are still fighting, some more rocks to hide in may be needed.


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## frank testagrose (Sep 22, 2010)

the water chemistry is fine.. 0 ammonia,0 nitrites, low levels of nitrates. i used to have oscars, arrowanas, and alligator gars, you could stick them in anything and they would survive. I think I'm just overstressing myself over nothing. MAYBE I NEED STRESS COAT. the fish are fine, they are eating, my chemistry is good, i need to stop listening to 19 year old dumb asses at the LFS that know absolutely nothing, they are only there to collect a check. unfortunately there are not many privately owned pet stores in broward county florida with an owner that has a passion for aquarium keeping. Its very sad the world has turned into petco's and wallmarts. any ideas for additional tankmates would be appreciated. THANKS FOR THE POSTS!!!!


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## frank testagrose (Sep 22, 2010)

oh and PFUNMO, i put in an extra piece of rockwork and they seem to have found their own area, one stays on the left side of the tank and the other one stays to the right. they switch off every once in a while but no more bickering.its like a water ballet with these two.


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## nmKramer (Oct 16, 2010)

Use Prime...

Vacuum gravel weekly with 50% water changes.

Did you say you have Tropheus with mbuna? :-?


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