# Geophagus/Ram stocking question



## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

I'm in the early stages of planning for a 75 gallon geophagus tank.

I have two Bolivian Rams from my current tank that I'd like to move to the new tank. I would make the back corners rocky with java ferns and anubias to provide some of the plant cover the Bolivians seem to enjoy - don't really want to do a lot of other plants. My question is, will I have any issue with the Rams being in there with 4-6 Geophagus Red Head Tapajos?

The final stock I'm looking at would look something like this -

4-6 Red Head Geophagus
2 Bolivian Rams
6 emerald corys
20 lemon tetras
2 leopard frog plecos


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## bbortko (Nov 20, 2011)

I know nothing about the frogs but the rest of the stock seems like a solid plan.


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## bblovesae (Feb 3, 2012)

I currently have 4 bolivians in with my santanoperca leucosticta ( closly related to geophagus and usually sold as geophagus juripari ) and they get along awesome. the rams always follow around and copy my earth eater. he doesn't seem to mind them at all. the rams even fight with him over food and they usually end up getting it, my leucostica is a gentle giant.

I also realized the rams scientific name is microgeophagus and they are both in the same subfamily, geophaginae. I thought that was pretty cool 

good luck and enjoy!


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## Dutch Dude (Sep 14, 2006)

I'm Not sure if this will work out. Orange Heads are very active and somewhat more territorial compared to other eartheaters. Bolivians are very brave fish and won't be scared of the OH. Things might turn out to be OK but if the OH claim the dormancy and the Bolivians fight back things might become nasty.


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## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

I was under an impression that Orange Heads and Red Heads were different fish, with the red heads being a good bit smaller.

While I'm here, how will Bolivians do in an environment with no plants? Ideally I'd have no plants but I don't want them to be unhappy.


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## CrypticLifeStyle (Dec 14, 2009)

Whether or not they are actually different is still a big subject of debate. I was chewed out on these forums a couple years ago for arguing they were different. Anyways, personally if you really want the orange heads to showcase their true personalty i wouldn't stock all those fish in a 75 gallon. They get along well with other fish, but they also love their own space, and if you end up with a pair out of that group they'll claim almost that whole tank. They're very passive aggressive til that point. My males are a good bulky 7" so they get a decent size after a few years. Also if you intend on having any successful spawnings down the road, those pleco's, or any pleco's in general are going to be your nightmare :lol:


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## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

OK, I could go without the plecos if necessary. Will their tendency to eat eggs and fry lead actually lead to aggression and injured fish, or do they just mess up the spawn?


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## keyholer (Apr 18, 2010)

Ditto on nixing the plecos. I have plecos in both of my tanks, and they have eaten more eggs than I care to count. I am actually planning on taking down both tanks in the near future so I can get those plecos out of there. Corys also eat eggs, although they're timid enough that a breeding pair of anything with good parenting behavior can usually keep them off the clutch. But not so plecos: they are vacuum cleaners and will not be denied when they get a whiff of eggs.

I just had a pair of Australoheros oblongum eggs hatch and it's a minor miracle they were able to keep those eggs away from my Bristlenose. I really don't know how they did it.

Bottom line, if you want to breed your fish, I'd say play it safe and go without the pleco.

Plus they are poop machines.


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## NeptunesNeighborhood (Apr 19, 2012)

JoeE said:


> Will their tendency to eat eggs and fry lead actually lead to aggression and injured fish, or do they just mess up the spawn?


The fish protecting the spawn will hammer the pleco and it will either get torn up or it will fight back and potentially kill the defender


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## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

Hello again -

Rather than clutter the forum I decided to re-use this thread.

I've convinced my girlfriend to let me get a 120 long (60' x 18') so that should give me a bit of breathing room.

I was thinking this stock:

5 orange heads (more to start, will reduce numbers as they mature)
30 lemon tetras
8 julii corydoras
2 leopard frog or starlight plecos
2 of some other dwarf cichlid, if possible - my bolivians, laetacara curviceps, or apistogramma agassizii

This is a display tank and won't be suitable for breeding. If I do decide to breed, will the orange heads be happy in a 40 breeder?

I'm going to use an FX5 and possibly add an AquaTop later for increased biological filtration.


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## BelieveInBlue (Jul 17, 2011)

The only problem I see with this set up is that you have a huge amount of bottom dwelling fish; considering that cichlids can be very territorial, I'd say that this is a bad idea. I would pick ONE species of bottom dwelling cichlids, and build around them. Personally, I'd ditch the dwarf cichlids and cories, and get a couple more geos. Then, I would add some kind of middle to top dwelling cichlids, probably angels, and call it a day. For breeding, a 40 breeder should be enough for a single pair to spawn and care for their brood.


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## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

Thanks. Maybe I will skip the cories and rehome the rams.

I would love to do angels but this will be a non planted tank and Angels, as I understand, strongly prefer plants. Any other middle dwelling cichlids that will do without plants?


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## BelieveInBlue (Jul 17, 2011)

They like plants, but so do most fish. As long as there's enough decor in the tank that they feel secure you should be ok. My angels live in a 55g with a lot of open space; it doesn't bother them one bit.


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## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

Sorry to keep coming back to this well -

A few more options I've been considering:

instead of a second cichlid species, a school of Spotted Silver Dollars, fish I've wanted for a while, to go with the lemon tetras;

adding indian almond leaves, so I can have the julii corydoras and they'll have enough hiding spaces so that territorial issues will be avoided.

Thoughts?


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## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

Additionally, how would the angels handle things if they start breeding? I know angels are mid-swimmers but they spawn on the bottom just like any other cichlid....wouldn't this cause territorial issues with the geos?


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## BelieveInBlue (Jul 17, 2011)

Angels spawn on a flat surface, which could be anything from a rock, to a large leaf, to the filter intake. They get somewhat aggressive during spawning, but only to fish that try to eat the eggs/fry. For the most part the parents will just flare and chase away potential predators. Not certain on the silver dollars; they get quite a bit bigger than most tetras, so I'm not sure if adding them in addition to the lemon tetras would be a good idea. Cories should be fine, with or withoout the almond leaves. I just prefer giving my cichlids as much room as I can, but I doubt the geos would give the cories much trouble.


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## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

How about Severums, possibly rotkeils? Between angels and severums, which is more likely to spar with the geos over space on the bottom?

Also, would grown-up angelfish eat golden pencilfish?


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## Stellaluna (May 8, 2006)

I don't think you can go wrong with either severums or angels. I've got angels with orange-head Tapajos and they rarely ever are in the same part of the tank, though it is a 150 high. The angels stay at the top/middle and the geos stay on the bottom. I also have Bolivians with my geos and they act just like the geos, sifting sand right in there with the big guys - no problems whatsoever. I have not had any spawning but I do have a pair that is getting ready, and their "aggression" is very mild and almost purely conspecific. Even then it is pretty tame. Breeding angels, on the other hand.....

One thing I'd consider if can is Denison's barbs (roseline shark, torpedo barb, etc.) as a larger schooling species that will occupy the middle. They are stunners and not nippy like most barbs. They'd be like a pencilfish, but big enough not to be snacked upon.


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## JoeE (Jun 11, 2012)

I love roseline sharks, I think they are gorgeous fish...but sadly that would require me to throw out my biotope idea.


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## Stellaluna (May 8, 2006)

Yes, that would do in your biotope! I just recently caved in and got some for one of my new setups - the first break in biotope I've had in years, but I decided I just had to have them.


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