# Your thoughts on color please.



## hook848 (Nov 12, 2002)

What do you feel is the biggest factor in the amount of color Tropheus display?

I'm interested in T. duboisi mostly. When I bought mine they were juveniles, but there was an adult male in full color already in the tank. He was the alpha from the start and never had is yellow band ever fade. He was beautiful, but also from the LFS.  I moved the group from my 75G to a 6-foot 125G a few months ago and removed him. I thought the other males would color up, but the don't display any band. Only a few females really show much yellow and that's not constant.

The reason I ask is I just added about twenty T. moori "bulu point" cherry spots. There are six adults showing good color and the other juvies do but not that much. They're only about an inch long.

So why do the cherry spots show good color and the dubs remain black and blue?

I don't have ideal water but it's stable. I have buffered with baking soda to a PH of 8.2 and KH of 15 but it made no difference.

PH 7.8
KH 5
GH <0
Nitrates 20 ppm


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## 24Tropheus (Jun 21, 2006)

High nitrates (yours does not sound high) can lead to colour loss or not developing it.
Yellow in dubs is I think linked with fresh algae I hear.
It takes a long time (months) to have much effect on both coloring up or coloring down.
Good stable conditions and patience and food with all the usual color enhancers/promoters (most makes have em all I think but you can check by reading up on the label), I guess is all I can say.
None dominant fish may never color up or take a very long time to get any good colour.


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## xchimbax (May 18, 2003)

Also substrate, lighting and backgrounds can effect colouration 
But duboisi are naturally always coloured up unlike moorii species


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## geoff_tropheus (Feb 13, 2003)

Quality of stock, Tank Decor, group size, food your feeding, and water quality.

Of those water quality and stock quality would be tied for No.1 in my book.

I have been reading alot lately that more and more people culling Duboisi with no compelte bands, or poorly colored bands, because they beileve the band is passed down to others.

I would get your beautiful banded males back into the tank, and let him be the dominate fish and take back the breeding.

Cherry Spots are not well know for looking good as a group. They have some outstanding looking Alpha's but as a group, usually not so good. The Cherry spots that are coloring now, are just trying to get themselves established in heirarchy. They are new, and in new surroundings.

The Duboisi are still in the same tank, same water, and all that you did was remove the alpha. Did you state what food you were feeding? I seen some Duboisi that were some of the largest ever I have seen, but had really poor color quality. The vendor, which I trust a lot, says it was becuase of the Fish Chow they had been acclimated to eating that was 60-80% protein. It put on their size, but their color suffered for it.

Your GH should target 10-12 dH. To have less than zero there I think it not so good for them. You KH needs 15-20 for stable pH between waterchanges. If your doing large weekly waterchanges, the KH of 5 might be ok, but if you miss a waterchange or two, your more likely going to be going acidic on them, which is not good if even for short times.


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## hook848 (Nov 12, 2002)

I'm going to concentrate on water quality from now on. I've been lazy in regards to buffering so hopefully I'll see a change.

I'm feeding NLS and bought my duboisi from a seller with good reviews on this site. I don't know what the parents looked like, but I'll keep that in mind next time I buy any Tropheus.

Buying the cherry spots wasn't the greatest idea. There aren't many Tropheus keepers locally so when I saw them on craigslist I went to see them. They were the first group I've seen in person other than mine. They were in a 4-foot 90 gallon along with a 12" Giant Puffer (Tetraodon mbu). The owner was in a bind and I thought I could give them a good home. I got two tanks, the 90 and a 55, all the fish and tons of extras for a good price. I have the puffer alone in the 90 and the cherry spots with my duboisi.

I think I may be going crazy. I went from owning one tank to owning four in a short period of time. All I wanted was a larger tank for my duboisi!! :-?


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## hook848 (Nov 12, 2002)

I took the time to figure out the buffer recipe, and I have been buffering my water for the last month.

In found out my GH was actually 5, not <0. I wasn't noticing the less obvious orange in the test tube.  So 5 tablespoons of baking soda and 4 1/2 tablespoons of epsom salt is what gives me decent numbers.

Water parameters are now:

PH 8.2
KH 15
GH 10
Nitrates <20 ppm ( I'm doing two water changes a week)

I'm not seeing any change in my dubs. The cherry spots look good and I even have some fry.

Here's a tank shot.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

I'm surpised that your nitrates are at 20ppm after doing 2 water changes per week. How big a water change are you doing each time, what type of filtration do you have?


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## hook848 (Nov 12, 2002)

noddy,

I'm changing out 50 gallons twice each week. My nitrates stay under 20 ppm, usually around 10 ppm, doing this. If I change water once a week, my nitrates get up to 40 ppm.

Filtration:

(2) AC 110 HOB
(1) Eheim 2026

I also have an AC 110 powerhead (950 gph) for water circulation.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

Well, that's plenty of water changes for sure. Your fish look pretty good in the photo's, I do 50 gal. each week (aprox 50%) and, if I'm a day late, they start to darken up. Sounds like your taking good care of them.


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## geoff_tropheus (Feb 13, 2003)

With Duboisi so far into generation now, it may be difficult to get better color out of them. Strips on Duboisi is rumored to be passed down. So you want to try and get the most beautiful striped male to be your breeder.

From the tank shot the fish look good to me. From the photo it looks like 20 Dubs with some fry, and the 20 Cherry Spots. To me those Dubs look nice. I'd buy them.

What food are your feeding?


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## hook848 (Nov 12, 2002)

Thanks geoff,

I'm feeding NLS.

Unfortunately I don't have any nicely colored males. I only had one and he was from my LFS. I took him back there when I moved the group into the 125G. I guess I always harbored some bias against him because he was not part of my original F1 group. At the time I was expecting other males to color up and breed. They took right to the breeding but show zero stripe. They are black with blue heads. Nothing I can do now. 

Some of my Cherry Spots are wild caught and are doing nicely. I have more confidence about buying, and keeping, WC trophs now than I did before. I would like to sell the Dubs and find another group to go with my Cherry Spots. I picked up a sweet 155G bow-front on craigslist and it's going to be my display tank.


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## TitoTee (Feb 18, 2006)

Is there a chance that you may not have Maswa/Halembe. Not all dub variants have yellow bands.

Some don't have bands at all and some have white bands.


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## geoff_tropheus (Feb 13, 2003)

Direct Sunlight always helps with Trophs. I think personally the brightest light helps bring out the most in them. I cannot remember, but wasnt you that posted that direct sunlight pic before of Duboisi...seems like it was someone from Oregon..cannot remember..

HAve you tried other lighting?

The only thing is, lighting is not going to make the Dubs bands come in. Diet and Genetics is that issue. NLS is one of the best, so...must be genetics.

White bands duboisi has three types. Wide Band is Bemba, Narrow Band is Karilani Island, and White band with some yellow is Kigoma. Being that some have no bands, I woudl think Karilani Island is most likely the location here. Several of my own Kariliani Island do not have bands.


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## hook848 (Nov 12, 2002)

TitoTee,

I'm pretty sure they are "maswa" or "halembe". They're from a reputable supplier.

geoff,

They are under new lighting in the 125G. I bought the same light Jolley uses on his tanks.
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=12109

Here is that pic of my dubs in the sun. The fish in the lower left is the male from my LFS. The others showin color are females. They were still in my 75G in these pics. They may not be colored like some groups I've seen pics of, but they're still nice.


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## geoff_tropheus (Feb 13, 2003)

Dubs n Tha Sun 8)


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