# Need advice and suggestions



## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

Hello all, this is my first post on these forums, and i'm new to the cichlid hobby. However, I have been keeping marine fish and corals for about 2 years now.

Now to cut to the chase, I am a high school sophomore and for my bio class, I have volunteered to set up our fish tank for the year because of my love for fish and the aquarium hobby. I immediately thought of an african cichlid tank because of their fascinating personalities and their social behavior. It is a standard 55 gallon tank, and for the substrate I will be using aragonite seafloor grade sand mixed in with larger pieces of cichlid substrate mix. Filtration would consist of 2 RENA smartfilter 55s (and maybe the porous rock I am going to use. I'm not sure if it will function the same as "live rock" in the marine hobby). To heat the tank I am going to use 2 100 watt marine land visi-therm heaters.

What I was planning on doing was to pile up holey rock on each end of the tank, and in between those two piles a field sand with shells with shell dwellers. I wanted to make this a biotope tank. What fish would you recommend for this tank? How many? What order should I put them in? And other suggestions about how to aquascape this tank?

Any advice or other suggestions in general?

Thanks so much for all of your help!


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## smellsfishy1 (May 29, 2008)

Your equipment choices are fine.
I'd suggest checking out some member tanks for some ideas. 
Many do biotope setups that are beautiful.
It sounds like you want to do a Lake Tang. setup with the shells and what not.
I haven't tried a Lake Tang. setup and only kept one species of fish from this lake so hopefully someone can offer some helpful guidance on the species, aquascape and placement of rocks, shells and other decor.


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## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

I think a lot of people keep comps with shell dwellers however they are very expensive. This is a school project and you shouldnt blow all of your cash. May i suggest going malawi? i love my set-up. Fish are usually cheaper as well.


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

I have to agree with Bac on the Malawi. You will have more vibrantly colored fish with a Lake Malawi set-up. I have an 100 gallon Tang tank. I'm honestly a little bored with it. I'm going to move the Tangs back to my 55 (because I can't let the Calvus go) and do something different with the 100. I love my Mbuna! For 55, I would suggest 3 species. My preference for a 55 would be Saulosi, Maingano, and Red Zebra...this week!...lol  I have all three plus Acei in a 125 gallon. I love it!! I think that it is an awesome undertaking, yet a great project for you! Be sure to include it on your college applications! I did a science fair project...years ago.. about 25 years.,  .with guppies. Someone killed my guppies, and ruined my project. I'm not trying to be negative, but be sure your fish are well fed, and protected from ignorant observers! Best of Luck to you. I always have loved aquariums, I hope that you do too!


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## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

Floridagirl said:


> I have to agree with Bac on the Malawi. You will have more vibrantly colored fish with a Lake Malawi set-up. I have an 100 gallon Tang tank. I'm honestly a little bored with it. I'm going to move the Tangs back to my 55 (because I can't let the Calvus go) and do something different with the 100. I love my Mbuna! For 55, I would suggest 3 species. My preference for a 55 would be Saulosi, Maingano, and Red Zebra...this week!...lol  I have all three plus Acei in a 125 gallon. I love it!! I think that it is an awesome undertaking, yet a great project for you! Be sure to include it on your college applications! I did a science fair project...years ago.. about 25 years.,  .with guppies. Someone killed my guppies, and ruined my project. I'm not trying to be negative, but be sure your fish are well fed, and protected from ignorant observers! Best of Luck to you. I always have loved aquariums, I hope that you do too!


fire away on the tang/shelldweller suggestions.
I also really like tropheus and the guy on the cichlid forum banner. Not sure of his name though 

It's all the schools money 

except for like the filters and stuff. I'm making a donation. All of the stuff that my teacher had originally were hopelessly outdated. By outdated I mean from the era of undergravel filters and corner filter boxes.


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## Dave (Feb 9, 2003)

If you have not kept Tropheus, I would not recommend them. They can be very difficult to keep based on high agression levels and sensitivity to water quality.

I personally find Tang tanks much more intersting that Malawi tanks. Sure, the Malawis are flashy, but Tang have man a lot more offer in the way they interact.

For shellies I would recommend N. multifasciatus. For rock-dwellers, I would recommend a small Julidochromis like transcriptus (NOT Gombe) or dickfeldi, N. leluepi or N cylindrus, and perhaps a pair/trio of A. calvus or compressiceps with a couple of large shells. You could even add in a group of 8 Cyprichromis leptosoma (non-jumbo types only).


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## chapman76 (Jun 30, 2004)

jj21 said:


> and the guy on the cichlid forum banner. Not sure of his name though


That is an Eretmodus cyanostictus (Kasanga). They're a Lake Tang goby. I would not recommend them for a 55g unless you can get a definitely pair. I had 4 that were previously together in a 180g tank. When trying to get the pair out, they moved around so much, we lost track of the pair so I got all four to determine who the pair was. Well, I put them into my 75g tank and had a 55g and a 29g to move the odd ones out into as the pair reformed. Well, needless to say, the two pairs relentless beat on both females. I tried one of the males and both females and then switched and switched and switched. I tried for about a month. Nothing worked. By the end, the two females were bite marked up and dark as night. While I LOVE gobies, I wouldn't recommend them in any 4 ft tank in the future. I miss their smiling little faces. Definitely one of the most cool fish I've ever owned.


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## Dave (Feb 9, 2003)

Agree with above, Gobies are great. If you cannot get a pair then they are usually fine as a single fish. However, I have noticed that males tend to mess with shellies.


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## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

Dave said:


> If you have not kept Tropheus, I would not recommend them. They can be very difficult to keep based on high agression levels and sensitivity to water quality.
> 
> I personally find Tang tanks much more intersting that Malawi tanks. Sure, the Malawis are flashy, but Tang have man a lot more offer in the way they interact.
> 
> For shellies I would recommend N. multifasciatus. For rock-dwellers, I would recommend a small Julidochromis like transcriptus (NOT Gombe) or dickfeldi, N. leluepi or N cylindrus, and perhaps a pair/trio of A. calvus or compressiceps with a couple of large shells. You could even add in a group of 8 Cyprichromis leptosoma (non-jumbo types only).


I cannot find N. multifasciatus in the species profiles. I can only find Lamprologus multifasciatus. I'm not sure if they are the same though. Also, would you recommend the mbita or the regular one? Are they both from lake tanganyika? I am not sure if they are different in anyway except how they look.

I like 
the multifasciatus 
the J. dickfeldi
the N. leleupi(to add some more color)
the A. calvus (preferably the white calvus if it comes from lake tanganyika)
the C. leptosoma.

now, my question is how many of each can/should I get, or if I could only get some of those fish and have to leave others out. Also, what order should I add them in to result in the least aggression? I already see that I can add about 8 C. leptosoma, and either a pair/trio of the calvus.

any aquascaping ideas to give these guys each their own place to establish their own territory, or is it fine the way I was going to do it?

Thanks for helping me pick out my fish  

edit// If I could find a female E. cyanostictus (is there anyway to sex them??) do you think it would be okay to add 1 of them?


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## chapman76 (Jun 30, 2004)

Yes, those multies are the same thing. You most likely will just able able to find multies that aren't location specific. Yes, they're both from Lake Tang.

What you'll have to to based on my limited Tang experience is to pick two species of rock dwellers. So, that means picking which two of the three you have (dickfeldi, leleupi, calvus) that you like the most and go with them. Also, as a tip, if you do pick the white calvus (which is from Lake Tang), I'd go with a dark or black substrate. Calvus seem to color up better when the sand is of the opposite color than themselves. I had my Inkfin on black sand and he was washed out. He's now over beige/white sand and he's black as night.

If you do go for a single goby, I'd say get rid of one of the groups of rock dwellers so you'll have one group and a single goby. I just don't think there would be enough room for 2 groups and a single in 2 rock piles. I could be wrong there though.

As far as adding them, I'd do it all at once. If you pick julies, I'd get at least 5-6 to get a pair. For the multies, I'd start with 6 and let them multiply. I started with 6 in 2007 and now have 50+. For calvus, I'd say start with 5-6 also and let the pair/trio form. They're more sensitive to changes in water so you'll want to be pretty careful with them when they're younger. Also, calvus grow INCREDIBLY slow. I got my Inkfin in 2005 at ~1" and now it's ~3.5". I can't give any input on the leleupi because I haven't kept them before. With cyps, I'd start with 8 or so. Ratios aren't as important with them, so I've heard. I've only kept a single before because I got him in with some Zrocks I ordered.


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## Dave (Feb 9, 2003)

Correct, N. or L. is the same thing. They are undergoing re-classification. You are not likely to find them with a specific collection point.

Pretty good advice above, though I think you could keep the calvus with the two rock dwellers. They would appreciate a couple of very large shells to hide in. I also think a single Gobie will be fine.

The shellies, with this species, you could have 6-8. The cyps you will want 8. The rock-dwellers you want either single fish or pairs. You often cannot start with pairs, so you would want 6 fish so that they could pair off. You would then remove the unpaired fish.

Alternatively, you can keep more rock-dwellwers by only keeping a single fish of each species, with some limitations.


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## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

chapman76 said:


> Yes, those multies are the same thing. You most likely will just able able to find multies that aren't location specific. Yes, they're both from Lake Tang.
> 
> What you'll have to to based on my limited Tang experience is to pick two species of rock dwellers. So, that means picking which two of the three you have (dickfeldi, leleupi, calvus) that you like the most and go with them. Also, as a tip, if you do pick the white calvus (which is from Lake Tang), I'd go with a dark or black substrate. Calvus seem to color up better when the sand is of the opposite color than themselves. I had my Inkfin on black sand and he was washed out. He's now over beige/white sand and he's black as night.
> 
> ...


I'm not sure if the calvus will be a good idea then. We will only have the tank set up until the end of the year, and then I will be giving them away to other cichlid enthusiasts.


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## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

also, do you think I would have more room if I just made a rockwall and had a field of shells in the foreground? Or do you guys think it would look better with my original idea?


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## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

So I stayed after school and set up the tank today. I rinsed out the sand and gravel, made two small piles with flat rocks that we already, and filled the tank up with water and added dechlorinator. As of right now, I have an in-tank filter in the tank right now with just a filter pad in it to polish the water and get some of the cloudiness out, as well as for water circulation. Tomorrow I am going to throw a couple of flakes of flake food in to get the cycle going. I am going to take the in tank filter out next monday when my teacher buys the new filters and the heaters. Then I am going to add the cichlid minerals/salts. I will wait until Wednesday, then take the water home and test it. If everything comes out okay, I was going to start adding fish.

Am I going too fast, or is my plan okay?

Also, any more opinions on how I should set up the rocks? Also, how many shells should I get?

What should I add first? Or should I add them all at once?

Any ideas for replacements for the A. calvus?


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## Dave (Feb 9, 2003)

Unless you are starting with a seasoned filter, it takes 4-6 weeks to cycle when you have a constant source of ammonia.


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## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

Dave said:


> Unless you are starting with a seasoned filter, it takes 4-6 weeks to cycle when you have a constant source of ammonia.


sooooo should I see if I can get some filter floss from an already established system to speed that process up or just keep throwing flake food in to decompose?

I understand that this takes time but I feel like I am kind of under pressure by my class and my teacher to get fish in this thing and everything up and running.


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## Dave (Feb 9, 2003)

I would seed the filters with media from a seasoned filter. Maybe your LFS can help you out. Tossing a little bit of food in isn't going to cycle the filters very quickly.


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## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

Dave said:


> I would seed the filters with media from a seasoned filter. Maybe your LFS can help you out. Tossing a little bit of food in isn't going to cycle the filters very quickly.


if I went on sunday to get seasoned filter media, would it be okay in a bag of tank water until monday when I could get it to school?


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## bac3492 (Jul 25, 2008)

As long as its kept in dechlorinated water, i think a single day would be perfectly fine.


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## Dave (Feb 9, 2003)

I would make sure that you keep the filter aerated so that there is plenty of oxygen.


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## jj21 (Oct 19, 2008)

alright. So any other suggestions in place of the calvus?

Should I put all of these guys in at once? Or one species at a time?


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## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

Since you do not have a lot of time, I recommend the Julies, Shellies, and Cyps. With 6 Julies, with any luck, you will have 2 pairs, and that will take up a lot of territory. They might even breed for you...maybe. Shellies should breed quickly, and when you find out how to make Cyps breed, let me know..lol.. Best of luck to you and your project.


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