# 110 Discus Tank



## guitarz1972 (Aug 4, 2009)

How does this stocking level sound for a 110-gallon "tall" tank? Dimensions are 48"x18x30." It will be (at an expensive cost) heavily planted.

6 discus
20 cardinal tetras
10 cory cats
1 bristlenose pleco

Thanks all. 

- Chris


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## thinking_fish (Aug 13, 2007)

Planted tanks arent the best for growing out discus but besides that I think it would work and look very nice :thumb:


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## jgentry (Jul 3, 2008)

Another thing to consider is that a 110g is not very well suited for plants. You are going to have to go metal halides to get enough light to the bottom of that tank. The lighting will be very expensive if you don't already have it.

Just something to think about.

I think your stocking sounds good if you are buying adult discus. Like mentioned above juvies are best grown out in bare bottom tanks.


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## apistomaster (Jun 22, 2006)

I would probably begin with 8-10 young Discus and go bare bottom using potted Crypts and wood with Anubias. You may find that Amazon Swords in pots will do well depending on how much light you use.
You can use HO T-5 fixtures to obtain plenty of light at less initial and lower operating expense than metal halides.

Once your discus have grown close to adult size at 10 months you can add washed sand during one of your routine water changes. If you buy 3" discus then they will be 10 months old in about 6 months. That isn't too long to go with the bare bottom method. Pairs should begin forming and begin spawning by the time they are 11 to 13 months old. Then you will have to decide if you want to try raising Discus.

I began keeping and breeding wild discus over 4 decades ago and since then have raised 1000's of domestic discus so I have a bit of experience with Discus. 
I currently have 2 and maybe 3 pairs of wild Nhamunda Blues i am trying to breed. I started them out in a low light planted 125 gal and have begun setting up individual pairs as they form and as I can juggle my fancy pleco breeders o free up another 29H for a wild discus pair. When the last Blue pair has been moved out then i will start over with a group of wild Red Spotted Greens this winter. I like wild discus but I sell domestic discus when I'm raising them.I am about to start over with domestic Brilliant Turquoise to replace some pairs of Red Turquoise I lost in an accident.


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## king uther (Jul 7, 2009)

sounds ok to me, although some dwarf cichlids like rams or apistogramas would add to the mix.

although I would not add both


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## M0oN (Dec 8, 2003)

Just my two cents here - to give a quick background I've been doing planted tanks and have, in the past, bred discus for around 20 years. With 12 years of that being pretty serious. I manage a fresh water section of my own in a mom and pop shop as well.

1. Discus will only show full potential if you grow them out in a bare bottom tank, power feed them, and perform water changes often enough to keep the nitrates below about 60 ppm. They are one of the few cichlids that show a notable difference in adult size after roughly 2-3 years of growth (with the first 9-12 months of that growth being the most important) based around proper husbandry.

2. Discus prefer warmer waters - roughly 86 degrees seems to be the magic number. This is somthing cory cats, and plants will not tolerate. However, I have found that discus kept in planted tanks do very well in temperatures as low as 76, it seems to me that plants in general have a healthy effect on all fish - and I've had mature pairs breed in waters this cold due to heavily planted tanks.

3. You do not need metal halides to sustain a planted tank - and I have no idea where somone got that idea. T5HO technology these days is more than sufficient to sustain plants in just about any tank you can dream up, with only the most extreme cases being an exception. In fact, if you were to use metal halides you would most assuredly need Co2 injection or face an overpopulation of algae that would ultimately kill your plants.

4. Discus will be bullied by even the smallest of cichlids - I've had pairs of apistogramma terrorize fully grown discus. They are very timid and docile fish, only showing MILD aggression between one another to establish a pecking order - and more notably during spawning.

Personally - if I had the money set aside, I would do the following with a 110 gallon.

Heavily plant it with a lighter base of substrate and a black background. While discus generally mimic the background, a result of keeping plants will be a reduction of peppering should they be pigeon blood - or stress bars should they be turqs. It is my experience that discus are more inclined to display improved coloration based upon a lighter substrate - as in nature their primary predators come from above (birds of prey ect.). While designer strains have obviously been captive bred for generations, you cannot simply erase evolutions blueprint for instincts of survival.

Co2 injection using a pH probe to monitor the proper levels - along with pure RO/DI water that has been replenished with either ADA or SeaChem supplements. Iron is very important to red plants, but will result in an overgrowth of algae if you are not precise with it. More importantly, in my opinion - would be your run of the mill root tablets, along with dosing some Excel.

In my own opinion the ADA line of products go way overboard, hobbyists have made a market out of regurgitating what they read on the internet - rather than real time experience. As a result, guys like Takisihi Ammano have rode in on the cash cow with all sorts of fertilizers that come out of left field. Only the most anal retentive of hobbyists will notice the difference in maintaining exact levels of the less important fertilization methods - and they are not necessary.

Co2 injection, iron, and Excel are all you really will ever need to get lush, dense growth out of your plants. I would get a quad T5HO fixture that runs the length of your tank and run all 5600k bulbs in it.

As far as stocking goes - cory cats are great, but chain loach (dwarf loach) are far more rewarding to watch if you can dig them up. Either way I think you are significantly understocked, and moreso underestimating how overstocked a planted tank can really be without bearing negative effects that you would see in tanks that do not keep plants.

My endlist would be:
Either 18 corydoras or chain loach. Your choice.
8 discus.
24 cardinal or rummynose tetra. (I prefer rummynose because they are a natural indicator of your waters quality, and overall tank health. Their noses will fade in red long before you see any devastating effects from something going wrong in your tank.)
6 bushynose plecostomas.

To give you an idea of what you can actually do - I have the following setup in a 90 gallon heavily planted tank that has zero filtration, and no Co2 injection. Using only two 48" T5HO bulbs. The only method of filtration is through the plants themselves, along with a powerhead for water movement along the substrate to sustain nutrient uptake in the plants, and an airstone (I do not recommend using this) to give a higher dissolved oxygen content for the discus.

8 adult sized discus.
4 dwarf gourami
18 corydoras cats
1 red tail shark
38 rummynose tetra
12 cardinal tetra
8 bushynose pleco's
4 roseline sharks
4 african clawed dwarf frogs

It is a very busy tank - and is intended to be one. It is a display tank in my shop, and gets compliments all the time. I have not had a single loss in the tank since I set it up - which I did all at once. I never cycled the tank - the stock has been the same since day 1.

Hope that all helps. Don't believe everything you read on the internet. Learn through experience - not regurgitated inexperience on the internet.


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## guitarz1972 (Aug 4, 2009)

Thanks to all you guys for the great input so far. MoOn had some particular interesting comments that I appreciate.

Here's what I've got so far - I am wanting to set this tank up using 160 lbs of eco-complete substrate (MoOn, I realize that's not a light substrate, but the deal I got was too good to pass up). I'm glad MoOn chimed in on the lighting system (running 4 5600K bulbs preferably). The compact-fluorescents I've got are 4x65 watts each at 6500K, so I hope that works well for this. Do you think I should do 2 6500K's and 2 10,000K's, considering the 30"-depth of my tank? I'm a little concerned about getting the light to penetrate the bottom.

This'll put 260 watts of light into the tank. At 2.3 watts per gallon, it's my intention not to have to do a CO2 system; I'd rather use Excel when and as it's needed.

I'm glad I turned out looking pretty under-stocked. It's my intent to be under-stocked for a while, since I've never kept discus before.

What about if I set up the tank, heavily plant it, cycle it, then start with 10 cories and 6-10 juvenille discus and go from there? Or should I go ahead and spring for adult discus, as this is my first time around with them?

Thanks again.

- C


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## jgentry (Jul 3, 2008)

guitarz1972 said:


> Thanks to all you guys for the great input so far. MoOn had some particular interesting comments that I appreciate.
> 
> Here's what I've got so far - I am wanting to set this tank up using 160 lbs of eco-complete substrate (MoOn, I realize that's not a light substrate, but the deal I got was too good to pass up). I'm glad MoOn chimed in on the lighting system (running 4 5600K bulbs preferably). The compact-fluorescents I've got are 4x65 watts each at 6500K, so I hope that works well for this. Do you think I should do 2 6500K's and 2 10,000K's, considering the 30"-depth of my tank? I'm a little concerned about getting the light to penetrate the bottom.
> 
> ...


Juvies in the planted tank will not grow well. You will either want to grow them out in a sperate tank or start it out bare bottom until they are decent size. Or start with plants and by adults. If these will be your first discus I recommend buying adults. I know they are expensive but the money is well spent. It will cost you as much or more then an adult to grow young discus when you factor in food and time spent.

I mentioned metal halides but wasn't really thinking when I said that. M0on is correct the T5 fixtures will work fine. I'm not a big fan of compacts personally but since you already have them you might as well try them and see. I would highly recommend you use CO2. Long term it is very hard for plants to out compete alge without it. From my experience at least.


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## M0oN (Dec 8, 2003)

Anything over about 1.5 watts per gallon will require Co2 - and even then it's worth the investment regardless, as you get a lot more impressive growth (namely more dense growth, not just faster growth) out of your plants.

I would just spring for adult discus - through good suppliers they are only about $20 more than juvenille's, unless you're talking real high quality grades of discus. Even for a beginner, growing discus out in a bare bottom tank can be a real learning curve. Getting discus to grow out properly in a planted tank would be a challenge for even the most experienced hobbyist.


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