# Mbuna - 55 gal



## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

What are the odds that the following species will work together long term in a standard 55 gal? I know these are all relatively large mbuna and am willing to substitute another species for the Trewavasae... I would prefer something that provides good contrast vs the other two species... possibly a cyno species or something like that. Open to all thoughts

YT Acei 1m:2f









M. Msobo 1m:4f









L Trewavasae Mpanga 1m:3f


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## esparzar1 (Jun 14, 2009)

those are some big fish for a 55 gallon. Some people say Acei get too big for a 55 and the mpangas can get up to 7 inch which most people would say is too big for a 55gal as well. They would all work well togther but I probably wouldn't advise them in a 55. That's not to say that it wouldn't work though.


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## esparzar1 (Jun 14, 2009)

I'd go with possibly the msobo, cyno sp. White Top hara and the Acei. You would have a wonderful contrast of color with those three species :thumb:


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## Kanorin (Apr 8, 2008)

I tried Msobo in a 55 gallon for a bit - things got too aggressive for my tastes when they started breeding.

I have Lab. Treavasae Mpanga, but have always had them in my 125, so I can't say whether they'd be ok in the 55 - probably fine for a year or so, but would eventually outgrow it is my guess. FYI, the coloration of the male you've pictured is exceptional and probably the result of some luck and some high beta-carotein diet. Most males will be more like a rusty orange color.

Here's an idea for a nice contrasting tank:
Met. Callainos or Ps. Acei
Ps. Elongatus 'Spot'
Yellow labs

The Cyno sp. Hara as was mentioned above would also be a fine choice.


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## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

esparzar1 said:


> I'd go with possibly the msobo, cyno sp. White Top hara and the Acei. You would have a wonderful contrast of color with those three species :thumb:


I'm not opposed to the Afra suggestion although i would really prefer another dimorphic species.



Kanorin said:


> ...Here's an idea for a nice contrasting tank:
> Met. Callainos or Ps. Acei
> Ps. Elongatus 'Spot'
> Yellow labs...


I already have the Msobo and the Acei breeding groups so I'm pretty set on these two species. Yellow labs i am opposed to as everyone and their grandmother owns them.

The elongatus are a very nice species although I'm not sure these would provide enough contrast with the male Msobo... I'm really attracted to the dimorphic species with decent looking females (such as the msobo, saulosi, trewavasae, etc.) or to the unique shape of the fish such as L. Trew


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## esparzar1 (Jun 14, 2009)

the Cyno. sp hara is dimorphic (opposite colors for M/F) :thumb: 
the males have a beautiful white look with black stripes and the females are a great looking blue ( like the cobalt). The met. msobo/acei/cyno. hara is about as coloful as you can get with three species (IMO). good luck on whatever you decide! We will need pics as well....lol opcorn:


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

Sub-dom male Hara can look just like females.. And dominant Hara females can look just like dominant males.

They are not dimorphic like Msobo, Saulosi, etc..


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## esparzar1 (Jun 14, 2009)

cantrell00 said:


> Sub-dom male Hara can look just like females.. And dominant Hara females can look just like dominant males.
> 
> They are not dimorphic like Msobo, Saulosi, etc..


You can say the same thing about Saulosi though. My sub-dom males will take on the look of the females and can be very hard to tell the difference. All I'm saying is I think they're dimorphic enough to look great in the tank :thumb:

I've never owned cyno sp. hara so I can only speak on what I've heard/read but it's still good info to know cantrell :thumb:


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

esparzar1 said:


> cantrell00 said:
> 
> 
> > Sub-dom male Hara can look just like females.. And dominant Hara females can look just like dominant males.
> ...


I see what you are saying and I agree that even male Saulosi can mute their coloring when they that being submissive is their best route for survival..

I was just saying that the differences in Hara male & female are not nearly as contrasting. It is VERY difficult to tell the difference between a sub-dom male and a female... It requires seeing the female holding or venting.


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## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

any other species suggestions?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

The problem with other dimorphic species with attractive females is that many of them have the same blue/yellow-orange theme as the msobo.

Perlmutt? Albino socolofi?


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## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

somewhat reviving this thread...

Currently have 16 demasoni, 1:2 acei and 1:2 juvenile msobo in the 55 with the intent to get more female msobo.

Long term viability?

Still heavily weighing whether or not i want to sell all but a single demasoni and go with a replacement species that gets a little larger and will do fine in a smaller group (ratio such as 1:3)... opinions welcomed.


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

limpert said:


> somewhat reviving this thread...
> 
> Currently have 16 demasoni, 1:2 acei and 1:2 juvenile msobo in the 55 with the intent to get more female msobo.
> 
> ...


My opinion is that the long term viability is most vulnerable with how you manage the M/F ratio of the demasoni. You really can't have too many of them.

Adding more msobo females would be recommended also.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

And more acei females. Which starts making the long-term viability in a 55G decline.


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

DJRansome said:


> And more acei females. Which starts making the long-term viability in a 55G decline.


true... you only have so many cubic inches to work with...


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## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

At what size can the demasoni be vented?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

After they lay eggs.


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## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

DJRansome said:


> After they lay eggs.


 :lol: =D>


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

No, it's true. The egg laying is what causes the female to have a larger pore for the eggs than the anal pore.

So if your fish had laid eggs, for a female as small as 1.5". For a male I'd wait until 3".


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## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

there are a lot of wiseguys on this forum so i figured you were just kidding. It seams like it will be a tough feat to weed out the males. Can it be done using relative size and/or aggression or would that just be throwing darts? In addition to my 16, i have another 5 growing out in my fry tank. What would be the ideal number and ratio to strive for in the 55g assuming 1 other species (such as msobo)?


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

Another species in addition to what you already have?

I would recommend anymore. If looking for an ideal ratio for the msobo, I would say 1 male to 5 females would be ideal.


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## limpert (Aug 28, 2007)

cantrell00 said:


> Another species in addition to what you already have?
> 
> I would recommend anymore. If looking for an ideal ratio for the msobo, I would say 1 male to 5 females would be ideal.


I was referring to demasoni, should have clarified


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

DJ is the expert on those guys but I would be willing to bet that you don't want more than 3 males in a 55.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I don't worry about weeding them out myself...I wait for the fish to choose the rejects and remove as required. But from observation over the years, it seems there are usually about three dominant males in my four foot tank.


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## cantrell00 (Oct 30, 2010)

DJ-

Not to hi-jack, but how are the Nyererei working with the others in the 75? Are they super aggressive? What is the M/F ratio.

I have considered adding them to my 180 but didn't know how they would work..


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

PM sent.


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