# Dempsey Breeding, Golds, Pinks, Blues



## CMonkey (May 19, 2016)

Hey all.
Need some help with some breeding questions. Mostly about dominant and recessive genes, specifically for coloration on the Dempsey. In order to clear up any confusion about what I am asking, I'll start with a quick rundown of where I am at.

Bought 2 electric blue JD from LFS. About 1.5inch. One showed some pretty clear signs that there was something not right within a couple of days, so I took him back. Down to one EBJD. Grew him out to about 3.5inch and wanted to start a breeding program with him (I was pretty sure it's a he). So I hop on ebay and find some mates for him. 


Here is "Blue"

And here is the Ad that was displayed. Labeled as Blue gene "pink" demseys at 1.5inch X4
I figured, "Ah, what the ****, I'll buy em" To see what kind of coloration would come from "pink" blue genes and EB breeding together, and I got a good chance to get a female.

So I eagerly await the arrival of my new fish, and when they come (all the way from Florida to Washington state) They are roughly 3 times the size that they were suppose to be!



Looked like 2 males (about 4-5in) and 2 females (about 2.5-3.5in) to me. 
So I email the guy, letting him know he didn't send me what I wanted. He didn't have what I wanted. I had the tanks to house them so I decided to keep all 4 until I could figure out what I wanted to do with them and he is currently trying to track down some smaller EBG.

So of course one of the males starts going Ape sh_t, chasing everything that swims in my 80gal bowfront. He gets re-homed to the 55gal to my rams horror.


see pic

Then blue starts getting beat up by one of the females that suddenly got ballzey in the 80gal. Male goes back in the 80gall and pop "blue" in the 55gal where he is much happier with his ram buddy.
So the two males start kinda hanging out and getting all buddy buddy and chase the females around and I'm figuring that they'll figure it out, one will pair up, and hopefully my EB will be big enough to handle the small female by then and I'll sell the other male "pink". So two breeding pairs of demseys, EB and EBG "pink" and one mated pair of "pink" blue gene. I'm thinking that they should both yield electric blues?

So my question...
If the Electric Blue coloration is a recessive gene color morph, what is the "pink" (although they look like golds to me, but what ever you want to call them)? 
If the pinks/gold lack the dark pigmentation, and the electric blues lack the green pigmentation, could you get Platinums? Something else entirely? Regular old Jack Dempsey that are severely stunted/fragile?
Is it an additional recessive gene or will the pinks/golds recessive gene take the place of the electric blue instead of overlapping it? 

Would it look like this? A platinum?

So we all know how to get a Electric Blue.

BB-regular Dempsey
Bb-Blue Gene Demsey
bb-Electric Blue Dempsey
_| b__b |	...._| B__b |
________	... ________...<--With this type of breeding
B|Bb|Bb |	...B|BB|Bb |......Can not accurately 
.|-------.......|------- .........determine difference
b|bb|bb |	...b|Bb|bb |........Between EBG + Regular
-------- ....--------

Electric Blue + Jack Dempsey = 100% Electric Blue Gene

Electric Blue + Electric Blue gene =50% EB and 50% EBG
Electric Blue Gene+ Electric Blue Gene = 50%EBG 25% Regular JD and 25% EB

So with the golds/pinks, are we looking at something like this?
bg-golds <---This would yield only gold and electric blues when bred with electric blue
Bg-gold gene

Or is it something like...

gg-gold <----This would yield only gold gene when bred with electric blue
bg-gold gene



To wrap up my story. The males that were getting all buddy buddy ended up being a mated pair. So the male Gold/Pink (whatever) is actually female despite her physical appearance which has shaken my confidence in sexing mature cichlids. So I guess we will see what two gold "blue gene" jack Dempseys make for babies.

Any help or experience would be greatly appreciated, so I can figure out what I'm gonna do with these guys...
Thanks


----------



## Mr Chromedome (Feb 12, 2013)

Blue and "pink" are not alleles, they are on different loci, so they are inherited separately. Whether there is any linkage, I do not know but I suspect it is unlikely. The EB gene pinks are genotype Bbgg. An Electric Blue Pink would have the genotype of bbgg. The phenotype would be the extended blue iridescent color on a light colored body, rather than the normal dark body.


----------



## CMonkey (May 19, 2016)

Very helpful. 
Ok, so these guys could be blue gene pinks then... awesome. 
Well I guess I'll post my findings if anyone is interested. Might have some fry available soon hopefully, though the male seems to be still trying to figure this mating thing out...


----------



## CMonkey (May 19, 2016)

Fry are now in larval stage. Looks like a decent bunch.


----------



## CMonkey (May 19, 2016)

Got about 150-200 fry in a 10 gal...
Does anyone have any interest in this?


----------

