# The Demasoni Project



## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

My first venture into African cichlids started with a 3ft 65g and 27 mbuna.  Thanks to everyone here @ the forum :thumb: , I soon realized this way too many. I subsequently lost half my stock of demasoni and so began the search for a bigger tank on craigslist to house some of the fish I had bought and after being inspired by the so many awesome projects on here decided to give it a try. The space I freed up for the tank would hold up to a 5ft tank, but 6 was going to be too long. Took forever to find one but here is what I got. For 400.00 I got a 60x18x26 with a pretty torn up pine stand and a fluval Fx5. Had some other things too, but ended up not using most of the rest. Here is some pics of what I started with.

053 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

054 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

055 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

057 by bradley.keck, on Flickr


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

First thing I did was clean the tank out good and disassemble the stand. Then I reinforced the stand with 2x4's and some of the scrap I took off the original stand. Put a new floor in with 3/4 in. ply and then covered it with 1/4 in. oak ply.

058 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

064 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

065 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

001 by bradley.keck, on Flickr
002 by bradley.keck, on Flickr


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

I really wanted a canopy for it so I decided to give it a try. I used some 1x2's and 1/2in. oak ply for it. Took some trial and error to get it right for sure.

003 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

005 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

Following weekend I put the trim on. First time using a table saw to miter. Cut out the door openings next. More trial and error :-? .
006 by bradley.keck, on Flickr

007 by bradley.keck, on Flickr
010 by bradley.keck, on Flickr


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## kittyk (Sep 20, 2012)

Haven't been on site for some time now, but will be following your project ! Stand and hood are awesome looking !!!  BTW--just got 8 demonsoni today for my 55 gal,....little worried with their reputation. How did you lose half your stock ? I started on mbuna's about 1 1/2 years ago and lost most of mine due to what i think was bloat


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Thank you kittyK!  My first go @ any kind of wood project. It was a good learning experience and now my wife is ready for some other projects not fish related. :wink:


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Had to take a break form the project for over a week, but then got back to it. Next up was staining outside and painting interior of cabinet and hood. Then I made the doors with a little help from my father-in-law and his wood working skills. I used a darker "Jacobean" color stain, one coat, and two coats of poly. Sanded it down with 240 grit before staining, and then with 240 and 400 b/t coats of poly. Doors were a PITA to hang straight :x I about went nuts @ that point.
016 by bradley.keck, on Flickr
017 by bradley.keck, on Flickr
018 by bradley.keck, on Flickr
020 by bradley.keck, on Flickr


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## kittyk (Sep 20, 2012)

love the look of the wood grain !!


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Cabinet and hood finally done! now I could have some fun equipping it! I had to order replacement hosing and connectors for the FX5 and give it a thorough cleaning. I have two aquatop CF400's on my 65g and have been very happy with them so I went with the two bigger CF500's for this tank. Cost was 310.00 for the two of them and came with plenty of ceramic rings. I went with aqueon pro heaters - 250w x2, and used the dual T5 light that came with the tank when I bought it. I replaced the blue light with a 6500K aqueon T5 and kept the original 10000K T5 bulb in it. The two of them on gave a nice color of light in the tank. Then got a power strip and timer. Mounted it in an accessible area with drip loops. I set up the CF500's the same way the 400's are in my 65g, set the fluval intake to the left of center, and the output nozzle 3in below the water line to use mostly for flow. The CF 500's will handle the surface agitation with their spray bars. Getting close now! :dancing: 
023 by bradley.keck, on Flickr
022 by bradley.keck, on Flickr
026 by bradley.keck, on Flickr


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Very nice job so far! Excellent upgrade on the stand and canopy build.


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## hose91 (Mar 5, 2014)

Wow, great project! If you don't mind terribly, got a couple of dumb questions...

1. Is the canopy super heavy? It looks tall enough to work under instead of taking it off if you have heavy work to do in the tank (like redo the rockscape or remove substrate), but still might be difficult to move if you had to. 
2. How is the opening and closing of the canopy? That top part looks to be quite high to grab and pull down! I do like the full openness you get when the front rotates back though. Keeps #1 from having to happen very often if ever. 
3. I never thought of this before, somehow, but I assume the doors are simply the cutouts with trim around them? Door hinges frighten me a bit as well, terrible PITA to get hung level and plumb. I feel your pain. 
4. Are you mounting the light to the canopy, or setting it on the glass tops? 
5. Does it go flush against that wall or be cornered on the diagonal like it is in the pics? Might have been a bear to move it back into that corner on carpet.

Really great work all around CC42, love the product so far, looks great!

Can't wait to see the rest!


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## dsiple3 (Mar 4, 2014)

Looks great. All I can say is that your wife must be very patient or not home much. If I had done my tank project in the house, I would have been killed....


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Thanks everybody for the nice complements  My wife is wonderful and she was patient. Most of it took place in the garage, but the tear down and checking fit with the tank all happened in the front room.  Those were not @ all dumb questions, but good ones I think. It is cornered in that room. We didn't want to put it flush because of the open stair rail. I did all the work in back before moving it in place and then added substrate and water. Only problem with that was of course I had a couple of air leaks in the hosing and had to work from in front. The canopy is not that heavy, but because it is a little over 5ft long you want two people to take it off. You are exactly right though that it opens up enough that there is no need to take it off. I can take the glass tops off and access everything with it open. To open it, I stand to one side and ease it back in place where it rest against the back half of the canopy. It opens and closes with a 4ft piano hinge. Again, thanks everyone for the nice comments and all the help. :thumb: More pics and updates to show soon :fish: Got to host and outdoor birthday party for my 12 y.o. daughter today! :dancing:


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Oh ya I forgot about the doors. Your exactly right. I used the cut outs form the ply, and framed with 1x2 oak. Cut slots in the wood for the ply and wood joints (forget what they are called) for the corners to hold.


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Oops! forgot about the light too! It's a 4ft light and the metal feet didn't extend out far enough to reach well so I have it sitting on the glass right now. When I go to remove the glass tops, it sits on top of the open canopy with the cord out of the way. Good questions! all stuff I had to consider and ponder during the build for sure!


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## JimA (Nov 7, 2009)

Looks good and nice job finishing it! My only suggestion would be raising the intakes on those filters, depending on what your using for substrate (sand I'm guessing) might suck it up into the canisters, they look pretty close to the btm?


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Thanks Jim! Your right and I noticed that when I put the substrate in. I was going to use PFS, but ended up using substrate that would buffer some for cichlids. I loved the color of it too. When I put the substrate in I realized I had to raise the intakes. Now Have the fluval about 3.5 in off the floor and the CF500's intakes about 2.5 in off the floor. The substrate is not as fine has PFS which helps too. Thank you again.


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## dsiple3 (Mar 4, 2014)

crazycolt42 said:


> Oops! forgot about the light too! It's a 4ft light and the metal feet didn't extend out far enough to reach well so I have it sitting on the glass right now. When I go to remove the glass tops, it sits on top of the open canopy with the cord out of the way.


Have you thought about putting a 1x2 along the sides of the canopy at a height where the light can sit on it so you don't have to remove it for cleaning the glass tops? Then you wouldn't have to remove it at all when canopy is open for any reason (unless of course you want to remove it).


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

dsiple3 - That is a great idea and I thought about doing it. The length of the canopy and the reach of the feet on the light bar would make me have to extend the 1x2 over the glass some. That would then not allow the glass tops to clear those 1x2's. If the feet reached about 2-3 inches further it could have sat on the supports all ready on there, but with the feet fully extended, they still touch glass! So, I have been thinking about suspending it some how. Any ideas on how to suspend it or attach it to the top? Also, would this diffuse the light @ all? Thanks! More pics coming soon! :thumb: :fish:


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

Well, the transformation is finally complete! :dancing: Both tanks are doing well for the most part. I had a little issue with getting ammonia to drop to 0 for about three days, but finally the numbers look good. The male Rusties in the 65g have become a little more territorial with their new décor - trying to establish their spots and are digging like crazy! The king demasoni went on a tyrant for about the first two days in the 120g - mostly chasing another subdom. male but has stopped now. Those two had become neutral in the 65g, but I guess the new surroundings caused the dom. male to provide friendly reminders to everyone in the new tank :lol: Here's the numbers in each tank:
65g - 7 Rusties, 8 cynotilapia species "lion" purple lupingu
120g - 8 lions cove electric yellow labs, 8 yellow tail acei, 8 M. callinos pearl white zebras, 8 demasoni (11 more growing in a 10g)
Here are some picks of the original 65g, the newly decorated 65g, and the 120g. 
The 65g last December with 28 total - 13 demasoni, 8 yellow labs, 7 rusties  
013 (1000x667) by [email protected], on Flickr
Revamped 65g , now 15 total and went with more natural theme:
024 by [email protected], on Flickr
018 by andrea.[email protected], on Flickr

The new 120g with 32 total for now.
001 by [email protected], on Flickr
016 by [email protected], on Flickr

Now I have to decide how many of the demasoni to add to the 120g once they are @ an inch or so. :-?


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## dsiple3 (Mar 4, 2014)

crazycolt42 said:


> dsiple3 - That is a great idea and I thought about doing it. The length of the canopy and the reach of the feet on the light bar would make me have to extend the 1x2 over the glass some. That would then not allow the glass tops to clear those 1x2's. If the feet reached about 2-3 inches further it could have sat on the supports all ready on there, but with the feet fully extended, they still touch glass! So, I have been thinking about suspending it some how. Any ideas on how to suspend it or attach it to the top? Also, would this diffuse the light @ all? Thanks! More pics coming soon! :thumb: :fish:


I was thinking of moving the lights up to the top of the canopy, much like I did in my build http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=302682&start=15#p2204570
Measure the height of the light fixture and put the 1x2 where the light has enough clearance from the top for air movement for cooling if needed.

As a personal preference, I like the lights up and away from the top mainly for the lighting effect through out the tank with the waves created from my spray bar. When I first started the night lights, I thought they were flickering and I had an electrical issue. But it was only the effects from the waves. :? The lighting isn't diffused to my eye, the white paint inside canopy helps to reflect it down to the tank anyway.


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## Demasoni1 (Apr 9, 2014)

Wow man! You have done an awesome job!

As far as the Dems, how many do you have in there now?

Are you wanting to breed them?


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

dsiple3 - Nice build! Thanks for the link. Should be pretty easy to do. I can make it to hover a couple inches below the top of the canopy and allow for full opening of the glass fronts. Nice to know it won't diffuse too much either. My LED on the 65g has the same shimmering effect that your describing and was missing it with the t5's resting on the glass of the 125, so nice to know I may get that as a bonus! :thumb:

demasoni1 - Thanks man! I have 9 demasoni in there now (just added 1 from the 10g that is about 1 1/4 in. long), and 11 fry about 1/2-3/4in long growing in the 10g. My total number is 33 right now. I have the flexibility to add none or all 11 fry. 6 of the demasoni are my original f1's and already breed like crazy (2 holding right now), the rest are f2's so not bad if I decide to strip a female in the future. Right now, I'm just going to chill and let them all release in the main tank. I honestly can't keep up with all their breeding. I will likely strip a female again though in the future and sell the fry. I don't really know how many is too many in this size tank. I could go from 33 all the way to 44 with what I have, but I want to have the stocking number where it should be when they are adults. I don't want to have to take some out just because of numbers. If I have a male(s) that cause problems that's one thing, but I want my numbers to be where they can be when adults. Probably something I could discuss in the Malawi thread :thumb:


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## Demasoni1 (Apr 9, 2014)

Sounds like a plan!


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## kittyk (Sep 20, 2012)

crazycolt--how big were your dems when they started breeding ? I dropped a large sponge filter into my dem tank and have a ten gallon ready for any fry. Would love to increase their population. Did you strip the female or just put her into the 10 gallon ? BTW--very nice looking tanks


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

They were no more than an 1.5in. long when they started breeding. The first brood, I placed the female in the 10g after three weeks. I knew she had to be getting close to releasing them and she started swimming near the top of the tank one day @ almost exactly three weeks (we saw them breed on a Sunday). I put her in the 10g and within a day she released three fry and what looked to be a chain of unfertilized eggs. The three fry are now in the main tank. She was holding again in after only about 2-3 weeks from releasing the first three. The 2nd time I stripped her @ three weeks and got 11 little 1/4in swimmers! That wasn't as hard as I thought it was going to be, but nerve racking for sure. I liked being able to just put her right back in the main tank and all the little guys in the 10g. Thank you for the compliment on the tanks  Have your dems mated @ all yet? How big are they? I bought mine @ about an inch long and from mail order to mating probably took about 4-6 weeks.


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## kittyk (Sep 20, 2012)

crazycolt42 said:


> They were no more than an 1.5in. long when they started breeding. The first brood, I placed the female in the 10g after three weeks. I knew she had to be getting close to releasing them and she started swimming near the top of the tank one day @ almost exactly three weeks (we saw them breed on a Sunday). I put her in the 10g and within a day she released three fry and what looked to be a chain of unfertilized eggs. The three fry are now in the main tank. She was holding again in after only about 2-3 weeks from releasing the first three. The 2nd time I stripped her @ three weeks and got 11 little 1/4in swimmers! That wasn't as hard as I thought it was going to be, but nerve racking for sure. I liked being able to just put her right back in the main tank and all the little guys in the 10g. Thank you for the compliment on the tanks  Have your dems mated @ all yet? How big are they? I bought mine @ about an inch long and from mail order to mating probably took about 4-6 weeks.


Haven't seen any breeding yet. I had them approx 3 weeks now, they also were about 1 inch when I got them (mail order). I've already put a sponge filter in the main tank and have ten gallon ready. I've got a couple of the demasoni that have a more washed out color. H.oping it's just normal lighter coloring of females and not stress related....actually the tank has seemed to calm down and each demasoni has their spot...except during feeding time !! Dems have grown little since I got them


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

You should see some holding soon enough :thumb: I have some dems that are washed out in color as well. I cannot figure out if it is stress related or not, but I do not think it is. When I went through such a bad period of loosing one or two a week, I noticed that when they quit eating and there was a problem, they actually got really dark, but not dark like the dominate male will get, more like a "washed out" dark. I have also seen my females get dark when they are holding (I imagine they are a little stressed during that time too). I would love to know if the light washed out appearance that some seem to keep more often is a sign of being female or sub-dominate male. The pics iggy has on his thread regarding demasoni were an eye opener! All of them are dark as can be. I don't use NLS food like he does, but not sure if that is why or not? He has like 30 of them in a 75g though. They can't all be males :lol: I have heard that the only way to for sure sex a dem is through venting or direct observation of holding/mating. Keep me posted on how it's going. I almost got albino scolofi -they are really cool looking. Bet they look good with the dems!


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## kittyk (Sep 20, 2012)

Dems still doing great  Don't see any holding yet though. Several days ago I thought couple were going through their breeding ritual, but i'm now thinking they were just chasing each other in a tight circle. After you saw your dems breed was it right away obvious the female was holding ? I agree with you the washed out ones are the females or sub -dom males....the ones I have are not as aggressive as the others. My dominate male loves to flare out , he is also the biggest in the tank. I do love the albino scolofi's , when I added the dems & 2 scolofi the long term resident scolofi immediately became the tank boss !! He chased everyone in the tank....my dems had some minor tail fin damage that must have been from him. I treated the tank with Melafix after about a week Mr. Scolofi (i've always thought he looks more male) calmed down. It's amazing the the dems fins are totally healed and you can't even tell they were nipped at. Now one on the new little scolofi has an atttitude, not causing any damage to anyone but def sticks up for himself . The other scolofi is cautious and keeps near it's home cave and comes out to eat. All the dems have a certain spot in the tank they like to hand out much of the time. I also don't feed NLS...but plan to order some soon. I gave some romaine lettuce the other day....they loved it !! How often are you feeding your tank ?

Thanks for the compliments on my tank on the other thread ("rate the tank above you").


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## crazycolt42 (Nov 10, 2013)

The compliments were well deserved! :thumb: We could tell right away that she was holding. She had this big dark pouch under her chin and although she would swim up with the others @ feeding time, she would not eat. the mating ritual was different too. More time spent @ each others back end. :lol: I think your exactly right that what you saw was a bit of what I call, "who's da man? I'm da man" kind of dancing all the mbuna do from time to time. Establishing a hierarchy I suppose. Isn't it surprising who sometimes ends up being the tank boss? I would have never guessed it would be one of the albino scolofi! My Rusties are the most digging and territorial species I have ironically- despite their profile description on the forum here. My demasoni picked an open flat area in the sand to mate close to rock in the back corner of the tank. This was close to where they both had established some personal space/territory. They were two of the biggest demasoni @ the time. Probably 1.5 to 2in. long. I actually thought it was two males until the mating occurred. It's going to happen for you and once it does, they won't stop. I too have not used NLS, mostly because they did not have this "veggie max" that they now have and I wanted a good herbivore pellet. I read a lot of positive reviews about the Hikari cichlid excel so I went with that and still have 1.5 bags of it left to use. I will feed 2x/day. Usually cobalt spirulna flake once and the Hikari soaked in Seachem nourish once a day. My fry the same, but I break up the pellet some first. They do heal up fast don't they? I had a lot of nipped fins when I first received my fish and they were regenerated within two weeks. Amazing! Also, a good sign that the aggression is not too harsh in the tank I think. Keep me updated on how things are going!


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## LearningLots (Jan 28, 2014)

Hey all, 
Awesome project you have completed. Really great work!!!

I also just recently setup my first cichlid tank. It was originally supposed to be a 75g housing an all male species tank. When I learned how hard it was to obtain the fish I wanted, I ended up with a 55g and mbunas. Right now, my tank houses 6 electric yellows, 1 syno cat, and only 4 demasoni (2M, 2F). Yes, i know the numbers are low for dems, but I purchased 14 to begin with.. I lost 10 due to aggression within my first 2 weeks. Out of those 10, only one appearred to have been attacked. The others just looked thin but all there. 
Anyways, tank has been going since April and I am even suprised my dems have not killed each other with these low numbers. My female began holding in June. I tried to catch her because I need to raise fry to add to their colony. This did not go so well and she ended up spitting into the main. I dont know how many she had, but I ended up with 4 fry that grew out in my main to about 1 inch. 
So, about 3 weeks later, holding again. She would not make it easy for me to catch, and spit in the main AGAIN. I noticed about 6 fry hiding in the fry piles I built for them. Then had to leave for a vacation and came home to find no fry left and my "toddlers" were gone as well 
But...on a good note she was holding again and this time I was able to scoop her up. I built a home made breeder box for her and I FINALLY got the fry I need. She spit about 3 days after catching her. I now have 15 fry in a seperate tank for grow out to add to my colony when they get big enough..(they were just born on tuesday) I think I will wait until they are about 1.5 before I add them hoping for survival. I did notice 2 babies in my main as well, and also a yellow fry,I must have lost the 2 while transferring them out of the main. My yellow is about to spit any day now and she is in her second clutch. 
Overall, I am happy that I ended up with the mbunas!!! Now, if I could just find room for a bigger tank... lol
Great pics and I hope your dems start breeding for you. And yes, it seems as though once they start they cannot quit. 
Goodluck!


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