# My 3D Background



## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

So here is my long overdue first attempt at a 3D background. I have been researching, collecting materials, experimenting and contemplating for about the last year and have finally started. I've learned so much from this site I wanted to share my work with everyone and hopefully get some advice and suggestions to help me complete the project.


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

Here is a list and pictures of the materials I am using
GE silicon I, makin sure this is the right stuff. Everyone always seems to have questions or concerns with this.








Planning on using only the big gap filler, had an extra can of the fire block laying around so using that to experiment, and I want to use the dye with drylok








Random styro pieces
























Drylok. Is This the Right Stuff????








I also originally purchased some quickcrete but changed my mind and wanna just use the drylok, may still incorporate this in someway. Right Stuff????








here is the substrate I want to use. has anyone used this particular product, right stuff???


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

My tank is a 45 gal (2' h x 3'w and 1'deep)


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## littlejoenc (Jan 11, 2005)

Every thing looks good to me...Seems like your putting a lot thought into this which is very good...I think you'll be glad your using The Dryloc...Just let your imagination run wild and go with it....Good luck....


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

I have been keeping cichlids for about 10 years now on and off. up until a year ago I had always used the under gravel filtration system that came with the tank when I bought it. The tank was always set up with stacks of large rocks that I had collected from local lakes and cleaned. In short it was the most difficult thing to clean ever and made upkeep very difficult and something I would always put off. I moved about a year ago and the tank has sat empty ever since my fish dyed about a month after that. Sooooo... aside from loving the way these backgrounds look my intention is to hide all hardware, and make it as self sustained and easily cleanable as possible. I know that every tank and set up will take work and maintenance on a regular basis, I just want to make it quick and simple when I do have to do it. With all that said I want to add an under gravel(sand) jet system that I will power with a new Ehiem 2217 canister filter I purchased. I know think this particular filter is rated for tanks that are about double the size of mine so I don't know if this is overkill but I wasn't sure with it being conected to the UGJ system. Plus I don't think lots of filtration is as bad thing and I can always use it when I eventually upgrade. Thoughts/concerns?


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

and here are the pics from the UGJ so far. I have more pics and can take more if anything is unclear or confusing let me know

























this is some egg crate/light diffuser I got from home depot that will lay on the bottom glass to keep the cichleds from digging and diffuse the weight of the rocks I do put in the tank


















I am going silcone the pvc to the bottom of the tank to make sure it doesn't get moved out of place and then silicone the top and sides to make sure it blends in with the sand substrate, that way if it does get dug up a little it's not very noticeable. After I built this I filled the tank and tested it for a little while along with a power head. For the most part I liked the way it worked and the jets seem to be positioned and angled correctly however its kind of impossible to tell with out the tank being completely set up. My 2 biggest concerns here are that once everything is set up and glued down if there will be dead spots...... and the vertical pipe coming down feeding the water back in. I don't know how to incorporate this into the background, should I try to leave openings for water to get threw? or should I completely try to seal it off with silicone? This is a big concern and would love to hear about any ones experiences or advice


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

before I go any further I wanted to post a link to a background that I am kind of using as a model for mine with a few alterations.








Here is a website with some step by step pictures but not much additional info so I'm trying to base what i do somewhat off of what I can see from these pictures
http://www.aquahobby.com/tanks/e_tank0902.php
so while I have been debating some of the techniques and methods for some of the other steps I decided to start the styro part of the background and see if that helps anything else take shape. I bought a pack of the white insulating polystyrene? styrofoam? from my local ace hardware and cut them down to the same size as the inside of the tank started gluing several of the pieces together with the silicone along with smaller random sized pieces. Placed stacks of books ontop and let them dry.


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

so finally got around to uploading the pics of what *** done so far. Glued all the random pieces of styro to the larger back pieces and started carving


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

getting farther along in the carving and started adding great stuff to fill in some cracks and gaps to smooth the corners


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

i've almost completed the carving and getting close to putting the concrete/drylok on and siliconing the background. I have a couple parts that im not exactly sure what to do with and still trying to figure out a few logistics. Here is a black and white photo of the back ground as it is now i think it gives a better idea of what the bg looks like without the two tone styro and great stuff.


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## mobafrontlover (May 1, 2011)

Im locked in its lookiing good I kinda like the 2tone look. maybe a wood and stone look?


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

so that's pretty much everything *** done up to date, i also put a silicone and sand on the undergravel jets. This is the point where im having so difficulty and really really could use some help and advice as to what to do from here. I am going to be running the undergravel jets from my canister filter and also adding a power head for increased water circulation and aeration. My difficulty and worry with this particular part is how exactly to seal around the vertical pvc pipe that will be feeding the ugj. I don't know whether i should try to silicone all around the top and bottom of the pipe and leave air in the vertical column surrounding the output pvc pipe or whether should try to leave it open and allow water in the column. My concern if i silicone and leave air is the possibility that it could leak and allow water in anyway and have no way to remedy the problem, also it would make it almost impossible to remove the pipe if i need to for any reason. The problem with allowing water behind and around the pipe would be lack of circulation. I could REALLY REALLY use help here guys. I'm including a bunch pics that will hopefully clarify what im talking about. PLEASE help, i've put a lot of time into this and would hate for it to be wasted this far along. Thanks


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

this is a top view without the hardware of where the power head will sit, the back upper left corner that is kinda an open square is where the vertical pvc pipe goes in to feed the ugj.


































this is a side view with everyhting in place minus a lil more foam work untill i figure out exactly what to do










and heres a bunch of views to hopefully clarify
top view
























probably going to be covering the power head with different shades of drylok to blend in a lil more

side view









tank side view

























HELP!!!!! dunno what to do about sealing the top and bottom of the input tube or if i should possibly make a hole or something to allow more water flow


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

mobafrontlover said:


> Im locked in its lookiing good I kinda like the 2tone look. maybe a wood and stone look?


i like the bgs with the drift wood look built in, thought it might be a little overzealous for my first try. I still have to coat the whole thing in drylock so it going to completely cover the everything anyway.


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## CITADELGRAD87 (Mar 26, 2003)

Have you tried to run that filter to see what kind of flow you get through the jets? The reason I ask is because I run one of those in my 50G and it returns through a spraybar just under the surface. Two weeks a=or so after a total filter rcleaning, the spraybar pressure drops WAY off, I think you are going to see less and less movement, and I dont think there is very much power on the terturn anyway.

My suggestion, and please don't take this as criticism, is to maybe run the powerhead as the jet pump, with a prefilter sponge to catch additional gunk, then, if you detect a drop in current in the ugjs, its a simple matter of just rinsing the sponge, and not a total filter cleaning.

then you could just run the eheim spraybar or a nozzle deal like they make for additonal current, but yor ugs would not be so variable in performance.

I really like your background, even without color on it it is very convincing, I wish I had some Artistic ability. Very nice, please keep us posted.


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## mobafrontlover (May 1, 2011)

dannyboy29 said:


> mobafrontlover said:
> 
> 
> > Im locked in its lookiing good I kinda like the 2tone look. maybe a wood and stone look?
> ...


They make dye so if you wanna try the 2 tone you can get the redish brown dye and on your second or third coat try it and if you don't like it cover it up that's what I did when I did mine. Remember the background is very hard to remove(trust me I know lol) so make sure you love it. You can keep coating it until your happy. Its just like painting if you don't like it paint over it


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

CITADELGRAD87 said:


> Have you tried to run that filter to see what kind of flow you get through the jets? The reason I ask is because I run one of those in my 50G and it returns through a spraybar just under the surface. Two weeks a=or so after a total filter rcleaning, the spraybar pressure drops WAY off, I think you are going to see less and less movement, and I dont think there is very much power on the terturn anyway.
> 
> My suggestion, and please don't take this as criticism, is to maybe run the powerhead as the jet pump, with a prefilter sponge to catch additional gunk, then, if you detect a drop in current in the ugjs, its a simple matter of just rinsing the sponge, and not a total filter cleaning.
> 
> then you could just run the eheim spraybar or a nozzle deal like they make for additonal current, but yor ugs would not be so variable in performance.


CITADELGRAD87 That is definitely a concern that I have been thinking about, i think my original thought process on using the powerhead as the jet pump was that the prefilter would be rather large and clunky and hard to hide, I also thought about still using the prefilter and maybe trimming it to a smaller size. it's really good to know that you that you notice a drop in pressure only a couple weeks after cleaning. I did test the flow with the eheim powering the ugjs but with nothing in the tank, the flowed seemed really good but that was with optimal conditions and only clean water going into the filter so there was obviously no diminished flow rate. My 2 main goals in the design were to clean the tank less often, and to hide all the hardware. I chose the eheim cause from the specs that I read it was rated for a 90 gal and would easily handle my 45 gal for a couple months at a time. CITADELGRAD87 is your tank heavily stocked? I just assumed the eheim would handle the load and was simply planning on using the power head for aeration and increased flow. Am i putting to much faith in the filter and making it do more work than it has to????


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

i suppose I could also try to complete the background in a way that would allow me to interchange the canister and the power head and then test more when everything is set up without having to dismantle anything or change or remove and of the bg.


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## CITADELGRAD87 (Mar 26, 2003)

My tank is lightly stocked right now, 5 medium sized fish (3-4 inch) waiting for me to finish my 100 g in wall project. I cleaned it and replaced all the filter pads about a month ago, when clean, the spraybar shoots almost the length of the tank when the water is below the bar. Last weekend, it shot literally about 6 inches. My stock is light right now, and that seems quicker than normal, maybe I need to look at the impeller, but I have had UGJS on my mind for about a month now, and I saw this issue you maye be facing.

You can absolutely trim the filter with scissors, I made a prefilter for my Emperor filter and the Ehiem, I just hacked away until they got to be the size of a baseball or slightly smaller. I just pop them off and run sink water over them, but you could also use tank water during a change and keep the bio filtration intact.

I know what you mean about visible equipment, I am trying to run the sump return on mine behind the bakcground so nothing is visible. Maybe you could do a foam outcropping to kind of hid it and give aditional depth?

EDIT--make no mistake, we are on the same page. That ehiem CAN be cleaned about every 3 months or so with a good fish load, I know this because it was in my office for years and I was not great about cleaning it. BUT when you get into the 2d and 3d months, I don't think your jets are going to perform as well as you want. While your filter can hack the 3-4 months before a breakdown for cleaning, when you get near that point, the poo is going to start piling up.

Another option: run them both, close the loop and put one on one input, the other on the other, I know there are people here who run 2 pumps on a single loop.


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

CITADELGRAD87 said:


> Another option: run them both, close the loop and put one on one input, the other on the other, I know there are people here who run 2 pumps on a single loop.


that is an interesting idea i had not considered before, i'll have to take a look tonight when I get home and see how I could configure that


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

i would have to pick up a reverse flow kit if I use the power head for the ugj correct? pros and cons for closed loop compared to open ended ugj?


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

You could just T off the input for the loop and have the sump return going onto one end and have flexible tubing on the power head and connect that to the other end of the T? I say flexible tubing because it would be easier to use that than to move the power head as it is and cut a new hole for it.


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## CITADELGRAD87 (Mar 26, 2003)

I am not sure if you would need a reverse flow kit, there is a great article in the library section where the guy used pumps inside the tank to power the jets, I cannot remember if he used such a kit. My other tank has a Mag 7 outside the tank pushing 3 jets without a flow reverse kit.

A closed loop really helps equalize the flow to all jets, my first system, in my 50, had just 3 jets like yours, my new one is a ring that is closed, I am not aware of any drawbacks to that setup, but it does help get the flow to each jet.


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

I've never heard of putting a reverse flow kit on a UGJ system. Why would you need it if the power head was in the tank? So long as there is enough jet openings I don't see any need of it. What's the GPH rating of the power head?


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

I dunno if reverse flow kit is the right wording or term, i'm trying to picture in my head how the power head would fit with the pvc because I would have to rotate it 90 degrees. i think ur probably right that just a piece of flexible hose would do the trick. gonna mess with it tonight and see what I come up with. Getting excited, as soon as I figure out the exact setup for the ugj and input i get to start with the drylok, can't wait.


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## CITADELGRAD87 (Mar 26, 2003)

Well, did you get to play with it? Are we rolling?


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## The King Crabb (Jun 28, 2011)

CITADELGRAD87 said:


> Well, did you get to play with it? Are we rolling?


+1. opcorn:


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## dannyboy29 (May 17, 2011)

sorry guys i work at a bar and weekends are busy for me, should have some time tomorrow afternoon to do some work on the tank. CITADELGRAD87 Found this link a while back and I think this is what u were talking about probably gonna try something like this http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/ug_jets.php


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