# Yay. Ich. Best method?



## lilcountrygal

Seems as my lovely catfish appears to be developing ich. So far, it hasnt spread to my cichlids with the exception of one minute "flake" on a cobue.

My pH is 7.4. Water temp 80. I turned up the thermostat a bit (still waiting on the increase in water temp). I plan to dose 1 tablespoon aquarium salt for every 5 gallons of water. I just wanted to confirm this is correct.

Also... is the bigger success treating ich with salt/increase temp or an actual ich medicine from the store? *** had crappy luck saving fish in the past. I think this was caught fairly early (the only one with tell tale signs so far is the catfish). Id rather up my chances of success this time by doing it the most successful way.

Temp increase + salt or
Ich medicine.

How do the experts treat ich?


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## Sub-Mariner

quick search and I found these:

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/ich.php

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/view ... 43c5c102bf


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## lilcountrygal

thanks. I had read the sticky in the Library section. Hadnt seen the above linked post tho. I was just looking for opinions on which method yields the best results... medicine or salt/heat.


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## 13razorbackfan

You will get proponents of each method. Heat/salt is easier on the fish and bacteria colonies. How high do you have your heat right now? Can you get it between 86-90?


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## lilcountrygal

I probably could get it that high. Was worried about the fish tho with the temp that high. Can they survive that hot? (the AC 110 does create good surface agitation). Horrible to say, but the catfish I can give or take. Don't want to lose any of my buddies. The temp is 82 now. I dissolved 25 tablespoons of aquarium salt and added it over a three hour period. The catfish still has a ton of white spots and the cobues each still have one tiny spot on their rear tails. How long should I give the salt/heat method before I buy meds? No improvement by the morning, get some? I do NOT want to lose any of my fish and so far only two have one white flake. Would it help to remove the catfish or is it too late for that?


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## 13razorbackfan

I would raise temp to 87-89....at 86 ICH stops reproducing after they fall off the fish at around 89.7 it kills the ICH outright but only after it falls off the fish. You can't kill ICH while it is still attached to the fish. You have to wait till it falls off the fish...this is why it takes a while to kill. You need to keep the treatment going for minimum 5-7 days after no more visible signs of ICH on your fish. Usually treatment is at least a couple weeks.

Do not switch to meds halfway through...continue doing what you are doing. You really need to perform 25% water changes daily and a good substrate vacuuming. I believe you have black sand right? I would just vacuum the top 1/2" of the sand or so. The vacuuming will suck up some of the ICH as they are in the sand trying to reproduce plus the fresh water will help the immune system of the fish. Make sure to pre-dissolve salt and add back to the tank in proportion to what was removed while vacuuming your sand.

Also...a completely dark tank is best during these treatments as it will allow your fish to rest and heal. What I would do is turn on tank lights for about 1 hour a day and during this time I would feed first, if they will eat, and then do the vacuuming. Add back in the pre-disolved salt and turn the lights back out. I would continue on with this routine for a minimum 5-7 days after all visible signs of ICH are gone.

You have to be patient. ICH does not go away overnight. The high temps will speed up the lifecycle of the ICH causing it to fall of the fish faster. This is the only time you can kill it. So if you wake up tomorrow and turn on the lights and it is worse...then don't panic. The high heat will for sure kill the ICH. Just make sure it is at least 86....90 is better if your fish can tolerate it. Your africans should be ok at 90. Just make sure to have a bunch of surface agitation.


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## lilcountrygal

So, when you say "keep the treatment going", you just mean daily water changes/substrate vaccuuming and replace the salt? I did about a 20% water change before adding the salt. I'll change more tomorrow. I keep turning up the heater, but the heat still only shows around 82. I'll try to turn the dial up more and see if I cant get some more results. Id at least like to get it to 86, I'm leary about 89. That scares me that high lol.

the fish are still eating good. You actually wouldnt know anything is wrong if I didnt see the catfish. No labored breathing. I occasionally see a cobue flash against a rock. One of the labs hangs back by the intake of the AquaTech 30/60, but he doesnt seem distressed (I dont even know if he has the white spots actually, he's hard to see them on because he's white). I did find a spot on one of my OBs and one of my yellow labs. The cichlids arent "infested" per say (yet). The catfish has a bunch on him.

I do have black sand, yes. I'll give another good vaccuum tomorrow and add more salt.

I knew better than to get that catfish.


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> So, when you say "keep the treatment going", you just mean daily water changes/substrate vaccuuming and replace the salt? I did about a 20% water change before adding the salt. I'll change more tomorrow. I keep turning up the heater, but the heat still only shows around 82. I'll try to turn the dial up more and see if I cant get some more results. Id at least like to get it to 86, I'm leary about 89. That scares me that high lol.
> 
> the fish are still eating good. You actually wouldnt know anything is wrong if I didnt see the catfish. No labored breathing. I occasionally see a cobue flash against a rock. One of the labs hangs back by the intake of the AquaTech 30/60, but he doesnt seem distressed (I dont even know if he has the white spots actually, he's hard to see them on because he's white). I did find a spot on one of my OBs and one of my yellow labs. The cichlids arent "infested" per say (yet). The catfish has a bunch on him.
> 
> I do have black sand, yes. I'll give another good vaccuum tomorrow and add more salt.
> 
> I knew better than to get that catfish.


Yes..to the first question. They should be fine at 89 but 86 will work also but make sure it is at least 86 because at 86 the ICH can not reproduce and will eventually die after 4-5 days. Again...this is once they have fallen off the fish. Can't kill them while they are attached to the host.


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## lilcountrygal

At 86, how long can they live on the fish? If they fall off at 89, and don't reproduce at 86, can they still live indefinitely at 86? I have some Rusty's coming tomorrow and don't want to harm them in any way


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> At 86, how long can they live on the fish? If they fall off at 89, and don't reproduce at 86, can they still live indefinitely at 86? I have some Rusty's coming tomorrow and don't want to harm them in any way


No...as long as they are attached to the fish nothing can kill them. The only thing that could kill them is if the fish dies. The ONLY way to kill ICH is after it falls off the fish in its free swimming stage.

Turning the heat up speeds up the ICH's life cycle while it is on the fish which is good. The longer it is attached to the fish the worse off for the fish. So...by speeding the lifecycle up it will drop off the fish...after a few days sometimes more(I have seen people say with heat up high it stayed on the fish visibly for up to a week but there are different strains so I am generalizing here). Now...once it falls off if the temp is over 86 it can't reproduce and dies after 4-5 days(again...different strains can go longer). Now..temps over 89.7 will kill the ICH outright ONLY after it falls off the fish and while it is in its free swimming stage(meds are only effective here as well).

Now...your fish should be able to tolerate 86-90 no problem for several weeks. As long as there is plenty of oxygenation they will be fine. Salt helps a bit with breathing also.

So to recap: 86 will stop reproduction(they reproduce after they fall off fish) & if they can't reproduce they usually die after 4-5 days.
89.7 will kill them outright only in their free swimming stage
Meds can only kill them in their free swimming stage
Don't use meds with high heat/salt..choose one or other
Darkness reduces stress so try and keep tank dark for most of day
High heat can sometimes cause them to be more aggressive so again..lights out can help reduce that
25% water changes that include sand vacuuming and add back in salt

I think that about covers it. If you have any further questions let me know.

Footnote: Some strains can be harder to kill than others but they are more rare. If after a week and a half if you see no improvement at all then it might be time to consider meds.


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## lilcountrygal

Awesome. Thanks for the help razor. :thumb: Heat now is at 84 and the red light is still on the heater, so I'm hoping its rising. Its a balmy 12 degrees here in PA, so it may take a bit longer to heat the tank up, which from what I read is probably better... gradual increase. I'll post back with anymore "ARGH, HELP" moments.


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> Awesome. Thanks for the help razor. :thumb: Heat now is at 84 and the red light is still on the heater, so I'm hoping its rising. Its a balmy 12 degrees here in PA, so it may take a bit longer to heat the tank up, which from what I read is probably better... gradual increase. I'll post back with anymore "ARGH, HELP" moments.


You have aqueon pro heater right? If so...mine maxed out at 86.

PS...I know it seems like a lot of work but well worth it in the end. :thumb:


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## lilcountrygal

I have a regular 200 watt heater, the one that comes with the Walmart kit. I'll be lucky to get it high enough. I'm at 84 right now, its at max setting. The red light is on, but I'll be lucky to hit 86. If I cant hit 86, should I go the medication route?


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> I have a regular 200 watt heater, the one that comes with the Walmart kit. I'll be lucky to get it high enough. I'm at 84 right now, its at max setting. The red light is on, but I'll be lucky to hit 86. If I cant hit 86, should I go the medication route?


No...stick with the heat/salt. Leave the heater on overnight and check in the morning. Heaters usually take a bit of time to reach max setting. 84 will still speed up the life cycle of the ICH just make sure if 84 is the max that you continue to do the water changes and sand vacuuming.


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## lilcountrygal

This morning, I've reached 86 (YAY). Thats as high as I'm going to get it unless it warms up outside. Everyone is still swimming around good, no labored breathing, etc., due to ich or temp. Even the catfish is acting fine. No less "dots" on her tho.

So, to recap... about 25% water changes daily, replacing the dissolved salt that I remove from the tank. Vaccuum substrate well. In 4-5 days with temps at 86, I should see a decrease in the ich spots on the catfish (?). In 7-10 days, do a 50% water change to try and remove some of the excess salt. Correct?


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## lilcountrygal

Would it help if I removed the catfish since he is the most infected or would it no make a difference?


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## D*N*R

I just ended my most stubborn ich battle. Heat and salt did it just go up gradually. My first time meds. did'nt clear it up ? :x NEW fish


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> Would it help if I removed the catfish since he is the most infected or would it no make a difference?


No difference. You need to treat the whole tank. Just keep doing exactly what you are doing and report back in 7 days or sooner if something drastic happens. Just keep up the water changes. If your fish are eating and acting healthy you probably caught it in time and should have no issues. Make sure temp stays at 86. Most strains of ICH will not kill fish if treated in time. You should be ok! :thumb:


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## lilcountrygal

Thanks, Razor. They're eating like pigs. Hope thats a good sign. Temp is up to about 88. I'll have to watch the temp if it gets warmer around here. I saw the pleco had some spots on him too.

At what point should I be looking for a decrease in the white spots?


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> Thanks, Razor. They're eating like pigs. Hope thats a good sign. Temp is up to about 88. I'll have to watch the temp if it gets warmer around here. I saw the pleco had some spots on him too.
> 
> At what point should I be looking for a decrease in the white spots?


88 is good...that will really speed up their life cycle. As far as noticing a decrease in spots..it just depends. You should after 7-10 days notice them slowly starting to go away. Sometimes sooner and sometimes later. If your fish are eating then that is great. Just continue doing what you are doing. See....88 isn't so bad huh? It will just make them more active and more hungry.

After a few days you will settle into a routine. What seems like a lot of work right now in a few days will just be routine. The couple weeks will go by really quick.


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## 13razorbackfan

Any changes? How do things look?


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## lilcountrygal

Not really. The tank stays at 88 now. I want to say the ich spots on the catfish are fading, but it might just be my eyes. He still has a bunch of them on him tho. I change about 30% of the water daily (missed today tho... just got home a bit ago and wont have time). I'll do a 50% change tomorrow. Its definitely not affecting the other fish in the tank, so at least it isnt spreading. They still eat like pigs. I think I fed them a bit too much this evening because it was probably around 3 minutes until they had the food gone... hence the 50% change tomorrow.


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## 13razorbackfan

Ok...good....make sure to vacuum the sand. The vacuuming is the most important part. If your fish are still acting healthy and eating then the ICH has not grown worse which is a good sign. Just keep doing what you are doing and I expect to hear in 5-10 days or so that all the ICH has fallen off the fish. Remember...keep doing treatments for at least 5-7 days after all last signs of ICH are gone. 10 days would be ideal just to be sure. :thumb:


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## RifterFish

Wow, that is too much work for me. this is my method which works like a charm. I've never used the heat method:
Do not stress too much about this. It is very easily treatable. I like to use Tetra Ick Guard, clears ick fast: dissolvable tablets. First of all, do not follow the directions on the box. It is a waste of time. You can treat the ick quicker and more effectively by following these steps. First, remove the carbon from your filter. Or, if you have empty filter pads just swap it out. You do not want carbon in your filtration as it will remove the chemicals of the medicine and render it useless. Second, drop the tablets in the tank, according to your tank size. Then, do nothing. That is it. Do not do any water changes.The water will turn blue and then eventually clear up after a day or two. Do not replace the water until your next scheduled water change. The ick will clear up within a day or two, but it is necessary to keep the medicine in the water to kill all the ick in the tank. Now, if you notice one or two fish that still have ick while the others are perfectly fine and healthy, it is time to remove that sick fish and put it in quarentine. It will most likely die, but there is nothing you can do for it. There is something much more wrong with it then simple ick or parasites. It will continue to bring the other healthy fish in your tank down. If it is a newly purchased fish, bring it back to the store for a replacement. Do not bother with medicines such as Melafix or Pimafix. Your fish is too far gone already and you would be wasting your money. These treatments are only good at the very first signs of illness. You really have to know your fish and their behavior to notice when something is wrong. pay close attention to each one individually.


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## lilcountrygal

I pretty much know each individual fish. I spend quite a bit of time just sitting by my tank and watching... its relaxing for me 

I caught the ich fairly quick due to that. It started on the catfish and a couple spots on a couple other fish.

I actually prefer to try the heat/salt method first. I'm one that believes not to add medicine unless all other options are too far gone. My thought was, try the heat/salt for a couple days, if it doesnt work, then treat the tank with something store bought. After the first two days of water changes, I saw no changes, but no spreading. No spreading to me is a positive sign. This evening I just changed 50% of the water and really believe the ick is slowly receding. The heat/salt is working.

I dont mind doing water changes... it makes the fish happy. :fish:


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> I pretty much know each individual fish. I spend quite a bit of time just sitting by my tank and watching... its relaxing for me
> 
> I caught the ich fairly quick due to that. It started on the catfish and a couple spots on a couple other fish.
> 
> I actually prefer to try the heat/salt method first. I'm one that believes not to add medicine unless all other options are too far gone. My thought was, try the heat/salt for a couple days, if it doesnt work, then treat the tank with something store bought. After the first two days of water changes, I saw no changes, but no spreading. No spreading to me is a positive sign. This evening I just changed 50% of the water and really believe the ick is slowly receding. The heat/salt is working.
> 
> I dont mind doing water changes... it makes the fish happy. :fish:


Yes...keep doing what you are doing. It will clear up...you just have to give it several days to a couple weeks or so. It all depends on the strain and how bad they are infected. If they are all eating and acting normally and it has not gotten worse then you are on the right track.


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## RifterFish

The method I described usually works overnight, sometimes by the next day if it is a bad case. I've had it happen a couple times with new fish from the chain stores. The heat method is okay, but my opinion is the longer they have it and it carries on, the more damage it does. Sounds like your catfish is ill and needs to be quarintined (ignore spelling). Ick normally only attaches to unhealthy fish. I don't normally use chemicals either, but this one is crucial when it comes to saving fish.


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## 13razorbackfan

RifterFish said:


> The method I described usually works overnight, sometimes by the next day if it is a bad case. I've had it happen a couple times with new fish from the chain stores. The heat method is okay, but my opinion is the longer they have it and it carries on, the more damage it does. Sounds like your catfish is ill and needs to be quarintined (ignore spelling). Ick normally only attaches to unhealthy fish. I don't normally use chemicals either, but this one is crucial when it comes to saving fish.


No...once it starts to spread at all it is in the tank...they reproduce in the substrate. Isolating fish seldom works. In this case it has spread to other fish already.

I have never seen any meds that can kill ICH overnight. Meds are not effective until after ICH has fallen off fish and is in free swimming stage.


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## RifterFish

Isolating the sick fish is needed to keep the other ones healthy. If the other fish are rid of the ick and are healthy, while one still has it, it is time to remove the fish from the tank. It is most likely terminally ill and it is only a matter of time before it dies. The product has worked for me every time I have used it, and yes overnight on two occasions, and 2 -days on another. The third occasion I had received two poor quality fish from an online pet store. They were skeletal and covered in ick. They came with two healthy ones. I treated the whole tank and the two healthy ones shed the ick quickly, but then got it back about two weeks later. I kept treating until finally I just had to take the two sick ones out all together. They died soon after and the two others survived to become thriving fish. As I said, the med works if you follow the directions I gave and not the ones on the label. Have you ever tried this method? Do not be so quick to dismiss it. I did not discount the heat and salt method. I simply offered an alternative to a long, drawn out process that prolongs the treatment. I learned by the mistakes I made when I first began. Trial and error as they say.


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## strat guy

I got hit with a bout of ich a month ago from some Wal-mart red eye tetras (...learned my lesson...). I raised the temp up to 85F and was treating with Aquarisol with only mild results. I switched to Mardel Coppersafe, and bang, it was gone in like 2 days. I would try that. I've used it in the past for other things, and its a pretty strong product. Most LFS should carry it, but I don't think the big guys do (PetSmart, Petco).


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## lilcountrygal

I actually think I'm at the end of my ich battle. This morning the spots were significantly decreased in the catfish. I found it very early tho. From what I read, catfish/loaches seem to get it quicker than regular fish and I saw the spots develop on the catfish. Never did they "act" sick, they all still ate, etc. Had I not known what ich was, I may have delayed the "treatment" until the fish were distressed. I save the meds for when I dont catch it as early as I did.

I didnt quarantine it because my quarantine tank currently has some Rustys in that I just received who werent exposed to ich. I couldnt delay getting the Rustys, and didnt want to put them in the tank with ich. I have used the meds before, and would never dismiss the thought of using them. I just wanted to see how successful this method is prior to adding chemicals to the tank.


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## RifterFish

Well, that is good. I've been thinking about getting some rusty Cichlids. Do they looks as pretty as they do on the websites? Or are they more dull in color?


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## lilcountrygal

RifterFish said:


> Well, that is good. I've been thinking about getting some rusty Cichlids. Do they looks as pretty as they do on the websites? Or are they more dull in color?


I absolutely love my Rustys. My favorites, actually. They arent dull in the least. The males have more of a purplish/rust tint to them and the females look more rust. I even have small ones (one and a half inches) and they're colorful. Beautiful fish... I highly recommend them. But, I guess I am a little bias


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## 13razorbackfan

Remember...keep doing the treatments for 5-7 days after ICH is no longer visible.


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## 13razorbackfan

strat guy said:


> I got hit with a bout of ich a month ago from some Wal-mart red eye tetras (...learned my lesson...). I raised the temp up to 85F and was treating with Aquarisol with only mild results. I switched to Mardel Coppersafe, and bang, it was gone in like 2 days. I would try that. I've used it in the past for other things, and its a pretty strong product. Most LFS should carry it, but I don't think the big guys do (PetSmart, Petco).


I had success with coppersafe as well.


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## SNDMN8Z

I have one fish that visibly has ich and a few that are flashing and some that are staying closer to the top of the tank. I want to try this heat/salt treatment first and go from there. With the salt, do I add it right away or wait til the tank reaches higher temps? I have increased the heater from 78 to 80 as of now so I am waiting for the water to heat up. Thanks for the help. P.S ICH sux!


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## RifterFish

Cool! You helped me make my decision on the Rusty Cichlids. I've been looking for some new, unique colors and these sound great. I haven't seen any males yet, but they sound awesome. Going to order some tomorrow. Thanks!


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## 13razorbackfan

SNDMN8Z said:


> I have one fish that visibly has ich and a few that are flashing and some that are staying closer to the top of the tank. I want to try this heat/salt treatment first and go from there. With the salt, do I add it right away or wait til the tank reaches higher temps? I have increased the heater from 78 to 80 as of now so I am waiting for the water to heat up. Thanks for the help. P.S ICH sux!


You can start to add it now....and add 1tbl per 5 gallons. Dissolve in tank water first and add some every few hours until you reach your 1tbl per 5 gallons.

Also...if your fish are at the top of the tank already then I would make sure you have GREAT aeration in your tank because heated water holds less O2. You can drop your water line a couple inches and let the filters drop off and splash into the tank water. That will help. As for everything else be sure to read the thread for other pointers.


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## SNDMN8Z

Thanks Razor, Ill get started with everything else.


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## Hoosier Tank

Thanks for the thread...
I have just restocked my tank with 11 new babies from the fish store for just under two weeks. Day before yesterday I noticed a white spot on both of the 2" Texas... not a bunch of little spots but one larger one on each side of both fish. (Larger than a grain of salt by a long way) so I started the research and close observation.
Yesterday when I got home I noticed one was labored breathing. By the end of the night it was laying on the bottom. I set up my quarentine tank and snatched him out (too late I am sure). Now I see the grains of salt size specs on a couple others. :x 
This morning I raised the tank temp from 80 to 84 and will pick up some salt and/or meds on the the way home. Bad part is the tank is a *180g* and with the sump I am looking at about 210g so the salt may be the most economical way to go. Just so I got this straight, I should add 40-42 Tablespoons of salt?


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## lilcountrygal

I added two tablespoons of Aquarium salt to 5 gallons (razor... is that too much? I see you suggested 1... the article, I believe, said 2-3. I went with 2). If I should be removing some water, let me know.

I'll definitely treat for at least another week. The spots are gone from the catfish.

All others battling the ich.... Id raise, as razor suggested to me, the temp up to at least 86. I put in about half a cup of the dissolved salt water every 15-20 minutes over the course of a few hours. When you do water changes, replace the salt that you took out.

And, most of all, dont be discouraged if you dont see improvement. It took many days before I even noticed a decrease in the ich. I held strong because, even tho I didnt see any decrease, it wasnt spreading either. Ich multiplies fast, so if you dont see it spreading significantly, Id say you're on the right track.


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## SNDMN8Z

Good to know....I hope I have the same success. I am still waiting on the water to temp to rise. I will be gettnig the salt on the way home from work to day to add in the tank.

Any suggestions on the 3 Ruby Reds I have being delivered hopefully today. My 75g is the only tank that i have set up at this time. I have a 10g but its out in the garage empty. Should I use a container with the water the fish came in and slowly add water to increase water volume and heat/airrate(sp) that to keep them out of the 75g?

So discouraged at this point but I guess I just have to deal with it and fix my issues!

Thanks.


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## Hoosier Tank

Thanks for the feedback *lilcountrygal*


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## lilcountrygal

SNDMN8Z said:


> Any suggestions on the 3 Ruby Reds I have being delivered hopefully today. My 75g is the only tank that i have set up at this time. I have a 10g but its out in the garage empty. Should I use a container with the water the fish came in and slowly add water to increase water volume and heat/airrate(sp) that to keep them out of the 75g?


This is SO probably the wrong advice, but..... my husband brought me home a yellow lab from Petsmart the same day he brought me Rustys from a fellow poster on the board. I didnt want to put the yellow lab in with the Rustys, so I acclimated the yellow lab to the tank water very slowly (the tank with ich). Its not recommended, but I really had no other choice... gamble with the Rustys or gamble with the yellow lab. The lab is doing awesome, never showed any type of distress at all. But, I DID catch my ich fairly early. I read that ich will attack catfish/loaches first and I caught my ich then, before it even spread to the cichlids other than a few spots here and there.

with the salt/heat method, you're looking at least two weeks of treatment.... you'd have to keep the Ruby Reds out of the main tank for at least that long. If you cant get the 10 gallon up in time, you have to do what you have to do. I hope someone with more experience will post on if the container would work, if I were you, Id wait for a more experience poster to answer that question. I just wanted to give you my experience.


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## SNDMN8Z

Any thing works for me right now. Thanks.


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> I added two tablespoons of Aquarium salt to 5 gallons (razor... is that too much? I see you suggested 1... the article, I believe, said 2-3. I went with 2). If I should be removing some water, let me know.
> 
> I'll definitely treat for at least another week. The spots are gone from the catfish.
> 
> All others battling the ich.... Id raise, as razor suggested to me, the temp up to at least 86. I put in about half a cup of the dissolved salt water every 15-20 minutes over the course of a few hours. When you do water changes, replace the salt that you took out.
> 
> And, most of all, dont be discouraged if you dont see improvement. It took many days before I even noticed a decrease in the ich. I held strong because, even tho I didnt see any decrease, it wasnt spreading either. Ich multiplies fast, so if you dont see it spreading significantly, Id say you're on the right track.


Glad to hear the ICH has retreated!! Just keep treating for 7 more days and you should be good to go. After the 7 days continue to do 25% water changes and just not replace the salt in the water added. Eventually the salt will all be removed through water changes.


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## Hoosier Tank

I picked up some aquarium salt on the way home and when I arrived checked the tank temp, was up to the 84 degree setpoint. I raised it to 86 and and added 4 1/2 cups of salt (two tablespoons per gallon) to the sump, should be a slow gradual dilution to the tank. After some thought I figure the rock work displaced about the same water that my sump holds so it should still be about 180g
I lost the small Texas in the quarentine tank, as expected... he was not doing well when I put him in but wanted him out of the main tank. The other juvie Texas has the same larger spots than the other infected fish but he is acting pefectly normal.
Lets see how they look after a few days of salt and gravel vacs :roll:


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## lilcountrygal

Check the library section for the ich article... I read its 2-3 tablespoons per FIVE gallon, not per gallon.

And if you can get your temp up to around 90, it'll go faster. Just make sure you have alot of aeration. I took a little water out of the tank so the filter overflow created more of aeration/surface agitation.


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## Hoosier Tank

Thanks for watching out for me *lilcountrygal*! Yes I read the article first. My math was correct for 2 tablespoons per 5 gallons. My typing skills are to blame and now it's too late to go back and edit the post. 

180g/5g =36, 36x2T =72T, 72T/16per cup =4.5 cups


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## lilcountrygal

Hoosier Tank said:


> Thanks for watching out for me *lilcountrygal*! Yes I read the article first. My math was correct for 2 tablespoons per 5 gallons. My typing skills are to blame and now it's too late to go back and edit the post.
> 
> 180g/5g =36, 36x2T =72T, 72T/16per cup =4.5 cups


glad it was you're typing skills lol. Good luck. :thumb: Lemme know how you made out.


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## Hoosier Tank

I do have news...
GOOD: 
The larger spot on my remaining Texas seems smaller. 
The female Salvini still has the 3 grain of salt size spots but they are not increasing.
None of the other fish seem infected so it doesn't seem to be spreading.

BAD:
I saw a free swimming little Bugger. I figure if I was able to see one in this huge tank, they must be all over
I am concerned about how thorough I can gravel vac without removing 200 lbs of rock.

I am impressed at the accuracy of these new Aqueon Pro heaters I have. Their dial setting is spot on tank temp maintained a solid 86. So I raised them to 88, their highest setting this morning.


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## lilcountrygal

I dont remove all of my rocks when I vaccuum. I try to get as much as I can, but cant get EVERY nook and cranny.

I'm not sure I've ever seen a free floating one? What's it look like?

Glad to hear everything is going good!


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## Hoosier Tank

lilcountrygal said:


> I'm not sure I've ever seen a free floating one? What's it look like?


Well, what I saw was EXTREMELY small. If it wasn't right up to the glass directly in front of me as I was checking my fish I would have never seen it. A TINY white worm jerking from straight to "U" shaped, Less than a 1/16" long and about the diameter of a hair if not even smaller. For a moment it went straight and stayed that way. I thought it died in front of my eyes, but then began jerking into a "U" again before the current carried it out of my sight.

I won't even be able to get half of my subsrtate vaccuumed, my rock pile is rather large in my 6' tank... :roll:


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## newbiecichlid99

i just had ick in my tank the salt and high temp didn;t seem to help i had temp at 86 as well !!! had break down and get med !!!


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## lilcountrygal

At 86 they cant reproduce anyway, Hoosier. So, even if its hanging out in the tank, it wont live long. If you can turn your temp up more, that would be good. As long as it isnt spreading. Id just vacuum the substrate best you can.

Heat/salt worked wonders for me. I see no more on any fish (including the catfish).

I googled ich. I'm not sure you can actually see ich without a microscope (other than the white dots). I could be WAY wrong on that tho. Are you sure you didnt just see a piece of debris/dust floating by? Are you sure it was alive?


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## newbiecichlid99

i am not sure of much at this point i am relatively new to these fish since july !!! have done tons of reading and 1 my good friends owns his own pet store and he has been my best info so far and says salt don;t work on parasite so


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## lilcountrygal

newbiecichlid99 said:


> i am not sure of much at this point i am relatively new to these fish since july !!! have done tons of reading and 1 my good friends owns his own pet store and he has been my best info so far and says salt don;t work on parasite so


well, I'm living proof it does :thumb: I definitely had ich on my fish. I definitely didnt add medicine. I definitely DID add salt/heat. There is definitely no more visible ich on my fish :lol:

Seriously tho... I think I caught mine very early. I'm not quite sure I would have had such a positive outcome had the fish been showing some type of distress.


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## 13razorbackfan

newbiecichlid99 said:


> i am not sure of much at this point i am relatively new to these fish since july !!! have done tons of reading and 1 my good friends owns his own pet store and he has been my best info so far and says salt don;t work on parasite so


It is the heat that is the most effective. Temp at 89.7 kills in free swimming stage...some say salt helps more with breathing than anything else so not totally sure on that. Temps at 86 will keep them from reproducing.

Meds are for sure another way to go but be careful as some will kill off all nitrifying bacteria and some meds can kill certain species of fish. Meds are only effective after ICH has fallen off of fish and in free swimming stage. The good thing about high heat...it speeds up lifecycle and heat over 86 stops from reproducing while 90 kills them only after they have fallen off fish.

I have used heat and salt...worked
I have used coppersafe...worked as well


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## 13razorbackfan

lilcountrygal said:


> newbiecichlid99 said:
> 
> 
> 
> i am not sure of much at this point i am relatively new to these fish since july !!! have done tons of reading and 1 my good friends owns his own pet store and he has been my best info so far and says salt don;t work on parasite so
> 
> 
> 
> well, I'm living proof it does :thumb: I definitely had ich on my fish. I definitely didnt add medicine. I definitely DID add salt/heat. There is definitely no more visible ich on my fish :lol:
> 
> Seriously tho... I think I caught mine very early. I'm not quite sure I would have had such a positive outcome had the fish been showing some type of distress.
Click to expand...

Keep doing your treatments though...

I am glad your ICH has started to retreat...that is awesome! :thumb:


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## lilcountrygal

13razorbackfan said:


> lilcountrygal said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> newbiecichlid99 said:
> 
> 
> 
> i am not sure of much at this point i am relatively new to these fish since july !!! have done tons of reading and 1 my good friends owns his own pet store and he has been my best info so far and says salt don;t work on parasite so
> 
> 
> 
> well, I'm living proof it does :thumb: I definitely had ich on my fish. I definitely didnt add medicine. I definitely DID add salt/heat. There is definitely no more visible ich on my fish :lol:
> 
> Seriously tho... I think I caught mine very early. I'm not quite sure I would have had such a positive outcome had the fish been showing some type of distress.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Keep doing your treatments though...
> 
> I am glad your ICH has started to retreat...that is awesome! :thumb:
Click to expand...

Its done more than retreat, razor. I think its completely gone. I know to keep the treatments going for another 7 days or so.

the only thing I see now is one spot on each of the cobues, and I cant be completely sure that its even ich. Both fish have it in the exact same spot on their anal fins. Just one "spot". The more I look, the more I think it isnt ich on them. Ill treat for 7 days... if its still there after 7 days, I'll go back to normal temp and change the saltwater for fresh. I'll keep an eye on those spots and if they start to spread, I'll start again.


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## 13razorbackfan

:thumb:


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## Hoosier Tank

That is great news *lilcountrygal*! Hope I have the same kind of luck.
Thanks for all your help *13razorbackfan* it is appreciated.


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## lilcountrygal

Razor... does this look like ich to you? Its not on the anal fin, I'm horrible at fin names. Could these be egg spots developing (even tho they're white?).



















both of these have the exact same spot, the exact same place.


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## newbiecichlid99

those are egg spots lilcountrygal i have a fully developed male and it started with white first


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## Hoosier Tank

yep, no worries on those spots!


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## lilcountrygal

WHEW. thank you. they looked bigger (like a small line) as compared to a dot. I was hoping egg spots started white, thanks.

The only bad news... they'll probably both be males.


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## newbiecichlid99

the female is alittle smaller and a greyish blue and mine has eggs spots as well doen;t mean anything


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## 13razorbackfan

Hoosier Tank said:


> That is great news *lilcountrygal*! Hope I have the same kind of luck.
> Thanks for all your help *13razorbackfan* it is appreciated.


You are very welcome!

Also...yeah those are eggspots lilcountrygal....they look healthy. Keep doing the treatments for sure so they don't come back.


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## SNDMN8Z

ICH seems to be gone so thanks for all your help. Although I lost some fish, that 14 day guarantee helped me get my money back minus $6 for one that decided to wait 15 days. But all my other fish lived and seemed to take the treatment well. I will be doing some tank maintenance this weekend to hopefully get it looking purdy and adding in my 4 Ruby Red juvies that have been in quarantine since this debacle started.


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## F15FreeEagle

So... I guess my first post on this forum will be reviving a 6 year old thread... Go me... Ha.  :lol:

Anyway, I came across this doing a google search because yesterday I noticed ich on 1 of my mbuna cichlids. :x I have debated in my own mind the course of action I want to take: meds or heat treatment. I have decided on heat treatment for the moment, as I am convinced I caught this pretty early. I have already done a water change (vacuuming the gravel also of course) and turned my 2 Fluval E300W heaters up (slowly!) to 87F. I also put in a couple of Aqueon Pro 200W heaters I had laying around and maxed them out (88F) (this is a 125 gallon aquarium.) I have 2 canister filters (Penn Plax, one being a 1500 Cascade, the other a 1000 Cascade) and currently have 4 airstones going, so water movement (oxygen) should not be an issue. My glass mercury thermometer says 86F at the moment, and the cichlids are being very active as I type this, so that is a good sign.

Anyway, thanks for all of the great advice here!


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## Smeagol

13razorbackfan said:


> I would raise temp to 87-89....at 86 ICH stops reproducing after they fall off the fish at around 89.7 it kills the ICH outright but only after it falls off the fish. ....... make sure it is at least 86 because at 86 the ICH can not reproduce and will eventually die after 4-5 days.


Resurrecting an old thread here. Is it true that ich can't reproduce in temperatures above 86F and will eventually die? I never heard that before, but 13razorbackfan was very confident in his claims about temperature.


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## DJRansome

I thought the raised temperature sped up the lifecycle and it would die sooner. I have not looked to see if there is newer research.


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