# Someone please explain to me what happened!!!!



## philipgonzales3 (Dec 4, 2013)

So my wooden tank stand had a wobble and was unlevel so I purchased a metal stand and set it up today. Things went smoother than I expected at first. I lowered the water level, put a tank divider in and caught all of the fish and put them in a 5 gallon bucket. I thought about putting an airstone in the water but I figured that they would be OK for a short period of time, if they could live in a bag for up to 48 hours as my supplier has posted on his website. This was probably illogical thinking on my part because a bucket and a bag are not the same thing. The bucket had aquarium water in it, about 2 gallons and I have 24 Mbuna. 8 Socolofi, 8 Yellow Labs, and * cynotalapia Zerbrodies. The fish were in the bucket for only 3 hours and the water temp dropped to 74 from 79.

When I went to go put the fish back in the tank I was shocked to see 3 or 4 fish laying on their sides. I then put them in the aquarium and they did this!!! was I suffocating them? or were they fighting? I don't understand and I feel kind of dumb now for not using more buckets and an airstone in the buckets. I figured they would be fine for a short period of time. The bucket water also tested 0 for ammonia and my tank has been cycled and the last water change I did was Friday and nitrates were low in the tank as I've been able to keep it below 20 so far.

The Socolofi appeared to be the most affected ones, I started putting them in the tank and they all started laying in the same corner...not cool.


Untitled by philipgonzales3, on Flickr

More fish started joining in. The yellow labs seemed to be the least affected.


Untitled by philipgonzales3, on Flickr

But they do seemed to join in a bit, even though they were swimming much better than everyone else.


Untitled by philipgonzales3, on Flickr

one Socolofi did appear to have some damage, This is the only fish with physical damage on him. This fish is really dark blue. Never seem it this color and I'm sure it must be a bad sign.


Untitled by philipgonzales3, on Flickr

The dark blue one seemed the most affected.


Untitled by philipgonzales3, on Flickr


Untitled by philipgonzales3, on Flickr

Within about 45 minutes every single fish, even the dark blue one that is still dark blue is swimming around going in and out of the caves, sifting through the sand and trying to get some algae off of the rocks. Like nothing even happened. This makes me believe that I will have no immediate losses, and I really do hope that I am right but what the heck happened here? I really need to get this figured out for next time. To me this was the craziest thing to see and then to see them just swimming around like nothing happened. The bucket was in the dark if that matters because it was their sleeping time so to speak.

oh yea and I reintroduced them into the tank at the same temp as the bucket. I waited until the heater in the tank caught up with the temperature in the water if that makes sense.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

So what is the pH right out of the tap, and what is it after it's been in your tank for 24 hours? Do you know your kH and gH?

I assume you filled the tank back up with new fresh water from the tap. I'm thinking that you have a high kH, and that your pH rises over time such as in your tank. Fish are probably unaffected during a routine water change, but it could be quite the shock going from one to the other that quickly.

The bucket should have been aerated with that many fish. Most likely a lack of oxygen caused those fish to be laying on their sides.


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## philipgonzales3 (Dec 4, 2013)

The PH from the tap is 7.5 and it has always read 7.5 in all my aquariums as well. I will double check it but I'm pretty sure it will be 7.5 still. I believe we have hard water but I honestly have never checked my gH and kH, as I've been putting it off because I figured the fish were fine so why bother with something that I have no business messing with. I will purchase the test kit for this and report back so that at least I will have a better understanding of my water.

Well if I ever have to remove the fish even for a little while I will be sure to run air stones and place the fish in multiple buckets. I got lucky this time.


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## philipgonzales3 (Dec 4, 2013)

I forgot to mention, the new tap water was also cloudy coming out of our taps and hoses and what not. The water was very white and I had never seen our water like this before. I looked it up on Google and it appears it is just air in the water and it is harmless. Is this true? I put the water in a cup and the white went away in a few minutes and cleared from the bottom up.

By the time the water heated up a bit it was much clearer as in the pics the water doesn't look white like it did when I put it in. Very strange to see water that white.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

I've heard of tap water having 'air' or gas in it, which can cause issues. I have no experience with this.

You can ask your LFS to check your water for gH and kH. They'll do it for free.


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## philipgonzales3 (Dec 4, 2013)

Do the big chain stores like petco and petsmart test the water for you? The LFS I go to is really small and the lady is very nice but she didn't even know what bio media was. She also told me she had ich in one of her tanks and 3 fish got sucked into her intake when I was there and they died. I doubt she would test it. The next store is 30 miles away and is one of the big chain stores.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

They do but it's with the strips. You could probably order one. They're like $12-15 I think.


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## philipgonzales3 (Dec 4, 2013)

I bought the nutrafin carbonate and general hardness test and I should get them tuesday. So too high of a kH is bad? I will test my PH when I get home both from the tap and the aquarium.


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## philipgonzales3 (Dec 4, 2013)

OK so I test my PH again today and got the usual results of 7.5 from the tap and the aquarium. So I was like um OK PH is the same right? well something told me that this may be incorrect so I tried the tests again except this time I shook the liquid bottles for the high PH test and sure enough my tap still shows 7.5 and my aquarium shows a PH of 8 on two tests. I can't believe that it doesn't indicate that you have to shake the PH tests to get an accurate result. I am using the API master kit and I know for sure the nitrate test has to be shaken super well. Have you heard of this? I just couldn't believe that I had been doing the test wrong/ getting inaccurate results with my PH this whole time.

So is this difference in PH a problem? If I ever have to move the fish for some reason into a 100% changed tank or whatever I can just drip accumulate them? or no? thanks for the help :thumb:


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

A high kH is not bad. My tap is 7.4 pH, but allowed to sit out overnight, it rises to 8.4. My kH is crazy high.

I wouldn't worry about the difference too much for regular water changes. I think it may have been something else you experienced.

I've never shook the pH bottles before so I can't comment on that. Sorry. I do know that you can get conflicting results between the low and high range bottles. Some people shake every bottle prior to each test.


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## forever_fishing (Jan 12, 2014)

*** had similar experiences with my Africans after a big water change what I believe it is they get scared abd stressed out and you also took them out so once you put them In they had new fish syndrome so they just hide, what I normally do it turn the lights off after a big change


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## philipgonzales3 (Dec 4, 2013)

So I just tested my gH and kH and my gH tested at 140 mg/l (ppm) and my kH tested at 90 mg/L (ppm). This was taken directly from the aquarium, and my last water change was Saturday and today is Tuesday.

This are the readings from my tap. gH 160 mg/l (ppm) and kH 110 mg/l (ppm).

Is the acceptable? Ideal? not ideal? what are the ideal ranges? I will probably not attempt to adjust these parameters unless necessary but still I want to know what the ideal range is supposed to be. Thank you for your time.


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## Chester B (Dec 28, 2012)

Sounds to me like you had oversaturation of oxygen, since your water was cloudy and quickly cleared. You are lucky this can kill fish within minutes if its too high. Once the oxygen started to off gas and return to normal levels your fish started acting normally again. Unfortunately I had to learn this the hard way, and I can say I now take precautions before any water change. I fill rubber maid garbage cans to let the the oxygen off gas for 24 hours, or I put in a submersible pump and mix the water for at least half an hour before I add it to the tank. This seems to be a little known problem with aquariums.


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## Sandy13 (Feb 1, 2014)

Hi, over saturation of oxygen was your problem when putting your fish back in the tank, that's why they went to the bottom. The cloudy appearance of the water is caused by minute bubbles, which clear from the bottom up as they float to the surface and naturally disperse. All you need to do is leave new water to stand til it clears. Hope this helps.


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## philipgonzales3 (Dec 4, 2013)

Thanks for the info, that sounds very reasonable to me. I'm so glad they recovered quickly. There's a lot for the beginner like me to learn that's why I'm glad this forum is here. I learns something new everyday.


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