# Eretmodus cyanostictus, anyone bred this fish?



## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

Eretmodus cyanostictus, anyone bred this fish? anyone have any experience with this fish, i'd like to hear... thanks...


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

I have some and they breed regularly.


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## @nt!x (Feb 9, 2009)

I have some coming to me in the mail today. Cant wait to receive them.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

What do you want to know? They breed regularly in captivity. You can search the library and this forum for previous threads on the topic, or I'd be happy to answer specific questions. They are wonderful fish! :thumb:


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## Petrochromislover (Feb 23, 2009)

how many eretmodus do you have? do you have a pair? what size tank are they in?


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

Petrochromislover said:


> how many eretmodus do you have? do you have a pair? what size tank are they in?


I have 4 in a 75 gallon with various lamps and 11 in a 50 gallon with xenos.


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## Rick_Lindsey (Aug 26, 2002)

How are they as parents? Do any of the species have more parental instincts than the others?

-Rick (the armchair aquarist)


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

> how many eretmodus do you have? do you have a pair? what size tank are they in?


I currently have ~20. 2 old cranky bachelors, 2 young pairs (in separate tanks), a handful of unpaired young adults, and a fry tank with month old fry.

All of the pairs of breeding gobies I have had were in 4 ft tanks.



> How are they as parents? Do any of the species have more parental instincts than the others?


They're terrible. Once the fry are spit, they are fair game. Fry must be removed from the parents if there's any reasonable chance to raise them to adulthood.


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

triscuit said:


> > how many eretmodus do you have? do you have a pair? what size tank are they in?
> 
> 
> I currently have ~20. 2 old cranky bachelors, 2 young pairs (in separate tanks), a handful of unpaired young adults, and a fry tank with month old fry.
> ...


I've bred them in a 3 footer. Also I agree with triscuit, worst parents ever...


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## daniel4832 (May 8, 2004)

You both left out that they are biparental mouthbrooders, with the female brooding the eggs first then passing them to the father. You need to wait until the father has had them for over a week before removing.
Great fish!!!
Thanks,
Daniel


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## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

well i've read about them quite alot on the net, there's not much info about them... i know that they're bi-parental. after how long does the female pass the eggs to the male.. i have a tank with leptosomas, young Calvus, Juli's and young Callochromis Macrops "ndole", i was thinking of getting 6 Eretmodus cyanostictus for the tank, i hear they do good with other fish but might be a little aggressive with each other... i have a 360 liter tank with quite a lot of rocks and hiding places... is this ok?


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## daniel4832 (May 8, 2004)

Your set-up sounds good. Getting 6 is a good number as it allows them to pick there own mate and helps spread out the aggression. Normally the female and male both hold for about 10 days, but since fish don't always read the books they may hold longer, I had a female that wouldn't pass to the male and held for up to 3 weeks, and I had another pair that would switch back and forth every couple of days. But on the whole except them each to hold for about 10 days. 
Thanks,
Daniel


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

lior said:


> well i've read about them quite alot on the net, there's not much info about them... i know that they're bi-parental.


 :wink: That's why I didn't state the obvious.



> after how long does the female pass the eggs to the male?


 It can vary between 10-14 days, depending on how much practice the couple has had. They bicker quite a bit when negotiating the transfer. I had one male breeding with 2 females, and he managed to convince both of the girls to give up their broods on the same day, even though they spawned 3 days apart. opcorn: :lol:



> i have a tank with leptosomas, young Calvus, Juli's and young Callochromis Macrops "ndole", i was thinking of getting 6 Eretmodus cyanostictus for a 360 liter tank


How long is this tank? I think those are good tank mates for gobies if you think there's still room for one more species.

One major advantage of gobies is that they don't stake out territory, but that also means they invade every other tank mate's territory. They are pretty much bulletproof from aggression from other species, but will tear each other apart regularly. [/quote]

Starting with six is the best way to make sure you get a compatible pair... but you will need to move out the extras or they will be killed. However, gobies are pretty rough on their chosen partner too, so be careful about moving out the wrong fish!


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## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

> triscuit said:
> 
> 
> > It can vary between 10-14 days, depending on how much practice the couple has had. They bicker quite a bit when negotiating the transfer. I had one male breeding with 2 females, and he managed to convince both of the girls to give up their broods on the same day, even though they spawned 3 days apart. opcorn: :lol:
> > quote]


isn't it a monogomus fish? how did he mate with 2 females together?

and if i do have 2 pairing up, could i leave the others in the tank?


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

I have 1 male in with 3 females, he consistently breeds with the 2 smaller females the larger one is ignored. I don't know that you'll be able to keep only 6 in that size of aquarium, gobies can be kept in a colony, but you'd have to devote your tank to them, similar to tropheus. I think you'd be pushing your luck trying to keep only 6, you'd be better off with a single pair, but every situation is unique. The gobies will let you know what they want you to do, one way or another... :lol:

The gobies I keep in a colony are pretty friendly with one another, I'm considering trying the colony approach in an aquarium where I keep something like 15 gobies with 15 tropheus, but that's an experiment for a later day.


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## daniel4832 (May 8, 2004)

lior,
This my experience, I have 6 in a 75 gl with other fish. I have two breeding pairs and two "lone wolfs" I think the extras keep the pairs from fighting as much. I think your set-up should work as is.
Thanks,
Daniel


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## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

thanks mates... 
i'll give it a go, cheers...
i'll keep you updated...


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## Jolly cichlids (Jun 19, 2009)

i have a pair that breeds regularily eretmodus cyanistictus makombe. They are in a 23 long by themselves, yes they bicker a bit but if you give them enough hiding spots they'll do great. Mine do not eat their fry and i cull the fry after a bunch are noticed swimming around. But i always leave a few in to keep the parents bond strong so they don't forget how to do it. Fry are fair game if its not the parents but i have never seen my gobies eat their own fry.


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## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

i just got eretmodus cyanistictus "bulu point"... anyone had experience with these as i see that every sub-species has a different behaviour.


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

It's not a subspecies, just a collection point.  I would say that each individual fish has a different behavior, and that your experience will be unique.

I've had terrific success breeding my multiple generations of E. cyanostictus, but I hear from several advanced hobbyists that can not get a pair to form, no matter how big the tank or how many gobies they start with. So, congrats on the new purchase, and let us know how it goes. :thumb:


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## Jolly cichlids (Jun 19, 2009)

ones that are collected from the north usually practice monogamous just female holding, and southern collected practice bi-parental mouthbrooding female/male mouthbrood. hope this helps


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## mielkeal (Mar 3, 2006)

There is an eretmodus variant in the US right now called blue point, not Bulu Point. Its possible that is what you have. I got a wild pair a few months ago and thought that they meant Bulu Point but the importer said no its blue point. They have bred twice but I had to separarte the pair because the male was constantly chasing the female to the point of torn fins. I have them back together now. Both parents held.


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

Jolly cichlids said:


> ones that are collected from the north usually practice monogamous just female holding, and southern collected practice bi-parental mouthbrooding female/male mouthbrood. hope this helps


This just isn't true....

Spathodus marlieri are the only gobies from lake tang. that are not bi parental.


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## Jolly cichlids (Jun 19, 2009)

sarah you better do some researching because this is true my makombe's only the female holds

*The southern,Zambian form, is characterized by biparental mouthbrooding,while the northern, or Burundian form is a maternal mouthbrooder. The type material of Eretmodus cyanostictus was collected at Kinyamkolo, in the southern part of the Lake.

I'm not trying to be biased here but my female makombe is holding presently,and she will still be holding till she spits in a week always has. They are a northern type 

http://www.cichlidae.com/article.php?id=61*


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

opcorn:

I'd love to see the link.

Unless I've been nutz all these years of breeding gobies.....


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## Jolly cichlids (Jun 19, 2009)

also what lcalities have you bred any northern. Knowing your locality in any fish is key when breeding


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

Jolly...

I have bred the northern erets and the southern ones. Many different locations over the years.

When I first bred them... gobies didn't come into the states with a locale...

I have .right now...

blue point
kigoma


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

that article was written in 1982.


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## Jolly cichlids (Jun 19, 2009)

just cause it's from 1982 doesn't make it untrue like my rymthe. I don't know what to say i've bred two northen types and both have practiced maternal mouthbrooding maybe it's my canadian water lol. Maybe i'm an anomily.I didn't want to get into a heated debate jsut posting what has happened in my experience


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

I respect your experience... :thumb:

It's just news to me. My male is holding right now :lol:

Anyone else have this experience?

Like I have always said... every goby pair is different. I just didn't think that different :wink:

In the back to nature guide.... it states bi-parental as well for sp. north.

I'm confused :?


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

All E. cyanostictus would be bi parental if environmental conditions allowed for it. Sometimes due to external circumstances males won't take eggs from their females, but this is usually not the case. I've had it happen to me on occaision, but I don't think its the norm. There is nothing in recent literature stating that E. cyanostictus is anything other than a bi-parental mouthbrooder regardless of location in the lake.


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

I agree with you...

I have seen males refuse... but the female wanted him to take the eggs. Usually in small tanks too....

Spathodus marlieri ... they are different though.... never had a male carry.

Anyone else have a male carry with them? I've had two pairs.... neither male did.


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

I've never had Spathodus marlieri males carry eggs either.


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## Jolly cichlids (Jun 19, 2009)

i also have never seen spathodus male carry, Yeah maybe my male gobies just were lazy. I would't stick a mouthfull of little suckers in my mouth lol


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

opcorn: Can I jump into the fray? :wink:

First off, Jolly- welcome to Cichlid Forum. Do some reading, post some pictures, enjoy the wonderful resources and years of recent expertise available. :thumb:

Now, please, clarify exactly why you think your very recent experience with breeding these fish allows you to not only generalize for the species but also shoot down those with much more experience than you? :roll: Last month you posted on Ontario Aquaria Club that you finally got *your first pair* of Eretmodus cyanistictus, and that it was a very rough courting period between the two fish. If you "saved her from extinction twice" then obviously the pair bond was not good and that the male was beating the living fins off the female anytime she tried to pass the fry.

My experience, with E. cyanostictus from the Mpulungu region, on my third generation now, is that if the pair bond is strong, the male will take the eggs. With a less stable, more damaging mating, the female may be forced to carry the eggs.

There's many things we didn't know in the 80's, and with any field related research, it's best to look for updated information. Not that they were necessarily wrong, just that we know more now from decades more of observation.

$0.02


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## Jolly cichlids (Jun 19, 2009)

just because i made one post about that locality of fish does not mean i have not bred eretmodus for over 13 years now from different localities. Sometimes all info is not posted. I have just relcently joined forums but have been breedingand importing Tangs for over 15 years so maybe i think i have some experience in this area. I didn't come on here to have to explain myself or my experiences.

my 0.02cents


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## Jolly cichlids (Jun 19, 2009)

"then obviously the pair bond was not good and that the male was beating the living fins off the female anytime she tried to pass the fry". i also didn't write this part so please don't put words into my mouth. The male never beats her up now even with their fry and they are like glue never seperated. So no they are a good pair

thanks


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

Jolly I did not mean to jump on you... I'm sorry if it came off that way.

I had never heard that before.... nor read it, nor seen it myself...

That doesn't mean it isn't possible.


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## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

triscuit said:


> It's not a subspecies, just a collection point.  I would say that each individual fish has a different behavior, and that your experience will be unique.
> 
> I've had terrific success breeding my multiple generations of E. cyanostictus, but I hear from several advanced hobbyists that can not get a pair to form, no matter how big the tank or how many gobies they start with. So, congrats on the new purchase, and let us know how it goes. :thumb:


ya thats true, but don't forget that different points make them evolve differently, in colour, behaviour, size... i know that there is a big problem today as in specifying this fish into sub-spiecies because they are different from one and other... for instance from my own experience comparing the Cyanosticus "Kasanga" to the Cynosticus "bulu point" their mouth structure is very different, the "Kasanga" has a wider mouth and grows larger too... just because today they are still called same species doesn't mean they are the same... remember "pseudotropheus"?


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

Very good points lior...

My point of bringing the date of the article up was that gobies have been divided up since that article.

Ever evolving...


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## daniel4832 (May 8, 2004)

WOW  Tricuit, please don't "welcome" me to anything!
Daniel


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

Longstocking... You are much more diplomatic than I! 

Daniel... please notice that I did not attack, disparage or misrepresent the poster's comments. I simply felt that his experience did not justify implying that Longstocking was ignorant about gobies. What forums do you visit where you start by disparaging the moderators?



> different points make them evolve differently, in colour, behaviour, size


Maybe, with sufficient geographic distance and environmental selection pressures... and I don't know that we have enough data on E. cyanostictus in the wild to make these generalizations. I'm not advocating mixing collection points, but it is difficult to define phenotypes by collection point for gobies, let alone find anyone with enough research money and time to identify archetypal behavior differences in wild goby populations. The next issue is that even reputable importers can't or won't identify collection points, and once you get to F1s, does it matter?

Here's one of my favorite websites about E. cyanostictus collection points: 
http://www.destin-tanganyika.com/Articl ... tmodus.htm


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## Darkside (Feb 6, 2008)

I still don't buy it. :lol:


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## @nt!x (Feb 9, 2009)

I just got a pair of these little sucka's and they are super cool. Such quirky personalities, I cant wait until they start to breed. :thumb:

continue on


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## daniel4832 (May 8, 2004)

Triscuit,
I think he was disagreeing with Sarah, not being disparaging. You on the other hand, IMO, where being disparaging. You seem to be attacking him rather then his opinions.
Does anyone have any northern E. cyanostictus (I haven't seen any for years) and can personally relate their breeding habits? I thought they were bi-parental mouth brooders, but it's been so long that I'm not 100% sure!


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

kigoma is considered a northern variant. They have the underslung mouth which is the difference....

I have a pair... the male holds.

Daniel and triscuit... please stop.

yeah I have been breeding these guys a while and kept many many many many pairs..... That doesn't mean I know everything about them :wink:


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## zebra7 (Jan 24, 2004)

I spawn E. cyanostictus Kapampa, beautiful goby. I have 2 wild pair's in a 180, along side a group of Petro. red fin Longola. These gobies hang in there with the aggresive Petro's, and spawn on a regular basis. Great pair bond's with the group, egg's are alway's passed back and forth between the sexe's. The two pair's want nothing to do with eachother, and will fight in pair's at time's in the middle of the tank. It's funny that they do battle as a pair 80% of the time. Great fish !


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## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

well i have now 6 "bulu point" F0, so once they breed i wil update and give you my experience. by the way, does anyone know if "bulu Point" and "Blue Point" is the same place? I know that there are many called species that are "Bulu Point" and many that are "Blue Point". please don;t answer if you don't know...


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## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

triscuit said:


> Longstocking... You are much more diplomatic than I!
> 
> Daniel... please notice that I did not attack, disparage or misrepresent the poster's comments. I simply felt that his experience did not justify implying that Longstocking was ignorant about gobies. What forums do you visit where you start by disparaging the moderators?
> 
> ...


by the way, good website... anyone have any other websires like this, of collecting points, even of other species... and also if you have good websites or articals about gobies i'd love to read too... thanks...


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## Longstocking (Aug 26, 2003)

bulu point and blue point are different fish. I'm not positive on the collection point but blue point is a southern variant. Bulu point is a northern fish.

Again the difference is in the shape of the mouth.

Blue point is a trade name traditionally associated with Zambia waters.


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## lior (Sep 16, 2004)

my "Bulu Point" looks nothing like the "Bulu Point" from the website...
http://www.destin-tanganyika.com/Articl ... on-eretmod us.htm


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