# Cycling new tank...how long before adding fish?



## srook23 (Feb 21, 2009)

Ok, I got a 120g. coming in Thursday. I've got some new fish coming in on Friday.

I have a well established 55g. right now with about 10 african males in it and some other rescue fish.

I was thinking about draining as much of the water as I could into a 30g. tub and then putting the fish in there then putting as much of the tank water as possible into the 120g. then filling it up. After I get the 120g. full I was going to remove the well ran Emperor 400 from the 55g and put it on the 120g. and let it run to build up the bacteria levels in the tank.

After I get all this done I was going to start putting the water from the 30g. container back into the 55g. and then top it off and kick it back on.

Adding some well established tank water and running the filter from an established tank, how long should it take to cycle the new tank? I was thinking it should build up the bacteria pretty fast, but I've never cycled before...in the past I've always just thrown the fish into the tank...oops. Never lost a fish like that before.

Also if I use this method to set up the new tank would it help to add a few fish soon to the 120g. to help the cycle move faster??


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## Morpheus (Nov 12, 2008)

The tank water isn't going to do much good. You're better off using the established filter, substrate and anything else that you had in the 55g tank. How many new fish, and what size, are you adding to the 120?


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## Rick_Lindsey (Aug 26, 2002)

Presumably you have more than one filter on the 55, and plan to leave the Emp400 on the new 120g?

If it were me, I'd get the 120 set up on thursday, with fresh clean water (dechlorinated of course), get the heater in there and any new filters that you're planning to use. Then when the fish get there friday, add them to the new tank and move the Emp400 from the 55 to the 120 at that time. Go ahead and replace the emp400 on the 55 if you need the extra filtration at that time.

You now have an established filter in each tank, and the new filters will start to gather bacteria as well. What you don't want to do is move an established filter to an empty tank, since the bacteria need to eat!

If the Emp400 is the only filter you have on the 55 then you'll have to do things a bit differently, and it will depend on what sort of filters you're planning for the 120. I'd be thinking about things like taking half of the filtration media out of the Emp400 and putting it into whatever filter you're using on the 120 (which is easy if it's another emp400, but more difficult if it's something like a cannister filter).

-Rick (the armchair aquarist)


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## Malawidolphin (Dec 15, 2006)

Putting a "well seeded" filter on the 120g with no amonia source will only kill off the bacteria in the filter. You should be adding amonia or fish to feed the bacteria. if you add amionia you should be watching your readings until Amonia and Nitrite zero out each day. If you choose to add fish then you have to monitor closely and be prepare to do several water changes if you see an Amonia/Nitrite spike. Will there still be an established filter on the 55g for when you return those fish to the tank? If not they will also go through an amonia/Nitrite spike. Tank water holds very little beneficial bacteria, if you could move some of the substrate also, then that would help.


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## srook23 (Feb 21, 2009)

I think in total it's going to be about 43 africans going in the 120; although 20 are demasoni.

I have the Emperor 400 and an XP2 on the 55 right now. I am planning to put 2 XP3's on the 120. I was going to set up the tank and put both XP3's on there and then put the Emperor 400 on for a few days and then put it back on the 55. I thought that would help "jump start" the bacteria in the XP3's. IDK.

I have like 34 new fish coming in Friday and they won't have a home so I guess it's ok to go ahead and add them to the tank? That's what I was really wondering about.


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## webgirl74 (Jan 30, 2009)

Agree with Malawidolphin. The seeded filter put into a new tank with all fresh tap water will not cycle the tank instantly. You'll be putting your new fish at great risk if you do that. In future, set up the new tank first and then order the fish. You can speed up the nitrogen cycle with household ammonia (directions are in the library section on here) and literally cut the cycling time to less than half. You'd probably be better off putting the new fish in the established tank temporarily, although they should really be quarantined. Better yet, if you can get ahold of a small quarantine tank, fill it 100% with water from your established tank and use one of the established filters. Then you'll have a prepped tank that you can quarantine the new fish in before adding them to your 120 gallon.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

If I'm reading this right, I think you could be in for a rough time with these fish. You're adding 43 fish on 
Friday, is that correct? And that's only a day after setting up?

Your best bet is to move one of the filters to the 120 and leave it there for several weeks while you get 
the XP3's set up and established. Even then, I'd be very surprised if you don't see some ammonia/nitrite 
spikes from those 43 fish. Moving the one filter for a few days like you suggested and then moving it 
back will do little to jump start the new filters. You'd definitely have some serious ammonia/nitrite 
issues with that plan. The water from the 55 isn't going to help with cycling. I wouldn't bother with 
trying to use it and moving fish temporarily to the tub. I don't see any gain from that, just stressed fish.

The odds of not having fish losses here are very low IMO. You'll need to be prepared to detox any spikes 
and dilute with water changes. Maybe I'm just misreading and you're not adding all of those at once. If 
the 43 number is eventual load and you're starting out with just a few, then better odds for success. But, 
I'd still move one filter and leave it there for weeks, not days.

The best plan would be to put a hold on the fish order, move a filter, and fishless cycle using the 
established filter to seed the XP3's. Should take about 7-10 days at most. Then you'd be able to 
add a full load of fish and sleep at night too


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## nauTik (Mar 18, 2009)

I agree, if you can put the fish order on hold it will save you a lot of stress for both you and your fish...


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## Bweb (Mar 31, 2009)

the fastest tank cycle I've ever heard about took 9 days and that's with an established filter and the use of 80 rosies as cycling fish by the 9th day only 20 or so rosies were left alive but not in good health but the tank was cycled However a newly cycled tank is not stable and is deffinatly not ready to support 43 fish which is to many for a 120gal established tank from all the research I've done. GOOD LUCK

You will need to do water changes often which totally slows down the cycling process it will take up to 6 weeks That's what happen to me with a 29gal that I put 5 small fish into prematurely.

I'm not trying to be negative just realistic a used filter will speed things up but won't cycle it in one day 

I hope everything goes ok get ready for lots of water changes.


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## Morpheus (Nov 12, 2008)

Bweb said:


> You will need to do water changes often which totally slows down the cycling process


Just curious, but how so?


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## Bweb (Mar 31, 2009)

Just curious, but how so?[/quote]

The bacteria does'nt just grow in the filters its in the gravel and any other nook and cranny When you do the water changes it usually disturbs all these other areas.

That's just my opinion from cycling tanks both ways it always takes me longer to cycle a tank when trying to control nitrite levels with water changes as opposed to just letting the tank stu and allow the bacteria to build up.

And does'nt any body else thing that's a large amount of fish even under ideal conditions.

Again no offense to srook23 I've totally just thrown fish in a tank two days after set up I did'nt even know about the N. cycle until a year after I started my first tank in 1984 The fish usually lived two but I was'nt aware that it was damaging to their health in the long run.


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## srook23 (Feb 21, 2009)

Until joining this site I had never heard of such a thing as cycling. I just filled the tank and threw fish in LOL. My bad. I wanted to do this one right. I might set up the 120 and add a few fish and let it sit for a while and keep the rest in the established 55g.

I didn't think 43 was too much for a 120 being that 20 are demasoni and 10 are yellow labs. Idk.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

> which totally slows down the cycling process


There's no logical reason for that to be so. If you mess around with filters, etc, it's possible to disrupt 
the bacteria, but not by doing water changes alone. You don't remove bacteria when you remove 
water alone, not an appreciable amount anyway. If you do a 'massive' water change, then you might 
disrupt them. I've seen that happen and can only speculate that a sudden change in water parameters 
was the reason. But, generally speaking, moderate water changes during cycling while not disturbing 
the rest of the system does not disrupt things. I've done it many times.

And I might add that so have many others here when trying to save their fish from toxic levels of 
ammonia and nitrite. You have to do what you need to do to save the fish. The cycle will happen.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

srook23 said:


> Until joining this site I had never heard of such a thing as cycling. I just filled the tank and threw fish in LOL. My bad. I wanted to do this one right. I might set up the 120 and add a few fish and let it sit for a while and keep the rest in the established 55g.
> 
> I didn't think 43 was too much for a 120 being that 20 are demasoni and 10 are yellow labs. Idk.


Go fishless using one of the filters from the 55 and you can add a full load of fish in about 10 days.

I don't see how anyone can say 43 is too many when they don't even know your final stock list. I'd 
suggest posting it in the appropriate section of this forum for feedback.


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## alicem (Jul 26, 2007)

I don't think they are saying 43 fish is overstocking your tank size. 
I believe they meant that adding 43 fish, all at once in an uncycled tank, is too many.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

> I don't think they are saying 43 fish is overstocking your tank size.
> I believe they meant that adding 43 fish, all at once in an uncycled tank, is too many.


You may be right, alicem, but that's kind of how I read this too.



> which is to many for a 120gal established tank from all the research I've done. GOOD LUCK


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## alicem (Jul 26, 2007)

prov356 said:


> > I don't think they are saying 43 fish is overstocking your tank size.
> > I believe they meant that adding 43 fish, all at once in an uncycled tank, is too many.
> 
> 
> ...


Hummm... yep, I see... missed it earlier. 
You're right, need to post that question, probably in the Malawi section, for feedback on stocking limits.


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## Bweb (Mar 31, 2009)

BWEB WISHES TO PRINT A RETRACTION :thumb:

My reply my have come off a bit harsh That is not what I intended

When I first read this post I was worried about all those fish and srook23's investment Into all those fish.

The bottom line is It's your tank and you will have Fun with it

If it helps you with your time line I set up my 125gal two weeks ago FX5 and Fluval405 ran the filters for 4 days Stole a real good amount of media out of two other canister filters from two of my established tank's and put it in the fx5 put 25 to 30 rosies in their (I know fishles cycling is the rage) and at the end of the second week my ammonia is zero and my nitrite is down to .25 ppm Nitrate 20ppm So seeding the filter will help you speed things up :thumb:

So my apology's to you and everyone else and my respect to every one on this forum their are a lot of great minds to draw wisdom from.

Take what you need and leave the rest Happy fish Keeping :thumb:


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## srook23 (Feb 21, 2009)

What I ended up doing was getting the tank Thursday. I set it up on Friday. I got some bacteria stuff to put in the water to help establish it...I know some people don't think this stuff works, but it worked well for me.

I put all new substrate and used none from the old tank. I did put one of the filters from the 55g on the tank along with a brand new XP3. I had all 43 fish in the tank by Friday night and they are doing fine. I took ammonia readings all throughout the day on Friday, Saturday, and Sunday...my ammonia never got over 0.5. Nitrates were not bad either. Tank was completely clear after adding bacteria stuff and giving it about an hour. Did all the tests before I started adding fish. Added a couple every couple hours and continued testing throughout. Thusfar there have been no problems, all fish are doing fine, and seem to be happy and unstressed. No fish losses.


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