# Tank based on C. Moori blue dolphin



## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

I'm planning to upgrade my 90 to a 125 sometime soon. I have 5 blue dolphins growing out in a 50 with 2 venestus. I would like to have a peacock hap tank with the main focus on some large dolphins. I would like a few other peaceful haps or peacocks to go in as well. I would like breeding so no cross breeding wanted. So fish I would like to breed would be blue dolphin, Taiwan reef, and maybe one other species that wouldn't cross breed, peacock or hap. I currently have a single male juvi taiwan reef, along with 3 hap 44 red fin. 1m 2f. Male is currently not dominant hopefully will change after I remove most my other fish. I would like nice color contrast but also keep it peaceful. Also if you can recommend some good bottom feeders that wouldn't complicate the spawning. I will be getting all juvis so I have time to grow out in my 50 and 90 before I get a 6ft. I actually wasn't interested in this until 2 pairs of convicts I was given just spawned and I now have about 100 fry swimming around in my 90. I love it. I should add, my blue dolphins are around 2 inches, my Taiwan reef 2.5 just starting to get blue on his face, and my hap 44 are 4-4.5 but I don't know if I will use them in this tank.


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## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

cyrtocara moorii have to be about the slowest growing longest to mature malawi out there. I am sure someone might have gotten spawns in under two years but I have not been that lucky. I really like this fish and have four of them for three or four years now with one around 8" while the others are taking their time to put on size.

Good luck with your group :thumb:


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

Yep that's fine that's one reason why I want a few other haps breeding in the meantime. I may grab 3 or so more just so I end up with a good mf ratio when they're adults


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

You mention bottom feeders. I have five moori growing out and they are the most bottom feeding of any African I've seen. They are frequently found plunging into the sand as if they were going after food. They go nuts for algae tabs. You may not need any bottom feeders. They are slow growing for sure. i find they do not really bother anybody else much. I have had a variety of other haps and labs while watching them grow in a 75. They chase each other and the others do the same but otherwise each ignores the others. Yellow labs, hap ahli, lab "Hongi", all seem to work with no problems. Each of the other groups have bred me out of spare tank space until I got tired of them and traded for others. Hongi are the current breeding group and other than getting sick of tearing down the rocks to catch holding females, I have no problems with the group.


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

Thanks for your comment. Your absolutely right, I knew they were sand sifters but I totally forgot about using them as bottom feeders. My juvi don't go higher than an inch or two from the substrate. I'm going to get a few more juvis my next stop at the whole saler, and I won't even bother with other bottom feeders, I will just keep my current SAE who does a great job on cleaning. It will be only cichlids. Any ideas on which other species would do good? I have the BD, the Taiwan reef, possibly hap 44, what else would you guys recommend? Maybe yellow or ruby red peacocks? Red fin borleyi? Something vibrant with color Or interesting looking but not too aggressive. Also how many of each species would be good as a final stocking for what I will have down the road a 125?I was thinking 1m 4f C. Moori, 1m 3f Taiwan reef, and if I do keep them 1m 2f hap 44.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I may be lucky or just have dumb fish but I really do not have much trouble with the stocking question. I have had numbers that were totally off the recommended and found no significant trouble. I had 5M-1F yellow labs in this tank at one point and the main problem was that she was always holding! I do keep plenty of rock for them but as far as any true aggression, I found none worth worry. Once holding, the female has the right of way and all others defer to her so there was no problem there. I think a lot of the hobby ideas came about when African's were first imported and they have stayed the same since. Unfortunately some of the early imports were the really aggressive ones that are now sold as "assorted Africans". If you stock zebra, aurautus, and such, you have to watch out. If you stock the calm types, you have far less trouble.


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## paradigmsk8er (Apr 13, 2009)

stocking mbuna vs stocking haps and peacocks can be a very different animal...

In my experience with hap/aulonocara tanks you can do the best you can to get the "stocking" right but it rarely turns out with your intentions. I have "calm" peacocks in my tank that are flat out nasty, I have "bottom feeders" that don't leave the top 6" of the tank, etc...it tends to be a hit or miss type thing, besides some of the obvious conflicts due to size (champs) or aggression (very similar peacocks and haps)..


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I think part of our problem with stocking tanks is due to the information we read. When I read profile information on various cichlids, I often see that the information carried on various sites are written word for word the same. It leads me to wonder how much actual research led to this "information" if it all comes out in the same words. Maybe it is too easy to just copy and paste? I have some really old books written back when Africans were beginning to become available and some of that same information is still in the press today. Maybe it is time for a really true fresh look at what these fish do and what we know about them? I'm not saying that all the information is untrue but there surely has been a few things learned over the last thirty some years that might be useful to us common hobby sorts.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

Excellent Thread Chunkanese,

I'm heading off this week end to pick up my 180 and some c Moori. You say you have 5 and are adding some more. I was thinking 5 for my tank but interested how many your thinking about. I didn't know they were sand sifters. I'll post some pic's when I'm set up, hopefully later this week end, placing them temporarily in my 150(just finished cycling) till the 180 is done.

Good times :dancing:

I'm following this one with interest.


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

Okay so I bought 6 more which were $3 per fish at 2 inches. This way I can guarantee to get atleast a few females and will only keep one male and sell the rest once sexed. I did see "4 blue dolphins but they were $9 each (good price) but I want to document their growth. I also got 4 more looking Taiwan reef which I plan to house with them. Unfortunately looks like I have 3 males. Have thread in ID discussion pics are coming. They are all currently in my 50 grow out until next week when I move out my mbuna and catfish from my 90. I don't want to keep mbuna with them as tankmates. I may keep my 1 acei however but only as a solitary fish as they tend to be peaceful. I figure they can stay in my 90 for atleast a year if need be. Anyone have recommendations for other hap or peaceful peacocks that would make good tankmates? I would like to finish with 5-6 adult blue dolphins, 4 Taiwan reef, what else? Another red or yellow colored species would be great.


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

Juststayinthecave- I would imagine you can keep plenty C. Moori in a 180. Do you plan on keeping other fish eith them or a single species tank. And yep my moori have been sifting sand their entire lives as of this time. I'm sure as adults they will use more height in the tank but I don't plan on keeping any catfish or other cleaners with them other than my 1 SAE. I don't want the cats to interfere with possible spawning down the road. I know it may be a long time but that's fine with me. And as for the other posters your both right, mbuna are very aggressive but I find alot of the info to be dated and usually these set in stone rules which are never meant to be broken are simply guidelines from the earliest fishkeepers which simply may have had extra aggressive specimens. I broke all the rules and my fish are thriving. Also most my fish like to hang out at the top of the tank where there's more of a current, even though most cichlids are said to hardly use the top 50 percent.


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## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

Chunkanese said:


> >snip<
> Another red or yellow colored species would be great.


Male copadichromis Borleyi show a nice red body and blue face when mature.

You do not need to worry too much about c. moori as they can stand up for themselves with pretty much the best of them. They get pretty large, even though like time it takes forever, and they don't back down from a fight easily. They just don't go looking for trouble except on occassion with each other.


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

Heres a quick video shot from my cell phone of my grow up tank. its a bowfront 55 filled 5/8 full. Not made to look good, just ease of access to net fish but provide them with an adequate habitat.
The fish are all from 1-2 inches. Its a large mix, but theyre not all for me. and most will be moved out once they hit 2-2.5 inches. Heres a list of the species.

Demasoni
C Moori Blue Dolphin
Venestus
Protomelas Mbenji (thick lip)
Taiwan reef?
Yellow lab
Auartus
Kenyi

Just a note, all those mbuna were added today, except the Dems, holding them for my brother as we got them for $1 a piece but his bigger fish would eat them until they get size. Should only be in here for a few weeks or a month. I only plan on keeping the C. Moori, and Taiwan reef.


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## paradigmsk8er (Apr 13, 2009)

Looks good. I got my male moorii into my 100 today, he's about 4.5" and coloring up nicely...and he is a feisty guy, sort of not living up to the "peaceful" reputation they have ha! We shall see over time but my wife and I both like them so maybe a species tank is in my cards....I can see why y'all like them


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I'm one who definitely breaks the rules when I feel the need. As for mbuna and C. Moori, I find it works okay so far. I do a lot of swapping and changing as I like to grow out fish to breeding and then get tired of breeding a type and switch. With the slow growing moori, *** had a number of different mbuna run through and most of the time the mbuna breed and I move them out. At this point, I'm maybe picking up some conflict with hap ahli and the moori. I have a group of ahli that should have shown much more color by now but they are still in hiding! I suspect it is due to them not wanting conflict with the moori who are much more the dominant fish at this time due to size. The lab "Hongi" are breeding constantly so there might be some conflict there also as the ahli and hongi seem to like the same rocks. Hongi win that discussion, though so that leaves the ahli pretty much out. Other than not breeding which is something of a relief at the moment and them not showing good color, I see no problems. No chasing,etc. of real importance. The holding "Hongi" females are still the boss even when smaller than the moori. Some kind of female attitude going on there! Maybe holding fish in your mouth for a month gives you an attitude nobody wants to mess with?


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## paradigmsk8er (Apr 13, 2009)

Funny you mention ahli...I have an absolutely stunning male ahli in my tank at about 6" right now and he is the tank jerk...

I have definitely broke the rules a bit in my tank as well-i have a pundamilia and an astatotilapia along with an acei itungi (big puppy dog)...all males, in with haps and peacocks...their behavior was carefully chosen, but it works.

I think as those of us who have stocked large rift lake tanks have come to found there is nothing concrete with stocking these fish--so many personalities and differences


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

Exactly, and were always learning. Of course some individuals live up to their breeds behaviours but there's always the exception. I wouldn't fear keeping mbuna with my dolphins I just want some size and exotic looking, where as to me mbuna usually stay medium size and most don't look as exotic to me as many haps and peacocks. There are a few I love yellow tail acei and some of the barred species but other than keeping my acei a mbuna habitat tank will be in the future as their behaviour can be second to none that's why I and most people love them.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

Chunkanese said:


> Juststayinthecave- I would imagine you can keep plenty C. Moori in a 180. Do you plan on keeping other fish eith them or a single species tank. And yep my moori have been sifting sand their entire lives as of this time. I'm sure as adults they will use more height in the tank but I don't plan on keeping any catfish or other cleaners with them other than my 1 SAE. I don't want the cats to interfere with possible spawning down the road. I know it may be a long time but that's fine with me. And as for the other posters your both right, mbuna are very aggressive but I find alot of the info to be dated and usually these set in stone rules which are never meant to be broken are simply guidelines from the earliest fishkeepers which simply may have had extra aggressive specimens. I broke all the rules and my fish are thriving. Also most my fish like to hang out at the top of the tank where there's more of a current, even though most cichlids are said to hardly use the top 50 percent.


Good questions, probably a bit beyond my expertise to answer but my plan at the moment is to end up with 5 c moori's, may add more for the reasons you have, but will add other Haps and Peacocks. Looking at the nimbochromis species - livingstoni and venustus, maybe an eye biter and some of the borleyi's and a few peacocks. Not to particular or really sold on the peacocks. I am getting some Red top Labs and have some gresheaki's and yellow Labs, may put some of them in the 180 but if that wont work I have another aquarium where I can do a great mbuma set up. 150 gallon


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Good luck with the stocking. I think you will find it works better than expected to have moori and mbuna together. I find they pretty much ignore each other in my 75. I would think in a larger tank it would work fine.


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

If I add venestus to the group would a 6ft 125g be enough for moori, Taiwan reef and venestus? I hear they arnt very aggressive and all fish will have good size. If I had just 1 male and 2 females do you think that will be good?


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## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

Our venustus do not bother the moori we have. The male sets up shop and spends all day trying to get the female to pay a visit. When she does find interest is when he becomes assertive as the other fish are quick to scoop up any eggs dropped and he ends up on the defensive.


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

how large is your tank? im looking to have 5 moori, 4 taiwan reef, 3 venestus, and possibly 3 hap 44, 1 Acei, 1 SAE. So thats, 17 fish, i would guess thats good?


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

I bought 8 Moori's on the week end, 2 survived the trip back home. Fish get transferred all over the place, but these didn't last 3 hours, must say they were in excellent shape at the sellers house. I better go to the library and read up on fish transport, don't need that again. Now I'm looking for more C. Moori's. Hate to be a downer on this thread but I had posted I was stocking, unfortunately it didn't work out this time.


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## Kerricko (May 26, 2010)

PfunMo said:


> I think part of our problem with stocking tanks is due to the information we read. When I read profile information on various cichlids, I often see that the information carried on various sites are written word for word the same. It leads me to wonder how much actual research led to this "information" if it all comes out in the same words. Maybe it is too easy to just copy and paste? I have some really old books written back when Africans were beginning to become available and some of that same information is still in the press today. Maybe it is time for a really true fresh look at what these fish do and what we know about them? I'm not saying that all the information is untrue but there surely has been a few things learned over the last thirty some years that might be useful to us common hobby sorts.


+1

I agree!! :thumb:


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

juststayinthecave said:


> I bought 8 Moori's on the week end, 2 survived the trip back home. Fish get transferred all over the place, but these didn't last 3 hours, must say they were in excellent shape at the sellers house. I better go to the library and read up on fish transport, don't need that again. Now I'm looking for more C. Moori's. Hate to be a downer on this thread but I had posted I was stocking, unfortunately it didn't work out this time.


 that's very strange. How big were they? I haven't lost any from what I see they get bagged and a blue liquid is added to somewhat relax them. That goes in a styrofoam box taped up with other bags and I don't do anything special. They only stay an hour in there but they could much longer. If I were you I would google up the local wholesaler even if it's a 2 hour drive it will be worth it. I got most of my moori for about $3 each at 2 inches. They are tanked with dems so I just have to take the time to put back the dems I catch. Very good health as this is usually the first step for the fish transport from the breeders and before the store. Don't give up. On another update I moved out 7 of my mbuna adults from my 90. There's still more but the largest and most aggressive are gone.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

They were between 2 and 3 inches but were put in one large bag, bag put in a bucket, bucket put in cooler with 2L oj container filled with hot water.(it was cool out) I left bag open and wrapped around bucket top to let air in. There was lots of slime in the water, stressed out I think. May have been some aggresion in the bag. Next time I'm going to put one fish per bag.

No way I'm giving up, just a bit angry with myself, should have been better prepared for the trip. Moved my new (used) 180 to its spot in the tank room, still favouring the moori's. They look way better in real life than any photo. These ones (2 survivors) have some dark spots, are yours clear?


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## Snake42490 (Mar 17, 2007)

I have 13 C. Moorii in my 220, they will be turning 6 years old in a couple of months, I have roughly 4 males and the rest remales, from what I have read C. Moorii and some of the shyest fish. I have been trying to breed them and have absolutely no luck. I read on some other posts of people that moved them to a separate tank to have them breed and had a pleco or a snail in the tank and they still had issues getting them to breed. They finally removed the pleco or snail and they started breeding like crazy. I have yet to see mine breed, i know they are mature enough, because the fish are HUGE. Anyway, they are one of my favorite fish. They do very very well in groups, my males have no issues with each other. It is really fun to watch them sand sift and show their natural wild habits. Good luck on finding more fish, sounds like you are lucky enough to have them in your area.

Oh and to finish my whole rant, if you are getting these fish just to breed, well that might not happen, but you should get these fish... just to get these fish.. because they are awesome!


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

The heat is where the transport went wrong. While not good to chill fish, it is far more deadly to heat them. I killed a group of fish this way as well. When I transport fish now I bag them in half filled bags, tie them and use an old cooler wedging the bags so they can't roll around. I never use heat as it acts to reduce the O2 in the water and that kills quickly. The cooler is good for keeping the water temp stable. Unless the fish are going to be in the bags for more than a day or exposed to really cold temperatures , they are better off without the heat. If they are in the car with you, they will be fine. You will get cold before they do. Keep them off the floor where heat from the exhaust may make the floor hot.


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

Try without the heat like the others said. In car they will be fine for many many hours. I'm not looking to breed just have a tank that could breed. I still want the dolphins regardless. Even if the other haps breed I would be very happy. I actually lost 1 blue dolphin this morning. The smallest one was breathing heavily and reclusive. All others are very active and healthy. Yep they have spots depending on their mood. I find they disappear a bit at night. As they mature they lose the spots and get very blue. Actually my 3 largest ones don't show spots anymore. I had actually been looking for this fish for a year. Once my lfs big ALS got them in. I went to wholesaler and they have hundreds all the time. I think they supply outside local areas. Very lucky. If I knew how to ship I would help out as I get them for $2-3 each.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

Thanks for the info on adding the heat. I was thinking of rigging an inverter, a heater and air stone into a cooler.

Chunkanese, does your wholesaler do mail order? Could you give me a contact e-mail address? And no not concerned if they don't breed , though it would be great, I just like the way there colour shifts when the swim. I just like em!


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## Chunkanese (Feb 4, 2011)

Just got back I picked up another 5 venestus juvis, 1 male is showing a tint of blue, the rest look like females or so. Going for a 1m 2f ratio. The other 4 I will sell once they get more size and sexed. I saw their new stock of taiwan reef I was disappointed as they all looked like young males except maybe 1 out of 20. Either they mostly bought males or they had a hint of hormoning. I will get their business card next time I go. However I see your in BC I'm sure there's some out there. I'm sure you can find some with a quick google search.


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## juststayinthecave (Dec 23, 2010)

Not having much luck finding them, but still looking.


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