# Canister for 90 gallon



## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

Okay, so I've been putting off the inevitable...

My 90 gallon stock is in my sig, I've been running it for about 2 months and my stock has hit its limit (once the oscar gets bigger one of the schools will be going back).

I'm currently running an AQ110 and an AQ50, and have wanted to get a canister filter to round out my filtration.

I'm torn between a few brands and models, mind telling me your experiences with them?

1. Eheim 2217/2215

2. Cascade 1000

3. Rena xp3/xp2

Ps - this canister would be in addition to the 2 HOBs that are running...


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## Jmanolinsky (Jun 4, 2010)

I'd go with the XP3. I have an XP2 and love it. It is easy to set up and maintain. It also comes with enough elbos and stuff to set up the spray bar however you like. I have an Eheim Pro II 2026 and like it too, but the spra bar is all one piece, leaving fewer options.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Man, did you hit my hot button! 
1. Ehiem 2217 -I use it for a pretty heavy stocked (at present) African cichlid 75 tank and love it. It lasts long and works good. Works a long time between filter cleanings. Should do a 90 with two HOB fine. 
2. Cascade 1000-- Got one on a lightly stocked (4 angelfish) 55 gallon tank. I bought it new and it is a disaster!!!! It is the only filter I've ever had trouble priming. Some way the motor sets where water doesn't get to it by just filling the can and letting water run in. Their statement about the priming bulb is totally bogus. They must have known they had a bad design when they added a priming bulb! The filter has major bypass places. Look it over before buying and you can see the water enters at the bottom but there is space on each side of the media baskets big enough to stick a hand down. The water goes to the top to exit but can just go around the media rather than through. Even with this space, the water flow drops off quickly. Half price for half filtering and double maintenance. JUNK ALERT
3. No experience

I'll try to calm down now.


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

PfunMo said:


> Man, did you hit my hot button!
> 1. Ehiem 2217 -I use it for a pretty heavy stocked (at present) African cichlid 75 tank and love it. It lasts long and works good. Works a long time between filter cleanings. Should do a 90 with two HOB fine.
> 2. Cascade 1000-- Got one on a lightly stocked (4 angelfish) 55 gallon tank. I bought it new and it is a disaster!!!! It is the only filter I've ever had trouble priming. Some way the motor sets where water doesn't get to it by just filling the can and letting water run in. Their statement about the priming bulb is totally bogus. They must have known they had a bad design when they added a priming bulb! The filter has major bypass places. Look it over before buying and you can see the water enters at the bottom but there is space on each side of the media baskets big enough to stick a hand down. The water goes to the top to exit but can just go around the media rather than through. Even with this space, the water flow drops off quickly. Half price for half filtering and double maintenance. JUNK ALERT
> 3. No experience
> ...


Good to hear man, I was really skeptical of the Cascades anyways, I'm really just torn between the eheim and the rena. Though I'm leaning to the eheim classics because of their track record and how quiet they are...

Keep the experiences coming!


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## nodima (Oct 3, 2002)

Chubbs the Jellybean said:


> Okay, so I've been putting off the inevitable...
> 
> My 90 gallon stock is in my sig, I've been running it for about 2 months and my stock has hit its limit (once the oscar gets bigger one of the schools will be eaten).


Fixed it for you!!!


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

Hahaha - yeah the giant danios might be, we'll have to see when he gets bigger I guess. I've heard stories of oscars demolishing giant danios, and also ones of oscars living in harmony with them.

Time will tell =P


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## gverde (Mar 3, 2010)

I like my Rena XP3 also. Easy to setup and clean. Never had a eheim though.


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## nlui220 (Feb 2, 2010)

Between the 2217 or 2215, go for the 2217. I have both models and the 2217 moves so much more water. I feel like I wasted money on the 2215 (shame on me for cheaping out).


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## z400 (Jun 30, 2009)

XP4 and an XP2


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

How's the noise on the renas?

I Might be getting a great deal on an eheim from the guy i bought my tank from,but im still weighing my options


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

For noise, I would expect either Eheim or Rena to be mcuh quieter than the HOB. Do you have a stand they will be under? That makes them even quieter but when I'm down working on my Ehiem 2217, I sometimes put my hand on it to tell if it is running. With the other stuff in the room, I can't always tell except by feeling the vibration. I still get noise from water but that is because I have the output turned upwards to make surface ripples.


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

Yeah I have a small cabinet I made in wood shop in 7th grade that I keep my stuff in and it has a spot waiting for a canister on the left side


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## z400 (Jun 30, 2009)

Chubbs the Jellybean said:


> How's the noise on the renas?
> 
> I Might be getting a great deal on an eheim from the guy i bought my tank from,but im still weighing my options


*** got an XP4 on my 90, its inside my stand. I cannot even hear the filter running.


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## bluedog800 (Aug 26, 2010)

i have a cascade 1200 and i never have trouble priming it (press the big button 3x) and no problems thus far, so far it is only 3 moths old. I have no complaints thus far on my 90 Gal and it is the only filter on it....


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

z400 said:


> Chubbs the Jellybean said:
> 
> 
> > How's the noise on the renas?
> ...


Good to know :thumb:


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Nice to be able to pick a few other people's experience and find what we can. I like reports that give me some real solid things to look or think about rather than just expressing a like/ dislike. 
I wonder if the Cascade 1200 has the same space between the walls and the media as the 1000. I found that to be such a major thing that it alone would keep me from buying it, had I known. It's hard to notice things like that until you known to look at that specific point.

bluedog800- Can you tell us if there is a large space there? I won't ask you to pull it apart to look but it would be of interest to know. Maybe they have a standard size media tray they use for several size canisters so that it fits different on different sizes? I've been tempted to run a test for bypass on mine but have not.


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## bluedog800 (Aug 26, 2010)

I have never opened a 1000 before, but my 1200 trays are able to hold the thickness of a aquaclear 70 sponge and there are 4 trays that are all interchangeable/the same size

the spnges are 2"thck, and about 5 1/2 - 6" long, the one out of my HOB is a bit deformed...
so 
about 5 1/2" - 6" square inside by 2" tall per tray


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

I own a marineland c series, i like them as a filter, but the outlet sucks. it sits too far below the water line to agitate the surface, and no spraybar option, otherwise I would say you should think about adding it to your list

of the canisters i've owned, my xp3 is my fav, the xp2 I don't really like
my cascade in constantly the dirtiest filter of them all when I change it, there is always more junk in it when I clean it, whether it's floating around in the canister or saturated in the floss, the plus is that all that **** isn't in the tank, i can tell that a lot of debris bypasses the media, but it doesn't appear to get back into the tank, which is the most important thing. but I will take the quick release of the xp's over single hose detachment anyday

I can't argue against eheims, except that the basket type filters are much easier to maintain than the classic eheims, and obviously flows are higher on other brands


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

I'm guessing my question about the size was not clear. What brought up the question of size was whether there is a large gap between the canister wall and the tray sides. That looks like it leaves a clear shot to bypass the media.

I have had the same complaint as cjacob on the Ehiem Classic's lack of trays. I did a small mod on mine that seems to help. Some use bags to put their loose media in and hold it but I didn't feel it totally filled the void and would cause some bypass. My mod depends on having the correct size small plastic bucket. I use a lot of drywall patch (mud) and the small buckets are handy. For this the bucket is just the correct diameter to do a snug fit with the plastic media plate of the 2217. I cut the bottom out of the bucket, pressed the plate down inside and made a tie-wrap handle. This gives me a quick, cheap media tray.


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## bluedog800 (Aug 26, 2010)

Ahh - there is a small gap on mine on the sides but, each tray clips to the one bellow and that makes a large tube for water to travel down. it is sealed to the pump at the top it a gasket.


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Thanks. I may have to pull mine apart and look if I might be missing a gasket at the top. On the other hand it may be there and I'm not seeing!!! :roll:


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## bluedog800 (Aug 26, 2010)

PfunMo said:


> Thanks. I may have to pull mine apart and look if I might be missing a gasket at the top. On the other hand it may be there and I'm not seeing!!! :roll:


mine is black about 1/2 long attaching the top basket to the head, mine always sticks to the top basket but you can put it on upside down, i just find it harder to know that there is a good seal.

if you are still confused let me know i will open it up tommorow ad snap a photo for you...


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

You're talking about the round gasket that goes between the water inlet and the basket? That I have have. Is there any thing to keep the water from comming up the sides of the trays and going back inthe oulet pipe? Anything to make it go through the media to get back out? I'll have mine out soon as well.


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## bluedog800 (Aug 26, 2010)

i will look tomorrow - no rubber parts


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

i'm pretty sure, just as any basket type canister, the top basket at the least is sealed to the pump head, so even if there is bypass between the baskets, there probably isn't much if any bypass between the top basket and the pump head

edit** the one thing I do know about my cascade, is that it has more waste and debris in it than any of my other filters when I go to clean it, which makes me think it picks up more junk than any of my other filters, but it's a cheap filter and a pain to even get the hoses off so I have a hard time suggesting it. and it takes me more than three pumps of the priming button to get it primed, in fact I hit it sevferal times to make sure the syphon starts, but that was only when the hoses were removed from the tank, when they have water in them, the syphon is still in tact


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

Maybe we have the same but view it differently. I cleaned mine and took a look and some pictures of what I object to on the bypass issue. Others may see it different but at least we can go with knowledge and decide for ourself.

First is the top of the canister removed with red arrows indicating where the input and output water goes. Input at the top right and output lower. Theory says the water goes in the tube and passes through the tube at each media basket until it reaches the bottom. Then it is supposed to go back up through each level of media and out the output line. 









My complaint is that there is a 1/4 inch gap down each side of the canister on all sides of the media baskets. There's also the question of how often you get that rubber gasket fit in between the two tubes without it getting out of place or mashed. Without that gasket sealing the water can just turn around and go back to the tank. 









At each level there is a plastic basket edge setting on a plastic edge until you get to the top level where this plastic layer lays on top of the baskets.










I think this plastic to plastic makes a very poor seal and water goes through this gap bypassing the media much of the time.


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## cjacob316 (Dec 4, 2008)

well I will say that the xp's have a gap down the side, because that's where the water goes until it goes up through the media baskets


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## bluedog800 (Aug 26, 2010)

Valid point but i don't seem to have trouble removing floating stuff from my tank. However, perhaps someone has a suggestion of something that could be put there to force the water to go the other way???


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

If they had just done any number of small things it would stop the flow. Some items I've thought about but not been moved enough to try involve adding foam in a couple places. I've thought of adding foam insulation around any of the baskets so the edge was sealed. A thin layer of foam glued to the lid would solve the plastic to plastic question. Just seems they didn't try very hard. 
Bottom line for me -- I don't recommend it.


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## DrgRcr (Jun 23, 2009)

I have to say, I have a 1200 on my 72g, and as CJ said, it always has a ton of dirt *in* it. I almost never see a reduction in flow either. I also have no problems priming after maintenance, possibly because I add some water back in before I close it up. But once I reconnect, I just open the valves and more often than not, I don't even neeed to prime. It's on there with a Penguin 350, and has handled the load of a heavily stocked mixed tropical, and now all male Malawi tank. In fact the water in that tank is so clear, with no exaggeration, I can watch TV through the length with zero distortion. Perhaps it's not the top of the line filter, but personally, I can't say it's the worst.


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

Okay so here's what I'm being offered

Fluval 403 - $80

Eheim professional ii 2028 - $125

He said they're negotiable.... Your thoughts?

Both filters work and have all parts and whatnot.


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

I'm thinking of taking the eheim - im getting a good deal right?


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## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

I have the 2028 for quite a few years now. Very good filter and quiet to the point that I need to feel it to confirm it is running.

Might be a bit small for a 90 as it would only give 3x's turnover. More than enough for bio but not enough movement for mech. Adding an AC 110 HOB for mech would help.


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

The tank is already running an AQ110 and AQ50


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

Thoughts on the deal I'd be getting on the eheim pro ii 2028? ($125)


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## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

Is it running. Would be a shame to get it home and find out an oring is missing.

Even so @ $125.00 that looks to be a decent price, especially if all media is included.


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

He has had it running on a 72 bow, and on a 90 (not at the same time haha), no problems. He sold me my 90 gallon, dual heaters, hood, glass tops, and AQ110 and I haven't had one problem other than replacing the bulb :thumb:


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## Tshethar (Jul 20, 2009)

I think $125 for a ready-to-go 2028 is a good buy. If it includes the media, plus the spray bar, intake, etc., then I'd do that deal. (Added bonus if you get the upgraded installation kits instead of the standard issue green plumbing parts.) I've had a 2026 for a year or so, which is paired with a AC70 on a heavily-stocked 55, and it does great. Quietest filter I've ever had, and has inspired me to get two more Eheims which I'm in the process of setting up on a new tank.

You might find out how old it is, and if it were me I'd probably download the manual and check and lubricate all the o-rings. If you're trying to save the bacteria in the media and it isn't more than a couple years old, you could put it off and just let it run until you're well-established. Otherwise, try to keep enough of the media in the ACs or in the tank while you do your service. With a little care it should run great for years.

One last thing on the mechanical filtration: It's true that these are better for bio than for pulling out particulate, and I noticed a certain amount of this in my setup. I just tried adding a 100 micron filter pad that I cut to fit under the top screen (on the top basket) for a little extra polishing, plus added some filter floss and Purigen to the AC. With these tweaks, I've got a crystal clear tank. :thumb:


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

I believe it does include media... I'm grabbing it tomorrow I believe.

In related news, I was just told by a guy who comes into where I work that he's giving me (yes, giving) his ready-to-go 55 gallon setup (tank, stand, tops, hood, AQ110, rocks), his 125 (tank, stand) and his diatom filter. For free!!!


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

and in the process of writing that I just flooded my _carpeted_ hallway with 10 gallons of water (hose burst at a connection point and I didn't realize until I checked on it) oh joy oh bliss :roll:


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## Glaneon (Sep 27, 2010)

I HATE it when that happens.

I had my hose burst on me (my fault, left pure hot water pressurized in it for over 30 minutes).


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## bluedog800 (Aug 26, 2010)

PfunMo said:


> Maybe we have the same but view it differently. I cleaned mine and took a look and some pictures of what I object to on the bypass issue. Others may see it different but at least we can go with knowledge and decide for ourself.
> 
> First is the top of the canister removed with red arrows indicating where the input and output water goes. Input at the top right and output lower. Theory says the water goes in the tube and passes through the tube at each media basket until it reaches the bottom. Then it is supposed to go back up through each level of media and out the output line.
> 
> ...


so you got me paranoid regarding this, i started to look into it... i just added a 3/4" round foam seal around the top filter basket, easy to install. My flow seemed to be a bit reduced, so thats a good sign... i will have to report back as to whether the performance changes....


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## PfunMo (Jul 30, 2009)

That's some report that I'd like to hear more about. What type foam? Door seal type foam? I have not worked out how to make it stay. Rather than totally highjack this thread, how about posting some info on your modification. I've read several that would like to find something. 
Thanks. =D>


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## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

bluedog800 said:


> ... i just added a 3/4" round foam seal around the top filter basket, easy to install. My flow seemed to be a bit reduced, so thats a good sign... i will have to report back as to whether the performance changes....


I do this with a 2080 around the top tray and use poly fiber that I cut into ~1" strips. Works great as I have been doing this a few years now. I thought that it would cause me to hafta open the can more often by limiting the bypass but that did not happen and I get ~ 6 months intervals with my system setup.

One thing though is I can hear a very light hum now being telegraphed into the case. Mebbe I have it stuffed too tight but it is something that I noticed after doing this mod.


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## newcichlidiot (Jul 7, 2010)

I would have to say you won't see a reduction in flow with that much bypass. It just means when your filter trays are dirty more water goes around. I think bluedog is on the right track.


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## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

It is not bypassing as much as you would think. Either that or the trays are actually sealing against the sides of the can but from looking down birds eye view it appears to leave a margin.

Using the foam and/ or poly fiber is accomplishing the same results by not allowing water to slip past the 1/8" space 'tween the top tray and side of the can. I thort stuffing that margin with poly would cause the flow to decrease as the trays start to near requiring maintenance but that does not happen as flow doesn't slow down much at all. I use the calendar as a heads up for when to open the can. In operation it does not make much difference as the pads are just as dirty as they were before using the stuffing. Still I now do it regularly for peace of mind.


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

So it turns out it's an Eheim Pro ii 2026 not 2028... Oh well, it came with 2 trays full of the EHFIMECH, so I've had it running for about 2 hours now... no more air in the system so it's SILENT


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## fox (Jun 11, 2009)

The 2026 is a good can. The only thing we needed to replace on ours in prolly 7 years is the top O-ring. They run pretty much silent and put out a lot of flow but mebbe not enought by itself for a 90G.

The top tray is a good place for sub-strat pro. Sorta like cocoa puffs but a lot more $$.


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

Haha - yeah, I just was excited to get it running, so I left both trays with the EHFIMECH in it... Tried opening it 30 minutes later, after unplugging... but i forgot to break the syphon.... gallon of water on the floor... (felt like an idiot)... Just have to get the spray bar and intake cover and I'm good!

Now on the 90 I have...

Eheim Pro ii 2026
AQ 110
AQ 50

Just under approx 1000 gph circulation


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## Chubbs the Jellybean (Jun 16, 2009)

So after running the eheim for about 2 weeks, and finally putting the filter pads in and figuring out how to not flood my room when I have to open the filter, I have a crystal clear tank with MUCH less debris on the bottom of the tank (poop)!

The tank stays cleaner longer (I don't have to do 50% water changes every 4 days, now I do a 30% every 6 days, keeps the levels perfect) and the fish seem happier! Not to mention that it is SILENT! :thumb:


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