# New Tank Same problem



## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

I had a thread back in September in relation to a problem where I ended up stopping all together stripping down and starting now after 1day of having water added iv noticed exactly the same issue before a skin like white spec forming ontop of my tank I need advice to what this actually is as it killed my fish last time. I have completely stripped the tank and sterilised every piece of equipment even the tank. with boiling water and salt. I have also put the heaters into the tank on 32C to kill anything left in it even though we started from scratch I need advice to what this is completely fresh tank nothing added to it just a tiny amount of streezyme an hour ago please does anyone has a cure or clue what it is when it is skimmed out its a yellow colour will provide pictures of what it looked like after a few days before tank was stripped fish developed white strands over eyes gills and in mouths and struggled to breath the pic of the net is before the tank was stripped anyone help to find out what also those little white balls are thank you


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Hi Andrew, sorry you are still having problems with this issue.

First, I see from your other posts that you are using ocean rock, is this something you bought from a fish store, did you buy it second hand or from nature?

Does the rock seem soft or crumbly or do you get some whitish deposits on your hand when you touch it when it's damp or wet?

Second, have you taken a sample of water from your faucet and compared it to see if you have white specs in the glass or bucket? The reason I ask is that sometimes hard water deposits can accumulate in a hot water heater or the anode tube is deteriorating and may need to be replaced.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

I brought part from fish store and part from a website online. yeah it does when its I'm water its not hard solid rock. yeah theres nothing wrong with my actual tap water when I filled it. it was clear a few obvious bits and pieces obviously tap water is never crystal clear but it did not have the specs ontop until later today 1 day after installed


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

If the rocks are softer when wet and parts of the rock are dissolving then that is why you are seeing the particles in the tank. Can you post a link to the exact rock you bought online?


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

http://www.completeaquatics.co.uk/aquar ... n-rock-1kg this is where I got it from I first also thought it was sand problem because of the bio active being sat for waaaaay too long


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Thanks Andrew!

Let's try a little experiment with one of your rocks. Remove a piece from the aquarium and let it dry out. Once it is dry, splash a little bit of household white vinegar on the rock and let us know if it fizzes.

I've done some brief searches on the rock you bought online and it is sold by Unipac and some online stores state that is in not inert and will release minerals into the aquarium so this might be what you are seeing in your tank. Normally this is not a problem except for it's appearance with particles in the water which can be reduced by increasing water surface movement so that the particles are collected in your filters.

Could you also post the pH of your tap water? I'm curious if your pH is low to start out with.

Do you also have a KH (alkalinity) test kit? If so, post the results of your tap water.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

I don't have any white vinegar in my household do you know if I can use anything else? 
I can test my tap water no problem iv never had this before iv kept tanks for ages but believe the ocean rock may be the cause. any suggestions other than to use different rocks or driftwood I know cichlids aren't fond of driftwood. I have a wave maker directly on surface creating massive water dispersion my ph from my tap water isn't low around 6/7 out of the tap I have to add salts and ph up when I do water changes.
I do not have a Alkalinty test kit unfortunately never had these issues keeping fish again I believe its down to the ocean rock because in the water when its touched dust/rock pieces fall off when touched


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I wouldn't worry about the vinegar and I don't think there is any other household product that would work the same.

My best guess is that the problem IS the rock especially since you are seeing dust and pieces falling off. I would just remove the rocks and choose some other type that may be available to you locally rather than buying online or at a fish store. You may want to check a landscaping supply company or a business that sells rocks and boulders in bulk for a much lower price.

Your tap pH is somewhat neutral at 7 and below that is more acid. You may want to consider different fish that would do well with your un-buffered water however. I've been blessed with a higher pH (7.6) and higher KH so I've never had to add salts or buffer products such as pH up.

Have you asked the fish store where you bought your fish from how they maintain a higher pH or KH in their tanks? I'm curious if their water parameters are the same as yours without needing to buffer their tanks.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

What can I do about that white spec again appearing on my new tank... before I add in the new sand or anything I want the water to be ok... is it harmful or do you believe it was the rocks?

Also they use some amount of buffers but keep the cichlids at 7.5/8.0 ph my tap is 7.5ishh so I always just buffer it a little to be safe and kept the cichlids when alive around 8ph


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I think it may be from the rocks mainly because you haven't listed anything else that might be contributing to the white specks.

Can you also post what model and brand of filters you are using as well as what filter media you are using? I just want to eliminate anything else that may be causing the white specks.

If your tap water is steady at a 7.5 pH, I would not worry about using any buffers at all. What you can do is stop adding buffers to the aquarium and then test the pH every other day to see if it varies at all. Post your results here.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

Ok, I used a fluvial fx300 and a ocerlaris 850 not the UV model


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

The 1st filter I can't find and the 2nd doesn't list the media. I'm just asking to see if it's possible the media is breaking down and you are seeing it in the tank.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

It's a Fluval 306 and an Aquaone Ocellaris 850.

both use filter media fluvial used ceramics and carbon but no carbon in tank as was treating fish with white spot and fungal growth before as thats what I thought the fish were getting covered in on top of the water line. the ocellaris uses ceramics and another type of like white compound will find the name for you


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Thanks for the clarification on the Fluval filter!

The filter media sounds just fine, I was just curious if you were adding some type of media that breaks down or causes whitish deposits such as crushed coral.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

No I don't what would be your advice before I buy new sand rocks this weekend? especially with the water


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Andrew, I am at a loss as to what is causing the white specks in the tank since you said you cleaned the tank, filters and everything else after you tore the tank down. In my opinion the only thing left is the actual tap water quality which may contain minerals. The only way to determine the hardness and alkalinity is to buy those two test kits I mentioned before and test your tap water.

I don't see a need to replace the sand as long as you rinse it well before adding it back to the tank. I think you had black sand before, correct?


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

Sorry for slow reply I found the issue with the white specs it was the filter the Ocellaris was producing a white sludge/spec inside I opened it up two days ago and it was full of those floaty white specs and I immediately took it out and threw it straight in the bin I noticed the outake tube had white slime all over the holes and at closure inspecting the tubing was full of flakes of whatever it was I'm now just investing in another fluval and using that hopefully that was the issue and everything is now fixed going forward. Also quick update on the rock situation it isn't ocean rock its fake guy at the shop where I always buy my fish said take a piece of our stuff home test it how you will I literally just did a scratch test on the rock its practically chalk could of also contributed to the tank but I believe the issue was that filter I opened up the top and it was just horrendous how much white specs were floating about could of been the media inside


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Glad to hear you got this sorted out!


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

Me too was a very long process that has cost so much to try different things ordered new sand and now have to decide what rocks I'm going to use again now as I have threw everything away. Any ideas for rock with caribsea cichlid mix sand?


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Are you saying the rocks from the 'guy at the shop' are practically chalk?

Try looking for rocks at a landscaping supply company, quarry or similar places that sell rocks in bulk amounts.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

No the website where I bought my tank from I ordered 30KG of '''Ocean Rock''' that is basically chalk lol alright I can try look around but do you think slate will look ok? and not have much affect to water parameters ?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Slate is usually too flat to form natural looking caves and rock piles.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

Ok not even if staggered out, What rocks would you suggest then?


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

HI again guys so because I completely started again and take is just sitting in cycle with a few Black widow tetras in the tank I believe iv experienced a massive bacteria bloom water is so hard to see through and is a green colour. Any suggestions or advice when it will clear up heard one of best things to do is just let it clear on itself whilst it cycles. Any advice on what to do because its now been roughly around 5/6days and it isn't looking like clearing thus far


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I would remove the fish and cycle with ammonia. No need for lights and without the lights the algae will disappear. You are not getting sunlight on the tank, right?

Regarding rocks...I like granite river rocks...from fist-sized to head-sized.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

No direct sunlight have no way of removing the fish unfortunately I can turn lights off it seems to have cleared up little today as have put in first bag of sand and rocks and also added the newer filter into the tank the cloudiness has cleared greatly see how it goes next few days. yes I have gone with granite type rocks have brown and greyish colour will post pics when I pick up rest next week and show what tank is looking like hopefully by then it will be crystal Clear and can start to get the water parameters up ready to get the cichlids back


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

Quick update on situation been experiencing my bacteria bloom now for over a week and a half it appears to be a very very bad one fish are still alive and about in the tank looking for help on how I can clear it up saw people mentioning doing 50% water changes everyday till it clears or adding ammonia to the tank neither of those two things are what I want to do as they are extremes at the most. Any tips anyone could pass on to what I can do at this current time as it hasn't gradually gotten worse and not better over the past week+ it started last week Thursday.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

current situation


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

50% water change is not extreme...it is routine maintenance. You would just do it every day until a balance is reached...several days or maybe a week. The problem is excess ammonia so don't add ammonia. Shade the tank as you mentioned it gets sun from windows...that will continue to cause you problems even after this problem is solved.

The bacteria will eventually settle in the filters...they are beneficial, they just should not be floating around in the water making it cloudy.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Can you post the tank test results?

You have fish in the tank so you do NOT want to add any ammonia.

I agree that a 50% water change is not extreme but you can do a 25% water change for the next 2 or 3 days to reduce the cloudiness. Usually the cloudiness goes away after a week or so on a new tank.


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## Andrew451 (Sep 13, 2017)

I meant 50% water changes everyday until problem is solved thats what I do not want to do thats what has been advised by other people doing 50% every day until clears that just means I would not of cycled the tank because it will have replaced 100% over 2days...


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

The beneficial bacteria does not live in the water...they live on the filter media and other surfaces. Removing the water does not remove the beneficial bacteria.

I realize you don't want to do it. Then I guess you just wait it out.


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## caldwelldaniel26 (Jun 11, 2017)

If you didn't have fish in the tank and had done a fishless cycle with ammonia then things wouldn't be so complicated. I realize that doing a lot of water changes is inconvenient, but if you're not willing to take the necessary steps to correct the problem then perhaps you shouldn't keep fish and find another hobby that is less work. As DJ stated, the bacteria don't live in the water column, they live on surfaces within the filter and tank so water changes to resolve the bacterial overgrowth you have now, will not affect your cycle or lack thereof. This is why it's so much better to do a fishless cycle because you don't have to do daily water changes to save your fish from being poisoned by ammonia or nitrite.


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## joselepiu (Jul 22, 2017)

DJRansome said:


> The beneficial bacteria does not live in the water...they live on the filter media and other surfaces. Removing the water does not remove the beneficial bacteria.
> 
> I realize you don't want to do it. Then I guess you just wait it out.





caldwelldaniel26 said:


> If you didn't have fish in the tank and had done a fishless cycle with ammonia then things wouldn't be so complicated. I realize that doing a lot of water changes is inconvenient, but if you're not willing to take the necessary steps to correct the problem then perhaps you shouldn't keep fish and find another hobby that is less work. As DJ stated, the bacteria don't live in the water column, they live on surfaces within the filter and tank so water changes to resolve the bacterial overgrowth you have now, will not affect your cycle or lack thereof. This is why it's so much better to do a fishless cycle because you don't have to do daily water changes to save your fish from being poisoned by ammonia or nitrite.


+1...


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