# Angry Auratus



## airtech87 (Jun 8, 2010)

I have a 60 gal African cichlid tank and one of my ten cichlids is an auratus. I've heard the yellow can only be female but I've also heard stories debunking that theory. Anyway, recently he/she has become VERY aggressive. He (we'll go with that for now) has all of a sudden started to terrorize all the other nine fish in the tank. It's not necessarily a new tank, and they have all gotten along great until now. I don't know what to do. I've tried adding an extra small amount of salt, I've tried lowering the temperature a little- all things I've heard help with aggression but I'm seeing no results. All water tests are great, and he is otherwise acting perfectly healthy (no outward physical symptoms whatsoever). Does anyone have any tips for me? I'm attached to them so I'd hate to give him away, but I see no other choice at the moment. All the other fish have tattered looking fins, and I'm sure will exhibit stress soon, because he is nipping.


----------



## DrgRcr (Jun 23, 2009)

I don't keep any Auratus, but from everything I've read and been told, that behavior is par for the course as far as that species goes. They are some mean, if not one of the meanest mbuna, as in making quick work of other inhabitants in short notice. I would think re-homing might be your best option to save the others. I'm sure others here will comment also. Good Luck.


----------



## smellsfishy1 (May 29, 2008)

Remove the auratus.
This has to be one of the most problematic species on the forum.
It goes something like this....
" I have had an auratus for a while and all of a sudden it is killing everything in my tank. What should I do?"

They get mean and they kill, it is as simple as that.
The appropriate way to keep them is as a large group in a large tank.
Just return it to the LFS and cut your losses.
That or setup a tank dedicated to auratus.
There should be a sticky to warn people about this species. :roll:


----------



## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

If I had a nickel for everytime I've read this type of post...  Lose the Aurauts.....and the Bumblebee and Kenyi if you have those as well.. :lol: What is your stocking? Perhaps we can help find a good long term solution...


----------



## GoofBoy (Jul 3, 2007)

I love this...


oldcatfish said:


> I know several people (besides myself) that have successfully kept M. Auratus, as well as other "hyper aggressive" species (Kenyi, etc.) long term with success.
> 
> The keys to doing it are the following:
> 
> ...


Best post ever on M auratus keeping. :lol: every time I read it. Just because I can't image spending that much tank/effort on them - and yes - Looonnnggg ago I had a M. auratus male kill off an entire tank one weekend while I was out of town. That kind of 'cured' me of trying to keep them.


----------



## DrgRcr (Jun 23, 2009)

As promised airtech, exactly the responses I expected  . Heed their advice.


----------



## PepoLD (Dec 9, 2009)

hehehe i remember my first Kenji cleaning up my tank from 40sh mbunas... i wanted to belive it was something else


----------



## pomi (Oct 13, 2009)

For all the problems it causes, the Auratus doesn't deserve to be kept in aquarium 

It's not even so good looking.... actually kinda dull colors for Mbuna type.

just my opinion...


----------



## airtech87 (Jun 8, 2010)

Thank you so much everyone!! Of all the tons and tons of research I've done on african cichlids, I don't really know how I missed that the auratus is so overly aggressive. I knew they were aggressive, but I thought with nine other fish he'd stay away from behavior that was TOO threatening. Ok, I'm going to give him up. There's no way I'm going to spend tons of money to buy a gigantic aquarium, etc., for one ticked off fish. Any suggestions on another to replace him? I'd like to keep ten, and I'll list the ones that I know their species. I've been trying to find out what the others are, but not much luck. They aren't very aggressive though.

1 of ea.:
Electric yellow lab
Red zebra
Rusty
Red Jewel
Firecracker
Bumblebee
Kenyi

Again, I really appreciate all the advice!


----------



## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

Unless they are all male, you are looking at some more blood shed. What size tank?


----------



## airtech87 (Jun 8, 2010)

I couldn't honestly tell you if they are all male. I looked up and asked around if there are any quick ways to tell, but it all came down to, if you want to know for sure, go with venting. But I haven't. It's a 60 gallon and is approximately 4 ft long, 1 ft wide, and 2 ft tall. If I had to make a guess with all I've been given, I'd say they are all males. But I'm not certain.


----------



## PepoLD (Dec 9, 2009)

airtech87 said:


> 1 of ea.:
> Electric yellow lab
> Red zebra
> Rusty
> ...


Whow, well... sounds like you like flirting with disaster... those are the most agressive mbuna, you are only missing a johanny and you are all set for a full slaughter haha jk 

but id recommend you to start with some less agressive fishes, Yellow Lab is ok, you might want to try Aulonacaras, Haps or Peacocks, for your tank size at least till you think to upgrade


----------



## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

If you have any females you will continue to have aggression..The Bumblebee and Kenyi will take up where the Auratus left off, and so on down to 1-2 fish. And it still may be a problem, even with no females. An all male mbuna tank is really hard to achieve, especially in a 55 or 60 gallon. That is why most will recommend 8-10 juvenile fish of 3 species , shooting eventually for 1male, 4-5 female. 
You said it wasn't "necessarily a new tank", but I'm willing to bet that the fish are just coming into breeding age. That is when these types of problems start. Good Luck.


----------



## airtech87 (Jun 8, 2010)

Well.....sounds like.....I don't know what to do. Lol.  I got them all when they were juveniles, so they've "grown up" together, but I guess you are both right. They are too aggressive and are coming into breeding age I suppose. So I guess there's not much I can do? I spent a lot of money combined on all these fish, and I'd really hate to part with them because I'm attached and that'd be a lot of money flushed down the toilet. Ha! No pun intended, really. I'll take your suggestions on fish to start with. I will be upgrading soon though. I plan to get somewhere around a 125 gallon, but it won't be tomorrow and definitely not for just a small few aggressive males. I'd like a comfortably full tank, not overcrowded, but not 4 or 5 either.

Ok, so I guess I'll be finding somewhere to trade them in. Any I can keep? Pepo you said the yellow lab is ok. Any others? I have two that I can't exactly find species names for. One is Orange with black/dark brown blotches, I'm guessing also Mbuna, and one has a very elongated body, almost a bottom feeding looking mouth but small, and the best way I can describe him is his markings look like cookies and cream ice cream. Haha. Small black and gray dots on a pale body.

Thanks so much! I'll see what I can do about starting over.


----------



## PepoLD (Dec 9, 2009)

can you post a pic?

they might last a bit more before they start killing each other, but if the Auratus was alredy at that point and the other are similar size, time could be soon.

Yellow labs are not agressive (not as much as the other mbunas at least)
they are Labidochromis, others like Sp. Hongi or Sp. Mbamba could work too. (try not to mix same color, because they xbreed a lot)

Cyrtocara Moorii is another Mbuna not as agressive as yours and really nice.

Id avoid Labeotropheus, Pseudotropheus, Melanochromis and Metriaclima (but Zebra Ob, they are usually not as agressive as the other M.).

Aulonacaras are another good option for your tank, since they are less agressive than Mbunas, and have amazing colors.

there are a lot of good combos for your tank, here's a link to the cookie cutter for 55gal
tanks, you might find one that fits you, it all comes to what do you like.. bright colors and very active fishes? go mbuna!, interesting personalities? go tanganyikas!, HUGE fishes? go CA Cichlids! 

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/cookie_cutter_55g.php

i hope that helps!

-P


----------



## airtech87 (Jun 8, 2010)

I found out the spotted one I described above is some kind of labeotropheus trewavasae, I just can't find which one. Couldn't find a picture of his exact markings, but otherwise his physical shape is exactly like the pics. Still looking for that last one, which I think may be a OB red zebra.


----------



## Floridagirl (Jan 10, 2008)

> Cyrtocara Moorii is another Mbuna not as agressive as yours and really nice.


Crytocara Moori is a Hap. There is also Tropheus Moori from Lake Tanganyika.


----------



## airtech87 (Jun 8, 2010)

Thank you both! I'll look into it. I found out what the other two were (post above). I think the lab might be ok. He seems generally peaceful, a lot more so than the others. The OB zebra (some type of OB morph Mbuna), I can't tell his aggression level. He's too overwhelmed by the auratus now, but even before he got that way, the OB was also seemingly complacent. I'm not sure I'd like to wait and find out if his temperament is otherwise though.

Thanks Pepo! Very helpful.  And thanks florida. I will be making many more posts I'm sure, as I am pretty much going to start over completely. I'm going to figure out exactly what I'd like in the 60 gal and check back to see if it will work, and I'll post later when I get the larger setup. I plan on making that one a showtank eventually.

Oh, and florida, the one I said was a "firecracker" (that's what the store called it), I looked up the tropheus moorii and that's him. So I guess he's ok to keep.


----------



## PepoLD (Dec 9, 2009)

Floridagirl said:


> > Cyrtocara Moorii is another Mbuna not as agressive as yours and really nice.
> 
> 
> Crytocara Moori is a Hap. There is also Tropheus Moori from Lake Tanganyika.


my bad, of course is a Hap, thats why is also called Hap Moorii  Im at my masters so im paying 50% attention there and 50% here hehe

and yeah ThereÃ‚Â´s a lot of Tropheus Moorii from Tang, but dont get there yet,  those are harder to keep up than Malawians


----------



## PepoLD (Dec 9, 2009)

airtech87 said:


> Thank you both! I'll look into it. I found out what the other two were (post above). I think the lab might be ok. He seems generally peaceful, a lot more so than the others. The OB zebra (some type of OB morph Mbuna), I can't tell his aggression level. He's too overwhelmed by the auratus now, but even before he got that way, the OB was also seemingly complacent. I'm not sure I'd like to wait and find out if his temperament is otherwise though.
> 
> Thanks Pepo! Very helpful.  And thanks florida. I will be making many more posts I'm sure, as I am pretty much going to start over completely. I'm going to figure out exactly what I'd like in the 60 gal and check back to see if it will work, and I'll post later when I get the larger setup. I plan on making that one a showtank eventually.


Make sure to post pics of your final setup!  id love to see how it ends up!


----------



## airtech87 (Jun 8, 2010)

So should I keep the Tr. Moorii or no? Too difficult? It's not the difficulty for me, as far as maintenance, tendency towards sickness, etc. I'm very, very tentative to my tank and have been able to handle a bad case of ich and other surprises that came up with all fish alive and healthy. It's just this aggression issue. So, the auratus, bumblebee, kenyi are out for sure. Red zebra too? I'm sorry if I'm repeating myself, I just need to know exactly which ones will go ballistic like the auratus. I can't handle the stress of seeing him do that to the other fish.

And I will def post pics! I've been saving for a sweet showtank for a long time. It's going to be awesome.  I'm just usually limited on funds, so I went with 60 gallons to put them in after starting most of them in a 30 gallon when they were not even half an inch.


----------



## GoofBoy (Jul 3, 2007)

airtech87 said:


> So should I keep the Tr. Moorii or no? Too difficult? It's not the difficulty for me, as far as maintenance, tendency towards sickness, etc. I'm very, very tentative to my tank and have been able to handle a bad case of ich and other surprises that came up with all fish alive and healthy. It's just this aggression issue. So, the auratus, bumblebee, kenyi are out for sure. Red zebra too? I'm sorry if I'm repeating myself, I just need to know exactly which ones will go ballistic like the auratus. I can't handle the stress of seeing him do that to the other fish.
> 
> And I will def post pics! I've been saving for a sweet showtank for a long time. It's going to be awesome.  I'm just usually limited on funds, so I went with 60 gallons to put them in after starting most of them in a 30 gallon when they were not even half an inch.


Depending on where you are in Texas - there are some fantastic Fish clubs. Some investigation may get you much cheaper and better quality fish than you could ever find in a fish store.

I would strongly recommend you come up with a list of 3 mbuna species you would like to keep and get 6-10 little ones of each of the species and start from there. The count would depend on the species and the final Male:Female ratio you would like to end up with.

We can help verify they have a very high chance of working together for you.

Most of us have tried the one of this and the one of that when we first started, myself included, and we pretty much have all failed, myself included.

The species group idea 1 M:3-5F really helps with mbuna and aggression, the bonus is you get to see breeding behavior.

Good Luck.


----------



## airtech87 (Jun 8, 2010)

Ok, that sounds like a good idea. Thanks! I've got a lot of questions and will be posting new threads soon once I figure out what to do with the fish I am going to give away. I don't know of any place nearby that will take them, and I don't have friends that want them. It'd be nice to find a way to get at least a little money back for them, but I don't see that happening. I'll keep the board updated on the next set I choose for input.


----------



## jordan_101 (Mar 21, 2010)

I have an arustus in my male malawi tank and my syno multis kick the **** out of him he is the most timid fish in my tank


----------



## gverde (Mar 3, 2010)

jordan_101 said:


> I have an arustus in my male malawi tank and my syno multis kick the #%$& out of him he is the most timid fish in my tank


Is he or she a juvie? After a few months when the auratus gets older things can change.


----------



## jordan_101 (Mar 21, 2010)

He's like 5 inches or so


----------

