# Nandopsis Haitiensis (Black Nasty) Really so nasty ?



## marinerm10

Hi everyone,

I havent been on here for a while but in between that I have stripped down my tank sold it and have been given a new one from a friend at work. It is very big well at least the biggest I have ever owned. It around 180 gallons.

I recently visited my local store and they have just taken delivery of some Black Nasties from their supplier. They are around 4 inch long. I wanted to find out what they are like as I have been reading that they are more aggressive than Red Devils. Not sure how true this is but does this cichlid live up to its reputation as being very very aggressive? I know they grow large and I am researching their care requirements so all I want to know is what they are truly like?

Also how compatible would they be with a RD of a similar size?

Thanks

Ps I am not sure if they come under south or central american so please can the moderator move this if it is in the wrong place. Thanks


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## Bkeen

I wouldn't put them in a community setting- I have six juvies in a 125 and have to break out dividers often to keep the two large males and the biggest female separated. These fish are extremely territorial. They are some of my favorite fish though!


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## marinerm10

Bkeen,

Are you able to post some photos of yours and also explain to me the difference between male and female. I would preferably want a male. The ones they had at my lfs were white with black speckles and had a tiny tiny bump on the head.

Is there a major difference? There isnt a lot of info online about that.

Thanks


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## Bkeen

marinerm10 said:


> Bkeen,
> 
> Are you able to post some photos of yours and also explain to me the difference between male and female. I would preferably want a male. The ones they had at my lfs were white with black speckles and had a tiny tiny bump on the head.
> 
> Is there a major difference? There isnt a lot of info online about that.
> 
> Thanks


White with dark speckles generally would be a male. The majority of Black nasties I've seen have been male. I'm at work and can't take any pics of them right now. There's a thread in this folder of them entitled _Parachromis or Nandopsis Wetpet_ 
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=206826&highlight=

Here's a video from Youtube in which you can easily distinguish between the Larger, lighter colored male and the darker, smaller female:






It's much more difficult to distinguish the sex of them when they are juvies.


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## marinerm10

Thanks for finding the vid Bkeen,

I just got back from the LFS and I have a male. He is a spitting image of the one in the video just a mini version. He is mostly hiding right now but I will get a photo of him up here tomorrow for you to confirm.

How would a RD cope with him if I picked one up in the next few days?


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## Bkeen

marinerm10 said:


> Thanks for finding the vid Bkeen,
> 
> I just got back from the LFS and I have a male. He is a spitting image of the one in the video just a mini version. He is mostly hiding right now but I will get a photo of him up here tomorrow for you to confirm.
> 
> How would a RD cope with him if I picked one up in the next few days?


I'd advise against putting anything with the Black nasty. One of three things will happen:
1. The Black Nasty will kill the RD.
2. The RD will kill the Black Nasty
3. They will fight and the black nasty will bloat due to stress and die, as they are prone to bloat.


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## Bkeen

I found the post I was looking for- TheFishGuy (moderator for this Central American folder and fish guru) provided some great info on these fish- here's one post you should read:



TheFishGuy said:


> On the contrary if you follow some simple rules of raising them you will have them for years.
> 
> First is to keep them with only themselves, no other fish.
> 
> Second, do consistent water changes. No matter what they are, 10% daily of 30% weekly, just be consistent.
> 
> Third, feed them Spirulina flakes when young and Spirulina pellets when older with the occasional treat of earthworms.
> 
> Don't be changing the decor around every five minutes. THey do not like change, more so than oscars, oscars sulk with change, odos die of bloat....
> 
> That's it. Now everyone knows the secret.


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## marinerm10

Thats great thanks for finding that info

I was going to get a photo up tonight but he has found himself a cave and is now building himself a barrier on all sides by digging it up and spitting it into big piles ! Is this normal? I am wondering if he will even be able to get out ! Very weird considering he is on his own ! Looks like he is trying to hide from something and shut himself off !


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## marinerm10

Here he is....Is it a male can anyone confirm? I am planning a massive overhaul of my tank, removing rocks, removing the plants can anyone recommend what conditions may be best for him and what I should get?

Thanks


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## Bkeen

marinerm10 said:


> Thats great thanks for finding that info
> 
> I was going to get a photo up tonight but he has found himself a cave and is now building himself a barrier on all sides by digging it up and spitting it into big piles ! Is this normal? I am wondering if he will even be able to get out ! Very weird considering he is on his own ! Looks like he is trying to hide from something and shut himself off !


They are compulsive diggers- it'll be okay. Here's a pic of the one from CichlidScene (one of the best looking Nasties I've ever seen)










You can see where he dug around and rearranged his tank.


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## marinerm10

That is a stunning Haitiensis. Amazing cichlid. Did you see the photo of mine Bkeen? Any ideas on its gender or to early to say?


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## Bkeen

marinerm10 said:


> Here he is....Is it a male can anyone confirm? I am planning a massive overhaul of my tank, removing rocks, removing the plants can anyone recommend what conditions may be best for him and what I should get?
> 
> Thanks


Hard to tell on the sex from the pic- it does look light colored but has prominent coloration around the back... After a while, you'll be able to tell. My females are pitch black except their faces when I first turn the light on in the morning.



thefishguy said:


> Don't be changing the decor around every five minutes. THey do not like change, more so than oscars, oscars sulk with change, odos die of bloat....


Easy on the redecorating- Do it right and do it once. Even that once is a risk IMO. I've had my tank set the same way since I got my nasties.


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## marinerm10

Yeah to be honest I might leave my tank as it is now.....I don't want to disrupt him and stress him

How big are yours now ? Do you know much on the growth rate?


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## Bkeen

marinerm10 said:


> Yeah to be honest I might leave my tank as it is now.....I don't want to disrupt him and stress him
> 
> How big are yours now ? Do you know much on the growth rate?


TFG got the fish ~1/2 inch. I got them in April and they ranged from 1-2 inches. They are now in the 3-4 inch range. I have 2 large males and one large female that seem to be more mature than the other three fish.

As far as the growth rate goes, they can be relatively fast growing fish, but the faster you grow them out, the more likely you are to have some get bloat. The spirulina (and occasional earthworm treat) diet probably doesn't grow 'em out as fast as more protein and different foods would, but it's better for the fish-as they are less likely to get bloat.


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## Boston_Guapote

I was able to pick out my pair even at a 1"... Few things to look for is the black blotch, which "usually" indicate a female, and lack of black (almost white) which usually indicate a male. See pics below...

Female









Male









Tank









Video dated Jan 27, 2010





Video dated June 17, 2010





My old male


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## TheFishGuy

glad to see people getting excited about these fish


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## Bkeen

TheFishGuy said:


> glad to see people getting excited about these fish


You started it for me... I'm just sharing the info you gave me. I love these fish!


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## marinerm10

Thanks for showing me your pair Bkeen. For sure I must have a male as he has not turned black and is exactly like yours. Your old male was amazing. What happened to him?

Mine is still hiding often but is starting to ease his shyness now. I can't help but think how he would cope with tank mates as he seems extremely unsociable so far.

I can't wait for him to grow larger to see those fins.


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## Bkeen

marinerm10 said:


> Thanks for showing me your pair Bkeen. For sure I must have a male as he has not turned black and is exactly like yours. Your old male was amazing. What happened to him?
> 
> Mine is still hiding often but is starting to ease his shyness now. I can't help but think how he would cope with tank mates as he seems extremely unsociable so far.
> 
> I can't wait for him to grow larger to see those fins.


Wasn't my pair- that was Boston Guapote, and Indeed his fish are gorgeous.


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## marinerm10

Ah okay sorry I thought they were yours, it was nice of you to not claim them as yours 

Are these cichlids not to popular in the aquarium trade, hence me only seeing them once in last few years?

If so I can't see why


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## PepoLD

marinerm10 said:


> Ah okay sorry I thought they were yours, it was nice of you to not claim them as yours
> 
> Are these cichlids not to popular in the aquarium trade, hence me only seeing them once in last few years?
> 
> If so I can't see why


as most CA....

size requirement


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## PepoLD

Bkeen said:


> marinerm10 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for showing me your pair Bkeen. For sure I must have a male as he has not turned black and is exactly like yours. Your old male was amazing. What happened to him?
> 
> Mine is still hiding often but is starting to ease his shyness now. I can't help but think how he would cope with tank mates as he seems extremely unsociable so far.
> 
> I can't wait for him to grow larger to see those fins.
> 
> 
> 
> Wasn't my pair- that was Boston Guapote, and Indeed his fish are gorgeous.
Click to expand...

still waiting to see yours :zz: you promissed pics since last week omg


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## Bkeen

PepoLD said:


> Bkeen said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> marinerm10 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for showing me your pair Bkeen. For sure I must have a male as he has not turned black and is exactly like yours. Your old male was amazing. What happened to him?
> 
> Mine is still hiding often but is starting to ease his shyness now. I can't help but think how he would cope with tank mates as he seems extremely unsociable so far.
> 
> I can't wait for him to grow larger to see those fins.
> 
> 
> 
> Wasn't my pair- that was Boston Guapote, and Indeed his fish are gorgeous.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *still waiting to see yours :zz: you promissed pics since last week *omg
Click to expand...

Got married last Saturday, went out of town for a few days after. Came home, my home a/c was broken, and This thursday I broke my foot- wild week. I'll get some soon.


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## PepoLD

Bkeen said:


> PepoLD said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bkeen said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> marinerm10 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for showing me your pair Bkeen. For sure I must have a male as he has not turned black and is exactly like yours. Your old male was amazing. What happened to him?
> 
> Mine is still hiding often but is starting to ease his shyness now. I can't help but think how he would cope with tank mates as he seems extremely unsociable so far.
> 
> I can't wait for him to grow larger to see those fins.
> 
> 
> 
> Wasn't my pair- that was Boston Guapote, and Indeed his fish are gorgeous.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *still waiting to see yours :zz: you promissed pics since last week *omg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Got married last Saturday, went out of town for a few days after. Came home, my home a/c was broken, and This thursday I broke my foot- wild week. I'll get some soon.
Click to expand...

Hahahaha seriously! congratulations!! i guess we can wait (another day or two) hahaha, and sorry to hear about your foot  i hope that was after the honeymoon!


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## Bkeen

PepoLD said:


> Bkeen said:
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> 
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> 
> PepoLD said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> Bkeen said:
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> 
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> 
> 
> marinerm10 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for showing me your pair Bkeen. For sure I must have a male as he has not turned black and is exactly like yours. Your old male was amazing. What happened to him?
> 
> Mine is still hiding often but is starting to ease his shyness now. I can't help but think how he would cope with tank mates as he seems extremely unsociable so far.
> 
> I can't wait for him to grow larger to see those fins.
> 
> 
> 
> Wasn't my pair- that was Boston Guapote, and Indeed his fish are gorgeous.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> *still waiting to see yours :zz: you promissed pics since last week *omg
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Got married last Saturday, went out of town for a few days after. Came home, my home a/c was broken, and This thursday I broke my foot- wild week. I'll get some soon.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hahahaha seriously! congratulations!! i guess we can wait (another day or two) hahaha, and sorry to hear about your foot  i hope that was after the honeymoon!
Click to expand...

It was the day we got back. At least the wife is helping (doing) my waterchanges for me.  I'll try to take pics of all of my fish tonight-


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## Logan Brace

What beautifull fish, They look a lot like dovii's except dovii's look sleeker. I've gotta dovii believed to be a male in a 75 for now. he's somewhere around3-4 inches. Got him at about 3.


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## Bkeen

PepoLD said:


> Bkeen said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> marinerm10 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for showing me your pair Bkeen. For sure I must have a male as he has not turned black and is exactly like yours. Your old male was amazing. What happened to him?
> 
> Mine is still hiding often but is starting to ease his shyness now. I can't help but think how he would cope with tank mates as he seems extremely unsociable so far.
> 
> I can't wait for him to grow larger to see those fins.
> 
> 
> 
> Wasn't my pair- that was Boston Guapote, and Indeed his fish are gorgeous.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> still waiting to see yours :zz: you promissed pics since last week omg
Click to expand...

I finally got updated pics up in the other thread-  :fish:


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## Logan Brace

marinerm10 said:


> He is mostly hiding right now but I will get a photo of him up here tomorrow for you to confirm.


If it's not a male, and you said you wanted one.... a 180 could easily house a pair of Nasty's. BTW, Nasty's *AREN'T* nearly as aggressive as they're made out to be IMO/E. I think a full grown Red Devil could take one out...... but then again, a Breeding pair of Nasty's can and will live up to their name.

PS: My Dovii is still shy, but at 3", he could take a Nasty. I really need a Nasty don't I.... I need another tank don't I.... ok you've convinced me I need them.


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## Bkeen

Logan Brace said:


> marinerm10 said:
> 
> 
> 
> He is mostly hiding right now but I will get a photo of him up here tomorrow for you to confirm.
> 
> 
> 
> If it's not a male, and you said you wanted one.... a 180 could easily house a pair of Nasty's. BTW, Nasty's *AREN'T* nearly as aggressive as they're made out to be IMO/E. I think a full grown Red Devil could take one out...... but then again, a Breeding pair of Nasty's can and will live up to their name.
> 
> PS: My Dovii is still shy, but at 3", he could take a Nasty. I really need a Nasty don't I.... I need another tank don't I.... ok you've convinced me I need them.
Click to expand...

Yes you do need some Nasties. :dancing:


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## PepoLD

I wish i could get one here


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## Bkeen

TTT


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## Logan Brace

Bkeen said:


> Yes you do need some Nasties. :dancing:


I had to make the hard decision between a Nasty and a Dovii a couple months back... came down to which one was cheaper, because I couldn't decide. I have plans for Nasties tough. My LFS still has the Nasties I didn't take, and one of the males has grown a lot. I didn't think these guys were supposed to grow fast but my LFS is amazing and it can do just about anything. Anyway he's grown a lot more than my Dovii(To my dismay), and he's a beaut. They have a good 15 Nasties in there so I'm sure I could get a pair. If any of you guys are interested If you guys pay for the shipping I could get them out to you. :thumb:


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## TheFishGuy

ha ha, I could beat the stores prices any day of the week! LOL But we're nto supposed to discuss those things in the open forums... :wink:


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## Bkeen

TheFishGuy said:


> ha ha, I could beat the stores prices any day of the week! LOL But we're nto supposed to discuss those things in the open forums... :wink:


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## TheFishGuy

So, I think I have an ad now... LOL


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## Bkeen

Bump for a good Haitiensis thread


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