# Tank size for / suitablity of brichardi in community tank



## acreal (Jan 18, 2006)

When i first started to look into tangs, I obviously noticed N. brichardi, but i wanted a community tank and so I haven't investigated further.

Now, this post got me wondering whether it is possible to house an N. brichardi group along side other species in a community tank on the long term (let's say in a 200-300g tank, or whatever).

That is, is possible not to have the brichardi take over the all tank in time by including enough predators for the fry to be kept in check ?


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## triscuit (May 6, 2005)

The poster in that thread is already having trouble with his brichardi and they haven't bred yet.

Some common experience suggests that hefty territorial cichlids may hold their own against a younger pair of brichardi. For example, if you allow a pair of j. marlieri to settle first, they will likely defend their breeding area sucessfully. N. leleupi may also be able to stave off the brichardi. The trick is to get adults and later introduce juvenile brichardi.

I bred both marlieri and brichardi in a 55gal. The chalinochromis were killed off very quickly, along with a singleton leleupi. A tank wide disaster shortened that experience, but it worked for about 18 months.


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## acreal (Jan 18, 2006)

> The poster in that thread is already having trouble with his brichardi and they haven't bred yet.


I was just saying that the thread got me thinking about brichardi's behavior, not that it led me to think cohabitation was possible. 

And from the hmm... tone of your voice, they really seem like little terrors. 8)

My point was that in my (limited) experience, I've noticed that overall population and tank arrangements have an important impact on aggressivity and so I was wondering whether brichardi's (or should i say fish of the brichardi complex?) couldn't be tamed by eg a large school of cyp/paracyp as well as a a bunch of small to medium size predators (tamed as in make them stop killing other inhabitants).

Anyway, that was more of a rhetorical question since I don't like the idea of any of my fish killing another (but that wouldn't happen since they're all good friends ).


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## Joels fish (Nov 17, 2007)

I think that Brichardis can work fine in a community setting, or at least they work fine in mine. I have 1 male and 2 females plus fry from two spawns and it has been very peacefull in my tank. All together I have the Brichardi, 3peacocks, a mystery hap. , 1 N. Venustus. 1 C. Moori , 1Neolamp. Moori 1 J. Reagani, and a OB peacock that thinks he's a Brichardi( the Brichardis let him hang around their little patch of rocks and hardly ever bother him) . So far even with the fry my Brichardis really don't cause any trouble unless someone gets too close for comfort to the fry. 
My experience with them has been very good , and I would recomend getting some if you have the room. The way they raise their young alone is a great reason to get some. The Brichardis reputation as trouble makers is in my opinion undeserved.


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## acreal (Jan 18, 2006)

> My experience with them has been very good , and I would recomend getting some if you have the room. The way they raise their young alone is a great reason to get some.


I don't think they'd fit in my current setup but someday, maybe. 



> The Brichardis reputation as trouble makers is in my opinion undeserved.


Interesting, can anyone comment on this ?

Btw, in what size tank are those and for how long have they been breeding ?


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## Xenomorph (Aug 6, 2007)

Brichardi's bad reputation is due to their strong family instinct. If they manage to outspawn the other tank inhabitants than they will go after their territory. As I mentioned in the other thread, if you have a big enough tank to try community go ahead... think about the species you like and we can give more input on that.

I just picked up a 400+gal tank and if it wasn't for my big Tropheus I'd go crazy on a community tank (which I think I will down the road )


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## acreal (Jan 18, 2006)

Xenomorph said:


> Brichardi's bad reputation is due to their strong family instinct. If they manage to outspawn the other tank inhabitants than they will go after their territory. As I mentioned in the other thread, if you have a big enough tank to try community go ahead... think about the species you like and we can give more input on that.


I really have no plans to challenge my luck with brichardi's right now.  Maybe when I'll be more confident with tangs/cichlids and aggression altogether.

Best of luck on your 400 btw! :drooling:


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## Joels fish (Nov 17, 2007)

> Btw, in what size tank are those and for how long have they been breeding


 They are in a 90g , and they have been spawning for about two months. Only three survied from the fist spawn, this one though it looks like I'll have the majority survive. Population control is going to be essential to keep this set up going well, fortunately I have a buddy back in Texas who is opening a fish store and has no problems taking them off my hands once the fry grow out a bit.
What fish do you have in your current set up? How large is your tank? I would think that a single specimen would work out fine so long as the tank isn't already at capacity.


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## acreal (Jan 18, 2006)

> What fish do you have in your current set up? How large is your tank?


I currently house 4 C. foae, 4 N. buescheri and 2 N. calvus in a 6' 150 (planning to add 20-25 C. leptosoma and 4 more foae soon).



> I would think that a single specimen would work out fine so long as the tank isn't already at capacity.


As i said, I'm not really looking into getting brichardi's and was *really* just trying to figure out the situation with them. But thanks for proposing. :thumb:


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## ashilli48 (May 14, 2006)

You are probably best avoiding the Brichardi. They are very attractive fish but too truly enjoy them I feel you need at least a pair and that is when the trouble may start. They are fierce "homeowners" and parents.

I have several but that was my mistake of startign with them first and trying to work other fish in. If I had it to do over I would try and avoid the Brichardi. Altough what is working for me right now is a large pile of rocks to the side, a large piece of hollow driftwood in the center and numerous varieties of plants. All of this seems to define territories but more importantly break up sight lines. Learned this through my wife's love of puffers and their "out of sight, out of mind" approach to cohabitation and lots of visual "blockades".


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## Joels fish (Nov 17, 2007)

> Altough what is working for me right now is a large pile of rocks to the side, a large piece of hollow driftwood in the center and numerous varieties of plants


 This similar in concept to how my arrangement is. No plants or driftwood , I am using rocks for the same purpose.


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## acreal (Jan 18, 2006)

Well... I do have a spare 30g at hand actually... :roll:

Btw, I actually forgot to go check the brichardi article in the library. Nice one.

N. brichardi and friends seems like an interesting fish, but I haven't yet fell for MTS and would like to keep it that way as long as possible. 

I do have a remaining question after reading the article though: if you house a brichardi group in a species tank (or community tank for that matter), how are you supposed to keep numbers in check ? They seem to be reproducing like rabbits. :-?


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## Joels fish (Nov 17, 2007)

Netting them out( though that can be a bit of a challenge) , fish traps , use of a predator(like some sort of cat fish) . I tend to rearange my aquascape from time to time , so netting them is pretty easy then. In something the size of a 30g though netting wouldn't be a big problem once the rocks , plants ,and such were removed . Really though, I think syphoning the fry with a hose is the least invasive and easiest way to get the young uns out .


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## acreal (Jan 18, 2006)

> Really though, I think syphoning the fry with a hose is the least invasive and easiest way to get the young uns out.


Least invasive for everyone else but the fry's. :lol:

But what would you do with the fry's, you'd either will to give/sell/trade them away or kill them no ?

Note that I haven't had any reproduction in my tank yet since it's a fairly new setup and so i'm not used to dealing with offspring relocation. Which is why I might be getting a bit OT on this thread...


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## Joels fish (Nov 17, 2007)

> But what would you do with the fry's, you'd either will to give/sell/trade them away or kill them no ?


 That's usually the tricky part. Like I said before, I have a friend with a fish store who will take them(Shipping them to Texas is the biggest obsticle in that) , but if push comes to shove I've got a tank full of hungry CAs and SAs that will always lend a hand in getting rid of excess fry if it comes down to it.


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## acreal (Jan 18, 2006)

That's always useful. :lol: Thanks for the infos. :thumb:


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