# API KH Test



## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Hi guys,

I finished cycling my tank less than a week ago, no fish yet, and I tested KH for the first time, today. It takes 3 drops to change the color from light blue to a very soft yellow. Should I add more drops until it turns bright yellow? or it doesn't matter what tone of yellow it is? If that's the case my water has a KH of 3 dKH, which I think it's low if I'm planning on stocking Malawi Haplochromis. Is that right? Thanks.


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## xxbenjamminxx (Jan 22, 2011)

Yeah, that is pretty low. Can pose a problem as it may let your PH swing which is not cool if your a fish. You can either check the library for the home made buffer recipe or get the store boughten stuff.

I would go with the one in the library. Cheaper, customizable, and well if you can do it yourself, why not. May only need to use baking soda depending on your GH and PH.


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## GTZ (Apr 21, 2010)

fddlss said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I finished cycling my tank less than a week ago, no fish yet, and I tested KH for the first time, today. It takes 3 drops to change the color from light blue to a very soft yellow. Should I add more drops until it turns bright yellow? or it doesn't matter what tone of yellow it is? If that's the case my water has a KH of 3 dKH, which I think it's low if I'm planning on stocking Malawi Haplochromis. Is that right? Thanks.





> 6. The Carbonate Hardness value is determined by the number of drops of the reagent that
> must be added to turn the water in the test tube bright yellow. Each drop Is equal to 1 'dKH
> or 17.9 ppm KH,(see the chart).


You're capping and inverting after each drop?
I'd try it again to see just how bright a color of yellow it gets, then use another test tube and count drops until it matches.
Check the pH in your tank after a water change and right before the following water change, I'm curious as to whether or not it's dropping significantly.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

I did invert it after each drop and I noticed that my pH has dropped significantly. My pH used to be 8.2+, it's 8.4 right from the tap water, but today it was at 7.4, I really don't know exactly when it dropped because the last time I checked it was last week and it was around 8.2. I finished my cycle last Friday and did a big partial water change that day, but it seemed like that didn't affect the pH at that time. Is the baking soda recipe a permanent solution? or just temporary?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Baking soda or other additives are added with every water change.

What is the pH of your tap water after sitting in a bowl on the counter for 24 hours?


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

You need to get the KH of your tap water. If it's at an ok level (and I suspect that it is) then water changes will get things straightened around and you don't need the baking soda at all. A drop in KH and pH is normal during cycling because of all of the ammonia used. The end product of the nitrogen cycle is acidic. If you get a KH level of 6-8 or so, you're fine. As long as you keep up with water changes you'll replenish buffers that way.

Regarding the color change, I add one more drop then call it a half. Like in your case, I'd say KH is 3.5. But, that's just me so that I have a point of reference. Whether it's 3 or 3.5 or 4 doesn't make that big of a difference. It's low.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

I will get the pH and KH of my tap water. pH is 8.4 right from the faucet, but I will let it sit on a bowl for 24 hours and then test for pH and KH, that should indicate me if I have to use the recipe for buffering or if weekly water changes will do the trick. I will keep you guys updated. Thanks.


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## DrgRcr (Jun 23, 2009)

I'd say you are right on the cusp of OK if it is truly 3. I'd test again as prov stated to double check. For comparison, my KH is about 4.5-5 with 7.6 pH out of the tap that off gasses to 8, and I've never had a pH crash. I've gone as long as 12-13 days between water changes because of my schedule a couple of times.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Thanks. I will double check it today, as well as check my tap water. I will also perform a PWC as this might be happening because of the cycle.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Ok guys, I have the readings from my tap water, my tap water after being on a bowl for more than 24 hours, my aquarium water before a 60% PWC, my aquarium water after a 60% PWC, my aquarium water 12 hours after adding 1 PPM of ammonia.

OK, these are the levels on my tank and my tap water: I know some of the tests are unnecessary for tap water but I still tested for it.

Tap water right from the faucet:
Ammonia: 0.50 PPM
Nitrite: 0 PPM
Nitrate: 0 PPM
pH: 8.4
GH: 3 dKH
KH: 2.5-3 dKH

Tap water sitting on the counter for more than 24 hours:
Ammonia: 0.50 PPM
Nitrite: 0 PPM
Nitrate: 0 PPM
pH: 7.4
GH: 2 dKH
KH: 2.5 dKH

Water from tank BEFORE doing a 60% water change on Wednesday night:
Ammonia: 0 PPM
Nitrite: 0 PPM
Nitrate: 80-160 PPM
pH: 7.4
GH: Didn't have a GH test.
KH: 3 dKH
Temp: 87 F

Water from tank AFTER doing a 60% water change on Wednesday night:
Ammonia: 0.25 PPM
Nitrite: 0 PPM
Nitrate: 40 PPM
pH: 7.4
GH: 3 dKH
KH: 3 dKH
Temp: 85 F

Water from the tank on Thursday afternoon, 12 hours after adding 1 PPM ammonia in the morning:
Ammonia: 0 PPM
Nitrite: 0 PPM
Nitrate: 40 PPM
pH: 7.4
GH: 5 dKH
KH: 3 dKH
Temp: 86 F

I think I will need to buffer my water and increase pH in order to stock African cichlids, right?

Please let me know your opinions.

Thanks.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

> I think I will need to buffer my water and increase pH in order to stock African cichlids, right?


Yes, 2.5 - 3 KH is low. I'd bump it up to 8 or so. Use baking soda (sodium bicarbonate). Your pH will rise also, but more importantly, it'll be stable.

The ammonia reading that you're getting is probably from chloramine in your source water. Not a concern, just make sure you're using a product that is specifically made to deal with chloramine.

As for GH, some debate on if it matters, but if you want to raise it, use Epsom salt (magnesium sulfate).


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Thanks.

I use Prime to neutralize chloramine. I will read about GH and Epson salt to decide if I will use it or not, and will definitely use baking soda to raise and stabilize the KH and PH. Is baking soda a temporary solution or I can use it regularly? Are there other ways to achieve that?


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

You can use baking soda regularly. Some use crushed coral in their filters to raise KH. I use aragamax sand as a substrate and it helps to buffer, but I've not relied on it exclusively. Always test as results and effectiveness can vary. Crushed coral in a filter is probably one of the most effective ways, as the high water flow will help to dissolve it.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

What's the ideal KH and GH for Malawi haplochromines? I know pH should be anywhere between 7.8 and 8.6. I will probably end up adding crushed coral in the sump, below the bio-balls I have some free space, how much do you think I'll need? By doing this I will probably not need the salts or is it a matter of choice? Is the API Aquiarium Salt any good? I don't mean to use it for buffering, but for general use. Thanks again.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

> Is the API Aquiarium Salt any good? I don't mean to use it for buffering, but for general use.


Waste of money. Don't add 'aquarium salt'. Lots of myths out there regarding it's benefits.



> What's the ideal KH and GH for Malawi haplochromines?


This article may be helpful. Practical Water Chemistry You won't find any ideals for KH as there are none. Just keep it up high enough so pH doesn't crash, say 8 or so.



> I will probably end up adding crushed coral in the sump, below the bio-balls I have some free space, how much do you think I'll need?


Results can vary. Add some and test to determine effectiveness.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

The Practical Water Chemistry was very helpful. I will try to raise my GH to 16 dKH, KH to 12 dKH, and pH to 8.4. My next question is, let's suppose I get some crushed coral from y LFS, I place it in the sump, and I'm lucky enough to get the pH, GH and KH that I want, wouldn't that change with every partial water change? At least the pH, being that my tap water has a pH of 8.4 right from the faucet but after a few hours it drops to 7.4. Would the crushed coral raise the new water's pH before it drops? Will KH do the job on keeping a stable pH?


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

> wouldn't that change with every partial water change?


Yes, anytime you mix in water with different parameters, it will change some things. GH will drop a bit, KH will drop a bit, but pH may stay same, or not. Generally, these changes will not cause any problems for the fish, as they won't be drastic. If we had to keep perfect parameters that never changed at all, we'd not be able to keep fish. Just test as you go, and you'll see the effects. Don't over react to or worry about moderate changes. It's not a big deal. The biggest thing is to keep KH up so pH doesn't crash. If you do that, you'll be fine IME.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Sounds good. Thanks! I know there's not a rule for this or a set measurement, but for a 120 gal. that has a pH of 7.4 and needs to be around 8.4 a 20 Lb. bag of crushed coral would be enough? An add it 10 lbs at a time and test, and so on until I get the desired levels.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

Yes, add some and test. 10# at a time sounds good. And monitor over time. The stuff has to dissolve to 'work'. If it gets coated with organics, and this inihibits its ability to dissolve, then it may become less effective over time.

And best to focus on KH instead of pH. Focusing on pH can lead to unnecessary frustrations. Bring your KH up and pH will come up as well and be stable. What it comes up to and settles at is of secondary importance. It'll probably fall anywhere between 7.8 and 8.4, and that's perfectly ok. Don't get trapped into thinking that you have to get your pH up to a certain value. If your KH is 8 or so, and pH is not 8.4, it'd be a waste of time and effort to try to bring it up more. Nothing to be gained and you could end up buying a bunch of expensive additives from local stores that send your pH on some serious swings. And all for naught.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Grat advice! Thank you!! Will keep you updated.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

I added CC last night, about 7-8 pounds and there was no difference in pH this morning, I know it probably takes 48 Hs. before I see a raise in pH. On the other hand, I've always used the High Range pH from API to test for pH, but this morning I decided to try and see what the pH test said and it was 7.6, so the high range pH gives me 7.4 (lowest in the chart) and the pH gives me 7.6 (highest in the chart); However, I also have the Seachem pH alert in my sump and that reads 7.4. I guess I should just go for what the high range pH test says and forget about the lower pH test.


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## DrgRcr (Jun 23, 2009)

If the normal test reads 7.6(high end of the scale) and the high test reads 7.4(low end of the scale), I'd take that as right in the middle at 7.5. But as previously stated, the KH is what will really matter, so I'd check that after the CC has been in there a couple of days. The pH at 7.5 will be fine if it stays consistently at or near that number.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Yeah, I figured I need to be more patient and wait for the crushed coral to do it's thing. KH should raise pH automatically, but most importantly help stabilize it.

Thanks.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

KH and pH are the same after adding CC 60 hours ago, should I keep waiting or add more CC?


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

You can if you have it, but if it takes a week or more to make a difference, water changes are just going to undo that difference. Some swear by crushed coral. I've seen aragamax sand make an overnight difference, but never tested crushed coral. Did you add it to the filter?


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Yes, I added it in the sump. I guess I will wait a little longer then and no water changes until I'm ready to bring my first fish. If I do a 90% water change to drop nitrates 24 hours before adding the fish then that will probably drop the KH, should I wait until it goes back up before adding the fish? or 24 hours is enough to accommodate the new water to the tank's parameters?


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

Don't do a 90% water change on a newly cycled tank as I've seen it cause cycling setbacks. Start doing small changes now.

I remember now that it was going in the sump. It'd be my guess that it's not going to be effective enough for you that way. Probably more effective in a cannister where water is pushed through it at a higher flow rate. But, add what you have and see. An alternative might be a small caninster llike the Eheim classics just for this purpose. You could put both intake and outflow in the sump with a sponge over the intake. You'd probably rarely have to open it. But, I find it easier to just do the baking soda.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

I will wait and see, but I agree that, at this point and if CC doesn't work, adding baking soda as part of the weekly maintenance with every partial water change is the way to go. As far as water changes, I will begin doing small partial water changes about a week before adding the fish to drop nitrates, 20% is fine?

Thanks.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

fddlss said:


> I will wait and see, but I agree that, at this point and if CC doesn't work, adding baking soda as part of the weekly maintenance with every partial water change is the way to go. As far as water changes, I will begin doing small partial water changes about a week before adding the fish to drop nitrates, 20% is fine?
> 
> Thanks.


Yes, even 30% or so, just avoid massive changes. Might not happen to you, but why risk it if you have all this time.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Sounds good. Thanks. Should I just use baking soda or follow this recipe? http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/buffer_recipe.php


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

> Should I just use baking soda or follow this recipe?


I use baking soda to raise KH. The epsom is optional and raises GH. I use it, but some debate as to it's usefulness. I'll probably stop when what I have runs out. I don't add aquarium salt. No debate in my mind that there's no benefit to adding aquarium salt on a regular basis. Others will disagree.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Thanks! I went to the beach on Sunday and brought home some small sea shells, I wonder if placing them in the sump will have any benefit? I'm also thinking about adding some rocks to buffer, I already have slate which I believe it helps, but I guess it's not enough.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Slate is inert. Calcium based rocks and shells can't hurt, but they also cannot dissolve fast enough to really impact your pH or KH if you are making regular water changes.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Thanks. I will wait a few more days and if I still don't see a change I'm just going to go with baking soda. I did a little test last night and these were the results:

First, I would like to let you know that the CC is from CaribSea, Florida Crushed Coral and it says in the bag that it's one of the best buffers available. However, I got it from my LFS and the bag looked pretty old, I don't know if that might have something to do or not.

On the other hand, I've tested my water and these are the parameters:

GH 7 dKH (raised a little since last time I tested)
KH 3.5 dKH (raised 0.5 -close to nothing, since last time I tested)
pH 7.4 (same as last time I tested)

Then, I took a cup of aquarium water and added a full teaspoon of baking soda. This was probably a huge amount of baking soda for a cup of aquarium water but I was just testing. These were the results:

GH 3 dKH

KH 20+ dKH (I stopped counting after 20 dKH, it was electric blue and it's supposed to be yellow, so I figured that it would take dozens of drops to change it to yellow)

pH 8.2 (It wasn't the exact same color as the color of the 8.2 measurement on the API test kit chart, but it was similar to it.)

Additional facts: I'm adding about 1.25 PPM of ammonia every morning to feed the bacteria while I don't get the fish. Could these be the reason why crushed coral is taking so long to buffer? It takes about 10 hours to drop Ammonia and Nitrites to 0 PPM after I add 1 to 1.50 PPM every 24 hours. My nitrates are probably high, maybe that's another cause?


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

The end products of cycling are acidic and will counter the effect of buffering, yes. I'd drop the ammonia dose to every 2-3 days. Do some water changes to get nitrates down.

Age of the crushed coral shouldn't make any difference.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Sounds good, I will try that and see if it helps with buffering. Thanks.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

I have come to the conclusion that maybe my CC is not helping because I have in the wrong place. Water overflows the baffle into the pump compartment & it's picked up by the pump inlet. There will be little water movement below the pump. which is where the CC is. CC is basically the substrate of the sump compartment where the return pump is. I've made an illustration of my sump. Maybe moving or adding more crushed coral to the area that's labeled "empty space" on the illustration, right? that way water WILL HAVE to flow through the crushed coral.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

I'd agree. Put it to the left side of the 'Empty Space' next to the sponge. See if that helps.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

However, crushed coral just cannot dissolve fast enough to significantly raise pH or KH. Baking soda will work.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

24 hours after moving the CC my pH has raised to about 8.0 and KH to 4.5 dKh and GH to 8 dKH, one degree for KH and KG and pH went from 7.4 to 7.8 - 8.0. Let's see if it stays stable!


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

> Let's see if it stays stable!


It may, but as DJ says, first time you do a water change, it'll undo much of what was accomplished. And a KH of 4.5 is borderline low. Unless it can raise the KH up to 7-8 in short order, I'd say it's not going to work for you.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

I see... I will wait a few more days, to see if it dissolves and raises the KH further or if that's all CC can do for me. If it does raises KH to 8, for example, then I will have to make sure that it does it in a short term, because of partial water changes, if it does, that means that CC by itslef will do the trick. On the other hand, if KH stays the same by the end of the week I will call it a day and use baking soda with each partial watter change once a week. How many teaspoons of baking soda do you think I need? I know it depends but with how many should I start to test? 15? To raise KH from 4 to 10 or so in a 120 gal. Thanks guys!


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

fddlss said:


> I see... I will wait a few more days, to see if it dissolves and raises the KH further or if that's all CC can do for me. If it does raises KH to 8, for example, then I will have to make sure that it does it in a short term, because of partial water changes, if it does, that means that CC by itslef will do the trick. On the other hand, if KH stays the same by the end of the week I will call it a day and use baking soda with each partial watter change once a week. How many teaspoons of baking soda do you think I need? I know it depends but with how many should I start to test? 15? To raise KH from 4 to 10 or so in a 120 gal. Thanks guys!


It doesn't take much. I'd start with 5 tablespoons, give it an hour and then test. You'll know from that how much a tablespoon will raise it. Then test after a water change to see how much it dropped and figure from there how much you'll need with each water change. Dissolve it before adding and add slowly.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Sounds good. I'm still waiting and KH, GH, pH didn't move, 3 days after adding new CC to an area in the sump with more water flow. You guys are probably going to say I'm dumb, but I'm really getting very inpatient and I would like to start stocking my tank, at least with 3 or 4 fish this week. Can I do a PWC to drop nitrates and stock the tank with the first 4 fish? Even though my water is not really hard and keep waiting to see if CC does something and if it doesn't can I gradually add baking soda a little bit every day or every other day until the water is hard enough? I know that if I waited this long I should just wait a little more, but like I said, I'm really tired of seeing that empty tank and I would like to know if my fish will survive under those conditions. Thanks.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

I would use the baking soda to get parameters up, and then start adding fish. If the CC starts working, then you may be able to wean the system off of the baking soda later.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

That's what I should have done; however, I was very impatient and got my first 4 fish before doing that and yesterday I got another 5 fish. I'm sure my filter will habdle the bio-load pretty well. I'm just doing a 30% PWC every day to drop nitrates. Nitrate is at 30 PPM now. My goal is under 5 PPM. Probably a PWC today and another one tomorrow will do it. I know I did everything backwards, I should have waited until next week, so I wouldn't be doing PWCs every day with the fish in and I would have time to buffer the water without the fish in the tank, using baking soda. As you know, my pH is 7.5 and KH 4.5 dKH. Most of these fish I'm sure they are raised in water even softer then that or similar, so I don't necessarily think they will die and even Lake Malawi has parts with 7.5 pH, but that's not the point because my KH is not high enough, good thing my tap water has a pH of 7.5. I'm afraid to use baking soda now, because pH fluctuations are worse than fish in a slightly different pH than recommended. I got about 9 pounds of limestone, too, which hopefully helps.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

Don't be afraid to bump up KH and pH with baking soda. Just do it gradually. I'm not convinced that these changes cause the serious death and disease issues they get blamed for. If you start believing they do, you'll go crazy constantly trying to maintain some specific levels. Some fluctuations are ok.


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## fddlss (Apr 7, 2011)

Sounds good! Thanks! I will do it gradually and test. I posted some pics of my fish.


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