# Filtration inquiry



## Dobbs92 (Dec 15, 2008)

I'm just in the early planning stages for a 72 gallon Malawian Cichlid tank. I've done some research regarding filters and read many reviews and have decided that I will likely go with a Rena, due to ease of maintenance, media flexibility, and cost. My question is this. I have read of several folks who have encountered flow problems with the XP4. It starts out fine and within a week or two flow is noticeably reduced. Afer checking things out and restarting, it works well again and then the flow reduces yet again. It has been suggested by a number of folks that the problem might well be too many media compartments. Has anyone else encountered this problem? It would cost a bit more and that's OK, so would I be better served by two XP2s? Thanks!


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## moi_eater (Jul 11, 2004)

If you are set on Rena then go with 2 XP3's or 1 XP3 and 1 XP2.

2 XP2's wouldn't be enough for a 72g Malawi tank imho.


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## sjlchgo (Mar 2, 2008)

Have you considered the Aqua Clear 110/500? 2 of those would be geat. Easy to maintain and inexpensive! Just rinse the sponge and you're set.


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## prov356 (Sep 20, 2006)

An XP4 will give you about 240gph packed with media. As the media clogs, it will slow even more. The 
smaller ones have fewer baskets, but they also have less powerful pumps, so not sure if there's any 
gain. I'd probably be tempted to combine an XP4 or XP3 with a HOB filter instead of opting for two 
canisters. I'd also suggest checking out the Eheim Ecco canisters with baskets. Nice filters.

Just my .02


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## Dobbs92 (Dec 15, 2008)

Thanks all. Three replies, three different ideas. I'll get back to the drawing board. Eheims seem a bit too expensive for now. Maybe I'll give them a second look, but I will certainly check out the AquaClears and Rena/HOB combo as well as a more powerful pair of Renas. Thanks again for your help.


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## moi_eater (Jul 11, 2004)

Eheims are worth the cost. I have 2 2217's and a 2080, which replaced Rena's. If you compare the gph and wattage with other canisters they are more efficient. IMHO it would be wiser to spend the money now for something that will last and use less electricity, saving you money in the long run.

The canister/HOB combo is also a possible choice that would be cheaper than 2 cans.


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## khaki (Jan 12, 2008)

try a C-360 or Fx5?


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## Dobbs92 (Dec 15, 2008)

Hello Moi_eater, First off, MERRY CHRISTMAS! Mom's at church so I'm excusing myself by watching the dogs. HA! You know, I looked into Eheims originally after reading a whole lot if reviews. But it seemed like priming could be a PIA and their filter medias replacements were sky high. I've been out of the deal for almost thirty years and want to keep maintenance fairly simple. Plus, I'm not very mechanically inclined. Can you shed some light here? I'm many months away but just trying to start off right. Just blue collar here, but a few hundred dollars one way or another at start up is no big deal. Renas look good but not just for the cost savings. It seems that they are genuinely reliable filters and simple to use. That part is important. Regarding Eheim, would two 2217s be sufficient to filrate a 75 gal and do you think I would need seperate powerheads to increase water current? Ditto for two Rena XP3s? Hey, I'm VERY rusty and looking for help where I can find it. Thanks again for answering my inquiry.


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## Baraccus (Nov 23, 2008)

Hey Dobbs...
I have a 90g w an xp3 and an Emperor 400 and a 60G with an xp2 and an emperor 400. I Recently bought a new tank (the 90g) and kinda re-outfitted everything. I never had a Canister before so when I bought the new tank I got one. Then I, almost immediately, got one for the 60g. I really like the xp's. I've only primed it once when I set it up. Now I'm not new to fish keeping but I'm new to cichlids and pretty new to the forum. I have learned more since joining this forum than in the past couple of years. What I've learned the most is about filtering. I'm getting kinda long winded here but here's my point. These canisters are so customizable. So as far as media replacement, almost non existent. Check this thread out. http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/view ... highlight=

It seems like a lot of guys here use a canister and a HOB filter. When I bought the Canister I was gonna get rid of the HOB until spending some time on this site. I would consider following that line of thinking. It'll save you some $$. The xp3 has one more tray than the xp2 so it's one more tray to play with. ..Hope this helped a little....BA


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## moi_eater (Jul 11, 2004)

Merry Christmas!

Canister/HOB combination can work just fine and save you some cash up front. The only thing is most HOB's and Rena XP series can be at least a little noisy, or get noisy after awhile (this has happened to me). So if you have your tank in a room that quiet is paramount, then go with Eheim canisters. If you don't mind some noise then a Rena XP3/HOB would be a fine choice.

There are the Ecco, Pro, Pro II, and Pro III models that have media baskets or the Classic models with no media baskets. I have no experience with the Ecco models, but I have a Pro III 2080 which a larger/upgraded version of the Pro II (2026/2028). The Classic series have been around a long time, and the two 2217's I have work very well. IMHO they are very easy to maintain because of being able to drain the canister before cleaning the media.

You have many possible choices but my recommendations are:

If you have your tank in a room where quiet is important: 2 Eheim canisters(2217 or 2028)

If you don't mind possible noise from the HOB, and you can replace the HOB when it gets noisy or replace it with a canister in the future: Eheim canister(2217 or 2028) and HOB of your choice

If you don't mind possible noise at all: Rena XP3 and HOB of your choice


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## Dobbs92 (Dec 15, 2008)

Hello baraccus and hello again moi-eater. You know, I can't believe this site. It is a virtual fountain of information and you folks are all so darned nice and helpful. Thank you both, I really mean that. I really thought that it would take me a long time to get comfortable with my limited African knowledge but I'm learning at breakneck speed. Baraccus, that forum on filter media is great! There are many possibilities and it made them a lot more understandable. I'll quit bugging foks for awhile (HAHAHA! - the fish questions come next!) but seriously, I have one more question, actually two. Noise is not a problem at all as the tank will be our computer room/book room. You both are recommending a canister/HOB combo. Will this work as well as two XP3s? If so, and both are easy to maintain., why spend unnecessary $$$$. I do have experience with HOBs and they are rather easy. Does anyone remember Dyno-flo? They were the filter of choice back then. Anyway, with either combo, two XP3s or an XP3 and Empreor400 do you think extra powerheads are needed for current and oxygenation? I'm not planning on stocking too heavily. Instead I plan to avoid the aggressive mbunas and am thinking of the few more peaceful ones, some mixed peacocks and perhaps a smaller hap or two. Actually, my wife is wild about Crytocara moorii (which I know can get large at which time I'll have to worry about it) so one is a possibility as is a D. compressiceps. My previous one didn't get too large and just minded his business and I'm crazy about this weird fish although I know that potential size could be a problem. Maybe if this all works out we'll just have to think about a larger hap tank down the road. Anyway, thanks so much to both of you for your time.


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## Toby_H (Apr 15, 2005)

Dobbs92 said:


> I can't believe this site. It is a virtual fountain of information and you folks are all so darned nice and helpful.


Just remember the help isn't free... you have to stick around and help others with what you've learned


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## Baraccus (Nov 23, 2008)

Dobbs...you are welcome buddy. ...Well since you're asking I'm sure 2 xp3's would work "better" but I'm sure an XP3 and a HOB will do just fine....Hmmmm oh yeah that's what I have on my 90G  ...Here is another thread that may answer your question on current and aeration.

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/view ... ght=nozzle

But the bottom line a Powerhead probably isn't needed. I'm sure some may argue otherwise. I just don't want to make my Tank a whirlpool ;-) ..I have my intakes both on one Side of the tank then I have the Spraybar on the other side along the width of my tank. So it forces water movement across my tank...hope that makes sense :zz: I have it angeled slightly upwards so that there is some movement at the top of the tank for some aeration...Now having said that..I have some powerheads in my box of goodies that are not being used and I have been considering putting one in and placing it towards the bottom to maybe sorta create flow at the bottom of the tank and flow poop and stuff up :-? Just a thought. I saw another thread too that the guys take some foam or filter padding and wrap it around the intake of the powerhead to pick up particles...pretty good Idea. ....Anyways there is a ton of info on the site....It's all the Ideas that guys have all the DIY stuff. Saves $$$ too. ....Latar...BA


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## Dobbs92 (Dec 15, 2008)

Yeah got it. I know exactly what you are saying about water movement. I had read some of the articels and posts regarding water movement and I was kind of planning on situating the filter intakes and outtakes pretty much as you did yours. It makes good sense. I'm figuring that "if" I need to add a powerhead it can be done later on. Hey, I'm just trying to know exactly what I'm doing before I go ahead and do it sometime later on this year. You know, measure twice, cut once. Thanks again!!


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## alicem (Jul 26, 2007)

Another thought: by using a canister, you can place the tank closer to the wall. 
If money isn't an issue, I would get two cans for extra filtration with flow over a wider area.

Aim the spray bars up to agitate the surface and I think you'd be fine.

When you do your partial water changes/sand vac, concentrate on the areas that have debris pooled.

If that gets too tedious, you can always add the power head(s).
hth


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## Dobbs92 (Dec 15, 2008)

Hello Alicem and thanks! Did you ever start a project and meticulously plan only to find a fatal flaw at the basic level? You found it. I won't get windy but an HOB would project the tank too far from the wall and I never thought of that. It's not a large room to begin with and we need room for our dogs to hang out with us while we're enjoying the tank so that's an issue and inches count but also walking in to the room, you have a few feet before you run into what will be the left side of the tank. I've measured and it should be fine without the extra projection of an HOB. But it would be a bit awkward should it project any further. A woman's common sense. perhaps? Thanks. Sorry that I didn't mention that sooner.


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## alicem (Jul 26, 2007)

That was an issue for me while planning the set up for my 46bow, so I thought I'd mention it, in case it pertained to your situation. 
Although it would have been "ok" to use a hob, I preferred the tank to be closer to the wall, saving floor space for the humans in my house. :wink:

If you're interested, I'm using 1 Rena XP3, with the spray bar aimed up, on my 46G bow.
It does a nice job.
If I had your longer/bigger tank, I'd definately use two of them, as I mentioned earlier.
:thumb:


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## Dobbs92 (Dec 15, 2008)

Got it! My original thought was 2 XP3s and that's how I'll go. Thanks!


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## alicem (Jul 26, 2007)

Keep an open mind and don't stay "set in stone" if you need to rethink things, 
especially since you are in the planning stages and have time.

As you have found out, things are constantly changing in the "fish business" 
with new products and new ways of thinking about things.


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