# Cyprichromis wasting...or not?



## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

I have a group of (11) Cyp. Lep. Kerenge Islands. They were all purchased as juveniles and were the same size at acquisition. I figure that they are 6-8 months old although I can't confirm this. The alpha male has just begun to color up within the last month. He is approximately 2" in length, the others vary in size between 1.5" and 1.75". They have been hungry eaters.

I have one cyp that is showing the physical signs of wasting; little to no growth within the last month, he is very skinny and 1/2" shorter than the others, and has a sunken stomach. He is also slightly darker as if he was stressed, although I don't see any environmental reasons why he would be. He swims and plays with the rest of the group and is not at all exiled or hanging out in a corner. He is not breathing faster than normal. I watch him eat and he does not spit at all like wasting cyps do. He readily takes to all 5 varieties of food I feed, including live insects.

He is active, not bullied by the other fish, does not have torn fins or any signs of disease.

The tank that they are currently housed is a 55. It is overloaded, but I perform 50% water changes 2-3 times per week. The water is treated with Prime, Rift Lake buffer mix is added, and the water is allowed to bubble and heat to tank temperature for at least 24 hours in a custom water change setup I have designed. Filtration is performed with (2) Eheim 2217s. Temperature is rock steady at 76*. Water parameters are perfect; 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and nitrates are below 5ppm at all times due to the water change schedule. I feed twice daily; the staples being HBH Spirulina 8 veggie flake in the AM and NLS Grow in the evening. Shrimp & Pea mix and Cyclopeze are fed as treats, as well as flies and mosquitoes I am able to catch. I fast the fish for 1 day every 2 weeks.

Whats going on with this little guy?


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

It sounds like you're doing everything right.

The only thing I would be concerned about is the bugs you are catching and feeding to them...You don't know what they've been exposed to and I really think it may be asking for trouble.

Any chance of a pic of the one in question?

It may just be a runt, but it could be parasitic.

Any white stringy feces in the tank?


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## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

I did my best to get some pictures of the little guy. He is like a torpedo and doesn't like my camera one bit. Sorry for the poor quality, but I had to increase by shutter speed just to get a still shot of him.

He is the one in the middle, farthest to the right. Note the stomach of the other cyp in the picture.










Another picture, this time in the middle on the left. You can see his sunken stomach, as opposed to the other cyp in the pic that has a slightly bulging stomach.


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## Seanboy (Feb 25, 2009)

I've had two cyps that looked like that. They behaved normally but eventually died.


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

I see what you mean...

Here's what I would do...

I'd either pick up some metronidazole and sprinkle it on the food that I have (along with a bit of tank water) or I'd pick up some Jungle antiparasitic pellets and feed that. (Don't give them anything else, otherwise they'll hold out for it and NOT eat the medicated food.)

It could be internal parasites, but with that many fish you would think it would be visible on more than one.

It could be that this is just a runt that isn't thriving.

It could also be 'wasting' or 'skinny' disease, both of which would indicate treating the entire tank. It could be fish tuberculosis...

Anytime you can get them to ingest meds, that's the way to go.

Good luck!


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## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

Thanks for the input.

I treated about two servings of food with Metro. I'm not surprised that the cyps ate it as if they had never eaten (including skinny)...they seem to try and eat everything. I made sure that he got some of the treated food.

The only fish that spit the food was my N. sexfasciatus. He kinda looked at me like "really? where is the good stuff?". That is fine though...he is a glutton.

Can you outline how you soak the food, how much you use, how long you let it soak, etc? I haven't had to use meds since the 90's as I keep up on my tanks and they just haven't fallen victim to illness very often. When they have, heat and salt has always done the trick.

-Thanks


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## lloyd (Aug 24, 2005)

vaypourus said:


> I treated about two servings of food with Metro...Can you outline how you soak the food, how much you use, how long you let it soak, etc? I haven't had to use meds since the 90's as I keep up on my tanks and they just haven't fallen victim to illness very often. When they have, heat and salt has always done the trick.


 regarding metronidazole, or any other ingested antibacterial medication, you will need to continue treating your aquarium for 10(min)-20(pref) days. there is a need to eradicate the 'organism' (term is used loosely, re: lacking identification) entirely, or you risk a recurring breakout. IME, results can be better/best, if treatment also includes the initial culling of those individuals showing worst condition.
increasing temperature can work for, or against, an undiagnosed ailment. so, it is best to leave as-is when conclusive identification is lack. salt is still used for external parasitic infections, but has no effectiveness against parasites protected within a body. HTH, and good luck with cyps.


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## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

Well. This has become more serious.

I came home tonight and discovered that skinny only has the upper half of his tail. I can't tell for sure if it is fin rot or from the N. sexfasciatus. The sexfasciatus looks guilty, but he isn't talking.

As much as it breaks my heart, I have decided that it is time to cull him to prevent disease (if that was the case) from spreading to the other fish. I'm not convinced that he would recover anyways. 

I tested water parameters and everything is textbook perfect. Nitrates are so low my API kit doesn't measure them.

I did an immediate water change anyways, even though I did one two days ago. I figure it can't hurt.

I am going to continue a regiment of food treated with Metro for the next 2-3 weeks as a precautionary measure. All other fish look healthy but I don't want to lose another.


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## BRANT13 (Feb 18, 2009)

Sounds maybe like cichlidaholic had stated and isnt growing as fast as the others.....it may not be competing as well as the other for food and getting picked on and simply cant thrive....i have three male exasperatus in my tank and i noticed the same thing happening to the least dominate of the bunch i moved him to a quarantine tank and beefed him and reintroduced hom with no ill effects?......this is just a guess :-?


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## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

It is really hard to say what was wrong. When I netted him, he was hardly swimming. I didn't even have to fight to catch him. I've seen few fish that at this stage that would make it more than 24 hours.

Due to the quick onset and some additional reading I have done, I'm leaning towards some kind of parasite.


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

I would continue to feed the other fish medicated antiparasitic food. :thumb:


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## vaypourus (May 20, 2008)

cichlidaholic said:


> I would continue to feed the other fish medicated antiparasitic food. :thumb:


Yup...that's what I'm doing. They all seem to take to the HBH Spirulina flake and the NLS Grow soaked in Metro just fine. I plan on treating for another couple of weeks.


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## noddy (Nov 20, 2006)

I think you were right to cull the fish, I doubt it would have lasted very long. I doubt that the food had anything to do with it's condition but, i would probably switch from the veggie flakes over to the HBH cichlid attack or frenzy (I forget what they call it these days) unless you have trophs in there with them. Also, I know some people starve their fish (trophs usually) for one day a week but they don't do it themselves in the lake. Anyways, I believe you have done all the right things and are probably over your problem. :thumb:


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