# ut oh..fish mouth's turning white?



## aandfsoccr04 (Sep 2, 2009)

So I have 41 fish that are supposed to arrive tomorrow but have got some weird stuff going on in my tank...









This rusty's tail is really white and I don't really know why...








this one's mouth is white








another picture








looks like it is rubbing off on my cobalts mouth as well..

what do you gusy think? ohhh what to do, what to do?


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## nick a (Apr 9, 2004)

Not really easy to see the pics that clearly--but it possibly looks like the results of lip-locking--which means that dominance/submission (the pecking order) is just getting sorted out in your tank.


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## PNESTOROWICZ (Sep 9, 2009)

What I think you might have a case of Columnaris. Also known a Mouth Fungus, Columnaris is actually a bacterial infection, not a true fungus.
Typically you'll see white, or semi-transparent strings of what look like fuzz in the mouth/gill area. Sometimes there will be white, clear, or reddish/pink sores on the body. Sometimes deep ulcers and inflammed patches develop on the body and fins of the fish.
Most times fish will be lethargic and won't eat. Sometime they will also be breathing heavily and fast.

In my experience, I've only been able to cure a columnaris infection with salt baths and increased temperature and salinity in the hospital tank. Of course, you can try any aquarium anti-biotic that is for gram positive bacteria, but I would also increase salinity and do salt baths.

But maybe some of the more experienced cichlids keepers will give you other answers.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I was going to say what nick a said. Is it raised and fuzzy or just like the color has been rubbed off his lips? Lots of my fish swim around with white lips due to lip locking, LOL!


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## aandfsoccr04 (Sep 2, 2009)

so you guys think its just fish picking at each other over dominance? none of the yellow labs have it which is ironic. The one venustus in my tank doesnt have it either. I am really hoping that it isnt some disease that is spreading throughout my tank and going to kill all the new fish I put in tomorrow...I'm gonna do a 25% water change tonight.


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## bigdaddy67 (Sep 5, 2009)

I agree on the columnaris diagnosis. However, columnaris is a gram NEGATIVE bacteria and needs to be treated as such. I have had the best luck with kanaflex or maracyn 2.

Treatment needs to start right away as columnaris is a systemic infection and causes internal damage before the external signs are visible.

good luck,
--Dave


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## Kanorin (Apr 8, 2008)

I would probably catch that fish and put him/her in a hospital tank.

That white spot on it's side near the tail - does that look like a fighting wound or a fungal/bacterial growth?

I'd be kinda worried if this were my tank and wouldn't add any new fish until I was sure that problems with either: a) aggression or b) illness - are under control.


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## Cento (Mar 30, 2005)

As mentioned, its hard to see clearly in the pics if it looks like fungus or fight related.

I also started to have that in my tank after my juv' saulosi matured and coloured up.. The lips on the males started to look like the colour had been rubbed off, like a cheap toy..

At first I thought it was from scraping algae from rocks, then i realized that it wouldn't be just the males... Then I saw them doing the "Startrek: Spock vs Kirk" dance for an hour (minus the dramatic music).

Needless to say, if it is indeed this, then not to worry.


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## aandfsoccr04 (Sep 2, 2009)

fish are coming tomorrow regardless of what happens. they are already in the mail.


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## aandfsoccr04 (Sep 2, 2009)

41 fish here with no DOA. I don't have a hospital tank set up because I just got this tank up and running within a month or so and didn't expect to need a hospital tank this fast. I am hoping that it is the dominance issue and not the bacterial issue.


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## sasquatch-exists (Feb 25, 2009)

Whats the fish that has a camo pattern. *** been trying to find the name everywhere. is it a HAP?


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## natalie559 (Dec 6, 2007)

I would suspect illness as well and would seriously look into symptoms and treatment or you risk losing your entire investment of fish! One or two mouths and I would think lip locking, but more fish than that and the tail too just doesn't sit right with me.

A quarantine tank is always a good idea and always cheaper than losing fish and at some point we will all need one- or two even


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## aandfsoccr04 (Sep 2, 2009)

yeah sometiems keeping fish is just a lil more stressful then I want it to be. I don't really know what to do in this situation. ugh.
Yeah it is the one hap in my tank. It's a venustus and I just really like him and want to wait and see what happens before I remove him for no reason....


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

You could grab a 20G tank for $30 and protect your investment of 41 fish. Net out the "infected" ones and observe or treat. Have you posted in the illness section? Once you net one of them you should be able to get a good, clear, close up picture (use a small container) and get a solid diagnosis.

Do you have lace rock? They also get the white lips from browsing algae from the rocks. I'd say most of my demasoni have the white lips to some extent. But it doesn't look like a growth at all...just lips missing a layer of pigment, LOL. And no white elsewhere on their bodies.


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## aandfsoccr04 (Sep 2, 2009)

I have two very large white rocks. I'm not sure what kind they are. Only that one fish has the white on its tail and it might of been like that when I got him and I just didn't notice perhaps. I just don't have a filter or anything for a hospital tank but will look into getting that set up.


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## BOOP (Feb 22, 2009)

Man dude i just had that happen and lost two adult and 1 juvi lab, 1 ahli, 1 black belt & 1 johanni. Now they were not in the same tank at the same time but in the same tank at some time or another. They all died within a week. Lathargic, wouldn't eat & heavy breathing as mentioned before. At end i had to disinfect the tank and recycle. Then i had to buy some crash test dummies to test the tank out. Two weeks in now and everything is fine now. The funny thing is this tank was my isolation tank/hospital tank and it killed everyone.


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## aandfsoccr04 (Sep 2, 2009)

yiiiiikesss. That's not what I want to hear at all. Well i'm getting my 30 gallon from my parents house on tuesday so will set that up and hopefully get all the fish out that have it...ughh


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## siklidkid (Aug 12, 2009)

I have the same problem. Treated with maracyn 2 (gram neg med), since it seemed to be Columnaris (gram neg bacteria). Nothing happened. They have had this mouth issue for a month now and nothing has changed. I have never seen these fish lip locked either. It isn't getting better or worse. It's on half of my fish to varying degrees. rustys, polits, mara lions, and NOTHING on the msobos.

I went to my LFS and noticed the rustys in one of his tanks had this mouth issue. He said it was not a disease. possible lip locking. He said sometimes it just "happens" to fish. whatever that means. He said just double dose Stress Coat and it should heal. :roll:

I PM'd you. I am concerned it might be coming from an online dealer.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Guys, they can also get the white lips from scraping algae off the rocks. If you have rough'ish rocks like sandstone or lace rock...and there is absolutely nothing growing on their lips...and the fish are eating, pooping, breathing and acting normally...

Maybe that's all it is?

I've never had Columnaris, so maybe a post to the illness section can help rule it out, but FWIW.


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## siklidkid (Aug 12, 2009)

DJ, In my case, I think that is what it is.

LOTS of grazing going on, and I have A LOT of lacerock. Simply rubbing the pigment off on the lacerock while grazing. That has to be it. All other behaviors are normal.

To the OP, not trying to hijack this. I was just as concerned as you and I saw you posted the same issue that my fish have. I think we are good, except I would be concerned with that white patch on that Rusty.


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## aandfsoccr04 (Sep 2, 2009)

All of my fish are still eating and all that. They all seem to be normal and I have two great big white rocks in my tank so that is probably it...



















Just showing you the rocks. The fish is completely different now.


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