# fish tank smells



## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

I am not sure if this is the right section, but recently I would say within past 4 months or so maybe 3 I switched over to a African chiclid tank. I must say out of all the fish I have had they are the more colorful, and active fish I have ever had.

to start of im getting a smell I have never had before. it has a smell kind of like it smells like a dirty diaper. I don't understand what it is or why. I change my carbon every month. do my water changes every 2 weeks. I did a water test every thing was good. only thing that was a little high was ammonia, but from my experiences its normal to have ammonia slightly elevated. its on the first color of the api chat I think .025. when the ammonia spikes I know the smell this is not that smell. anyone have any idea what it could be? not sure if its just what a chiclid tank smells like or what. appreciate any help.


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## sumthinfishy (Jan 26, 2013)

is there a dead one in there somewhere? or remnants of a dead one? that would do it. tank should not smell like that


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## Brentt700 (Mar 14, 2013)

I agree. Have you done a head count to see if all the fish are accounted for? A dead decaying fish will make a nasty smell such as what you are describing.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

yea did a head count. I did feed them some feeder fish though. I hear ups and downs with them that they really are not good for them, but I will admit it. I put them in there to only for the purpose to watch them get eating up. made the mistake of putting them in after I was told a lfs owner mis guided me. my fish were not large enough to eat them yet, but one guy said they were big enough. the tiny tiny ones they eventually bit in half but as they were dying I was taking them out, and trying to search for spines to take out as well. i have done several water changes. i tried to vacuum back cant get to fussy i don't want to break the glass, and have not had the time to do big cleaning day, taken out all the rocks. i even done a 75% water change.

all my fish are accounted for. 8. i have them in a 36 gallon tank. now i know that's way to small but the fish are still tiny, and its only for a short period. i really wanted chiclids, and said to myself i don't have the time right now to upgrade my tank. ill just get them small and by the time they are bigger ill hopefully have the time to get a new tank. not sure what size. i would like to do a 75 gallon but may have to settle with a 55-65. unless i can find a custom made not too expensive that's not as wide as 48" i only have 44" to work with. just figures i would list the tanks specs as well in case that was important.

i hope i can avoid a big cleaning as last time i did that i started that b.s. new tank cycle all over again.


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## SOU812 (Jun 11, 2013)

stick to a complete cichlid food,NLS is an example of a well balanced food,1 mm cichlid formula is all you really need
knowing the type of filtration you have and how/often you clean it, will help
water change schedule/how much and how often?
vacuuming the substrate schedule?
sometimes food gets stuck underneath the lip of the top brace as well


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## nodima (Oct 3, 2002)

bigt0689 said:


> I am not sure if this is the right section, but recently I would say within past 4 months or so maybe 3 I switched over to a African chiclid tank. I must say out of all the fish I have had they are the more colorful, and active fish I have ever had.
> 
> to start of im getting a smell I have never had before. it has a smell kind of like it smells like a dirty diaper. I don't understand what it is or why. I change my carbon every month. do my water changes every 2 weeks. I did a water test every thing was good. only thing that was a little high was ammonia, but from my experiences its normal to have ammonia slightly elevated. its on the first color of the api chat I think .025. when the ammonia spikes I know the smell this is not that smell. anyone have any idea what it could be? not sure if its just what a chiclid tank smells like or what. appreciate any help.


Having ammonia levels is *not* normal, if the tank is cycled properly, they should be at zero. A properly cycled and maintained tank should not have any objectionable smell to it. Two things to check are extra food rotting in the space between top glass and tank frame, and for a dead fish, either of these could be the source.

Describe your water changes - how much do you change every two weeks, and what do you use for a water conditioner? What are you using for filters?


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## nodima (Oct 3, 2002)

bigt0689 said:


> i hope i can avoid a big cleaning as last time i did that i started that b.s. new tank cycle all over again.


This could be the source of your issue - by the tone of this statement, I'm concerned that you don't fully understand the role a cycled tank plays in long term fish health. I know that years ago I did not. How recent was this "big cleaning", and how soon afterwards did you add your cichlids?

You should not need to sanitize your entire tank, but also I'd recommend doing searches on tank maintenance, vaccuuming, and the nitrate cycle. There are articles in the library which should also help you out.

Hang in there, this is all part of the learning curve, and there are lots of people here who are able to answer questions and provide experience.

cheers


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## BillD (May 17, 2005)

The short answer here is that you need to change more water more often if the tank smells. every tank is unique, and to arbitrarily say you should change X amount of water may not be good advice. However, you can't really change too much water too often, so it is better to do more and stay ahead of any problems.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Another thing to check for is any fish food that may be trapped on or around the aquarium trim or lid.


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## austings (May 12, 2012)

Deeda said:


> Another thing to check for is any fish food that may be trapped on or around the aquarium trim or lid.


+1 
I had this same problem, (I started a thread awhile back, and i believe it was Deeda that clued me into this.) I had a bunch of food that had stuck to the top lip, I ran my finger under it, and couldn't believe how much crud was there.Now, i clean that once a week. Haven't had the smell in a long time.

However, I think we need to get your tank parameters under control. That's more important that a bad smell. If you're using test strips, I would highly recommend getting a liquid test kit. They are $23 right now at the big chain pet store.


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## k7gixxerguy (Jan 12, 2012)

And I would stop with the live food for sure. Feeder fish can introduce disease to your tank and depending on your stocklist may be bad for your fish in general.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

I will check the lid for food. the big cleaning that started the mess was back in march or early april. I have always had a slightly elevated ammonia level. the only time I had it to 0 was when api was in the filter. forget the name thin ammoizorb or something like that. a sandy bag. I checked again no dead fish. I used to do a water change once a week but switched it to every 2. I don't know the exact amount I would say around 50-60% I like to get the tank to about half full. I don't vacuum gravel anymore. I was its not always a good thing to do. I used to vacuum once a week when I did a water change. I used to get it all real good. now when I just touch rockers nothing but particles all over the place. I used to be real fussy until I made a mistake. about 20-30% water change weekly every 2 weeks 60% once every 30 days 75% vacuum once a week clean glass every day from the algea. gave up on that I cant get rid of it. I don't have plecos anymore, and my bottom feeders died off. chiclids killed the last 3 cory cats I had when I went on a mini vacation. I only fed them feeder fish the one time. I feed them omega one super color chiclid pellots. they tear them up. I don't really care for omega brand I prefer tetra, but my dad had it at his office his saltwatr fish didn't like them so he gave them to me. there small granules. not the big fat things you feed fish in your pond. I feed them once a day.


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

IMO if you have an ammonia reading either your tank is'nt cycled or you have chloramine in your tap water and are getting a false positive on your tests. You should also not have an odor if you are using carbon in your filter. Tank water should not smell badly. As others have stated you need to do more often and larger water changes. An indication of this is the abuntance of algae in your tank. I'm assuming there is a high level of nitrates and phosphates causing this.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

I don't do phos test nitrate was 0. Ill go back to large water changes weekly. I never had a problem with the tank smelling so bad. until i lost all my fish when i finally decided to take out the plant gravel. forget who made it but was a nutrient black rock gravel. put old gravel back in did big cleaning and that's what cycled everything im assuming and killed all my fish i had for years. that was about 3-4 months ago then decided to get chiclids. i never had that smelly water before.

maybe the large water changes weekly will help again.

as for the algae, i used to have it under control, and very minimum for the longest time. i only leav emy lights on for 8 hours at a time. i switched the bulbs to chiclid bulbs. catalina made them. i used to have a planted tank with high tech bulbs t5 ho co2 lights on 12+ hours a day no algea. i don't mess with plants anymore. i don't know if its coincidental or of a planted tank really prevents algae or helps fight it. it just grows all over the glass now. ill clean it and 2 days later it comes right back. just recently i tried only leaving light on for 4 hours a day and that didn't do a thing. if i add more rocks within a day or two algae starts growing on them.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

ohh yea i also have well water not city water. do the api give false readings sometimes?


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

Could be the well water. Sulpher smell? Some well water in farming areas is high in nitrates due to run off from fertilized fields. I also have well water but have no problems. If your nitrates read 0 you definitly have problems. Tank probably not cycled.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

well that sucks ill do another reading to see what it says. tank better be cycled water is crystal clear. should I take all rocks out an djust vacuum gravel to get all that **** out? when I move gravel clouds of particles come out. if I turn off filter the sam estuff also comes flying out of filter if I turn it back on and I clean that too every time I put new carbon in once a month.


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

So....only one filter? If you "clean it out" once a month you may be killing all your bb.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

I started cleaning it because it will stop working. and gets nasty with them tiny particles all over the place. every so often usually once a month I have to take it apart and remove the motor take that apart and clean it real good so it will turn on and start pumping water again other wise it just makes a tiny noise and wont run. after I clean that part it works great again, and does not make a loud dramatic buzzing noise. yea I only run 1 fiter a 70 gallon aqua clear.

when I add carbon I put new carbon in, rinse it off first real good, wash the white rocks, and rinse the sponge of all the slimy garbage and put it all back together. wish I could figure out what all this particle stuff is though never had it before. water used to be crystal clear when changing filter no mess when doing that or scraping the gravel no clouds of stuff coming up.


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## b3w4r3 (Dec 14, 2012)

Are you using a vacuum to clean the gravel at each water change? You need to clean the gravel until all that waste is gone...


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

heres the test results:

nitrate 0 ppm
ammonia very hard to tell but looks like it could be .025 ppm.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

bw my hose that I use is a vacuum. I used to do that, have not done it lately. if we get a nice day tomorrow ill just take all the rocks out maybe get rid of same and see if I can find more slate. been using rocks and they don't stack well. went to local fish store and they are beating you up up $5 a pound. still trying to find slate like rock that's paper weight. I will start to vacuum again on water changes. I was told they can do harm and kill your bb.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

but now that I think about it do they make just vacuums so I don't have to worry about draining all the water so I can stir it up vaccum it all then do water change to get that **** out? the one I have no vacuums but changes water as well


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## Pseudeotropheus BB (Jan 24, 2013)

There are potentially several issues here but first what type and how large are the African Cichlids you are housing?


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

i thought African was the type. I really don't know. one is orange, 1 I know is an electric yellow, one is light blue with black stripes going down with yellow tip rins, one is blue with lighter blue stripes I think he is a demosani, I got one white with black and yellow strips going from front to back 1 all yellow, and a all orange with black sports sort of like a tiger. and last one is blue as well with I think black stripes going down. I can take a picture if that's easier.

I have 2 that maybe 3" and rest look under 3".


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## Pseudeotropheus BB (Jan 24, 2013)

It sounds like they are all Mbuna however a pic would probably be helpful for reasons which will be explained by either myself or others I'm sure.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)




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## b3w4r3 (Dec 14, 2012)

bigt0689 said:


> heres the test results:
> 
> nitrate 0 ppm
> ammonia very hard to tell but looks like it could be .025 ppm.


Sounds like this tank has been set up for at least a few months now. That being the case I don't think your nitrates are 0ppm. Which tests are you using? The nitrate liquid reagent tests require following the directions very closely to get the proper reading, which means shaking one of the bottles very well, then shaking the mixture for the required time. Failure to do this will give an improper reading and influence further tests making the tests useless.

With gravel substrate it's very important to always vacuum it thoroughly. You say just moving a little of it makes a cloud, and that's a big problem as that is just uneaten food and poop rotting away. I would vacuum it as much as you can ASAP changing at least 1/2 of the tank water. If it's still dirty you can repeat the following days until you get it pretty clean. After that I would recommend doing water changes/vacuuming once a week at least 50% of the tank water.

You have some nice looking fish there. Perhaps you might consider changing to sand as it's easier to keep clean compared to gravel, and the fish will like it more. I don't think you have elevated ammonia but the tank should always be 0ppm ammonia. The api ammonia test can be difficult to read on the low end, I know it is for me. I will do a test of tap water which I know has no ammonia, then compare it to the tank when I am unsure of a reading.

The tank isn't very well stocked for it's size, but you know that. Is this supposed to be an all male setup?


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

b3w4r3 said:


> bigt0689 said:
> 
> 
> > heres the test results:
> ...


the test is api liquid test kit.

I honestly don't know the difference between males and females. would like to have some females. I guess ill just have to find a way how to vaccum the tank real good without draining it completely. the one I got vacuums and changes water at same time.


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## Tony La Morte (Nov 30, 2011)

Hi big, 
If I understand correctly, less than 48" Length your options, other than Custom, will be limiting.
The Bumble Bee, (Pseudotropheus Crabro) are border line in a 48" tank. 
I currently have one in a 4' tanks but he has an exceptional personality.
More info will yeild more help.
Regards,
Tony


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

Tony La Morte said:


> Hi big,
> If I understand correctly, less than 48" Length your options, other than Custom, will be limiting.
> The Bumble Bee, (Pseudotropheus Crabro) are border line in a 48" tank.
> I currently have one in a 4' tanks but he has an exceptional personality.
> ...


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## Bowfront (Jun 3, 2013)

There are two problems I see from your posts. One is the use of well water that probably has a smell to it right out of the tap. Two is your rock substrate which is holding ****. Ditch the rock and get pool filter sand. Then ditch the large rocks and get large limestone rocks to buffer the PH. You can get the rocks at a garden supply center or landscaping place real cheap, by the pound. Clean them well before you use them. I would also recommend getting a catfish like a synodontis large enough to survive cichlid aggression because it will help you out with uneaten pieces of food in the tank.

.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

were am i supposed to get sand from? i don't really like the idea of using sand. never had a problem using substrate before except for all this **** coming up. are limestone rocks heavy? i don't know what they look like, the garden place i was at today had huge pieces of stuff very thick. guy was only going to charge me 18 cents a pound but said he would only charge me for 10 pounds even if i get 15 pounds. not sure how much i would even use in my tank. i thought slate was the best because it was so light.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

but about the fish though how do you know if a chiclid is a male or female?


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

looked into them cats im not paying any were near $100 for 1 fish. so I guess ill have to settle for one of the simple color ones. the real colorful ones were very expensive. by any chance do you have another catfish just so I have 1 for a backup incase the lfs does not have it. if its not a rare fish and they don't stock it because I buy from them a lot he said he will get fish from his supplier if its worth it for him but if its rare or hard to move he wont get them. may be able to flash him a $20 up front and he may get me one not sure.


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## b3w4r3 (Dec 14, 2012)

The rocks you have are fine, don't know where the limerock suggestion came from unless you are having issues with ph.

If you don't want to use sand that's fine. Just suggesting it because it's easier to keep clean and mbuna like to dig as part of their natural behavior. You can get pool filter sand at any pool supply store, most times for less than $10 for a 50lb bag. You only need an inch to inch and a half in the tank, but be sure to place your rocks first. You want rocks sitting on the glass not the sand. Mbuna will dig and can topple stacked rocks if they are on the sand. If staying with the gravel you could get one of those EHEIM Quick Vac Pro Automatic Gravel Cleaner which is being discussed in this thread viewtopic.php?f=6&t=257953 However I think normal vacuuming would be fine. 50% of your water would allow you to change 15 gallons or so which should be more than enough to do a good gravel cleaning. If you haven't done it yet what are you waiting for?

As far as getting a cat, I would not add any fish to this tank until you get this smell problem under control. Still you really need a bigger tank with the fish you have but that's really another issue all together. I suggest starting another thread in the malawi section to address your stocking issues and discuss options.

About the api nitrate test, are you shaking the bottle 2 solution for at least 30 seconds? That bottle contains some solids which collect at the bottom and unless it is shaken very well the solution will not mix properly giving an incorrect reading. Then you need to shake the test tube once mixed for a full minute to get the proper reading, and wait 5 minutes for the results.

Identifying males can be difficult. Only way to be sure is to vent them by removing them from the tank and looking at the holes near their tail. There is an article about it in the library section on this forum.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

okay, no I forgot all about shaking bottle number to I just added bottle one put lid on shake then add bottle 2 and shake again. ill re do it tomorrow. maybe ill look into sand. how would I clean sand though from all the fish waist and all? ill change the water tomorrow was going to do it today but got too late in day, I didn't feel like taken everything apart by the time I got back from garden center looking for rocks. the rocks I have now don't bother me its just they wobble if I stack 2 on top of each other. I don't want to make the little cave part to short they can't fit thru. was waiting on changing water to see if I got new rocks today so at least I can kill 2 birds in 1 stone but I will get right on water change tomorrow. I just am worried about changing gravel again, because that's what started the new tank syndrome all over again, when I took out the black plant gravel and put the old gravel back in, and yes I did wash it off. I don't want that bs starting back up again. I hate cloudy water and expensive fish dying. not as bad as previous fish that I paid $20+ for but still I don't like losing fish.


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## Pseudeotropheus BB (Jan 24, 2013)

The best but not the only way to determine male/female in Mbuna are the eggspots located on the anal fine. The male has more predominant spots where as the female has less. As I said this is the best way but not the only way to make that determination. Best thing to do is a little research.

I too would switch the gravel however I would go with Caribsea African Cichlid Mix or equivalent but I also realize that would be a substantial task at this point.

As for a O Nitrate reading that is pretty much impossible when dealing with Africans. They produce a heavy bio-load, I would definitely recheck going by the directions. The way I perform the test is Shaking bottle once slightly add 10 drops, shake bottle two for 30 seconds and at the same time shake your test tube a couple of times, add 10 drop of bottle two to the test tube and shake for 1 min, wait 5 min. to achieve reading.

As for the food Mbuna more than any other freshwater fish have special needs. NEVER feed Mbuna animal protein which is not easily digestible. There are specialty formulas made for Mbuna which are highly palatable and easily digestible. I am in no ways promoting any brand of food however I am currently feeding my Mbuna both Kens Premium Vegetable Flake and LFS Spectrum Cichlid Formula. Both are exceptional food.


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## Pseudeotropheus BB (Jan 24, 2013)

Pseudeotropheus BB said:


> The best but not the only way to determine male/female in Mbuna are the eggspots located on the anal fine. The male has more predominant spots where as the female has less. As I said this is the best way but not the only way to make that determination. Best thing to do is a little research.
> 
> I too would switch the gravel however I would go with Caribsea African Cichlid Mix or equivalent but I also realize that would be a substantial task at this point.
> 
> ...


Please dont take offense to this as I am only providing some constructive criticism. I urge you to visit the library on the forum and educate yourself about the do's and dont's of this species. I am not sure how long you have been in the hobby but this fish definitely takes special needs and requirements.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

okay I wll do another test probably tomorrow or later on tonight. I will also check into the threads when I get a minute. I have had chiclids for about 2 months I would say.

I just cleaned the gravel real good. got the bulk of it to were theres no big dark clouds coming up anymore just a few light here and there. changed the water as well.

would be nice to try to raise them and see if I can get some babies. when I first got back into having a fish tank I used to have the mollys and such and were breeding them, but became a pain in the butt always getting sick, and dying. 8 outta 10 times they had babies they died. be pretty cool to see if I can do it with chiclids. sure its a whole different game though.

If I don't have to change the gravel I don't want to. I just don't want that mess to start back up again putting new gravel in. and all that work of taken everything out and the cleaning the new stuff and putting that in the tank takes time.


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## smitty814 (Sep 27, 2012)

No offense but it reads like you have never kept fish before. The impression I've gotten is that you don't want to do the required work to keep fish. I've read allot about doing things tomorrow or you really can't be bothered or don't want to.
You've received some good advice here. Fish tanks that are properly maintained don't smell.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

I have had my tank running for about 6 years or so. I never said I don't want to maintain it. I jus said I don't want to switch to sand if I don't have to. I said before I don't want to go through getting sand put it and new tank syndrome again, because last time I changed gravel it started it up again. when I meant ill do test tomorrow I meant it as in I was not sure if since I just changed everything around if I should wait, and let my tank settle down to re do the test.

i used to be real fussy with the tank it was just too much work. that was also when it was planted. now water changes are not that big of a deal takes 10-15 minutes just got out of the habit of doing them once a week.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

I know I just changed the water too but smell is gone. hopefully It was all that **** in bottom of rocks. I also cleaned my glass lid real good too incase any of that algae or what ever was on it was what what smelling.

about the sand though, what does it actually do? anything beneficial? I remember some one saying you wont have to vacuum anymore or sounded like it. why is that? also if I ever decided to put a few plants in is sand goo dfor them or no? do chiclids eat them?

last but not least the whole reason I didn't really want to change gravel. is their a way to add the sand without losing b.b. an dstarting new tank syndrome all over again? also can I buy it in less then 50 pounds bags? if I can only get a small amount prefer what ever I would use.


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## nodima (Oct 3, 2002)

bigt0689 said:


> I know I just changed the water too but smell is gone. hopefully It was all that #%$& in bottom of rocks. I also cleaned my glass lid real good too incase any of that algae or what ever was on it was what what smelling.
> 
> about the sand though, what does it actually do? anything beneficial? I remember some one saying you wont have to vacuum anymore or sounded like it. why is that? also if I ever decided to put a few plants in is sand goo dfor them or no? do chiclids eat them?
> 
> last but not least the whole reason I didn't really want to change gravel. is their a way to add the sand without losing b.b. an dstarting new tank syndrome all over again? also can I buy it in less then 50 pounds bags? if I can only get a small amount prefer what ever I would use.


Good to hear smell is gone/reduced.

Sand packs more densely than gravel, and does not allow waste or uneaten food to get too deep into it like gravel does. It reduces maintenance but does not eliminate it - most waste will stay on top where it is easily vacuumed up.

The pool filter sand is cheap. Like $10 bucks for 50lbs. Or you can buy "aquarium" sand by the pound at an aquarium store for 25 or 30 bucks for 10 pounds or so...

Do some searches on this site to learn about switching to sand from gravel, and you'll see it is very easy to do and done properly does not impact the BB in the filters. No matter what sand you choose, be sure you rinse it a lot.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

okay will do im going to read up some more right now before I head out to fish store to get a automatic feeder. im sick and tired of feeding blocks gave them to chiclids twice and don't think they touched them until they were getting starving. going to check into the catfish as well to help with bottom. if everything sounds good with the sound, and is easy I will most likely get that next week when I get back in town. I want to be home while I change it to sand so I can keep a eye on everything make sure nothing gets out of whack.


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## nodima (Oct 3, 2002)

you know --- I'm beginning to get the sense that perhaps another hobby is in order here...


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

whys that? I had fish for years with no problems.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

You may have kept fish for years without any problems but cichlids are different than smaller tropical fish.

You have a 36 bow-front tank with 8 cichlids that are at least 3" long with one AC70 filter. Your tank is undersized for the fish you have and is under-filtered. You use (or have used) feeder blocks to feed your fish which can foul the water. You don't seem to have the time to properly correct the issues you are having with this tank because you seem to be looking for a quick fix. I'm sorry that my post seems rather harsh but you don't seem to be making any headway in correcting the existing problems with your tank.

Have you been able to get current water test results for Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate?


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

yes there all good. thought I posted that already. I was told my tank would work just for now to hold me over until I find a new tank. I don't plan on having this tank for much longer, im hoping within a month ill get one. I got the money and the time, just cant find the used tanks that are freshwater. every one on craigslist locally is reef tanks or salt. at the time I got my tank though the guy said that would do rule of thumb was to go 3x the tank size. or something like that. so would adding a new filter help? another 70 or maybe add a 110 then when that one gets established replace the other with a 110 so at least when I make the move even if I end of buying a new tank I would already have the filters established. or is 2 110s not big enough to run a 65-75 gallon tank. im favoring the 75 right now.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

also I only used feeder blocks a few times when people could not come up and feed them for me. that's why I said I wanna get a automatic feeder. I go away a lot in the summer, and winter. but most of the time in the summer some one is around to feed them.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

We need to know the actual number results of your water tests, not that their all good. The Ammonia and Nitrite should be Zero and the Nitrate should be under 20 ppm.

I would consider using the AC110 or similar size filter in addition to your current AC70 when you upgrade to a larger tank though a canister filter may be more appropriate since you're away frequently. Canister filters will not require the weekly cleaning that power filters will on a Mbuna tank. The addition of another filter on your tank will allow you to alternate filter cleaning without impacting the water quality of your tank.

I have had a good experience using the Eheim automatic feeder for my aquarium. I do use 2mm or 3mm pellet food with it but I don't have any experience using flake food with it.

It is also possible that the person(s) you have feeding your fish while you are away are over-feeding your fish and contributing to your water quality problems. An automatic feeder may help avoid these problems. Fish in good condition can go 1 week without food with no issues.

Used reef or saltwater tanks can be used for freshwater fish as long as they are rinsed of the majority of the salt residue. Some of the equipment you might get with a used set-up will not be necessary for a freshwater tank so keep that in mind when you pay the price.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

okay cool. they didn't have that kind they had a top fin one that's rounded. so just grabbed that. ill probably just set it up to feed them every other day when I use it.

I did not know I was supposed to clean my filter weekly thought it was only once a month. then again these fish may be different then what im used to. learning curve to everything. am I supposed to change the carbon weekly? or just clean the filter out?

I kind of figured that if you cleaned the tanks real well, but all the tanks I found were loaded. asked one person if he would be willing to sell just the tank and stand and he said know its all staying together. my dads tank has enough fish and my other 20 gallon salt that im taken care of for my sister has enough fish in it. so I don tthink those set ups would work since I could not use them.

I did how ever find when I ran out to pets mart since I was not going to pay $40 for 1 fish the catfish some one mentioned but it was the more expensive kind. they had a 60 gallon tank and stand on sale. are 60 gallons big enough for Africans or is 75 the better way to go? when the time does come I have most of the stuff. just need to get the sand and ill be set. I have a light by catalina already with 4 bulbs they call are African bulbs just for chiclids apparently it brings out there colors better. got the 1 filter only need 1 more got the rocks. may get the one decoration they had fake rock but was pretty big with holes all over for $30. I got the heater that's supposed to be good for up to I think 65 or 75 if I read directions right. if that 60 will work I may jump on the deal instead of waiting for something used. unless I can talk to a manager and see if he will work with me on the 75. I got gift cards for the lfs but they charge $400 just for their tanks alone plus another $250 for the stand.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

testing:

ph 7.2
ammonia: 0 ppm
nitrite : 0 ppm
mitrate: 10 mg/l

done on api test kit liquid


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Thanks for posting your water test results. They are looking good for the tank.

I know I said that power filters need to be cleaned weekly with Mbuna cichlids but that is my personal experience and how often you will need to clean it depends on your particular tank set-up. Just remember to rinse the cartridge or sponge, depending on the filter model, in a bucket of fish tank water. I think you said you have well water as your water supply so that should not be a problem to rinse your filters in it but for now, I recommend just using fish tank water. Be sure that you only use a pail or bucket that is dedicated for fish use only so that you don't get any household chemicals in your tank.

At this time I would not recommend adding any additional fish to your tank. As long as you monitor the amount of food your fish actually eat, there should not be any excess food getting trapped in the gravel. Mbuna cichlids will eat all the time but I recommend only feeding them once or twice a day, just a few pellets per fish.

The most important dimension for a Mbuna cichlid tank is the footprint, that means the length x the width. Please keep this in mind when choosing a new tank.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

will do would a 48" wide 17.5" deep tank work? I found a 65 and a 75 in those dimensions. I would just keep the fish I have no nothing new. maybe if I find the one blue African I cant find any were I may get it. think its called fuellorboni. the lfs said its rare to find. not sure if he meant in general or for him to see were he gets his fish.

I only feed them once a day as well. I hope a very tiny bit every 12 hours will be fine for them while im away. unless I can find a better automatic feeder this piece of trash top fin will have to do. its one extreme to the next. 1st setting is a tiny amoun tof food next switch up number 3 it fills my palm up. don't want that much going in tank


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Aquariums are measured in length x width x height. A standard 75 gallon tank is 48" long x 18" wide x 21" high so that would be an appropriate size tank for the fish you currently have + some additional fish when it is established.

Automatic fish feeders are great when they work properly. I've only used the Eheim brand feeder and am happy with it's operation.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

okay cool thanks. if I ended up just buying a new tank and not used set up. would it still go thru the new tank syndrome if I use my filter I have now and can get my hands on another one of them that has been running in an established tank?I heard some people at fish stores say they would just get others peoples used filter media or what ever you wanna call it. could not understand why I just heard them saying it to the people working at fish store. im assuming maybe you avoid that because of the bb in the filter sponge.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

If you buy a new or a used tank AND transfer over your existing mature filter and fish, you may experience a mini cycle. You can also purchase a commercially produced 'bacteria in a bottle' product to help cycle your tank. Using mature filters from other fish keepers can also help cycle your new tank but be sure there are no issues or diseases in the donor tank.


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## bigt0689 (Apr 7, 2013)

okay thank you


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