# L. caeruleus not looking good, need help!



## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

My yellow lab is not looking very good. Started to develop sypmtoms about 2-3 days ago. She is hiding underneath the heater. Her face looks somewhat swollen, and her chin is pulled down. What I mean by pulled down is, if you pinch your skin underneath your chin in the center and pull down, that is what her chin looks like.

Its like somebody is pulling her chin skin down. She also is occassionally diving into the sand and picking up a mouth full. It looks like she has sand in the corners of her mouth...think of how a chipmunk's cheeks would be.

She is eating. Last night I didnt get to see her eat, but my g/f said that the lab made went up to eat, but didnt eat very much.

Any ideas?

Tank: 75 gal
ammonia: 0
nitrite: 0
nitrate: 10 ppm

ph: 8

Filtration: 2 XP3's and a Rio 2100 powering UGJ's with a prefilter sponge

Temp: 79-80 degrees


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Holding? The only thing that does not fit is picking up the gravel.


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## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

DJRansome said:


> Holding? The only thing that does not fit is picking up the gravel.


Nah, she's not holding. She is the only lab in the tank and has been for a while now. It would be quite a miracle if she was holding, lol.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I've read females will often drop eggs solo and pick them up themselves...unfertilized. You could try stripping her to see what's in there. If the eggs are unfertilized they swallow or spit them within the week.


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## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

DJRansome said:


> I've read females will often drop eggs solo and pick them up themselves...unfertilized. You could try stripping her to see what's in there. If the eggs are unfertilized they swallow or spit them within the week.


She seems to have an increased respiratory rate as well. 

I tried to take some pics, but she wouldnt stay still

What else could it be?


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## QHgal (May 18, 2006)

> She is the only lab in the tank and has been for a while now. It would be quite a miracle if she was holding, lol.


This doesn't matter. Are there other fish in the tank? Other mouth brooders? If there are, then she's possibly holding and they are hybrid fry. ANY mouthbrooder will readily cross with another, doesn't matter the species, color, genus, etc. If there is a male mouth brooder in the tank and the lab is definetly a female, then they will spawn.


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## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

The tankmates are 14 cyp's, 3 calvus, 1 brichardi, and 3 syno's. So I dont think that is the case here.


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

Can you post a pic?

Any spawning activity between the calvus?

Kim


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## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

cichlidaholic said:


> Can you post a pic?
> 
> Any spawning activity between the calvus?
> 
> Kim


I'll try to get a good pic tonight. Couldnt get a good pic last night.

The calvus are only 1" in size. I havent noticed any breeding activity. Although I've never seen calvus breed before, I'm sure they are too young to be breeding from everything I have read.


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

Yes, you are right...The calvus are far too young to breed, and at the rate they grow (slow) it will be quite some time before they are breeding size.

I'll watch for the pic. It really sounds like a holding female, but if she's picking up sand then she isn't holding...

Kim


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## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

cichlidaholic said:


> Yes, you are right...The calvus are far too young to breed, and at the rate they grow (slow) it will be quite some time before they are breeding size.
> 
> I'll watch for the pic. It really sounds like a holding female, but if she's picking up sand then she isn't holding...
> 
> Kim


I just dont know how she could be holding. It makes no sense.

Why do you think she is picking up the sand, as well as leaving some of the sand in her mouth?

I can tell its in her mouth still b/c I have black sand, so you can see the sand since the mouth is somewhat transparent.


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

You may be seeing fry through her mouth rather than sand. They look rather dark once they start maturing a bit.

I don't know why she's picking up sand...I just know that if she really is picking it up, she likely isn't holding.

Kim


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## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

I'll try to get a pic tonight. I'd really like to figure it out, and help her if help is needed


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## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

pic attempts werent successful tonight. (im not at the house tonight where the fish are). My g/f said that the lab went up to the surface to eat, but didnt take anything. She also said that it looked like the black things in the lab's mouth seemed to shift when the lab swallowed.

Is it possible the lab spawned with one of the cyps??


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

I suppose it is possible, I just wouldn't imagine it happening. They are both mouthbrooders, though, and when you put a fish in a situation like this, anything can happen.

I'll be very interested to see the outcome of this one!

Kim


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## stslimited84 (Oct 5, 2007)

The lab in question has seemingly returned to normal. The black spots in her mouth, and bulge in her throat have gone away, and she is no longer timid or hiding.

Maybe indeed she was holding?


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## cichlidaholic (Dec 7, 2005)

Watch the tank closely for fry.

It sounds like she was holding.

Kim


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