# Tankmates advice



## Aussiecicichlid (Oct 17, 2010)

Hi i recently bought 4 Metriaclima pulpican and 2 elecric yellows ( Labidochromis caeruleus )
and am wanting a catfish and a top of ther tank african cichlid, by top of ther tank i mean i want fish thas prefer to stay at the top where as the 2 speacies i have now are mid to bottom dwellers.

Thats all the questions i have for now but if i have any more ill post them in this thread.

Im actualy new to fish, im a reptile keeper, have been for about 5 years now but a few weeks ago my younger bro asked me to take an agressive black shark off his hands as it was attacking his other fish, i did , and now i have a 60lt tanks and 6 african cichlids lol.

Im 28 and from Australia. later-

darren.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Welcome to Cichlid-forum! What are the dimensions of your tank?

Malawi are harem-breeders which means even if you don't care about breeding, it's best to keep lots of females and a single male so the male aggression can be spread among the females. A single female can be killed by the male. Think in terms of 1m:4f depending on the species.

Since you have mbuna, you might have trouble finding compatible tankmates that stay at the top. But I have found my mbuna use the whole tank constantly, so no need for a top-dwelling species.

An ideal catfish for Malawi is synodontis, either multipunctatus or lucipinnis. They do best in groups of 5-6.


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## Aussiecicichlid (Oct 17, 2010)

Hey DJRansome,

Its a 60 lt tank, i don't recall the dimensions though. i checked my Ph last night and it was 7.6, i want to get it to 7.8 and idealy, 8.

All the fish bar 1 are doing great, are active and eating well but sadly 1 of my electric yellows is on its way out, i have quarantined it in a cup of tank water and will take it back to the pet shop today.

I will definately get some of the rift lake catfish you suggested though at $25.95 each ill only get 2-3 at most.

cheers-

Darren.


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## Aussiecicichlid (Oct 17, 2010)

Ok, just thought i would update.

The sick/dying electric yellow's condition hasn't improved or worsened, i haven't yet taken it back to the pet shop as i hoped it would improve but sadly, i doubt it will.

My ph is good (7.6 ph), water hardness? i am new to this and don't know how to check that but ill give you a quick run down on the tank.

Tank = 60 lt
substrate= calcium carb gravel.
decorations= 3 large and 2 small rocks that were boiled and scrubbed, several plastic plants.
filter= AquarWorld internal filter 800, 800L/Hr 
chemicals and additives= Water ager (removes chlorine and chloramine) Stress zyme and African Cichlid salt.

Food= African Cichlid flakes, Spirulina Sticks. Note- I will occasionally supplement their diet with brine shrimp and thawed zucchini but not often.

I currently feed them 3 small pinches of both flakes and Spirulina Sticks a day (1 in the morning- 7:00, 1 at 5:00 and 1 at 12:00 before i go to bed), i prefer 3 small meals for them instead of 1-2 big meals.

What do you think? any advice is always appreciated.

Cheers-

Darren.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Your tank might be too small for your fish, what are the dimensions. When I look in the Library, a 20G Long tank is 76 liters and that is also too small for mbuna. You want a tank more in the 209 liter range.

Synodontis will hide all the time if you have less than three. Maybe you would prefer a bristlenose pleco so one will be sufficient and they are less expensive.

Your fish are not strict carnivores so look for a food that is low in protein, check the labels. Be sure they eat the food before it hits the bottom and none is left. 3X daily is hard to feed small enough portions.


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## Aussiecicichlid (Oct 17, 2010)

Hey DJ,

I actualy thought the tank might be a little small when the fish reach their full size but the guy at the pet store told me it would be fine. I know most pet stores will tell yuo what you want to here but this place is differet, i got the tabk for $40, the rocks and plastic plants for near to nothing and a 10 % discount on the fish, the guy i deal with there has always been real honest and has even steerd me away from expensive products for cheaper products that are are pretty much the same.

ill look in to the dimensions and post them here .

Glad you mentiond protien intake as its something i wasnt sure about. As a personal trainer and nutritionisti can tell you that taking in more protein than your body can use dose you no harm regardless to what most GP's think, it really dose you no harm but thats us, what about cichlids? what do you think of the diet im feeding mine? is spirulina needed?

What would you suggest i feed them and how many times per day?

Sadly my sick eletric yellow passed away, i will take it to the pet shop tomorrow and get them to test a sample of my tank water. I tested it myself and it all looks fine but it never hurts to get a second opinion hey.

would only be able to get 2-3 catfish, pleco's start at $45.95 so i don't think ill be getting one of them but i will get 2 more yellow's and hopefully 3 of the catfish you suggested. Cheers-

Darren


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## torin32 (May 24, 2010)

Nice to have you here, welcome to the boards. I would have to agree that your tank is to small and you dont have enuf rock work. Keeping mbuna require lots of rock so they may claim territory. M to F as stated above also helps alot, as far as getting your fish to the top part of the tank it is possible, rock work all the way up should do it. Bottom feeders a pleco is a bad idea for that size of tank because of bioload very messy and they get too big. Especially if it is common type of pleco. Ideally if you want these type of fish 40 g is on the small but would do in small numbers for your yellow labs and smaller cichlids. Good luck its all about the learning curve you will get there. Just remember to research first than go purchase save your money and time.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Aussiecicichlid said:


> Glad you mentiond protien intake as its something i wasnt sure about. As a personal trainer and nutritionisti can tell you that taking in more protein than your body can use dose you no harm regardless to what most GP's think, it really dose you no harm but thats us, what about cichlids? what do you think of the diet im feeding mine? is spirulina needed?
> 
> What would you suggest i feed them and how many times per day?


Mbuna have a long gut. When stressed they are susceptible to bloat which can kill them and/or infect your tank. Avoiding excess protein can't hurt.

Many of us feed New Life Spectrum Cichlid Formula, protein is 34% and ingredients are high quality for mbuna like krill, spirulina and lots of fruits and vegetable extracts.

I feed adults (over one inch) 1X daily with one day/week fasting. A few pellets hit the substrate for the cats and that's it...the mbuna catch the rest as it sinks.


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## Aussiecicichlid (Oct 17, 2010)

Hey DJ,

Thanks again, you have been a great help and i plan to use the the advice you have given me . At present i bleieve my 4 Metriaclima pulpican are male but as a newb i cant be sure. From what *** read females keep the color of juvie's, the pale grey and light blue stripes.

Its possible i have 1 lol there has been no agression in the tank whatsoever and i hope it stays that way. If i could take back 3 of them and exchange them for females then i would.

I also have 1 yellow lab and plan to get another 2-3. If mine is male i will get 2-3 females but how can i tell the difference? i have been doing allot of reading but the problem is that the only pics i can find of female labs are of adults and mine is a juvie so its a little hard to tell if mine is male or female so any pointers would be apreciated.

I also want to get 1 male and 2-3 female red zebras and 3 Synodontis multipunctatus.

If when these fish get bigger and it seems my tank is a little on the small side then i will get a bigger one but for now it will do.

The fish food you reccomended seems to have raveing reveiws, a little expensive though, Hikari is cheaper but i may try it.

Im going to start feeding them twice a day instead of 3 to cut down on waste, 1 small pinch in the morning and one larger pinch at night before lights out.

Any further adcive, pointers is always apreciated mate.

Thanks again-

Darren.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I would wait to add fish until you get the larger tank. Six mbuna in a 20G for more than a 3-week quarantine period is likely to cause problems under they are really tiny. Once they get to the 2" mark, or even 1.5" you will need it because they will be mature enough to claim territories. The fighting/chasing over territories? One of the stressors that can make them susceptible to bloat.

With labs you can't tell the difference except by venting and that does not work well until the fish has spawned...catch 22. A common practice is to buy extra juveniles and return males as they mature.

Red zebras (Metriaclima estherae) and infamous for crossbreeding with yellow labs so if you add them, don't save fry from labs or estherae. And in fact, you usually don't want two fish of the same genus in one tank (crossbreeding and fighting) so might not be the best mix with your pulpican.


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## Aussiecicichlid (Oct 17, 2010)

lol **** pet shop, selling me a 60 lt tank knowing exactly what cichlids i wanted and how many and telling me this tank would be fine.

I know the guy in charge of the aquarium department and he has always been real helpfull and always gives me discounts but im a little dissapointed that they sold me a tank thats too small for what i want to keep but im at foult too as i didnt know enough about keeping them, afterall *** only ever kept reptiles till now.

After doing more research i beleive 2 of my pulpicans are female and the other 2 are male.

The yellow lab i think is female due to its lighter coloration but i can't be sure.

I definately want to do the right thing and give my cichlids the space they need but for now they seem to have heaps of room and then some. I will get 2-3 more labs, 2-3 catfish and thats all ill get for this tank, atleast untill i can afford a bigger one then ill add 3-4 of 1 other speacies *** been looking at in the store, can't remember what it was called but i won't be getting any of those untill i upsize.

I plann on doing a 20% water change a week, would this be enough? i cant change too much of the water too often as we have water restrictions here in Queensland.

I think that covers the basics, ill take some pics of my tank when i get a chance and post them on the forums.

Thanks again mate for all the help, tips and advice.

Cheers :thumb: -

Darren.


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## torin32 (May 24, 2010)

If you watch most male mbunas will dig females usually dont. It aint 100% but I am pretty sure females do not burrow or make nests.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

My females dig. My yellow lab females are brighter than the males. Sorry to debunk the myths, but better to know, right?

50% weekly is usually the starting place for cichlids. With six mbuna in a 20G you might need to do a larger percent. Keep your nitrates at or under 20ppm. If you can't "waste" water try live plants, they will consume some of the nitrates.

Watch them for aggression to help them live until the larger tank arrives. Can't trade it in, huh? Best of luck!


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## Dewdrop (Nov 20, 2007)

That's what I was thinking...since the tank is new & it was their fault that they didn't sell you the right size to begin with, maybe they will take it back & just have you pay the difference in price. It's worth a try. Good luck & welcome to the forum :thumb: .

P.S. A 55gallon (I don't know l.'s) is the *minimum* size recommended for most malawi mbuna but if a 75g. doesn't cost much more, I'd for sure go with it. Bigger usually *is* better when it comes to fish tanks. I'm sure lots of people wish they had bigger.


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