# 120 Gallon tank stocking help please



## FishJones (Jan 2, 2009)

Hi all, I'm new here, nice to meet such a good group of people. I have a new 120 gallon tank and I want JD and an Oscar, what else would you recommend with those? Convicts? Also too, what cichlid should I use as my hardy fish during the Cycle? And how many? I'm going to use Tetra Safe Start and you can't use the pure ammonia fishless cycle with that, according to a couple Tetra people. Thanks for any help.


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## Toby_H (Apr 15, 2005)

what dementions is your 120 gal? 4'x2' footprint or 5'x18" footprint?

I have a 4x2 120 gal, and in my opinion, it makes a great tank for a large/aggressive pair (I have Trimacs in mine) but is not so great for a community (which I've also tried). The 5' 120 gal would suit either quite well (I have never owned a 5' 120 gal, but have local friends who do).

The wider (front to back) footprint is appreciated by big fish but doesn't really offer that much more territory to a community (at least in 4~5' tanks).


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## FishJones (Jan 2, 2009)

Hey Toby, thanks for your help man. Mine is the 5 foot imprint so that's cool you said they were good ones. Toby, do you think Oscars and JDs would get along? The JD is the one fish I want, I can go without the Oscars if not really compatible. Do you think if I used convicts for my starter fish that they would be hardy? Supposedly this Safe Start has it cycled in two weeks, known a lot of people it's worked for. Thanks again for the help!


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## Toby_H (Apr 15, 2005)

Responses like this is what happens when they give me too much time off work 

I have two tanks right now that each have an Adult Dempsey and an Adult Oscar... in my experience they make great tankmates. During the grow out stage they seem to juggle the "king of the tank" title back and forth which can make for some awkward weeks, but as long as they get through the teenage stage (which is awkward for all of us  ) then they do just fine as adults.

Although I've never owned a 5' 120 gal, I've had 4'x18" footprints & 6'x18" footprints, so I feel I can make a pretty good estimation at how it would work. First piece of advice from me is, if you want a relatively peaceful tank, don't do pairs of anything or do a pair only tank. Oscars and Dempseys are both pretty hard hitting Cichlids and a pair of each would drive each other crazy and keep your floors wet (angry Oscars splash a lot).

But I believe that an Oscar (either gender), Dempsey (either Gender), and two other Cichlids that will not challenge for the "king of the tank" title would make for a very nice peaceful 5' tank. Although it goes against my previous suggestion and holds some additional risk, some smaller species could be done as a pair. I'll list some suggested tankmates and note possible pairs that are 'risks' I would be willing to take.

Convicts (possible pair), Firemouth (possible pair), Severum, Blue Acara, GT/Saum (female only), one of many Geos (possible pairs of smaller growing Geos). There are also some smaller but not quite dwarf Cichlids that may work such as Keyholes, Neets or Rainbows, but as Iâ€™ve never kept them I cannot give too much input here. Iâ€™ve also kept W African Jewels with my SA/CA Cichlids and they did very well (W African River fish prefer water parameters very similar to SA Cichlids). I prefer female only when it comes to Jewels.


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

Simmer down there Toby, simmer down... :lol:

Welcome to the site FishJones, are you planning on getting these fish from your waters down there in Florida?

Ok, now it's time to pick apart Tobys response... 

1.) I would stick with the initial advice of no pairs. I've had a pair of convicts literally take over 1/4 of a 240. That's a 2'x2' square. While they really won't do much damage to an older oscar of jack dempsey they will create stress in the tank. Stress kills fish. So I'd suggest no pairs.

2.) I wouldn't attempt Kehole cichlids, they wouldn't be rough and tumble enough for a jd and oscar or even a convict.

You said your foot print is 5'. Five foot by what? I personally have never seen a 5' 120. It's peaked my interest.  I've got a 5' 185 that's 5'x2'x30" tall. It's quite the versitile tank.

Toby, if I've hurt your feelings then you must still be hung over from new years :lol:


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## FishJones (Jan 2, 2009)

Hey Toby and TheFishGuy, I really appreciate the help, you guys definitely know what you are talking about! Toby, know it takes time to write all that, appreciate it man, and fishguy. I found getting good help about cichlids is tough online. I studied this stuff up and down and it's nothing like getting advice from people who have actually had the cichlids themselves. For most Jack Dempsey tankmate articles, they say to get compatible Central American ones-doesn't help much. I'm going to do exactly as you guys say, no pairs, etc. My tank is 60 inches long, 18.5 inches wide, and 26 inches high. I got it from Petsmart the other day, was going to get a 75, but this one was only like $30 more so pretty cool. It was funny, I needed a bnackground a week later so I went there and they measured my tank there, but it was like 6 feet long, lol so I thought I got ripped off. Just mine is taller than their 120 gallon. Let me ask you guys this-what would be a good starter fish for my tank? I'm going to use that Tetra Safe Start and if it's not cycled in 2 weeks, will return the fish to Petsmart (good about returning, my local one), will do the pure ammonia fishless cycle. Read a lot about people having good luck with Safe Start so hope it helps me. Would you recommend getting some cichlids as a starter fish or maybe getting like zebra danios? I could return the Danios no problem once it's cycled. How many do you think I would need? Do you guys think a parrot cichlid, a JD, an Oscar would work with a couple of Silver Dollars or Angel Fish? I'm going to buy the JD and Oscar as juveniles so do you think it will help their aggression later? Also too, for me to get more different types of colorful cichlids, would you suggest changing the cichlid type to African maybe? Thanks guys for the help really appreciate!!


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## Toby_H (Apr 15, 2005)

TFG, your advice is always based on experinece and has never been offensive in any way :thumb:

FishJones, I'm not quite sure I understand your cycling approach. If you are adding ammonia directly to the water you do not want to have fish in the tank. There are basically two approaches to cycling, A) with fish where the fish themselves provide the waste (ammonia) or B) a fishless cycle where you manunally add ammonia to the tank.

I personally do not like the idea of cycling with fish, unless you are starting with ample "established media" that is capable of handling at least most of the waste the fish will produce. But since I've had mature tanks for a long time, I've never had to do a fishless cycle.

And I wasn't "hung over" from New Year's Eve, I actually didn't drink a drop that night. But boy did I wear myself out boogying the night away...


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## FishJones (Jan 2, 2009)

Hey Toby, nah what I'm going to do is use Tetra Safe Start to cycle it with fish. I just have read a lot of people who have success with it. Basically, just dump the Safe Start in there with starter fish and then after 10 days or so, you're cycled. The Safe Start has bacteria in it that becomes active with the fish ammonia. Tetra and fish people say you can't do pure ammonia (no fish) cycling with Safe Start. I just meant if the safestart didn't cycle me, I would find the fish a happy new home and then do cycling with pure ammonia (no fish). I had bought the Safe Start bottles before and can't return it and so want to use it because it was like $19 apiece. I just had the worst time cycling a 29 gallon, used gravel from an established tank, used Stability, and it wouldn't ever cycle, my ammonia was always at 1.0, and was doing 50% water changes every day also. Cool your cycling is cake with your media, that's awesome!!


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

I'm really no help at all when it comes to cycling with chemicals. I'm not a real big fan of chemicals in tanks, meaning adding them for any reason... Also, like Toby said, I've had established tanks forever so starting tanks is a cake walk.

Do you have a tank set up now? Maybe we can figure out why your last attempt didn't work. Using old filter media and dirty decor should start your tank instantly. You'd need to ad fish instantly too though. Some people will add the media and decor but not add fish...

I'm not a real big fan of parrots either, I don't care for manufactured fish...

As for africans, it's a perfect tank to do african mbuna in. It's got the length and height, and would look good as an african "reef"


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## FishJones (Jan 2, 2009)

Hey TFG, thanks for the help, I really appreciate it. That sounds great for the mbuna, I hear a lot about those, will definitely check it out. I'm with you on the parrot fish, it makes me feel sad for them how they were conceived. I think my SafeStart bottles aren't going to be big enough for my tank so I'm not going to use those. I haven't gotten it setup yet. I just got my Rena XP4 yesterday in the mail (it saved me $125 buying it new off E-bay, compared to PetSmart, amazing) Yeah, I got bad advice originally on my new 29 gallon tank and listened to the LPS dude and told me to put 10 fish in there right off the bat. So that probably messed it up. I then waited a week and added beneficial bacteria from Petco. Then I returned 6 fish and so then added gravel from the LFS and Stability, and nothing helped. So new tank, new beginning, lol. TFG, do you think the pure ammonia fishless cycle works? I'll add my pure ammonia solution to 5 ppm and then keep doing it until the nitrite spike then will half it. I'm going to go now and get some more gravel from the LFS. Do you think I should be good? All my family and friends have salwtwater tanks or I'd be getting some of their used media. Thanks again for the tank idea and the help!!


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

Well, all you can do is try with the cycling... I'm a bit old school and the last tank I had to cycle was a customers. It was a 240/150 combo set up with over 500 gallons total including the sump. It took four weeks to cycle and we tested the water every three days till it was perfect. We didn't add anything but 100 goldfish, half of which were dead by the time we were done...


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## FishJones (Jan 2, 2009)

Thanks TFG. I got a lot of gravel from my LFS so hope that helps speed it along. WOW, on your 500 gallon tank cycle, good job on cycling that!!! Let me ask you this-I have my aquarium decor all set, huge shipwreck pieces (tons of hiding places), under water volcano, and a geyser, so I don't have any rocks-will that mess me up with cichlids? I know they like rocks. I just didn't want to take the chance of having the rocks tipped over by an aggressive cichlid and brak my tank-that would be my luck.


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## TheFishGuy (Apr 21, 2005)

I had a close call once about ten years ago, but it was my fault for not stacking the rock very well... I still have proof of that incident on the front pane of glass of my 185. That chip tends to turn green before everything else :lol:


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## tomanystraydogs (Apr 27, 2003)

A little late but I have done the ammonia with bio spira and no fish cycle, works great.


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