# Making the 800 gallon 800 gallons bigger!!!



## TheFishGuy

Ok, I know it's been a couple of days but my plate is very full. Well now 3/4 of it is gone and I'm full....

I'll start by saying thanks for all the compliments and kind words. I've got a lot of time sweat blood and tears in this project and it's about to get worse... I'll get to that after I answer some questions...



> Are you happy with the Sani-tred?


No, not at all. As a matter of fact I would never reccomend this company to anyone. The service was great before the sale then went down hill after the purchase. I'm not the only one this has happened to. The tank is leaking once more. Only difference is this time it's a very slow leak and it's going to be a huge job to re-seal. The glass needs to be removed and all the bulkheads need to be removed then re-installed. 


> What would you do differently now?


I'd do a couple of things differently.
1.) I would take my time and finish the entire room before filling the tank. Meaning the ceiling would have been insulated, the walls would have been insulated and then both would have been covered with a moisture proof material. 
2.)The outside of the tank would have been painted at the very least to resist moisture. 
3.) and most importantly... I would have framed the floor correctly. Meaning I should have let the sheeting go under the framed walls, then built the walls on the floor of the tank instead of getting all the frame work up first. I know why I did it the way I did it. I didn't have the plywood ,but I should have waited. I believe this is one of the factors in the leak issue. The floor simply flexed because my fat @$$ was walking around the edges. 
4.) I should have most definately glued the bottom piece of hardie panel to the floor instead of just letting it lie there. I believe this is another major factor in the first leak.
5.) Along with everything else listed... I should have made it bigger........ 


> What do you love most about the tank?


Definately the entertainment factor, it's like watching a soap opera. That and it's virtually maint. free aside from water changes (which are a breeze) and rinsing the pre filters every so often. 


> What do you love most about WHAT YOU BUILT for the tank? ie: the way you designed something that you're particularly happy with everything you think about it? I'm sure you'll say filter, but break down why and what you love most about the filter too?


I'm definately very happy with the filter, you nailed it. and my last answer kind of answered why. A three year old could maintain this tank. Which is good, because I tend to act like a three year old sometimes. One of the best things about the filter is turning the valve to drain a third of the water. All I do is turn the valve and walk away. Watch T.V. Cut the grass, practice making another child.... who knows, anything.... Point is I don't have to worry about draining too much water. No hoses to baby sit... nothin'. Thene to re-fill it's just turn a valve or two and set the timer for 30 min. If I happen to get down there too late it's no big deal.... I've got a floor drain so any overflow just goes down the drain 


> And now one for my own personal gain, if you dont mind:
> Do you think 1/2" of tempered glass is ok for a 6x3x4(4 ft HIGH) tank? The viewing area would be about 5'x3' with 3 inches overlapping for seal. So total glass size would be 66"x42". Think that's pushing it?


I see one major issue. Tempered glass is not good for a fish tank. While it does take a lot to break it. When it breaks it explodes. With plate glass if it breaks it just cracks. Water will dribble out giving you time to get things together to rescue your fish. Do you remember the scene in Leathal Weopon II when Mel shoots the tank and it explodes? Picture that with your fish tank and tempered glass. If that were plate glass he would have just put a hole in it.... Not very exciting for the movies eh? Sorry for that info... 



> Just wondering ... have any of your handfed monsters ever get a bit of TFG finger fillet?


Not as of yet  Knock on wood!

Any other questions?

what are you going to seal the tank with this time?

Pond armor.

what are you going to do with the fish?

They will be in an 8' pool in the basement during the reconstruction.

Are you going to do all the things you said you'd do if you had to do it again?

YES 
this includes making it bigger...


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## mithesaint

What? I'm sorry, you mumbled. Come again? Did you say...

MAKE IT BIGGER?

Just wondering :dancing:


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## SLIGHTLY STOOPID

You're sealing this time around with Pond Armor? Dood! That's expensive. How much do you need to cover your job?

The link:Pond Armor

:thumb:


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## mbunapete

TFG: "The tank is leaking once more. Only difference is this time it's a very slow leak and it's going to be a huge job to re-seal. The glass needs to be removed and all the bulkheads need to be removed then re-installed.

You say that with a Zen like serenity. Us mere mortals would be crapping our pants!


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## mbunapete

Mrs. TFG is a saint.


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## TheFishGuy

You guys kill me. :lol:

Mrs TFG knew going into this that it was an experimental project. While she's not really very happy about an 8' pool in the basement she knows this is my passion. She also knows that I don't go drinking and doing things that others may do with their spare time... I'm a good boy, so I get rewarded 

Besides, a loving relationship is about give and take. She gives, I take :lol:

Her dream from a little girl was to be a stay at home mom. She started working at age 14 and worked every day, sometimes two jobs untill about a month after we were married. While it's true I have a great wife, probably the best wife a guy could ask for. We've paid our dues, we're still payin' em... who am I kidding??

I'm hoping to get the tank drained and the fish moved out this weekend, sunday more like it... I'll keep you posted.


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## loogielv

thanks for the reply TFG. Great answers.

I offically finished the whole thread, front to back, start to finish. Great read. Truly. You should really go back and read it. Everyone should actually.

I have some follow up questions if you dont mind.

1) Why do you believe that putting wall braces on top of the tank flooring would have made a difference? Didn't you secure the plywood to the floor bracing? Do you think that putting the walls down into the tank flooring would keep it from moving more or something?

2) Do you ever feel that 100 fish is overcrowded in your tank? It certainly didn't look that way until feeding time, but video doesn't really capture the tank in all its glory either.

3) I just assumed that everyone used tempered glass. What do you think is possible with a 6' x 4' piece of glass with 500 gallons of water behind it? (actual size is about a 5' x 3'..just being worst case guy) 
1/2" plate? 1/2" tempered? 3/4" plate or 3/"4 tempered? I dont have any reason for worrying about thickness other than pricing. I would assume that plate is cheaper but also that 1/2" tempered is cheaper than 3/4" plate. I truly have no idea though. Haven't bothered to price em out, as I didn't know the thickness i'd need. I'm just concerned about pricing.

4) If you couldn't make the tank longer and could only choose between more height or more depth, which would you choose and why? if you could choose more length, would you do that instead of either height or depth?

5) one thing that i've never understood about your bucket pre-filters is that the pre-filter material wraps around the inside of the bucket, but the water flows into the center and down through a pipe, in the center of the bucket. Shouldn't the water pass through the pre-filter, instead of just brush up against it on the way out through the plumbing? What i mean is, why didn't you put the pre-filter on the bottom of the bucket so all the water has to pass through it, thereby making more of a...filter? am I missing something?

6) how hard is it to get waste and poop off the bottom of the tank? one of my biggest concerns is having to constantly siphon poop off the bottom. I want a setup where the poop is auto sucked into the overflow and down through the filter, but I just dont know how to do that and still keep plumbing and pipes inside the tank to a minimum.

one person suggested to me to have a coast to coast overflow box where the water flows freely over the top and then down through standpipes to the sump. the idea is the amount of water going over the edge is enough to create great circulation, mixed with proper return placement and i shouldn't have any issue. I've created a design that I think works, but who really knows. (i'll pm with my thread link. dont wanna hijack) which brings me to my final 2 questions

7) do you feel circulation and water movement in your tank is optimal? would you like more return lines or more output to the sump lines? more water flow at all?

7a) (ok, 3 questions ) i saw in a pic that your spray bar seems more like a...drizzle bar? is that so? does it not spray the water into the tank with much force? do you like it the way it is?

8)do you think that an overflow box is overkill on a tank that you can freely drill, such as a plywood tank? you have shower drains and some piping that act as your overflow. Most overflow boxes were designed due to the inability to freely drill a glass tank, however the idea of a coast to coast OF seems to me will increase circulation and thereby remove more poop from the bottom. I'd also like an intake at the bottom somewhere and return lines jetting in the general direction of the bottom intake to help blow debris towards it, to help increase the likelihood the poop will automagically disappear into my filters, but reverse siphoning is a concern also.

I'm sorry to write a book of questions for you. I know you're busy. I'm subscribed to this thread so answer whenever. Take your time. It's appreciated either way


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## TheFishGuy

I'll get to these before the end of the weekend... hopefully... And you'll be shocked to know that the water does flow through the pre filters... I'll explain with a scematic when I get to answering.... OK, off to work


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## TheFishGuy

I did get the tank empty today and the fish moved. It's been a long hard day. I was up at 8:00 am and watched the weather. I pretty much assumed we wouldn't be working monday so I thought I'd move the fish then instead of today. After breakfast and some wrestling with the kids my brother/boss called and said normal time on Monday :x So at 11:00 am I started to move a 60, two 29's and a 20H to make room for the 8' pool. I finished moving and measuring the fish and emptying the tank eight hours later...

Here's the list of fish (and their sizes) that were in the 800:

Black belt 9
Black belt	8.5
Black belt	9
Black belt	9.5
Blue Acara 5
Bocourti	11
Bocourti 10
Common Oscar 11.75
Common Oscar 8.5
Cutteri	5.25
Firemouth	5
Giant Danio 2
Green Severum 7
Green Severum 7
Green Severum 6.75
Green Terror 4.25
Intermedious 8.25
Intermedious 8.25
Intermedious 8.25
Irridescent Shark 15
Irridescent Shark 10.5
Jack Dempsey 6.5
Jack Dempsey 3.25
Jack Dempsey 3.75
Jaguar 7.5
Lemon Severum 4
Loepard sailfin pleco 14.5
Mad Barb	15
Mad Barb	15
Midas	7.75
Midas	7.75
Midas	7.5
Midas Mr. T 8.5
Nicaraguan Cichlid	6
Nicaraguan Cichlid	7.125
Nicaraguan Cichlid	7.25
Nicaraguan Cichlid	7
Nicaraguan Cichlid	4.25
Nicaraguan Cichlid	5.25
Nicaraguan Cichlid	5.25
Pacu	22
Pacu	18
Pacu	17
Pictus Cat	10
Red Bay Snook 5.25
Red Midas 8.75
Red Terror 7.25
Red tiger oscar	8.75
Regans Cichlid	7
Regans Cichlid	6.25
Regans Cichlid	5.25
Robertsoni 10
Salvani	5.75
Salvani	4.5
Silver Dollar	7
Silver Dollar	5
Silver Dollar	6
Silver Dollar	6
Synodontis	8
Synspilum	10.5
Tiger Tilapia	8
Tiger Tilapia	7
Tilapia Mamfe	7.25
Uaru	5

And here's a picture of the pond/pool set up. I'll be covering it as soon as I can get the time. And I'll be answering those questions tomorrow morning... I'm bushed......


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## loogielv

you know, i've always wondered why people dont use these pools for indoor ponds. They're super cheap compared to other options. Super easy and the mammoth one that's like 25' across and 4 1/2' deep is only like $300....


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## TheFishGuy

loogielv said:


> thanks for the reply TFG. Great answers.


Thanks, I try 



> I offically finished the whole thread, front to back, start to finish. Great read. Truly. You should really go back and read it. Everyone should actually.


I've been meaning to do just that... I'm just waiting for time to fall out of my... 



> I have some follow up questions if you dont mind.


Don't mind at all 8)



> 1) Why do you believe that putting wall braces on top of the tank flooring would have made a difference? Didn't you secure the plywood to the floor bracing? Do you think that putting the walls down into the tank flooring would keep it from moving more or something?


In typical home construction the floor is framed, then sheeted. The walls are then built on top of the floor. The reason is this; when the floor sheeting (decking) is ran all the way to the edge there's not possibility of sag. The way I originally framed the tank the decking did not go all the way and I think it's sagging. Though it doesn't look like it is from underneath.



> 2) Do you ever feel that 100 fish is overcrowded in your tank? It certainly didn't look that way until feeding time, but video doesn't really capture the tank in all its glory either.


In the current stock list, no. But it all depends on the size of the fish 



> 3) I just assumed that everyone used tempered glass. What do you think is possible with a 6' x 4' piece of glass with 500 gallons of water behind it? (actual size is about a 5' x 3'..just being worst case guy)
> 1/2" plate? 1/2" tempered? 3/4" plate or 3/"4 tempered? I dont have any reason for worrying about thickness other than pricing. I would assume that plate is cheaper but also that 1/2" tempered is cheaper than 3/4" plate. I truly have no idea though. Haven't bothered to price em out, as I didn't know the thickness i'd need. I'm just concerned about pricing.


Pricing jumps dramaticly from 1/2" to 3/4" thick glass. Your best bet is to stick with 1/2" plate glass. With 1/2" you'll need to keep the over all hieght of the tank at 30" or shorter. The taller you go the more thick of glass you'll need.



> 4) If you couldn't make the tank longer and could only choose between more height or more depth, which would you choose and why? if you could choose more length, would you do that instead of either height or depth?


I would always go for the larger foot print. Area is key. BUT! It also depend on what type of fish you plan to keep. Some people want taller tanks to show smaller fish or reefs. Others, like myself, need area because I keep cichlids and pacu and large cats...



> 5) one thing that i've never understood about your bucket pre-filters is that the pre-filter material wraps around the inside of the bucket, but the water flows into the center and down through a pipe, in the center of the bucket. Shouldn't the water pass through the pre-filter, instead of just brush up against it on the way out through the plumbing? What i mean is, why didn't you put the pre-filter on the bottom of the bucket so all the water has to pass through it, thereby making more of a...filter? am I missing something?


I've been waiting to answer this one. Simply because I like to do drawrings 

Water flows into the perforated trash can which fit perfectly into the five gallon pail. I guess I'm not sure if I ever mentioned that the perforated trash can has a solid bottom. The water is forced through the sides then falls to the bottom of the trash can :thumb: Here's a drawring:












> 6) how hard is it to get waste and poop off the bottom of the tank? one of my biggest concerns is having to constantly siphon poop off the bottom. I want a setup where the poop is auto sucked into the overflow and down through the filter, but I just dont know how to do that and still keep plumbing and pipes inside the tank to a minimum.


Well, you can't accomplish what you want without plumbing or pipes in the tank. Those pipes can easily be hidden though... If you make ugj's and run the supply to them in one of the front corners you'll never see the pipe! Also, if your overflow is in the back wall and you plan to use a spray bar all three things combined make a circular current through the entire length of the tank. Thus not letting waste build up on the bottom.



> one person suggested to me to have a coast to coast overflow box where the water flows freely over the top and then down through standpipes to the sump. the idea is the amount of water going over the edge is enough to create great circulation, mixed with proper return placement and i shouldn't have any issue. I've created a design that I think works, but who really knows. (i'll pm with my thread link. dont wanna hijack) which brings me to my final 2 questions


Ok, but make sure you feed sinking food, or it'll all go down the drain 



> 7) do you feel circulation and water movement in your tank is optimal? would you like more return lines or more output to the sump lines? more water flow at all?


I think the water flow is perfect  I've been building filters for a long time... And I feel this is the best one that I've come up with yet. It keeps the water clean, no dead spots to speak of really, and the fish seem to like it. (they told me so in a dream)



> 7a) (ok, 3 questions ) i saw in a pic that your spray bar seems more like a...drizzle bar? is that so? does it not spray the water into the tank with much force? do you like it the way it is?


Oh... you must have seen the wrong picture. It sprays with plenty of force! Some 1500 to 2000 gallons of water is forced through that spray bar an hour... No drizzling there... :thumb:



> 8)do you think that an overflow box is overkill on a tank that you can freely drill, such as a plywood tank? you have shower drains and some piping that act as your overflow. Most overflow boxes were designed due to the inability to freely drill a glass tank, however the idea of a coast to coast OF seems to me will increase circulation and thereby remove more poop from the bottom. I'd also like an intake at the bottom somewhere and return lines jetting in the general direction of the bottom intake to help blow debris towards it, to help increase the likelihood the poop will automagically disappear into my filters, but reverse siphoning is a concern also.


Well, it wouldn't be reverse siphoning... it'd simply be draining during a power outage. Sure, people could say use a check valve... but they tend to fail... and with all that pressure behind it from a monster tank.... If you want your return lines on the bottom incorperate them with the ugjs. That's how they are on the 800. There's just a siphon break hole placed at the exact right hieght so as to stop siphon. I personally don't like overflows. I've lost too many fish and wasted too much food with those types of overflows... So you'd be preachin' to the wrong quire on that one 



> I'm sorry to write a book of questions for you. I know you're busy. I'm subscribed to this thread so answer whenever. Take your time. It's appreciated either way


This goes for everyone... Never appologize for asking questions. Asking questions means you're doing research. And doing research is the right thing to do. My answers might not be what you want to hear, or you might have a different way. That's fine, that's what makes the world go around! I try to answer everything on these boards I belong to with my personal experiences. If I use a different source I usually quote the source. It's important to understand that there's more than one way to do something, and what's right for me might not be right for the next guy. And it's also important to understand that every fish is different. While they might have basic care needs, their personality will define their individual care. <---- That's good stuff right there :lol: I wrote that 

Havea great day!


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## sirdavidofdiscus

You didn't use the "pond" you built for the last leak?


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## TheFishGuy

No, that wasn't very deep, and theres' a handfull of large pacus that need the hieght. That and this was cheaper... $50.... done....


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## RyanR

loogielv said:


> you know, i've always wondered why people dont use these pools for indoor ponds. They're super cheap compared to other options. Super easy and the mammoth one that's like 25' across and 4 1/2' deep is only like $300....


The reason seems to be the same one that kept me from getting one for floating around drinking beer after doing stuff around the house: The big cheap ones are really crappy, and fail sooner vs. later. Read the reviews on the websites, like Target, or your favorite box store.

-Ryan


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## loogielv

well gee TFG, i thought you were gonna answer my questions. You just sidestepped them all and barely breezed over em.

 jk. ty tons for the great replies. it's great to know you're so active in helping as well as active in being awesome.



RyanR said:


> The reason seems to be the same one that kept me from getting one for floating around drinking beer after doing stuff around the house: The big cheap ones are really crappy, and fail sooner vs. later. Read the reviews on the websites, like Target, or your favorite box store.
> 
> -Ryan


I really gotta disagree here. I had the big momma that i got for like $300 and it worked like a charm. I finally had to just give it away because i had to move. The thing never failed. Ever. 
Also any reviews on the pool, i imagine wont be reviewing it for the sake of keeping fish. 
I will say the filter it comes with is just awful. It sucks to the end all be all of sucking. However any fish person would just pull it out and redo it anyway. the holes are already in place in the side of the pool to DIY it anyway.

I think these pool are awesome for the sake of keeping fish. I'd be worried about rocks and such on the vinyl, but that would go for any pond lining...

edit: just to clarify, i had it for the purpose of swimming. not fish keeping.


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## TheFishGuy

We've got a 12' (for swimming) and withstood four kids this past summer, and the summer before. I even left it up over winter, but it was a pain to clean... This little 8' pool is doing fine so far... and it was $50... $50... you can't beat it with a stick. As for decor in it there's a solution. Just cut a piece of pond liner the shape of the bottom to act as a buffer or cushion if you will. All that's in this pool is two large pieces of pipe that were smooth and a big pot. The pipe is to set heaters in as to not burn through the plastic...


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## talon444

TFG, I found this post (the original thread) last night and just finished reading both threads this morning.

I do have a question. How is resealing with Pond Armor coming along? How many coats do you plan on using. It seems the websites says one 10ml coat is enough and anymore is wasting money (and it is expensive!). I am just though on scratches from rocks and things like that.

I am in the planning stages of building a monster tank myself (which led me to your threads), and I cannot put into words how helpful and useful your insights through this process have been. I am sure when it is all done and in the years after my tank will have some issues of its own, but the information you have provided I am sure will save me a whole lot of time and $$$$, and it is very much appreciated. Especially in regards to the few issues you have had.

Again many thanks and great job.


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## loogielv

tfg, i've been meaning to reply here re: the pond armor and forgot...
i've heard that the recommended (by the manufacturer) amount to coat is way underestimated. People on other forums have gone as high as 3 times what the manufacturer recommends and still have pinhole leaks. After adding 3 or 4x the recommended they cease having issues though. do some research on it, just to be safe.


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## TheFishGuy

I will, thank you for that little tid bit.

Update:

Well since my incredibly understanding wife who lets me fill the house with fish tanks doesn't want the tank to take up more room I've decided to add onto the back of it. I'm going to take it a step furthur though and make the addition deeper. What I mean by deeper is by making it taller by going down.

Here's the future footprint:










So while the footprint will be larger indeed, it's going to be 26 or so inches deeper in the addition part. Here's a 3D to explain.










Then what it'll look like through the glass:










With the addition the total gallons will go from 785.45 to 1623.27 more than doubling gallonage. More importantly this will give options for more fish to go into the tank by creating two huge breaks in line of site. Breaks in line of site are important when keeping large cichlids... It'll also be interesting to see which fish prefer the deeper water. Hopefully tomorrow I'll be able to take a saws all to the back wall


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## LJ

Wow! Straight envy TFG.


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## loogielv

big addition! i dont see what could _possibly_ go wrong. :lol:

seriously though, that tank is going to have some serious personality! 
curb appeal if you will? i'm sure you will!

same type of bracing,hardware etc throughout?


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## TheFishGuy

The addition's going to be a little different. Since it's going all the way to the floor floor joists won't be needed. As a matter of fact I might not do anything to the floor but line it. The walls will be built in the same way though.


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## sirdavidofdiscus

I'll be able to give you a hand after Jan. 1 until mid March if you need it. (or want it)


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## TheFishGuy

Thanks Big D, I'll be in touch


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## lylefk

First, I spent the last 2 days reading everything and watching the videos...very cool and quite an experience :thumb:

I'm planning a tank as well, although it won't be as large as yours...I'm thinking right around the 450-600 gallon mark. (8'x30"x36"-48")

I found it all through your post on waterwolves and figured it would be easier to ask the questions here.

1) Will the added depth in back increase the pressure on the glass? Will you have to go to thicker glass?

2) Why Pond Armor? It is (literally) attractive for me because I want to go with a black background...why not Drylok again?

3) The debate about having your bio media submerged...do you see any negative aspects to doing it this way? I was originally planning on keeping the media out of the water, but this seems simpler.

4) How loud is the tank on the finished side? I want it as quiet as humanly possible.

5) What do you reckon the energy savings is heating the whole room versus heating the tank in a traditional fashion? This is also an important factor for me.

6) It seems like your tank stays pretty clear...do you see a need for any additional mechanical filtration?

7) Finally (I think), what turnover rate are you shooting for with the new tank? I assume you are going to upgrade or double up on your pump situation...

8) An easy one...eta for the new, completed tank?

Thanks so much, I appreciate you taking the time to answer so many questions and I definitely appreciate you taking the time (and the risks) over the last couple of years, you are a pioneer for the hobby  Who knows, maybe 12 months from now I can become your Pacifc Northwest MFR chapter. I'm planning a decent sized pond in the backyard as well with a Skippy filter for some monster catfish and who knows what else...My last tank was a 180, I can't wait for the upgrade!


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## Izzydawg

Hey that's gonna be SWEET 8) 
A Fishroom/Bedroom...that's even sweeter :thumb: 
Can't wait to see your project when it's done opcorn: 
Mrs TFG, you're a lucky chick :wink:


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## TheFishGuy

lylefk said:


> First, I spent the last 2 days reading everything and watching the videos...very cool and quite an experience :thumb:


 Why thank you 



> I'm planning a tank as well, although it won't be as large as yours...I'm thinking right around the 450-600 gallon mark. (8'x30"x36"-48")
> 
> I found it all through your post on waterwolves and figured it would be easier to ask the questions here.


With your permission I might copy and paste these questions and answers on every forum I belong to...



> 1) Will the added depth in back increase the pressure on the glass? Will you have to go to thicker glass?


The glass is 3/4" thick as is, so no upgrade needed  I could go 6'-7' tall and still not need thicker glass 



> 2) Why Pond Armor? It is (literally) attractive for me because I want to go with a black background...why not Drylok again?


Well, drylok is not really designed to work in these situations, allthough I think it could work... As for the pond armor, what sold me on it was the fact that it's applied at 10mil thick. That's huge, and I plan to spray it so it should be the last time I ever seal this tank. Which is why I want to make it bigger 



> 3) The debate about having your bio media submerged...do you see any negative aspects to doing it this way? I was originally planning on keeping the media out of the water, but this seems simpler.


While simpler... I do plan to have it out of water when I'm all said and done. This was stolen off a design for a pond filter. It works but I think it would be better not submerged. The air will help the chemical process. Which is why wet drys are so effective...



> 4) How loud is the tank on the finished side? I want it as quiet as humanly possible.


It's not very loud at all. If you go to you tube and look for my videos and watch them all you should be able to get an idea of how quiet it is 



> 5) What do you reckon the energy savings is heating the whole room versus heating the tank in a traditional fashion? This is also an important factor for me.


Actually, I'm thinking I might have been doing wrong this whole time. I've got 500 watts keeping the 800 gallon pool at 78*. It took 2000 watts between two four foot electric baseboard heaters to keep the tank at 80*. So I think I'm going to opt for a 500 watt or two titanium heater(s) when the tank is finished. I'll still keep the room insulated because it just makes sense 



> 6) It seems like your tank stays pretty clear...do you see a need for any additional mechanical filtration?


No, this filter should be able to filter a tank 3000 gallons or better...



> 7) Finally (I think), what turnover rate are you shooting for with the new tank? I assume you are going to upgrade or double up on your pump situation...


Wasn't planning on it  But we'll see how it goes 



> 8) An easy one...eta for the new, completed tank?


Spring  Any more questions? 8)


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## Zack2112

This is awesome. I thought the tank was incredible when you finished it the first time. I cant wait to see how it turns out.


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## lylefk

Perfect, thanks! That helps immensely! I'm working on a 3-d model of the tank plan, I'll post it for your advice when I finish it if you don't mind...it's very similar to your setup...

Thanks again! :thumb:

Lyle


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## maclak

TheFishGuy said:


> Ok, here's a little more of a detailed video of the filtration system  It picks up right where the first one left off.


Hey I have read all of your old 152 1/2 pages and the new one up to page 11 or so. As eveyone else has said you are a great insperation. I too like to do eveything my self even though many of the times it cost more. I also do computer stuff and Imaging on the side. If you ever need computer or digital media help let me know. I am in the process of getting my Digital editing business(many photos) off the gound but would be willing to help some of you out for free :wink: . Feel free to pm me for my contact info. keep up the good work!!!


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks for the kind words 

I've got a couple of video updates on some progress. This weekend I'm going to try and get all the lumber together to get more done.


----------



## maclak

So how are things comming along, you still updating this thread or has it moved?


----------



## Nathan43

I love coming here to drool. Makes me wish I was more into carpentry like i was in highschool. maybe when I have my own garage again. Anyway, I have maybe one of the best questions here. How in the world do you catch a fish in this thing if you need to remove it??? :lol:


----------



## TheFishGuy

I'm still updating here maclak ,the problem is there hasn't been any updates LOL, To busy making Christmas presents...

As for Nathan 43's question... There's actually a couple of different ways. The first way is to introduce a new piece of pipe to the tank. Cichlids are naturally curious and every single cichlid in the tank will take it's turn investigating the new pipe. When the one you want does just net either side :thumb:

For smaller fish, fish traps work well...

For larger fish larger fish traps are used. That's basicly a rubbermaid container witha hole cut in it. Or I'll use a large piece of eggcrate to herd everyone to one end then net who ever I want...

Other than that it's a royal pain in the rectal area. Add into the fact you've got to catch fish from looking down into the tank and not through it... Yeah, it's a blast taking every single piece of decor out to get to the fish you want.... I could go on all day but I'm trying to be a good boy for Santa


----------



## Toby_H

How often do you actually get IN this monster tank yourself? I'm not sure why, but I've always assumed this is how you caught specific fish. Hop in and corner them...


----------



## clgkag

Great idea on the pipe thing. Never thought about it but you are right. everyone has to check it out. I have several fish in a 3ft tall 450 I need to get out and was dreading having to take out all decor. I think I will try this first. :thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

Nope, nevr hopped in and cornered them, I'd be afraid of what they'd do to me :lol:

I've only been in on a few occasions when some of the bigger fish knock loose the 90* elbo that feeds the jets. I took care of that the second time by placing a large rock on the corner...

You might think 80* water would be nice and warm..... it's not.


----------



## Notrevo

TheFishGuy said:


> Other than that it's a royal pain in the rectal area. Add into the fact you've got to catch fish from looking down into the tank and not through it... Yeah, it's a blast taking every single piece of decor out to get to the fish you want....


You are dead right on this...though it is interesting to view the fish from above rather than just through the glass the way we do. I'm about ready to start over with youngsters but will wait until summer...not trying to undertake that effort in the winter


----------



## Cursor

I have a setup of 4 large tanks with a large sump that is in my basement. They are all on a central system that is heated via hydronic heating (hot water heat). It's a simple loop from the hot water heater to a stainless steel heating coil that is in the sump and back to the hot water heater. This setup heats my tanks to 81F without causing any issues. It also oddly enough has lowered my gas bill since the house is heated from the tanks. My total gallonage is somewhere around 1200. So I'm pretty sure this will be a decent way for you to heat your tanks and maybe save you some money. Since you are already in the middle of redoing your setup I thought I would mention it.

Below is a link to where I purchased the stainless steel coil.
Hydronic Heating Coil for Sumps

Also the guy at Jehmco is very knowledgable and I'm sure he could answer any questions you have.

Have a Merry Christmas.


----------



## Toby_H

TheFishGuy said:


> You might think 80* water would be nice and warm..... it's not.


LOL... Yea I learned that lesson with my 300 gal Rubbermaid...

I also thought it was cool when my Oscars nibbled at my toes... until one got a toe in far enough to be pinched in it's grinding plates. OUCH!!!


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## TheFishGuy

Very interesting Cursor, very interesting indeed...


----------



## Cursor

The way the hydronic heating works.. you take your hot water supply and put a hot water recirculating pump near the sump (at least in my case). You have a temperature controller that the hot water recirculating pump is plugged into. The probe from the temp controller is in your sump. The hot water line runs out of the recirculating pump and through the the wall stainless steel coil that is in your sump. This acts as a heat exchanger. The water from the stainless steel tubing is then plumbed into the intake of the hot water heater (the cold water side). This way the hot water heater is receiving not totally cold water to reheat.

When the temp controller says the sump is cold it turns on the recirculating pump and boy do you have some serious heat going through the stainless steel coil. And of course it turns off when the probe meets it's temp.

If you decide to go with this method pm me and I'll go over a few other minor points or gotcha's that I had.

In the end it has been a very good heating arrangement for my 1200 gallon setup. The basement stays at 74F or so and the tanks at 80-81 depending on what I have them set at. The tanks do not flucturate but a partial degree in this setup.

I have also had the raise the temp of the tanks before and it was very easy.

I have a 40 gallon water heater and honestly haven't noticed an issue with having less hot water.

As for why this setup has saved me some money in heating my house. Prior to the tanks coming to this house the house was very dry, so essentially since the tanks act as a fairly significant source of heat for the house and a humidifier you can keep the house comfortable easier due to the tanks acting as a humidifier. Even so, I honestly think this setup may save you money heating the tank and give you better control over the tanks temp in the long run.


----------



## TheFishGuy

I'm very interested in this method, I'll also be getting a new water heater as ours is only a 40 gal and is on it's last leg. I used to be able to do a water change on the 185 and the 240 one after the other, now it barely keeps up with a water change on one... So when I get ready to go shopping for the water heater I'll pm you for more explicit details on what to get.

Is there any reason why I can't use flexible copper as a heat exchanger?


----------



## Cursor

Yes, my research suggested that too much copper would leach into the water column, vs the stainless steel coil I mentioned will not leach anything and will do a fabulous job still.

Originally I thought about using the copper finned tubes as heat exchangers and nixed the idea once I learned that I would leach more copper into the system.

My argument was how much more copper can I leach since all the pipes of the house are copper... the point that was brought to my attention was the copper pipes in the house are not sitting in a closed water system constantly in contact with the water... so although our normal plumbing leaches some, since this plumbing would be in our tank water constantly it would leach more.

Have a great Christmas.


----------



## auratum

Cursor said:


> Yes, my research suggested that too much copper would leach into the water column, vs the stainless steel coil I mentioned will not leach anything and will do a fabulous job still.


The concerns with copper build up might be valid if you never did water changes. If you are doing 30% weekly water changes then this should be of little concern.

Just my $0.02...

Merry Christmas!!!

Patrick


----------



## Cursor

I just went the stainless steel route to be super safe. In the end it wasn't that expensive considering it saves me a great deal of money on heating my tanks.


----------



## auratum

Cursor said:


> I just went the stainless steel route to be super safe. In the end it wasn't that expensive considering it saves me a great deal of money on heating my tanks.


It also gives you a greater level of assurance that you won't end up with fish water in your hot water system!


----------



## auratum

Hey TFG - getting ready to start on my own DIY based on information in your threads and the PM help you have provided. As I mentioned to you, I am planning on a stack of 3 - 8' x 2' x 1.5' tanks. I am planning on 3/4" plywood with 5/16" Hardi stuff. I went to buy the plywood at Lowe's and there are several grades of plywood. I remember reading that you used $berch$ plywood. The $berch$ plywood was more expensive than treated plywood. Why did you choose the $berch$? Did you do this for looks or is $berch$ plywood stronger than pressure treated plywood of similar thickness? I had to spell $berch$ wrong as the site things the correct spelling is a swear word.

Thanks!
Patrick


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## TheFishGuy

I did not end up using b.irtch plywood, I just ended up using 1/2" CDX which was very very cheap, then covering it with hardie panel...


----------



## auratum

Thanks TFG! I just did some reading on grades of plywood thanks to your tip on CDX and feel much better informed to make the right decision!

Thanks!
Patrick


----------



## TheFishGuy

Hi everyone, hereâ€™s some video updates for you, mostly of demo:

Update 4: 




Update 5: 




Update 6: 




As always if thereâ€™s any question feel free to ask and Iâ€™ll try to answer the best I can.


----------



## sirdavidofdiscus

Sounds like you're tearing it all down and starting over. Are you still plannig ao leaving any of the orginal structure?


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## TheFishGuy

The framing is going to stay, I'm just going to make a couple of changes to it to make sure the back and front bottom seams never split ever again...


----------



## TheFishGuy

Iâ€™ve got another quick up date, well itâ€™s more so all of you can feel my painâ€¦ LOL











I also got all the framing material today from Mentor Lumber, Rick was able to help out Monster Fish Rescue by giving the material pretty much at cost. They didnâ€™t make any money, but they didnâ€™t lose any eitherâ€¦ Itâ€™s been a tough year for everyone so I didnâ€™t want them to lose money on me. I was also able to order the hardie panel today too. It should be in Friday or Monday. Roughly $600 so far for this repair/addition. Iâ€™ll know an exact amount when my bill comesâ€¦

Iâ€™m hoping tomorrow will be a productive day for this project. If I can get everything framed by Monday then Iâ€™ll be able to start installing the hardie right away! Atleast soon weâ€™ll all be able to see the shape of the tank!


----------



## TheFishGuy

Hereâ€™s what got done todayâ€¦.

Up date 9 




Up date 10 




It took an hour and twenty minutes to clean the second pane of glass. A nerve racking hour and twenty minutesâ€¦

It took three hours to frame the floor of the addition. The â€œsleepersâ€


----------



## auratum

TFG - Great updates!

I have some more questions...

1) You have indicated you are going to Pond Armor vs. Drylock. I am just wanting to confirm that you did not see a failure of the drylock, but you are seeing the Pond Armor as a more suitable material as you look to re-do your monster tank?

2) Based on your material list, it sounds like you plan to use plywood covered with Hardi Panel, and sealed Pond Armor?

3) With your "deep end" addition - are you going to have a short wall where this transitions to the deep section to slow the fish from moving all the substrate from the existing part of the tank into the deep end? It just seems like if you didn't have a small rise then the sand would migrate with the fish helping.

4) Isn't the deep end over the top of your floor drain? How are you setting up the filter and drains? I know you love to make diagrams!

Thanks!
Patrick


----------



## Aalelan

Wow!!! expanding it out! I plan on getting my liner boards all drylocked this weekend and maybe start putting them in next weekend.. Then I just need to order the glass!! Still not sure what I want to try to get yet 4' of water deep is a lot to hold back.. Keep up the good work and I'm going to stay tuned to your updates!


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## TheFishGuy

auratum said:


> TFG - Great updates!


Thanks 



> I have some more questions...


Ok 



> 1) You have indicated you are going to Pond Armor vs. Drylock. I am just wanting to confirm that you did not see a failure of the drylock, but you are seeing the Pond Armor as a more suitable material as you look to re-do your monster tank?


True, the drylok was not the issue... Pond armor is made for this though... Smaller tanks I'd have no issues using drylok...



> 2) Based on your material list, it sounds like you plan to use plywood covered with Hardi Panel, and sealed Pond Armor?


Yep Yep 



> 3) With your "deep end" addition - are you going to have a short wall where this transitions to the deep section to slow the fish from moving all the substrate from the existing part of the tank into the deep end? It just seems like if you didn't have a small rise then the sand would migrate with the fish helping.


If I've got any silicone left I plan to silicone rocks there to make a wall for the substrate... Which is going to be gravel this time...



> 4) Isn't the deep end over the top of your floor drain? How are you setting up the filter and drains? I know you love to make diagrams!


Nope, the drain is under the original back wall!  Scematic coming soon!



> Thanks!
> Patrick


You're welcome, Jonathan 

Awesome Aalelan!


----------



## travis2k

sure, just as I almost finish my tank, you have to expand yours :x

Just kidding, now i can show the wife, and say "see the fish guy has a 1600 gallon tank" , then find a different spot for the 700 Im building now (should be test filling this weekend)
:dancing:

I had asked you some questions about glass a long time back, and read through most of your threads, love the videos too.

Just wanted to say thanks for all the great info, although seeing you tear yours apart makes me nervous as all heck.

One question, why are you going with gravel instead of sand, Im thinking of sand for mine, so wondering what your reason was

thanks again for your inspiration and contributions

ps I am going to pick up some silicone remover in the next week, I cant remember the name now, but it works awesome (some natural non chemical stuff), I'll post the name when I pick some up (not sure if you want the glass cleaner than it is, but ..)


----------



## TheFishGuy

I'll be using acetone to clean the glass, it's worked for me in the past 

The sand was cloging the prefilter pads too much... And I'm not paying for sand anymore just to watch it get rinsed out of the pads.... :lol:

Don't be nervous, it was my fault this tank leaked, not dryloks!

I made some pretty good headway today, 99% of the framing is done. Just seven small pieces to put in and I can start sheeting! 
All the braces under the floor sheeting were installed.
Holes were drilled in the scribed floor joists under the addition.
The floor sheeting was installed and the walls framed.
I also figured out how many gallons of water the tank will holdâ€¦

1457.01 gallons! The sump will also have water in it but I havenâ€™t made a 100% decision on the sump yet. Itâ€™s got to be quite large in order for it to not run dry before it gets fed. Iâ€™m thinking about 175 gallons or 200 gallons should do it.

Hereâ€™s a short videoâ€¦






Thanks for looking!


----------



## travis2k

I made mine using several coats of resin ( I think polyester) and 1 layer of fibreglass matting in there, then a few layers of gelcoat on top, so a different sealant.

I also did my construciton a little different, building the plywood box first, then attaching the 2x4 walls to it (the sheet of plywood on the bottom was made 7" wider to put the 2x4 walls onto and is a single sheet of wood)

The plywood walls are glued and screwed together as well as held in by the 2x4's,

for the lid I built a plywood frame and wrapped it in pond liner and will sit glass in that (should be tight fit for water and gives me quite a bit of plywood bracing across the center of the tank)

but the end product looks pretty similar to yours, two windows and all but only 8' long
I have the same shower drain in the back about 2/3 of the way up, and one about 1/3 of the way up, but Im hoping the filter sand I have is heavy enough, not to get sucked in, I only have a couple bags and will use some in the filter anyways, so before i go buy more,

how much sand did you lose to the filters?

sorry for the long post and slight thread jacking,
Wow yours is coming along fast, and thats a nice size, should be able to house a lot of rescued fish

for a sump Im grabbing some 45 gallon blue barrels used for shippinh food, a guy here sells them for $30 a piece, if you can find something like that, could work great, you could probably even stack them, and way cheaper than anything else I've found and trusted to hold water


----------



## bell

wow......i didn't even see this thread.......great stuff john


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## auratum

Thanks for the answers to questions and the progress is looking good!!!

Are you planning to silicone the Hardi panel or just glue it in and coat with Pond Armor?

Thanks!
Patrick


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## imusuallyuseless

Making me jealous again...

Good work gramps :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

Travis, The last filter was three 44 gallon drums, two of which were crushed under the weight of sand that was removed the first time the tank leaked... Then I decided to just use a wood box with pond liner. This time it's going to be something totally different that I've been wanting to do for quite some time... News on that in a bit... I do understand your build, I'm just going with what I know from framing experience and then doing a little overkill :lol:

Thanks Bell  I was posting this in the CA folder on an existing thread then I decided to split it and move it here... Incidently your oscars are going to love this tank, so will your silver dollars :thumb: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: Oh yeah, and that giant pleco which is over 20" now! :lol: That thing is still one of the best cleaners for being a huge pleco, he's not going anywhere!

auratum, I'm just going to liquid nails it again, seeing as it was a pain in the arse to remove it should work just fine again! :lol:

imusuallyuseless, you're just still a useless little boy...... And you hit the nail right on the head as to why I'm making this bigger... just to make you lose sleep not having something like this :dancing: :dancing: :dancing: :lol:


----------



## bell

cool man, i was wondering about the pleco......i've got some pics of when he was about 1" long when i brought him home, i'll get them posted tomorrow.....same with the O's 

are you going to roundover the lip where it goes to the deep section?


----------



## RyanR

Man, you should put a little window on the side of the deep section: When big brother isn't watching, fish may hatch a scheme to unionize. You don't want that! :lol:

So is it pond armor, then silicone the seams once in place?

Very fun to watch the progress! Thanks for sharing!

-Ryan


----------



## TheFishGuy

That'd be cool bell  No, I'm not going to round it over but it will be covered with siliconed in place stones for added protection, and as a "wall" to stop the substrate...

Ryan, It's just pond armor and that's it. No silicone. The only silicone I'll use is on the bulkheads and for the glass. The corners will be reinforced with fiberglass mesh.


----------



## travis2k

wow, you managed to crush one of those things? the plastic is super thick.

Ya i have very little framing experience, I worked at a truss plant for a while, and dads a carpenter, so I took the tiny amount I knew of framing, and tried to overdo, I'm sure there must be several thousand screws in there by now

I should be turning on the hose in the next couple hours, wish me luck

you stil sticking with SA/Ca cichlids for this mostly?


----------



## TheFishGuy

Everything that came out will be going back in.


----------



## imusuallyuseless

TheFishGuy said:


> imusuallyuseless, you're just still a useless little boy...... And you hit the nail right on the head as to why I'm making this bigger... just to make you lose sleep not having something like this :dancing: :dancing: :dancing: :lol:


I knew it!!! The world does revolve around me 8) 8) 8)

Anywhoo, Thanks for all the vids. Been showing the wife. Hopefully it'll soften her up for the 240-300G I plan to start in the next month or so :thumb:


----------



## auratum

Shameless bump - updates?!?!?!?!?


----------



## bell

baby pic of the pleco, about an inch and a half.....he had some great young colors......









about 6"....









yea where you at J ?


----------



## TheFishGuy

Well, I didn't get anything done on the tank this past weekend due to conflicting sceduals...

but hereâ€™s update #12

Link:





Embeded:


----------



## TheFishGuy

The sheeting is done! Next is cutting holes in it where the bulkheads are going to be. The reason Iâ€™m doing that is because last time there was barely enough thread on the shower drains to make a good seal. Iâ€™m going to make the holes slightly larger than the nut for the bulkhead, this way Iâ€™m only dealing with the thickness of the hardie panel and pond armor. And yes, I plan to silicone in the bulkheads this time. Last time I did not. I might go get the hardie panel tomorrow and the two sheets of plywood to make the sump tank. The sump tank will be made out of Â¾â€


----------



## bell

good stuff.....starting to take shape


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## TheFishGuy

Thanks dude!


----------



## 98dsol

WOW thats gonna be a nice tank! Looks like your are doing a great job on it! :thumb: 
Why are you lining the tank with hardie board? Shouldn't the pond armor seal off the wood from the water? From the little I know about resin, it should adhere very well directly to the plywood. You might be able to save some $$.


----------



## imusuallyuseless

Looks great :thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

98dsol said:


> WOW thats gonna be a nice tank! Looks like your are doing a great job on it! :thumb:
> Why are you lining the tank with hardie board? Shouldn't the pond armor seal off the wood from the water? From the little I know about resin, it should adhere very well directly to the plywood. You might be able to save some $$.


I'm following pond armors reccomendations... I thought the same thing...


----------



## schlambambel

Hi FishGuy asked this on another forum that you posted but nhere it is again. Hvery impressed with what you've done. Just have a couple of questions. Why didn't you use PT plywood? I'm guessing maybe the seepage of chemicals. Did you frame it 16 OC? How big and the cost of the glass. sorry for being redundant


----------



## TheFishGuy

I didn't use treated plywood because the tank is getting lined with hardie panel ,then sealed with pond armor. Water sould never get to the plywood... An the studs are 1' oc. for the most part. The short walls on the addition are 10"oc.

As for the cost of glass... I got it two and a half years ago during the build of the 800... it was at a price that was too good to be true... I'll put it to you this way... It's now what you know it's who you know  Basicly $100 a piece... They're 72"x30"x3/4" WAY overkill......


----------



## schlambambel

thaks for the info seen reply on other forum


----------



## schlambambel

thaks for the info seen reply on other forum


----------



## steelblue77

Amazing work! I can't wait to the see the finished tank. The L-shape and deeper portion should allow for some interesting behaviors in the fish.

Big :thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

I'm interested to see if my predictions happen. I know of certain fish that will stay down ther, but I also know certain fish will strictly go down there to spawn.... We'll see


----------



## steelblue77

TheFishGuy said:


> I know of certain fish that will stay down ther, but I also know certain fish will strictly go down there to spawn.... We'll see


The break in the line-of-sight should certainly help with that. I suppose the establishment of territories will play a big role in it.

BTW, love the youtube updates. Glad to see I'm not the only one to ever frame up around a full (and heavy) garbage can. :lol:


----------



## theanimalman

This has got to be one of the best DIY, ongoing, changing, interactive, full of photos and video and tons of Q & A thread of all time. Thank you for keeping it going.

I've been following this thread from about page 40 on the original thread. Tons of great information. Tons of great pics and video. Tons of answered questions and feedback. You don't see that on alot of other threads.

I'm really excited to see how the remainder of the expansion goes. Wishing you the best.

Looking forward to the fiberglass, epoxy and glass going back in. Can't wait for filling day.

Excuse me is this has been asked already. With the tank size doubling are you also planning on doubling the amount of fish in the tank?


----------



## TheFishGuy

As for doubling the fish.... They're already doubling in size so..... That and whatever needs rescued....

And thank you for the very kind words! I might just put that all in my signature! LOL That was awesome... I feel my head swelling... no wait... that's the beer...

So I promised everyone an update by Thursday, the only thing I really got done was four out of seven sheets of hardie panel installed. Tomorrow hopefully the rest of it will get doneâ€¦ Weâ€™ve got a party Saturday, Iâ€™ve got work Sunday and three days next week so not much is going to get done again for a whileâ€¦ I hate workâ€¦ It gets in the way of the things I really want to do! LOL

Hereâ€™s some pictures:

The hardie has been glued to the floor with liquid nails:










This is showing one of the preliminary holes thatâ€™s cut for one of the bulkheads:










This is a picture of two dogs and a cat:


----------



## bell

i think that cat just escaped from jail.......better call the cops


----------



## TheFishGuy

:lol: :lol: :lol: He reminds me of the cat from Alice in Wonderland when he wears those pjs and crawls up on the back of the couch :lol:


----------



## blueinfinity

yay. getting closer


----------



## TheFishGuy

Here it is, up date 14!





Nothing exciting really, but for those of you that do not have speakers hereâ€™s a summary:

1.)	The hardie is going in slow due to waiting for it to dry before the next piece can be put in.
2.)	The pump and unions have been ordered for the radiant heating system. They will be in this week.
3.)	Most of the plumbing has been purchased for the radiant heating system.
4.)	The Pond Armor has been ordered!
5.)	The temperature controller arrived today too!
6.)	The basement is a mess.
7.)	I wish I had more time to get this thing done.
8.)	If I had hair Iâ€™d be pulling it out.
9.)	Iâ€™m tired.


----------



## Aalelan

The video does not appear to work.. I even went to your youtube page and could not find it..

could you explain this a little:


> 3.) Most of the plumbing has been purchased for the radiant heating system.


I have not done anything for heating yet so If i can get a better idea i will do that.. :lol:

Thanks and looking good!!!


----------



## theanimalman

It appears the video name may be a duplicate?


----------



## TheFishGuy

Sorry about the non working videoâ€¦ youtube insisted that the first time I uploaded it failed. They even asked me if I wanted to try it againâ€¦ So I did. It said it was successful so I postedâ€¦ Then all of a sudden they said it was a duplicate! &@[email protected]%#$

Thatâ€™s ok, I forgot to post the pictures I took of the bracing LOL So hereâ€™s the pictures:




























And hereâ€™s one from today:










And hereâ€™s the videoâ€¦ hopefully LOL






As for the heating... I'll be using the water from my water heater for the house. It will circulate through 50' of pipe going through the sump. The pump that will circulate the hot water (135*) will be operated by a temperature controler


----------



## sirdavidofdiscus

Still not getting the video.


----------



## herny

great work man and the vid worked for me


----------



## Howler33

Wow...simply amazing bro, I am amazed at your perseverence and your wife's tolerance. I am sure all the sweat and long nights will be worth it when you are kicking back in your chair with a brew next to your monster tank. Keep up the awesome work!


----------



## TheFishGuy

Dave, I'm not sure why the vid won't work for you.. here it is again:





Thanks herny 

Oh Howler33, there' going to be many a beer drunk during the first fill and test of the sump... Many... My only hope is that the sump is large enough... if not I'm going to be bumbed...

As for my wifes tolorance... Seriously... no doubt, that woman deserves an award... =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
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=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> 
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>


----------



## bell

if you need another large container for the sump i could get my friend christian to donate a couple 55 gallon barrels for sump duty (he's in akron), they are plastic and work great, mine was in service for about 2 years and was flawless 
search my "diy pvc overflow" thread for pics.....


----------



## dwarfpike

I know the tank is **** and all, and *TFG* isn't a bad looking guy ... but why are all the related videos James Bond related?!?!?!?!?!? :-?


----------



## TheFishGuy

It's simple... Bond does the impossible... and so do I! LOL not bad looking eh? Hmmnnn... I feel my head swelling.... :lol:


----------



## dwarfpike

Well, deffinately no Sean Connery though!!!! :thumb: :lol:


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## herny

yea your wife does man and i want to do some thing like this when i get my own house but idk about that big lol


----------



## TheFishGuy

dwarfpike said:


> Well, deffinately no Sean Connery though!!!! :thumb: :lol:


He is the man! I'll agree with you there! My wife likes the Rock... She says he's yummy :lol:

And here's a vid from today


----------



## dwarfpike

TheFishGuy said:


> He is the man! I'll agree with you there! My wife likes the Rock... She says he's yummy :lol:


Heh. Luckily my girl prefers girly men like Johnny Depp!!! At least luckily for my scrawny behind!!! :lol:

I love the video updates btw. I followed the orginal thread of course (it's how/why I found this site from ultimate bettas) but I couldn't follow some of the instructions because I am not carpentry inclined at all. Hearing the explainations goes a long way in aiding in, at least my, comprehension. :thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

I'm glad they're helping, that was my hope... you know it's just hard to put things into print sometimes... so much easier to just say it


----------



## Leviathan64

" Hearing the explainations goes a long way in aiding in, at least my, comprehension. " :thumb:

I have three words for you. Silence is golden! :lol:


----------



## TheFishGuy

So are you saying you'd rather not hear my wonderful voice? Then you're gonna hate this next video that's uploading! :lol: I should have up date 16 posted tonite


----------



## TheFishGuy

Up date #16

You can either watch this:




Or read this:

First off, the Pondarmor is here! Here and under strict orders to acclimate for a day. The cans were submerged in hot water for an hour then theyâ€™ll sit until tomorrow late morning when weâ€™ll start doing the seams! Sunday morning weâ€™ll go over the whole thing looking for touch ups, which according to Butch weâ€™ll have some. The bummer is Iâ€™ve got a side job to do Monday and Tuesday. So the glass wonâ€™t get put in till Wednesdayâ€¦

Also, the circulating pump is here and installed for the heating systemâ€¦ Along with a â€œTâ€


----------



## herny

i think your voice is brilliant lol 2 to Morgan Freemon


----------



## TheFishGuy

:lol: :lol: :lol: Should a do a penguin video next?! :lol:

Thanks


----------



## mok3t

Man I'd LOVE to build something like that. Thought with that sheer quantity of water I'd need permission from the water board to fill it once I've built it as it would be classed as a reservoir lol.

Awesome work TFG. Keep us posted, been checking this daily now for updates. Awesome to see it coming along.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks, yeah I'm actually going to call the water dept because they offer a once a year "pool fill" at a discounted rate... So I'm going to see if they'll do it for me for the test fill :lol:


----------



## Howler33

Earlier in this topic you mentioned that one of the reasons you feel the first tank failed was because of walking around the perimeter. I know you have added spans between the joists to support the edges of the plywood but, have you considered constructing a separate ledge around the back that would solely be for you to walk on while servicing the tank? Seems like a tight fit now with the new addition but having a ledge several feet off the ground may help if you need to access the deep end.


----------



## bell

his problem iirc was that the bottom hardi panel was not glued into place and something shifted when he walked on it, now that every panel is glued (liquid nail.....strong stuff ) he won't have any problems imo


----------



## TheFishGuy

You're correct bell... And as for the "catwalk" there's going to be something I'm walking on... The sump! :lol:


----------



## steelblue77

Can't wait for the next video update! Pond Armor!

opcorn:


----------



## TheFishGuy

You don't have to wait long!






What do you think of the color? My wife loves it!


----------



## illy-d

TheFishGuy said:


> You don't have to wait long!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What do you think of the color? My wife loves it!


That colour ROCKS!!! Once you have the water in there with the lights and such that will give incredible depth to the tank...


----------



## RyanR

Pretty fantasmic! :thumb:

The color is awesome. You'll have to share your opinions on Pond Armor once you get some rest! 

Thanks for keeping us in the loop on this great project. Better than most TV shows. :lol:

-Ryan


----------



## steelblue77

Excellent color choice. I was just at the Pond Armor site and wondering if the Competition Blue would look nice in an aquarium. It adds a sense of depth. Very nice.

How did the fiber-glass strips go up for you? Did it stay in place on the vertical seams alright? Oh, and was there any smell in such a confined area? I know it is non-toxic, but thought it might still have a smell as it cures.

:thumb:


----------



## Howler33

Well done on the color choice; I like it better than the light aqua green you had before. You should get a nice ripple effect from the lights to give the tank a deep sea feeling.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Cool! I like the color/colour too! My wife really really likes it. she can't wait to see Bob in the tank :lol: Bob is our Robertsoni... As for the smell... there really wasn't any... I mean... I wasn't sure what it was going to be like but there's less smell than latex paint! I really dif this stuff... Only thing is i think I put it on too thick... I've only got one batch left to do touch ups... But there's not too many of those... I've already done a pretty good inspection of it and the touch ups won't take long at all... Now i'm really bumbed that I won't be able to get the glass and plumbing in till Wednesday :? But I suppose I'll have to work in order to pay the bills :roll:

Do you guys have any idea how badly I want to get water in this thing?!? I've got to stay focused though and finish all the stuff that needs finishing before I go filling the thing... I need to finish getting the ceiling buttoned up and sealed for moisture and get the top bracing in...

Thanks again for the feedback! and if anyone gets anything from pond armor be sure to tell Butch I sent you!


----------



## bell

awesome tfg........i always like the darker blues


----------



## TheFishGuy

Cool, I'm glad people like it  We really like it! Someone pointed out an image of Jesus in this latest video... If you pause at 59 seconds you can see it perfectly.... Crazy stuff... Should I sell the tank on ebay? :lol:


----------



## steelblue77

TheFishGuy said:


> Someone pointed out an image of Jesus in this latest video... If you pause at 59 seconds you can see it perfectly.... Crazy stuff... Should I sell the tank on ebay? :lol:


Only if it starts bleeding. :lol:


----------



## TheFishGuy

:lol: :lol: :lol: I actually laughed out loud... just thought I'd point that out :lol:


----------



## sirdavidofdiscus

Love that color. If you need more muscle with the glass I'm free most of the week.


----------



## TheFishGuy

I might take you up on that! I'm also considering doing it Monday evening now... I lost the brakes on my truck so it's a perfect excuse to put off that side job for a day :lol:


----------



## sirdavidofdiscus

Unfortunately Mon and Wed evening's I'm not available. Also Day Thurs. during the day.


----------



## Morpheus

Looks amazing! Just wondering, how do you apply the pond armor?


----------



## imusuallyuseless

Looks good. Nice work gramps :drooling:


----------



## klumsyninja

Whoa! you really can see Jesus in your pond armor... dude that could very well be a good omen.

The color looks great and the sheer awesomeness of that tank is profound.. dude, you're *so* cool.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks everyone... Klumsyninja thinks I'm cool useless... And I'm not allowed to be a grandpa for atleast ten years! :lol:

Upon request I did a little informational video seriesâ€¦ If you ever plan to work with Pond armor this might help you get together some of the things youâ€™ll needâ€¦ The first three vids are about 5 min each, the last one is a quick snippetâ€¦ As for progress on the tankâ€¦ I wired the temperature controller in and tested it along with the pumpâ€¦ The pex is going to work just fine to heat up the water! It gets hot FAST! Everything works as it should! Iâ€™m looking fore ward to see it in action!
I was also able to get out and get the fittings and pipe for the filterâ€¦ Hopefully Iâ€™ll be able to work on that this afternoonâ€¦ Weâ€™ll seeâ€¦

Well, hereâ€™s videos 18-21 if youâ€™re interested to see pond armor getting installed.

18-	



19-	



20-	



21-


----------



## illy-d

Nice updates... I'm a Southpaw as well... Medical experts agree that everyone is actually born _right_ handed, and only the _gifted _overcome it.


----------



## steelblue77

Thanks for the info on the pond armor. That stuff is thicker than I would think. But, it looks like it cures to a very durable surface. And I love the tip with the can opener! Never thought of doing that. I hate those lips. They make it so hard to pour neatly.

Now for the glass! opcorn:


----------



## bell

cool stuff......i can't believe you painted over Jesus' face


----------



## TheFishGuy

I agree illy-d! :lol:

You're welcome steelblue, as for the glass... hopefully wed nite... hopefully... We'l see...

And Mr. Bell, I'm probably going to go to he.ll now......................... :?

Hey! I got the bulkheads installed this evening but then had some other things to do so that's all I got done today... hopefully if the day isn't too long tomorrow I'll get some plumbing done for the filter! That's going to be a fun video... You guys will get to see what it's like to belly crawl under the tank! LOL


----------



## TheBanker

its like watching diy network Fish aquarium edition. i think your build is great.


----------



## TheFishGuy

:lol: Thank you


----------



## auratum

Awesome amatuer film work! I appreciate you sharing the gory details - helps the rest of us understand what and how you did it.

Great job! :thumb:


----------



## Morpheus

You should have filmed the entire thing and sold DVD's of the entire process start to finish. A new DVD would arrive every month. Hey, if it works for Time Warner, why not TheFishGuy? I'm just saying.

By the way, my arms got sore just watching you scoop the pond armor out of the can.


----------



## TheFishGuy

:lol: Maybe i'll make a DVD when it's done, then sell em for $19.95

BUT WAIT! THERE'S MORE!

Act now and you get a second DVD with more fun things to do with big fish!

shipping and handling apply to both videos and is $300 per video but I'm saying this so fast and it's written so small that no one will notice the extra $600 billed to their credit card


----------



## bell

TheFishGuy said:


> shipping and handling apply to both videos and is $300 per video but I'm saying this so fast and it's written so small that no one will notice the extra $600 billed to their credit card


LOL


----------



## TheFishGuy

You like that? :lol: Hey bell, didn't you say you had some west systems stuff?


----------



## Howler33

Excellent job on the instructional video. Pond Armor should pay you to use the videos on their site.

Too bad the mixture is so thick otherwise you could just spray it on in several coats.


----------



## bell

i have 2 gallons of sweetwater epoxy, one gallon is lt grey, the other is dark blue......they are still in storage, i'm hoping to get to that box this weekend (it's buried in the garage LOL) as i'm selling a bunch of porsche parts and need to get into a few of the surrounding boxes 
i'll let you know once i get them out.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Howler33 said:


> Excellent job on the instructional video. Pond Armor should pay you to use the videos on their site.
> 
> Too bad the mixture is so thick otherwise you could just spray it on in several coats.


The reason it was too thick was because I didn't add denatured alcohol to thin it... Apparently the colder the material is the thicker it is... so it was my bad... But I don't mind the thickness... just more insurance!

Sweet bell! get digging!


----------



## TheFishGuy

Hereâ€™s what got done last nightâ€¦ The first video I took was too long for youtube so I had to do it over again and make two and they just recently finished uploadingâ€¦ My sincerest apologies for the delayâ€¦

Up date # 22 




Up date # 23 




As Iâ€™m typing this a video is uploading to youtube from what got done todayâ€¦ You wonâ€™t be disappointed when that gets posted!


----------



## bell

great vids john 
plumbing is fun


----------



## theanimalman

Great job on the plumbing. Good thing you aren't Claustrophobic.

The auction sounds really fun. I wish I would have known about it when I lived out there.

Good luck putting the glass in. Can't wait to see that.


----------



## steelblue77

Great drain setup. I made lots of mental notes for my dream tank. Those rescued monsters are gonna be very happy.

:thumb: :thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

steelblue77 said:


> Great drain setup. I made lots of mental notes for my dream tank. Those rescued monsters are gonna be very happy.
> 
> :thumb: :thumb:


Well, you don't need mental notes! Just revisit the videos!  Thanks for the compliments guys... I hope you enjoy this as well!....


----------



## RyanR

Great stuff!

The "underneath" video had a Blair Witch Project feel to it! :lol:

Where'd you find that sweeeeet piece of driftwood?

I'm just fascinated by this project. Thanks again for sharing it with us.

-Ryan


----------



## TheFishGuy

That sweet piece of driftwood is a plastic resin mold! I've got two of them  And thank you Ryan, and.... You're welcome!  My hope is that I might be able to help someone by thinking of something they didn't when they get ready to build their tank... My other hope was that people would help me think of something I may have missed!


----------



## Zack2112

Im loving the videos. "ill see you tomorrow afternoon with water in it, hehe. maybe." hahahah. I dont like the sound of maybe! I wanna see it now! I cant believe how quickly these last stages have come along. Great work, I cant wait to see it full!

Thanks for posting all of this.


----------



## sirdavidofdiscus

If you fill it Fri. and go to auction Sat. You shouldn't need the decrorations till Sun. It's supposed to be warm this weekend. Maybe the snow will melt. Too bad I could have helped you with the glass Thrus. afternoon.


----------



## Morpheus

You da man!


----------



## TheFishGuy

I know there was people willing to help... but I never know what's going to happen around here... To be honest, the hardest part was getting over and through the front... After that it was pretty easy...

5 hours and counting! Anyone is welcome to come on over to see it fill... But I've got to be leaving here by 5:45 to go to an OCA meeting LOL So I hope it fills fast! LOL


----------



## theanimalman

Fantastic progress. Can't wait to see it filled now.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks! IT'S FULL!! And no leaks! I've got to leave here in an hour and a half so hopefully I can get my wonderful wife to post the videos of the fill... They're uploading to you tube now... :dancing: :dancing: :dancing:


----------



## Morpheus

Congratulations Jonathon!! Can't wait for the vids.


----------



## steelblue77

I found update #27: 




I'm way too impatient, I know.


----------



## theanimalman

It better not leak while you are at the auction.

How long are you going to let it sit full of water before adding fish? I guess you need to finish the filter first...

A thought I had about the deep end of the tank. The fact that you won't be able to see below the ledge. What about putting a couple of small mirrors in the top corners of the tank, near the surface, to see down into the deep end? Or some variation of that idea?


----------



## bell

i think we need an underwater web cam


----------



## steelblue77

bell said:


> i think we need an underwater web cam


Agreed.


----------



## Turtlemaxxx

A little underwater camera strapped to a little R/C submarine!! Then give guided tours from inside the tank 

-matt


----------



## blueinfinity

video removed? NOOOOOOOOO


----------



## dwarfpike

Turtlemaxxx said:


> A little underwater camera strapped to a little R/C submarine!! Then give guided tours from inside the tank
> 
> -matt


That would so rock!!!! We need to start a collection so *TFG* can get them!!!


----------



## Zack2112

dwarfpike said:


> Turtlemaxxx said:
> 
> 
> 
> A little underwater camera strapped to a little R/C submarine!! Then give guided tours from inside the tank
> 
> -matt
> 
> 
> 
> That would so rock!!!! We need to start a collection so *TFG* can get them!!!
Click to expand...

I totally agree. It would be awesome. This reminds me of a link i had saved on my old computer. Im gonna have to find it. It was a link to a live feed webcam at an aquarium somewhere with manatees. It was cool, you could visit it anytime and watch the tank. I think something like that should be set up on here. Better yet, install a few around the tank and then set up a webpage like that other. That way we can switch between cameras and get a live feed of the tank at all times. hahaha that would be so cool.


----------



## Howler33

There are over 48,000 memebers on this site and I think most would pay .99 cents a month to have a live feed TFG tank webcam. We could completely fund his next tank which would be a gallon for each member on the forum, then he could charge admission to the 48,000 gallon monster. Next he could do scuba tours into the tank while saving up for the ultra monster 100,000 gallon amazon river with viewing tunnels. Of course at that point he would have to up the webcam to $9.99/month but, it would be worth it. :lol:

OK, maybe all that won't happen but, it would be cool to see an underwater webcam.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Woa woa woa people... relax... I am working on a web cam, but that'll be our little secret... but I've got some good news and bad news... The bad news is the tank leaked... The good news is I know why and it can easily be fixed... Only trouble is I filled the thing (two hours and twenty minutes) and I had to empty it an hour later... Now that's not why the video was removed. The video was removed because youtube said a few videos had errors??? How that's possible I'm not sure... but I'm back from the OCA Winter auction and I'll get it figured out... Boy is it a pain in the rear to post videos... I'm exhausted...

Aside from that I came home with a handfull of rarities and a few favorites... didn't spend very much but I'm happy...

And bell, this message is for you. Your oscars are now residing at a master breeders home where he plans to spawn them. Actually if he spawns them then he's promoted to master breeder status. He's going to give the two back to me after his successful spawn along with a SLEW of fry. Now in a cichlid club in order to get credit for a spawn you have to raise the fry to atleast an inch... So if you want some fry you'd better get some tanks up! :thumb:


----------



## illy-d

Sorry to hear about the leak. I wish you a speedy fix.


----------



## Mussin

Looking forward to some vids and pics of the new monster with fish in it!

Awesome Project...

Jeremy


----------



## bell

bad news about the leak......details?

good news about the O's......i'm getting ready to build my stand, been tied up with a few other projects recently......


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Wow...missed the leak and the need for a rebuild until I saw a post on my local fish forum from TheFishGuy. Can't miss out on this!


----------



## illy-d

Hey Jonathon - any updates? I'm hoping for good news...


----------



## TheFishGuy

Hi folks,
First off, Iâ€™m sorry I have not posted lately. My heart has not been in it. I did fill the tank last Friday and everything was fine. An hour later I discovered a major leak and had to drain the tank. The leak was caused by a spot in the pond armor where a piece of fiberglass was left and a bubble of air was trapped behind the pond armor and burst under the pressure thus creating a crack in the pond armor on the floor of the tank. Another leak was discovered in the plumbing and was easily fixed. Actually Iâ€™m kind of embarrassed about that because I knew doing it that it was going to be risky. Both the crack and bubble were fixed with very little effort and the tank was again filled Monday night. The weekend was too busy to do it any earlier. This morning I woke to find the tank about an inch and a half low. There seems to be an issue with the floor of the deep end but I have yet to drain the last three inches out of the deep end and clean it to inspect. Iâ€™m feeling a bit defeated at the moment so I apologize for the lack of posting. One thing that did lift my spirits was finding out from the water company that it only costs $12.30 to fill the tank. So Iâ€™m not feeling so bad wasting the water.

The plan is to work on finding the issue tomorrow and solving it then filling Wednesday morning. Hopefully I will have good news Wednesday evening. Third timeâ€™s a charm!

Thank you for following the thread and for all the moral support.

Jonathan

Ps This is a â€œcopy and pasteâ€


----------



## 2wheelsx2

Good luck with getting it fixed up and going.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thank you


----------



## xwolfiex

I actually found this forum when i googled something that had nothing to do with fish...but was directed to your original 150+ page thread...lol and 4 days later.....I was hooked again. I had oscars and dempsys long ago. but reading your thread, and then 3 more weeks of reading all i could on these forums, has me hooked again. Your epic story, was a huge part of it, so I wish you all the best, in getting this up and running.

joe


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks Joe, you're the second person in a week that's told me it was essentially because of that thread why they got back into it  Not to sound corny but that post made me feel really good. Thank you


----------



## bell

don't let the leak get you down man.......you'll get it sealed up, and plumbing always leaks the first time around.....were you able to pinpoint where the loss was coming from with the pipes?


----------



## Maddog

man, this is [email protected]! don;t think about leaks, think about the sense of accomplishment when it;s done and your babies are swimming aroudn in there!

Nothing worth doing is easy!

koodos to making this far already, and

CHIN UP< finish it!

cheers bud


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks fellas, I do have some good news. It's not as bad as I thought it would be. The entire tank has been wiped down and dried up and while wiping it down I found plenty of spots where you could still see raw hardie panel, so I'll be mixing up small batches of pondarmor to fix those... Apparently my eyes were shut when I did the first inspection! LOL


----------



## Howler33

Glad to read that the fix is simple. Sometimes you just need to take a step back from a large project and get a fresh look.


----------



## illy-d

Sometimes I'll buy lotto tickets when the estimated winning amount gets really high... Then I like to fantasize about all the things I would do with the winnings. I won't bore you with all of the details but I will say that ever since you first started this project back in the day one of the things on my to do list is to go to Ohio and see the tank for myself in person while enjoying a beer or 12 in your company.

I, like a lot of people live vicariously through your tank. The ups, the downs, the struggles and the successes resonate within me and I can't really explain why... The good news is I don't have to explain it because I'm pretty sure that everyone that has followed your 'journey' knows exactly what I mean.

We are your Sherpas and the summit is in sight... So when you feel overwhelmed know that we are with you in spirit. Keep going!!!


----------



## TheFishGuy

Howler33 said:


> Glad to read that the fix is simple. Sometimes you just need to take a step back from a large project and get a fresh look.


Funny you say that... I talked with Butch (From pond armor) and he said the same thing. He also brought up a good point. when you're staring at one color all the time, your mind tends to fill in the spots I missed with blue. Kind of like blind spots when you look at the sun...

And Illy-D, what can I say... Thank you. Thank you very much. 

The way things are going around here it doesn't look like I'll be getting much done today... I woukld have liked to test fill tonite but now it's not going to be till the late morning tomorrow... Then I've got french doors to install on Friday along with trimming a room out... My hope is this pig holds water through all that time and the weekend, then come monday I can gladly drain it, seal everything I want to, get the sump in the roomm ake some lids, decorate and get some fish back in this thing... Then I can start on the fish room and get that cleaned up and rebuilt... I'm having surgery at the begining of march, then it's more than likely back to work, so I've got to get this thing done!


----------



## Leviathan64

> Then I can start on the fish room and get that cleaned up and rebuilt.


Rebuilding your tank is easy compared to cleaning up your fish room. I'm curious how you'll convince Lora to keep the pond down there. :lol:


----------



## steelblue77

I can relate to the "burnt" feeling. You've been hitting this project hard for a while now and just need to take a break. A little down-time can do wonders renewing your enthusiasm. Don't let the leaks get ya down. Although, they are very deflating, I imagine. Hang in there.

:wink:


----------



## TheFishGuy

I've got a plan on the pond situation. I'll set it up outside for the summer then simply explain that it needs to be brought in for the winters :lol: How are those Nics by the way?

I'm enthusiastic again! BUT i will be going over the entire tank once more in the morning to make sure I've gotten everything... Butch tells me after 12 hours to check and see if the repairs feel smoth, if so, then fill... so if I get up early (which for some un Godly reason I'm always up early) and go over it one more time then I can test fill again in the evening... I think I'm more than likely to find something going at it fresh again...


----------



## willny1

Hang in there man. You're coming down the home stretch! :thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

Hereâ€™s a few videos about the leak. I had this interesting set of eleven videos of when I first filled the tankâ€¦ I shot a quick snippet every 15 minutes, but youtube rejected like half of them and I ended up deleting them allâ€¦ Iâ€™ll take pictures every 15 minutes next time, since pictures donâ€™t take fifteen hours to load! LOL

#25 




#26 




#27


----------



## maclak

Its been a while since I have check out your stuff. I am glad to hear things are starting to get back on tract for you. Let me know if you need some help with the video stuff, like I said before I am pretty good with that sort of thing  Either way keep up the good work!!!

Kevin


----------



## steelblue77

TFG, do you think with more heat and possibly 2 thinner coats (denatured) of pond armor, you would have avoided the pinholes? I ask because it almost looks like the tiny holes are the result of too much surface tension in the pond armor, preventing it from closing those tiny gaps. If it was a little thinner and warmer it may have spread over those more easily. I've never worked with that material so I'm not familiar with it's workability.

At any rate, good luck, and I will not bend over. :lol:


----------



## TheFishGuy

Ha ha! Kevin, I will be calling on you to help set up a web cam somehow... I'm computer illiterate.... as for the tiny holes... I don't think it matter how thin or thick or what the temperature is. The only thing is I was supposed to thin each mixture down with 2 oz. of denatured alcohol and I didn't... Sure wish I would have though! LOL

Hi, my name's Ben... Ben Dover...


----------



## willny1

We do it twice,

because we are nice...

As long as I can't see those pinholes from my house. :wink:


----------



## TheFishGuy

willny1 said:


> We do it twice,
> 
> because we are nice...
> 
> As long as I can't see those pinholes from my house. :wink:


Do your best we'll caulk the rest.... How's that one for ya... Looks great from my house...

You might be able to see this from your house though...






It's been solved as of 6 am this morning...


----------



## TheFishGuy

Butch sent me some more pond armor to work with so I can get the sump lined with it today. It just got here so Iâ€™m soaking it in a tub of hot water to warm it up before I start mixing. So I figured since I had an hour to wait for that Iâ€™d let you guys know that I did a final measurement on everything The tank, including the sump total 1549.65 gallons. 1549 doesnâ€™t quite roll off the tongue like â€œ800â€


----------



## dwarfpike

1400.

Big. Bold. Round. :thumb:


----------



## spotmonster

Did you check to see if Pond Armor can be sprayed on?

I bet that would have solved all the leak issues and taken a heck of a lot less time.


----------



## spotmonster

> I will be test filling this evening once more so hopefully that goes well


****, I was actually thinking I should stop by to check the tank out while it was empty!
Oh well.


----------



## illy-d

1500


----------



## TheFishGuy

Spot monster, feel free to drop by anytime 

I think we're going with fifteen hundred by the way 

I wanted to spray it because I've got a sprayer... butch talked me out of it because of the huge waste in material... But I feel the same way as you do... I wanted to spray it. I'm a decent sprayer...


----------



## illy-d

Would it have sprayed? Watching those clips of you mixing it it looked pretty thick and viscous...


----------



## rcrspeedracer03

i just finished all 190 pages on this tank and loved every second of it even though it took me 4 days to read it this was a great read would recomend it to any one who is wanting to build there own diy tank big or small sorry about all your losses and congrats on your new members to the family you have a great looking family i have been wanting to build my own diy tank and now that i have seen yours and all the problems you have had with yours i will start mine this summer and it is all your falt


----------



## auratum

TheFishGuy said:


> So I figured since I had an hour to wait for that Iâ€™d let you guys know that I did a final measurement on everything The tank, including the sump total 1549.65 gallons. 1549 doesnâ€™t quite roll off the tongue like â€œ800â€


----------



## TheFishGuy

Here's my defense on calling it the 1500. When the pump is running it will have 1500 gallons in it as my sump is gravit fed. On my 240 when it's sitting idle only holds about 215 gallons... See what I mean 

The filling did not go well and I'm very close to my breaking point. I only have 2/3 of a kit left of pondarmor and I'm going to use it all to re-coat the deep end. If that doesn't work I will have to wait until next winter to finish this project.


----------



## auratum

TheFishGuy said:


> Here's my defense on calling it the 1500. When the pump is running it will have 1500 gallons in it as my sump is gravit fed. On my 240 when it's sitting idle only holds about 215 gallons... See what I mean


Nope - I don't see it. It must be that new math...  It's your tank, call it what you want. :thumb:



TheFishGuy said:


> The filling did not go well and I'm very close to my breaking point. I only have 2/3 of a kit left of pondarmor and I'm going to use it all to re-coat the deep end. If that doesn't work I will have to wait until next winter to finish this project.


Sorry man! I wish you luck in getting this last patch to work! Keep the faith and don't forget to take care of Mrs. TFG - it is one of those Hallmark Holidays today!

Patrick


----------



## Zack2112

I totally see what you mean about holding 1500 when running and 1400 at idle. I think 1500 sounds good. Thats what I would most likely say haha.

I really hope the repair goes well. I think I can speak for all of us when we say we feel for you on this this project and wish you good luck. Its an awesome project and has been coming along all too well to wait another year. Regardless what happens with the repair thanks for posting this thread and keeping everyone informed and involved in the project. Its been a real treat to follow its progress. Best of luck! Hope it all works out well!


----------



## travis2k

Did you figure out what the problem was with the last application? Let us now what the problem was, maybe we can help with a solution? After all the info you given to CF its the least we can do.

Don't give up hope, I've been close to quitting myself many times.

I've been working on my 700 for the past 10 months, while getting married and getting laid off in the mean time.

I find a trip to the LFS to see what will go in my tank when it's done is always good for a little inspiration. (Or go have a look at your robertsoni in the pool and think how hapy he will be back in the tank.)
Why do you have to wait until next winter if this doesnt work?

hope it goes well, good luck


----------



## spotmonster

If I may ask, what's the reason for waiting until next winter? Because work will keep you busy, you're just burnt out, or financial reasons?

I know my finances are keeping me from even buying some bady needed filteration for my recent 180 set up. It's being ran with 2 Emperor 280's


----------



## majooismajor

hey TFG

i cant find ur vids of u buildin ur first monster fish tank...could u plz help me find it  
much appriciated

love ur work, keep it up!!!


----------



## majooismajor

hey TFG

i cant find ur vids of u buildin ur first monster fish tank...could u plz help me find it  
much appriciated

love ur work, keep it up!!!


----------



## TheFishGuy

There are no vids of the construction of the 800, only the thread here on C-F:

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/view ... light=1122

As for the reasons why I'll need to wait until next winter:
1.) Money for this project has been beyond drained.
2.) Work will start up soon and there will literally only be time to do water changes.
3.) Not sure I can mentally handle this any longer :lol: 
4.) After numerous attempts at filling and re-sealing I still have a leak.
Unfortunately I cannot find the source. I am not sure what my next step is
going to be but I will be taking a break from this project. You tube
consistently keeps rejecting my videos all of a sudden so there will be no
video up date this time around. I did fill the tank and sump (which does
not leak) this afternoon and I also finished the plumbing for the filter.
I temporarily put the pump in and tried to run a cycle on the tank.
Unfortunately the tank is going to need another bulkhead to feed the sump
as the pump almost overflowed the tank while simultaneously draining the
sump tank. According to my calculations each inch of the tank is 39.83
gallons and it takes two inches to fill the pipes in the filter system so
roughly 80 gallons to get the filter running. But again, the sump is not
getting fed fast enough. In theory the sump should be half full when
running normally and completely full when sitting idle or during a power
outage. If when I add another bulkhead to the tank it is still not enough
then the sump tank needs to be larger. I find this hard to believe since
this is the same pump that ran the 800 with zero issues in a sump tank
that held only 115 gallons or so. The only difference is 12 gallons of
water per inch in the addition. In my opinion 24 gallons is not enough of
a difference to warrant a larger sump tank than 163 gallons. The major
difference is one less bulkhead, one less feed to the sump.

That is where we stand.

I need to work tomorrow on a small job that should take less than 12 hrs
to complete, so nothing is going to get done tomorrow.

Here is a punch list of things that need to happen before full operation
and stocking of fish:

1.) Fix the leak.
2.) Install the under gravel jets and spray bar.
3.) Add a bulkhead and another run to the sump.
4.) Install and connect the heat coil.
5.) Make lids.
6.) Test everything for a week.
7.) Drain and decorate.
8.) Stock.

2-8 are very easy steps. Itâ€™s one that Iâ€™ve got an issue with. The only
feasible idea I have is to re-coat the entire tank by spraying it. Other
than that Iâ€™m open to ideas. I believe Iâ€™m only a few clicks away from
reaching my limit of patience. Honestly, Iâ€™m past patience and frustration
and have moved right onto the â€œI donâ€™t care anymoreâ€


----------



## bell

do you have a general idea where the leak is? 
is the the armor still flaking off?


----------



## herny

i dont know what to say to help but i wish i could help if i lived close enough i would come over when ever to help with what i could so you could get this done


----------



## TheFishGuy

The pond armor is not flaking off... I was actually peeling that up then stopped when it got too difficult the peel... I cannot locate the leak but I do see water dribbleing out right above the plywood floor from under the tank at the deep end. Butches recomendation is to fill the tank and let it leak till it stops leaking. Then the leak point should be at the waterline or just above. That's all fine and dandy but I'm afraid of drenching the plywood floor... Do you think the use of a dehumidifier and cranking the heat to 90* would dry it up enough?

And thanks herny


----------



## Rivermud

I honestly doubt it. The room is probably saturated with moisture as it is. I was trying to think of a way to use a dye like we do in pressurized systems but that's not going to help you. I can't think of too many things that would be a cheap easy fix. You may look into the potable water tank sealers. You can also try to use a vinyl mesh similar to what they use for stucco work to give you a solid core to build up a coat of dry lock or something similar. Use a moisture barrier behind it like the stuff they put on before putting siding up, that waterproof sticky membrane... shrug, just ideas.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Well, the tank would be empty after the repair was made assuming the leak was found... But your ideas are catologged  Thank you


----------



## bell

since you can't see down into the deep end what about doing a few coats of drylock ? i'm sure you have some laying around.....
would epoxy work on top of the pond armor? i've got the 2 gallons (which i still need to get to) and can try ship to you this week......
if the problem is definitely in the deep end then it won't need to be visually perfect as long as it seals.
and there's always silicone


----------



## 98dsol

I can understand your frustration. I was plagued with green water and thread algae in my planted tank for 2 long years before I won the battle.:dancing:

Regarding the sump, the problem isnâ€™t that your pump is running out of water because the sump is too small. The problem is that your pump is pumping water faster than it is being fed. To put it another way, the size of a sump is dictated by a power outage scenario. So as long as the sump doesnâ€™t overflow when the pump turns off, then the size is fine. Just keep adding bulkheads until the drains can keep up with the pump.

Finding the leak isnâ€™t going to be hard, just messy. I really canâ€™t think of anything other than filling it letting it leak until it finds a waterproof level. I donâ€™t know what kind of damage this might do to the floor though. Iâ€™d just put a few fans pointed under the tank to dry it out when you are done. 
Good luck.


----------



## herny

yea man no problem it hurts hearing you putting it off i beat if you had one more person there you could find the leak


----------



## dwarfpike

This will probably sound silly, but couldn't the fill the tank part to find the leak work in reverse? Probably slower, but fill it to the deep part is full and wait and check for the leak, then add two inches more, check, ect?

Or I guess it's possible it's only leaking under the pressure of being full.


----------



## Robchester_2000

this may be stupid, as i don't know how much is pouring through, etc, could you not put down some plastic containers to catch the leakage, then keep swapping them in and out as they fill?
if theres no room, or its not viable, sorry, just don't want you to give up..


----------



## auratum

Not sure how to find the leak, but if you know it is in the bottom of the deep end, you could glue down another piece of Hardi Panel over the top and recoat with Pond Armor - sort of a new fresh seal...

I am sorry for you pain. You can do it!

Patrick


----------



## madzarembski

Hi TFG

This is the first time I've posted to your thread even though I have read the whole thing. How fast is the leak? You may be a ble to locate it by putting in a different color liquid that will stay somewhat together. The off colored liquid will hopefully pool by the leak as it is pulled through. I think this may only work if there is enough pull to bring the liquid to the source. Good Luck. I will keep looking for ideas.

Madzarembski


----------



## Zack2112

*** been wracking my brain trying to figure something out for locating the leak. I think that dwarfpike might be on the right track. I was also thinking, and this may be stupid, but its just a thought I keep having. I do not know really how you are finding the leaks, like if it us just accumulating on the floor, or if you can track the water trail back up the wood or see where the wood is wet. But my thought was that you could almost dust the entire outside of the tank with something like baby powder, then when you fill it up you would see the water trail where the powder was washed away and trace it back to the origin. This may not be practical, part of me thinks it could work, part of me thinks its a stupid idea. I really do not know, but I figured I would throw that out there anyway.

Does silicone bond well to pond armor? I know it kinda sucks to silicon the tank as well since it should be totally fine with pond armor, but its a thought to consider. Sorry I cant be of much more help.

Best of luck!


----------



## travis2k

I've thought of a couple ideas, dont know if any will work, or what materials you might have, or be able to get cheaply

1) silicone a big piece of glass into the bottom of the deep end
2)pond liner in the deep end seal with....(not silicone, doesnt work so well, maybe sicaflex?)
3)tiling with waterproof tiles and grout or use caulk or silicone to grout your tiles (not sure on adheasion)
4)silicone the whole deep end
5)fibreglass matting, woven glass fibres to be used with epoxy, maybe pond armor? if bell sends you some epoxy it should work with that.

I'll keep my thinking cap on..


----------



## Zack2112

have you narrowed it down to the deep end?


----------



## Morpheus

If it is in the deep end, is it possible that the plywood is flexing just enough to cause the leak? That is a ton of weight. Just enough to separate the pond armor enough to let water through? And then when you empty it the plywood returns to its original state, and the pond armor still seems seamless. I can't remember what what spacing you used for your joists, but maybe doubling the number you have might help. Make them removable if you ever have to get under the tank. Or perhaps just put joist spacers between the joists anywhere there is a seam in the plywood (i.e. arounds the perimeter of the deep end).

Again, I may be way off course, but I'm figuring at this point the more ideas the better.


----------



## bell

a little far fetched (i know how tfg builds his stand) but it's an interesting concept......something a few shims could handle.........

is the base flexing? maybe there's a soft spot in the floor?

tfg..... what about just running a good wide bead along every corner and seam? if you're only dealing with pinholes it could surely work.


----------



## Morpheus

Yea, I know it's far fetched, just throwing anything that comes into my mind out there. Not sure though how shims would handle it? I'm talking about flexing between the joists, where there is no support. If he went 16" O/C, that would be 14 1/2" inches of unsupported plywood between the joists. Not saying 14 1/2" of plywood could flex, but then again I've never built a 1500 gallon tank :lol:

And now that I re-read your post, I think I know what you mean. Perhaps the joists are moving under the weight? In that case I get the shim idea. But I'd make them aluminum.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Ok... The actual floor joists of the deep end are scribed to fit the concrete floor perfectly, so the only flex would the the 8" of concrete... They are also 8" on center 

The reason I know it's leaking in the deepend is because three times i've stopped filling right when the deep end fills. From under the tank you can see water dribbling out between the hardiepanel and the decking, or plywood floor if you will. I should add that the floor is 3/4" plywood. The stud walls are also 8" on center...

Here's what I've decided to do. Tomorrow afternoon I will be siliconing all of the inside corners of the entire tank. Then Wed morning I will test fill. I only say that because I'll be up at the but crack of dawn tomorrow so I'll probably start siliconing then! LOL

Then, if a leak does pop up I'll stop filling and let it leak until it stops. That should reveal the leak point somewhere on the waterline. I will have a whole slew of fans and heaters under the tank to attempt to keep it dry during the leaking... Again.. if it does leak...


----------



## maclak

I would have to aggree, start filling slowly and wait to see what happens. May be slower but will save a bunch of frustration. One other idea would be to add some sort of "fish safe" die or something along those lines that is a different color than the blue, that way it will show where the hole is. Did this once in a pool, can remeber what I used but there was a greater concentration of "die" where the holes where. I will try to look though old documents to see if I can find what I used for this. good luck :fish:


----------



## maclak

I found some good info for you for Dye testing sorry for all of my sp errors earlier. I found two good sites. http://www.poolleak.info/solutions/find_leak_myself.php and http://www.brightdyes.com/MSDS.html
looks like this could work, and they may even send you some stuff for free. If you have any question let me know. Sorry I did not think of this earlier for you 

Kevin


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks Kevin 

Up Date:
Since you tube is not cooperating weâ€™re going to do this up date old schoolâ€¦ I got the entire tanks seams siliconed this afternoon. By the time I was finished (which it only took about 20 minutes) my eyes were burning! LOL I was able to keep the door open and thereâ€™s an exhaust fan just a few feet away in the small bathroom/laundryroom in the basement that I was able to keep on and it took care of most of the fumes from the siliconeâ€¦ Actually I think Iâ€™m still HIGH LOL. Hereâ€™s some pictures of that:



















I also decided there wasnâ€™t any reason the heat coil couldnâ€™t be ran so I did that tooâ€¦ That really only took about 30 minutes seeing as I already had the thermostat wired and the pump installed. Iâ€™ll re-cap how this is intended to work. I might even go super old school and do a drawing in paint! Yeahâ€¦ Letâ€™s do that:










So hereâ€™s some coiled in the sump around a cage made from eggcrate from an old project. When I run out to my shed Iâ€™m going to grab a bunch of zip ties to separate the coils so theyâ€™re not touching each other. Hence the eggcrateâ€¦ And it got the dang thing out of the way in the fish room! LOL



















Hereâ€™s a shot of the heat lines running into the tank room and down into the sump. As you can see I took the 55 out in order to do this:










Hereâ€™s the pump mounted about 5â€™ up in the laundry room/little bathroom (which is essentially just a toilet, my toilet according to Dominic! LOL)










And hereâ€™s where you can see it going into the drain cock of the water heater.










Now I couldnâ€™t just hook this up and not test itâ€¦ So I filled the sump with 46* water and set the thermostat to 60*â€¦ Weâ€™ll see how it doesâ€¦ Of all the upgrades Iâ€™m doing to this tank this is the one Iâ€™m most excited about, well that and now Iâ€™m on the hunt for a giant piece of drift woodâ€¦ Maybe Iâ€™ll just go cut a tree down in the back and wedge it in the tank so it doesnâ€™t floatâ€¦ OOOOâ€¦ Chainsaw! 
Thatâ€™s it in a nutshell, hopefully tomorrow will be a good day and weâ€™ll have no more leaks. Iâ€™m goingto get on the horn with you tube and see whatâ€™s up their rear latelyâ€¦ Donâ€™t they understand the importance of this? Sheeshâ€¦ the nerveâ€¦

As always, if thereâ€™s any questions feel free to ask! I will do my best to typ out an answer for youâ€¦ cuz you guessed itâ€¦ you tube sucks!
Ps. Sorry for the book, but it would have only been a short video to listen to if you tube didnâ€™t suckâ€¦


----------



## bell

awesome stuff, i too am curious with the water heater/coils 
silicone is VERY bad for your nose, it can damage nerves and such in your sinus'.......so be careful (although it looks like you're done )

i think you'll be good to go


----------



## 98dsol

Dang Me! Looking good. Fire that chainsaw up get to cuttin' boss!


----------



## TheFishGuy

LOL It's raining here today......... no chain saw action....

The heat coils work incredibly well. I'm very happy with them 46* water turned to 66* water in about two hours. Then this morning I jacked it up to 80* for fun :lol:


----------



## Robchester_2000

Keep Going TFG! you can do it!


----------



## travis2k

Definately a cool idea with the heat coils, Im having a hard time finding 1000 watt heaters, and this seems like an interesteding route.

How hard/expensive is it to hook something like this up?


----------



## TheFishGuy

Well, you've got to have some plumbing skills, but regular compression fittings for 1/2" copper work on the pex, so when transitioning from copper to pex I just used a comp fitting... The hard part for some might be finding the pump. If you know a plumber they might be able to get one for you... I just ordered it from aplumbing supply store.. but I have a commercial account... Plus they all think I'm nuts :lol:

Put it to you this way, if you can solder pipe and you can read a measuring tape and have an understanding of how water heaters work then you'll be fine. It was cake for me because the hardest thing someone might come across is adding the valve to the sill cock of the water heater. The water has to be shut off to the water heater and the tank needs drained so you can add a short nipple to it then a "T" then two valves. One for draining the tank and the other for letting water back in from the heating system. I replaced my water heater so I was able to do it all before hand  I mean, if you get into it and are going to do it ask as many questions as you like, I'll do my best to answer them


----------



## spotmonster

Is this the same water heater that is running your house? Any worries about taking showers, doing wash, and heating the tank at the same time?.......Sorry honey, fish tank is cold, turn the washer off and don't wash the kids today 

Where did you get the idea for using a water heater? This could possibly be cheaper than running seperate heaters, baseboard heaters ect for fish rooms.


----------



## travis2k

Hmmm.

I dont think I know enough to go that route myself, and with the cost of a plumber would probably make it more expensive than I want.

I need to run some lines to fill the tank anyways (will probably splice off the laundry)
maybe I'll look at a small hot water tank right in the fish room



> Plus they all think I'm nuts


 If I had a dollar for everytime I heard 
"How big?" and got that wow your nuts look...
well lets just say I could afford a bigger tank


----------



## TheFishGuy

I got the idea of the heat from someone on here named Cursor. He was following the thread, I wonder where he's been?

Up Date:
Wellâ€¦. Itâ€™s been an hour and SHE HOLDS! The extra pipe running back into the sump because the pump was a little too much seems to be doing itâ€™s job well! The tanks been running for about an hour now and all seems to be well!!!!!!!! So let me ask youâ€¦ Did you enjoy the drama? LOL I didnâ€™t. It took over six hours for me to fill this time, and my feet hurt from pacing back and forth! But who cares about meâ€¦ I took a few pictures so we can go step by step through the saga of fillingâ€¦
In this picture youâ€™ll see that Iâ€™ve got the spray bar plumbed in. I decided in order to force myself to slowly fill the tank that I would fill the sump, shut the water off, then use the pump to pump the water into the tank. Then while the sump was filling from the tap again it would give me time to inspect everything. Then with one final inspection after the sump was full Iâ€™d plug the pump in adding 150 ish more gallons to the tank. It took eleven times in order to completely fill the tank.










Here are the spots where it leaked every other time it was filled. These were the spots where I closely inspected about five times after every time 150 ish gallons was put in the tank. The white line that you see in the pictures is the Â¾ decking of the deep end, water would slowly dribble out from the top of it:




























Now hereâ€™s the spray bar in action giving the tank a nice shower every half hour or so:



















And hereâ€™s Max coming to inspect my work! LOL Future county building inspector! LOL



















And hereâ€™s a slide show of the fill:



Then when the tank spilled a tiny bit of water into the sump tank I stopped filling it and started to just fill the sump tank. When both containers were at maximum then it was sitting at what I call â€œIdleâ€


----------



## Leviathan64

:dancing: =D> opcorn: 

Looks like I might have to take a little drive tomorrow.


----------



## bell

i'm so glad it's working out 
next time i'm in ohio i'll bring over a 6'er


----------



## Mussin

Great news... I wish I lived a tad closer...

Jeremy


----------



## TheFishGuy

Leviathan64 said:


> :dancing: =D> opcorn:
> 
> Looks like I might have to take a little drive tomorrow.


I'll be home in the afternoon 

All are welcome! Hopefully it'll still have water in it then! LOL

Thanks everyone!

And bell, I'll have a sixer waitin'


----------



## Zack2112

Congrats TFG! Im glad that it worked out this time around. It turned out awesome. I really love the heating coil too. As far as the DVDs go that would be pretty sweet. Too bad I dont live so far away or I would definitely have to check this out. Great job, I will be looking forward to the vids if youtube ever starts to cooperate!

Im just so blown away at how awesome this tank is. Someday I will have to build me a monster for some clown knifes.... It was my first fish I ever got, and i only had it for a few months before it outgrew my tank and I had to sell it. I will get another someday.

Again, awesome job.
Thanks for posting the whole process.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thank you for keeping my spirits up and not letting me give up! I'm not celebrating yet though... It's got to stay full with no leaks till saturday atleast...


----------



## theanimalman

Hold, baby, hold!!!

You don't waste any time water testing, do you. Thank goodness its holding this time.

Now the waiting and watching game begins.

Thanks for keeping us updated.


----------



## fishwolfe

everytime i see what your up to i feel closer to being sane  looking good :thumb:


----------



## maclak

Great job man, way to stick with it. When you have some "time" pm me and maybe we can talk about getting those videos up, and perhaps put them up on Monster Fish rescue website. Let me know if that is something you would be interested in doing and I could try to help you out, no charge. Also on a side note (wanted to wait until your tank drama was over) a while back I was telling you about my friend that has a fish store over here in the Albany NY area. Not that long ago he got a tiger shovel nose in for rescue. Let me know if you are interested not sure how well he would travel though kind of big. Either way keep up the great work.

Kevin
:thumb:


----------



## non_compliance

so what the heck did you do differently to get rid of the leak?


----------



## MIKE PAPA

Silicone.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Yeah, figures... Siliconing the corners did it :roll: As for the watch and wait.... I'm keeping myself busy, because if I don't I'll drain the darn thing and start loading fish into it :lol: I had a small confrence to go to this morning but when I got home I got this incredible burst of energy... I went out back and cut the top off a tree I cut down last year and put it in the tank! :lol: It's 9' long, and the picture isn't all that great because of the bubbles on the glass... I couldn't find my magna sweep



















Not only that but I got a half a ton of wash stone and brought most of it down to get ready to rinse it It was fun carying two five gallon pails full down stairs at a time... 12 buckets should do it...










AND I also brought in all of the decor that was under the pond liner outside the back door...










I'm begining to think there's seriously somethng wrong with me :fish:

As for the tank, the pump is dialed in and working well, things might change with that once all the jets are in but I'll deal with it... I plugged the pump back in at 6:45 am this morning and the heater had gotten the sump water up to 80*. After being gone for four hours the tank it's self climed 11* up to 72*... Then I decided to shut the thermostat off, there was no real reason to heat the tank up just to drain it Saturday AM... After I'm done posting it's down to the fish room for a few hours to start cleaning gravel, then I've got parent teacher confrences to night... I hate when life gets in the way of fun stuff... anyone wanna come over and rinse a half a ton of gravel?


----------



## RyanR

Great news! =D>

So is that a 55g tank without a bottom over the sump inlet? Neat idea.

-Ryan


----------



## bigdaddycon

hey tgf, glad to hear the tank has held, like the others i have followed your thread. cant wait till i can build my own monster tank.


----------



## bell

when i'd wash gravel i'd use a large colander in the sink and a hose, would let me do manageable batches plus was easy to scoop with. iirc the last time i did 7 5-gallon buckets full in less than an hour.......

i like the tree


----------



## joshmonica

looks like you have changed the filter system alittle. I remember the 5 gallon bucket prefilter to 55 
gallon drum set up. How is the set up now.

josh


----------



## TheFishGuy

RyanR said:


> Great news! =D>
> 
> So is that a 55g tank without a bottom over the sump inlet? Neat idea.
> 
> -Ryan


Yep, and it will be full of bio media 

Bell, That's exactly how I do it :thumb:

Joshmonica... That's a cool name... If you have kids you should name them Joshmonica LOL Ok, the filter is actually getting simpler... Water will spill over prefilters then tricle through bio media, then get pumped back into the tank


----------



## severseas

TFG - speaking for myself and I'm sure many others, we live vicariously through you and your fish adventures. Someday I'll build that big tank ...

Didn't you have sand in the 800 before the conversion? Why the switch?


----------



## TheFishGuy

The sand was play sand too lite. It kept clogging the prefilters... I like to look, but I also like the look of gravel... So I figure it'll be a nice change


----------



## truett

Just one question. Which way do you go from here?


----------



## TheFishGuy

THis should answer your question truett, I got the top braces painted with drylok the bark removed from the tree, and I got all the under gravel jets in! so we're ready to decorate!! Here's a slide show of the progress! Just click on it


----------



## Howler33

The tank looks very, very good TFG. Great job fighting through the challenges on this build.


----------



## bell

good stuff........are you going to be able to jump start your filtration with the water in the "pool"?


----------



## sirdavidofdiscus

Won't the deeper part of the tank have higher head pressure causing ugj in the deep part have very small if any water flow? I didn't see any valves to regulate the flow if this is the case. 
Looking good though. Glad you solved the leaks.


----------



## Zack2112

something i just thought of, is there going to be any kind of barrier to keep the gravel from the higher portion of the tank from falling down into the deep end?


----------



## truett

I was wondering what direction you are going to go when you expand agin.


----------



## auratum

sirdavidofdiscus said:


> Won't the deeper part of the tank have higher head pressure causing ugj in the deep part have very small if any water flow?


Actually the head pressure cancels out because of the head pressure of the water in the pipe. When doing pressure drop calcs it is all about the net difference in head pressure between the pump inlet and the jet outlet as long as the piping stays completely full of liquid. Now if the pipe to get down to the bottom jets is longer, then you have more frictional losses in the pipe leading to higher pressure drop... Not sure if that explanation was clear or not?

I would be more concerned about the number of jets coming off that one supply line - seems undersized, unless it is being fed from more than one direction. For good distribution, a rule of thumb is to shoot for 60% of the cross sectional area in the header divided up into the jets. In other words take the open area where the water flows through for each jet and add it all up and it should only be 60% of the cross sectional area for the header. You can work backwards also if you know the number of jets and the header size to calculate the size hole that would work best. In the end, the biggest problem is poor distribution of water through the header and low velocities for the jets...


----------



## TheFishGuy

Itâ€™s been a long time cominâ€™ but the fish are in! The tank is full and holding just fine. The temperature last nite in the tank was only 71* As of this morning it was 77* We took a lot of pictures so hereâ€™s a slide show again for you. I was just too pooped to get to posting last niteâ€¦



Once the deep end was full with water from the pond I started to stock the tank and the first fish to venture into the rest of the tank was a female jaguar cichlid. Soon after it seemed everyone wanted to be up there. LOL The only fish I havenâ€™t seen yet is the larger of the two iridescent sharks, but I expected thatâ€¦
Hereâ€™s a list of whatâ€™s been put in so far:
Paco the pacu 22â€


----------



## TheFishGuy

I'm not too worried about the pressure... There's nothing syoping the jets down there... There's gravel on all the rest of them...

no more expansions on this tank... :lol:

Zack, it's kind of hard to see but there's a wall made of rock holding the gravel up top


----------



## bigdaddycon

hey tgf, glad to see you got the fish in and the tank held. it must be nice to sit back and look at the work you did on the tank. and did i read your fish list right that you have an 8 inch convict, could you post some pics of it, the biggest con i ever had was my old 6 inch male


----------



## klumsyninja

Mad congratulations are in order.

And may I say thank you for chronicling the entire journey for us. It's been a huge inspiration!

Awesome, well done =D>


----------



## Morpheus

Congratulations Jonathon. And let me know when that DVD is ready, I'll be first in line.


----------



## herny

ma nthats a big ass pelco


----------



## Morpheus

Big ass pleco for a big ass tank.


----------



## bell

good stuff, glad they're in 

i raised a nice pleco


----------



## truett

I think that you and I and the Misses know better. :lol:


----------



## Cursor

Howdy,

Congratulations on getting the tank back up and working. I'm glad to hear the heating system is working so well.

I do have a few questions... more of a time line to make sure I understand.

Saturday you started moving everyone.

You filled the deep end of the tank with pond water, then slowly moved all the fish.

You then stated the tank temp last night was 71* and as of this morning it was 77*.

Was the pond running at 71*? Or was this from adding more water to the tank since the pond wasn't 1500 gallons?

Were you concerned to have those fish in 71* water?

Are you concerned about increasing the temp of the tank too quickly if they were living in 71* water in the pond?

You did an awesome job on this project, I'm very glad the heating system is working well for this tank.

I suspect treating for ich if you ever have to will be a far less life altering event now.

Talk to you later.


----------



## gmaschke

It has been a lot of fun following along. However it has been way to big a project for me to even dream up. None the less I really enjoed it.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks for the kind words everyone  As for the temperature concerns.... I'm not waorried as most of these fish are mature or adults. They can handle temp swings a lot better than juvies. The temperature in the pond was 74* and with adding the rest of the water to the tank it dropped to 71* Very slowly I might add... Then over night it raised only 6*... But now it's at 80* 

The pleco pictured on the towel soaked in tank water was bells pleco.. and the one I was holding is mine. There's only an inch difference between the two and they actually get along fairly well 

The tank is slooooooowly clearing but I think I'm going to do a water change soon... or do you all think I should wait until this coming saturday... I also need to finish the bio tower as I've got 9 pounds of charcoal to add to the filter and i still need to make a tray for the filter pads... The charcol will help polish the water and I think once the filter pads are in more of a permanent position things will clear up quicker... I simply forgot to make a tray until it was too late  So the pads are just seperated from the bio media by eggcrate....


----------



## Mussin

WOW... That slide show is awesome.. You have some AMAZING fish! I cant get over the size of that pacu!!  The white Midas are killer! Is there any aggression in a tank that size?

What do you feed those guys??

Jeremy


----------



## auratum

Strong work TFG!!!


----------



## TheFishGuy

Mussin, There's aggression, but not like you'd think. When there's that much room to run the aggression that does crop up only last for a few seconds. They rarely pursue a chase further than 8'... At the moment though they're establishing territories and having a blast doing it I might add :lol:

Thank you auratum


----------



## Cursor

I would do a water change personally.

I'm assuming you moved the bio media that was filtering the pond/pool over to the tank... since you still have that bio media working for you, I don't see a reason not to do a water change.


----------



## maclak

I am happy to see that the light at the end of the tunnel has arrived. I enjoyed the slide show as well. Couldnâ€™t help but think how crazy it is that those fish look so small compared to your tank. It is the equivalent of a 4 inch fish in my tanks, yet yours are over 10 inches!!! I took one of the pictures you took and did a little edit to it. Let me know if you like it. If you have some pictures you really like and would like me to edit and enhance them let me know. I didnâ€™t know how red those pipes where so it was hard to match the color, it may be a little too much in what I did but easily fixed. Any way keep up the good work, can wait for more pictures and video.

Kevin

http://maclakdesigns.com/gallery/displayimage.php?pid=1&fullsize=1


----------



## Aalelan

How about a cover for the top? Are you not going to have one since you moisture proofed the room? What about jumper type fish?

I Ask because I'm still trying to engineer my lid/top


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks Kevin, those pictures were taken with my cheapo camera. My wife is waiting until the water is cleared up before she busts out the Caddy of cameras around here LOL But thank you anyway! I'm going to do a water change today.... While a burn the cabinets and paint the fish room! LOL I went a little crazy with demo yesterday after water changes... Now i've got a week to get the sink re-installed LOL


----------



## TheFishGuy

lids will come if I feel they're necessary... When the 800 was built I didn't have lids for a few months... We'll see....


----------



## Curator

man, that monster of a tank is looking pretty awesome!!!


----------



## alfish

congrats fish guy. been following since the first build. looks great and the fish wow!!! :dancing: :


----------



## illy-d

Awesome. Congratulations!!! Enjoy a cold one and sit back and watch your tank!


----------



## bell

any pics yet? 
(i know you're probably elbow deep with everything on your agenda )


----------



## TheBanker

glad to see everything worked out well. :thumb:


----------



## Nerdy Biker

I've been watching your progress for a few weeks and I'm glad you finally got that sucker filled up!

What are you going to do when that snakehead grows bigger and starts to eat his finned friends?


----------



## james_martin65

there is not a snakehead in that picture, or in the tank if im not mistaken


----------



## grail63

james_martin65 said:


> there is not a snakehead in that picture, or in the tank if im not mistaken


That is not a snake head it is a pike cichlid I think you are refering too


----------



## TheFishGuy

Yes, that is a belly crawler pike


----------



## dwarfpike

Looks to be a beauty of BC too *TheFishGuy*!! :thumb:

Now you need some lents ... and marms ... and acutirostris ... and cinctas ...


----------



## TheFishGuy

Dude... you're speakin' a language I just don't understand... :lol:

Hereâ€™s slide show of some pictures my wife took with her camera:

And this is the filter for the tank. The water first passes through 4 square feet of prefilter pad which is cushion for boat seats. This is the same material that was being used in the 800 and for filtering the pond when it was up. Then is passes through three three pound bags of charcoal. Iâ€™m hoping it helps to clear the tank up. Then finally it passes through the bio media then into the sump tank where the pump and the heating coil is located.










At first I just had the three 2â€


----------



## kylearch

opcorn: =D> nuff said


----------



## RyanR

Congrats! :thumb:

I think the entire interweb has a strange peaceful feeling now that you're back up and running! A long saga, and just awesome to see a happy ending.

Some great fishies as well! How long does it take for a convict to get that big?? :lol:

-Ryan


----------



## dwarfpike

TheFishGuy said:


> Dude... you're speakin' a language I just don't understand... :lol:


Philistine!!! :lol: You have THE ultimate pike tank now!!! (of course you did before too! :lol: )

BC = bellycrawler
cincta = 









lent = Cr. lenticulata









marm = Cr. marmorata 









acuts =









I'll learn you right yet boy!!! :x ((besides, with my tanks in storage, I need to live vicariously through your tank now!!))


----------



## bell

good stuff tfg


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks everyone 

Dwarfpike, Feel free to email me for my address and feel free to ship me six young ones of every pike listed  Pikes have always been one of my favorites but never seem to get any... The one I have is the last of six...


----------



## dwarfpike

Well sure, as soon as you fly out and turn that lower apartment into a tank for me so I can breed them, I'll send you all the pike and argentea fry you want!!! :lol:


----------



## Nerdy Biker

Those belly crawlers are awesome, Can they live with south American Cichlids?

TheFishGuy, When you where planning your tank build, Did you consider using some kind of waterproof panels like thin Plexiglas/lexan etc. over the hardi panels, then caulk the corners to seal it?

Why didn't you make the tank out of concrete?

Why did you use choose pond armor and not fiberglass?

Just wonderin'


----------



## TheFishGuy

Nerdy Biker said:


> Those belly crawlers are awesome, Can they live with south American Cichlids?


Mine is living with quite a few at the moment. Now if you're talking rams... then no... Pikes are excelent predators...



> TheFishGuy, When you where planning your tank build, Did you consider using some kind of waterproof panels like thin Plexiglas/lexan etc. over the hardi panels, then caulk the corners to seal it?


 Yes, that was discussed within the firts two or three pages of the original build and decided that unless you got the seams absolutely perfect the pressure would just completely blow out the plexi or lexan or whatever...



> Why didn't you make the tank out of concrete?


Simple really. I'm a carpenter, and every material used (aside from the pond armor) I have used on site before 



> Why did you use choose pond armor and not fiberglass?


Because pond armor was specificly designed for this application and I thought that this time around I'd use something that made sense...



> Just wonderin'


It's ok to wonder, I'm sure others wondered the same questions but didn't ask


----------



## bell

how's everything holding up?


----------



## auratum

Yah, come on with some more pics/vids! :thumb:


----------



## CHBGator

I agree need more pics/vids.


----------



## Chuck Petrosky

I'm going into withdraws :fish:


----------



## Morpheus

Didn't he say something about having surgery the beginning of this month? Maybe just recovering from that.


----------



## spartman

Have read the whole discussion from beginning till now and have to say WOW!!!

I like your idea of using the water heater for heating the tank.

What kind of pump did you use?

And what controller did you use?

Do you have any more pics/details on how you tapped into the water heater?

Thanks


----------



## Cursor

I helped TFG with the hot water heater (hydronic) heating system at least from a conceptual standpoint.

Here is my setup, his is very similar.

The recirculating pump that I am using is a grundfos 
UP15-18SU 59896127 1/25th HP, 1 Speed, Stainless Steel Union Housing,115 volt, 85 watts 7.50 11.50

http://www.grundfos.com/Web/HomeUs.nsf/ ... E9386256AE E00587B37?opendocument

You will most likely have to get this from a plumbing supply store that your plumber has access to. I had to find someone with access to such a shop to buy mine.

TFG used a grundfos as well but he used one that was cast iron.

As for the temp controller it comes from www.jehmco.com

Here is the model I got.

ETCI-2R2

2-stage Electronic Temperature Control w/ 2 Receptacles for up to 1000 watts load each, Includes digital temperature display 
$112.50

You could probably get away with

ETCI-1R

Electronic Temperature Control w/ Receptacle for up to 1800 watts load, Includes digital temperature display 
ready to use with power input cord and 3-prong receptacle 
(second receptacle available installed for $7.00) 
$75.00

I believe he went with ETCI-1R or something similar from jehmco, he went with the wire it yourself version rather than the prewired since he was placing the temp controller farther away than I did.

Last part you need is the stainless steel coil. I would go with 50 feet of it, that's what I did. You can also buy that at Jehmco.

SST-5X20

Stainless tubing, coiled. 
1/2â€


----------



## spartman

THANK YOU!!!


----------



## TheFishGuy

Everything's holding up well... I got the basement painted too!


----------



## bell

Looks awesome john, how are the fish liking the deep end?


----------



## dwarfpike

I love that pic ... it looks like you matched the wall color to the background of the tank (at least I hope you did and I'm not embarassing myself with it just being a camera effect  ). Makes the fish REALLY stand out compared to before.


----------



## Morpheus

Absolutely stunning!


----------



## sirdavidofdiscus

Love that painted wall.


----------



## Izzydawg

Sweet job man :drooling:


----------



## Chuck Petrosky

I was 30 + about twenty years ago. Now I get tired watching all the work you do :lol: 
Great Job! =D> now it's time for a nap...probably dream about :fish:


----------



## TheFishGuy

:lol: Thanks everyone, I'll try to post a video if I can get it to work... As for the deep end, All the catfish live down there, which is what I expected. The cichlids occasionally go down there but don't stay long... It's really neat to see one of the cats come up from the deep end here and there and now and again... It makes me appreciate them that much more


----------



## maclak

Looking really good, pretty soon we can talk about getting the webcam up and streaming on your web site, and if we get really crazy we could do an underwater webcam. Keep up the good work, can't wait untill I get a house to do this too.


----------



## maclak

Looking really good, pretty soon we can talk about getting the webcam up and streaming on your web site, and if we get really crazy we could do an underwater webcam. Keep up the good work, can't wait untill I get a house to do this too.


----------



## maclak

sorry for double post


----------



## RyanR

We should make like a web controlled servo-type finger thing so we can tap on the glass from the interweb. :lol:

-Ryan


----------



## moto_master

I was thinking a remote controlled submarine with a web cam attached to it, so we can swim in it from the Internet... 

:drooling: Looks awesome by the way! I'm so envious. :thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

Thanks fellas... and easy... one thing at a time... I already have enough issues just keeping the site updated.... I need to quit my job....... :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Chuck Petrosky

I say quit the job and open your own business ...jon's monster tanks! I'll take a 400 gallon salt and a 400 fresh please :wink:


----------



## daytona1295

> I say quit the job and open your own business ...jon's monster tanks! I'll take a 400 gallon salt and a 400 fresh please Wink
> 
> :lol: :lol: I concur Ill take a 400 fresh


----------



## daytona1295

oops new to this the part i said wasent supposed to be in the quote :lol: which was

:lol: :lol: I concur Ill take a 400 fresh


----------



## SLIGHTLY STOOPID

If I was in charge of the moderators around here I would make sure certain fishguys are spending more time writing valuable DIY articles rather than making more endless threads. But thanks anyway.

:thumb:


----------



## TheFishGuy

Well if you'd like to see a presentation of how the tank was built Iwill be starting to give power point presentations at local fish clubs around northeast ohio. My first date is April 3rd at the OCA social gathering. I'll be talking about the construction of the tank in great detail and entertaining questions  Let me know if you'd like more information. I'll be signing autographs at the end of the meeting! :lol:


----------



## SLIGHTLY STOOPID

> I'll be talking about the construction of the tank in great detail and entertaining questions Smile Let me know if you'd like more information. I'll be signing autographs at the end of the meeting!


Thanks. I hope you are organizing your info for reading material. You are obviously motivated to share and I might pay 5 or 10 bucks for an Ebook.

I think your world tour might motivate your communication in layman's terms. You might get questions from people who are totally ignorant of DIY words and phrases. I'm not lingo savvy but I have good hands and a knack for this sort of thing.

Your threads are readable but I would rather hear it from the perspective of you telling it to someone who is not familiar to DIY terms but could easily DIY it themselves. Does this make sense?

Peace :fish:


----------



## TheFishGuy

Makes absolute sense to me! That's why I've decided to start giving presentations about this tank and other projects I've done like making my own filters and such! I haven't had time to work on the DVD but I will this coming weekend. I'm having surgery this thursday morning so I'll have a few days of not being able to do anything after that but sit in front of the computer and compile every video shot!


----------



## auratum

Sounds like you are having the bullets taken out of the gun...


----------



## Chuck Petrosky

I recently saw a video where a cucumber was being fed to the fish. I also seen a video where you do the same. I gave it a try in my 130 gallon fresh community tank and the clown loaches loved it. so did almost every other fish in the tank. They divoured it within 1 day. Does this have any nutritional value?
If I was the moderatory I'd give the fish guy a big :thumb: I've learned so much from this guy and my :fish: have too. They arn't ready for hot dogs yet thoe :lol: Anyways, thanks for sharing and teaching others =D> ...good luck too with the snip, I mean surgery.


----------



## TheFishGuy

FREE LOVE!!! :lol:

Of course there's nutritional value in feeding your fish fresh veggies! Have you tried anything else? Romaine lettuce is good too!


----------



## sirdavidofdiscus

TFG how did you clean those clay pipes the 1st time you used them? I just had to replace a the plumbing from my house to the septic tank. So I have a few pieces laying around my yard
.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Well, in your case did they have raw sewage running through them or where they just in the ground? If raw sewage is the case obviously hose them off well then soak them in dilluted bleach water. Rinse them throw them in the oven on 350 for 15 minutes or so. Serve hot! :lol:

If they weree just in the ground I'd just rinse them off to get the dirt off... That's all I do


----------



## BigJagLover

The on the ground thig is what i did as well. I dont thing many paces still use the clay pipes do they?


----------



## TheFishGuy

No, only for repairs....

Hey check out the newest member "Bert"




























Bert's 20" tip to tip and hopefully will be going to the Cleveland Metroparks Zoo in an Asian biotope


----------



## bell

nice fish  where did he come from? rescue?


----------



## TheFishGuy

Yep, a member of this site Lowcel...


----------



## TheFishGuy

Ok... So I'm a little fired up at the moment... Let me explain... I went to the village of Orwell (my home town) to ask if I could put out my Monster Fish Rescue.com sign in the front yard because I was hosting a board meeting for the Ohio Cichlid Association as I'm a board member and voulonteered to host a meeting. The sign is 18" x 24".










I went to the village and I asked if there was a permit I needed to get to put the sign out, she (Vicki Thomson who is the zoning inspector) said she wasn't sure but if I wanted to put it out this one time that was fine and then we'd talk about it at a later date... This came in the mail for me:



















After calling this morning she tells me people were complaining about the sign... Likely story. No one has ever complained about the sign before I brought it to her attention. When I brought it to her attention I also told her that we're not open to the public and that rescues were performed over the internet and that at a last resort fish would come here. And 99% of the time I go get the fish IF the fish even needs to come here. Thankfully most rescues are resolved before even making it to the website or here! The last time someone came here and brought a fish that needed rescued was four months ago. And the sign was out for a couple of weeks at that time... Not a single complaint then...

So now I've got 90 days to shut down my non-profit LLC for running a buisiness out of my home. There's a Planning and Zoning Meeting April 21st @ 6:30 P.M. at:

179 West Main Street

Orwell Ohio 44076

They want me to come and ask for a condition use permit which costs $175 because I run an internet fish rescue.

I'm asking for your support. If you believe that what I do is a good thing, if you're a supporter of Monster Fish Rescue then come to the meeting, it's open to the public. If you can't come to the meeting write a letter and send it to:

Orwell Zoning Commision

c/o Vicki Thomson

179 West Main Street

Orwell Ohio 44076

I'm not asking for donations, I'm asking for your support in any way you can. Personally I find the entire situation rediculous. No good deed goes unpunished.

If you sell Avon, or Creative Memories supplies, or have ever sold a single thing on eBay or Aquabid you're an internet buisiness. If you've ever babysat for someone, you're running a buisiness out of your home. Better run out and get that permit!

On a lighter note, youtube has pulled their head from their [email protected]#% Here's some videos of the tank and our latest rescue!!!!


----------



## LowCel

That is complete BS! Could you make up a rough draft letter and post it so people can alter it a little then mail it in to show their support? I know I would be happy to, I just wouldn't know where to start writing the letter from scratch.

Thanks again for giving "Bert" a good home. I'm glad to hear that your wife is so crazy about him. My wife didn't feel quite the same way. Of course the fact that he bit my wife didn't help matters out any. I gave him a BIG treat afterwards though. 

Also, looking forward to seeing the videos. Can't view youtube from work.


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## LowCel

Forgot I can check out videos on my iphone. The first video is awesome, haven't made it to the second video yet. Bert looks awesome in there, I really like his groupies as well.

Is Bert bigger than the Pacu?


----------



## Rockydog

TheFishGuy said:


> Ok... So I'm a little fired up at the moment... Let me explain... I went to the village of Orwell (my home town) to ask if I could put out my Monster Fish Rescue.com sign in the front yard because I was hosting a board meeting for the Ohio Cichlid Association as I'm a board member and voulonteered to host a meeting. The sign is 18" x 24".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I went to the village and I asked if there was a permit I needed to get to put the sign out, she (Vicki Thomson who is the zoning inspector) said she wasn't sure but if I wanted to put it out this one time that was fine and then we'd talk about it at a later date... This came in the mail for me:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After calling this morning she tells me people were complaining about the sign... Likely story. No one has ever complained about the sign before I brought it to her attention. When I brought it to her attention I also told her that we're not open to the public and that rescues were performed over the internet and that at a last resort fish would come here. And 99% of the time I go get the fish IF the fish even needs to come here. Thankfully most rescues are resolved before even making it to the website or here! The last time someone came here and brought a fish that needed rescued was four months ago. And the sign was out for a couple of weeks at that time... Not a single complaint then...
> 
> So now I've got 90 days to shut down my non-profit LLC for running a buisiness out of my home. There's a Planning and Zoning Meeting April 21st @ 6:30 P.M. at:
> 
> 179 West Main Street
> 
> Orwell Ohio 44076
> 
> They want me to come and ask for a condition use permit which costs $175 because I run an internet fish rescue.
> 
> I'm asking for your support. If you believe that what I do is a good thing, if you're a supporter of Monster Fish Rescue then come to the meeting, it's open to the public. If you can't come to the meeting write a letter and send it to:
> 
> Orwell Zoning Commision
> 
> c/o Vicki Thomson
> 
> 179 West Main Street
> 
> Orwell Ohio 44076
> 
> I'm not asking for donations, I'm asking for your support in any way you can. Personally I find the entire situation rediculous. No good deed goes unpunished.
> 
> If you sell Avon, or Creative Memories supplies, or have ever sold a single thing on eBay or Aquabid you're an internet buisiness. If you've ever babysat for someone, you're running a buisiness out of your home. Better run out and get that permit!
> 
> On a lighter note, youtube has pulled their head from their [email protected]#% Here's some videos of the tank and our latest rescue!!!!


Instead of snail mail here is a list of contacts that have e-mail address's http://www.orwellvillage.org/directory.htm and this is the zoning inspectors address [email protected].

Message sent!


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## RyanR

That's pretty nuts. Did they fine you?

If so, can't you just say it's Monster Fish Rescue .com for state senate?

Is the hoo-ha over the sign.... or the whole MFR concept?

-Ryan


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## TheFishGuy

It started with a the sign, because I wanted to put it out if people were coming from out of town they could find the house easier. Then I sent the cease and desist paperwork... HAVING NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SIGN...

Here's how the letter started:

"It has been brought to our attention that you are running a business in a residential area. you will have to the next Planning and Zoning Meeting to be held . April 21st. @6:30 pm and ask for a conditional use permit, then there will have to be a public hearing on the matter."


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## travis2k

BOO-URNS!!

That sucks, I had a quick look at the Orwell website, and can't find any zoning bylaws.
Do you have, or can you get a copy of zoning bylaws? I know in my area you can have a home based business as long as it conforms to certain standards.

I have worked in the land development business and feel you pain deadling with small town beauraucrats. I think a form letter might help some people with what to write, I would also talk to your neighbors, as they are generally important in these kinds of decisions.

Let us know how we can help.


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## RyanR

Of course it's not a "business".... You can argue that folks can breed fancy purebred doggies in their house. With dogs, they can charge mad money for a puppy with papers. That's totally "for-profit".

Whereas I'm sure MFR operates in the red....

-Ryan


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## mthigpen_02

Since you don't make any money from taking in fish I even question how your considered a business. Maybe a non-profit charity or free adoption agency but certainly not a business.


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## LowCel

I guess the guy down the road that takes in every dog around and just leaves them outside to bark and almost starve to death is alright though. Afterall, he probably doesn't have a website.

(not a particular guy but just about every area has this guy, it could be a woman with cats thoguh)


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## LowCel

RyanR said:


> Whereas I'm sure MFR operates in the red....
> 
> -Ryan


I'm sure of that. He only requested a small donation for some gas money to meet me to pick up Bert. He drove over 2 1/2 hours each way in a large Suburban. I guarantee he spent more on gas than I donated. On top of that Bert eats a LOT!!!!


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## LowCel

mthigpen_02 said:


> Since you don't make any money from taking in fish I even question how your considered a business. Maybe a non-profit charity or free adoption agency but certainly not a business.


Good point, I think he should turn it into a business. If he does he can show that he is operating at a loss every year and keep track of all expenses. He will then be able to get a nice tax return every year. :dancing:


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## TheFishGuy

Part of being a non profit is that MFR's tax statements need to be public record. I have not attained non profit 501c3 status yet but will soon.

Here's what I'll be reading at the up coming meeting:

Monster Fish Rescue.com

Pertaining to the matter of the Monster Fish Rescue.com sign that was in the front yard of 113 South Maple Street, where I, Jonathan Strazinsky reside, I would like to clarify (1) the signs purpose, and (2) Monster Fish Rescue as a business.

1.)	I contacted zoning the week of March 9th to ask about placing the sign in my front yard as a simple land mark for fellow board members of the Ohio Cichlid Association so they could easily find where our board meeting was going to take place. Each month a board member of the OCA volunteers to host a board meeting at their residence. I volunteered to host Marches meeting. I wanted to make sure there were no issues with the village of Orwell with me wanted to put the sign up. Vicki Thomson informed me that I could set up the sign on the day of the meeting (March 14th 2009) and she then would bring it up to her boss about possibly keeping the sign up on a permanent basis which I was told would cost $10. Initially I just wanted to have the sign out to use as a land mark for when people would come over for any reason what so ever. Then Vicki told me that it was only $10 for a sign permit.
Admittedly I forgot to take the sign down. The meeting ended late and we had family over the following day. My priority was not to get the sign down but to prepare our home for visitors. I apologize if the sign offended someone in the village but I find it interesting that the first time I bring the sign up to a village employee all of a sudden thereâ€™s â€œComplaints about the signâ€


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## LowCel

Unless they are just complete asses I don't see how they could rule against you. That is just one man's opinion though.


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## illy-d

Unbelievable. Is MFR a business? Do not for profit societies fall under the same category as for profit enterprise in your area?

I'll write an email to Vicki but it would probably carry more weight if my comments were correct - MFR is a rescue society correct?

Anyhow do any of the other fish give Bert a hard time?


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## TheFishGuy

No body really gives Bert hard time.. it seems he's their new leader LOL

MFR is a non profit LLC.

This was written and posted on another forum I belong to. I , of course think itâ€™s excellent! Feel free to do with it what you please.

[quote name='BenPursglove' date='Mar 23 2009, 08:55 PM' post='2317586']
OK if anyone wants to help support the MonsterFishRescue.com project please see the email at the bottom of this post.

I'm sure a little spammage from this site will soon sort them out and we can enjoy some more vids. Replace the "etc" at the end of the mail with your name...my mail is going as soon as I post this.

Dear Sir / Madam

It has recently come to my attention that you have recently served Lora& Jonathan Strazinsky (address unknown) with a â€œstop zoning and/or building violationâ€


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## illy-d

Sorry - I didn't see there was a page after the one I was reading... You answered my question...


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## illy-d

Jonathan - check your MFR email, I bcc'd you on a message I sent to the Village of Orwell in your support. I hope it helps.


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## TheFishGuy

Will do


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## Chuck Petrosky

Turn your mailbox into a Monster fish and put the name on it. I came from a foster home and my foster parents did not have problems running there business out of the home. The home was the business. Your fostering fish. If the problem is the sign, use your mailbox. People down the road run a computer business and stuck there mailbox in a monitor, mounted it and thats how there clients find them. Your handy, I'm sure you can come up with something cool.


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## OceanDevil

Chuck Petrosky said:


> Turn your mailbox into a Monster fish and put the name on it. I came from a foster home and my foster parents did not have problems running there business out of the home. The home was the business. Your fostering fish. If the problem is the sign, use your mailbox. People down the road run a computer business and stuck there mailbox in a monitor, mounted it and thats how there clients find them. Your handy, I'm sure you can come up with something cool.


Awesome Idea! :thumb:


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## TheFishGuy

The issue is they say I'm running a business in a residential area.


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## bell

can you contact your local congressman? sometimes the higher ups can help with dealing with stubborn local governments.......you pay taxes for a reason......if you get nowhere at the meeting of course......

leave out the part where you left the other big box with a sign on it out last year......
and don't call the sign an advertisement, makes it sound like a business........theres a better word but i can't think of it right now.


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## sirdavidofdiscus

I've been to your house a couple of times. Your house is on a major state highway and what, 3 houses down from the intersection where everything is commercial. I don't see how they'd have a problem with the sign. Some people need better things to do. Get them a good hobby like some kind of internet forum to read and post on all day. :lol:


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## TheFishGuy

:lol: Nice :lol:


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## LowCel

BCC'd you on my letter. Hope it helps.


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## travis2k

http://www.city.courtenay.bc.ca/media/8 ... 202500.pdf

Just thought I'd send you a quick copy of our local bylaws here, on page 21 is the part about home occupation.

Do you have anything in your municipality that lays out the rules?

the short version, is you can do most businesses out of your house, as long as no one can tell your doing it.


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## Coln

Poor Cindy just got an eMail from Hopeman, are they compelled to reply to queries?
Been watching your tank progress awesome stuff, keep up all the good work =D>


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## Mandalawi

Done and Done. Keep up the work on the tank. Why is it that local governments seem to just HAVE to go overboard on somethings / people at times.


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## illy-d

Mandalawi said:


> Done and Done. Keep up the work on the tank. Why is it that local governments seem to just HAVE to go overboard on somethings / people at times.


Honestly it's because I think they are bored and they have to try and make themselves look busy... Ever notice that things like this only become 'problems' when people try to do the right or honourable thing and operate above board? Jonathan tried to do the right thing and it came back to bite his a$$.

Bureaucrats are typically too lazy and set in their ways to actually go out and look for 'problems' to fix or wrongs to right... They are like little gifts from heaven when they appear unsolicited in their email inbox or over the phone.

There's a very good chance that Stan the by-law enforcement officer was taking a break from eating a donut and scratching his ass and he had wandered over to Vicki & Cindy's area of the office to resume his marathon 'flirt' sessions that occupy 90% of his day and he overheard the call about erecting signage in front of a house... In a misguided effort to impress the Ladies in the office Stan thought he would mosey on over and check things out on the way to the donut shop (where he would purchase more donuts for himself and coffee for the Ladies - Cindy likes it Black and Vicki likes it with Sweet & Low and non fat skim Milk). If TheFishGuy had not have lived so close to the local Donut Shop Stan probably wouldn't have bothered to go out of the way and none of this would have happened - as fate would have it this was Stan's lucky day and he got to be the Hero saving Orwell Village from the clutches of Monster Fish while fullfilling his jobs number one prerequisite - getting the coffee.

How do I know this? I used to work for a municipality and this is how they rolled from 8:30am to 4:30pm Monday to Friday except on holidays... Of course I could be wrong (but I doubt it).


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## TheFishGuy

Oh, but illy-d, c'mon, people complained about the sign... :roll:


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## Mandalawi

It just cracks me up because we have something along similar lines going on here due to a mural that a business owner painted on the side of his building and the city has been relentlessly going after him for years now constantly dragging him into court.


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## TheFishGuy

Dumb..... just plain DUMB


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## Mandalawi

While i don't endorse this site at all this is the Most complete timeline i could find in a short amount of time. This is the similar silliness i was talking about. 
http://randazza.wordpress.com/2008/02/2 ... se-update/


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## TheFishGuy

Interesting....


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## RyanR

If the problem is just the sign, perhaps a better strategy is to just pack it in, and devise some desktop sized displays that you could leave at animal hospitals/veterinarians and fish/pet stores.

Whatever you do, don't tell anyone that you've got 1500 gallons o' fish already happening. There's a ordinance against everything. :roll:

-Ryan


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## TheFishGuy

The thing is, the city is well aware of my tanks... so far no issues until now...

Ok, what do you say we get this thread back on track with some VIDEOS!!! People have asked about my other tanks and what fish I keep. So I took the camera down stairs to do a little tour of the basementâ€¦

Vid #1 is of some small tanks in the back behind the 240





Vid #2 is more small tanks behind the 185





Vid #3 is the 185





Vid #4 is the 240 (wifes frontosa tank with no frontosa in it at the moment LOL)





Vid #5 is the 1500





Vid #6 is of the mechanicals of the 1500 (filter and heating system)





Iâ€™m working on some statistics of the 1500 and Iâ€™ll post those later today ;-)


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## klumsyninja

TFG: WOW!

Thoroughly enjoyed the tour.. Thanks a bunch.

Question: Do you think it's a good idea to have tons of us spamming them with letters? Do you not think that will piss them off and potentially make your life more uncomfortable?

I know if it were me I'd be pissed to be swamped with all kinds of letters and emails..

That said, I 100% back you on this and am willing to of course send a letter of endorsement if you think that's what you'd like from us.

I think it's ridiculous that they are bothering you over such a little sign. People put monstrously ugly lawn ornaments and landscapes on their property advertising their poor taste and reason... yours is just a simple sign... Ridiculous.

Side note: when we flush our dead fish it causes problems at water treatment centers? Did not know that.


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## illy-d

Why do you want the Brichardi's and Labs out of the Front tank? They're all African so you have a nice theme going there...

Your heating system on the 1500 has a lot in common with the refrigeration systems used in Hockey Arenas - I imagine it's pretty efficient. I would be shocked if the temp in the big tank was ever out more than half a degree.


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## TheFishGuy

As for the fish in the water treatment plant. It's not a big deal. they break down as fast if not faster than a chunk of poo :lol: They've got more things to worry about being flushed thatn a dead fish. Like womanly products if you know what I mean... As for labs and brichardi. The brichardi might be able to go back in some day but they harass the mpimbwe fronts, nipping and such. The labs are from lake malawi and were in there for some color until the fronts got a little bigger. Now that the fronts react to my wife when she comes up to the tank she's happy and doesn't need the labs any longer LOL

For you numbers people hereâ€™s some fun stats:

This represents total water volume involved in running the tank:

Sump = 163.09 25 Â½â€


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## sirdavidofdiscus

Doesn't look like you have many oscars anymore.


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## TheFishGuy

There's three in there. The other two I've got are on loan to someone trying to attain master breeder level in the youngstown club  BUT the two biggest are doing the dance in the tank over a nice flat rock


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## herny

sweet man that would be cool to see them breed in a community tank like that and see their behavior


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## LowCel

It's so nice to see that I am not the only person that posts on various forums.

Now I've got to tell you that I am slightly po'd about your tank. You have spent less on it than I have on my 300 gallon setup. That does not give me the warm fuzzy feeling I was looking for.


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## TheFishGuy

herny said:


> sweet man that would be cool to see them breed in a community tank like that and see their behavior


 I've had oscars spawn in the 800. It was interesting because there was eight oscars at the time. All eight protected the eggs! But it proves to be too stressful for oscars to spawn in comminity settings so they eat the eggs....


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## TheFishGuy

LowCel said:


> It's so nice to see that I am not the only person that posts on various forums.
> 
> Now I've got to tell you that I am slightly po'd about your tank. You have spent less on it than I have on my 300 gallon setup. That does not give me the warm fuzzy feeling I was looking for.


DIY Baby, DIY.

Incidently that was the cost to do the addition and rebuild. The entire project has a touch under 4K in it.


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## illy-d

Is that a typo? How much glass do you have that it weighs 7 tons? Did you mean water?


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## TheFishGuy

It was joke man... It just felt like it weighed 7 tons :lol:


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## TheFishGuy

Upon request Iâ€™ve shot some videos again.
The first is feeding the massesâ€¦ 










Then I thought Iâ€™d take you guys through a water change. Also in this Iâ€™ve tested my water upon request. I normally do not test my water because I feel if fish are spawning and getting their fry to free swimming stage on their own then the water must be cleanâ€¦ A bit old fashioned I guessâ€¦ It was only after spending some time on forums I thought Iâ€™d better get a test kit. So I went and wasted some money on oneâ€¦ I donâ€™t test my water when fish get sick because they rarely do. Itâ€™s when I introduce new fish then usually the only thing I ever have to deal with is ick. And I can handle that without testing water 
Hereâ€™s a short series of what I have to do for a water change. Itâ€™s not rocket science. So if itâ€™s â€œIâ€


----------



## mepeterser2451

hey how's the drylock holding up on your setup? i was plannin on building a 75-100gal plywood with drylock this summer just cause i have the glass from a broken tank. do you think the hardipanel is really necessary for such a small tank? or could i use the hardipanel without plywood? any advice?


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## TheFishGuy

I'd use the hardie with plywood... Drylok does not last on plywood... Speaking from experience...


----------



## illy-d

Checked out your vids - very cool. Have you though about trying some floating plants - lilly pads would look very cool in there!

How do you transport Bert?


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## TheFishGuy

Bert will go in a 30 gallon rubbermaid tub for the hour ride along with a bettery powered pump and sponge filter 

I've tried floating plants but they eat em LOL


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## Cursor

I'm assuming you throw in dechlor of some type before you start to refill the tank during a water change?


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## TheFishGuy

1 1/3 cups of stress coat is added while the water is refilling. 1/2 cup treats 240 gallons. The water change is a touch under 500 gallons


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## Cursor

Thanks, I thought I watched all the video's but I obviously skipped right over that one.


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## TheFishGuy

:lol: It happens when people post too much at once :lol:


----------



## Mussin

Whats the story on Bert?? He is HUGE! The cleveland Zoo is taking him in? Where did you get him from? What size tank was he in?

Jeremy


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## illy-d

Is there a reason why you use stress coat over a product like Prime? 99% of the people I know in the hobby locally use Prime - is stress coat better or cheaper?


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## Coln

Is that seacham prime, called 'safe' in the uk and lasts for ever would have thought good for
your size of tank


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## TheFishGuy

Old habbits die hard I guess... I get it a gallon at a time for $30. But I'm looking into getting water conditioner from a pond supply store... it's much cheaper


----------



## TheFishGuy

Bert is going to the Zoo in a couple of weeks. They asked me to hold him until they;re ready for him and one of their larger quaranteen tanks opens up... They had an anchor worm issue...


----------



## Sav505

TheFishGuy, I've just got to say one little thing. With all of the time, effort and money you spend on this big beautiful tank, why do you put flower pots in it? I know the fish like to hide in them, but why not try to come up with something a little nicer to look at? Like maybe some hollow logs or something. A great place to look is around the lake after a good rain. If you lived close to me I would give you the wood from my old 180.

Don't get me wrong here, I still think your the man when it comes to DIY tanks. I just thought I'd throw it out there.


----------



## TheFishGuy

Honestly, I like the pipes and clay and pots. I'll tell you why. For the longest time i used to do everything natural. Wood, hollow logs, all kinds of slate and what not. BUT I've found that when you start to use more things that _don't_ break down in your tank the better your filtration responds. Less time rinsing prefilters and more time just watching the fish. Also, when you keep as many aggressive species as I do in one tank you need hide spots... Again, I like the logs and such, just too messy....


----------



## bell

tfg......i was finally able to get to the sweetwater epoxy out of my storage.........i'm going to keep one gallon and donate the other to MFR.......i have light grey and dark blue, pick a color.....i'll be using the other for inside my stand/hood so i don't care which color i end up with 
also pm me your shipping addy and i'll get it out this week.......


----------



## Chuck Petrosky

I was just wondering if you could give us some more info on your heating system. Where to purchase a thermastat and the cir pump? How much does the unit run physically and $. Have you noticed much of an increase in the bill for your hot water?
Would it help in the energy usage to insulate the outter walls of the tank with foam-board insulation as well as wrapping the pipes?
Another question is how do you keep your bio media saturated in the event of a prolonged power outtage? Idea: use a back up batery powered sump pump to pull water from the sump and redirect it threw the bio media. Just an idea
Also like the windmill powered air stones for large ponds. might be nice to get the water moving in the deep end and keep the tank oxyginated in thoes unexpected power outtages.


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## TheFishGuy

Chuck. The pump was purchased at a plumbing supply store through my account. If you know a plumber or are friends with one you could go that route. The name of the pump was a grundfos. The thermostat was purchased from jehmco. A sponsor of this site. I have not noticed a significant increase in my gas bill... Though I'm two months behind on it so I try not to look at it LOL

As for power outages they rarely last longer than a couple of hours. The longest was eight hours. I guess I'll have to take my chances until I can afford a generator some time in the future. I do have a way to wire the generator into my panel when the time comes...

I do have battery powered pumps that can run all the small tanks, but nothing for the sumps to keep water flowing through the bio media....


----------



## TheFishGuy

Hello Everyone and Happy Easter. Iâ€™m writing today in desperation. Weâ€™ve received a disconnection notice. Work has just started back up for me and weâ€™re still playing the catch up game and money is not coming in fast enough. Weâ€™re short roughly $1000 and Iâ€™m afraid of what would happen if our electricity/gas gets turned off. I know that times are tough right now for everyone but Iâ€™m asking if someone could please dig deep to help MFR out of this situation. Thank you very much. Jonathan


----------



## truett

you have a pm


----------



## AfricansRule

PM Sent


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## TheFishGuy

Thank you.


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## Morpheus

Jonathon, do you have a paypal account set up?


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## LowCel

Money sent, sorry it isn't more.


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## TheFishGuy

The paypal account associated with MFR is my old email address. [email protected]

Thank you both very much


----------



## Nathan43

pm sent


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## truett

Has anyone heard from thefishguy?


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## LowCel

truett said:


> Has anyone heard from thefishguy?


I spoke to him via e-mail this evening.

Anyway, come on guys and gals, lets help out a member that really contributes to the hobby in his moment of need.


----------



## joshmonica

keep the lights on, you have been an inspiration to many here. Although i don't post often i have enjoyed both your original build and the addition. The video series was awesome. Its great to see both the ups and downs of a diy build.

I just recently looked on google maps to see where orwell, ohio is. We live very close, i am just outside of Erie.

I keep meaning to join the ohio cichlid association and will one of these days. Definitely going to the fall events this year.

Maybe one of these days i will have to employ your services/construction skills for my own monster build (as soon as the wife approves and i know we wont be moving.....trying to convince the wife we need a larger house at the moment)

josh

p.s. pay pal donation sent


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## TheFishGuy

Thank you everyone so very much for your generosity. MFR is alive! Thanks to you all!! I'm sorry I haven't been on line very much... Dur to the recent financial situation I decided to work five 12's in a row... hopefully we'll get caught up!! I think we will!!! I'm off today due to weather and more than likely tomorrow too. I guess i should have went to college :lol: I love my chosen career but it's like feast or famine around here all the time. Thankfully my wife understands because her father is a carpenter too... You always seem to get the inside work when it's beautiful outside and the outside work when it's going to rain cichlids and catfish......

BUT! With everyones help MFR will be around for a while longer!! On that front, our latest rescue is a 22 1/2" Clown knife named Bozo!! He a beast and now the larges fish by one half of an inch in the 1500!


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## travis2k

Glad to hear things are looking up, my dads a carpenter I completely understand the feast or famine thing. Keep up the good work. (I just took in my first adoptee, an 8" red devil who needed a home, she will go in my 700 gallon) So thanks again, without your 800 for inspiration I might not have mine. :thumb:


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## truett

Glad to see things are looking up. I know how you feel. I have been there myself.


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## Morpheus

Glad to hear things are looking better!


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## Nathan43

TheFishGuy said:


> BUT! With everyones help MFR will be around for a while longer!! On that front, our latest rescue is a 22 1/2" Clown knife named Bozo!! He a beast and now the larges fish by one half of an inch in the 1500!


Got a video of this guy, would love to see it.


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## LowCel

Nathan43 said:


> TheFishGuy said:
> 
> 
> 
> BUT! With everyones help MFR will be around for a while longer!! On that front, our latest rescue is a 22 1/2" Clown knife named Bozo!! He a beast and now the larges fish by one half of an inch in the 1500!
> 
> 
> 
> Got a video of this guy, would love to see it.
Click to expand...

Same here, I'd also like to see an update on Bert. I miss his ugly mug.


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## TheFishGuy

I do have a vid, but I'm a little behind on water changes. for now, an update on MFR.

Iâ€™m writing this evening to update everyone on the status of Monster Fish Rescue. It seems as if due to a technicality I have no choice but to apply for a conditional use permit in order to keep â€œrunning my business in a residential areaâ€


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## LowCel

Man I am getting tired of hearing this stuff. You are doing way too good of a deed to keep running into so many obstacles. Good guys really can't catch a break. Good luck Jonathon, I really hope things work out for you and soon.


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## TheFishGuy

Thanks LowCel... I'm going to take a break for a while...


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## bell

dude you need to call carl monday........


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## parkayandbutter

In memory of the past.......... For you Buddy....... From Tx:


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## TheFishGuy

And people accuse me of over crowding.......


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## bell

Tfg.....I have the name of an attorney which handles exactly what you are dealing with, recommended by a good well off friend in ashtabula, he's in geneva and his name is ken piper, any lawyer will give you 5 minutes free to see if and how they can help.....may be worth a shot....I received some other advice which I'll pm you tonite....sitting on the beach right now LOL


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## TheFishGuy

You go sit on your beach... I'll go swimming...


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## bell

Does the screen just pop in? No other fish are stuck in the pipe I hope.....can you flush that line to make sure?


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## illy-d

I thought for sure they would bite.


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## TheFishGuy

illy-d said:


> I thought for sure they would bite.


Me Too! :lol:

I can see all the way down into that pipe and there's plenty of normal flow going through it because the water level in the tank has not changed... The piece of decor I picked up with my foot might have knocked the cover off... It used to be up at the surface and I actually saw the pacu freak out at one point and swim into it... The cover is like the cover in a shower... It just snaps in... but takes a screw driver to pop it off...


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## Bigcatsrus (the bf!)

Hi,

Awesome is the only word that springs to mind. :thumb: One day I think we are going to have to do something similar  but hey ho.

Just a thought in reguards to the sign issue, don't know if it'll help in the future but a big ar$e vinyl sticker on the rear window of a car parked outside would do what you wanted but perhaps not be covered by the same laws. :-?

I'm amazed that another country is more anal with the old red tape than the UK! :?


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## TheFishGuy

Actually, I was able to get the sign permit. They made a mistake as the sign meets the criteria :lol:

The issue now is running a "business" from my home. The great part is it's ALL internet so I can run it from anywhere in the world 

They've got nothing


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## Turtlemaxxx

I know a guy who runs his carpentry/ handyman business out of the upstairs of his house. the upstairs has his showroom and office. come tax time the city tried to tax him the higher business rate for the whole house's square footage instead of just the upstairs. you can run the business from anywhere but they will prolly want a "home base" for it. just chimmin in here. And as always, i want your tank. :thumb:

-matt


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## jschall

TheFishGuy said:


> You go sit on your beach... I'll go swimming...


Lucky you, when I stood in my turtle tank the turtles tried to eat my legs.


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## gtsum

incredible journey so far, and best of luck to you with the town :thumb:


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## TheFishGuy

> Re: Making my 800 800 gallons bigger
> ________________________________________
> â€œJonathan, I hope you got through your crisis, I was unable to help because as you said, times are tough. Please give us an update!â€


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## bell

dude that really sucks.......i made a new header on my facebook page directing to your site.....


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## dwarfpike

It's things like this that make you think that good deeds do go unnoticed ...

But they don't. Take care of family and home first, you can always reopen it later.

Just so you know, not that it will really help now ... but if I ever win or come into a lot of money, MFR will be my charity of choice!!!

Good luck man!!


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## TheFishGuy

Thanks guys  I might have a pike you might be interested in there dwarfpike cr. semicincta (wild caught)


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## JamieH

Dude

I read through both threads... although i didn't reply so much... i u=wish i could help you - you've been an inspiration to me.


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## greencross420

good luck man, maybe you could pull some sponsers? I dont know best of luck.


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## TheFishGuy

I've got something totally off subject but I know of someone in the memphis, tn area in desperate need to rehome his oscar, his zip is 38104. Is anyone close that can take him??? PLEASE!!!!


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## TheFishGuy

Little update, the village is off my back, but now it's something worse...


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## dwarfpike

Geez Joanthan, you are like me ... if it weren't for bad luck, we wouldn't have any luck at all!! :?


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## TheFishGuy

I'm a little nervous with this bout of bad luck though. It's a little beyond bad luck...


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## Lancerlot

TheFishGuy said:


> I'm a little nervous with this bout of bad luck though. It's a little beyond bad luck...


Man. Just watched the video. This is sad to hear. . Were you hurt while working? Cause I know here in ontario and rest of canada we have something like workmen's comp. Pays for you not working. Till your better.

There's got to be something for you in Ohio. I wish I could help out but i'm just starting in life  I'm a carpenter my self all season. I've been injured many times and got pay while being off work. I hope you can find something like this.


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## TheFishGuy

It's kind of a different situation.... Didn't get hurt at work...


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## Lancerlot

TheFishGuy said:


> It's kind of a different situation.... Didn't get hurt at work...


awe ****


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## TheFishGuy

You're tellin' me......


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## Zack2112

I really wish there was a way I could help you out, you have been doing a great thing here. Unfortunately I am a college student struggling to get by myself. I hope things work out for you and I wish you all the best.


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## jb1234

Hey TFG sorry to hear the bad news. I am going to build a plywood tank and was wondering how much wood you left overhang the glass to silicone the glass to. Do you thinka 2 inch reveal enough. More or less?


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## TheFishGuy

I shoot for three inch... Depending on what size the tank is... Under 300 gallons 2" is probably fine.


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## jb1234

Thanks for the response. I am looking at right around 400 gallons.


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## TheFishGuy

You're welcome.

The auctions are now up on eBay:

Clown Loach Shirt

Oscar Shirt


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## jb1234

A couple of questions for you. Why did you line the tank with hardi panel then armor coat. Why not just armor coat over the plywood? Also where did you buy sheets of hardi panel? Having a hard time finding them locally. Trying to tidy up the final details before I begin my build.

Thanks
Justin


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## TheFishGuy

The reason Hardie panel was used is because it's a concrete based product and pond armor is designed to work with sealing concrete ponds.

Also, I know for a fact if you go to the Home Depot Pro Desk and tell them you're looking for Hardie soffit material called specificly "Hardie Panel" they can order it for you at roughly $30 a sheet.

If you decide to start a thread would you throw up a link to it on this thread?


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## jb1234

I will definitely start a thread and add a link as soon as I get started. Which should be any day now.


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## tsmi031

WOW ... I'm in awe ... just stumbled across this thread ... amazing


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## TheFishGuy

*tsmi031* where in ohio are you? I'm in the extreme north east...


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## SupeDM

Hope things are going ok now. Unless you broke your foot at home and dont have homeowners insurance then someone has to pay for it. Who's property were you on they are ultimately responsible for paying for the bills and lost wages, also it is their responsibility to find out what insurance company should cover it. Call a lawyer and he will have it covered in a day or so. Also my car insurance offers a blanket policy that covers anything anytime with a deductible and covers lost wages. Its 70 dollars a month for my whole house, family and anyone on my property. Wish I was working so I could send some money but I also broke my leg at work this year and My company offered a early layoff so I could keep my health insurance and all that ****. I wont go back to work my real job untill May. Look into a blanket insurance policy for the future it could save your world.


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## jb1234

"Unless you broke your foot at home and dont have homeowners insurance then someone has to pay for it. Who's property were you on they are ultimately responsible for paying for the bills and lost wages, also it is their responsibility to find out what insurance company should cover it. Call a lawyer and he will have it covered in a day or so."

Now this is the new american way. SUE SUE SUE. Come on unless it was someone else who actually caused the injury why go after the person.


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## TheFishGuy

Ok, let's not start anything about this... It happened at home. I'm back to work now playing the catch up game... Just rescued a 45# 28" pacu last nite...


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## jb1234

Holy cow of a pacu. That thing is a monster for sure. Good to here your back to work. :thumb:


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## TheFishGuy

Check out these pictures... When I went in to get a picture of the pacu all the fish thought it was time to eat! :lol:

http://s47.photobucket.com/albums/f197/ ... 9f45d7.pbw


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## tsmi031

TheFishGuy said:


> *tsmi031* where in ohio are you? I'm in the extreme north east...


I am just outside of Columbus ... sorry to hear about the run of bad luck ... hoping things turn around for you quickly


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## TheFishGuy

Thanks, me too. If you're ever up in this area feel free to stop on by


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## tsmi031

I would love to if I ever get the chance, that tank is amazing ... I may have to pick your brain on a filtering design down the line


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## TheFishGuy

Filtering is most of the time way over engineered. Filtering tanks is not rocket science  I have enough sponge filters to filter this 1500 with them :lol:


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## Rhinox

So...

3 days later and I've finally read every post in all three threads about this tank... Well worth the read. Certainly puts my puny 55g "project" into perspective.

Anyways, somewhere along the way, I remember you talking about being in debt and thinking maybe you should have went to school... Well let me tell you, you don't know debt until you're sitting under a pile of student loans. Between my wife and I, our combined loans are pretty much mortgage levels. You have a house, and we can't yet afford one because its impossible to save up a down payment. This is not to say we struggle... we manage to pay all our bills and all, but it still gets tough when brake pads, rotors, and tires all need replaced at the same time, so are we really better off? Idk, maybe in 30 years when loans are payed off will the extra income really start to pay dividends - if we manage to keep steady jobs... I'll tell you what though... most days, while I'm sitting at my desk doing (or not doing) engineering stuff, sometimes I wish I was actually outside really working - making things, buiding things, anything tangible, acomplishing SOMETHING. I couldn't even think about doing that now, because if I didn't have a job where I'd make as much as I do right now, I couldn't afford to pay my loans. Maybe I'm just at the wrong job... idk. So... grass is always greener on the other side... always.

But the read was enough to get me to start eying up my basement (in the house we're renting  ) in a completely different light. Its set up in a way thats pretty much perfect for a large wall/tank setup... if only we owned the place. I'd do the stocking a little different though... probably a malawi biotope.

Despite no experience, I did have a couple ideas I thought I'd share. I've been keeping them to myself so I could try them out first, but maybe I can help someone.

1: Look into plywood stitch and glue boat building and see if you get any ideas. I know its probably late in the game for this, but for any future builds or add-ons this might be a lot easier and save a lot of frustration (and probably cheaper than sealing and resealing over and over again). Specifically, I'm talking about the way the plywood seems and the plywood itself are sealed water tight. If it works for boats, it should definately work for an aquarium. A boat hull with a 30" draft should have the same pressure as a 30" deep aquarium, only on the other side of the wood.

Basically, the short summary is that the panels are held together with wire stitches (temporary). Then, and epoxy+filler putty is prepared and used to create a fillet on the inside of the joint. This fillet is then covered with fiberglass cloth and epoxy. After the inside is finished, the wire stitches are cut on the outside flush with the plywood, and more of the epoxy putty stuff is used to seal the outside and fill the holes, followed by another strip of fiberglass. That becomes a permanant, strong, durable, completely watertight joint with almost no chance of ever leaking. Then, more epoxy to seal off the rest of the plywood inside and out.

Like I said, this has been used in plywood boat building for many years, for even very large boats bigger than your giant aquarium (although it is more popular for smaller boats/canoes). For an aquarium, I'd make 2 adjustments: 1) I'd forgo the use of stitches and instead use permanant screws due to the nice right angle corners, and 2) I'd use a few layers of fiberglass cloth on all the inside surfaces of the aquarium for abrasion/impact resistance (so if a rock tumbles, it doesn't break the epoxy and cause the plywood to leak/rot. In plywood boats, the fiberglass cloth is used on the outside only for impact and abrasion resistance and doesn't add any strength at all.

I know people have used epoxy and fiberglass to seal a tank before, but pretty much everyone I have read about is still using silicone on the joints. Epoxy fillets would eliminate the need for silicone use for anything other than sealing the glass, and IMO would do a much better job than silicone anyways - otherwise, the boatbuilding guys would be using silicone  And I wouldn't be worried about it being too brittle aka breaking if the wood shifts when water is added... how much shifting do you think goes on in a boat with waves and people walking around and stuff? And these boats some say can last a hundred years.

(If you can't tell, I went through a phase where i wanted to build myself a rowboat/canoe... lake erie is so close... mmmm pearch  )

Anyways, when (yes I said when, not if  ) I build a DIY tank, whether big or small, this is the way I'm going to do it.

2: This I might try, even in my 55g. It seems a popular way to keep tanks clean is a spray bar return, and underwater jets. My idea is basically to use a spraybar as an underwater jet . It'd be perfect in a plywood tank - you could put it in the front under the glass and it'd probably never be seen behind the plywood. Seems it would do a great job "sweeping" the substrate and eliminating deadspots. Just thought it would be easier and better than running pipes all over the tank aiming jets trying to hit all the deadspots. It seems so obvious to me that I wonder if anyone has every tried it before, and if not, why not? Maybe it would be too hard to create enough pressure to get a good current going through all the holes? Idk, but I'd like to try it (or see someone else try it).

3: This idea pertains to your monster fish tank only really... Have you ever considered doing continuous water changes? You're really pretty much already set up for it. You got the ball valve on the 30% drain, and you've got the supply right above the tank. If I were you, I'd grab a 5g bucket and put it under the drain, and adjust the valve until it is draining about 2 or 3 gallons an hour, then do the same with the supply, and voila! no more water changes. Over the course of the week, you'd use the same ammount of water that you'd use doing 30% water changes anyways, so it seems obvious that you might as well just continuously change out water as you're already set up for it. You could probably even use warm water to continuously fill the tank with as the water heater should easily keep up with 2-3 gallons of warm water per hour and still leave plenty for other uses. Either way, I guess your hot water heater will be heating it now, but it would be more efficient I think to just add warm water to the tank.

So yes, those are just my peanut gallery suggestions, and yeah, its easy for an engineer to say what they would do when they're not the ones who have to do it . But I'm just a short trip down 322 if you ever need help with anything (I pretty much live right off of 322 in S. Euclid). I'm good for muscle and beer  (and I sorta wanna see the tank too  ) Actually, I just drove through orwell last friday night on my way to meadville PA. Weird.


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## TheFishGuy

*Rhinox*

Thank you for all the insight, and I might definately pick your brain on the boat thing if I ever get the opportunity to build the pacu paridise tank... I'd love to do a 10K tank just for pacu...

As for the water changes... Here's my theory as to why I don't do it automaiticly. I feel it's a necessary thing to watch your fish, and during a water change it forces me to get involved and see what's going on with them. It's important to know what the fish are doing "normally" so you can know when something abnormal is going on. Unfortunately I "normally" don't have time to just sit and watch them (actually my sons and I sat in front of the tank for 20 minutes tonite discussing names for all of the fish)

Also, the easier way is to put an over flow into the sump tank and just turn the water on at a slow drip like you said... This way in case of a power outage water doesn't over flow the sump. I have city water so the water would still be filling while the pump was off... If just used the 1/3 drain I would have to get the out flow and in flow exactly the same... Virtually impossible IMHO.

As for money... I try not to think about it too much :lol:

And you are welcome to come out any time. just shoot me a pm or email me [email protected] a couple of days ahead of time  Fish geeks are always welcome... even if they're engineers :lol:

One of my best friends is an engineer and I always rip on him and his "field verify" stamp... You guys like to use that when you don't know how something is going to get put together :lol:

It's all in good fun!


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## auratum

Rhinox - I am in the middle of a plywood tank project and had some comments/questions on your suggestions...



Rhinox said:


> Like I said, this has been used in plywood boat building for many years, for even very large boats bigger than your giant aquarium (although it is more popular for smaller boats/canoes). For an aquarium, I'd make 2 adjustments: 1) I'd forgo the use of stitches and instead use permanent screws due to the nice right angle corners, and 2) I'd use a few layers of fiberglass cloth on all the inside surfaces of the aquarium for abrasion/impact resistance (so if a rock tumbles, it doesn't break the epoxy and cause the plywood to leak/rot. In plywood boats, the fiberglass cloth is used on the outside only for impact and abrasion resistance and doesn't add any strength at all.
> 
> I know people have used epoxy and fiberglass to seal a tank before, but pretty much everyone I have read about is still using silicone on the joints. Epoxy fillets would eliminate the need for silicone use for anything other than sealing the glass, and IMO would do a much better job than silicone anyways - otherwise, the boatbuilding guys would be using silicone  And I wouldn't be worried about it being too brittle aka breaking if the wood shifts when water is added... how much shifting do you think goes on in a boat with waves and people walking around and stuff? And these boats some say can last a hundred years.


My plan is to use epoxy to seal the tanks. I am using 3/4" plywood as the tanks are not over 22" deep. The idea I came up with in lieu of using epoxy fillet was to cut strips of plywood at an angle to fill the corners and use the epoxy to seal and glue these in place. I bought stainless steel screws to hold the basic box together, but the plywood ~3/4" angle strips would lock the corners tight and allow easier lay up of the glass cloth on the inside of the tank. Do you think there would be any disadvantage to this vs. fillets of epoxy putty?



Rhinox said:


> 2: This I might try, even in my 55g. It seems a popular way to keep tanks clean is a spray bar return, and underwater jets. My idea is basically to use a spray bar as an underwater jet . It'd be perfect in a plywood tank - you could put it in the front under the glass and it'd probably never be seen behind the plywood. Seems it would do a great job "sweeping" the substrate and eliminating dead spots. Just thought it would be easier and better than running pipes all over the tank aiming jets trying to hit all the dead spots. It seems so obvious to me that I wonder if anyone has every tried it before, and if not, why not? Maybe it would be too hard to create enough pressure to get a good current going through all the holes? Idk, but I'd like to try it (or see someone else try it).


I think your idea could work depending on the desired effect. If you are trying to overcome gravity to lift fish poop off the bottom and up into the filter, then you will need a certain velocity of water to do this. To get velocity you need to either pump lots of water spread evenly across the area or use less water in higher velocity jets that entrain tank water that causes overall water movement in the tank - which will lift the poop off the bottom and into the filter. You can also use air to help move water. To add to your idea of an underwater spray bar in front on the bottom pointing to the back, you could put a bubble bar in the back on the bottom which would help lift water and create a circulation current in the tank - bottom front to bottom back to top back to top front to bottom front - do you follow? I too am an enginerd and have done some mixing design in tanks using a circulation pumps. The biggest challenge with aquariums is the shape of the tank and all the stinking decorations that cause dead spots where stuff can accumulate. Ideally you would want your filter intakes to be the dead spots, but that is tough to do as we all like to be able to move our tank decorations around based on changes in our fish and just to mess with the tanks.


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## newfisher

auratum,

The reasons for fillets are:
1 - to give the fibreglass a gradual bend around the corner to better distribute stress,
2 - to allow the fibreglass better contact with the tank at the corner.

Fibreglass just does not like to be wrapped around outside or inside sharp corners.

The 3/4" angle strips may help to distribute stresses a bit, but I would suggest they are not needed as they would create more work than necessary, since you would still need to use filler to create small fillets above and below the strips to "help" the fibreglass make the angular transitions from the sides to the bottom of the tank.


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## auratum

newfisher said:


> auratum,
> 
> The reasons for fillets are:
> 1 - to give the fibreglass a gradual bend around the corner to better distribute stress,
> 2 - to allow the fibreglass better contact with the tank at the corner.
> 
> Fibreglass just does not like to be wrapped around outside or inside sharp corners.
> 
> The 3/4" angle strips may help to distribute stresses a bit, but I would suggest they are not needed as they would create more work than necessary, since you would still need to use filler to create small fillets above and below the strips to "help" the fibreglass make the angular transitions from the sides to the bottom of the tank.


Thanks for the response newfisher. I am new to fiberglass so I appreciate the tips. I would have thought cutting the 90 degree angle into two 45 degree angles - would this still be too tight of corners for the glass cloth? How smooth of a transition do you need?

I hope this isn't too far off topic - not trying to hijack this thread...

Thanks,
Patrick


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## newfisher

An air gap can still form behind the fibreglass at the transition from wall to 45 and 45 to floor. Air gaps can allow leaks and too many gaps will result in weaker fabrication, as the strength in thin fibreglass laminations comes from having a good bond with the substrate. Therefore, some filler material, such as glass bubbles (known also as microballons) would need to be mixed with a bit of epoxy to make a paste of about the consistency of thick peanut butter. The paste is then spread at the angle transition, then regular epoxy is brushed over the wall, wet paste and floor, then fibreglass is laid into the wet epoxy. If additional layers of fibreglass are to be applied, they are best applied immediately into the first wet layer. Stippling with the tip of a brush into the corner and up onto the wall and on the floor of the tank will ensure a good bond and remove any trapped air bubbles.

I use tongue depressors (inexpensive, available in bags of 100 at many hobby shops and most mail order woodworking suppliers) to mix my epoxy, the paste, and to apply the paste to make fillets. The radius on the end of the tongue depressors is just about right for making fillets for most types and weights of fibreglass for 90 deg corners ... thus, the 45 deg wood filler is really not necessary.


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## bobrizzle

loogielv said:


> you know, i've always wondered why people dont use these pools for indoor ponds. They're super cheap compared to other options. Super easy and the mammoth one that's like 25' across and 4 1/2' deep is only like $300....


i hope they carry those in canada.


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## mepeterser2451

hey sorry to hear about your misfortunes. its been a while since i checked this thread. just wondering, has the drylock held up all this time? i'm still planning to make my small version this spring.


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## ssacrew

I just read through the entire thread, and was wondering the financial situation you face currently. While I am a college student myself, I know of some rather well off people down here who may be able to fund money towards your "business" nfp group.


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## TheFishGuy

I think drylok would have held up just fine, though I'm now using pond armor. The pond armor is holding fine, the issue was with design. I ended up closing off the deep end as that 5' vertical wall could not withstand the pressure of 1500. I essentially made the tank 300 gallons smaller.

The rescue is barely surviving, rescues continue to come in without financial support. Easily understood considering the economy.

The potential good news is I've found another printer and I'm taking my time feeling him out to see if he's really as excited about printing shirts as he says he is. I'll be meeting with him this evening. He's also adopting Bert.

ssacrew, financial donations are always needed and appreciated. Unfortunately most people could care less about fish. Now if I rescued dogs let's say, I'd be fine.


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## Lunafish

I saw the lids on your website, custom made for tanks. I think I'll be sending you specs and money. How much does shipping run? Or is shipping not feasible with 48" long lids?

Matt


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## TheFishGuy

Please pm me


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## czar_wilson

soo
wow 
i knew your tank was the talk of the town... well forum but
I had no idea there was an expansion and troubles of that sort

awesome job
hope your still fighting the good fight :thumb:


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## TheFishGuy

Thanks, the tank has been flawless now for over a year. Knock on wood. BUT I closed off the deep end... which was causing all the problems...


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## Guest

Well i finally finished! It took me a week to do but I read the entire thing all three threads. I am inspired and like many others wish i had the space to build a tank like this. You did a great job and i enjoyed all of it. Congrats on the great family and I am sorry to hear about your losses. Going through this thread I was not able to see a lot of the videos due to the fact that they were moved or not working. Do you have those some were that they can be seen I would love to watch them so I can better understand the last part of what you went through with the addition.

Thanks,

Patrick


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## Guest

Also how is MFR doing and what happen with the ordeal with you town?


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## TheFishGuy

I'm working on re-uploading the videos...

MFR is closed due to lack of finnancial support.


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## Guest

Great I look forward to seeing them and I am sorry to hear about MFR. How is the tank doing?


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## TheFishGuy

Tank's doing great... Here's a link:
http://s47.photobucket.com/albums/f197/ ... =slideshow


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## The King Crabb

I love it :thumb: Especially fond of that secret door behind the OCA award :lol:


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## TheFishGuy

Thank you.


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## Guest

Tank looks great!


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## TheFishGuy

Thank you, I'm very proud of it. I could have gone out and bought a 1200, but this is way more rewarding!


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## TheFishGuy

If anyone is still following. 
You can find me on Facebook.
Jonathan Strazinsky
Send me a friend request along with a message you're from cichlid-forum!


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