# New member questions



## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

I currently have a 55 gallon tank. It is not fully cycled yet. Its been running for almost 2 months now.

Filters: Marineland 400 Biowheel and an Aquatech 20-40 gallon
Medium sized subtrate
Silk plants and a few pieces of large driftwood

PH 8.0

I am wanting to set up strictly a cichlid tank. Looking at mostly Tanganyika and Malawai Lakes, mainly Malawi.
I currently have 2 dojo loaches, 2 bristlenose plecos, and 2 dwarf blue gouramis. I'd like to keep the dojo loaches, but I dont mind getting rid of the other 4 if they won't suit well with the cichlids. Thoughts?

My main questions are these:
Do cichlids do best with very fine substrate, or will the medium sized pebbles that I have now suffice? If I swap out the substrate, I assume I will be starting the majority of the cycle all over again?
How do they like driftwood? Would it be best to swap it out for rocks and create caves for them?
Thank you for all the help with this!


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

And I am going with the Mbuna family most likely, as I am all about color.


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## morrismorris (Mar 21, 2017)

Rocks. A lot of rocks. I would also suggest promoting green algae so they can do their thing and graze.

I will let someone else answer your other questions.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

morrismorris said:


> Rocks. A lot of rocks. I would also suggest promoting green algae so they can do their thing and graze.
> 
> I will let someone else answer your other questions.


Thanks for the response.


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## james1983 (Dec 23, 2007)

Pool filter sand is my choice, I now have it in all of my tanks. The fish like to sift through it looking for food. Changing substrate shouldn't hurt your bacteria, most of its in the filter. I've changed substrate twice already and never experienced any issues.

For mbuna I would fill the tank with as many rocks as possible, making plenty of caves. I've also used driftwood before without any negatives.

Your dojo loaches may not have a good time with mbuna though.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I'd leave out the Tangs with Malawi as well.


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## Iggy Newcastle (May 15, 2012)

The problem I see is removing a few fish in an uncycled tank, then slamming it with mbuna. You'll encounter problems.

Try to source some established media, or start fresh with returning your current fish, and doing a fishless cycle. For your first foray, do not mix rift lakes.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

Iggy Newcastle said:


> The problem I see is removing a few fish in an uncycled tank, then slamming it with mbuna. You'll encounter problems.
> 
> Try to source some established media, or start fresh with returning your current fish, and doing a fishless cycle. For your first foray, do not mix rift lakes.


Thats actually exactly what my thought was as well. I'm going to start completely fresh. Im going to remove and re-home the fish that I have, completely clean out the tank. Put new sand, rocks and filters, and do the fishless cycle. 
Can you elaborate on what you mean by "do not mix rift lakes"? I'm guessing you're referring to don't mix driftwood in with this?

Thanks


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

james1983 said:


> Pool filter sand is my choice, I now have it in all of my tanks. The fish like to sift through it looking for food. Changing substrate shouldn't hurt your bacteria, most of its in the filter. I've changed substrate twice already and never experienced any issues.
> 
> For mbuna I would fill the tank with as many rocks as possible, making plenty of caves. I've also used driftwood before without any negatives.
> 
> Your dojo loaches may not have a good time with mbuna though.


How deep do you have your sand? And do you deal with air bubbles that get filled with toxic gas?


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## james1983 (Dec 23, 2007)

glickster89 said:


> james1983 said:
> 
> 
> > Pool filter sand is my choice, I now have it in all of my tanks. The fish like to sift through it looking for food. Changing substrate shouldn't hurt your bacteria, most of its in the filter. I've changed substrate twice already and never experienced any issues.
> ...


Pretty thin, maybe an inch. Between vacuuming and the fish sifting it stays turned over pretty good.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

james1983 said:


> glickster89 said:
> 
> 
> > james1983 said:
> ...


Awesome...thanks. My last question about pool filter sand. I haven't yet found a siphon that attaches to any of my sinks faucets, so I have been currently doing the old school manual siphon with buckets. How would this work with cleaning the top surface of pool filter sand? I assume I would keep the hose about an inch or so from the top of the sand, but I still envision sand getting sucked up.


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## thornsja19 (Feb 4, 2017)

glickster89 said:


> Can you elaborate on what you mean by "do not mix rift lakes"? I'm guessing you're referring to don't mix driftwood in with this?
> 
> Thanks


I believe he is referring to not mixing Tangs with Malawi mbuna. Should choose one or the other. Although while you mention it, I wouldn't put driftwood in a mbuna/Tang tank. They like hard and alkaline water. Driftwood will make the water more soft and acidic. Plus it's not really something they run into in their natural environment too much (mbuna especially). Keep the décor simple. Sand for substrate and large rock piles that algae can grow on is all they need and what they like best.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

thornsja19 said:


> glickster89 said:
> 
> 
> > Can you elaborate on what you mean by "do not mix rift lakes"? I'm guessing you're referring to don't mix driftwood in with this?
> ...


Got it. I was deciding between Tangs and Mbuna but I am doing 100% Mbuna. Understood about just sand and rocks. Makes it easy too. Filtration wise- Am I good with what I have?Marineland HOB 400 biowheel as well as a 20-40 gallon aquatech for extra filtration. Also do you guys use carbon in your filters?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

We don't use carbon unless we are removing medication or if the tap water is discolored.

To decide whether you have enough filtration, you look up the gallons per hour (GPH) of each filter. You can look at the specifications that came with the filter, or Google the name of your filter and gallons per hour.

A common guideline is 8X to 10X GPH. So for a 55G you want between 8 x 55 or 440 and 10 x 55 or 550 gallons per hour.

Check out the Cichlid-Forum Library for videos on cleaning sand. Check out the Python "No-Spill Clean and Fill" for a siphon that will attach to your faucets (many adapters) and both drain and refill your tank with 78 degree water.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

Another question:
My 55 gallon tank does have the plastic rim along the sides, so it is not rimless. The stand that it fits on does not any sort of center support. All the support is on the edges and 4 corners. How much weight in rocks do you think I can add? (along with 50-75lbs of PFS)
Thanks!


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Tanks are always supported at the edges/corners only...you can fill the tank solid full of rocks and stand on top without breaking the glass.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

Started the fishless cycle today. I understand you all dont recommend using carbon in your filters, unless removing medications, etc. 
Does that include starting this fishless cycle as well? I picked up some fluval foam filter in place of the carbon ones. Just making sure this is okay to use when starting a new cycle. Thanks.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Yes it is ok.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

I am about halfway through the cycle. I do have one question hoping to get answered.

Im in the nitrite testing process, so I am doing daily water changes while testing for nitrite, and then adding the ammonia every other day. I was adding dechlorinator to the water after each water change, but then thought it was unnecessary because I dont have any fish in there and it was just a waste. I was then going to add in enough of the dechlorinator for 55 gallons once the cycle was done. But now I am thinking that was a mistake by not adding it after each water change.

Is that chlorine killing off all the good bacteria that I have been building up in my filters? I hope I didnt screw this up. Nowhere on the fishless cycle guide did it state about adding or not tap water solution during the water changes since there's no fish. Thanks.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Why are you doing water changes during a fishless cycling? I reread the article and it recommends a small water change IF the nitrite is very high.

What are the results for nitrite now?

I don't think you need to add a dechlor product during the fishless cycling procedure since there _should_ be minimal disinfection levels at the tap water.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

Deeda said:


> Why are you doing water changes during a fishless cycling? I reread the article and it recommends a small water change IF the nitrite is very high.
> 
> What are the results for nitrite now?
> 
> I don't think you need to add a dechlor product during the fishless cycling procedure since there _should_ be minimal disinfection levels at the tap water.


I read that differently then. Nitrites are high. 5ppm. *** been taking out 10 gallons a day, so about 20% a day.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

Then you are just fine doing small water changes. Too high nitrite or ammonia levels during the fishless cycling can slow the process down and the small water changes can help.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

Deeda said:


> Then you are just fine doing small water changes. Too high nitrite or ammonia levels during the fishless cycling can slow the process down and the small water changes can help.


Awesome. And as far as adding or not adding dechlor? You dont think it's necessary to add it during this until fish are being added? Whatever is in the tap water isn't going to mess with the bacteria that's being built up in the filter media?


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I don't see any mention in the Fishless Cycling article about using a dechlor product so I'd skip it.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

Thanks. Hoping some others can weigh in on this as well.


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

any other opinions on whether dechlorinator is 100% necessary after doing water changes during the fishless cycle?


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I think I would add it so the chlorine does not kill the beneficial bacteria. Unless your water is not chlorinated (like in my case, I have a private well).


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## glickster89 (Mar 16, 2018)

DJRansome said:


> I think I would add it so the chlorine does not kill the beneficial bacteria. Unless your water is not chlorinated (like in my case, I have a private well).


Thanks. I agree. I have city water so it does have chlorine. I started out using dechlor and then stopped. *** done probably 4 water changes at 20% and havent added it. I added enough last night for 55 gallons. Do you think Im okay to continue with the cycle in this case? Or do you think the beneficial bacteria has been killed off to the point that cycle is messed up now?


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

Finally finished the fishless cycle a week or so ago. I just ordered fish today through <vendor name removed>
5x Demasoni "Pombo Rocks" (Pseudotropheus demasoni) 
5x Red Zebra (Maylandia estherae)
5x Yellow Lab (Labidochromis caeruleus)
All are 1" unsexed
3x Synodontis Petricola (Lucipinnis)
Unsexed 3/4"-1"

I also ordered an 850gph powerhead for extra movement on the other side of the tank in place of another filter. I am stoked for this! Next up will be some java fern if the cichlids dont wreck them.
(I had issues with my other username, so i made a new one- same person hah)


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

Is it safe to add live plants any time to the tank? Can I add them on a newly cycled tank before fish are added?
Thanks.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Sure. Live plants are a whole other balancing act (outside of fish complexity) so be sure you have done your research and are ready for the effort.


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

Attaching a photo of my tank. 55 gallon. Pool filter sand. Local Boise river rock. Added live plants yesterday. Various swords and java fern. I may add some more rock and stack higher to create more caves, but I like how natural it looks right now. Fish should be getting delivered in the next couple days. Thoughts?


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

It looks good though you have too much substrate in there and you have also buried the plants too deeply. You need enough substrate to hold the plant roots but not so much that you bury the crowns of the plants.


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

Dang, really? Ok. Based on research, *** been told to do 3" thick of substrate when planting live plants. That's what it is. I planted the plants just like you do in a garden. The sand is right at the level of the root ball. I didn't bury the root ball with sand.


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## Deeda (Oct 12, 2012)

I enlarged your pic and it appears the stems of the plants are covered with substrate so hence my previous comment. I've had no luck with sword plants as I didn't provide enough light or fertilizers for them to grow. Java fern did grow well for me though I just tied the rhizomes to rocks or driftwood with good results.

This will be a Malawi tank correct? I can just see those plants uprooted by the fish in their quest to move the substrate around.


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

Deeda said:


> I enlarged your pic and it appears the stems of the plants are covered with substrate so hence my previous comment. I've had no luck with sword plants as I didn't provide enough light or fertilizers for them to grow. Java fern did grow well for me though I just tied the rhizomes to rocks or driftwood with good results.
> 
> This will be a Malawi tank correct? I can just see those plants uprooted by the fish in their quest to move the substrate around.


I enlarged it as well and I do see what you're saying. I will remove the layer that I covered the root balls with. For me, live plants is an experiment. If they don't make it, oh well. I'm more focused on my fish than I am with the plants, but wanted to try the live plants out.
The tank is near a large window that gets indirect light all morning and day, as well as when I turn on the lights on the tank when I come home, So I am hoping light shouldn't be an issue.
As far as depth of substrate. I am very good about water changes and vacuuming the sand. So as long as that's done, having 3-4" of sand will still be an issue?
I can take some out, not a problem. I want to do this right! Thanks for your help.
And yes. All Mbuna cichlids.


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

Important question:
My fish were supposed to be delivered today, but the USPS said it most likely won't be until tomorrow.
I added my last doseage of ammonia on Monday (72 hours ago) 
Should I add more tonight to keep the cycle alive? Tank is converting ammonia within 24 hours, so what about half doseage of what I normally add?
Thank you


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

No. The bacteria will survive for weeks/months without ammonia once established.


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

DJRansome said:


> No. The bacteria will survive for weeks/months without ammonia once established.


Great to know. Thank you. Ended up getting the fish today so all is good.


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## ironspider (Dec 5, 2017)

glickster said:


> DJRansome said:
> 
> 
> > No. The bacteria will survive for weeks/months without ammonia once established.
> ...


Show us a pic!


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

ironspider said:


> glickster said:
> 
> 
> > DJRansome said:
> ...


Will do! They are all juvies- 1". Beautiful fish. Will be fun to watch them grow up.


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## glickster (Jul 19, 2018)

Here's a couple videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBXc8KB ... ture=share

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEYu2m3 ... ture=share


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## ironspider (Dec 5, 2017)

glickster said:


> Here's a couple videos
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBXc8KB ... ture=share
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEYu2m3 ... ture=share


Love it!


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