# 150 gallon ALL MALE Peacocks and Haps Stocking list



## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

I was going to go with Mbuna, and now changed my mind to ALL MALE Peacock and Haps. My wife didn't like how aggressive the Mbuna were, and wanted a more peaceful but yet colorful tank, since we just took down our 180SW tank that was doing beautiful for several years

I'll be starting my cycle this weekend on my 150G tank. It's non-drilled, and I'll have 2 x Fuval FX6 canister filters for filtration
A rocky 3D background, which is only 1/2" thick, so it willn;t take up much swimming room
I'll have one large rock with holes in it, about 16" tall one one side ( artificial ) and about 50lbs of Lace rock on the opposite side for my aquascaping, keeping plenty of area for swimming

I been researching a stocking list of the web , and came up with a starter list, I have no idea how many species this is, or what's compatible for a ALL MALE P&H Tank, here's the stocking list:

Taiwan Reef ( this is one of our FAV fish, so colorful! )
Pheno Tazania Star Sapphire
Moori Dolphin
Super Red Empress ( Another FAV fish of ours )
F1 Azureus
F2 Maleri Sunshine ( Another fav fish )
WC Mloto Likoma
WC Ngara Flametail
WC Midnight Huseri
F1 Blue Neon ( Another FAV fish )
Bi Color 500
Otter Point Jake
Lemon Jake 
Rotor Kaiser Red Rubin ( Another fav )
Ruby Red Peacock ( another fav )
Chitande Type North
Blue Orchid
Dragon Blood ( Another fav )
Latifasciata "Zebra Obliquidens"
Dominant Fryeri ( love it )
Benga Sunshine ( love it )
Phoenix ( love it )

What do you think? I have no idea which one's are peacocks, and which one's are haps ?


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Just found these 3 also

Red Fin Borleyi
Lwanda ( love it )
Flavescent ( love it )


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Now, I'm still not 100% sure if I want to do this. I bought P&H's last month from a LFS, and was going to return them for Mbuna after seeing how playful they were

MY wife thinks their to aggressive, ( Mbuna ) and wanted a more peaceful tank, and likes the colors of the P&H's

I still want Mbuna's, they move around, and play , but with both of us working full time, I don't have time to watch the tank all day, so I'm thinking a P&H's all male tank would be a easier more calming tank to set up?


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## tanker3 (May 18, 2015)

fltekdiver said:


> MY wife thinks their too aggressive, ( Mbuna ) and wanted a more peaceful tank
> I don't have time to watch the tank all day, so I'm thinking a P&H's all male tank would be a easier more calming tank to set up?


Now why would you think that? Peacocks can be very mean with each other too. There are some very mean peacocks. Also not all males in a "All Male Peacock" tank will color-up. Not discouraging you, but something to think about.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

It's just a general statement, meaning when we were watching that one tank of Mbuna, they were chasing each other around allot

The P&H's tank, were allot more peaceful, but alittle to slow moving for me. They were all just kinda hanging in the water. I'm not saying that's how they all are either. I also know that wasn't a all male tank.

That's why were going to go to a different LFS as Roger suggested this weekend to talk to them

With both of us working full time, I don't want aggression issues where their killing each other while I'm at work all day

The LFS that Roger suggested specializes in Cichlids, the one we went to yesterday leans more towards SW tanks. All their display tanks are SW

I need to find out between a all male P&H's tank, if that will be more aggressive then a Mbuna tank, or vise versa

If Mbuna's will be easier to maintain, I'd rather go with them then


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

SO here's the question I guess I'm looking for, since I'm new to Cichlids

If 40% of tanks are P&H's tanks, and the other 40% are Mbuba tanks, and only 10-20% percent of people do all male P&H's tanks, because of aggersion issues, and those tanks are only recommended for people wwith cichlid experience , I don't want to be starting off on the worng foot

If all male tanks P&H's are just as common as Mbuna tanks, and P&H tanks, then I'll start one up

If everyone here said, I'm leaning in the wrong direction, and actually Mbuna tanks are easier to start up and maintain , I would strongly consider that option, as that was the route I was going to go with my 90G I was just starting up

I need to make a decision here this week, so I know how to aquascape the tank

Mbuna like lot's of rocks, and caves, I'll add about 150lbs of Lace Rock and make allot of caves

If it's a P&H tank, I'll keep it more open, very little caves, and use about half the rocks then, and keep allot of open sand on the bottom


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## Kevin in Ky (Dec 31, 2013)

Wow, what a great problem to have! I hope to be making that same decision in the next year or two, when I can upgrade to a large tank. I haven't kept Haps or Peacocks at this point, so I can only advise you when it comes to the Mbuna. With a tank that size, there a tons of combinations of Mbuna that would work great without alot of aggression issues. Just make sure you (and your wife) understand that the chasing and activity etc. and alot of things that look like aggression..is just normal Mbuna breeding behavior. Especially if you are observing a group of them in a smaller LFS tank. The key with Mbuna is researching your stock list well,..buying groups of each..and then weeding out (selling/trading) the extra males..as you settle in to a working group of different species that consist of male/female ratios of roughly 1 male/4 or 5 females. You may be able to have more than one male of certain species depending on how 'dominant' the main male is.

If you do decide to go with Mbuna, make sure to read articles on them in the 'Library' section of this site..and then ask for advice on stock lists here,..look at as many pictures as possible etc. Then buy high quality pure fish from a reputable LFS or breeder or order from a good online vendor.

Hope that helps some!


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## Aquariguns (Jan 15, 2015)

Otopharynx lithobates is also known as the Sulphur-Crested Lithobate or AKA Z-Rock
Dimidiochromis compressiceps - Malawi Eye-Biter


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thanks, I did a ton of research on them last month, when I was starting a 90G Mbuna tank up

I actually have a stocking list I picked out for the 90G I could just add one more species to the 150G

You think Mbuna would be a better choice?

I don't wan to be the 10% that I starting up a all male P&H tank. I don't have enough experience with Cichlids yet to know. I been in SW for the past 5 years
Last FW tank I had was around 7 years ago


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## Kevin in Ky (Dec 31, 2013)

Well, I don't want to say Mbuna would be a better choice,..without having kept peacocks or haps. From what I have read on this site over the last couple of years,..it doesn't sound like there is anything 'difficult' about an all male P&H tank,..just drawbacks maybe with a particularly dominant fish..or several fish not 'coloring up' the way you might expect, becasue they are intimidated by a dominant fish. Other than that..just the high price and availability of all males that vary enough in look to get along,..and then getting them all at approx the same size so they can be added at once (again these are only the drawbacks that I read about). Others with experience with these guys can add much more.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thank you I appreciate the feedback. You bought up some good points. It maybe a challenge to stock such a large tank all at once, trying to find just all males

I guess I would have to buy them a little bigger, so I know I'm getting all males, and pay a higher price per fish because they will probably be in the 2"-3" range , vs buying them at junivals

I'm kinda pressed for time, because I need to aquascap my tank this week, and the two tanks are very different in aquascaping them

We're 50/50 going all Male H&P's or Mbuna


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## lilscoots (Mar 13, 2012)

All male tanks are a lot of trial and error to get a mix of individual fish that "get-along". A proposed stock list is a good place to start, but even then each individual fish you get may or may not follow it's species' typical behavior/aggressiveness. If you're not going to be around much to keep an eye on the tank I don't think an all male tank either mbuna or hap/peacock is the best option. Breeding groups of similar temperment are less difficult to maintain in my opinion but not nearly as visually appealing. Both mbuna and hap/peacock tanks can be peaceful or aggressive depending on the fish/species in the tank. Not very encouraging, but I'd rather see you find something do-able than have you get a bunch of fish and watch them all murder eachother.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

I agree completely , with both me and my wife working full time, I have very limited time in the hobby. That's the main reason I broke down my 180SW tank last year. I was religious with water changes, and spending hours each week on the tank, in the begging it was fun, but then as life changes and we just get busier , it became allot of work to keep up the tank

I'm reading in the library section now, an all male tank takes lots of removing fish and adding fish. Because of aggression issues, and takes allot of time and money. To be honest, I could start back up a SW tank again with clowns, yellow tang, blue hippo etc, and walk away from it, everyone would get along

I got into the Hobby again, thinking FW would be easier. I went with 2 canister filters FX6, so the maintence would be less, and I was hoping to add a bunch of fish, and just enjoy the hobby

After spending hours between last night and today reading, I don't know if a all male tank is the way to go

I really don't want females in the tank for P&H's, I would need to go 4f to 1m, and the females just don't have any color
The P&H's though, get bigger then Mbuna, require less rock work, which I like open tanks, with low profile rocks.

Mbuna on the other hand , I wouldn't have to worry about the females , as they are colorful, but require allot more rock work, which I don't like seeing tanks with all rock just stacked in their. Mbuna will also be smaller in size, I think the P&H would look better in a taller 30" tank like I have being its a 150

Thanks for the help, from what you guys are saying, it would be easier to go with something like Mbuna, then I don't have to worry about females and colors, and watching the tank as closely like I would have to with a all male P&H tank

If I did Mbuna, it would be a M/F tank. The only reason I said all male tank was because I didn't want female P&H in the tank with no colors
'


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## LeeAberdeen (Sep 4, 2014)

fltekdiver said:


> I was going to go with Mbuna, and now changed my mind to ALL MALE Peacock and Haps. My wife didn't like how aggressive the Mbuna were, and wanted a more peaceful but yet colorful tank, since we just took down our 180SW tank that was doing beautiful for several years
> 
> I'll be starting my cycle this weekend on my 150G tank. It's non-drilled, and I'll have 2 x Fuval FX6 canister filters for filtration
> A rocky 3D background, which is only 1/2" thick, so it willn;t take up much swimming room
> ...


I can comment from experience on about six of your listed species, which are all in my all-male 150g. Namely: Taiwan Reef, Pheno Tanzania, Rubin Red, Fryeri, Blue Neon and Benga.

Never had any issues with aggression with any of these, and they're all beautiful fish too. The Taiwan Reef is a bit of a star, sort of joint dominant male with one of my OB Fires, and the most intelligent and curious in there. Always at the glass, he is, weaving and bobbing his head, and the first over for the frozen bloodworm, sticking his head in the tea strainer. Definitely get the Pheno, too, because mine's only tiny but he's already a great little character. If you can get a 'Blue Ice' Fryeri, they're stunning.

The other three are great too. I'd say the only one you might have problems with is the Rubin Red, but even he's quite placid. As others have said though, fish don't always conform to their stereotypes, and you might get a rogue. Equally, some fish are supposed to be aggressive and aren't. All things being equal, those six are safe choices, but I can't comment on the others, unfortunately.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Perfect, thanks for the help, I'll put them down on the to get fish list, if we decide to do the P&H's for sure

I appreciate it


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## Aaron S (Apr 4, 2015)

So I don't think anyone can tell you what to do, we can provide our opinions and observations. What I can say is I have similar criteria that you do. My first cichlid tank was a random fish tank (47gal). It was so incredibly wrong in many ways. As the fish grew up over the first year there were power struggles - some of which needed to be dealt with that day to save a fish. All mbuna have a normal behavior of chasing each other around and this is one of the things I really liked about them...my beta fish is so incredibly boring just hovering in space all day. I got tired of them always trying to kill each other and through my research fell in love with the star sapphire. So I read up on the forums and websites to figure out I needed to upgrade to a bigger tank. Long story short - I ended up deciding on star sapphires and yellow labs only in my 125g (along with a crew of synodontis petricola- which my fiance says she doesn't care about the other fish as long as we have the catfish). Yellow labs give you the mbuna behavior but are mild mannered enough to have with other calm fish if you wanted a particular hap or peacock. Many people swear by saluosi as being fairly mild mannered mbuna. Based on your comments, I personally would recommend peaceful mbuna and get larger groups instead of the 1:5 that people normally recommend (aka choose less species). The larger groups will put less stress on the females and make it more forgiving if you end up with multiple males. So something like saluosi, acei, and rusty's would be my recommendation (although I personally would get yellow labs, maingano, and rusty's probably)


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thanks. That's close to my stocking list I made up for my Mbuna

This was what the list from my 90G

Yellow Labs 1m:4f
White Top Hara 1m:4f
Cobalt Zebra 1m:4f
Maingano 1m:7f

Since I got a 150 I could just add about another 6 fish onto that list

I would could drop one of those, and add Acei, Soliousi, or Rusties like you had mentioned

That would be a colorful peaceful tank I would think


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## Kanorin (Apr 8, 2008)

I have had several mbuna tanks over the years and my more recent adventure has been a hap and peacock tank (have had it for 4 years or so).

If I had to compare/contrast the two setups I would say these points:

1) Assuming you buy unsexed juveniles for the mbuna tank and sexed young adults for the Hap/peacock tank, the amount of work as far as adding/removing fish during the first 3-6 months is approximately the same. In the mbuna tank you'll probably have to remove some males and possibly add more females. In the H/P tank you'll have to swap some males. The H/P tank may be slightly more work if you really want everyone at full color.

2) Hap / Peacock tank will be more diversity in colors, more open tank, less action overall.

3) If you keep the mbuna and want to raise fry - this will be a lot of work. If not, buy some synodontis catfish.

4) Whether you choose Haps/Peacocks or Mbuna, the species and the combination of species that you choose will be the biggest determinant as far as how challenging it is to achieve peace. We can help you put together an easy-going group of mbuna or haps/peacocks (just know that you may have to trade peacefulness for color in some situations).

I would put more stock into what types of setups make you happy rather than which is likely to be more or less work to get right.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I will add that I had no problems with peacefulness after the initial 2-year period of adjustment. But I did not get the fish to color up to my satisfaction...some of my favorites were the more timid fish. So I have switched over to mixed gender on all tanks.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Kanorin , you made some very good points.
To answerer your comments:
1) I did not know this, great point. I thought If I did just all M/F Mbuna , I wouldn't have issues down the road. If that's the case, where both might be the same amount of work, I will base the facts then on what we like, vs what might be easier to start up

2) I agree. I actually like the more open tank, less rock work, and I'm ok if they are alittle less active then Mbuna.

3) I defiantly do not want to raise any fry, I will add synodontis catfish to my list

4) Great point, Maybe I can put a list together If I think we may lean towards P&H's, and If I don't like them then make a list of Mbuna's to see what I like best of the two?

Another great point, Instead of trying to build a tank what might be less work, I'll build a stock list more towards what we like

Thanks for the help!


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

DJRansom

I talked with a LFS today, who said I may get a better chance of the males coloring up with females in the tank
My issue is then If I'm doing 1m to 4f ( H&P's ) I have 4 to 1 fish with very little color

The last time I went down this road last month, I switched over to Mbuna for the reason when I went to start my 90G tank up, as the females Mbuna at least have more color

They told me today, that they have allot of request for a all male tank ( P&H ) and it's very popular today, but very expensive. He said I may end up paying $25 -$35 a fish


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Definitely stock what you like. Yes I pay $35 to $50/fish for all male...and that is not even at an LFS.

Yes the individuals in all male will have 0% to 90% of the color they would have in a species tank with females. But if you can get 90% of the color on _all the males _and it's what you want...it's worth it. My issues was my favorites where the minority that did not color up well.

I do find mixed gender tanks of any species easier in the long run...but what good is easy if you are not satisfied???


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## ArtyCichlids (Nov 30, 2015)

WHY NOT BOTH?! Haha, in my tank I have mostly all male P&Hs but a few little mbunas. And honestly, I can say my mbunas are 100% more peaceful than my P&Hs (maybe because of the ratio difference) and active. I have a few caves that only the mbuna can squeeze into which keeps the P&Hs from fighting over. Honestly, I don't think you can generalize the tanks. Both tanks can be very aggressive and peaceful, if done correctly. For me, I added mbunas that were smaller than my P&Hs, because they're obviously known to be more aggressive, so it balanced out. If you love both, why not go for both?
This is only my opinon, some would argue you shouldn't put them together because of dietary differences. But I feed my tank the best of the best, Northfin. Formula, Krill Pro, and Veggie Formula.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

I thought about it to be honest. Half the You Tube Videos I watched had the less aggressive Mbuna's like yellow labs mixed in with 
H&P's. I knew about the different diets, and read a bunch of threads on it. If you google it, seems more people do it then advised
I just didn';t bring it up because I know it's a touchy subject 

I'll need your suggestion if so on diets, I don't know what the best of the best food is

Here's a pic of my aquascaping so far. My 3D background comes in tomorrow, I'll silicone it in place, fill it after 24 hours, and start my cycle
I have 150lbs of Lace Rock ordered because I was going to start it up as a Mbuna, but If I keep it P&H's, I'll only add about 50lbs on the right side of the tank, make a few more caves and that's it, I'll keep the tank open for P&H's


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

I keep Yellow Labs and Demasoni in my 140 gallon tank at work with Trout cichlids, Compressiceps, and Ruby Red Peacocks. Never had any issues.

Yellow Labs are so adaptable and relatively friendly that they can work with just about anything.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thanks, I was actually considering them for sure if I did an all male H&P's. I've seen allot of videos and threads where people added the, without issues

How is the Demasoni ? I would love to add one in the tank as well, but heard they can cause havoc


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## Narwhal72 (Sep 26, 2006)

I have never had much problems with demasoni. But I only have two in the 140. When I was breeding them I was doing it in a 20L and most people told me that was impossible.


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## ArtyCichlids (Nov 30, 2015)

Here's what I'd say about diet if you want both of them. Just do purely Northfin cichlid formula. No krill, no veggie formula. The cichlid formula will give both mbuna and P&Hs everything they need and more. They both absolutely love it and provides necessary nutritions for both. In my tank I have a baby demasoni, he's literally like .5-.75 inches with a 3.5in red empress. Demasoni do have a huge attitude problem! Even my little guy! He swims around like he owns the place, no one messes with him and he doesn't mess with anyone because he's so small. Cutest little guy ever and smallest. That's my advise on adding some or a demasoni. Go quite small compared to the others and in my experience it should be fine.


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## ArtyCichlids (Nov 30, 2015)

To be honest. You can't always take people's advice and say for sure that's the only way or option. Fish are quite heavily huge trial and error, I'm quite new to cichlids myself and have gotten mixed answers everywhere. The biggest thing I've encountered to be wrong was adding Frontosa into a P&Hs and expecially Mbunas. Honestly, I wouldn't recommend it, it's a scary situation. But I just added this 1.5inch frontosa into my tank, it's been a solid week, no nipped fins or any signs of him being bullied. He eats great and glows! The only thing I would do is maybe add another, because he seems a little lonely.
Even my boss's 120 gal tank has 5 inch P&Hs with like 20 yellow labs 1 inch, 2 demasoni 1 inch and 2 frontosa 1.5 inch.
That's like Taboo! Worst thing ever! Dead fish everyday! He's had that stocking and setup for a solid 2 weeks now. No casualities.
Good luck!


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Ok thanks, I was thinking some yellow labs, I don't know if I bold enough to do a demasoni, even with a 150G tank. I would love to.

I was thinking some yellow labs and maybe a Acei or something to mix with the P&H's, then I would have the best of both worlds!


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## Kanorin (Apr 8, 2008)

What are the dimensions of the tank?


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

It's a 150G, 72" long by 30" high


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## Been_away2long (Jul 13, 2015)

I'll weigh in since I've done 2 all male Hap/peacock tanks. First one was a 180gal that I sold 4 years ago and now I have a 125gal all male tank. Here's some tips best thing to do from my experience is to get the fish as young juvs let them grow up together so they are used to each other and won't be as aggressive. Try to avoid hybrids they are more aggressive and also avoid getting fish that look similar. Thing with all males in one tank even fish that are considered timid can be aggressive. Only a few fish will have full color potential where others won't looks as good/great. All male tanks you have to be ontop bc one male will n can take over the entire tank. My male albino fryeri would guard his cave and 4ft of the tank and the rest of the fish were stuck in 2 feet. You basically have to remove add fish remove and add fish to find the perfect match but that can take years. If I can do it over again I would go a mbuna community let the females hold release the fry and see how many last. Or I would do haps n peacocks with females and either collect the fry or just let the females hold and release fry in the tank. Don't get me wrong love my all male tank but only have a handfull of fish fully colored to full potential others have color but not over the top


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Wow, that's good to know ! I'm not sure if I want to wait years, and wait to see if they all color up . I also don't have the time to keep taking fish out, and replacing them. We both work allot of hours, and weekends were not around allot of the time. 
We have a 38' camper, that sometimes we will leave at the campground for a month at a time, and go up their 3-4 nights a week, and only be home a few days a week. We only do that about twice a year though. Most of the other times, we go camping over the holidays for about a 4-5 day stretch

This is what I was looking for. So your saying, either go 1m to 5f H&P tank, or, go just Mbuba M&F . If I went the Mbuna route, I always had to planed to do a M&F tank. The females have allot of color on the Mbuna

What about half and half? Say 1m to 4F Peacocks, the timid ones, and the other half timid Mbuna's like the Yellow Labs and maybe Acei?


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## Been_away2long (Jul 13, 2015)

Not sure if you know or seen haps/peacock females but they are not colorful. I think a mbuna tank done right in terms of color and how active would look cool. I wouldn't choose a timid peacock to go with mbuna even if they are more timid. One issue is haps n peacocks have different dietary needs but people have done it thousands of times. I would choose a peacock like Aulon lwanda/aulon Ngara flame tail/aulon AB konings something like that only one auloncara species. Possible can add cyno afra to the mix with labs n acei.

To me I would do a mbuna tank:
Cyno afra specie
Iodo sprengerae Rusty
Metria sp msobo
Yellow labs
Acei or pseudo sp Williamsi north aka blue lips

That combo would have unique and almost every color and active


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

That's close to what I was picking out in my 90G I was going to set up as a Mbuna tank

Cynotilapia sp."Hara", http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=2626
Maingano, F1 - http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=756
Chailosi, F1 - http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=860
Rusty http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=707
yellow labs - http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=1669


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

I recognize about half the Mbuna in this video

He has allot of color for. A Mbuna tank


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## Aaron S (Apr 4, 2015)

Looks like acei, yellow labs, Labeotropheus fuelleborni, Metriaclima sp. "elongatus chewere" (probably not correct, but its a close ID), Metriaclima estherae, ice blue


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thanks for the help I made a list last night about 7 different types I will post it today to get everybody's response of what they think and add those with it I'm going to the local fish store tomorrow and we'll know for sure if I'm going to do peacocks or mbuna


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

Ahhhh....
Making a list...
and checking it twice...
trying to find out...
which species will play nice!
:thumb:


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Roger That said:


> Ahhhh....
> Making a list...
> and checking it twice...
> trying to find out...
> ...


LOL !!! To funny! :lol:


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

*MBUNA STOCKING LIST, 150g TANK, 72' LONG X 30" HIGH X 18" WIDE . Filtration is 2 x Fuval FX6 Canister's *

Ok, If I were to do a Mbuna tank, M & F , I'd appreciate any advice. I was thinking maybe 6-7 Species , maybe 1M to 5F or 1M to 6F ?

I picked out so far, ( I wouldn't do all these species, just would narrow down what's compatible with the list, and welcome any recommandations for colorful Mbuna )

1: Yellow Labs for sure, easy to take care of ,bright yellow, colorful : http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/l_caeruleus.php

2: Metriaclima sp. "elongatus chailosi ? http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=860

3: Cynotilapia sp. "hara" , I think these are easy to keep like the yellow labs?
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... hp?id=2626

4:Labidochromis sp. "Hongi" - I'm not sure the behavior on this guy, I read mixed reviews. 
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=727

5: Ladotropheus Sprengerae " Rusties " - These seem to get better reviews, colorful in person, people say their color and beauty is better then the internet pics : 
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=707

6: Metriaclima SP. " MSOBO " - Not sure about this guy, it says the females are orange/yellow, they may cross breed with the labs?
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=801

7: Pseudotropheus Socolofi : Easy to keep, bright blue, I think this guys a winner? 
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=919

8: Pseudotropheus Cyaneorhabdos Maingano : Both M & F same colors , so If I do 1M to 5F , not sure if they would clash with any others picked out :
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=756

9: Afra - Cynotilapia afra : Love his bold stripes , would this go with the Hara ? This was recommended threads above:
https://www.aqua-fish.net/fish/afra

10: Iodotropheus sprengerae : This was recommended by been_away2long , nice fish also, better colors then the other Rusty I have picked out? http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/i_sprengerae.php

11: Metriaclima sp. "elongatus chailosi" : I have several above picked out this color, which is the best?
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/s ... php?id=860

Thanks again for the Help !


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

Your goal is to avoid similar colored species and similar barred or striped species. The footprint of your tank is the exact same as a 125 gallon 72" x 18" so you should stick to five species and a group of Synodontis cats.
The yellow labs and Msobo could be an issue but maybe not...
Choose between Maingano or Chailosi....they look very similar in color and horizontal stripes, go with 1m:7f
Choose between Cynotilapia sp Hara or Cynotilapia Afra...again they look very similar in color and horizontal stripes...
Rusties will look nice when they are adults, with red LED strips in really makes them pop in color.

So...
Yellow Labs 1m:4f 
Cynotilapia sp Hara or Afra 1m:4f
Rusties 1m:4f
Maingano or Elongatus Chailosi 1m:7f
Msobo or Socolofi Albino (sp Hara females can look very light blue at times) 1m:4f
Synodontis Multipunctatus for fry control - group of 5


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Ok thanks ! The rocks are finally done, I washed them, boiled what I could, power washed them and rinsed them several times. I'm finally ready to aquascape. The 3D background is installed also

Heading over to the LFS at 11am, so I know how to aquascape the tank, once I know which direction I'll be heading

I really wish I could do both. I'm not sure Mbuna will fill up a 150 since its 30" high

I think the P&H's with their larger sizes would fit better and look better

I would have also liked a larger Hap, about 8" or so. One display fish, that everyone goes wow over


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

This guy has some beautiful Mbuna in his tank


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

You can and....you can. Just need to make up your mind. But the Mbuna are fun to watch and are very active most of the time. If you want activity in the upper half of the tank...substitute the Socolofi or Msobo with Yellow Tail Acei. They like to occupy the upper half of the tank and are a large good looking species 1m:4f.


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

Also...I would talk to Billy and order your stock 2" in size if available so he can sex them more accurately. He did a good job getting my ratios as accurate as possible at that stage. The only species I'm not certain that I have the correct ratios to sex are the Maingano's and Rusties. Very difficult to tell them apart! But I have had no issues in three months.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thanks! I will talk to him today, and get a idea what he can get

I'm headed up their around 11am this morning

I'm so excited, it been waiting all week for today. I can't wait to get up their , lol


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

Yeah...one of these days I'm going to hop on my bike and ride up there to check out their store...if we could get out of this awful rainy season!


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

fltekdiver said:


> Thanks! I will talk to him today, and get a idea what he can get
> 
> I'm headed up their around 11am this morning
> 
> I'm so excited, it been waiting all week for today. I can't wait to get up their , lol


Tell Billy Roger from South Florida said hello. And that their stock is beautiful and highly recommended!


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Will do!


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Heading home to start aquascaping, it's going to be a Mbuna Tank! Roger Billy said to say Hi!


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

Cool. Well at least now you won't be second guessing your decision....great choice! I made the same choice.

Hint: try to arrange the rock so that the best areas for the fish to hang out is in view. In other words, avoid setting up the hardscape so that you rarely see most of the fish. Make the best caves and coves visible from the front.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Got it thanks, I'm just getting home in a few, and going to start the rock work etc. Hoping to fill it tonight to start the cycle


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

What Mbuna is this, I want one of these for sure


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

I also liked these, though they seemed a little aggressive


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## james1983 (Dec 23, 2007)

The first pic doesn't look pure, resembles the hap S.fryeri a little. The white fish in the 2nd pic looks like an ob zebra, yellow orange fish looks like a red zebra.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thanks, what about the white, light blueish spotted one ?


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

It is a Mbuna Tank right ?

Here's a full **** of the tank


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## james1983 (Dec 23, 2007)

fltekdiver said:


> Thanks, what about the white, light blueish spotted one ?


That's an ob zebra. The tank in the picture looks to be mostly mbuna. I see the fryeri looking fish andaybe a tinfoil barb towards the upper right.


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## JimA (Nov 7, 2009)

You may have seen this tank already? But it might give you some more ideas..

Just do some searches for his stock.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thanks guys, I got the tank filled, aquascaping done, I'll let the water warm up to temp, and add the ammonia tomorrow to start the cycle!


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## james1983 (Dec 23, 2007)

That looks really nice, love the rocks.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thank you !! I'm going to try to get better pics, to show all the holes and caves. Theirs so many caves and holes, It will be fun to watch them all swim through. I have marine LED lights, so I have to adjust them down so it doesn't bleach out the rocks in the pics, in person it looks unbelievable

Thanks again!


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

That looks great! I knew that background would blend well with lace rock, it will look really natural when you get some diatoms covering the surface of the rocks. It also does not look like 150 lbs of rock. Is it stable? Make sure the higher rocks can't get knocked off easily. My rocks are together tight and I've had two small rocks on top knocked off somehow. If you do have more rock don't be afraid to put it in....even if it means removing artificial decorations. The more natural the better, I like to try to replicate their natural environment as much as possible.

Is your background inside the tank or is it behind the back glass? Reason I ask is if it is inside the tank you won't be cleaning the back glass...so you could stack rocks all the way to the back in a couple of areas to add depth to your rocks if you wanted and leaving more open sandy areas in the other spots. I like how you have two areas you focused on, but the small plant you have between the rocks piles kind of joins them together. I would move the plant more behind the rock but between the piles to draw your eyes to the separation more.

I thought you got two FX6's. I only see the one intake tube right in the middle of your nice background! If you are putting in two FX6's...put the intake tubes of each filter in the back left and back right corners of the tank right under the output tubes of each. If you aim your output nozzles to create a clockwise circular flow, the intakes will work fine in the corners so you can hide it better leaving only your background in view. If you have a powerhead, put it on the left wall half way between the top and bottom and at the back...aimed behind the rocks to push the water around lower in the tank. This helps to keep the waste from sitting on the sand and pushes it to the intakes. Aim the output nozzle of the back left filter straight across the back of the tank to the right filter and up to the surface. You want to really agitate the surface of the water to eliminate protein buildup on the water surface...ask me how I know...this works great. Aim the other nozzle of the same output in the same direction but angled down directly at the intake strainer of the filter on the right side of the tank.

Aim the output nozzles of the right side filter up to the surface, aimed to the front glass angled slightly to the left. This helps push the water around the end of the tank and back in the other direction in the front creating the clockwise flow. Aim the other nozzle of the same output tube directly at the front glas in the middle of the tank in height and width. This will get your flow circulating well and keeping the waste picked up from the surface of the sand bottom and from the rocks.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Thank you Roger ! Yes, I have 2 Fuval FX-6's , It was allot of work today, between aquascaping, getting the sand into the tank, setting up the filter etc. I started at 9am this morning, and didn't stop till 8pm tonight  Ohh, my wife did treat me to lunch today though 

I'll add the other FX6 in the morning. I agree on the plant, I actually have a rock in it's place that fit's that open space perfect. I had the plant where the intake was, but wasn't sure where to put the intake, and I put it where I had the plant, but then the plant closed the middle back up

I didn't know where to put the intake hose, I'll flip it tomorrow and move it to the corner. I don't like it in the middle, it really sticks out

I bought 150lbs of rock, and used 75lbs. I returned the other 3 box's today with Fed Ex. I went through the 6 x 25lb box's, hand picked and stacked the ones I wanted to use, and returned the rest. Someone else will get clean, power washed, boiled rocks now  
I really didn't want to go much higher on the rock, I like to keep it some what open still

I put egg crate down, and put sand in to fill the holes in the egg crate, used a wide spackling knife to smooth out the sand into the egg crate. I stacked the rocks on the egg crate, then, ( what a pain this part was ) I carried 1/2 - 5 GAL buckets of sand into the room, stood on a ladder, and used a small container to scoop out the sand and place around the rocks all the way around the tank, this took for ever to do.

I have 2 x Jabeo Power heads coming, which sync together, and have a night sensor, where they slow down to half the speed at night, to let the fish rest.

The 3D background is inside the tank. It's 1/2" thick . Cost me about $200.00 . It's silicone in place.

I didn't stack the rock work against it, because I did that on my 180SW tank, I had about 200lbs of Live Rock stacked against the back glass. It was hard to get the Detrius out of the rocks. It made it allot more stable. I have it together tight, but their are some loose rocks on the tops. I was just thinking the big catfish may knock them over.

I'll take another pic tomorrow when I move some stuff around, and hook up the other FX6

Thanks again for the help!


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

Yes adding the sand can be quite challenging. I had the same difficulty. Except I didn't add any sand until after adding the rock. When I filled up the tank and started it up....most of the sand behind the rock wall got sucked into the rocks and filled all of those spaces under the rock. I had to add another bag of sand in the back which was even tougher.

Yeah, you don't want the rock all the way back touching the glass. It would be very difficult to clean but more importantly it will cut off a circular flow around the rocks. The good flow going around constantly will draw most of the waste out of the rocks and eventually sucked up the intake tubes. What I was trying to explain was to try to add depth to the piles of rock. This would help to stabilize the stack of rocks. The fish will also fit in small spaces that you wouldn't think they could, so you don't need a lot of big caves. They actually prefer caves to hide in that aren't accessible from both sides of the rock.

Remember to configure your filters and powerheads to create a good clockwise circular flow around the rocks. They like to play in the current too, when they want a break they just duck into the rocks and they're out of the current. I used to only use the powerhead for a few hours every couple of days, I have a Koralia 1500 gph. Now I leave it on all of the time, they don't react or behave any differently whether it is on or off.


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

Oh...and don't move the plant between the two stacks of rock to place another rock there. The separation and two distinct piles are nice. Move the plant a bit back and offset one direction or the other to open up the gap between the rock piles. But I would add in any and all of the remaining rock you have.

You have a lot of open unoccupied area in the entire upper half of your tank. Yellow tail Acei will use that space and they get big and beautiful. I would go with that species over the Msobo or Socolofi. If you wanted...you could throw in a floating plant fake or real and anchor it to the sides of the tank to keep it in place. That would fill in some of the big open water above. I have two Marineland bamboo plastic plant that are 3' long. You can remove the base and float them which would work great in your setup if you want to try it.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Ok thanks I really appreciate it. I returned the rest of the rock yesterday. Out of 6 boxes ( 25lb boxes ) I was able to use 3 of them
The others weren't good for stacking. They had allot of large flat pc.s in them which were really skinny.

I'll defiantly add some 36" plants, that would look awesome !

It's just about 11am, I'm going to start it in about a hour. I'm hoping I have enough hose to move the intake to the corner. Otherwise I'll have to buy another one, no biggie

Thanks again, I'm be adding the ammonia today also!

Do I add the salt now or after the cycle?


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

No salt...no buffers. Try to avoid using any buffers. The fish you buy from the LFS are aquarium raised in typically similar water parameters that you also have from the tap. My PH is 7.8, KH is 5 or 6 and GH is usually around 10. Not ideal or perfect but good enough to avoid using buffers. It is difficult and expensive to be constantly using buffers every time you do a water change to try to maintain a consistent level.

If you absolutely must use buffers....don't add them until after the cycle.


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

Here's a couple of photos of the rock now covered with diatoms. Most don't like this and try to clean it off or remove it. I think it makes everything look natural! I like it and now makes the tank look uniform. Eventually it clears up and goes away or turns to green algae. I'm hoping for the green algae for a beautiful natural look and for the benefit of the fish.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Ok thanks, I'm working on the 2nd FX6 installation now

Do you think I should re-do the rock work, and move it all back, and lean it all up against the back rock wall ? Or should I leave it how I have it, which is 4"-6" off the wall? Right now I can get get water flow around them, but their not as stable as moving them back against the wall. I also have all the sand in now, which will be challenging to move them


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

I wouldn't move them...you have a good flow around it now. But do make sure that you don't have any loose larger rocks positioned that can fall easily.

But that petrified wood rock you have on top of the fake petsmart rock looks like it will fall rather easily.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Ok Everything done. I removed the plant. It was blocking the flow in the rear in the middle. I'll add 2 Bamboo 3' in the corners as you suggested

I checked all the rocks, nothings loose except the one rock on the right formation, on the top left of the formation. It's just sitting their. Everything else is locked into each other.

I'll have to buy one more hose, as the canister filter is all the way to the right side of the cabinet, to get the hose for the intake moved from the middle to the far right

I'm not sure what to do with the heaters yes. I have another one coming Tuesday as well. I run 2 heaters that make 300 watts , so If one gets stuck on, it can't over heat the tank

Here's some pics finished. Both filters are up and running, and I'm going to add in the ammonia now. The water temp is upto 84

Now I can start back on my stocking list. BTW, your tank looks great! I love your set up, and the picture above matches perfectly ! :fish:


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## Roger That (Aug 12, 2015)

It's coming together nicely! Three months from now you'll be very pleased with how everything looks. Looks much better with the intake tubes in the corners. The plants will hide them well.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

I keep reading over every post from start to finish on this thread

Now I'm thinking of mixing Haps ( All Male ) with Mbuna. Possibly going with Yellow labs and Acei for the Mbuna, since they seem to be the picks to mix with Haps, and maybe a cyrtocara moorii Hap, and a few others

What do you think?

I would like something larger then the Mbuna, like a few Show Pc fish, something 8"-10" possibly mixed in ?

I'm having a hard time, we really like both species, Haps and Mbuna's. I keep watching all these You Tube Video's and reading threads on mixing both, and everything I read you need a large tank, and I have a 6' long 150G tank that's 28" tall.

I really don't want a stressful tank though. I keep reading if I did a all male P&H tank, people say they it's easier to do a mixed gender of both, or Mbuna tank


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

The moorii are 9" so you are set.

Six labs, six acei and 6 haps should work. You just need to choose the other haps.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Wow, that made my day! I really do love them both!

I'm so happy that took allot of stress away!

So how many Moorli , one or two? Male or female?

6 labs and 6 Acei , so do 1M & 5F of each? Or 2M & 4F?

That 13 or 14 fish. Then I need 6 more Haps, what would work that's docile Haps like the Mbuna and Moorli ? 
Would these be all male also?


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Also I was reading if mixing them, I should stock the Haps first, let them grow to about 4" and then stock the Mbuna
But I'm thinking the yellow labs should get along right away?

I understand mixing Haps with Mbuna maybe challenging , but I think a all male tank of P&H would have been just as, or even more challenging.

I'm thinking if I choose the more timid of each groups. Haps and Mbuna hopefully it should be a peaceful tank, hence the yellow labs and Acei. Those seem to be the only two I keep seeing being recommended if going to mix at all

I appreciate the help, as this has been very challenging, but I'd rather do it now, then later and get what we like


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

If you are doing all male for the six haps then only one moorii and male. I would stock them all at once. 12 mbuna and six male hap individuals (depending on size at maturity).

Having the male haps is like having an all-male tank of P&H...just you have to get only 6 individuals to work together.


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## fltekdiver (Sep 27, 2015)

Ok thank you, I appreciate it


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