# 2 New comers having a hard time



## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

A few days ago I added 2 new cichlids to my tank. I got them because they were the same size as my other cichlids which I thought would help them integrate into the tank better than if they were small youngins. After I added them there was the usual butt heads with the new guys, then it settled down for a day and then today I noticed what looks like "skinning" on a few of there mouths from when they lock lips. I am a little concerned that maybe these new additions wont work out so I was hoping someone could give me some tips or advice? Or a heads up on when its time to give up and remove them. I have a spare tank set up in case it comes to that. I also will be doing a water change and rearranging the rocks today to see if that helps.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

What size tank.....what are the fish in your tank? Which ones are the new ones?

Do you have pics if you are not sure?


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

The tank is 55 gallons and I am unsure of the species of each fish but I do have pictures of them and the new ones which I will post here in a minute.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Darcrath said:


> The tank is 55 gallons and I am unsure of the species of each fish but I do have pictures of them and the new ones which I will post here in a minute.


Do you have a few more minutes to take pics of them all? That is really the only way to help. Without knowing what they are it is hard to tell you how to fix.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

These are the new guys ^





These are the guys originally in the tank, there are 7 originals total and 2 new guys.


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## sumthinfishy (Jan 26, 2013)

add a lot more rock.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Tomorrow I plan on picking some up from a local landscaping company


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

I think I see a male kenyi, greshakei, cobalt blue zebra, yellow lab, red zebra and I am not positive on the other two.

In the 4th pic down there is a yellow fish under the rock, it appears to be a male kenyi, is that one of the new fish or one you already had? They are very aggressive. Most of the fish you have can be aggressive. The yellow lab is more docile.

Which fish is chasing which fish?


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

The yellow fish under the rock is doing a lot of the chasing and so is the pink/salmon colored guy on the bottom picture, though he is doing it a bit less. They only started acting more aggressive when I added the 2 new guys at the top. I'll try and get a better picture without the flash of them. I am debating them moving them to my hospital tank tonight...


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Darcrath said:


> The yellow fish under the rock is doing a lot of the chasing and so is the pink/salmon colored guy on the bottom picture, though he is doing it a bit less. They only started acting more aggressive when I added the 2 new guys at the top. I'll try and get a better picture without the flash of them. I am debating them moving them to my hospital tank tonight...


The one under the rock is a Kenyi and one of the most aggressive malawi cichlids you can buy. They really need a minimum or a 75g tank or bigger footprint. You are going to really need to rethink your stocklist. You should read the species profiles on those fish at the top of the page. Click "species profiles" and then "lake malawi" then "malawi mbuna". You will see the Kenyi(Metriaclima lombardoi) and the others I listed.

You are going to have to find a couple that you like and build around those.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Here are the two prime aggressors, I forgot to mention there has been some lip locking with these 2 and the new guys. Everyone else has been chasing but overall fine.



And here is the first new guy.

This guys eye looks like it may have gotten bumped or nipped? You cant really tell in this pic and he wont let me get a good one of it.

And the last new guy.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

The cobalt blue appears to be holding eggs/babies in her mouth. Your fish aren't going to last very long. You really need to pick out a couple you like and take the others back. Then you can get more fish to build around those.

The fish in the top pic, Kenyi, is going to kill those other fish. I assure you. I can already see where he has lip locked the zebra and the other is being shredded. I don't think you have more than a day or two to make the change.

You need a lot more rocks and hiding spots. Places where the aggressive fish can't track down and find the fish they are chasing. You really need to take the Kenyi back to the LFS. Going to have a hard time getting him to work in a 55g especially since he is already an established fish in the tank. I would take him back tomorrow.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Before I added the two new guys I never had an issue other than the occasional nipped fin. But the kenyi has been with the other 7 since day 1. So I guess he just snapped :/ I'll put the Kenyi into my hospital tank tonight. Do you have any suggestions as far as changing up the current fish set up? As for my cobalt blue, I have never had that happen before, any suggestions for that?

This is my first cichlid tank and I've had them for a year now.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Darcrath said:


> Before I added the two new guys I never had an issue other than the occasional nipped fin. But the kenyi has been with the other 7 since day 1. So I guess he just snapped :/ I'll put the Kenyi into my hospital tank tonight. Do you have any suggestions as far as changing up the current fish set up? As for my cobalt blue, I have never had that happen before, any suggestions for that?
> 
> This is my first cichlid tank and I've had them for a year now.


Which ones do you like the best? I would pic out two you like the best and add either a male or a bunch of females. It can be tricky though since you have had them in the tank for a year. Let me PM DJ and try to see if she can help you a bit more as far as what might work out best.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Alright  I appreciate the help a lot. I feel like I should keep the one holding fry for sure. I looke forward to hearing what DJ has to say.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Darcrath said:


> Alright  I appreciate the help a lot. I feel like I should keep the one holding fry for sure. I looke forward to hearing what DJ has to say.


The good thing about the one holding is you know it is a female. It really is all personal choice. I think she will be able to lay out a few different forks in the road for you to choose.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Well im fairly certain they are not "pure" so I am super curious to find out who the father is. Maury anyone? lol.
But in all seriousness, Are there any you would suggest specifically not be kept? Aside from the Kenyi.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

No pressure, right? First, I think you need to post pics in unidentified and get all the fish identified. Second, you need to decide if you will have an all-male tank or a mixed gender tank.

If you are going with an all-male tank (one of each and no look-alikes) then you need to remove the confirmed female and any other females as soon as they can be identified. A female in an all-male tank will create complete chaos.

The father could be the kenyi, but you will never know and I assume you will not save the fry so it may be better not to think about it too much. :thumb: If you decide to keep one fry I'd keep it in a separate tank until it matures so you are sure you will be able to ID it as separate from your existing adults. But then what? I find it much harder to deal with an adult hybrid than to take the natural approach (just let the mom spit the fry).

Once you have only males in the tank...you remove the trouble-makers as they arise and rehome them. All-male tanks...especially mbuna all-male tanks, are hit or miss and what works for one will not work for all. IME I don't find there is really an effective way to "make" a mix work if it isn't working.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

The all male tank is what I had set up, or so I thought. I was pretty surprised when razor said one of them was holding fry. I am playing with the idea of trying mixed gender but I'm not sure... I did post in the unidentified so when I get some ID's Ill post my current stock list here for you.
What direction do you guys think I should go? Mixed gender or all male? I feel like it would be amazing watching fry grow up. But I am very open to some advice right now and I would like to avoid any loss of life in my current set up, fortunately once I took the Kenyi out things settled down a lot.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Mixed gender is easier for a beginner I think. But you will have to choose only 3 species for a tank your size.

I see socolofi and yellow labs. Those are good for the first two species at 1m:4f of each.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Any recommendations based on what I currently have in the tank? I also went to the landscaping yard and got a ton of rocks today so I am currently playing around with them
Ill post pictures in the appropriate spot later.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Also here is the link to the thread for the species debate viewtopic.php?f=14&t=256639


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

Well, you first need to decide mixed gender or all-male. If you want to keep your current fish, maybe you have decided all-male. You do have labs and socolofi in the tank currently, LOL.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

I believe the joke may have gone over my head but I would like to understand it none the less lol.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

I was not making a joke...did you think I was because I said LOL? I probably shoudl have used a smiley face. I was confused because you said you were interested in mixed gender, but then asked for options with your existing stock which has too much variety for mixed gender.

I was just making the point that some of your existing stock is a yellow lab and a socolofi...so there is one option.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Oh I see! Well I meant as in if I were to go the way of mixed gender what should I keep from my existing stock? 
The same applies to if I were to stay with the all male tank. I am weighing my options here so I just want to get all the options out there


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

All male, you just have to remove first females, then look-alikes (like a male kenyi and a yellow lab are both yellow fish) and then whatever is left, you remove trouble makers...even if they are your favorite fish. You need extra tanks and a way to rehome them.

For mixed genders, you want 3 species and from your existing stock I would choose yellow labs and socolofi. I don't think I would choose one of the others for the 3rd species but MAYBE the Metriaclima greshakei. Stock 1m:4f of each.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Hmmm interesting. I really like the greshakei. But wouldnt 15 fish in a 55 gallon be a bit much? Also for the all male tank how many would you suggest? I do have a 10 gallon that I am keeping my kenyi in right now. I also have a 20 tall I could set up somewhere, but I will be rehoming the kenyi soon, if not tomorrow.


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## DJRansome (Oct 29, 2005)

15 fish is the right number for a 55G if you are doing mixed gender. 8-10 fish is the right number if you are doing all-male.

The 20 tall would be good for housing a single fish overnight prior to rehoming like the 10G.

Thinking about it, with the greshakei and socolofi both being basically solid blue fish...I would not do the mix.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Well today I will be bringing the Kenyi and the 2 new comers(one of which is apparently also a Kenyi) back to a LFS. Then I'll be adding the new rock and hopefully that helps until I can do some more stocking corrections.


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

I would like to add that since adding more rock and fixing the aquascape to a more cichlid friendly environment they are doing much better. Everyone seems much happier and less stressed out.


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## 13razorbackfan (Sep 28, 2011)

Darcrath said:


> I would like to add that since adding more rock and fixing the aquascape to a more cichlid friendly environment they are doing much better. Everyone seems much happier and less stressed out.


That is good news. Did you take the Kenyi back?


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## Darcrath (Apr 13, 2013)

Yeah I did, I also told the pet store what species it was and that it was fairly aggressive.


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