# Does this Bolivian Ram look sick to you?



## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

Three of my four Rams are full-bodied. This fellow's chest is a little sunken in and his eyes seem much larger in relation to his body size than my other Rams. He's the least colourful of my Rams and has more squabbles than the others. He eats well and generally acts okay. Hopefully I'm just being paranoid.
Sorry about the pictures - my office is pretty sunny in the morning:
















Here's another Ram for comparison:








And a link to a movie:
http://s257.photobucket.com/albums/hh23 ... 1701-1.flv


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

Whith its fins out like that it does not appear to be feeling poorly. The coloration does show some stress. Its very possible that this one is just less dominant so it is stressed and a bit underfed.

The second one actually looks a bit over weight, so if they are in the same tank I would lean toward just not getting enough food.


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

MalawiLover said:


> The second one actually looks a bit over weight, so if they are in the same tank I would lean toward just not getting enough food.


Don't you know that one _never _comments on a females' weight? Seriously though, thanks for the opinion. They're in the same tank, so I'll chalk it up to a little stress and a little under eating...for some.


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

With that egg ube down she look like she is in the mood as well. She could be a bit moody too


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

I've had only one batch of wigglers (that I know of) in the 1.5 years the Rams have been in there. Something about the 11 rummynose, 3 corys and bristlenose that discourages breeding! Nevertheless, the tank has been a joy, and people often come in to my office and use my tank to 'calm down.'


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

I am afraid that this ram is literally wasting away. Sorry for the picture quality, I only have my blackberry. I can now see the outlines of this poor guy's skull, and his lips are a bit mangled and a bit white. Behaviourly, he gets chased around a little, but nothing extreme. He also eats.
But he's definitely getting thinner and thinner.
I have a hospital tank at home I could put him in if there's any course of action that can be suggested...


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

WOW that is emaciated. Has seen been eating at all? If she has, it could be a very nasty case of parasites. When I got my rams they had Camallanus worms rather bad. Have you noticed any tiny red threads poking out of her anus?


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

MalawiLover said:


> WOW that is emaciated. Has seen been eating at all? If she has, it could be a very nasty case of parasites. When I got my rams they had Camallanus worms rather bad. Have you noticed any tiny red threads poking out of her anus?


No, nothing out of the ordinary at all, other than the outward appearance. He does swim in a very tail-heavy fashion, if that means anything.

Should I isolate the fish and use some sort of generic parasite treatment? I feel like I have to try something...even if it's euthanasia...I can't stand looking at the poor bugger.

keivn


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

Parasites are about the only thing I can think of that would cause this type of emaciation, especially if he is eating.

If you are willing to give it a try, I would suggest putting hi in a hospital tank and treating with Jungle Parasite Clear Tabs. They have worked really well in the past for me on a variety of intestinal parasite issues.

Though if he is too far gone he still might not recover and euthanasia is always an option, but you seem to agree its a last resort. If you decide that it is time, then clove oil works very well. Its has general ansesthesia properties. Once the fish "sleeps" a stint in the freezer (clove treated water and all) will finish it.


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

Thanks for your help. This will be my Sunday project. The hospitalization and the Jungle Parasite Clear Tabs, that is.

kevin


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

Good luck. It will likely take a while for him to start putting weight back on (if this works) so please keep us update as to his progress (or lack of)


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

Okay...a busy weekend, but the Ram is now home from the office and in the hospital tank with a Jungle tab dissolving as I type this. I think I know the answer to this, but I imagine daily or twice daily 25% water changes would be a good idea?


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

I would check the directions on the parsite tabs. If youj do more water chnages than they call for you will just dilute the medication and it may not help then. Follow their instructions and you will get the best results


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## twohuskies (Mar 1, 2008)

I think you're supposed to dose according to directions, then treat again (if necessary) in 48 hours, with a 25% water change before the next treatment. Can't remember the total # of treatments you can use - maybe up to 3? Those would be spaced 48 hours apart.

GL, and keep us posted. opcorn:


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

Things are looking pretty grim.
I treated on Monday and did a 25% change before treating again on Wednesday. Everything was unremarkable but today the Ram is sitting on the bottom (did another water change on Saturday) and not moving much at all.
Tomorrow I may have to pick up some clove oil in case he continues to linger on the substrate.


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## ridley25 (Jan 5, 2008)

He way laying on his side and barely breathing when I got home. He had a nice clove oil bath and is now in the freezer.

Thanks for the help - I'll have to keep a closer eye on things if there is a next time.


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## MalawiLover (Sep 12, 2006)

Sorry to hear he didn't turn around, but you did everything possible.


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